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Shieldbreaker escaped proc set nerfs
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Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Hmm, plot thickens... Think I'm gonna keep a closer eye on curse damage.. unless I misread it - and it was 11k - haha!Edited by Biro123 on September 7, 2017 2:50PMMinalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.0 -
Mazbt✭✭✭✭You want a shield breaker nerf?
Make it melee. So it's still a counter to shields, but not brainless cheese.
I like that. high risk (by being up close) for good reward. I dunno whether the tool tip should say on melee light/heavy attacks or a % chance on melee abilities though.Mazari the Resurrected (AD)- PVP stamplar main
Maz the Druid - PVP group stam warden
- many others
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Fantasia1 -
KingJ✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I know that's why I mentioned on a balanced Build Shields will be stronger/reduced more damage than you deal to the shield.Master at arms and iron clad cancel each other out,Hardy cancels out mighty,Shields cancels precise and penetration,While Bastion will boost your shields more than the bonus damage shattering blows allow.Curse 8k damage every 3seconds break cloak and unblockable and undodgable still strong.Yea 2 abilities have a wait time doesn't change how strong they are.Sweeps a spammable and isn't dodgeable.My point still stand the abilities you are most likely to use are undodgable.
Adding points to shattering blows isn't a great counter when mighty ,ironclad reduce the damage shields take on top of Bastion 20%.Your still gonna have stronger shields than damage On a balanced Build for a stam Build VS a Balanced standards Magic sorc CP setup Shield will be stronger.
Who the hell put 100 points into precise strikes?No one one.With putting points into bless,Master at arms,Pen,mighty probably gonna only have 10% into shattering blows while most sorc gonna have 20% into boosting bastion.While Dodge roll has many hard counters shields have few.Drummerx04 wrote: »EdmundTowers wrote: »Is there really groups out in cyro running shield breaker?
Yes, you know those AD stamblade groups? I've encountered the same groups and players for months now. At least 4 of them are now primarily running shield breaker (good stamblades, not ones that just roll over and die when you look at them), or at the very least slot it when they see me coming (yeah kudos for planning ahead).Groups in shield breaker sounds hilarious but unlikely
Come talk to me when you encounter 2 grand overlord, permadodge, shade porting, cloaking stamblades each running shieldbreaker, and running with a magDK for lockdown and dot pressure.
Oh, or my personal favorite. A pack of 6 Werewolves and one or two of them were wearing shieldbreaker.How to avoid shieldbreaker proc damage:
Dont spam cast your shields-> no shield means no proc damage
Oh? Don't cast shields? Wow, why didn't I think of that? Oh right, because a NB running shieldbreaker can still land an 8k incap.
@DocFrost72 For the suggestion to run mutagen and critsurge to counter shieldbreaker, I want to point out that you have to be actively dealing damage and landing hits for surge to proc. You are not attacking while shielding the rest of the damage, and you are not landing hits that get dodged or "missed" with cloak. Add in more time lost for breaking CC or dodging or even blocking a CC.
But a real player will also apply actual damage in a 1v1, and if the player is even a little decent, some of that damage will make it through the shields. Your mutagen and surge get overcome very quickly in practice. Yes, resto ult is also an option, but at that point you are sacrificing offensive burst which you NEED to kill some of the players pressuring with this set. Miat's and similar addons make dodging frag burst a joke.
Look, I understood that this topic would be unpopular because sorcs are just so OP, and thus people think it's fair or their right to bypass shields with oblivion damage. Hell in zone chat I'll see complaints that 5+ people couldn't kill this one magsorc then subsequently wiped to him, then some random 300CP AR16 stamblade and I go in and kill him within a minute or two. But we can't call that an L2P issue or we trigger someone else.
Let me propose some 5 piece sets to give you an idea of why shieldbreaker is basically broken powerful.
Dodgebreaker: If your enemy dodges your light or heavy attacks, you deal (inseart shieldbreaker oblivion damage).
Guardbreaker: If your enemy blocks your light or heavy attacks, you deal (inseart shieldbreaker oblivion damage).
I mean what's the problem? If you don't dodge or block the light attacks then you won't take any damage from the set... Oh wait, that's your primary method of mitigating damage? Too bad, that guy in the back is wearing a 5 piece set.
Dodge has plenty of counters in the game right now, no need to equip a set for that.
Shields can't be crit, CPs are front loaded. Don't put 100 points into Precise Strikes, but split them between Shattering Blows and Precise. All of a sudden EVERYTHING you do counters shields.
There is no anti-dodge CP. That's the reasoning behind non-dodgable skills. It's up to you to decide if that's a sufficient reasoning.
Point is, you split between Precise and Shattering, as specializing in one will leave you vulnerable to the other defense type. And that is your counter. Both won't work on a successful dodge, and all non-dodgable moves are intentionally weak or ultimates. With the special exception of birds for balancing purposes.
Let's talk about all the weak undodgable abilities like curse that hit me meduim build 8k damage while having Blood spawn up and major resolve and ward.Most undodgable abilities are magic and used in your build For example sweeps,curse,POTL.Only stam ability that you would use that undodgeable is Jabs and hurricane.There no reason for wardens birds to be undodgable other than making the class you have to pay for even stronger.
Only hard counter for shield stacking is shield breaker and knightslayer.I will say a Fury Shield breaker Blood spawn S&B Stamdk dueling build wouldn't be bad setup and would really hurt a low health stamdk trying to pop igneous.Probably the build @Derra .
Ironclad is the equivalent to Master at Arms.
Curse takes four seconds, PotL... errr... also takes a defined amount of seconds. Those aren't spammables for that exact reason.
1 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
I know that's why I mentioned on a balanced Build Shields will be stronger/reduced more damage than you deal to the shield.Master at arms and iron clad cancel each other out,Hardy cancels out mighty,Shields cancels precise and penetration,While Bastion will boost your shields more than the bonus damage shattering blows allow.Curse 8k damage every 3seconds break cloak and unblockable and undodgable still strong.Yea 2 abilities have a wait time doesn't change how strong they are.Sweeps a spammable and isn't dodgeable.My point still stand the abilities you are most likely to use are undodgable.
Adding points to shattering blows isn't a great counter when mighty ,ironclad reduce the damage shields take on top of Bastion 20%.Your still gonna have stronger shields than damage On a balanced Build for a stam Build VS a Balanced standards Magic sorc CP setup Shield will be stronger.
Who the hell put 100 points into precise strikes?No one one.With putting points into bless,Master at arms,Pen,mighty probably gonna only have 10% into shattering blows while most sorc gonna have 20% into boosting bastion.While Dodge roll has many hard counters shields have few.Drummerx04 wrote: »EdmundTowers wrote: »Is there really groups out in cyro running shield breaker?
Yes, you know those AD stamblade groups? I've encountered the same groups and players for months now. At least 4 of them are now primarily running shield breaker (good stamblades, not ones that just roll over and die when you look at them), or at the very least slot it when they see me coming (yeah kudos for planning ahead).Groups in shield breaker sounds hilarious but unlikely
Come talk to me when you encounter 2 grand overlord, permadodge, shade porting, cloaking stamblades each running shieldbreaker, and running with a magDK for lockdown and dot pressure.
Oh, or my personal favorite. A pack of 6 Werewolves and one or two of them were wearing shieldbreaker.How to avoid shieldbreaker proc damage:
Dont spam cast your shields-> no shield means no proc damage
Oh? Don't cast shields? Wow, why didn't I think of that? Oh right, because a NB running shieldbreaker can still land an 8k incap.
@DocFrost72 For the suggestion to run mutagen and critsurge to counter shieldbreaker, I want to point out that you have to be actively dealing damage and landing hits for surge to proc. You are not attacking while shielding the rest of the damage, and you are not landing hits that get dodged or "missed" with cloak. Add in more time lost for breaking CC or dodging or even blocking a CC.
