Sorcs and Favoritism

Izaki

Edziu wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

sorceresr never got big nerf like other classes, example: magdk since game start was godmode, then nerf to the ground and unplayalbe for over year, templar have buff an nerf but big nerfs very hurting like now stamplar is unplayable in vpe since few months and now more unplayable, nb similiar, once was good and then now until now and nb is stil worst class for dps while sorc was damn never that down with nerf like other classes and this is balance? while very other class was up and at the bottom sorc was never at bottom, only as average or on top

Streak was nerfed

They will feel the burn of course changes the most.

only streak truly nerfed huh? maybe few patches ago but what now?
did the got nerf to their main sustain? did they got nerf to their main defense and survivability? did they got nerf to their most important class skills? no

sorceres now didng get any nerf like dk now is *** with sustain, templar *** with healing and how nb was *** with dps in pve and open fights in pvp he is now *** more because ZO$ took his only unique in compare to other classes - sustain from siphoning attacks to very long fights whiel dealing damage

sorc still have everything what he have now, only thing when he can suffer is nerf in cp but templar, dk and nb will feel nerf 2-4x more than sorc because class skills nerf

Streak got nerfed 7 times man. Just cause this patch and the 2 patches prior to that they didn't receive a nerf, doesn't mean they need one. Sorcerers were relying heavily on cost reduction in both PvP and PvE, I'd even go as far as saying more than other classes. Shield stacking is expensive, the PvE Pet rotation is VERY expensive. Force Pulse is also an expensive spammable. The only thing you could call more or less cheap in a Sorc's kit is Curse, the Execute and the proc'ed Frags. Mines and Streak both cost absurd amounts.

Izaki

Xvorg wrote: »

Weps wrote: »

What makes me laugh is Sorcs people complaining about this patch.
Really. If you're saying you're hit the most you need to learn how to play your own class.
I agree with whoever said that stamsorcs are the poster child of abused CPs and sustain problems and I have to add even Magsorcs and their infinite streaking, shield stacking and whatever other freaking features they have.

Again, you fooled the whole community once with that Haunting Curse Homestead PTS 1 "nerf", QQing so much about how you could not put enough pressure on enemy players in PvP, that eventually turned into the greatest buff of recent patches.
Is basically this class that makes it impossible to go around with light and medium armor even in CP campaigns, because sneaky nightblades have counters meanwhile 2 sorcs in the same group will nuke you down from 20 metres away before you could even begin to put pressure on them. Even with heavy armor.

This class has the most effective shield stacking of the game, with Hardened Ward (basically the strongest pure damage shield out there and could easily skyrocket your mitigation to 20k plus in PVP ) that can be stacked on top of Harness Magicka that will basically erase his cost while protecting your butt.
They have Crit Surge who can basically keep them healed while they're murdering you from 20mt away.
They have the Blood Magic passive that will restore you 8% more Health when you cast a Dark Magic ability.
So with a Dark Conversion and a 8k plus C-Frag they will be at full health and full magicka with just 2431 stamina and 4050 magicka. Dark Conversion, of course, untouched by this patch.
They have Unholy Knowledge passive that reduces the cost of magicka and stamina abilities by A LOT and it's the only passive of this kind which remains UNTOUCHED BY THIS PATCH.
They have Capacitator who increases your Magicka Recovery by 10%. Again, untouched by this patch.
They have skills and passives that can increase their max Magicka, Health, Magicka return. And all those skills can also stack Weapon and Spell damage on top of the passive that buffs Physical and Shock Damage that, drum roll please, is helpful to proc their class defyning ability: a second execution. A passive execution.
They have the mobility, the powerful damaging monster set that synergizes so damn well with their shield stacking that grants them the best mitigation out there, they have an uncounterable, unpurgeable and overpowered ability which is Curse, they can put you at execution level with just 3 skills and they can finish you off, all of this while jumping in their mines.
Plus, they synergize so well with Shock staves and a High Elf Mag Sorc can do powerful damage with Force Pulse, both of which are clearly unreflectable and undodgeable beams that will, once again, help you proc the Execution Passive.

And you're saying this is not OP? You're saying you got hit the most? You're saying you're being nerfed in this patch like all other classes who will vanish in the next months or become completely irrelevant in PvP?

Either you don't play your class properly, you never tried to play another class or your completely dishonest and scared shitless to lose even one of these priveledges and have to actually fight and earn your kills and have to actually play skillfully and die as often as any other class instead of just sit in the back, one shotting people and streaking away from every root or ground AoE being applied to you.

And please, don't tell me I have to play the class because my main DPS is a mag Sorc and I can hit almost 20k DPS on console, with a rotation I practiced 1 hour a day for 2 weeks, 35k magicka and 2.3k spell damage and mostly blue and green items equipped while my stam sorc hit 15k DPS with Automaton just fresh outta grinding.
Automaton and random Rubedite swords I pick up farming world mobs. 15k. With basically all the passives to unlock.


Enjoy your class but don't try to justify this s#!t.

You forgot the passive that reduces the ulti cost in the same amout Akaviri Dragonguard (a 5 pieces set) does

Yeah, at this point bring in the Catalyst passive (20 ult on potion use), the Siphoning passive (every 4 seconds gain 2 extra ultimate), the Dawn's Wrath passive (3 ult every 6 seconds) and the Earthen Heart passive (3 ult every 6 seconds). All of these give roughly the same ultimate gain as the Powerstone passive.

DHale

Sorc is op. That applies to three scenarios. One you you play in a group, Two you don't play one but get killed by them a lot. Three you are a baddy. Likely it is two and three. If you want kill a sorc just heavy or light into dizzy swing the shield will be down back up a little crit rush light attack and reverse slice. I don't even watch the health anymore anymore. I am on to the next player knowing that I just did 38 k non crit damage combo on a 20 to 23 k player and a 10 to 13 k shield. Easy peezy lemon squeezy.

If I had any trouble whatsoever I would put 30 points into shattering blows but it is not needed. Stamplars and magplar can and should cleanse all curses and mages wraths and DK can igneous and vigor all sorc damage especially running shuffle and immovable pots. When you get knocked down by a procced frag is where you are vulnerable.

grim_tactics

Maybe the best reply to this thread would've simply been:

Hate Sorcs? Get over it.

Edziu

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

sorceresr never got big nerf like other classes, example: magdk since game start was godmode, then nerf to the ground and unplayalbe for over year, templar have buff an nerf but big nerfs very hurting like now stamplar is unplayable in vpe since few months and now more unplayable, nb similiar, once was good and then now until now and nb is stil worst class for dps while sorc was damn never that down with nerf like other classes and this is balance? while very other class was up and at the bottom sorc was never at bottom, only as average or on top

Streak was nerfed

They will feel the burn of course changes the most.

only streak truly nerfed huh? maybe few patches ago but what now?
did the got nerf to their main sustain? did they got nerf to their main defense and survivability? did they got nerf to their most important class skills? no

sorceres now didng get any nerf like dk now is *** with sustain, templar *** with healing and how nb was *** with dps in pve and open fights in pvp he is now *** more because ZO$ took his only unique in compare to other classes - sustain from siphoning attacks to very long fights whiel dealing damage

sorc still have everything what he have now, only thing when he can suffer is nerf in cp but templar, dk and nb will feel nerf 2-4x more than sorc because class skills nerf

Streak got nerfed 7 times man. Just cause this patch and the 2 patches prior to that they didn't receive a nerf, doesn't mean they need one. Sorcerers were relying heavily on cost reduction in both PvP and PvE, I'd even go as far as saying more than other classes. Shield stacking is expensive, the PvE Pet rotation is VERY expensive. Force Pulse is also an expensive spammable. The only thing you could call more or less cheap in a Sorc's kit is Curse, the Execute and the proc'ed Frags. Mines and Streak both cost absurd amounts.

streak got nerfet 7 times and still on live its spammable minimum 4 times before he will stop whiel trying to run away
I dont see shield stacking is expensive when every not bad sorc I will meet have 100% shields uptime in fight
while stacking or spamming with force pulse frag pulse and here you are, range hit with stun with nb incap strike if you dont dodge/block it
sorc dont need to spam force pulse in pvp and in pve, in pve like every other magica skill its procing very cheap crystal frag, in pvp you dont spam force pulse because you shieldstacking also and reapplying curse with fragment proc and execute ofc

and about mines you jsut casting it and walking around them kiting your melee enemy unlti he will get hit by most of them which isnt to fast or if is fast you have still enought magica and time to regen magica because those mines arnt weak in damage when someone is clearing them

Xvorg

Streak cannot be spamming, and this is the ability that's touched the more by sustain nerf, 21% less cost reduction on a 50% skill cost use increase is huge. People can spam heal, why not shield ?

