The hard truth why 'everyone' is so upset with the Patch Notes...

Kalante

It's really concerning how many people think that this is actually good patch. This is probably the most anti new player experience patch iv'e ever seen in my life.

Romo

Absolut_Turkey wrote: »

People are mad because there won't be anymore cookie-cutter builds for each class. People are actually going to have to THINK about their individual play styles, and learn to fine tune their builds on their own, instead of having some Youtuber tell them how to play their character.

This is the funniest post to come out.

The min/max folks are already on test server figuring out the new "meta" builds.

They will post the favored "cookie-cutter" builds within a week of this going live.

And the game will be back to square one, just like every-time there is a round of so-called balancing(which NEVER works).

The only things we "gain" from this is having to re-spec/choose another FOTM class.

Tommy_The_Gun

max_only wrote: »

Except for Sorcs.

Sorcs are still the favored son.

Yeah...

Shadow_Viper_vX wrote: »

They're about to lose their easy-mode.

Sorry but stamblade is not an "easy-mode" since like... 5 - 6 patches ago or something... Sorry but I lost count on how many time NB was hard - nerfed...

But sorcerer ? Nope. Sorcerer is still as good as it was before... Just look at Vet trials scoreboard... Not many NB there...
Or, better yet - even play some PvP...
You will see that like 90% of PvP population is sorcerer...
#Class Balance

Shadow_Viper_vX

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

Except for Sorcs.

Sorcs are still the favored son.

Yeah...

Shadow_Viper_vX wrote: »

They're about to lose their easy-mode.

Sorry but stamblade is not an "easy-mode" since like... 5 - 6 patches ago or something... Sorry but I lost count on how many time NB was hard - nerfed...

But sorcerer ? Nope. Sorcerer is still as good as it was before... Just look at Vet trials scoreboard... Not many NB there...
Or, better yet - even play some PvP...
You will see that like 90% of PvP population is sorcerer...
#Class Balance

Neat, And?

The Uninvited

zaria wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

That's all fine and good, but name me another MMO where you can solo vet level dungeons or even trial/raid bosses? Yes games like WoW once you are a few levels above a dungeon you can solo it, or maybe starting in Cataclysm some people could go back and solo like the Emerald Dragons and what not, but never the current same level content. That is the problem. You should not be able to do that.you just won't be able to spam all your skills anymore and still be topped off at the end of a fight.

Now you name me a game where over 50% of the population can do that. You can't and that's exactly where the problem lies.

The good players are already theorycrafting, the average players will follow their footsteps, but the casuals.....? I think they are going to have a real tough time with this patch.

50% of players soloing veteran dungeons
if people don't have bread why don't they eat cake Try to take a look outside your trial guild.

A couple players has managed to solo selected raid bosses, 1% probably less can solo selected veteran dungeons.
Normal dungeons is not supposed to be hard for an cp600 so good players can solo many of them.

Pugging veteran dungeons in June will be for hardcore masochistic only.
Even pugging normal ones will be an chaos.

Read my first comment again, as we are basically saying the same thing. When I said "name me a game where over 50% of the population can do that" I meant including ESO.

You're right, pugging will be complete chaos. Like I said, casuals will probably have a hard time come 6th of June.

But lets wait and see what will be in PTS patch notes of today.

Ep1kMalware

Shadow_Viper_vX wrote: »

They're about to lose their easy-mode.

It'll be fine, Learn to Play

Adapt and Overcome

Stop Freaking Out

OR <----

They're homogenizing classes, and applying so many changes at oncs there's no way the already underperforming team at zos hq could ever learn anything from it.

If they went the same direction in smaller steps, that'd be a different story.

Amayna

Shadow_Viper_vX wrote: »

They're about to lose their easy-mode.

It'll be fine, Learn to Play

Adapt and Overcome

Stop Freaking Out

The Hard Truth is many people will just unsub or quit like myself, this game really isn't that fun to play and with the changes it will make it even less fun to play, it isn't about easy mode, it's about playing a game that's fun to play, why fight for resources while you're trying to have fun?