But a real player will also apply actual damage in a 1v1, and if the player is even a little decent, some of that damage will make it through the shields. Your mutagen and surge get overcome very quickly in practice. Yes, resto ult is also an option, but at that point you are sacrificing offensive burst which you NEED to kill some of the players pressuring with this set. Miat's and similar addons make dodging frag burst a joke.
Look, I understood that this topic would be unpopular because sorcs are just so OP, and thus people think it's fair or their right to bypass shields with oblivion damage. Hell in zone chat I'll see complaints that 5+ people couldn't kill this one magsorc then subsequently wiped to him, then some random 300CP AR16 stamblade and I go in and kill him within a minute or two. But we can't call that an L2P issue or we trigger someone else.
Let me propose some 5 piece sets to give you an idea of why shieldbreaker is basically broken powerful.
Dodgebreaker: If your enemy dodges your light or heavy attacks, you deal (inseart shieldbreaker oblivion damage).
Guardbreaker: If your enemy blocks your light or heavy attacks, you deal (inseart shieldbreaker oblivion damage).
I mean what's the problem? If you don't dodge or block the light attacks then you won't take any damage from the set... Oh wait, that's your primary method of mitigating damage? Too bad, that guy in the back is wearing a 5 piece set.
Dodge has plenty of counters in the game right now, no need to equip a set for that.
Shields can't be crit, CPs are front loaded. Don't put 100 points into Precise Strikes, but split them between Shattering Blows and Precise. All of a sudden EVERYTHING you do counters shields.
There is no anti-dodge CP. That's the reasoning behind non-dodgable skills. It's up to you to decide if that's a sufficient reasoning.
Point is, you split between Precise and Shattering, as specializing in one will leave you vulnerable to the other defense type. And that is your counter. Both won't work on a successful dodge, and all non-dodgable moves are intentionally weak or ultimates. With the special exception of birds for balancing purposes.
Let's talk about all the weak undodgable abilities like curse that hit me meduim build 8k damage while having Blood spawn up and major resolve and ward.Most undodgable abilities are magic and used in your build For example sweeps,curse,POTL.Only stam ability that you would use that undodgeable is Jabs and hurricane.There no reason for wardens birds to be undodgable other than making the class you have to pay for even stronger.
Only hard counter for shield stacking is shield breaker and knightslayer.I will say a Fury Shield breaker Blood spawn S&B Stamdk dueling build wouldn't be bad setup and would really hurt a low health stamdk trying to pop igneous.Probably the build @Derra .
Ironclad is the equivalent to Master at Arms.
Curse takes four seconds, PotL... errr... also takes a defined amount of seconds. Those aren't spammables for that exact reason.
No. I have only Curse. Telegraphed and delayed.
Templar and Warden have more undodgable stuff as a design choice. That doesn't apply to all classes.
Shattering and Bastion have different values since shields only scale with magicka, while attacks with damage and resource. Ten percent more damage does cancel out twenty percent more shield if you built your damage character right. I can see healers and tanks complaining, but those have different roles.
And I can see magicka classes complaining. Harness is OP.Edited by Lord-Otto on September 7, 2017 6:08PM0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
I know that's why I mentioned on a balanced Build Shields will be stronger/reduced more damage than you deal to the shield.Master at arms and iron clad cancel each other out,Hardy cancels out mighty,Shields cancels precise and penetration,While Bastion will boost your shields more than the bonus damage shattering blows allow.Curse 8k damage every 3seconds break cloak and unblockable and undodgable still strong.Yea 2 abilities have a wait time doesn't change how strong they are.Sweeps a spammable and isn't dodgeable.My point still stand the abilities you are most likely to use are undodgable.
Adding points to shattering blows isn't a great counter when mighty ,ironclad reduce the damage shields take on top of Bastion 20%.Your still gonna have stronger shields than damage On a balanced Build for a stam Build VS a Balanced standards Magic sorc CP setup Shield will be stronger.
Who the hell put 100 points into precise strikes?No one one.With putting points into bless,Master at arms,Pen,mighty probably gonna only have 10% into shattering blows while most sorc gonna have 20% into boosting bastion.While Dodge roll has many hard counters shields have few.Drummerx04 wrote: »EdmundTowers wrote: »Is there really groups out in cyro running shield breaker?
Yes, you know those AD stamblade groups? I've encountered the same groups and players for months now. At least 4 of them are now primarily running shield breaker (good stamblades, not ones that just roll over and die when you look at them), or at the very least slot it when they see me coming (yeah kudos for planning ahead).Groups in shield breaker sounds hilarious but unlikely
Come talk to me when you encounter 2 grand overlord, permadodge, shade porting, cloaking stamblades each running shieldbreaker, and running with a magDK for lockdown and dot pressure.
Oh, or my personal favorite. A pack of 6 Werewolves and one or two of them were wearing shieldbreaker.How to avoid shieldbreaker proc damage:
Dont spam cast your shields-> no shield means no proc damage
Oh? Don't cast shields? Wow, why didn't I think of that? Oh right, because a NB running shieldbreaker can still land an 8k incap.
@DocFrost72 For the suggestion to run mutagen and critsurge to counter shieldbreaker, I want to point out that you have to be actively dealing damage and landing hits for surge to proc. You are not attacking while shielding the rest of the damage, and you are not landing hits that get dodged or "missed" with cloak. Add in more time lost for breaking CC or dodging or even blocking a CC.
But a real player will also apply actual damage in a 1v1, and if the player is even a little decent, some of that damage will make it through the shields. Your mutagen and surge get overcome very quickly in practice. Yes, resto ult is also an option, but at that point you are sacrificing offensive burst which you NEED to kill some of the players pressuring with this set. Miat's and similar addons make dodging frag burst a joke.
Look, I understood that this topic would be unpopular because sorcs are just so OP, and thus people think it's fair or their right to bypass shields with oblivion damage. Hell in zone chat I'll see complaints that 5+ people couldn't kill this one magsorc then subsequently wiped to him, then some random 300CP AR16 stamblade and I go in and kill him within a minute or two. But we can't call that an L2P issue or we trigger someone else.
Let me propose some 5 piece sets to give you an idea of why shieldbreaker is basically broken powerful.
Dodgebreaker: If your enemy dodges your light or heavy attacks, you deal (inseart shieldbreaker oblivion damage).
Guardbreaker: If your enemy blocks your light or heavy attacks, you deal (inseart shieldbreaker oblivion damage).
I mean what's the problem? If you don't dodge or block the light attacks then you won't take any damage from the set... Oh wait, that's your primary method of mitigating damage? Too bad, that guy in the back is wearing a 5 piece set.
Dodge has plenty of counters in the game right now, no need to equip a set for that.
Shields can't be crit, CPs are front loaded. Don't put 100 points into Precise Strikes, but split them between Shattering Blows and Precise. All of a sudden EVERYTHING you do counters shields.
There is no anti-dodge CP. That's the reasoning behind non-dodgable skills. It's up to you to decide if that's a sufficient reasoning.
Point is, you split between Precise and Shattering, as specializing in one will leave you vulnerable to the other defense type. And that is your counter. Both won't work on a successful dodge, and all non-dodgable moves are intentionally weak or ultimates. With the special exception of birds for balancing purposes.
Let's talk about all the weak undodgable abilities like curse that hit me meduim build 8k damage while having Blood spawn up and major resolve and ward.Most undodgable abilities are magic and used in your build For example sweeps,curse,POTL.Only stam ability that you would use that undodgeable is Jabs and hurricane.There no reason for wardens birds to be undodgable other than making the class you have to pay for even stronger.