Sorry, I have a hybrid sorcs in HA that runs 2H/bow and magicka skills... and even she (with a 25k magicka pool) can streak at least 4 times before starting to run only.
Shield spamming is not a problem, shield spamming while streaking is.

No good sorc will wait 8s for the second curse when you can use it twice in that time. This is only a PvE change.

And what do you do against another streaking sorc?

You don't know how playing a NB if you are not able to survive/escape sorc, l2p issue

You don't know how to play sorc if you can't find a NB. Streak in his direction... it is a l2p issue

Shield is not mitigation, shield have no resistance and can't be crit, this not mitigation, like armor make

Yes, shield is shield. Mitigation implies you receive dmg. Shield implies 0 dmg received. It is simiar to dodgeroll

Entropy is far better, good sorc don't use critical surge in PvP

So a skill that needs to be casted in combat and has a crappy heal is better than a skill that's casted out of combat and has a very good heal? Just because it is empowered through a passive? Just lol. You can get a frag proc with surge out of combat...

There is no decent sorc using a lightning staff over a fire staff in PvP, which game do you play ?

Sorry, but sorcs have no need to use lit staff as other classes. Their shields protect them from reflects, and they can proc concussion through other means. Other classes need to use lit staff, not because they want to, but because they need to.

The rest... just lol.


Stop lying to yourself. Sorc is the best class in this game, at the point any potato can be effective with it. Try a NB or a DK before saying sorcs are bad.

HiImRex

Minalan wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Drdeath20 wrote: »

Name 1 buff templars got?

Only nerfs.

Losing blinding flashes to radiant destruction might be the only buff.

The only reason 1t was a templar buff was because heavy armor became viable then.

They didn't get buffs. They were just the best in PvE DPS.

Templar can permanently shut a sorc down this coming patch. There's no penalty for reapplying it over and over again, and the sorc can't just CC break to get rid of it.

I'm sure you can guess what I'm talking about.

Templar - eclipse! (gave up entropy/class execute/class dot/backlash/elemental drain/hard CC for this skill)

Sorc - Hardened! Curse! Crushing! Hardened! Crushing!

(3.5 seconds pass)7 sec CC immunity!

Sorc - Hardened! Curse! Crushing! Crushing! Wrath Frag! lul

Templar - melts

yea every templar can "shut down" mag sorcs now

KingJ

grim_tactics wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

grim_tactics wrote: »

Cyrisus wrote: »

grim_tactics wrote: »

Not going to read all the pages but I will agree with a post I saw on the first page.

I get the feeling everyone saying Sorcs are god mode/easy mode haven't played one.

Shield stacking doesn't do a thing when you have someone with good burst rotation beating on you the whole time. More than 1 person attacking you and all you are doing is surviving while doing 0 damage to them.

Smart players know how to make Infernal Guardian essentially do nothing so - yeah - I could spam shields but I'm gonna die anyway.

Now factor in the new CP structure and the amount a shield can do is greatly reduced.

Sorcs can point the finger the other way.

NB right now has great burst and for whatever reason you can still stun/root from stealth attacks.

Templars can go from no health to 100% very easily while also doing good damage.

And some DK builds can sustain forever in 1v1 and at times 1vX.

Don't let the fact that the top 1% of PvP players that use a Sorc insanely good represent the whole class as OP. The same could be said of every top player in each class.

I agree these nerfs look like garbage on paper and a lot of you have a reason to be mad - but I can almost promise if this went live today that you would see Sorcs melt easier than they do now without being able to spam all the shields in the current meta.

I would go as far to say that with the CP tree listed in this PTS patch if I tried casting all 3 shields I would have 0 magicka left and it would only last for 6 seconds which afterward would mean I couldn't cast anything when they ran out.

Sorcs are by far one of the easiest classes to play with extremely high reward on the current patch so saying that only the 1% are making the class look really strong is as far from the truth as you will get. Shieldstacking is a big reason why most of the really stupid, 0 counterplay builds work (Petsorcs, Pirate Skeleton, etc.). I believe shieldstacking does everything if you know how to play it properly. When stacked correctly they prevent any sort of burst while also keeping up tempo. You only lose if you're a lot worse than your opponent. However, if you're equally skilled they won't have a chance at beating you while you just faceroll your keyboard and watch them die. Assuming equal skill level I don't think there's a single matchup where a sorc straight up loses. In a worst case scenario they will go even.

P.S: Infernal Guardian hasn't been viable for a long time now so using it as a foundation makes no sense. Any decent player would just slot Pirate Skeleton instead and be unkillable.

My point is that the counter play against Sorcs exists and they are nowhere near OP.

I run Pirate Skeleton and I'll agree it's ridiculous.

However, saying using shields "properly" you can keep up tempo I don't agree with.

Stacking shields against burst means you are doing 0 damage - again - and wasting resources.

Doing it to sustain against a Zerg while streaking - yes that's a little funny - and I can get away most of the time.

I just don't agree with Sorcs being OP at all.

It's impossible to have 100% shield uptime and with this new patch will not happen. It costs too much to constantly keep casting hoping you out sustain someone else's burst and resource pool. It can happen but, come on, we are talking about 6 seconds.

I understand the points and I'm not saying there's no need for changes.

I'm all for reducing cast or increasing duration IF they don't allow stacking.

Or just make it where they can be critically hit. I'm fine with that too, but without shields Sorcs aren't viable at all for any play style in PvP.

Sounds to me you are just a bad sorc.

Or maybe you're just bad and don't know how to counter?

If all you are doing is stacking shields and not doing any damage you suck good sorcs can stack shields and still deal damage.If you can't you sucks its pretty simple.Most of Sorc burst is delayed and timing everything for example curse+dawnbreaker= endless fury will kill most players you by the time your first shield is finished you will still have your second shield and during that time your first curse would have exploded average curse 6-8k.If all you do is shield stack you don't know what you are doing you have time to burst if you can't you suck.

Aedaryl

Edziu wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

sorceresr never got big nerf like other classes, example: magdk since game start was godmode, then nerf to the ground and unplayalbe for over year, templar have buff an nerf but big nerfs very hurting like now stamplar is unplayable in vpe since few months and now more unplayable, nb similiar, once was good and then now until now and nb is stil worst class for dps while sorc was damn never that down with nerf like other classes and this is balance? while very other class was up and at the bottom sorc was never at bottom, only as average or on top

Streak was nerfed

They will feel the burn of course changes the most.

only streak truly nerfed huh? maybe few patches ago but what now?
did the got nerf to their main sustain? did they got nerf to their main defense and survivability? did they got nerf to their most important class skills? no

sorceres now didng get any nerf like dk now is *** with sustain, templar *** with healing and how nb was *** with dps in pve and open fights in pvp he is now *** more because ZO$ took his only unique in compare to other classes - sustain from siphoning attacks to very long fights whiel dealing damage

sorc still have everything what he have now, only thing when he can suffer is nerf in cp but templar, dk and nb will feel nerf 2-4x more than sorc because class skills nerf

Streak got nerfed 7 times man. Just cause this patch and the 2 patches prior to that they didn't receive a nerf, doesn't mean they need one. Sorcerers were relying heavily on cost reduction in both PvP and PvE, I'd even go as far as saying more than other classes. Shield stacking is expensive, the PvE Pet rotation is VERY expensive. Force Pulse is also an expensive spammable. The only thing you could call more or less cheap in a Sorc's kit is Curse, the Execute and the proc'ed Frags. Mines and Streak both cost absurd amounts.

streak got nerfet 7 times and still on live its spammable minimum 4 times before he will stop whiel trying to run away
I dont see shield stacking is expensive when every not bad sorc I will meet have 100% shields uptime in fight
while stacking or spamming with force pulse frag pulse and here you are, range hit with stun with nb incap strike if you dont dodge/block it
sorc dont need to spam force pulse in pvp and in pve, in pve like every other magica skill its procing very cheap crystal frag, in pvp you dont spam force pulse because you shieldstacking also and reapplying curse with fragment proc and execute ofc

and about mines you jsut casting it and walking around them kiting your melee enemy unlti he will get hit by most of them which isnt to fast or if is fast you have still enought magica and time to regen magica because those mines arnt weak in damage when someone is clearing them

You are complaining because a sorc can use streak 4 times before being OOM ? really ?

Dk skills are expensive, do you see dk not using skills b and doing nothing because there skills are expensive ?

Frag have a slow animation, can be dodge and block and it's telegraphed, add-on also tell you how to dodge, what do you need more ? I can't play for you sorry

Mines are in the game since few years now, it's strong yeah, but not being able to counter them at all is a L2P issue.

