What's the point of running Templar healers now? (PTS natch potes)

SilverWF

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

SilverWF wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

And they will still be the best healers and supports. That is not going to change.

Not. Major mending loss removes best healer title.
Changes in Repentance and Shards removing best support title.
Try better next time.

Sorc/NB healers don't have Major Mending.
DK's Major Mending will be pathetic next patch.
No one has Minor Mending except for Templar.
So who will become the best healer? Warden? Have you seen Warden's major mending uptime? No? So how do you assume that they will become the best healer?

Shard's removing? What? They are still there. Shard will be more effective than Orb so it shouldn't be any issue.

Yeah but repentance nerf is BS, that shouldn't go live.

Who said about Sorcs and NB? They are really good DDs, why the hell play on them as healers?
DKs mending would be OK for healer, coz they rarely being hit and their shield would go for full time.
Who need Minor mending if there is Major?
There is always situations where someone goes under 50% HP - heal them once - 10 secs of Major Mending on you.
Removing tittle, not shards ><

CaiWenji

CaiWenji wrote: »

Paraflex wrote: »

I main a Templar healer in pvp and I like the changes. You will have to run light armor to support a group and have less tools to bring to the table. We don't need to excel in every part of group play. BOL and minor mending is a good change my only issue is why does the Warden the new class the only one having access to major mending permanently? That's kind of unfair because its the new class to sell...

I used run Templar healer in PvP too. I stopped once I read that Total Dark(black ball skill and best offense against Magicka players) would now give them cc immunity once it pops. With cc immunity you can still cast on them but then it's only more like proximity detonation but crappy. If they don't have cc immunity it reflects most spells back at them. Their strength becomes their demise.

They buffed it too a bit ago. But the original is still better than now. The buff was unlimited targets simultaneously casted on from the same temp. But usually only one or few powerful sorcs in enemy groups. So I'd prefer stopping that or those targets one by one rather than splitting up my dmg and granting their whole team cc immunity.

Kalzzifer

The big question is: will the templar buffed after everyone bought the Warden?

Make Templars great again! (BTW templar is a support class (no matter as healer or dd) and should remain a support class)6

FENGRUSH

SilverWF wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

SilverWF wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

And they will still be the best healers and supports. That is not going to change.

Not. Major mending loss removes best healer title.
Changes in Repentance and Shards removing best support title.
Try better next time.

Sorc/NB healers don't have Major Mending.
DK's Major Mending will be pathetic next patch.
No one has Minor Mending except for Templar.
So who will become the best healer? Warden? Have you seen Warden's major mending uptime? No? So how do you assume that they will become the best healer?

Shard's removing? What? They are still there. Shard will be more effective than Orb so it shouldn't be any issue.

Yeah but repentance nerf is BS, that shouldn't go live.

Who said about Sorcs and NB? They are really good DDs, why the hell play on them as healers?
DKs mending would be OK for healer, coz they rarely being hit and their shield would go for full time.
Who need Minor mending if there is Major?
There is always situations where someone goes under 50% HP - heal them once - 10 secs of Major Mending on you.
Removing tittle, not shards ><

LOL - its ok to list sorcs and NBs together as 'really good DDs'. But you cant list warden and templar together as 'really good healers.' Sorry - one has to be the best in his book when it comes to his role.

Its all comical as well since templars can still pull more DPS than a NB dropping beams in raid. I know theres a language barrier here with this guy but looks like theres general understanding issues too.

hmsdragonfly

SilverWF wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

SilverWF wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

And they will still be the best healers and supports. That is not going to change.

Not. Major mending loss removes best healer title.
Changes in Repentance and Shards removing best support title.
Try better next time.

Sorc/NB healers don't have Major Mending.
DK's Major Mending will be pathetic next patch.
No one has Minor Mending except for Templar.
So who will become the best healer? Warden? Have you seen Warden's major mending uptime? No? So how do you assume that they will become the best healer?

Shard's removing? What? They are still there. Shard will be more effective than Orb so it shouldn't be any issue.

Yeah but repentance nerf is BS, that shouldn't go live.

Who said about Sorcs and NB? They are really good DDs, why the hell play on them as healers?
DKs mending would be OK for healer, coz they rarely being hit and their shield would go for full time.
Who need Minor mending if there is Major?
There is always situations where someone goes under 50% HP - heal them once - 10 secs of Major Mending on you.
Removing tittle, not shards ><

If a Templar can DPS so why can't Sorc/NB heal? And no, NB isn't good as good as Templar at DPSing.
In vet trials, healers are being hit often enough to make DK's major mending uptime pretty low. You can test it yourself
As for warden, ZOS said they are adjusting their major mending uptime. If they do not keep their words, you will have my support.

As for shard, orb costs 1k more, stupidly slow, hard to aim, deals much less damage. Shard will be better than Orb, making Templar healers more effective in the min-max side of things.

ZOS_Bill

We've had to remove a few posts for some baiting and flaming. It's ok to disagree, but please try and stay civil and follow the forum rules when doing so.

Gomumon

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Gomumon wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

I am getting really tired of these insults: "Templars are just a simple healing class" etc.

I wonder how many times us simple, privileged Templars that deserve to get nerfed to oblivion in your opinion have kept your asses alive and your resources going during the game?

