Morrowind...and ESO+

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Tandor wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

No because its an issue of morality. If we just sit idly by and let game companies take advantage of us, more and more games will come out with less and less value. This trend of providing as little value as possible while continuously increasing the costs, micro-pays, pay gates etc is immoral, disgusting and there is rightly a consumer backlash.

Then if it's an issue of morality, why are you even still here? It's like another poster who resigned over the crown crates, and is back again complaining about how she won't have any more to do with Zenimax or any of its companies or games - and yet she's still posting here about trying out Morrowind.

If these were genuinely held moral principles you guys would be gone. Period. End of.

So if you don't like how your country is run, how your local city runs, how anything in life is done, you run away? Does that fix it? Does that help the people you care about that are going to stay no matter what because they are addicted?

Someone needs to be the voice of reason in this insane world. If all the critics leave, then all we would have left would be the apologist fanbois making post after post about how much they love crown crates, or anything else ZOS throws at them.

DaveMoeDee

ashenb14_ESO wrote: »

FlaviusVoyage wrote: »

Expansion, DLC, what is the difference? Both include additional content.

The dif? you have to pay cash for expantions, dlc you can get with a sub or by buying it outright....and you can buy it with crowns saved up from a sub, zos wont let you buy morrowind with crowns because they want your cash money, more of it if you have sub and own the dlc already...

in short, they are nerfing all current classes, and forcing you to buy dlc..i mean an expansion to gain access to an un-nerfed class and all the map content... who wouldnt consider spending 40-60-80bucks on top of their sub to gain access to the one class that wont force you to spend 90% of your attack time doing heavy attacks to regen....

it should be great, after all, zos can do no wrong...ask the fanbois...

kinda waiting for them to make the whole game as hard as gaining Vet Ranks was.... that would make the game soooo much better *eyeroll*

How do you know Warden is "un-nerfed"?

zakriel

Tandor wrote: »

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

So if they find out that they can make more money by releasing an expansion every year, you'll gladly admit that you are willing to pay and take the chance away from new players to enter the game by making the entry fee higher. I mean look at MMOs like wow, there are no new players, just people who return to check out a new expansion for 2 months then leave again and the game is empty for 10 months.

The entry fee is the same as it's been for a while now, the cost of the game - half price at the moment according to another thread. New players aren't having anything taken away, they can even buy the Gold Edition at a bargain price with most of the DLCs included, or they can still subscribe and get everything included except Morrowind for which they pay the same price as the rest of us.

"Except Morrowind" and every single dlc, which comes after it. Thats the issue. If you want to enjoy the full content of the game as a new player, you have to buy morrowind to make your subscription worth something. I mean nobody'd want to join in the game after 2-3 expansions, when another players subscription unlock 15+ dlcs, while yours only 4-5.
On the other hand, if you can buy it for crowns, but it's not available for the subscription, you could get the content when you finished the previous ones, which makes your subscription the most valueable.

Tandor

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

No because its an issue of morality. If we just sit idly by and let game companies take advantage of us, more and more games will come out with less and less value. This trend of providing as little value as possible while continuously increasing the costs, micro-pays, pay gates etc is immoral, disgusting and there is rightly a consumer backlash.

Then if it's an issue of morality, why are you even still here? It's like another poster who resigned over the crown crates, and is back again complaining about how she won't have any more to do with Zenimax or any of its companies or games - and yet she's still posting here about trying out Morrowind.

If these were genuinely held moral principles you guys would be gone. Period. End of.

So if you don't like how your country is run, how your local city runs, how anything in life is done, you run away? Does that fix it? Does that help the people you care about that are going to stay no matter what because they are addicted?

Someone needs to be the voice of reason in this insane world. If all the critics leave, then all we would have left would be the apologist fanbois making post after post about how much they love crown crates, or anything else ZOS throws at them.

Comparing a computer game to how a country is run is a bit over the top, wouldn't you say?