Strider_Roshin

Sorcs are going to get hit hard this patch. Shield stacking is going to become very taxing, and now DKs, Wardens, magblades, and Templars will be hard counters to them. The only class that is free AP to them are Stamblades, but that's because they need to be in melee range to activate shadow barrier; making mines incredibly painful for them.

So do I think they need nerfed? Not really, they're super powerful, but everything but a stamblade can make easy work of them if built right.

Xvorg

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Weps wrote: »

What makes me laugh is Sorcs people complaining about this patch.
Really. If you're saying you're hit the most you need to learn how to play your own class.
I agree with whoever said that stamsorcs are the poster child of abused CPs and sustain problems and I have to add even Magsorcs and their infinite streaking, shield stacking and whatever other freaking features they have.

Again, you fooled the whole community once with that Haunting Curse Homestead PTS 1 "nerf", QQing so much about how you could not put enough pressure on enemy players in PvP, that eventually turned into the greatest buff of recent patches.
Is basically this class that makes it impossible to go around with light and medium armor even in CP campaigns, because sneaky nightblades have counters meanwhile 2 sorcs in the same group will nuke you down from 20 metres away before you could even begin to put pressure on them. Even with heavy armor.

This class has the most effective shield stacking of the game, with Hardened Ward (basically the strongest pure damage shield out there and could easily skyrocket your mitigation to 20k plus in PVP ) that can be stacked on top of Harness Magicka that will basically erase his cost while protecting your butt.
They have Crit Surge who can basically keep them healed while they're murdering you from 20mt away.
They have the Blood Magic passive that will restore you 8% more Health when you cast a Dark Magic ability.
So with a Dark Conversion and a 8k plus C-Frag they will be at full health and full magicka with just 2431 stamina and 4050 magicka. Dark Conversion, of course, untouched by this patch.
They have Unholy Knowledge passive that reduces the cost of magicka and stamina abilities by A LOT and it's the only passive of this kind which remains UNTOUCHED BY THIS PATCH.
They have Capacitator who increases your Magicka Recovery by 10%. Again, untouched by this patch.
They have skills and passives that can increase their max Magicka, Health, Magicka return. And all those skills can also stack Weapon and Spell damage on top of the passive that buffs Physical and Shock Damage that, drum roll please, is helpful to proc their class defyning ability: a second execution. A passive execution.
They have the mobility, the powerful damaging monster set that synergizes so damn well with their shield stacking that grants them the best mitigation out there, they have an uncounterable, unpurgeable and overpowered ability which is Curse, they can put you at execution level with just 3 skills and they can finish you off, all of this while jumping in their mines.
Plus, they synergize so well with Shock staves and a High Elf Mag Sorc can do powerful damage with Force Pulse, both of which are clearly unreflectable and undodgeable beams that will, once again, help you proc the Execution Passive.

And you're saying this is not OP? You're saying you got hit the most? You're saying you're being nerfed in this patch like all other classes who will vanish in the next months or become completely irrelevant in PvP?

Either you don't play your class properly, you never tried to play another class or your completely dishonest and scared shitless to lose even one of these priveledges and have to actually fight and earn your kills and have to actually play skillfully and die as often as any other class instead of just sit in the back, one shotting people and streaking away from every root or ground AoE being applied to you.

And please, don't tell me I have to play the class because my main DPS is a mag Sorc and I can hit almost 20k DPS on console, with a rotation I practiced 1 hour a day for 2 weeks, 35k magicka and 2.3k spell damage and mostly blue and green items equipped while my stam sorc hit 15k DPS with Automaton just fresh outta grinding.
Automaton and random Rubedite swords I pick up farming world mobs. 15k. With basically all the passives to unlock.


Enjoy your class but don't try to justify this s#!t.

You forgot the passive that reduces the ulti cost in the same amout Akaviri Dragonguard (a 5 pieces set) does

Yeah, at this point bring in the Catalyst passive (20 ult on potion use), the Siphoning passive (every 4 seconds gain 2 extra ultimate), the Dawn's Wrath passive (3 ult every 6 seconds) and the Earthen Heart passive (3 ult every 6 seconds). All of these give roughly the same ultimate gain as the Powerstone passive.

Do you know the catalist passive can be used each 45 secs? Than you need 40 secs to get 20 ulti with siph passive? and that together they reach simiar numbers to the reduction provided by power stone if you are aiming for EOTS?

In other words, you need at least 45 secs of depleting your magicka pool and potion inventory to get what sorcs has granted...

Seriously, try harder

Weps

Aedaryl wrote: »

Weps wrote: »

What makes me laugh is Sorcs people complaining about this patch.
Really. If you're saying you're hit the most you need to learn how to play your own class.
I agree with whoever said that stamsorcs are the poster child of abused CPs and sustain problems and I have to add even Magsorcs and their infinite streaking, shield stacking and whatever other freaking features they have.

Streak cannot be spamming, and this is the ability that's touched the more by sustain nerf, 21% less cost reduction on a 50% skill cost use increase is huge. People can spam heal, why not shield ?

Because you can spam shield, streak AND the most powerful shields. And don't tell me you can't spam streak, again that means you're either dishonest or a really bad sorc because I could spam it with 34k magicka without Lich and I've seen plenty of people doing over and over again the moment you put a root or an AoE on them.
Two days ago a freaking 450 CP player did it 3 times in a row, everytime I put a root on him.
You can't do it you say? False information you say? Well, in the war of pointless accusations I say "Learn to play".

I even seen a freaking stam sorc doing it, so please, don't try to fool me while acting like you're the *** encyclopaedia of sorcs.

And again, everyone got those freaking nerfs.
But you're the only one who's acting like you're the one who got nerf'd the most.
UN REAL.


Again, you fooled the whole community once with that Haunting Curse Homestead PTS 1 "nerf", QQing so much about how you could not put enough pressure on enemy players in PvP, that eventually turned into the greatest buff of recent patches. No good sorc will wait 8s for the second curse when you can use it twice in that time. This is only a PvE change.
Is basically this class that makes it impossible to go around with light and medium armor even in CP campaigns, because sneaky nightblades have counters meanwhile 2 sorcs in the same group will nuke you down from 20 metres away before you could even begin to put pressure on them. Even with heavy armor.

You don't know how playing a NB if you are not able to survive/escape sorc, l2p issue

Well yeah, I'm a pretty *** Nightblade.
So? Is that your argument? What does it prove?
Does ZoS have to buff this class over the limits so I won't be playing a nightblade? What the *** does that even mean?

It's not only me, I can survive or escape a sorc and I can get nuked by them. I can even kill them. I can even put pressure on them, it's a shared feeling across the whole community, I've seen heavy armor people around me going down with a Curse, a Force Pulse and a 10k Frag with Curse explosion and subsequential passive implosion. So tell me, master of the game, how do you survive that?

This class has the most effective shield stacking of the game, with Hardened Ward (basically the strongest pure damage shield out there and could easily skyrocket your mitigation to 20k plus in PVP ) that can be stacked on top of Harness Magicka that will basically erase his cost while protecting your butt.

Shield is not mitigation, shields have no resistances and can't be crit, thisis not mitigation, like armor

Nope, shield mitigates the same amount of damage you would take if you didn't have them, so the lower resistance you have the higher the damage your shield takes. It's not mitigation, alright, how do you wanna call the ability to resist a 20k burst without blocking? Shieldigation?


They have Crit Surge who can basically keep them healed while they're murdering you from 20mt away.

Entropy is far better, good sorc don't use critical surge in PvP

Good sorc use both. Entropy is far better if you need to empower your next attack, your frag or your whatever, if they want sustain they can slot Crit Surge and gain even more power, more healing and more survaivability.
And Stamsorc use this. A lot.

They have the Blood Magic passive that will restore you 8% more Health when you cast a Dark Magic ability.

Crystal frag cannot be spammed, and since light armor take the most damage, this passive is just not great, sorc use healing ward when they need HP

See? Dishonesty again.
Who said anything about spam? I said it restores you 8% health. Plus with the Crit Surge they receive even more healing out of this.

So with a Dark Conversion and a 8k plus C-Frag they will be at full health and full magicka with just 2431 stamina and 4050 magicka. Dark Conversion, of course, untouched by this patch.

Dark conversion can only be use in homestead with amberplasm, since you have less regen, cp roll dodge and break free seperate, and less stamina recovery from player that light attack you, this skill can not now be call a magicka regen skill for mag sorc, plus it can be bashed/crushing shocked

And? Again, who cares? Good sorcs can do it without giving you the time to react. Boom, full health again. Plus, who's using crushing shock besides other sorcs in PvP? Magblades? The Dodo?
Can be bashed? Yeah, from 20mt away?

