vICP did not need a nerf!

Blackleopardex

Apherius wrote: »

Luigi_Vampa wrote: »

ZOS has data on how many people complete this dungeon, from group finder, pre-made etc... That is how they choose if the dungeon needs nerfed. I don't agree with it, but ZOS probably has a certain completion percentage rate they are trying to achieve. The dungeon has been out long enough and they want light attacking PUGs to complete it now.

Sucks for the hardcore crowd. I think they should add a Nightmare Mode with better rewards, (smaller loot table, or tokens, gold jewlery) or something. Keep Nightmare mode out of group finder, only pre-made groups can enter and give elite players something rewarding their dedication.

Yes to the nightmare Mode.

no more rewards cause people are jealous, and I don't want these jealous to destroy this mode by creating nerf thread simply because they want to loot these gold jewerly ... We just need more achievement with this mode .

You make a very good point when you say that there should be no better loot reward for the "nightmare mode", however do you think the nerf-crowd could live without being able to do these awesome achievements that says you did a good job regardless of much you had it nerfed before you managed it!

Meld777

Blackleopardex wrote: »

This was recorded in Morrowind, before they nerfed it agian... why!

Because not everyone was able to solo it in Morrowind.

Danksta

Jhalin wrote: »

Bruh linking some elites beating it on vhm proves nothing about its difficulty one way or the other

VICP has been soloed, there was no reason to nerf it.

Asardes

Is it possible to solo ICP? I think there are two levers that need to be pulled at the same time to open the door to the end boss AFAIK.

Subversus

Blanco wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

Yoku wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

1) You guys talk about minor tweaks as if they were major nerfs. They're not.

2) Veteran modes of this dungeon, WGT, COA and the other DLC dungeons all need major nerfs. Why? Because you can't find any pugs in the group finder who can complete them.

COA is not a DLC dungeon.... but why you dont search 3 friends and try hard until you complete?? atleast this is how i did it in the beginning...

vCoA2 is hard but not an dlc one, pugs are pugs, see it as an major debuff.
On the other hand vCoA1 is easy, we 3 manned it because of bug in finder. one death, me because of fall damage
The only issue is sets, why does spell power cure drop from WGT and not wayrest or fungal 1

No it's not
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TXghSpgcs4

agree. CoA2 is not at all hard.

Just cringe whenever someone lists it as a 'hard' dungeon.

Just cringe whenever I see elitists try and act cool in a video game by claiming something they cleared is easy just because they cleared.

Dymence

Subversus wrote: »

Blanco wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

Yoku wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

1) You guys talk about minor tweaks as if they were major nerfs. They're not.

2) Veteran modes of this dungeon, WGT, COA and the other DLC dungeons all need major nerfs. Why? Because you can't find any pugs in the group finder who can complete them.

COA is not a DLC dungeon.... but why you dont search 3 friends and try hard until you complete?? atleast this is how i did it in the beginning...

vCoA2 is hard but not an dlc one, pugs are pugs, see it as an major debuff.
On the other hand vCoA1 is easy, we 3 manned it because of bug in finder. one death, me because of fall damage
The only issue is sets, why does spell power cure drop from WGT and not wayrest or fungal 1

No it's not
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TXghSpgcs4

agree. CoA2 is not at all hard.

Just cringe whenever someone lists it as a 'hard' dungeon.

Just cringe whenever I see elitists try and act cool in a video game by claiming something they cleared is easy just because they cleared.

I know right! Normal dungeons are really hard too. Everyone who says they are easy are filthy elitists trying to act cool.

OC_Justice

WGT and ICP were both pugable, I finished both with pugs. Most fun I have ever had in this game. Hope they weren't nerfed too much. Both took a long time and it was the group mentality of never give up that saw us through them.

O_LYKOS

We're not all the best of the best of the best, sir!

Apherius

Asardes wrote: »

Is it possible to solo ICP? I think there are two levers that need to be pulled at the same time to open the door to the end boss AFAIK.

Not anymore , pulled at the same time or one by one , this was in a old patch.

OC_Justice

O_LYKOS wrote: »

We're not all the best of the best of the best, sir!