What did they add in Morrowind that we don't already have?

we have zones, dungeons, trials nothing new there just more of the same ol'

You might say a new class? not really we already have healers, well we did until the deconstruction of Templar

The Adapt and overcome attitude is played out, I wanna have fun in an MMO especially one that I pay for!

Ep1kMalware

Amayna wrote: »

Shadow_Viper_vX wrote: »

They're about to lose their easy-mode.

It'll be fine, Learn to Play

Adapt and Overcome

Stop Freaking Out

The Hard Truth is many people will just unsub or quit like myself, this game really isn't that fun to play and with the changes it will make it even less fun to play, it isn't about easy mode, it's about playing a game that's fun to play, why fight for resources while you're trying to have fun?

What did they add in Morrowind that we don't already have?

we have zones, dungeons, trials nothing new there just more of the same ol'

You might say a new class? not really we already have healers, well we did until the deconstruction of Templar

The Adapt and overcome attitude is played out, I wanna have fun in an MMO especially one that I pay for!

Ye I never saw resources being an issue. Zos just did what zos normally does and instead of offering a solid reason to run less resources, or balancing with battle spirit, they just could have just went with the working system they had and tweaked it weekly.

3 years and they've got no idea wtf to do.

Shadow_Viper_vX

One should always be striving to improve their skills as a player.

flizomica

the new meta, the best way to complete content, will be heavy attack builds. thats how people will have to adapt to clear content the most efficient way.

i haven't met a single person who thinks a heavy attack meta will be in any way more fun than live dps builds. if anything having a heavy attack as your spammable requires less skill than live rotations..

STEVIL

Kalante wrote: »

It's really concerning how many people think that this is actually good patch. This is probably the most anti new player experience patch iv'e ever seen in my life.

Having played it, i disagree.

The bad part for new players IMO was the good intended poorly implemented pruning of skills for newbies. can be fixed by changing it to display tabs for locked skill lines and explantory quick summaries of each with how to unlock info.

The changes to sustain actually made the "leveling as newcomer" process IMO much more informative. The overland questing isn't that much more dangerous but if you just try and hammer thru with spammables (easily done on live) the sustain bites you so the fights take longer. But, if you actually try those things like DoT (anytime) or AoE (against multiples) with weapon attacks worked in and a bare bones minimal rotation then the fight ends much quicker with less sustain issue.

In other words, while not being more deadly, it is more likely to teach you good play style habits you will need later on.

That is IMO a win for new players... also helps keep the "good habits" rewarding from beginning to end game.

Now one area where it might have a negative impact in fact might be on more experienced players trying to speed-level cuz their DPS wont be as splat dead next mob quick as it used to be after say two to three mobs.

But i am curious, when you played the content on PTS what did you find particularly "most anti new player" parts to be?

STEVIL

Amayna wrote: »

Shadow_Viper_vX wrote: »

They're about to lose their easy-mode.

It'll be fine, Learn to Play

Adapt and Overcome

Stop Freaking Out

The Hard Truth is many people will just unsub or quit like myself, this game really isn't that fun to play and with the changes it will make it even less fun to play, it isn't about easy mode, it's about playing a game that's fun to play, why fight for resources while you're trying to have fun?

What did they add in Morrowind that we don't already have?

we have zones, dungeons, trials nothing new there just more of the same ol'

You might say a new class? not really we already have healers, well we did until the deconstruction of Templar

The Adapt and overcome attitude is played out, I wanna have fun in an MMO especially one that I pay for!

As do i but i find the sustain balance and options we get in the morrow patch so far to be more fun than the burn thru fast we have now.

To be honest, i like that i am looking at sets like seducers, eyes of mara, lich, magnus, even syrabane again because i now see "mag recovery" slots on sets as on par with "spell crit" and "spell damage" instead of half-rate. A lot of new set possibilities are back on my radar bringing their own takes on playstyle that isn't just "run burn down sequence and repeat."