They have Unholy Knowledge passive that reduces the cost of magicka and stamina abilities by A LOT and it's the only passive of this kind which remains UNTOUCHED BY THIS PATCH.

5% is only 2% more than breton passive, crying baby asking for nerf, did you tried mag sorc in PTS ? Also, NB regen passive didn't got touched by this patch, stop doing misinformation pls

Talking about magicka cost reduction and you answer with regen.
Who's doing misinformation?

Plus you're talking about racial skills and I'm talking about class skill.
What is this, a freaking kindergarten game?
What about a Breton Mag Sorc, you happy now?

They have Capacitator who increases your Magicka Recovery by 10%. Again, untouched by this patch.

See above

Oh yes, I forgot about that. I even stated it in the next post. And as I said I'm a *** Nightblade.
But still Nightblades got nerf'd and you are untouched.

They have skills and passives that can increase their max Magicka, Health, Magicka return

Slotting 2 skill for 8% max magicka is not a great skill, nb have that in passive, and inner light give 7% max magicka, 10% critical chance, empowered buff, 2% magicka regen, and reveale ennemies near you. The max health is a passive by slotting 2 skill for a pet, which 1% of sorc do in PvP. where is my skill/passive that increase my magicka return ?

If your pet dies you gain Magicka back. If you have a pet skill slotted ( curse ) you gain more health.
If you have Necropotence you have 4k more magicka. The only one who can still stack as high as your class are Magblades.
Do you see magblades around? And they can stack it with a laughable skill, while pets are overpowered for PvE and can be pretty viable for PvP. Plus you need only 3 skills on your main bar and those are enough to burst down anybody.

And all those skills can also stack Weapon and Spell damage on top of the passive that buffs Physical and Shock Damage that, drum roll please, is helpful to proc their class defyning ability: a second execution. A passive execution.

They have the mobility,

streak took serious nerf, anyone wearing medium armor can have a similar if not better mobility too

Serious nerf where? For cost increase?
You really need to get down your high horse because EVERYBODY GOT THAT.

Oh yeah, the "Streak penalty" with the cost increase. Too bad, considering how every other class got nerf'd, you don't need to spam it anymore, because one will cleanse you from roots and basically teleport you away from anybody's reach.


the powerful damaging monster set that synergizes so damn well with their shield stacking that grants them the best mitigation out there,

Damage set is not a sorc class ability and everyone say that set need nerf, sorcs are the first. see above for mitigation part

Dishonesty again. I said that synergizes well with shield stacking.
Templars don't shield stack. MagDk don't shield stack ( 2k shield, wow, are you kidding me? ) and Magblades don't shield stack.
So immortality through Bone Pirate and shield stacking or high burst damage from 20 mt away with immortality using Infernal Guardian can be effectively used and it's only used by Mag sorcs.

they have an uncounterable, unpurgeable and overpowered ability which is Curse

Curse is purgeable, and counterable by that and by the fact you exactly now when it will damage you.

3.5 seconds in open field? Purgeable? If you have a coordinated zerg with 2 healers but most of the time, in 3.5 seconds it counts as unpurgeable.
And no, it doesn't have a counter because the sorc is not going to sit on the chair waiting for you to explode, he's going to force pulse you and mages wrath you until he takes you 15% HP. And in this zerg meta, you can count on at least two sorcs targeting you this way if you're in heavy armor.

So let me put it this way, if you like it better:
it has the hardest to purge and most damaging negative effect in the game that, if the sorc is good, will always make them gain the upper hand the second they cast it on you.

You know, there's nothing bad in admitting that you're using a broken ass skill.
Even stamplar say so when they're spamming POTL like they're in a Monty Phython sketch.

, they can put you at execution level with just 3 skills and they can finish you off, all of this while jumping in their mines.

If you are not able to survive the most telegraphed burst in the game and not able to counter mines, it's a L2P issue, sorry

You really don't play in Cyro much, do you?
Oh, of course. You play as a sorc.

To me, it's not all the people in this thread who are salty because they got killed by a sorc, it looks more like you want sorc this way because you either can't kill a living soul or you're just deceptive af.

Plus, they synergize so well with Shock staves and a High Elf Mag Sorc can do powerful damage with Force Pulse , both of which are clearly unreflectable and undodgeable beams that will, once again, help you proc the Execution Passive.

There is no decent sorc using a lightning staff over a fire staff in PvP, which game do you play ?

You don't play Ps4 Eu huh? Then again, when they want to target you they use inferno. When they need AoE they use Light.
It's a L2p issue.

And you're saying this is not OP? You're saying you got hit the most? You're saying you're being nerfed in this patch like all other classes who will vanish in the next months or become completely irrelevant in PvP?

It's not OP, everyone will adapt, sorc and others too

It's not OP.
A whole community saying the opposite. But it's not.

You will adapt? You don't need to adapt? You just took a 20% nerf and that's it. All your ways to heal, to become immune to every damage coming your direction and to gain resources and to burst people down with 2 skills remain untouched.
You just need to spam a little less and you're fine, you can still run around with all damage glyphs and Lich because of the nerfs the other classes received.

Either you don't play your class properly, you never tried to play another class or your completely dishonest and scared shitless to lose even one of these priveledges and have to actually fight and earn your kills and have to actually play skillfully and die as often as any other class instead of just sit in the back, one shotting people and streaking away from every root or ground AoE being applied to you.

You are complaining about mechanics you don't even understand and now how it work, it's a l2p issue, sorry again

Try again.

And please, don't tell me I have to play the class because my main DPS is a mag Sorc and I can hit almost 20k DPS on console, with a rotation I practiced 1 hour a day for 2 weeks, 35k magicka and 2.3k spell damage and mostly blue and green items equipped while my stam sorc hit 15k DPS with Automaton just fresh outta grinding.
Automaton and random Rubedite swords I pick up farming world mobs. 15k. With basically all the passives to unlock.


Even AFK, I can put more dps than that, pls, stop that l2p issue, you just seems stupid.


Lol. You must be one stupid mofo aren't you?
With one sentence you just proved my entire point.
Nice way to shot yourself in both feet.

Read again.


Enjoy your class but don't try to justify this s#!t.


I enjoy my class, but I can't stop laughing fixing your false informations

I've no doubt you enjoy your class, lol. That's the whole point of the conversation.
Regarding the false informations, well try again.

Cheers

Edziu

Aedaryl wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

sorceresr never got big nerf like other classes, example: magdk since game start was godmode, then nerf to the ground and unplayalbe for over year, templar have buff an nerf but big nerfs very hurting like now stamplar is unplayable in vpe since few months and now more unplayable, nb similiar, once was good and then now until now and nb is stil worst class for dps while sorc was damn never that down with nerf like other classes and this is balance? while very other class was up and at the bottom sorc was never at bottom, only as average or on top

Streak was nerfed

They will feel the burn of course changes the most.

only streak truly nerfed huh? maybe few patches ago but what now?
did the got nerf to their main sustain? did they got nerf to their main defense and survivability? did they got nerf to their most important class skills? no

sorceres now didng get any nerf like dk now is *** with sustain, templar *** with healing and how nb was *** with dps in pve and open fights in pvp he is now *** more because ZO$ took his only unique in compare to other classes - sustain from siphoning attacks to very long fights whiel dealing damage

sorc still have everything what he have now, only thing when he can suffer is nerf in cp but templar, dk and nb will feel nerf 2-4x more than sorc because class skills nerf

Streak got nerfed 7 times man. Just cause this patch and the 2 patches prior to that they didn't receive a nerf, doesn't mean they need one. Sorcerers were relying heavily on cost reduction in both PvP and PvE, I'd even go as far as saying more than other classes. Shield stacking is expensive, the PvE Pet rotation is VERY expensive. Force Pulse is also an expensive spammable. The only thing you could call more or less cheap in a Sorc's kit is Curse, the Execute and the proc'ed Frags. Mines and Streak both cost absurd amounts.

streak got nerfet 7 times and still on live its spammable minimum 4 times before he will stop whiel trying to run away
I dont see shield stacking is expensive when every not bad sorc I will meet have 100% shields uptime in fight
while stacking or spamming with force pulse frag pulse and here you are, range hit with stun with nb incap strike if you dont dodge/block it
sorc dont need to spam force pulse in pvp and in pve, in pve like every other magica skill its procing very cheap crystal frag, in pvp you dont spam force pulse because you shieldstacking also and reapplying curse with fragment proc and execute ofc

and about mines you jsut casting it and walking around them kiting your melee enemy unlti he will get hit by most of them which isnt to fast or if is fast you have still enought magica and time to regen magica because those mines arnt weak in damage when someone is clearing them

You are complaining because a sorc can use streak 4 times before being OOM ? really ?