I am no where near the best of the best. I am mediocre at best. I have been told I stink as a tank, I have also been told I am a good tank. I do believe that there has to be some emphasis on learning to play a game the right way before you can expect to accomplish anything in any game. One does not try to play chess with checkers mentality. You can not go at this game as though I am wearing armor and I have a sword that should be good enough. Is it the right armor for you, is it the right weapon for you? If you are a casual player and just enjoy questing, then fine any armor will be fine and you can solo a lot on your own. If you want to finish dungeons, step it up a little. If you want to finish the tougher dungeons, step it up a little more.

Again, don't bring checkers pieces to a chess match.
Anyone can accomplish anything given the time and tools.
They have given you the tools in skills and weapons to purchase or find.
If you have the time to play you have time to learn.

As MJ says, "make defeat your fuel"

CromulentForumID

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Apherius wrote: »

Luigi_Vampa wrote: »

ZOS has data on how many people complete this dungeon, from group finder, pre-made etc... That is how they choose if the dungeon needs nerfed. I don't agree with it, but ZOS probably has a certain completion percentage rate they are trying to achieve. The dungeon has been out long enough and they want light attacking PUGs to complete it now.

Sucks for the hardcore crowd. I think they should add a Nightmare Mode with better rewards, (smaller loot table, or tokens, gold jewlery) or something. Keep Nightmare mode out of group finder, only pre-made groups can enter and give elite players something rewarding their dedication.

Yes to the nightmare Mode.

no more rewards cause people are jealous, and I don't want these jealous to destroy this mode by creating nerf thread simply because they want to loot these gold jewerly ... We just need more achievement with this mode .

You make a very good point when you say that there should be no better loot reward for the "nightmare mode", however do you think the nerf-crowd could live without being able to do these awesome achievements that says you did a good job regardless of much you had it nerfed before you managed it!

You will get more complaints from the achievement crowd than the loot crowd, to be honest. The forum is littered with threads complaining about being FORCED to play certain content because there was an achievement associated with it. Double the complaints when it comes with a hat and/or title.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

vICP should have never existed in the first place. Both of these annoying 4man pve spamfests ruined what could have been an amazing continuity between PvP and PvE.

If you had to get emperor on your faction then your emp and retinue had to battle to the throne room to crown him. Should have been like a trial with locked emperor access.

OC_Justice

CromulentForumID wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Apherius wrote: »

Luigi_Vampa wrote: »

ZOS has data on how many people complete this dungeon, from group finder, pre-made etc... That is how they choose if the dungeon needs nerfed. I don't agree with it, but ZOS probably has a certain completion percentage rate they are trying to achieve. The dungeon has been out long enough and they want light attacking PUGs to complete it now.

Sucks for the hardcore crowd. I think they should add a Nightmare Mode with better rewards, (smaller loot table, or tokens, gold jewlery) or something. Keep Nightmare mode out of group finder, only pre-made groups can enter and give elite players something rewarding their dedication.

Yes to the nightmare Mode.

no more rewards cause people are jealous, and I don't want these jealous to destroy this mode by creating nerf thread simply because they want to loot these gold jewerly ... We just need more achievement with this mode .

You make a very good point when you say that there should be no better loot reward for the "nightmare mode", however do you think the nerf-crowd could live without being able to do these awesome achievements that says you did a good job regardless of much you had it nerfed before you managed it!

You will get more complaints from the achievement crowd than the loot crowd, to be honest. The forum is littered with threads complaining about being FORCED to play certain content because there was an achievement associated with it. Double the complaints when it comes with a hat and/or title.

Nightmare mode with gold drops...I like that.

MLGProPlayer

MakoFore wrote: »

there should be a vet+ difficulty level then- for groups of 4 max cp players- with a chance to win gold jewellery and weapons and helm drops. imagine gold scathing mage rings, etc. that would give end game users something to motivate us to go back into these places- and a challenge, while also giving every level players content they can pug.

But then all the whiners would be out in full force asking for this difficulty to be nerfed as well because they feel they are entitled to complete content on every difficulty, without actually having to put any work in.

Wifeaggro13

Emma_Overload wrote: »

1) You guys talk about minor tweaks as if they were major nerfs. They're not.

2) Veteran modes of this dungeon, WGT, COA and the other DLC dungeons all need major nerfs. Why? Because you can't find any pugs in the group finder who can complete them.