Only hard counter for shield stacking is shield breaker and knightslayer.I will say a Fury Shield breaker Blood spawn S&B Stamdk dueling build wouldn't be bad setup and would really hurt a low health stamdk trying to pop igneous.Probably the build @Derra .
Ironclad is the equivalent to Master at Arms.
Curse takes four seconds, PotL... errr... also takes a defined amount of seconds. Those aren't spammables for that exact reason.
No. I have only Curse. Telegraphed and delayed.
Templar and Warden have more undodgable stuff as a design choice. That doesn't apply to all classes.
Shattering and Bastion have different values since shields only scale with magicka, while attacks with damage and resource. Ten percent more damage does cancel out twenty percent more shield if you built your damage character right. I can see healers and tanks complaining, but those have different roles.
And I can see magicka classes complaining. Harness is OP.
Not that bastion is worth spending points in beyond ~5% in the first place.
Ironically if a sorc dumps points into bastion they´re easier to kill.Edited by Derra on September 7, 2017 6:22PM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
I know that's why I mentioned on a balanced Build Shields will be stronger/reduced more damage than you deal to the shield.Master at arms and iron clad cancel each other out,Hardy cancels out mighty,Shields cancels precise and penetration,While Bastion will boost your shields more than the bonus damage shattering blows allow.Curse 8k damage every 3seconds break cloak and unblockable and undodgable still strong.Yea 2 abilities have a wait time doesn't change how strong they are.Sweeps a spammable and isn't dodgeable.My point still stand the abilities you are most likely to use are undodgable.
Adding points to shattering blows isn't a great counter when mighty ,ironclad reduce the damage shields take on top of Bastion 20%.Your still gonna have stronger shields than damage On a balanced Build for a stam Build VS a Balanced standards Magic sorc CP setup Shield will be stronger.
Who the hell put 100 points into precise strikes?No one one.With putting points into bless,Master at arms,Pen,mighty probably gonna only have 10% into shattering blows while most sorc gonna have 20% into boosting bastion.While Dodge roll has many hard counters shields have few.Drummerx04 wrote: »EdmundTowers wrote: »Is there really groups out in cyro running shield breaker?
Yes, you know those AD stamblade groups? I've encountered the same groups and players for months now. At least 4 of them are now primarily running shield breaker (good stamblades, not ones that just roll over and die when you look at them), or at the very least slot it when they see me coming (yeah kudos for planning ahead).Groups in shield breaker sounds hilarious but unlikely
Come talk to me when you encounter 2 grand overlord, permadodge, shade porting, cloaking stamblades each running shieldbreaker, and running with a magDK for lockdown and dot pressure.
Oh, or my personal favorite. A pack of 6 Werewolves and one or two of them were wearing shieldbreaker.How to avoid shieldbreaker proc damage:
Dont spam cast your shields-> no shield means no proc damage
Oh? Don't cast shields? Wow, why didn't I think of that? Oh right, because a NB running shieldbreaker can still land an 8k incap.
@DocFrost72 For the suggestion to run mutagen and critsurge to counter shieldbreaker, I want to point out that you have to be actively dealing damage and landing hits for surge to proc. You are not attacking while shielding the rest of the damage, and you are not landing hits that get dodged or "missed" with cloak. Add in more time lost for breaking CC or dodging or even blocking a CC.
But a real player will also apply actual damage in a 1v1, and if the player is even a little decent, some of that damage will make it through the shields. Your mutagen and surge get overcome very quickly in practice. Yes, resto ult is also an option, but at that point you are sacrificing offensive burst which you NEED to kill some of the players pressuring with this set. Miat's and similar addons make dodging frag burst a joke.
Look, I understood that this topic would be unpopular because sorcs are just so OP, and thus people think it's fair or their right to bypass shields with oblivion damage. Hell in zone chat I'll see complaints that 5+ people couldn't kill this one magsorc then subsequently wiped to him, then some random 300CP AR16 stamblade and I go in and kill him within a minute or two. But we can't call that an L2P issue or we trigger someone else.
Let me propose some 5 piece sets to give you an idea of why shieldbreaker is basically broken powerful.
Dodgebreaker: If your enemy dodges your light or heavy attacks, you deal (inseart shieldbreaker oblivion damage).
Guardbreaker: If your enemy blocks your light or heavy attacks, you deal (inseart shieldbreaker oblivion damage).
I mean what's the problem? If you don't dodge or block the light attacks then you won't take any damage from the set... Oh wait, that's your primary method of mitigating damage? Too bad, that guy in the back is wearing a 5 piece set.
Dodge has plenty of counters in the game right now, no need to equip a set for that.
Shields can't be crit, CPs are front loaded. Don't put 100 points into Precise Strikes, but split them between Shattering Blows and Precise. All of a sudden EVERYTHING you do counters shields.
There is no anti-dodge CP. That's the reasoning behind non-dodgable skills. It's up to you to decide if that's a sufficient reasoning.
Point is, you split between Precise and Shattering, as specializing in one will leave you vulnerable to the other defense type. And that is your counter. Both won't work on a successful dodge, and all non-dodgable moves are intentionally weak or ultimates. With the special exception of birds for balancing purposes.
Let's talk about all the weak undodgable abilities like curse that hit me meduim build 8k damage while having Blood spawn up and major resolve and ward.Most undodgable abilities are magic and used in your build For example sweeps,curse,POTL.Only stam ability that you would use that undodgeable is Jabs and hurricane.There no reason for wardens birds to be undodgable other than making the class you have to pay for even stronger.
Only hard counter for shield stacking is shield breaker and knightslayer.I will say a Fury Shield breaker Blood spawn S&B Stamdk dueling build wouldn't be bad setup and would really hurt a low health stamdk trying to pop igneous.Probably the build @Derra .
Ironclad is the equivalent to Master at Arms.
Curse takes four seconds, PotL... errr... also takes a defined amount of seconds. Those aren't spammables for that exact reason.
No. I have only Curse. Telegraphed and delayed.
Templar and Warden have more undodgable stuff as a design choice. That doesn't apply to all classes.
Shattering and Bastion have different values since shields only scale with magicka, while attacks with damage and resource. Ten percent more damage does cancel out twenty percent more shield if you built your damage character right. I can see healers and tanks complaining, but those have different roles.
And I can see magicka classes complaining. Harness is OP.
Not that bastion is worth spending points in beyond ~5% in the first place.
Ironically if a sorc dumps points into bastion they´re easier to kill.
Yeah. Wish I could find the exact formula. Someone did the math to show exactly when Bastion becomes redundant.
There is a point to be made that shields cover direct and DoT, physical and magic. And that's almost negligible.0 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Depends on how high your magica is.... Bastion being a %boost, the higher your mag, the bigger your base shield, the more you get from bastion.Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Depends on how high your magica is.... Bastion being a %boost, the higher your mag, the bigger your base shield, the more you get from bastion.
Ah. That is true, but it is more difficult to stack only one scaler. You typically give something up. And if it is "only" a slot for Inner Light, that's already a sacrifice. From this perspective, Bastion can have slightly higher percentages than the damage counterpart.0 -
Devilhand✭✭✭mmm.... L2P issue.
Adapt like everyone else and stop asking for nerfs.
It took ZOS over 2 years to review Mag Sorcs Curse, when they decided to nerf it mag sorcs complained so much it got buffed. If you are complaining while playing a mag sorc, then you really need to learn to play. Most OP class overall.
It allows you to be a glasscannon, hit real real hard (over 12k frags... 10k curses.. etc. Which is more then any other class can hit you with a single skill. Not to mention the un criticable shield stacking, that when ever you drop to low health can get up to 35k shields (How do you burst thru that, if the sorc is competent? No way.) Then the instant kill execute, and if that does not kill you, a execute passive => implosion.
Oh, and curse => undodgeable, unblockable, crits real hard if the sorc knows what hes doing.. only counter is... PURGE, yet there is only 1 class with a reliable purge which is templar, the rest are screwed and have to eat thru it.