Skip it already! A nightblade, dragonknight or a sorc would have done the same, but because they didn't get the CORE-supportskills, they where never chosen to be healer. You and all the other templars, who are used be the one and only, are just not capable to accept that YOU ARE NOT THAT SPECIAL ANYMORE

/rant

Are you serious? If you were all this time so envious to people who chose to play templars, why didn't you just make one yourself?

This is not about "being special". This is about crippling a class. Maybe you enjoy to see it happening to others, I certainly don't and wouldn't wish it on any sorc, NB (that is too late unfortunately) or DK.

It's difficult to understand people this spiteful exist.

Yeah right. I already play 2 of them. The people, which are playing it are not in my interest. You could feel special all day long. I don't care.

It is not about crippling a class. It is about to make an too good class comparable. The class was to good for healing and supporting and now this is gone. Now It is still good or even slightly better as the others. But you feel entiteled to be the unreachable healer for chosing the templar. Now you have to work for your place as a healer. And you can't accept it. You got 3 years of beeing the best by default. I hope you enjoyed this time enough. And when you major up, you can stop the salt in the end...

What's the point in even having classes if everyone is going to be able to do anything just as good as anyone else? The beauty of an RPG is that you PLAY a ROLE; usually a warrior, mage, cleric, rouge, ranger, or berserker, or a subclass of them.

The QQ coming from templars is pretty pathetic. The very idea that they might not be meta healers anymore is apparently too much for them to take.

Should they never ever add another class then? They have a healer, they have a tank, they have two DPS classes (ranged and melee).

By your logic it's done, no new classes ever. All because Templars want to retain superiority forever.

I'm talking about classes, not roles. What's pathetic has been the QQ all these years who want every class to be good at everything. By that logic, yes, there's no point in even having separate classes.

In any other RPG, nobody *** that the cleric can't do as much DPS as the mage, or that the warrior can't heal as much as the cleric. It should be no different here.

If you're more concerned with aesthetics (being able to heal on a Sorcerer, NB, or DK just as good as a Templar because you like the aesthetic of those classes better), then maybe an MMO RPG isn't for you. The point of an RPG is to play a class archetype that fits in with what you wanna do, but at a sacrifice of not being able to do another thing better.

Templars should be the best clerics.
Dragonknights should be the best warriors.
Sorcerers should be the best mages.
Nightblade should be the best rogues.
And Wardens should be the best rangers.

If you wanna play something where everything performs the same no matter how it looks, go play CS:GO/COD and paint your guns. ZOS pandering to players like you is why this game has turned into Participation Trophy Simulator 3.0.

masterbroodub17_ESO

Gomumon wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Gomumon wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

I am getting really tired of these insults: "Templars are just a simple healing class" etc.

I wonder how many times us simple, privileged Templars that deserve to get nerfed to oblivion in your opinion have kept your asses alive and your resources going during the game?

Skip it already! A nightblade, dragonknight or a sorc would have done the same, but because they didn't get the CORE-supportskills, they where never chosen to be healer. You and all the other templars, who are used be the one and only, are just not capable to accept that YOU ARE NOT THAT SPECIAL ANYMORE

/rant

Are you serious? If you were all this time so envious to people who chose to play templars, why didn't you just make one yourself?

This is not about "being special". This is about crippling a class. Maybe you enjoy to see it happening to others, I certainly don't and wouldn't wish it on any sorc, NB (that is too late unfortunately) or DK.

It's difficult to understand people this spiteful exist.

Yeah right. I already play 2 of them. The people, which are playing it are not in my interest. You could feel special all day long. I don't care.

It is not about crippling a class. It is about to make an too good class comparable. The class was to good for healing and supporting and now this is gone. Now It is still good or even slightly better as the others. But you feel entiteled to be the unreachable healer for chosing the templar. Now you have to work for your place as a healer. And you can't accept it. You got 3 years of beeing the best by default. I hope you enjoyed this time enough. And when you major up, you can stop the salt in the end...

What's the point in even having classes if everyone is going to be able to do anything just as good as anyone else? The beauty of an RPG is that you PLAY a ROLE; usually a warrior, mage, cleric, rouge, ranger, or berserker, or a subclass of them.

The QQ coming from templars is pretty pathetic. The very idea that they might not be meta healers anymore is apparently too much for them to take.

Should they never ever add another class then? They have a healer, they have a tank, they have two DPS classes (ranged and melee).

By your logic it's done, no new classes ever. All because Templars want to retain superiority forever.

Templars should be the best clerics.
Dragonknights shouldbe the best warriors.
Sorcerers should be the best mages.
Nightblade should be the best rogues.
And Wardens should be the best rangers.

If you wanna play something where everything performs the same no matter how it looks, go play CS:GO/COD and paint your guns.

So now you claim to know what ZoS intends with warden? Pretty sure they already put something out on that and you are way off-base. Try again.

Gomumon

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

So now you claim to know what ZoS intends with warden? Pretty sure they already put something out on that and you are way off-base. Try again.