Because there is no community jere just sadfluxing community of people that play the game for the ctown store. It was not like that two years ago

ecru

exeeter702 wrote: »

Now in reality you can throw all that out the window because dlc needs to sell, and naturally the more accessible a game or content is, the larger potential revenue can be acheived. That is the sad truth.

oh yeah, i'm so sad that a lot of people are playing eso. some of them are even doing vet dungeons! how awful.

BrightOblivion

Apherius wrote: »

Luigi_Vampa wrote: »

ZOS has data on how many people complete this dungeon, from group finder, pre-made etc... That is how they choose if the dungeon needs nerfed. I don't agree with it, but ZOS probably has a certain completion percentage rate they are trying to achieve. The dungeon has been out long enough and they want light attacking PUGs to complete it now.

Sucks for the hardcore crowd. I think they should add a Nightmare Mode with better rewards, (smaller loot table, or tokens, gold jewlery) or something. Keep Nightmare mode out of group finder, only pre-made groups can enter and give elite players something rewarding their dedication.

Yes to the nightmare Mode.

no more rewards cause people are jealous, and I don't want these jealous to destroy this mode by creating nerf thread simply because they want to loot these gold jewerly ... We just need more achievement with this mode .

I'm equally concerned the "nightmare mode" crowd will get their fancy powerful gear they want to make the mode worthwhile and go "This nightmare mode is too easy! We want/demand a fourth mode to challenge us, and have even better loot to make it worthwhile! Do it, ZO$!"

As far as I can tell, this isn't an outright vertical progression game once you hit CP160, apart from continuing to gain CP. Even then, stuff scales with you up go CP160, and has since One Tamriel. That's why raid stuff isn't all inherently better than all dlc dungeon stuff, which isn't all inherently better than non-dlc dungeon stuff, which isn't inherently better than overland stuff, which isn't inherently better than crafted stuff, as much as certain people might argue/insist that it should be. Other games have a gear/content treadmill. This one doesn't, necessarily.

I mean, yeah, vet dungeons are harder than normal ones, and vet trials are harder than that, but it's not a "constantly build harder and harder content" type game. Or at least doesn't seem that way to me.

Danksta

Asardes wrote: »

Is it possible to solo ICP? I think there are two levers that need to be pulled at the same time to open the door to the end boss AFAIK.

I'm not sure if there was assistance for that part, there are only videos for each individual boss. But there wasn't anyone in group with him so I'm assuming he found a way to bypass it solo otherwise he'd been kicked when he was the only person left in group.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/315035/vet-imperial-city-prison-has-been-soloed/p1

It might be mentioned in there somewhere how it was bypassed.

Betsararie

Tyrion87 wrote: »

Apart from vICP, I remember the days when vWGT was a challenge. When during the fight with Molag Kena you actually had to beat a couple of storm atros while the fight itself lasted longer than 1 minute. When during the Planar fight players had to cooperate and the order of touching the pinion mattered.

Now it's all gone. You just burn everything. You don't see a single atro. You don't take turns in touching the pinion.

Vet mode should pose a challenge even for good endgame players while normal mode should be for casuals (like it used to be... in good ol' times). What do we have instead right now? Normal is for farming, vet is for casuals. There is no challenging content for 4-man groups of good endgame players anymore. If someone counts vDSA, that's obviously not enough. ZOS caters so much (too much) to casual players, neglecting completely more dedicated part of their playerbase. If this is the direction of ZOS for vet modes, they should introduce a third tier of difficulty asap otherwise they will be losing players even more.

That is a shame, I haven't run them since the changes, but it sounds like the nerf did them in good.

There goes some of the best content in the game. The dungeons may have have been tough until you learned the mechanics, but in reality, they were easy.

code65536

Danksta wrote: »

Asardes wrote: »

Is it possible to solo ICP? I think there are two levers that need to be pulled at the same time to open the door to the end boss AFAIK.

I'm not sure if there was assistance for that part, there are only videos for each individual boss. But there wasn't anyone in group with him so I'm assuming he found a way to bypass it solo otherwise he'd been kicked when he was the only person left in group.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/315035/vet-imperial-city-prison-has-been-soloed/p1

It might be mentioned in there somewhere how it was bypassed.

Sorc streak

zaria

CromulentForumID wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Apherius wrote: »

Luigi_Vampa wrote: »

ZOS has data on how many people complete this dungeon, from group finder, pre-made etc... That is how they choose if the dungeon needs nerfed. I don't agree with it, but ZOS probably has a certain completion percentage rate they are trying to achieve. The dungeon has been out long enough and they want light attacking PUGs to complete it now.