Sure, keep nerfing every single set that benefits stamina classes, but then nerf the following:
Undodgeable and unbloackable damage sources cannot crit.
Power of the light and it morphs copy damage only from the templar, and should not have initial damage.
Soul assault should be able to bash to interrupt.
Nerf Skoria set too
and can keep adding things to the list.
As far as i can see, ADAPT and stop crying.1 -
Devilhand✭✭✭Drummerx04 wrote: »DocFrost72 wrote: »
I guess you really don't want to use mutagen, to the point you'll say shieldbreaker makes it impossible to win a 1v1 as a sorc.
I can't contribute anymore (constructively) to that conversation, sorry.
See, once again, it's not that shieldbreaker makes it impossible to win. Crap players on shieldbreaker are still crap players, sure they can now pressure me pretty hard, but will likely die to one little combo and still be pretty ineffective.
Shieldbreaker scales in effectiveness with players that also don't suck at their class. So you take a couple shieldbreaker hits you put on your mutagen and take a 9-12k incap from stealth getting CC'd and defiled, break free at which point all your shields are gone and you take another 2-3k light attack and 5k surprise attack which bypassed your shields as you cast them because server latency, so now you are at like 5k health taking active pressure from both shieldbreaker and execute damage.
Either way, shieldbreaker is applying massive amounts of pressure. What people don't seem to acknowledge is that damage gets through shields already if the sorc is going offensive at all, and whatever tiny hots we get through surge or mutagen goes to fixing that damage. Shieldbreaker therefore negates all of those hots and then deals some extra damage on top of it.
You want a combo to really *** off the sorcs? I ran into an infused oblivion, shield breaker, knight slayer, heavy bow attack the other day. Hits like a third of my health to oblivion damage for every heavy attack.
Ok... Let me see if i can understand your logic. You want to be unkillable in your mag sorc.
We got it, it is definitely a L2P issue. You are complaining because a capable player that did its combo (I mean, used his abilities/skills agaisnt you, and then when you are stacking your 3 shields (over 30k) he decided to used oblivion damage to burst you? Looks smart and fair, tell me 1 class that can burst thru +30k shields before you heal from your healing ward back to full health if the sorc has any skills... No way.
Dont want to die to shield breaker? get a HoT, multiple choices. LOS, and keep pressure in your target. Dont want to adapt? then stop filling forums with nerf everything so i can be an unkillable mag sorc, which has been and it is real real strong class.
+12k frags and + 10k curse non stop... Instant kill execute, execute passive, dark deal?, etc etc etc...
Edited by Devilhand on September 8, 2017 6:47PM1 -
Drummerx04✭✭✭✭✭
✭mmm.... L2P issue.
Adapt like everyone else and stop asking for nerfs.
It took ZOS over 2 years to review Mag Sorcs Curse, when they decided to nerf it mag sorcs complained so much it got buffed. If you are complaining while playing a mag sorc, then you really need to learn to play. Most OP class overall.
It allows you to be a glasscannon, hit real real hard (over 12k frags... 10k curses.. etc. Which is more then any other class can hit you with a single skill. Not to mention the un criticable shield stacking, that when ever you drop to low health can get up to 35k shields (How do you burst thru that, if the sorc is competent? No way.) Then the instant kill execute, and if that does not kill you, a execute passive => implosion.
Oh, and curse => undodgeable, unblockable, crits real hard if the sorc knows what hes doing.. only counter is... PURGE, yet there is only 1 class with a reliable purge which is templar, the rest are screwed and have to eat thru it.
Sure, keep nerfing every single set that benefits stamina classes, but then nerf the following:
Undodgeable and unbloackable damage sources cannot crit.
Power of the light and it morphs copy damage only from the templar, and should not have initial damage.
Soul assault should be able to bash to interrupt.
Nerf Skoria set too
and can keep adding things to the list.
As far as i can see, ADAPT and stop crying.
Yeah, if my target isn't wearing impen and running around in light/medium armor, I have hit upwards of 13k frags with 42k mag and 3200 spell damage and around 12-14k penetration on an empowered frag. But numbers hitting that high are pretty rare, and doesn't stop the attack from being easily blocked or dodged. Maybe one day I'll post a video with a counter for "attacks launched, vs attacks landed successfully" to demonstrate what I mean.
35k shield stack? You don't burst through that for two reasons. You can apply continuous pressure as each shield is applied so it never reaches 35k but still constantly pressures magicka resources (a stamina character does not refund harness which is pretty expensive). The shields don't last very long, so if you pause for a buff rotation, you can probably land a burst on the sorc's health.
I again point out in this thread that many other classes deal high damage with high defense, any good player can apply heavy pressure AND have good survivability in a 1v1.PC/NA - Nightfighters, Raid Leader and Officer
Lilith Arujo - DC sorc tank/dps/healer - Dro-m'Athra Destroyer, Gryphon Heart, Grand Warlord
Lilith Tortorici - DC templar trials healer
Notable Completions:
vAS (72k), vMoL HM (160k), vAA HM (135k), vHRC HM, vSO HM (141k), vHoF HM (168k), vCR+3(129k), vDSA 45k, vMA 591k
Original Addons:
Lilith's Group Manager
Lilith's Lazy Hacks - Auto Recharge/Repair
Bot Scanner 2000
Lilith's Command History
Maintained Addons:
Kill Counter0 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭mmm.... L2P issue.
Adapt like everyone else and stop asking for nerfs.
It took ZOS over 2 years to review Mag Sorcs Curse, when they decided to nerf it mag sorcs complained so much it got buffed. If you are complaining while playing a mag sorc, then you really need to learn to play. Most OP class overall.
It allows you to be a glasscannon, hit real real hard (over 12k frags... 10k curses.. etc. Which is more then any other class can hit you with a single skill. Not to mention the un criticable shield stacking, that when ever you drop to low health can get up to 35k shields (How do you burst thru that, if the sorc is competent? No way.) Then the instant kill execute, and if that does not kill you, a execute passive => implosion.
Oh, and curse => undodgeable, unblockable, crits real hard if the sorc knows what hes doing.. only counter is... PURGE, yet there is only 1 class with a reliable purge which is templar, the rest are screwed and have to eat thru it.
Sure, keep nerfing every single set that benefits stamina classes, but then nerf the following:
Undodgeable and unbloackable damage sources cannot crit.
Power of the light and it morphs copy damage only from the templar, and should not have initial damage.
Soul assault should be able to bash to interrupt.
Nerf Skoria set too
and can keep adding things to the list.
As far as i can see, ADAPT and stop crying.
Coming from a non-mag sorc - this is the most biased and uneducated and post I've seen today. You could eat it and still wont know when it's cheese.
So please show me the build that get's a 35k shield in PvP.
But most important: please tell me why a hardcounter isn't cheese.
Sincerely,
your stam buddy McFreeze.6 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭mmm.... L2P issue.
Adapt like everyone else and stop asking for nerfs.
It took ZOS over 2 years to review Mag Sorcs Curse, when they decided to nerf it mag sorcs complained so much it got buffed. If you are complaining while playing a mag sorc, then you really need to learn to play. Most OP class overall.
It allows you to be a glasscannon, hit real real hard (over 12k frags... 10k curses.. etc. Which is more then any other class can hit you with a single skill. Not to mention the un criticable shield stacking, that when ever you drop to low health can get up to 35k shields (How do you burst thru that, if the sorc is competent? No way.) Then the instant kill execute, and if that does not kill you, a execute passive => implosion.
Oh, and curse => undodgeable, unblockable, crits real hard if the sorc knows what hes doing.. only counter is... PURGE, yet there is only 1 class with a reliable purge which is templar, the rest are screwed and have to eat thru it.