You're still here trolling? Here is a definition of a ranger archetype.
"The Ranger Classes: Other Names: Hunter. Rangers are woodsmen skilled at surviving in the wild...Rangers may also be skilled in some form of wilderness or nature magic. [...] We're talking about the forest-dwelling recluse who serves as a self-appointed guardian for their ancient and enchanted home."
"The Beast Master Ranger: Living out in the wilderness is just easier with a loyal dog at your side and a hawk on your arm. This variant employs a number of beasts, and can be as simple as a Houndmaster using two or three dogs, to something more fantastic like a snake charmer or dinosaur rider. Different from the Druid because the Beast Master Ranger is still a martial class who fights alongside his beasts."

ESO - Introducing The Warden: "If you are interested in a class that uses the wilds of Tamriel to protect, heal, or deal damage (occasionally all at the same time) the Warden is for you.

“The nature-based class was a core player fantasy that we hadn't fulfilled with the four classes that currently exist," says the Warden's Lead Designer Eric Wrobel. “So we wanted to give people the ability to express themselves that way."

Like nature itself, the Warden is an irresistible, chaotic force in battle, able to summon fierce animals, sprout healing plants from the ground, or cloak themselves and others in protective ice.

The inspiration for the character's design in part comes from traditional nature-based archetypes and in part from the Elder Scrolls' Spinners – the Wood Elf priests of Y'ffre who use storytelling to preserve Bosmer culture."

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, odds are it's a duck. Contrary to what you'd like to believe, ZOS didn't design the RP elements of class archetypes much different than virtually every fantasy RPG, ever. Try again.

masterbroodub17_ESO

Gomumon wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

So now you claim to know what ZoS intends with warden? Pretty sure they already put something out on that and you are way off-base. Try again.

You're still here trolling? Here is a definition of a ranger archetype.
"The Ranger Classes: Other Names: Hunter. Rangers are woodsmen skilled at surviving in the wild...Rangers may also be skilled in some form of wilderness or nature magic. [...] We're talking about the forest-dwelling recluse who serves as a self-appointed guardian for their ancient and enchanted home."
"The Beast Master Ranger: Living out in the wilderness is just easier with a loyal dog at your side and a hawk on your arm. This variant employs a number of beasts, and can be as simple as a Houndmaster using two or three dogs, to something more fantastic like a snake charmer or dinosaur rider. Different from the Druid because the Beast Master Ranger is still a martial class who fights alongside his beasts."

ESO - Introducing The Warden: "If you are interested in a class that uses the wilds of Tamriel to protect, heal, or deal damage (occasionally all at the same time) the Warden is for you.

“The nature-based class was a core player fantasy that we hadn't fulfilled with the four classes that currently exist," says the Warden's Lead Designer Eric Wrobel. “So we wanted to give people the ability to express themselves that way."

Like nature itself, the Warden is an irresistible, chaotic force in battle, able to summon fierce animals, sprout healing plants from the ground, or cloak themselves and others in protective ice.

The inspiration for the character's design in part comes from traditional nature-based archetypes and in part from the Elder Scrolls' Spinners – the Wood Elf priests of Y'ffre who use storytelling to preserve Bosmer culture."

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, odds are it's a duck. Contrary to what you'd like to believe, ZOS didn't design the RP elements of class archetypes much different than virtually every fantasy RPG, ever. Try again.

Their lore matches rangers which proves......what exactly? Ranger can't be healers? Rangers can't be tanks? Pretty sure they've been all those things throughout RPGs

At no point does the lore you linked from ZoS OR the other sources ever pigeonhole it. You've proven exactly nothing.

LordSlif

Sorcs untouchable

Gomumon

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Their lore matches rangers which proves......what exactly? Ranger can't be healers? Rangers can't be tanks? Pretty sure they've been all those things throughout RPGs

At no point does the lore you linked from ZoS OR the other sources ever pigeonhole it. You've proven exactly nothing.

Gomumon wrote: »

In any other RPG, nobody *** that the cleric can't do as much DPS as the mage, or that the warrior can't heal as much as the cleric. It should be no different here.

If you're more concerned with aesthetics (being able to heal on a Sorcerer, NB, or DK just as good as a Templar because you like the aesthetic of those classes better), then maybe an MMO RPG isn't for you. The point of an RPG is to play a class archetype that fits in with what you wanna do, but at a sacrifice of not being able to do another thing better.

Templars should be the best clerics.
Dragonknights should be the best warriors.
Sorcerers should be the best mages.
Nightblade should be the best rogues.
And Wardens should be the best rangers.

If you wanna play something where everything performs the same no matter how it looks, go play CS:GO/COD and paint your guns. ZOS pandering to players like you is why this game has turned into Participation Trophy Simulator 3.0.

You're grasping at straws. No point in typing it again. If you still don't get it, there's no point in even replying to me. L2R: www.hookedonphonics.com

GallantGuardian

The only changes im concerned with are repentance and shards...

Make repentance a stamina steal that way anyone using the ability can get stamina back... the magika steal option is far from op... i use it on my magplar dps build and it isnt filling my bar completely but atleast while its up im getting some stamina back with out having to constantly throw heavy attacks as a tank.. when a lot of times that not an option

Also shards ... make it share coold down with orbs if you must but can you allow templars to retosre

hmsdragonfly

Gomumon wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Gomumon wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

I am getting really tired of these insults: "Templars are just a simple healing class" etc.