Dk skills are expensive, do you see dk not using skills b and doing nothing because there skills are expensive ?

Frag have a slow animation, can be dodge and block and it's telegraphed, add-on also tell you how to dodge, what do you need more ? I can't play for you sorry

Mines are in the game since few years now, it's strong yeah, but not being able to counter them at all is a L2P issue.

did you understand what I wrote?

I jsut answered to @IzakiBrotherSs that any sorc is just spaming minimum 4 streak if not more so they dont have problem with expensive streak

yes, frag is easy to avoif when you see it but you wont be always able to avoid this like you will get cc or anything before hit this or you was just on melee on sorc trying to melt finally his shield while he got proced frag whiel shieldstacking etc

and to mcounter mines you just need to go into all of them or atleast to 3 from 5 of those to have pure land to fight with sorc in melee range and healing while clearing mines while sorc can no place new mines or just he bursting you if you n9ot dodging it in this time as stamina build

Joy_Division

Minalan wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Drdeath20 wrote: »

Name 1 buff templars got?

Only nerfs.

Losing blinding flashes to radiant destruction might be the only buff.

The only reason 1t was a templar buff was because heavy armor became viable then.

They didn't get buffs. They were just the best in PvE DPS.

Templar can permanently shut a sorc down this coming patch. There's no penalty for reapplying it over and over again, and the sorc can't just CC break to get rid of it.

I'm sure you can guess what I'm talking about.

No, I can't. Because you are most certainly not talking about Eclipse.

You know that new "improved" templar spell which now gives targets CC immunity after those 3.5 seconds expire ... even though they did not spend a drop of stamina actually CC breaking.

Every time ZoS changes this ability, non-templars actually get worried this will be a threat in PvP and I just laugh. Sure don;t consider the perspective of someone who has used this ability more than anyone on the NA server since the beginning of the game. Because I'm totally biased and do not have tons of experience with every single iteration of the spell and knows exactly what it once did and what it does now.

I have been using defensive posture for months now and it is so far and away better than Eclipse it is painfully obvious to me that not a single developer - ever - has actually tried to use Eclipse in a competitive situation and came away beleiving that it was an interesting skill, let alone a viable option.

If you are worried about any class's anti sorc/projectile defenses, you better look at the Warden. Their defense last nearly twice as long as eclipse, when it absorbs your frag, they will thank you for your ultimate.

Magıc

Xvorg wrote: »

Magıc wrote: »

People who cry about sorcs shields make me laugh.

These cost increase changes will hurt sorc too. Sustaining on sorc is going to be hard too (dark deal/conversion need to be nerfed, but at the same time, players with even a few brain cells know that they need to bash socs).

Hexys and I calculated that to make streak cost the same on PTS as they do on live currently (as a non breton) you have to race change to breton as well as stick 3 cost reduction glyphs on. That means you lose 700ish SD. And all the good sorcs will tell you that they judge their sustain/skill cost based on streak cost.

what is 700 SD for a class that increases it by sloting class skills and has access to major sorcery through a class skill?

Mageblades, Mageplars and mDKs are going to have the same problem, but they don't have that passive, so each point they put into cost reduction/magicka recobvery is going to affect them twice.

We used standard pvp skill setup while testing and the 700 SD sorcs lose is WITH major sorcery compared to live WITH major sorcery.

I'm not saying sorcs won't be op. Ofc they will, idk what Zos are thinking. But saying sorcs will be godlike when streak is costing 3.2k magicka is just an over the top reaction.

Xvorg

Magıc wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Magıc wrote: »

People who cry about sorcs shields make me laugh.

These cost increase changes will hurt sorc too. Sustaining on sorc is going to be hard too (dark deal/conversion need to be nerfed, but at the same time, players with even a few brain cells know that they need to bash socs).

Hexys and I calculated that to make streak cost the same on PTS as they do on live currently (as a non breton) you have to race change to breton as well as stick 3 cost reduction glyphs on. That means you lose 700ish SD. And all the good sorcs will tell you that they judge their sustain/skill cost based on streak cost.

what is 700 SD for a class that increases it by sloting class skills and has access to major sorcery through a class skill?

Mageblades, Mageplars and mDKs are going to have the same problem, but they don't have that passive, so each point they put into cost reduction/magicka recobvery is going to affect them twice.

We used standard pvp skill setup while testing and the 700 SD sorcs lose is WITH major sorcery compared to live WITH major sorcery.

I'm not saying sorcs won't be op. Ofc they will, idk what Zos are thinking. But saying sorcs will be godlike when streak is costing 3.2k magicka is just an over the top reaction.

Without the specific nerfs to othe classes they were doing ok. Now that the other classes have been heavily hit in the only thing they did better than sorcs (sustain) what do you think it's gonna happen?

I grant you though that DK Heavy attack builds are going to become BiS and that's because they have a skill that supports that playing style.Sorcs also have a skill that support that playing style too and an ulti that depends on light and heavy attacks.

Just think about stam DK sustain. With the nerfs to constitution, CP stars and blocking there's no reason to be a stamDK

Stamden

Weps wrote: »

What makes me laugh is Sorcs people complaining about this patch.
Really. If you're saying you're hit the most you need to learn how to play your own class.
I agree with whoever said that stamsorcs are the poster child of abused CPs and sustain problems and I have to add even Magsorcs and their infinite streaking, shield stacking and whatever other freaking features they have.

Again, you fooled the whole community once with that Haunting Curse Homestead PTS 1 "nerf", QQing so much about how you could not put enough pressure on enemy players in PvP, that eventually turned into the greatest buff of recent patches.
Is basically this class that makes it impossible to go around with light and medium armor even in CP campaigns, because sneaky nightblades have counters meanwhile 2 sorcs in the same group will nuke you down from 20 metres away before you could even begin to put pressure on them. Even with heavy armor.

This class has the most effective shield stacking of the game, with Hardened Ward (basically the strongest pure damage shield out there and could easily skyrocket your mitigation to 20k plus in PVP ) that can be stacked on top of Harness Magicka that will basically erase his cost while protecting your butt.
They have Crit Surge who can basically keep them healed while they're murdering you from 20mt away.
They have the Blood Magic passive that will restore you 8% more Health when you cast a Dark Magic ability.
So with a Dark Conversion and a 8k plus C-Frag they will be at full health and full magicka with just 2431 stamina and 4050 magicka. Dark Conversion, of course, untouched by this patch.
They have Unholy Knowledge passive that reduces the cost of magicka and stamina abilities by A LOT and it's the only passive of this kind which remains UNTOUCHED BY THIS PATCH.
They have Capacitator who increases your Magicka Recovery by 10%. Again, untouched by this patch.
They have skills and passives that can increase their max Magicka, Health, Magicka return. And all those skills can also stack Weapon and Spell damage on top of the passive that buffs Physical and Shock Damage that, drum roll please, is helpful to proc their class defyning ability: a second execution. A passive execution.
They have the mobility, the powerful damaging monster set that synergizes so damn well with their shield stacking that grants them the best mitigation out there, they have an uncounterable, unpurgeable and overpowered ability which is Curse, they can put you at execution level with just 3 skills and they can finish you off, all of this while jumping in their mines.
Plus, they synergize so well with Shock staves and a High Elf Mag Sorc can do powerful damage with Force Pulse, both of which are clearly unreflectable and undodgeable beams that will, once again, help you proc the Execution Passive.

And you're saying this is not OP? You're saying you got hit the most? You're saying you're being nerfed in this patch like all other classes who will vanish in the next months or become completely irrelevant in PvP?

Either you don't play your class properly, you never tried to play another class or your completely dishonest and scared shitless to lose even one of these priveledges and have to actually fight and earn your kills and have to actually play skillfully and die as often as any other class instead of just sit in the back, one shotting people and streaking away from every root or ground AoE being applied to you.

And please, don't tell me I have to play the class because my main DPS is a mag Sorc and I can hit almost 20k DPS on console, with a rotation I practiced 1 hour a day for 2 weeks, 35k magicka and 2.3k spell damage and mostly blue and green items equipped while my stam sorc hit 15k DPS with Automaton just fresh outta grinding.
Automaton and random Rubedite swords I pick up farming world mobs. 15k. With basically all the passives to unlock.


Enjoy your class but don't try to justify this s#!t.

Finally someone who understands all this BS. This class is so overtuned in so many ways.