Sure, keep nerfing every single set that benefits stamina classes, but then nerf the following:
Undodgeable and unbloackable damage sources cannot crit.
Power of the light and it morphs copy damage only from the templar, and should not have initial damage.
Soul assault should be able to bash to interrupt.
Nerf Skoria set too
and can keep adding things to the list.
As far as i can see, ADAPT and stop crying.
Lol - you sound like the guy who used to join in to all the nerf sorc threads - spouting this kind of stuff... turned out he wasn't even CP160 yet..Minalan owes me a beer.
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"30s to eval"
"Read the ******* lorebook."0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I am seriously considering asking Gina to slap a sticky on the front page about Curse.
Curse was made unblockable when Streak was made blockable. You complain about 10k every four seconds? I could slap you with 40k every five seconds before that nerf. Nightblades complain about undodgable, unblockable Curse? Convenient to look away from an undodgable, unblockable CC. That is AoE, slows you, repositions you, maims you, grants 5k resistances, is notoriously buggy.
You want that Curse-with-Streak-change reversed?
BE MY EFFING GUEST! YOU. WILL. REGRET.
Glad we could talk about that.2 -
Devilhand✭✭✭Drummerx04 wrote: »
Yeah, if my target isn't wearing impen and running around in light/medium armor, I have hit upwards of 13k frags with 42k mag and 3200 spell damage and around 12-14k penetration on an empowered frag. But numbers hitting that high are pretty rare, and doesn't stop the attack from being easily blocked or dodged. Maybe one day I'll post a video with a counter for "attacks launched, vs attacks landed successfully" to demonstrate what I mean.
35k shield stack? You don't burst through that for two reasons. You can apply continuous pressure as each shield is applied so it never reaches 35k but still constantly pressures magicka resources (a stamina character does not refund harness which is pretty expensive). The shields don't last very long, so if you pause for a buff rotation, you can probably land a burst on the sorc's health.
I again point out in this thread that many other classes deal high damage with high defense, any good player can apply heavy pressure AND have good survivability in a 1v1.
Oh.. Sorry, so you expect to hit 14k frags on tanks to? Why dont make a skill that instantly kill your enemy player...
And btw, you are wrong. +10k frags are FAR to common, and with the stats you running you know im saying the truth.
Basically, you are running a glasscannon, and you are complaining because there is a way to counter your crazy high damage/sustain and survivability with uncritable shields? Naw... Adapt and L2P with it like everyone else.
And as you said, you dont burst thru 35k shields, there is no way. Any capable sorc can survive the burst any stam class can get on him and turn the wheel back the stam class in 3 seconds. So again, stop complaining.
"the shields dont last very long..." => 6 seconds. BUT... You keep refreshing them all time, so by pressing 2 keys you have 20-25k normally, or even more uncritacable health. Yep, thats fair...
And ofc any class can get high damage, but none can achieve what a good mag sorc can do. Pretty much god mode.
Yet, I see you only complain about what is killing you, because:
a) you dont want to adapt
b) you dont know how to adapt/counter it
No issues with the set, keep it as it is.1 -
Devilhand✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »mmm.... L2P issue.
Adapt like everyone else and stop asking for nerfs.
It took ZOS over 2 years to review Mag Sorcs Curse, when they decided to nerf it mag sorcs complained so much it got buffed. If you are complaining while playing a mag sorc, then you really need to learn to play. Most OP class overall.
It allows you to be a glasscannon, hit real real hard (over 12k frags... 10k curses.. etc. Which is more then any other class can hit you with a single skill. Not to mention the un criticable shield stacking, that when ever you drop to low health can get up to 35k shields (How do you burst thru that, if the sorc is competent? No way.) Then the instant kill execute, and if that does not kill you, a execute passive => implosion.
Oh, and curse => undodgeable, unblockable, crits real hard if the sorc knows what hes doing.. only counter is... PURGE, yet there is only 1 class with a reliable purge which is templar, the rest are screwed and have to eat thru it.
Sure, keep nerfing every single set that benefits stamina classes, but then nerf the following:
Undodgeable and unbloackable damage sources cannot crit.
Power of the light and it morphs copy damage only from the templar, and should not have initial damage.
Soul assault should be able to bash to interrupt.
Nerf Skoria set too
and can keep adding things to the list.
As far as i can see, ADAPT and stop crying.
Coming from a non-mag sorc - this is the most biased and uneducated and post I've seen today. You could eat it and still wont know when it's cheese.
So please show me the build that get's a 35k shield in PvP.
But most important: please tell me why a hardcounter isn't cheese.
Sincerely,
your stam buddy McFreeze.
LOL.
I dont have to show you any build. But it is real simple, a sorc with 40k magicka will have a shield stack of 19-25k depending if its dampen/harness, CP. When he drops low on health and decide to use the third shield (healing ward), which it increase the shield size up to 300%...=> boom, 35k. Easy.
Burn thru that with out oblivion damage.
Any good sorc will just rebubble and get pressure right away on its stam target so he has to go defence AGAIN, and he just heals up.
And yes, the post may have some grammatical errors, im sorry, but dont have the patience to write perfectly to answer trolls or little kids that cry for everything because there is something they cant figure out how to deal with it.
Oh, and there is nothing biased, just the truth of what good sorcs can do in cyro by them self. The fact I have a mag sorc and have no issues against shield breaker, is enough. Dont have to show you people how to play the game. Learn to play and adapt, and stop asking to nerf everything you cant counter because you lack imagination and/or, your youtube streamer hasnt show you the new "meta/cheese" build.
almost forgot, a hardcounter? everything has a hardcounter right now. Sure remove all oblivion damage, and make mag sorcs immortals... Thats cheese. Apparently you cant see what there is under your nose.
2 -
Devilhand✭✭✭mmm.... L2P issue.
Adapt like everyone else and stop asking for nerfs.
It took ZOS over 2 years to review Mag Sorcs Curse, when they decided to nerf it mag sorcs complained so much it got buffed. If you are complaining while playing a mag sorc, then you really need to learn to play. Most OP class overall.
It allows you to be a glasscannon, hit real real hard (over 12k frags... 10k curses.. etc. Which is more then any other class can hit you with a single skill. Not to mention the un criticable shield stacking, that when ever you drop to low health can get up to 35k shields (How do you burst thru that, if the sorc is competent? No way.) Then the instant kill execute, and if that does not kill you, a execute passive => implosion.
Oh, and curse => undodgeable, unblockable, crits real hard if the sorc knows what hes doing.. only counter is... PURGE, yet there is only 1 class with a reliable purge which is templar, the rest are screwed and have to eat thru it.
Sure, keep nerfing every single set that benefits stamina classes, but then nerf the following:
Undodgeable and unbloackable damage sources cannot crit.
Power of the light and it morphs copy damage only from the templar, and should not have initial damage.
Soul assault should be able to bash to interrupt.
Nerf Skoria set too
and can keep adding things to the list.
As far as i can see, ADAPT and stop crying.
Lol - you sound like the guy who used to join in to all the nerf sorc threads - spouting this kind of stuff... turned out he wasn't even CP160 yet..
Nope. Not me.
Im a Beta player, solo all time in cyro with out issues, and im tired of people crying about everything.
On the other hand, you sound like a sorc lover that lack imagination or skills to manage such a easy set like shield breaker.
Nice try to troll me bud.
L2P0 -
Devilhand✭✭✭I am seriously considering asking Gina to slap a sticky on the front page about Curse.
Curse was made unblockable when Streak was made blockable. You complain about 10k every four seconds? I could slap you with 40k every five seconds before that nerf. Nightblades complain about undodgable, unblockable Curse? Convenient to look away from an undodgable, unblockable CC. That is AoE, slows you, repositions you, maims you, grants 5k resistances, is notoriously buggy.