I wonder how many times us simple, privileged Templars that deserve to get nerfed to oblivion in your opinion have kept your asses alive and your resources going during the game?

Skip it already! A nightblade, dragonknight or a sorc would have done the same, but because they didn't get the CORE-supportskills, they where never chosen to be healer. You and all the other templars, who are used be the one and only, are just not capable to accept that YOU ARE NOT THAT SPECIAL ANYMORE

/rant

Are you serious? If you were all this time so envious to people who chose to play templars, why didn't you just make one yourself?

This is not about "being special". This is about crippling a class. Maybe you enjoy to see it happening to others, I certainly don't and wouldn't wish it on any sorc, NB (that is too late unfortunately) or DK.

It's difficult to understand people this spiteful exist.

Yeah right. I already play 2 of them. The people, which are playing it are not in my interest. You could feel special all day long. I don't care.

It is not about crippling a class. It is about to make an too good class comparable. The class was to good for healing and supporting and now this is gone. Now It is still good or even slightly better as the others. But you feel entiteled to be the unreachable healer for chosing the templar. Now you have to work for your place as a healer. And you can't accept it. You got 3 years of beeing the best by default. I hope you enjoyed this time enough. And when you major up, you can stop the salt in the end...

What's the point in even having classes if everyone is going to be able to do anything just as good as anyone else? The beauty of an RPG is that you PLAY a ROLE; usually a warrior, mage, cleric, rouge, ranger, or berserker, or a subclass of them.

The QQ coming from templars is pretty pathetic. The very idea that they might not be meta healers anymore is apparently too much for them to take.

Should they never ever add another class then? They have a healer, they have a tank, they have two DPS classes (ranged and melee).

By your logic it's done, no new classes ever. All because Templars want to retain superiority forever.

I'm talking about classes, not roles. What's pathetic has been the QQ all these years who want every class to be good at everything. By that logic, yes, there's no point in even having separate classes.

In any other RPG, nobody *** that the cleric can't do as much DPS as the mage, or that the warrior can't heal as much as the cleric. It should be no different here.

If you're more concerned with aesthetics (being able to heal on a Sorcerer, NB, or DK just as good as a Templar because you like the aesthetic of those classes better), then maybe an MMO RPG isn't for you. The point of an RPG is to play a class archetype that fits in with what you wanna do, but at a sacrifice of not being able to do another thing better.

Templars should be the best clerics.
Dragonknights should be the best warriors.
Sorcerers should be the best mages.
Nightblade should be the best rogues.
And Wardens should be the best rangers.

If you wanna play something where everything performs the same no matter how it looks, go play CS:GO/COD and paint your guns. ZOS pandering to players like you is why this game has turned into Participation Trophy Simulator 3.0.

100000th person who assumes that Templar healers will be worse than NB/Sorc/DK healers. Welcome to the party.

Btw
Magicka Dragonknights are basically Pyromancers (aka Fire mages).
Magicka Nightblades are Mages mastered in Alteration Magic.

Not going to argue but it seems like your assumption of the archetype isn't entirely correct. Every class is a mage and every class is also a warrior.

Gandrhulf_Harbard

Troneon wrote: »

Illurian wrote: »

Also, I find it hilarious that the strongest class at the moment (mag sorcs) were completely untouched, while everything else suffered significant nerfs.

Been happening since forever...

I take it Mr Wrobel mains a MagSorc?

All The Best

Gomumon

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Gomumon wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Gomumon wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

I am getting really tired of these insults: "Templars are just a simple healing class" etc.

I wonder how many times us simple, privileged Templars that deserve to get nerfed to oblivion in your opinion have kept your asses alive and your resources going during the game?

Skip it already! A nightblade, dragonknight or a sorc would have done the same, but because they didn't get the CORE-supportskills, they where never chosen to be healer. You and all the other templars, who are used be the one and only, are just not capable to accept that YOU ARE NOT THAT SPECIAL ANYMORE

/rant

Are you serious? If you were all this time so envious to people who chose to play templars, why didn't you just make one yourself?

This is not about "being special". This is about crippling a class. Maybe you enjoy to see it happening to others, I certainly don't and wouldn't wish it on any sorc, NB (that is too late unfortunately) or DK.

It's difficult to understand people this spiteful exist.

Yeah right. I already play 2 of them. The people, which are playing it are not in my interest. You could feel special all day long. I don't care.

It is not about crippling a class. It is about to make an too good class comparable. The class was to good for healing and supporting and now this is gone. Now It is still good or even slightly better as the others. But you feel entiteled to be the unreachable healer for chosing the templar. Now you have to work for your place as a healer. And you can't accept it. You got 3 years of beeing the best by default. I hope you enjoyed this time enough. And when you major up, you can stop the salt in the end...

What's the point in even having classes if everyone is going to be able to do anything just as good as anyone else? The beauty of an RPG is that you PLAY a ROLE; usually a warrior, mage, cleric, rouge, ranger, or berserker, or a subclass of them.

The QQ coming from templars is pretty pathetic. The very idea that they might not be meta healers anymore is apparently too much for them to take.

Should they never ever add another class then? They have a healer, they have a tank, they have two DPS classes (ranged and melee).

By your logic it's done, no new classes ever. All because Templars want to retain superiority forever.