Obviously same for stam side.

i liked that when i leveld up characters under the pts, the playstyle from burn down approaches started to slow down because of sustain but the leveling when i began to play "right" using an aoe vs groups and DoT when i could let the mobs go away still pretty quick and before sustain became an issue - promoting good play habits even overland early on.

Its not "the way it was" but that happens every major patch.

Some old ways of doing things go away and new ways of doing things emerge and there is always panic and doom and gloom and tons and tons of uninformed or inaccurate ragery going on.

or did the 2h ulti actually kill the game and destro ulti prove useless as we heard all thru that PTS cycle?

I find the closed beta interesting because while indeed not everything is rainbows and candy corn happy - the tone over there is so much different than the tone for sections open to comment from folks with little to no actual experience playing under the patches.

Many is a meaningless term without some context - four is many compared to one and three is many to a kendar... some players will unsub and quit whether they make changes or not. Just the same, some will sub and start play too.

I dont know about you but my bet is a week after morrowind goes live, there will be more players than there are today, not less. i would bet the same for a month after.

And two-three months after that there will be a new flurry of ragey outrage posts about whatever the new patch is going to include or what it isn't going to include or what the game ought to be doing to stave off almost certain immediate death...

Will keep these predictions in a mason jar, sealed (Praxis) on funk and wagnal's porch.

Galwylin

Word on the street is this patch will make ESO as interesting as listening to Rich explain how something works he's never seen. Awe inspiring is how. Maybe next patch they'll add auto-attack to save all our mouse buttons.

Begins fight.
Cast ability.
*holds mouse button down*
Later that same fight... "Look, some stamina!"
Cast ability.
*hold mouse button down*

I have to stop. That's just sounds like too much fun being had there. It could go on forever. Let's hope!

max_only

GuyNamedSean wrote: »

Eh. I play a Nightblade tank. I'm not a sap tank, either. I've run nearly the same build since about two weeks after launch when I rerolled from Sorcerer tank. I honestly don't think anything will change me. I don't care if Nightblades get nerfed as long as the game feels balanced afterward. So the meta is going to change? So what? If I can still smoke dungeons like nothing and have a decent time in PvP then I'm fine. I really don't understand the people that have eight characters fully prepared so they can swap around whenever the meta changes. What's the appeal of always playing flavour of the month?

@GuyNamedSean

Do you use Siphoning Attacks at all?

Joy_Division

STEVIL wrote: »

Kalante wrote: »

It's really concerning how many people think that this is actually good patch. This is probably the most anti new player experience patch iv'e ever seen in my life.

But i am curious, when you played the content on PTS what did you find particularly "most anti new player" parts to be?

Done vMA 5 times. This patch is going to wiped the gap between the "ceiling" and the "floor".

STEVIL

Joy_Division wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Kalante wrote: »

It's really concerning how many people think that this is actually good patch. This is probably the most anti new player experience patch iv'e ever seen in my life.

But i am curious, when you played the content on PTS what did you find particularly "most anti new player" parts to be?

Done vMA 5 times. This patch is going to wiped the gap between the "ceiling" and the "floor".

Thanks and assuming you mean widen that makes sense. The current vma is tuned to the old dps sustain setup. Unless they adjust the pve top end, those "new players" trying vma with their iron swords will have a tougher time of it to be certain.

Gorthax

ookami007 wrote: »

Shadow_Viper_vX wrote: »

They're about to lose their easy-mode.

It'll be fine, Learn to Play

Adapt and Overcome

Stop Freaking Out

Wrong. They are upset because they are nerfing all classes.... EXCEPT Warden. And Warden is hidden behind a paywall.

Did you honestly expect them to create a new class and then give it away for free? Seriously? That just blows my mind. You don't want the new chapter/expansion then be ok with not getting the new class either.

Many mmos release a new class with a new expansion and you have to pay for it. If they don't make you pay then chances are that game is a super heavy p2w game.