Killset

Aedaryl wrote: »

Weps wrote: »

What makes me laugh is Sorcs people complaining about this patch.
Really. If you're saying you're hit the most you need to learn how to play your own class.
I agree with whoever said that stamsorcs are the poster child of abused CPs and sustain problems and I have to add even Magsorcs and their infinite streaking, shield stacking and whatever other freaking features they have.

Streak cannot be spamming, and this is the ability that's touched the more by sustain nerf, 21% less cost reduction on a 50% skill cost use increase is huge. People can spam heal, why not shield ?

Again, you fooled the whole community once with that Haunting Curse Homestead PTS 1 "nerf", QQing so much about how you could not put enough pressure on enemy players in PvP, that eventually turned into the greatest buff of recent patches. No good sorc will wait 8s for the second curse when you can use it twice in that time. This is only a PvE change.
Is basically this class that makes it impossible to go around with light and medium armor even in CP campaigns, because sneaky nightblades have counters meanwhile 2 sorcs in the same group will nuke you down from 20 metres away before you could even begin to put pressure on them. Even with heavy armor. You don't know how playing a NB if you are not able to survive/escape sorc, l2p issue

This class has the most effective shield stacking of the game, with Hardened Ward (basically the strongest pure damage shield out there and could easily skyrocket your mitigation to 20k plus in PVP ) that can be stacked on top of Harness Magicka that will basically erase his cost while protecting your butt.

Shield is not mitigation, shields have no resistances and can't be crit, thisis not mitigation, like armor

They have Crit Surge who can basically keep them healed while they're murdering you from 20mt away.

Entropy is far better, good sorc don't use critical surge in PvP

They have the Blood Magic passive that will restore you 8% more Health when you cast a Dark Magic ability.

Crystal frag cannot be spammed, and since light armor take the most damage, this passive is just not great, sorc use healing ward when they need HP


So with a Dark Conversion and a 8k plus C-Frag they will be at full health and full magicka with just 2431 stamina and 4050 magicka. Dark Conversion, of course, untouched by this patch.

Dark conversion can only be use in homestead with amberplasm, since you have less regen, cp roll dodge and break free seperate, and less stamina recovery from player that light attack you, this skill can not now be call a magicka regen skill for mag sorc, plus it can be bashed/crushing shocked

They have Unholy Knowledge passive that reduces the cost of magicka and stamina abilities by A LOT and it's the only passive of this kind which remains UNTOUCHED BY THIS PATCH.

5% is only 2% more than breton passive, crying baby asking for nerf, did you tried mag sorc in PTS ? Also, NB regen passive didn't got touched by this patch, stop doing misinformation pls

They have Capacitator who increases your Magicka Recovery by 10%. Again, untouched by this patch.

See above

They have skills and passives that can increase their max Magicka, Health, Magicka return

Slotting 2 skill for 8% max magicka is not a great skill, nb have that in passive, and inner light give 7% max magicka, 10% critical chance, empowered buff, 2% magicka regen, and reveale ennemies near you. The max health is a passive by slotting 2 skill for a pet, which 1% of sorc do in PvP. where is my skill/passive that increase my magicka return ?

And all those skills can also stack Weapon and Spell damage on top of the passive that buffs Physical and Shock Damage that, drum roll please, is helpful to proc their class defyning ability: a second execution. A passive execution.

They have the mobility,

streak took serious nerf, anyone wearing medium armor can have a similar if not better mobility too

the powerful damaging monster set that synergizes so damn well with their shield stacking that grants them the best mitigation out there,

Damage set is not a sorc class ability and everyone say that set need nerf, sorcs are the first. see above for mitigation part

they have an uncounterable, unpurgeable and overpowered ability which is Curse

Curse is purgeable, and counterable by that and by the fact you exactly now when it will damage you.

, they can put you at execution level with just 3 skills and they can finish you off, all of this while jumping in their mines.

If you are not able to survive the most telegraphed burst in the game and not able to counter mines, it's a L2P issue, sorry

Plus, they synergize so well with Shock staves and a High Elf Mag Sorc can do powerful damage with Force Pulse , both of which are clearly unreflectable and undodgeable beams that will, once again, help you proc the Execution Passive.

There is no decent sorc using a lightning staff over a fire staff in PvP, which game do you play ?

And you're saying this is not OP? You're saying you got hit the most? You're saying you're being nerfed in this patch like all other classes who will vanish in the next months or become completely irrelevant in PvP?

It's not OP, everyone will adapt, sorc and others too

Either you don't play your class properly, you never tried to play another class or your completely dishonest and scared shitless to lose even one of these priveledges and have to actually fight and earn your kills and have to actually play skillfully and die as often as any other class instead of just sit in the back, one shotting people and streaking away from every root or ground AoE being applied to you.

You are complaining about mechanics you don't even understand and now how it work, it's a l2p issue, sorry again

And please, don't tell me I have to play the class because my main DPS is a mag Sorc and I can hit almost 20k DPS on console, with a rotation I practiced 1 hour a day for 2 weeks, 35k magicka and 2.3k spell damage and mostly blue and green items equipped while my stam sorc hit 15k DPS with Automaton just fresh outta grinding.
Automaton and random Rubedite swords I pick up farming world mobs. 15k. With basically all the passives to unlock.


Even AFK, I can put more dps than that, pls, stop that l2p issue, you just seems stupid.

Enjoy your class but don't try to justify this s#!t.

I enjoy my class, but I can't stop laughing fixing your false informations

Your go to response to just about every Sorc balance thread is L2P followed by insults. I am going to assume English is your second language when you typed "you just seems stupid." Now to the issues, sans insults. Sorc is over performing by leaps and bounds compared to other classes at the moment. A min/maxed Sorc played by a skilled player is about as lethal as they come in PvP right now. With that being said, yes they can be beat. Yes they can be zerged down. But they are performing on a level right now that most other classes can't touch. Often times Sorc advocates concede they are VERY strong 1v1, which is evidenced in most dueling tournaments, but then throw out the "you can't use the 1v1 measure" argument. So that leaves us AvA, small scale, and just plain PvP.

Sorcs are performing extremely well here too. They are able to output extremely high burst damage from RANGE. They have top tier mobility and access to arguably 3 of the most powerful ultimates in the game in the form of Soul Assault, Negate, and Destro ult. Often times I see Sorcs throw out the streak and shield duration nerfs as if it is some type of evidence that their class is balanced. Shields never lasted longer than 6 seconds in a fight and they got an additional shield versus stamina users with the change to annulment, but this is never mentioned. And don't forget all the nerfs to stamina that have happened right along with Sorc nerfs. Unchained, Dodge roll, and Shuffle to name a few.

The 8% increase to fire staff single target damage, out of control ultimates, one of the best executes, unblockable and undodgeable curses and frags that hit as hard as ultimates have gone a long way to fuel the resentment that we now see. All of this coupled with the fact that Sorcs can now run Lich while using a monster set because Lich is now available in all pieces and traits. I get that a lot of these things I listed are not Sorc exclusive but they synergize so well with Sorc it propels the class far past what most builds are able to achieve.

Now with all of that being said the patch notes get released, which is a kick in the teeth to anyone not planning on playing a Warden or already playing a Sorc. Ask yourself why do so many people campaign for Sorc nerfs or more fair class rebalancing? Is it because everyone is stupid like you often suggest or is there a legitimate concern. Before the Shield nerf the Sorc class made bad players look good, good players look great, and great players straight monsters. After the nerf great players stayed great, good players stayed good, and bad players got exposed. Which one are you I wonder.

grim_tactics

Somehow I feel that all the salty players don't play as a Sorc yet they seem to know everything about them, how to play them, and how everything works together.

Or - they're just repeating something some streamer has said cause he got wrecked.

Hmmmmmm.

Xvorg

Now with all of that being said the patch notes get released, which is a kick in the teeth to anyone not planning on playing a Warden or already playing a Sorc. Ask yourself why do so many people campaign for Sorc nerfs or more fair class rebalancing? Is it because everyone is stupid like you often suggest or is there a legitimate concern. Before the Shield nerf the Sorc class made bad players look good, good players look great, and great players straight monsters. After the nerf great players stayed great, good players stayed good, and bad players got exposed. Which one are you I wonder.

The answer is "because they don't know to play their classes... is a l2p issue"

It has been the answer given in threads like this one for years-

They suggest you l2p your class, as they have mastered each class in the game (which is obviously not the case), then they say they are the ones ZoS should listen about sorcs because they are the experts about sorcs, that they have only played sorcs and that sorcs are in a bad spot...