I'm talking about classes, not roles. What's pathetic has been the QQ all these years who want every class to be good at everything. By that logic, yes, there's no point in even having separate classes.

In any other RPG, nobody *** that the cleric can't do as much DPS as the mage, or that the warrior can't heal as much as the cleric. It should be no different here.

If you're more concerned with aesthetics (being able to heal on a Sorcerer, NB, or DK just as good as a Templar because you like the aesthetic of those classes better), then maybe an MMO RPG isn't for you. The point of an RPG is to play a class archetype that fits in with what you wanna do, but at a sacrifice of not being able to do another thing better.

Templars should be the best clerics.
Dragonknights should be the best warriors.
Sorcerers should be the best mages.
Nightblade should be the best rogues.
And Wardens should be the best rangers.

If you wanna play something where everything performs the same no matter how it looks, go play CS:GO/COD and paint your guns. ZOS pandering to players like you is why this game has turned into Participation Trophy Simulator 3.0.

100000+ person who assumes that Templar healers will be worse than NB/Sorc/DK healers. Welcome to the party.

Btw
Magicka Dragonknights are basically Pyromancers (aka Fire mages).
Magicka Nightblades are Mages mastered in Alteration Magic.

Not going to argue but it seems like your assumption of the archetype isn't entirely correct. Every class is a mage and every class is also a warrior.

I never said that any class can't fall into another archetype. I'm just saying each class should have pros/cons to their obvious archetype. I'm aware that ZOS wanted to give everyone the potential to be either a Fighter, Mage, Cleric, Assassin, or Ranger, but that doesn't mean that every class should see the same result in each.

As I've said before, if they want sameness they may as well do away with classes. Last I checked, this was still an RPG and not an adventure game. Differences in class performance should be more than superficial; ability choice more than aesthetic preference.

Jemcrystal

I just want a healer that is easy. As in the one class you can eat a burrito, watch youtube, and run a dungeon all at the same time. There is no easy dungeon running class in this game with this balance obsession. It's to much like Square Enix's Final Fantasy XI. All of a sudden you have to work at being a healer. Research, builds, best armor. I miss the days (in general mmo gaming) when healer was harder to take down than a tank even if they showed up in the nude and could "/follow" the group and just had to hit a button if the screen started showing red. I don't want to work at a game. I want to play at a game. I miss the easy life. It made queue up on dungeon finders quicker - you only had to hunt high and low for a tank.

hmsdragonfly

Gomumon wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Gomumon wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Gomumon wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

I am getting really tired of these insults: "Templars are just a simple healing class" etc.

I wonder how many times us simple, privileged Templars that deserve to get nerfed to oblivion in your opinion have kept your asses alive and your resources going during the game?

Skip it already! A nightblade, dragonknight or a sorc would have done the same, but because they didn't get the CORE-supportskills, they where never chosen to be healer. You and all the other templars, who are used be the one and only, are just not capable to accept that YOU ARE NOT THAT SPECIAL ANYMORE

/rant

Are you serious? If you were all this time so envious to people who chose to play templars, why didn't you just make one yourself?

This is not about "being special". This is about crippling a class. Maybe you enjoy to see it happening to others, I certainly don't and wouldn't wish it on any sorc, NB (that is too late unfortunately) or DK.

It's difficult to understand people this spiteful exist.

Yeah right. I already play 2 of them. The people, which are playing it are not in my interest. You could feel special all day long. I don't care.

It is not about crippling a class. It is about to make an too good class comparable. The class was to good for healing and supporting and now this is gone. Now It is still good or even slightly better as the others. But you feel entiteled to be the unreachable healer for chosing the templar. Now you have to work for your place as a healer. And you can't accept it. You got 3 years of beeing the best by default. I hope you enjoyed this time enough. And when you major up, you can stop the salt in the end...

What's the point in even having classes if everyone is going to be able to do anything just as good as anyone else? The beauty of an RPG is that you PLAY a ROLE; usually a warrior, mage, cleric, rouge, ranger, or berserker, or a subclass of them.

The QQ coming from templars is pretty pathetic. The very idea that they might not be meta healers anymore is apparently too much for them to take.

Should they never ever add another class then? They have a healer, they have a tank, they have two DPS classes (ranged and melee).

By your logic it's done, no new classes ever. All because Templars want to retain superiority forever.

I'm talking about classes, not roles. What's pathetic has been the QQ all these years who want every class to be good at everything. By that logic, yes, there's no point in even having separate classes.

In any other RPG, nobody *** that the cleric can't do as much DPS as the mage, or that the warrior can't heal as much as the cleric. It should be no different here.

If you're more concerned with aesthetics (being able to heal on a Sorcerer, NB, or DK just as good as a Templar because you like the aesthetic of those classes better), then maybe an MMO RPG isn't for you. The point of an RPG is to play a class archetype that fits in with what you wanna do, but at a sacrifice of not being able to do another thing better.

Templars should be the best clerics.
Dragonknights should be the best warriors.
Sorcerers should be the best mages.
Nightblade should be the best rogues.
And Wardens should be the best rangers.

If you wanna play something where everything performs the same no matter how it looks, go play CS:GO/COD and paint your guns. ZOS pandering to players like you is why this game has turned into Participation Trophy Simulator 3.0.