You want that Curse-with-Streak-change reversed?
BE MY EFFING GUEST! YOU. WILL. REGRET.
Glad we could talk about that.
And another sorc lover.
Yes, I do find Curse is OP as hell right now, and anyone with a brain will say the same.
But, did I ask for a nerf? NO.
Did I ask for a change? NO
I said:
If you keep "nerfing" or modifing every single counter stam classes have against shield stacking classes, then you have to deal with shield stacking classes too or they will become "god mode". And I said all those things about sorcs because THEY are OP, and by the attitude you have you know it is truth.
Oh, yea ofc NB's will complain for all the reasons you posted + the fact it breaks the specific class survival ability they use (cloak). Which is... Hardcounter. I had to adapt to it on my NB's, specially when you have 10 people following you and 2-3 sorcs sppaming that *** on you so you just pop up and get zerg, same with power of the light. I am complaining lately in forums about that? NO.
If you cant deal against shield breaker as a mag sorc, then you have to rethink about your build. I had to adapt to it too on my mag sorc.
This whole thread/discussion is just a L2P issue, coming from some sorcs that cant adapt and desire to run full glasscannon builds 3 shooting everything in the path and surviving. Come on...
There will ALWAYS be a hardcounter for any build in this game, thats the problem with it and thats the reason by +3 years of ESO there is still no balance, and i doubt there will ever be. Just adapt to it, live with it, and move foward.
And if you dont know how to deal against shield breaker, then why the hell you fighting those guys in the first place by your self? Ignore them, or get a friend and group up. Few of us soloers out there now a days, no shame in grouping since cyrodil is pretty much a zerg vs zerg 24/7 right now.2 -
Drummerx04✭✭✭✭✭
✭Drummerx04 wrote: »
Yeah, if my target isn't wearing impen and running around in light/medium armor, I have hit upwards of 13k frags with 42k mag and 3200 spell damage and around 12-14k penetration on an empowered frag. But numbers hitting that high are pretty rare, and doesn't stop the attack from being easily blocked or dodged. Maybe one day I'll post a video with a counter for "attacks launched, vs attacks landed successfully" to demonstrate what I mean.
35k shield stack? You don't burst through that for two reasons. You can apply continuous pressure as each shield is applied so it never reaches 35k but still constantly pressures magicka resources (a stamina character does not refund harness which is pretty expensive). The shields don't last very long, so if you pause for a buff rotation, you can probably land a burst on the sorc's health.
I again point out in this thread that many other classes deal high damage with high defense, any good player can apply heavy pressure AND have good survivability in a 1v1.
Oh.. Sorry, so you expect to hit 14k frags on tanks to? Why dont make a skill that instantly kill your enemy player...
And btw, you are wrong. +10k frags are FAR to common, and with the stats you running you know im saying the truth.
Basically, you are running a glasscannon, and you are complaining because there is a way to counter your crazy high damage/sustain and survivability with uncritable shields? Naw... Adapt and L2P with it like everyone else.
And as you said, you dont burst thru 35k shields, there is no way. Any capable sorc can survive the burst any stam class can get on him and turn the wheel back the stam class in 3 seconds. So again, stop complaining.
"the shields dont last very long..." => 6 seconds. BUT... You keep refreshing them all time, so by pressing 2 keys you have 20-25k normally, or even more uncritacable health. Yep, thats fair...
And ofc any class can get high damage, but none can achieve what a good mag sorc can do. Pretty much god mode.
Yet, I see you only complain about what is killing you, because:
a) you dont want to adapt
b) you dont know how to adapt/counter it
No issues with the set, keep it as it is.
@Devilhand Did you even read my post? No, I don't expect frags to hit tanks for 14k... that's why I described at length the damage+pen I stacked against an enemy target that was basically naked. And frankly it's the same deal with curse. It only really hits hard against other glass cannon builds. But good try on deflecting away from the entire point of this debate.
You can't complain about me pointing out Shieldbreaker... and then turn around and complain about sorcs. Clearly you have a problem with magsorc, and you:
a) don't want to adapt
b) don't know how to adapt counter sorcs
You can't easily burst down a sorc who ALREADY has 35k shield stack (which by the way disappears fast when even 1 good player is on you), nor can you easily burst down a templar who is blocking and healing itself, nor a permadodge+cloak stamblade running with LoS, or a s&B stamwarden dropping trees and shalks and pressuring with birds. You also seem focused on "uncrittable shields" while conveniently ignoring "uncrittable block" or at the very least 70% damage mitigation from blocking on dps s&b builds.
And bulls**t other classes can't do what sorcs can. Have you even watched Kodi play his stamwarden with Sribes? The two of them sit there tanking AND killing 10-20 DC/AD at a time for 4-20 minutes of continuous pressure and action.
The guild ANIMOSITY on PC/NA vivec can hold off and even kill dozens upon dozens of enemies with a group of like 8. Last time I saw them running, they had 1 magsorc in the group and it was easily the softest target. Everything else was a complete waste of time to attack and twice as dangerous.
Tell me how you manage to get around the fact that by the time you have finished casting 3 shields, one good player has already dealt 15-25k damage to them leaving you with an actual shield stack of only 10-15k tops. Oh, and this is basically in execute range in order to get such a powerful healing ward, so stam players have 0 problems laying on the pressure.
"But healing ward and maybe surge will heal you out of execute range" to which I say shieldbreaker.
"Why not use resto ult?" I could, but now I've had to blow a defensive ult and sacrifice my offensive burst just to stave off shieldbreaker
"Why didn't you streak away to LoS?" I did, but I don't have infinite magicka and everything in this game has a snare or root attached to it, so dark conversion isn't always an option. Might as well lump in gap closer here as well.
Every single global cooldown I use to shield, is a global cooldown shieldbreaker can damage my health.
I think I and many others in this thread would just love to have you share your video of an open world cyrodiil encounter against Miat and/or Mizaru running shieldbreaker and hard focusing you on your magsorc with no external support. Show me a video like that, and i'll go ahead and quit the game, because clearly my 2 years of l2p have gotten me nowhere.
PC/NA - Nightfighters, Raid Leader and Officer
Lilith Arujo - DC sorc tank/dps/healer - Dro-m'Athra Destroyer, Gryphon Heart, Grand Warlord
Lilith Tortorici - DC templar trials healer
Notable Completions:
vAS (72k), vMoL HM (160k), vAA HM (135k), vHRC HM, vSO HM (141k), vHoF HM (168k), vCR+3(129k), vDSA 45k, vMA 591k
Original Addons:
Lilith's Group Manager
Lilith's Lazy Hacks - Auto Recharge/Repair
Bot Scanner 2000
Lilith's Command History
Maintained Addons:
Kill Counter1 -
Dorrino✭✭✭✭✭This thread is really tasty:)
- Mag sorcs are fine, you just need to learn to counter them!
*shows shieldbreaker*
- Nononono! Don't counter me like this! Counter me without shieldbreaker!
- But, hm, there's no other counter against mag sorcs:)
- You don't understand! "One good player has already dealt 15-25k damage to them leaving you with an actual shield stack of only 10-15k tops."
Hilarious:)
No, my dear mag sorc, no player good or not can burst through 15-25k shield in 3 sec. The game doesn't work like this.
You can't pressure mag sorc through the full shield stack with healing ward underneath.
And the reason for that is not 20k+ shields. The reason is those 20k+ shields are uncrittable. You can't burst without crits.
This fact alone make any fight predictable for a mag sorc. Mag sorc is always in the control. Solely because the uncritability of the shields.
The only way for a 'good player' to win against a good mag sorc is for mag sorc to fail shield stacking.
Or a shieldbreaker. Which just shifts the pendulum away from the poor powerless mag sorc.