What do non sorcs do? Creates a sorc to play the class, realizes it is the easiest class to play and ask ZoS why they can't give the same treatment to DKs, Temps and NBs.

Then the sorcs go to the thread and give again the generic answer... "they don't know to play their classes... is a l2p issue".

And the cycle starts again.

Jsmalls

Damage shields were nerfed, it shows it in the patch notes, by quite a large %. Everyone is just reading over it without noticing it though. But that's on you, Zos did take action though, if you're too ignorant to realize it good, makes my class stronger by you not knowing.

Xvorg

grim_tactics wrote: »

Somehow I feel that all the salty players don't play as a Sorc yet they seem to know everything about them, how to play them, and how everything works together.

Or - they're just repeating something some streamer has said cause he got wrecked.

Hmmmmmm.

Far from truth. Those who advocate for fair changes have experience playing srcs.

Don't you feel that those who say sorcs are not OP only play sorc and have never tried another class?

Anti_Virus

Aedaryl wrote: »

Weps wrote: »

What makes me laugh is Sorcs people complaining about this patch.
Really. If you're saying you're hit the most you need to learn how to play your own class.
I agree with whoever said that stamsorcs are the poster child of abused CPs and sustain problems and I have to add even Magsorcs and their infinite streaking, shield stacking and whatever other freaking features they have.

Streak cannot be spamming, and this is the ability that's touched the more by sustain nerf, 21% less cost reduction on a 50% skill cost use increase is huge. People can spam heal, why not shield ?

Again, you fooled the whole community once with that Haunting Curse Homestead PTS 1 "nerf", QQing so much about how you could not put enough pressure on enemy players in PvP, that eventually turned into the greatest buff of recent patches. No good sorc will wait 8s for the second curse when you can use it twice in that time. This is only a PvE change.
Is basically this class that makes it impossible to go around with light and medium armor even in CP campaigns, because sneaky nightblades have counters meanwhile 2 sorcs in the same group will nuke you down from 20 metres away before you could even begin to put pressure on them. Even with heavy armor. You don't know how playing a NB if you are not able to survive/escape sorc, l2p issue

This class has the most effective shield stacking of the game, with Hardened Ward (basically the strongest pure damage shield out there and could easily skyrocket your mitigation to 20k plus in PVP ) that can be stacked on top of Harness Magicka that will basically erase his cost while protecting your butt.

Shield is not mitigation, shields have no resistances and can't be crit, thisis not mitigation, like armor

They have Crit Surge who can basically keep them healed while they're murdering you from 20mt away.

Entropy is far better, good sorc don't use critical surge in PvP

They have the Blood Magic passive that will restore you 8% more Health when you cast a Dark Magic ability.

Crystal frag cannot be spammed, and since light armor take the most damage, this passive is just not great, sorc use healing ward when they need HP


So with a Dark Conversion and a 8k plus C-Frag they will be at full health and full magicka with just 2431 stamina and 4050 magicka. Dark Conversion, of course, untouched by this patch.

Dark conversion can only be use in homestead with amberplasm, since you have less regen, cp roll dodge and break free seperate, and less stamina recovery from player that light attack you, this skill can not now be call a magicka regen skill for mag sorc, plus it can be bashed/crushing shocked

They have Unholy Knowledge passive that reduces the cost of magicka and stamina abilities by A LOT and it's the only passive of this kind which remains UNTOUCHED BY THIS PATCH.

5% is only 2% more than breton passive, crying baby asking for nerf, did you tried mag sorc in PTS ? Also, NB regen passive didn't got touched by this patch, stop doing misinformation pls

They have Capacitator who increases your Magicka Recovery by 10%. Again, untouched by this patch.

See above

They have skills and passives that can increase their max Magicka, Health, Magicka return

Slotting 2 skill for 8% max magicka is not a great skill, nb have that in passive, and inner light give 7% max magicka, 10% critical chance, empowered buff, 2% magicka regen, and reveale ennemies near you. The max health is a passive by slotting 2 skill for a pet, which 1% of sorc do in PvP. where is my skill/passive that increase my magicka return ?

And all those skills can also stack Weapon and Spell damage on top of the passive that buffs Physical and Shock Damage that, drum roll please, is helpful to proc their class defyning ability: a second execution. A passive execution.

They have the mobility,

streak took serious nerf, anyone wearing medium armor can have a similar if not better mobility too

the powerful damaging monster set that synergizes so damn well with their shield stacking that grants them the best mitigation out there,

Damage set is not a sorc class ability and everyone say that set need nerf, sorcs are the first. see above for mitigation part

they have an uncounterable, unpurgeable and overpowered ability which is Curse

Curse is purgeable, and counterable by that and by the fact you exactly now when it will damage you.

, they can put you at execution level with just 3 skills and they can finish you off, all of this while jumping in their mines.

If you are not able to survive the most telegraphed burst in the game and not able to counter mines, it's a L2P issue, sorry

Plus, they synergize so well with Shock staves and a High Elf Mag Sorc can do powerful damage with Force Pulse , both of which are clearly unreflectable and undodgeable beams that will, once again, help you proc the Execution Passive.

There is no decent sorc using a lightning staff over a fire staff in PvP, which game do you play ?

And you're saying this is not OP? You're saying you got hit the most? You're saying you're being nerfed in this patch like all other classes who will vanish in the next months or become completely irrelevant in PvP?

It's not OP, everyone will adapt, sorc and others too

Either you don't play your class properly, you never tried to play another class or your completely dishonest and scared shitless to lose even one of these priveledges and have to actually fight and earn your kills and have to actually play skillfully and die as often as any other class instead of just sit in the back, one shotting people and streaking away from every root or ground AoE being applied to you.

You are complaining about mechanics you don't even understand and now how it work, it's a l2p issue, sorry again

And please, don't tell me I have to play the class because my main DPS is a mag Sorc and I can hit almost 20k DPS on console, with a rotation I practiced 1 hour a day for 2 weeks, 35k magicka and 2.3k spell damage and mostly blue and green items equipped while my stam sorc hit 15k DPS with Automaton just fresh outta grinding.
Automaton and random Rubedite swords I pick up farming world mobs. 15k. With basically all the passives to unlock.


Even AFK, I can put more dps than that, pls, stop that l2p issue, you just seems stupid.

Enjoy your class but don't try to justify this s#!t.

I enjoy my class, but I can't stop laughing fixing your false informations

Magicka Sorcerers are OP(over performing) don't worry it will be toned down soon.

Xvorg

Jsmalls wrote: »

Damage shields were nerfed, it shows it in the patch notes, by quite a large %. Everyone is just reading over it without noticing it though. But that's on you, Zos did take action though, if you're too ignorant to realize it good, makes my class stronger by you not knowing.

I have a Mageblade. That mageblade relies on 2 mechanics: annulment and cloak. It's the only way I can heal efficiently.

The thing is that Radiant Magelight (3780 magicka) brings down my first "defensive barrier". The second is taken down through heavy dmg

I also had a mage sorc (now moar of a hybrid). That magesorc relied on 2 defensive mechanics: annulment and conjured ward. To take dow my firs barrier (conjured), an enemy had to use a rotation including heavy hitting skills. Moar than 3780 magicka/stamina. Then the second barrier (annulment) entered in action. And the enemy had to use a similar rotation to get down that 2nd barrier. During that time, I had the option to recast the first barrier and keep my health bar untouched.

Also I had the option to morph annulment into harness magicka, recovering magicka on every smagick dmg at me. On top of that, crystal frags had a chance of proccing each time I casted a shield, for 50% its cost and a 20% moar dmg.

As a NB using cloak, i CAN'T recast cloak during the 5 secs magelight effect lasts. Also I have no option to purge it. As a Magsorc I can recast each shield as much as I can as log as I have magicka.

Yes, I can stack healing ward and annulment, but the benefits of using cloak are lost (healing ward takes you out of cloak), besides 3 skills for protection leaves my bar plenty of crap. How do I do dmg? How can I have some sustain? The option is to drop cloak, and if I do that, what's the point of playing mageblade?

Hankrabbit

MagSorc is just fine. Pirate Skeleton is the problem. The 30% damage reduction should not be applied on shields.
I mainly playing StamNb in PvP and in duels and defeated many really good Sorcs on Ps4. You need good timed CC's and the right burst. Pressure them, drain their ressource pools and dodge their frags. good game 2 easy

Vaoh

With all of these cost reductions and such I'm getting the feeling that Sorcs will have to put out low damage in order to sustain their shields even remotely well at all.

People should be calling for the Pirate Skeleton monster set to be nerfed. This is what grants Mag Sorcs the over-the-top survivability they have now.