100000+ person who assumes that Templar healers will be worse than NB/Sorc/DK healers. Welcome to the party.

Btw
Magicka Dragonknights are basically Pyromancers (aka Fire mages).
Magicka Nightblades are Mages mastered in Alteration Magic.

Not going to argue but it seems like your assumption of the archetype isn't entirely correct. Every class is a mage and every class is also a warrior.

I never said that any class can't fall into another archetype. I'm just saying each class should have pros/cons to their obvious archetype. I'm aware that ZOS wanted to give everyone the potential to be either a Fighter, Mage, Cleric, Assassin, or Ranger, but that doesn't mean that every class should see the same result in each.

As I've said before, if they want sameness they may as well do away with classes. Last I checked, this was still an RPG and not an adventure game. Differences in class performance should be more than superficial; ability choice more than aesthetic preference.

Of course every class has their pros and cons. Templar is the best healer and DK is the best tank. And they will still be. Doesn't mean we shouldn't make non-Templar healers as viable as we can, Templar will still be the best class in healing, so what's the deal?

FENGRUSH

Jemcrystal wrote: »

I just want a healer that is easy. As in the one class you can eat a burrito, watch youtube, and run a dungeon all at the same time. There is no easy dungeon running class in this game with this balance obsession. It's to much like Square Enix's Final Fantasy XI. All of a sudden you have to work at being a healer. Research, builds, best armor. I miss the days (in general mmo gaming) when healer was harder to take down than a tank even if they showed up in the nude and could "/follow" the group and just had to hit a button if the screen started showing red. I don't want to work at a game. I want to play at a game. I miss the easy life. It made queue up on dungeon finders quicker - you only had to hunt high and low for a tank.

Every templars feels right now

masterbroodub17_ESO

Gomumon wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Gomumon wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Gomumon wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

SorataArisugawa wrote: »

Northern_Eve wrote: »

I am getting really tired of these insults: "Templars are just a simple healing class" etc.

I wonder how many times us simple, privileged Templars that deserve to get nerfed to oblivion in your opinion have kept your asses alive and your resources going during the game?

Skip it already! A nightblade, dragonknight or a sorc would have done the same, but because they didn't get the CORE-supportskills, they where never chosen to be healer. You and all the other templars, who are used be the one and only, are just not capable to accept that YOU ARE NOT THAT SPECIAL ANYMORE

/rant

Are you serious? If you were all this time so envious to people who chose to play templars, why didn't you just make one yourself?

This is not about "being special". This is about crippling a class. Maybe you enjoy to see it happening to others, I certainly don't and wouldn't wish it on any sorc, NB (that is too late unfortunately) or DK.

It's difficult to understand people this spiteful exist.

Yeah right. I already play 2 of them. The people, which are playing it are not in my interest. You could feel special all day long. I don't care.

It is not about crippling a class. It is about to make an too good class comparable. The class was to good for healing and supporting and now this is gone. Now It is still good or even slightly better as the others. But you feel entiteled to be the unreachable healer for chosing the templar. Now you have to work for your place as a healer. And you can't accept it. You got 3 years of beeing the best by default. I hope you enjoyed this time enough. And when you major up, you can stop the salt in the end...

What's the point in even having classes if everyone is going to be able to do anything just as good as anyone else? The beauty of an RPG is that you PLAY a ROLE; usually a warrior, mage, cleric, rouge, ranger, or berserker, or a subclass of them.

The QQ coming from templars is pretty pathetic. The very idea that they might not be meta healers anymore is apparently too much for them to take.

Should they never ever add another class then? They have a healer, they have a tank, they have two DPS classes (ranged and melee).

By your logic it's done, no new classes ever. All because Templars want to retain superiority forever.

I'm talking about classes, not roles. What's pathetic has been the QQ all these years who want every class to be good at everything. By that logic, yes, there's no point in even having separate classes.

In any other RPG, nobody *** that the cleric can't do as much DPS as the mage, or that the warrior can't heal as much as the cleric. It should be no different here.

If you're more concerned with aesthetics (being able to heal on a Sorcerer, NB, or DK just as good as a Templar because you like the aesthetic of those classes better), then maybe an MMO RPG isn't for you. The point of an RPG is to play a class archetype that fits in with what you wanna do, but at a sacrifice of not being able to do another thing better.

Templars should be the best clerics.
Dragonknights should be the best warriors.
Sorcerers should be the best mages.
Nightblade should be the best rogues.
And Wardens should be the best rangers.

If you wanna play something where everything performs the same no matter how it looks, go play CS:GO/COD and paint your guns. ZOS pandering to players like you is why this game has turned into Participation Trophy Simulator 3.0.

100000+ person who assumes that Templar healers will be worse than NB/Sorc/DK healers. Welcome to the party.

Btw
Magicka Dragonknights are basically Pyromancers (aka Fire mages).
Magicka Nightblades are Mages mastered in Alteration Magic.

Not going to argue but it seems like your assumption of the archetype isn't entirely correct. Every class is a mage and every class is also a warrior.

I never said that any class can't fall into another archetype. I'm just saying each class should have pros/cons to their obvious archetype. I'm aware that ZOS wanted to give everyone the potential to be either a Fighter, Mage, Cleric, Assassin, or Ranger, but that doesn't mean that every class should see the same result in each.