In the meanwhile for a med armor build, relying on dodge as a primary means of defense, warden's cliffracers are the shieldbreaker. Warden's scorch is the shieldbreaker. Dawnbreaker/leap/destro ult are the shieldbreaker. Curse is a shieldbreaker as well. Stacking delayed shieldbreaker. Endless fury, as a cherry on the top, is the shieldbreaker with oneshot from 20%hp.
And all of them are much more effective at their job than 2.1k dmg each sec if light attack lands.
So please, for once, take a look at the game from a non-mag sorc perspective. The game will still be good, trust me.Edited by Dorrino on September 9, 2017 6:56AM6 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I am seriously considering asking Gina to slap a sticky on the front page about Curse.
Curse was made unblockable when Streak was made blockable. You complain about 10k every four seconds? I could slap you with 40k every five seconds before that nerf. Nightblades complain about undodgable, unblockable Curse? Convenient to look away from an undodgable, unblockable CC. That is AoE, slows you, repositions you, maims you, grants 5k resistances, is notoriously buggy.
You want that Curse-with-Streak-change reversed?
BE MY EFFING GUEST! YOU. WILL. REGRET.
Glad we could talk about that.
And another sorc lover.
Yes, I do find Curse is OP as hell right now, and anyone with a brain will say the same.
But, did I ask for a nerf? NO.
Did I ask for a change? NO
I said:
If you keep "nerfing" or modifing every single counter stam classes have against shield stacking classes, then you have to deal with shield stacking classes too or they will become "god mode". And I said all those things about sorcs because THEY are OP, and by the attitude you have you know it is truth.
Oh, yea ofc NB's will complain for all the reasons you posted + the fact it breaks the specific class survival ability they use (cloak). Which is... Hardcounter. I had to adapt to it on my NB's, specially when you have 10 people following you and 2-3 sorcs sppaming that *** on you so you just pop up and get zerg, same with power of the light. I am complaining lately in forums about that? NO.
If you cant deal against shield breaker as a mag sorc, then you have to rethink about your build. I had to adapt to it too on my mag sorc.
This whole thread/discussion is just a L2P issue, coming from some sorcs that cant adapt and desire to run full glasscannon builds 3 shooting everything in the path and surviving. Come on...
There will ALWAYS be a hardcounter for any build in this game, thats the problem with it and thats the reason by +3 years of ESO there is still no balance, and i doubt there will ever be. Just adapt to it, live with it, and move foward.
And if you dont know how to deal against shield breaker, then why the hell you fighting those guys in the first place by your self? Ignore them, or get a friend and group up. Few of us soloers out there now a days, no shame in grouping since cyrodil is pretty much a zerg vs zerg 24/7 right now.
Anyone with a brain would have read more cautiously. Don't need to be a sorc lover to have basic comprehension skills, really.
I didn't say I can't deal with Shieldbreaker. Keep trying to lecture me about sorc play, amateur, very amusing. You think sorc players know less about how to deal with SB than the ones using/defending it?
What I do criticize is how exponentially stronger it gets in zergs. If you think four players of the same class and a damage build targetting you at the same time with no purging healer around and no way to prepare in four seconds, is as common as a single dude of any class with an unleveled bow light attacking from stealth behind a zerg, well... Loss of reality? No clue about Cyrodiil? Ate too many cookies?
Trust me, Streak nerf was much worse than Curse buff. But, sorc haters gonna hate, no matter what.0 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭This was a reasonably civilised thread till someone came in with an aggressive, insulting attitude, full of exaggeration.
35k+ shields.. LOL
Edited by Biro123 on September 9, 2017 11:28AMMinalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.0 -
Devilhand✭✭✭Drummerx04 wrote: »
@Devilhand Did you even read my post? No, I don't expect frags to hit tanks for 14k... that's why I described at length the damage+pen I stacked against an enemy target that was basically naked. And frankly it's the same deal with curse. It only really hits hard against other glass cannon builds. But good try on deflecting away from the entire point of this debate.
You can't complain about me pointing out Shieldbreaker... and then turn around and complain about sorcs. Clearly you have a problem with magsorc, and you:
a) don't want to adapt
b) don't know how to adapt counter sorcs
You can't easily burst down a sorc who ALREADY has 35k shield stack (which by the way disappears fast when even 1 good player is on you), nor can you easily burst down a templar who is blocking and healing itself, nor a permadodge+cloak stamblade running with LoS, or a s&B stamwarden dropping trees and shalks and pressuring with birds. You also seem focused on "uncrittable shields" while conveniently ignoring "uncrittable block" or at the very least 70% damage mitigation from blocking on dps s&b builds.
And bulls**t other classes can't do what sorcs can. Have you even watched Kodi play his stamwarden with Sribes? The two of them sit there tanking AND killing 10-20 DC/AD at a time for 4-20 minutes of continuous pressure and action.
The guild ANIMOSITY on PC/NA vivec can hold off and even kill dozens upon dozens of enemies with a group of like 8. Last time I saw them running, they had 1 magsorc in the group and it was easily the softest target. Everything else was a complete waste of time to attack and twice as dangerous.
Tell me how you manage to get around the fact that by the time you have finished casting 3 shields, one good player has already dealt 15-25k damage to them leaving you with an actual shield stack of only 10-15k tops. Oh, and this is basically in execute range in order to get such a powerful healing ward, so stam players have 0 problems laying on the pressure.
"But healing ward and maybe surge will heal you out of execute range" to which I say shieldbreaker.
"Why not use resto ult?" I could, but now I've had to blow a defensive ult and sacrifice my offensive burst just to stave off shieldbreaker
"Why didn't you streak away to LoS?" I did, but I don't have infinite magicka and everything in this game has a snare or root attached to it, so dark conversion isn't always an option. Might as well lump in gap closer here as well.
Every single global cooldown I use to shield, is a global cooldown shieldbreaker can damage my health.
I think I and many others in this thread would just love to have you share your video of an open world cyrodiil encounter against Miat and/or Mizaru running shieldbreaker and hard focusing you on your magsorc with no external support. Show me a video like that, and i'll go ahead and quit the game, because clearly my 2 years of l2p have gotten me nowhere.
So in the end, im still right. You just dont want to adapt, and decided to cry in here. Toxic builds will always exist and people like you and the rest of the people here complaining about it will always complain. Truth is, no matter how many post you make in forums they wont change a thing.
Oh, and btw dont try to turn the wheel back to me and say i didnt adapt, because I did. Im not the guy complaining, im the guy telling you people to stop asking for nerfs because you dont want to die and want to 2 shoot people, which is crazy. There are some mag sorcs around that have no issues surviving multiple targets at same time, so you saying 1 single person can burst all 3 of your shields real fast means then you really need to tweek your build around or your play style.
I wont answer more to this, a waste of my time.1 -
Devilhand✭✭✭This was a reasonably civilised thread till someone came in with an aggressive, insulting attitude, full of exaggeration.
35k+ shields.. LOL
Not exaggerating. Already explained, so you seem to dont understand what you read and apparently havent realized sorcs can achive does numbers with no issues. Go back to your zerg.1 -
Devilhand✭✭✭I am seriously considering asking Gina to slap a sticky on the front page about Curse.
Curse was made unblockable when Streak was made blockable. You complain about 10k every four seconds? I could slap you with 40k every five seconds before that nerf. Nightblades complain about undodgable, unblockable Curse? Convenient to look away from an undodgable, unblockable CC. That is AoE, slows you, repositions you, maims you, grants 5k resistances, is notoriously buggy.
You want that Curse-with-Streak-change reversed?
BE MY EFFING GUEST! YOU. WILL. REGRET.
Glad we could talk about that.
And another sorc lover.
Yes, I do find Curse is OP as hell right now, and anyone with a brain will say the same.
But, did I ask for a nerf? NO.