This is a common complaint I keep seeing pop up, that the warden is hidden behind a paywall and people are upset. Just wow lol

To each their own I suppose.

Edit: as for the nerfs...whatever lol all these cancer God mode builds need to go away(pvp).

The game needs to be harder pve wise. Right now, except for trials, I can watch tv, play with my dog, make dinner, drink coffee, etc etc at the same time while doing a vet dungeon(exaggerated if people don't get that). If doing what they are doing indeed makes the game even remotely harder then I am all for it.

FoulSnowpaw

Kalante wrote: »

It's really concerning how many people think that this is actually good patch. This is probably the most anti new player experience patch iv'e ever seen in my life.

A new player knows not of the so called easy times. To the new player the new patch is normal. To the old folks it may be hard. Overall, since light/heavy attacks are "buffed", it's a lot more like Skyrim. We like Skyrim.

GuyNamedSean

max_only wrote: »

GuyNamedSean wrote: »

Eh. I play a Nightblade tank. I'm not a sap tank, either. I've run nearly the same build since about two weeks after launch when I rerolled from Sorcerer tank. I honestly don't think anything will change me. I don't care if Nightblades get nerfed as long as the game feels balanced afterward. So the meta is going to change? So what? If I can still smoke dungeons like nothing and have a decent time in PvP then I'm fine. I really don't understand the people that have eight characters fully prepared so they can swap around whenever the meta changes. What's the appeal of always playing flavour of the month?

@GuyNamedSean

Do you use Siphoning Attacks at all?

I've gone back and forth on it. Usually I haven't used it, no. Although it is worth noting that I'm playing a DK tank now and I will be making a Warden when it comes out. I was curious to see if I would be better at my job playing DK (I had an easier time with resource management as a Nightblade because my buffs all lasted much longer than my DK buffs, but I do feel like I have a lot more damage potential as a DK), and I am curious to see how well Warden will play.

Victoria_Marquis

As a healer it's my job to tank bosses, I just spam heal them and suck the life out of them slowly. The fight is exciting and last about two hours.... Solo

STEVIL

Victoria_Marquis wrote: »

As a healer it's my job to tank bosses, I just spam heal them and suck the life out of them slowly. The fight is exciting and last about two hours.... Solo

What??? Are you saying there is a way to play that isn't group/trial max dps "one percenter" style???

is it April 1 again?

C'mon, really?

Nah?

Xylphan

FoulSnowpaw wrote: »

Kalante wrote: »

It's really concerning how many people think that this is actually good patch. This is probably the most anti new player experience patch iv'e ever seen in my life.

A new player knows not of the so called easy times. To the new player the new patch is normal. To the old folks it may be hard. Overall, since light/heavy attacks are "buffed", it's a lot more like Skyrim. We like Skyrim.

I like the changes as well. Makes things more "gritty" and will decrease the faceroll "I got lightning coming out mi bum" dungeon runs.

max_only

GuyNamedSean wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

GuyNamedSean wrote: »

Eh. I play a Nightblade tank. I'm not a sap tank, either. I've run nearly the same build since about two weeks after launch when I rerolled from Sorcerer tank. I honestly don't think anything will change me. I don't care if Nightblades get nerfed as long as the game feels balanced afterward. So the meta is going to change? So what? If I can still smoke dungeons like nothing and have a decent time in PvP then I'm fine. I really don't understand the people that have eight characters fully prepared so they can swap around whenever the meta changes. What's the appeal of always playing flavour of the month?

@GuyNamedSean

Do you use Siphoning Attacks at all?

I've gone back and forth on it. Usually I haven't used it, no. Although it is worth noting that I'm playing a DK tank now and I will be making a Warden when it comes out. I was curious to see if I would be better at my job playing DK (I had an easier time with resource management as a Nightblade because my buffs all lasted much longer than my DK buffs, but I do feel like I have a lot more damage potential as a DK), and I am curious to see how well Warden will play.

So you don't play a nightblade after all....

SnubbS

I'm actually pretty excited for the patch, but only because it doesn't negatively impact what I do most (read: the only thing I do) in game.