As I've said before, if they want sameness they may as well do away with classes. Last I checked, this was still an RPG and not an adventure game. Differences in class performance should be more than superficial; ability choice more than aesthetic preference.

So you're aware that ZoS intentionally hasn't relegated each class to a specific role but you want them to be pigeonholed into a certain role? Seems legit.

Calandrae

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Jemcrystal wrote: »

I just want a healer that is easy. As in the one class you can eat a burrito, watch youtube, and run a dungeon all at the same time. There is no easy dungeon running class in this game with this balance obsession. It's to much like Square Enix's Final Fantasy XI. All of a sudden you have to work at being a healer. Research, builds, best armor. I miss the days (in general mmo gaming) when healer was harder to take down than a tank even if they showed up in the nude and could "/follow" the group and just had to hit a button if the screen started showing red. I don't want to work at a game. I want to play at a game. I miss the easy life. It made queue up on dungeon finders quicker - you only had to hunt high and low for a tank.

Every templars feels right now

Wow. You really are something else. I guess it's impossible for you to fathom that some of us lousy loyal Templar players just happen to like and enjoy the class. And therefore wish it to remain even remotely unique, fun and yes - also useful and meaningful.

You really must despise the class and the ones that play it if you think that we have just chosen it for easy and mindless play and fast queues on dungeon finder (that I never use personally because I don't do pugs...). But hey, I guess you know better. I must have just deluded myself these past 3 years. Thanks for telling me how I feel. It's all much more clear now.

Lore_lai

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Jemcrystal wrote: »

I just want a healer that is easy. As in the one class you can eat a burrito, watch youtube, and run a dungeon all at the same time. There is no easy dungeon running class in this game with this balance obsession. It's to much like Square Enix's Final Fantasy XI. All of a sudden you have to work at being a healer. Research, builds, best armor. I miss the days (in general mmo gaming) when healer was harder to take down than a tank even if they showed up in the nude and could "/follow" the group and just had to hit a button if the screen started showing red. I don't want to work at a game. I want to play at a game. I miss the easy life. It made queue up on dungeon finders quicker - you only had to hunt high and low for a tank.

Every templars feels right now

What is your purpose here?
At this point it feels like you're just trying to flame people for no reason.

Calandrae

Lore_lai wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Jemcrystal wrote: »

I just want a healer that is easy. As in the one class you can eat a burrito, watch youtube, and run a dungeon all at the same time. There is no easy dungeon running class in this game with this balance obsession. It's to much like Square Enix's Final Fantasy XI. All of a sudden you have to work at being a healer. Research, builds, best armor. I miss the days (in general mmo gaming) when healer was harder to take down than a tank even if they showed up in the nude and could "/follow" the group and just had to hit a button if the screen started showing red. I don't want to work at a game. I want to play at a game. I miss the easy life. It made queue up on dungeon finders quicker - you only had to hunt high and low for a tank.

Every templars feels right now

What is your purpose here?
At this point it feels like you're just trying to flame people for no reason.

I guess he feels entitled to do so.

FENGRUSH

Lore_lai wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Jemcrystal wrote: »

I just want a healer that is easy. As in the one class you can eat a burrito, watch youtube, and run a dungeon all at the same time. There is no easy dungeon running class in this game with this balance obsession. It's to much like Square Enix's Final Fantasy XI. All of a sudden you have to work at being a healer. Research, builds, best armor. I miss the days (in general mmo gaming) when healer was harder to take down than a tank even if they showed up in the nude and could "/follow" the group and just had to hit a button if the screen started showing red. I don't want to work at a game. I want to play at a game. I miss the easy life. It made queue up on dungeon finders quicker - you only had to hunt high and low for a tank.

Every templars feels right now

What is your purpose here?
At this point it feels like you're just trying to flame people for no reason.

To provide insight to insanity on some of these posts. Ive got more templars than anything in my group. The changes impact me significantly. I also have experience with templar in its current broken state. Change was due. People that fail to accept that are in denial.

Calandrae

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Lore_lai wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Jemcrystal wrote: »

I just want a healer that is easy. As in the one class you can eat a burrito, watch youtube, and run a dungeon all at the same time. There is no easy dungeon running class in this game with this balance obsession. It's to much like Square Enix's Final Fantasy XI. All of a sudden you have to work at being a healer. Research, builds, best armor. I miss the days (in general mmo gaming) when healer was harder to take down than a tank even if they showed up in the nude and could "/follow" the group and just had to hit a button if the screen started showing red. I don't want to work at a game. I want to play at a game. I miss the easy life. It made queue up on dungeon finders quicker - you only had to hunt high and low for a tank.

Every templars feels right now

What is your purpose here?
At this point it feels like you're just trying to flame people for no reason.

To provide insight to insanity on some of these posts. Ive got more templars than anything in my group. The changes impact me significantly. I also have experience with templar in its current broken state. Change was due. People that fail to accept that are in denial.

Your way of providing insight seems pretty unconventional though. Maybe practice your expression a bit more in the future?

Also try to remember that you are no authority to define was it due and what is not. Some changes might be due, some might not, but it's not up to you decide and your opinion is just that, an opinion among others.