Sucks for the hardcore crowd. I think they should add a Nightmare Mode with better rewards, (smaller loot table, or tokens, gold jewlery) or something. Keep Nightmare mode out of group finder, only pre-made groups can enter and give elite players something rewarding their dedication.

Yes to the nightmare Mode.

no more rewards cause people are jealous, and I don't want these jealous to destroy this mode by creating nerf thread simply because they want to loot these gold jewerly ... We just need more achievement with this mode .

You make a very good point when you say that there should be no better loot reward for the "nightmare mode", however do you think the nerf-crowd could live without being able to do these awesome achievements that says you did a good job regardless of much you had it nerfed before you managed it!

You will get more complaints from the achievement crowd than the loot crowd, to be honest. The forum is littered with threads complaining about being FORCED to play certain content because there was an achievement associated with it. Double the complaints when it comes with a hat and/or title.

LOL, so you must have achievements, that next hating questing but still want the quest achivement, hating pvp but want warlord
Gear: You can do normal and patch around, only issue is that you want vet for purple, so you need second set overland or easier dungeon. This is even more relevant for trial sets.

Blackleopardex

Was gonna edit my first post but I can't anymore since I said a bad word...
So if anyone is interested here is a updated version of the video just with the sorc perspective edited in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5sQ4kQb8TU&feature=youtu.be

Jhalin

You and your elitist buddies are just afraid of feeling less speshul if the majority of players aren't locked out of this content anymore cause of some well deserved adjustments.

Asardes

Not afraid, just bored to death. There's a big difference. I actually liked the time when I was afraid of dungeons like CoH 2, CoA 2, vICP and vWGT. And by no means I'm an "elitist". Just an above average player. I still have much to learn in this game since I played mostly as tank since I joined. I'm just a mediocre DD, barely able to pull just under 30K self buffed on dummy.

exeeter702

ecru wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Now in reality you can throw all that out the window because dlc needs to sell, and naturally the more accessible a game or content is, the larger potential revenue can be acheived. That is the sad truth.

oh yeah, i'm so sad that a lot of people are playing eso. some of them are even doing vet dungeons! how awful.

Mind reading the whole damn comment instead of taking that last sentence out of context before you make such a stupid statement.

Twohothardware

It needed nerfed just like Mazzatun and Cradle of Shadows. Vet Dungeons are suppose to be for players above CP160, not simply players that have pre-made organized groups. With matchmaking pugs the completion rate on these Dungeons was probably less than 5%.

Betsararie

Twohothardware wrote: »

Vet Dungeons are suppose to be for players above CP160

And therein lies the problem.

What about the rest of us? CP 160 is a very low level. We need true veteran content in this game.

Balsagna

SammyFable wrote: »

Agreed. Can't we have a single challenging thing in this game, that's NOT a raid?

Like vDSA and vMA?

Oh, and, take your cp off and have at it.

Twohothardware

Blanco wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

Vet Dungeons are suppose to be for players above CP160

And therein lies the problem.

What about the rest of us? CP 160 is a very low level. We need true veteran content in this game.

It's called Vet Trials, Vet Maelstrom Arena, Cyrodiil, ect

I'm also not against them adding a "Nightmare mode" to the Dungeons that simply gives you an increase to your reward chances and offers a challenge to max CP players. It shouldn't give higher quality items or items you can't get in the regular Vet mode though. A Nightmare mode should be for premade groups only as well.

Betsararie

Twohothardware wrote: »

Blanco wrote: »

Twohothardware wrote: »

Vet Dungeons are suppose to be for players above CP160

And therein lies the problem.

What about the rest of us? CP 160 is a very low level. We need true veteran content in this game.

It's called Vet Trials, Vet Maelstrom Arena, Cyrodiil, ect

I'm also not against them adding a "Nightmare mode" to the Dungeons that simply gives you an increase to your reward chances and offers a challenge to max CP players. It shouldn't give higher quality items or items you can't get in the regular Vet mode though. A Nightmare mode should be for premade groups only as well.

Sure, I participate in all those things.

My point is in part, why does it have to stop there? Why can't we have 4-man dungeons, too?

I have seen more discussion of a 3rd difficulty lately, and I will say, I am warming to the idea. It might solve a lot of these problems pertaining to the difficulty level of content.