Did I ask for a change? NO
I said:
If you keep "nerfing" or modifing every single counter stam classes have against shield stacking classes, then you have to deal with shield stacking classes too or they will become "god mode". And I said all those things about sorcs because THEY are OP, and by the attitude you have you know it is truth.
Oh, yea ofc NB's will complain for all the reasons you posted + the fact it breaks the specific class survival ability they use (cloak). Which is... Hardcounter. I had to adapt to it on my NB's, specially when you have 10 people following you and 2-3 sorcs sppaming that *** on you so you just pop up and get zerg, same with power of the light. I am complaining lately in forums about that? NO.
If you cant deal against shield breaker as a mag sorc, then you have to rethink about your build. I had to adapt to it too on my mag sorc.
This whole thread/discussion is just a L2P issue, coming from some sorcs that cant adapt and desire to run full glasscannon builds 3 shooting everything in the path and surviving. Come on...
There will ALWAYS be a hardcounter for any build in this game, thats the problem with it and thats the reason by +3 years of ESO there is still no balance, and i doubt there will ever be. Just adapt to it, live with it, and move foward.
And if you dont know how to deal against shield breaker, then why the hell you fighting those guys in the first place by your self? Ignore them, or get a friend and group up. Few of us soloers out there now a days, no shame in grouping since cyrodil is pretty much a zerg vs zerg 24/7 right now.
Anyone with a brain would have read more cautiously. Don't need to be a sorc lover to have basic comprehension skills, really.
I didn't say I can't deal with Shieldbreaker. Keep trying to lecture me about sorc play, amateur, very amusing. You think sorc players know less about how to deal with SB than the ones using/defending it?
What I do criticize is how exponentially stronger it gets in zergs. If you think four players of the same class and a damage build targetting you at the same time with no purging healer around and no way to prepare in four seconds, is as common as a single dude of any class with an unleveled bow light attacking from stealth behind a zerg, well... Loss of reality? No clue about Cyrodiil? Ate too many cookies?
Trust me, Streak nerf was much worse than Curse buff. But, sorc haters gonna hate, no matter what.
Dude. Like you had responded before to people complaining about curse. Why you suppouse to survive 4 players or a zerg?
As the game is now, if you get 4 curses from 4 different mag sorcs, you are pretty much screwed, I understand that. On the other hand, if you are fighting 4 players on your mag sorc and 1 of those have shield breaker you might die if you dont kite around LOS or burst the dude fast, but why do you guys think you should be able to survive thru that? Practice makes the expert, want to be able to 1vX, then practice and stop complaining.
Want to survive zergs? group up or about them. Period.
Ate to many cookies??0 -
Devilhand✭✭✭This thread is really tasty:)
- Mag sorcs are fine, you just need to learn to counter them!
*shows shieldbreaker*
- Nononono! Don't counter me like this! Counter me without shieldbreaker!
- But, hm, there's no other counter against mag sorcs:)
- You don't understand! "One good player has already dealt 15-25k damage to them leaving you with an actual shield stack of only 10-15k tops."
Hilarious:)
No, my dear mag sorc, no player good or not can burst through 15-25k shield in 3 sec. The game doesn't work like this.
You can't pressure mag sorc through the full shield stack with healing ward underneath.
And the reason for that is not 20k+ shields. The reason is those 20k+ shields are uncrittable. You can't burst without crits.
This fact alone make any fight predictable for a mag sorc. Mag sorc is always in the control. Solely because the uncritability of the shields.
The only way for a 'good player' to win against a good mag sorc is for mag sorc to fail shield stacking.
Or a shieldbreaker. Which just shifts the pendulum away from the poor powerless mag sorc.
In the meanwhile for a med armor build, relying on dodge as a primary means of defense, warden's cliffracers are the shieldbreaker. Warden's scorch is the shieldbreaker. Dawnbreaker/leap/destro ult are the shieldbreaker. Curse is a shieldbreaker as well. Stacking delayed shieldbreaker. Endless fury, as a cherry on the top, is the shieldbreaker with oneshot from 20%hp.
And all of them are much more effective at their job than 2.1k dmg each sec if light attack lands.
So please, for once, take a look at the game from a non-mag sorc perspective. The game will still be good, trust me.
There is your answer from Miat.
Need more "good players" to show you how wrong you guys are?
ADAPT1 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I am seriously considering asking Gina to slap a sticky on the front page about Curse.
Curse was made unblockable when Streak was made blockable. You complain about 10k every four seconds? I could slap you with 40k every five seconds before that nerf. Nightblades complain about undodgable, unblockable Curse? Convenient to look away from an undodgable, unblockable CC. That is AoE, slows you, repositions you, maims you, grants 5k resistances, is notoriously buggy.
You want that Curse-with-Streak-change reversed?
BE MY EFFING GUEST! YOU. WILL. REGRET.
Glad we could talk about that.
And another sorc lover.
Yes, I do find Curse is OP as hell right now, and anyone with a brain will say the same.
But, did I ask for a nerf? NO.
Did I ask for a change? NO
I said:
If you keep "nerfing" or modifing every single counter stam classes have against shield stacking classes, then you have to deal with shield stacking classes too or they will become "god mode". And I said all those things about sorcs because THEY are OP, and by the attitude you have you know it is truth.
Oh, yea ofc NB's will complain for all the reasons you posted + the fact it breaks the specific class survival ability they use (cloak). Which is... Hardcounter. I had to adapt to it on my NB's, specially when you have 10 people following you and 2-3 sorcs sppaming that *** on you so you just pop up and get zerg, same with power of the light. I am complaining lately in forums about that? NO.
If you cant deal against shield breaker as a mag sorc, then you have to rethink about your build. I had to adapt to it too on my mag sorc.
This whole thread/discussion is just a L2P issue, coming from some sorcs that cant adapt and desire to run full glasscannon builds 3 shooting everything in the path and surviving. Come on...
There will ALWAYS be a hardcounter for any build in this game, thats the problem with it and thats the reason by +3 years of ESO there is still no balance, and i doubt there will ever be. Just adapt to it, live with it, and move foward.
And if you dont know how to deal against shield breaker, then why the hell you fighting those guys in the first place by your self? Ignore them, or get a friend and group up. Few of us soloers out there now a days, no shame in grouping since cyrodil is pretty much a zerg vs zerg 24/7 right now.
Anyone with a brain would have read more cautiously. Don't need to be a sorc lover to have basic comprehension skills, really.
I didn't say I can't deal with Shieldbreaker. Keep trying to lecture me about sorc play, amateur, very amusing. You think sorc players know less about how to deal with SB than the ones using/defending it?
What I do criticize is how exponentially stronger it gets in zergs. If you think four players of the same class and a damage build targetting you at the same time with no purging healer around and no way to prepare in four seconds, is as common as a single dude of any class with an unleveled bow light attacking from stealth behind a zerg, well... Loss of reality? No clue about Cyrodiil? Ate too many cookies?
Trust me, Streak nerf was much worse than Curse buff. But, sorc haters gonna hate, no matter what.
Dude. Like you had responded before to people complaining about curse. Why you suppouse to survive 4 players or a zerg?
As the game is now, if you get 4 curses from 4 different mag sorcs, you are pretty much screwed, I understand that. On the other hand, if you are fighting 4 players on your mag sorc and 1 of those have shield breaker you might die if you dont kite around LOS or burst the dude fast, but why do you guys think you should be able to survive thru that? Practice makes the expert, want to be able to 1vX, then practice and stop complaining.
Want to survive zergs? group up or about them. Period.
Ate to many cookies??
Dying to four curses is insanely specific. Having one Shieldbreaker on you with three whatever people distracting you is way, way easier to orchestrate. It's the same BS exaggeration as is 35k shields. Just nothing honest about it and pure sorc hate.0