This patch is worrying—they had a vision of making the game easier on newer players, more casual friendly—and they did the opposite—that's really concerning to me. If you have a good idea, and are unable to properly implement said idea—that's really bad.

usmcjdking

The meta has not changed at all.

The meta is still the following:

Maximize DPS to ignore difficult mechanics, raising the chances of success.

-High damage gear.
-Sustainable rotation.
-Group buffs.
-Penetration.
-Overhealing.

These patch notes have not changed ANYTHING and anyone who thinks it has doesn't know what the word meta means.

GuyNamedSean

max_only wrote: »

GuyNamedSean wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

GuyNamedSean wrote: »

Eh. I play a Nightblade tank. I'm not a sap tank, either. I've run nearly the same build since about two weeks after launch when I rerolled from Sorcerer tank. I honestly don't think anything will change me. I don't care if Nightblades get nerfed as long as the game feels balanced afterward. So the meta is going to change? So what? If I can still smoke dungeons like nothing and have a decent time in PvP then I'm fine. I really don't understand the people that have eight characters fully prepared so they can swap around whenever the meta changes. What's the appeal of always playing flavour of the month?

@GuyNamedSean

Do you use Siphoning Attacks at all?

I've gone back and forth on it. Usually I haven't used it, no. Although it is worth noting that I'm playing a DK tank now and I will be making a Warden when it comes out. I was curious to see if I would be better at my job playing DK (I had an easier time with resource management as a Nightblade because my buffs all lasted much longer than my DK buffs, but I do feel like I have a lot more damage potential as a DK), and I am curious to see how well Warden will play.

So you don't play a nightblade after all....

So I just switched off of a Nightblade that's been my main since two weeks after the game came out to level a new character and see how it plays. Nightblade is still my best character.

Shadow_Viper_vX

usmcjdking wrote: »

The meta has not changed at all.

The meta is still the following:

Maximize DPS to ignore difficult mechanics, raising the chances of success.

-High damage gear.
-Sustainable rotation.
-Group buffs.
-Penetration.
-Overhealing.

These patch notes have not changed ANYTHING and anyone who thinks it has doesn't know what the word meta means.

QFE!

As I've said before, the more effort a person puts into Learning to Play the easier it'll will for that person to Adapt and Overcome.

Shadow_Viper_vX

GuyNamedSean wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

GuyNamedSean wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

GuyNamedSean wrote: »

Eh. I play a Nightblade tank. I'm not a sap tank, either. I've run nearly the same build since about two weeks after launch when I rerolled from Sorcerer tank. I honestly don't think anything will change me. I don't care if Nightblades get nerfed as long as the game feels balanced afterward. So the meta is going to change? So what? If I can still smoke dungeons like nothing and have a decent time in PvP then I'm fine. I really don't understand the people that have eight characters fully prepared so they can swap around whenever the meta changes. What's the appeal of always playing flavour of the month?

@GuyNamedSean

Do you use Siphoning Attacks at all?

I've gone back and forth on it. Usually I haven't used it, no. Although it is worth noting that I'm playing a DK tank now and I will be making a Warden when it comes out. I was curious to see if I would be better at my job playing DK (I had an easier time with resource management as a Nightblade because my buffs all lasted much longer than my DK buffs, but I do feel like I have a lot more damage potential as a DK), and I am curious to see how well Warden will play.

So you don't play a nightblade after all....

So I just switched off of a Nightblade that's been my main since two weeks after the game came out to level a new character and see how it plays. Nightblade is still my best character.

My current main is a nightblade

subtlezeroub17_ESO

Actually, the reason is that most of the console players have never played an MMO before. They don't know how to adapt to patches, so when it does, they get upset.

Not to be condescending, but a lot of the arguments I see floating around lead me to believe that this is many people's first mmo ever.

apostate9

Zvorgin wrote: »

Rolling a warden will still enable easy mode.

Dude...have you seen Warden?

It totally won't.