Izaki

Xvorg wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Weps wrote: »

What makes me laugh is Sorcs people complaining about this patch.
Really. If you're saying you're hit the most you need to learn how to play your own class.
I agree with whoever said that stamsorcs are the poster child of abused CPs and sustain problems and I have to add even Magsorcs and their infinite streaking, shield stacking and whatever other freaking features they have.

Again, you fooled the whole community once with that Haunting Curse Homestead PTS 1 "nerf", QQing so much about how you could not put enough pressure on enemy players in PvP, that eventually turned into the greatest buff of recent patches.
Is basically this class that makes it impossible to go around with light and medium armor even in CP campaigns, because sneaky nightblades have counters meanwhile 2 sorcs in the same group will nuke you down from 20 metres away before you could even begin to put pressure on them. Even with heavy armor.

This class has the most effective shield stacking of the game, with Hardened Ward (basically the strongest pure damage shield out there and could easily skyrocket your mitigation to 20k plus in PVP ) that can be stacked on top of Harness Magicka that will basically erase his cost while protecting your butt.
They have Crit Surge who can basically keep them healed while they're murdering you from 20mt away.
They have the Blood Magic passive that will restore you 8% more Health when you cast a Dark Magic ability.
So with a Dark Conversion and a 8k plus C-Frag they will be at full health and full magicka with just 2431 stamina and 4050 magicka. Dark Conversion, of course, untouched by this patch.
They have Unholy Knowledge passive that reduces the cost of magicka and stamina abilities by A LOT and it's the only passive of this kind which remains UNTOUCHED BY THIS PATCH.
They have Capacitator who increases your Magicka Recovery by 10%. Again, untouched by this patch.
They have skills and passives that can increase their max Magicka, Health, Magicka return. And all those skills can also stack Weapon and Spell damage on top of the passive that buffs Physical and Shock Damage that, drum roll please, is helpful to proc their class defyning ability: a second execution. A passive execution.
They have the mobility, the powerful damaging monster set that synergizes so damn well with their shield stacking that grants them the best mitigation out there, they have an uncounterable, unpurgeable and overpowered ability which is Curse, they can put you at execution level with just 3 skills and they can finish you off, all of this while jumping in their mines.
Plus, they synergize so well with Shock staves and a High Elf Mag Sorc can do powerful damage with Force Pulse, both of which are clearly unreflectable and undodgeable beams that will, once again, help you proc the Execution Passive.

And you're saying this is not OP? You're saying you got hit the most? You're saying you're being nerfed in this patch like all other classes who will vanish in the next months or become completely irrelevant in PvP?

Either you don't play your class properly, you never tried to play another class or your completely dishonest and scared shitless to lose even one of these priveledges and have to actually fight and earn your kills and have to actually play skillfully and die as often as any other class instead of just sit in the back, one shotting people and streaking away from every root or ground AoE being applied to you.

And please, don't tell me I have to play the class because my main DPS is a mag Sorc and I can hit almost 20k DPS on console, with a rotation I practiced 1 hour a day for 2 weeks, 35k magicka and 2.3k spell damage and mostly blue and green items equipped while my stam sorc hit 15k DPS with Automaton just fresh outta grinding.
Automaton and random Rubedite swords I pick up farming world mobs. 15k. With basically all the passives to unlock.


Enjoy your class but don't try to justify this s#!t.

You forgot the passive that reduces the ulti cost in the same amout Akaviri Dragonguard (a 5 pieces set) does

Yeah, at this point bring in the Catalyst passive (20 ult on potion use), the Siphoning passive (every 4 seconds gain 2 extra ultimate), the Dawn's Wrath passive (3 ult every 6 seconds) and the Earthen Heart passive (3 ult every 6 seconds). All of these give roughly the same ultimate gain as the Powerstone passive.

Do you know the catalist passive can be used each 45 secs? Than you need 40 secs to get 20 ulti with siph passive? and that together they reach simiar numbers to the reduction provided by power stone if you are aiming for EOTS?

In other words, you need at least 45 secs of depleting your magicka pool and potion inventory to get what sorcs has granted...

Seriously, try harder

@Xvorg
Destro ultimate on a Sorc costs 213 ult. The only ultimate gain Sorcs have is the basic ultimate gain, aka Light, Heavy attacks and block, this is 3 ultimate every second for 9 seconds. From here its pretty easy to see that it will take a Sorc 71 seconds to get the Destro ult charged.

Destro ultimate on a NB costs 250 ult. With the standard ult gain and the siphoning passive, you have the standard ult gain + the extra 2 ult every 2 seconds. This is basically 4 ult per second. Which gives you 62.5 seconds to charge the Destro ult. And that's without the potions. So lets take into account the potions. Basically, you start with 0 ult and you drink your potion, that gives you 20 ult right off the bat, which basically takes the cost down to 230 ultimate. At this point, you'll take 57.5 seconds to get your destro ult, if you don't drink a second potion. If you do, then it will take you 52.5 seconds to charge a Destro ult if a Siphoning ability is cast every 2 seconds (not hard at all). So a NB will get a destro ultimate almost 20 seconds faster than a Sorc would. That's quite a large margin. Even if you don't use a siphing abilty every 2 seconds, you'll still get your ult faster than a sorc would.

So what were you saying? Try harder? I think that applies to you

Izaki

Edziu wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

sorceresr never got big nerf like other classes, example: magdk since game start was godmode, then nerf to the ground and unplayalbe for over year, templar have buff an nerf but big nerfs very hurting like now stamplar is unplayable in vpe since few months and now more unplayable, nb similiar, once was good and then now until now and nb is stil worst class for dps while sorc was damn never that down with nerf like other classes and this is balance? while very other class was up and at the bottom sorc was never at bottom, only as average or on top

Streak was nerfed

They will feel the burn of course changes the most.

only streak truly nerfed huh? maybe few patches ago but what now?
did the got nerf to their main sustain? did they got nerf to their main defense and survivability? did they got nerf to their most important class skills? no

sorceres now didng get any nerf like dk now is *** with sustain, templar *** with healing and how nb was *** with dps in pve and open fights in pvp he is now *** more because ZO$ took his only unique in compare to other classes - sustain from siphoning attacks to very long fights whiel dealing damage

sorc still have everything what he have now, only thing when he can suffer is nerf in cp but templar, dk and nb will feel nerf 2-4x more than sorc because class skills nerf

Streak got nerfed 7 times man. Just cause this patch and the 2 patches prior to that they didn't receive a nerf, doesn't mean they need one. Sorcerers were relying heavily on cost reduction in both PvP and PvE, I'd even go as far as saying more than other classes. Shield stacking is expensive, the PvE Pet rotation is VERY expensive. Force Pulse is also an expensive spammable. The only thing you could call more or less cheap in a Sorc's kit is Curse, the Execute and the proc'ed Frags. Mines and Streak both cost absurd amounts.

streak got nerfet 7 times and still on live its spammable minimum 4 times before he will stop whiel trying to run away
I dont see shield stacking is expensive when every not bad sorc I will meet have 100% shields uptime in fight
while stacking or spamming with force pulse frag pulse and here you are, range hit with stun with nb incap strike if you dont dodge/block it
sorc dont need to spam force pulse in pvp and in pve, in pve like every other magica skill its procing very cheap crystal frag, in pvp you dont spam force pulse because you shieldstacking also and reapplying curse with fragment proc and execute ofc

and about mines you jsut casting it and walking around them kiting your melee enemy unlti he will get hit by most of them which isnt to fast or if is fast you have still enought magica and time to regen magica because those mines arnt weak in damage when someone is clearing them

You don't get do you? A sorcs way to sustain was only cost reduction and regen in the first place.

SirMewser

Neighbor wrote: »

There is so much garbage that makes Sorcs good too that they need to change.
-Shields need to be crittable
-Bastion needs to be removed
-Pirate skeleton needs real nerfs
-Lich, Amberplasm, Synablade all need to be nerfed
-There needs to be a debuff to reduce shield effectiveness

Even with all that, Sorcs would still be far and away the best PvP class. But at the very least the gap would be closer.

You say all of that but not reverting the; duration reduction to (most) shields, negate magic absorbing even physical damage, and battle spirit halving the magnitude?

Not sure if you are trying to insult people with cognitive disorders or trying to be funny, regardless, this is very short-sighted and is demanding drastic changes prior to minor ones over time with actual testing rather than reading text.

You are promoting ZoS' radical changes made to classes by suggesting your own.

What side are you actually on?

If anything wants to be changed, you can't favor one side of an argument, and provide lousy feedback.

smacx250

My sorc's theme song for this patch!

https://youtu.be/O3GiDF0tV94