Lore_lai

FENGRUSH wrote: »

To provide insight to insanity on some of these posts. Ive got more templars than anything in my group. The changes impact me significantly. I also have experience with templar in its current broken state. Change was due. People that fail to accept that are in denial.

Please provide with insight on what exactly was and was not broken then, but don't just try to generalize and ridicule.
That's just low.
So what exactly was so broken and needed fixing?

And your experience at playing Templar is very niche.
People have brought up different aspects of the class that got changed that have nothing to do with BoL spam qq.
Changes that will hurt, oh, say - small group play in pvp, for example.

vyndral13preub18_ESO

Northern_Eve wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Lore_lai wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Jemcrystal wrote: »

I just want a healer that is easy. As in the one class you can eat a burrito, watch youtube, and run a dungeon all at the same time. There is no easy dungeon running class in this game with this balance obsession. It's to much like Square Enix's Final Fantasy XI. All of a sudden you have to work at being a healer. Research, builds, best armor. I miss the days (in general mmo gaming) when healer was harder to take down than a tank even if they showed up in the nude and could "/follow" the group and just had to hit a button if the screen started showing red. I don't want to work at a game. I want to play at a game. I miss the easy life. It made queue up on dungeon finders quicker - you only had to hunt high and low for a tank.

Every templars feels right now

What is your purpose here?
At this point it feels like you're just trying to flame people for no reason.

To provide insight to insanity on some of these posts. Ive got more templars than anything in my group. The changes impact me significantly. I also have experience with templar in its current broken state. Change was due. People that fail to accept that are in denial.

Your way of providing insight seems pretty unconventional though. Maybe practice your expression a bit more in the future?

Don't mind Fengrush so much. The nerf Templar is strong with that one. Which is his opinion and is what it is. He is a much better player then I could ever dream of being. So while I don't agree with him a lot I generally try not to get worked up over him yelling nerf over and over.

I also try to remember that a lot of his angst comes from being like 4 foot tall.

FENGRUSH

Northern_Eve wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Lore_lai wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Jemcrystal wrote: »

I just want a healer that is easy. As in the one class you can eat a burrito, watch youtube, and run a dungeon all at the same time. There is no easy dungeon running class in this game with this balance obsession. It's to much like Square Enix's Final Fantasy XI. All of a sudden you have to work at being a healer. Research, builds, best armor. I miss the days (in general mmo gaming) when healer was harder to take down than a tank even if they showed up in the nude and could "/follow" the group and just had to hit a button if the screen started showing red. I don't want to work at a game. I want to play at a game. I miss the easy life. It made queue up on dungeon finders quicker - you only had to hunt high and low for a tank.

Every templars feels right now

What is your purpose here?
At this point it feels like you're just trying to flame people for no reason.

To provide insight to insanity on some of these posts. Ive got more templars than anything in my group. The changes impact me significantly. I also have experience with templar in its current broken state. Change was due. People that fail to accept that are in denial.

Your way of providing insight seems pretty unconventional though. Maybe practice your expression a bit more in the future?

Also try to remember that you are no authority to define was it due and what is not. Some changes might be due, some might not, but it's not up to you decide and your opinion is just that, an opinion among others.

It may be unconventional. You made a post earlier saying this class no longer excels in healing. I believe it still excels in the ability to burst heal better than any other healing class. That is a pretty special thing - thats the difference between life or death in fights. But it doesnt excel in healing? Honestly, tell me why. Because thats the last thing I posted to you here and you didnt pipe up except to say what a bad guy I am.

Everyone wants the class they play to be kept in good shape - and in templars case theyve taken a pretty heavy hit. But blindly arguing things over and over and claiming you dont excel in a role youre best at is something else altogether. Im really not trying to be rude, but tell me why it doesnt excel in healing. The support skill nerfs are too much in my opinion, but thats generally ignored as well by people simply wanting major mending back.

Calandrae

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

He is a much better player then I could ever dream of being. So while I don't agree with him a lot I generally try not to get worked up over him yelling nerf over and over.

I also try to remember that a lot of his angst comes from being like 4 foot tall.

Well, being "a much better player" doesn't really grant anyone the right to belittle, ridicule and flame people. I bet plenty of people in this thread who play templars are much better at several things in life than "FENGRUSH" is, yet he talks to us like we are all some kind if simpletons - just because we play a class he doesn't seem to like in a MMO.

FENGRUSH

Lore_lai wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

To provide insight to insanity on some of these posts. Ive got more templars than anything in my group. The changes impact me significantly. I also have experience with templar in its current broken state. Change was due. People that fail to accept that are in denial.

Please provide with insight on what exactly was and was not broken then, but don't just try to generalize and ridicule.
That's just low.
So what exactly was so broken and needed fixing?

And your experience at playing Templar is very niche.
People have brought up different aspects of the class that got changed that have nothing to do with BoL spam qq.
Changes that will hurt, oh, say - small group play in pvp, for example.

Im pretty sure Ive quoted you in this thread, or another about the support changes and shared feedback on shards and repent. Im not randomly taking shots at templars for the sake of having fun. Im specifically interested in all of the people saying 'templar is dead, its not the best healer, it has no role'. I havent found a single one that knows what theyre talking about or has any ideas behind what they are saying.