Tandor

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

So if they find out that they can make more money by releasing an expansion every year, you'll gladly admit that you are willing to pay and take the chance away from new players to enter the game by making the entry fee higher. I mean look at MMOs like wow, there are no new players, just people who return to check out a new expansion for 2 months then leave again and the game is empty for 10 months.

The entry fee is the same as it's been for a while now, the cost of the game - half price at the moment according to another thread. New players aren't having anything taken away, they can even buy the Gold Edition at a bargain price with most of the DLCs included, or they can still subscribe and get everything included except Morrowind for which they pay the same price as the rest of us.

"Except Morrowind" and every single dlc, which comes after it. Thats the issue. If you want to enjoy the full content of the game as a new player, you have to buy morrowind to make your subscription worth something. I mean nobody'd want to join in the game after 2-3 expansions, when another players subscription unlock 15+ dlcs, while yours only 4-5.
On the other hand, if you can buy it for crowns, but it's not available for the subscription, you could get the content when you finished the previous ones, which makes your subscription the most valueable.

That sounds pretty messed up to be honest. Morrowind, plus one chapter per year, is all subscribers pay for - nothing different for new players in that. "Every single DLC, which comes after it" relates to DLCs which are part of the subscription or else available in the crown store. I've no doubt that the Gold Edition will be expanded in time to come to include most of the DLCs up to that point - it's the way the base game is usually treated in MMOs, new players get the chance to buy either the very basic base game or else a combined edition including all the DLCs except the most recent which remains available separately. In the case of ESO, of course, the DLCs are included in the subscription anyway. So the most a new player has to pay for is the base game, a subscription, and an annual chapter - the same as everyone else. Like all MMO developers, ZOS have no interest in pricing new players out of the game.

zakriel

Tandor wrote: »

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

So if they find out that they can make more money by releasing an expansion every year, you'll gladly admit that you are willing to pay and take the chance away from new players to enter the game by making the entry fee higher. I mean look at MMOs like wow, there are no new players, just people who return to check out a new expansion for 2 months then leave again and the game is empty for 10 months.

The entry fee is the same as it's been for a while now, the cost of the game - half price at the moment according to another thread. New players aren't having anything taken away, they can even buy the Gold Edition at a bargain price with most of the DLCs included, or they can still subscribe and get everything included except Morrowind for which they pay the same price as the rest of us.

"Except Morrowind" and every single dlc, which comes after it. Thats the issue. If you want to enjoy the full content of the game as a new player, you have to buy morrowind to make your subscription worth something. I mean nobody'd want to join in the game after 2-3 expansions, when another players subscription unlock 15+ dlcs, while yours only 4-5.
On the other hand, if you can buy it for crowns, but it's not available for the subscription, you could get the content when you finished the previous ones, which makes your subscription the most valueable.

That sounds pretty messed up to be honest. Morrowind, plus one chapter per year, is all subscribers pay for - nothing different for new players in that. "Every single DLC, which comes after it" relates to DLCs which are part of the subscription or else available in the crown store. I've no doubt that the Gold Edition will be expanded in time to come to include most of the DLCs up to that point - it's the way the base game is usually treated in MMOs, new players get the chance to buy either the very basic base game or else a combined edition including all the DLCs except the most recent which remains available separately. In the case of ESO, of course, the DLCs are included in the subscription anyway. So the most a new player has to pay for is the base game, a subscription, and an annual chapter - the same as everyone else. Like all MMO developers, ZOS have no interest in pricing new players out of the game.

That's just my theory, but the model seems to be heading that way. By those DLCs i mean the ones which can only be accessed when you buy the chapter. I mean lets just say that there is a new faction dlc like the Dark brotherhood, which is located on the new area, which the chapter unlocks. So you have the subscription, but not the chapter , so you can't access it and can't buy it from the crown store till you have it. (for ex.: you don't have imperial dlc, you can't buy the house for imperials, just like that)

Time will tell, but i really hope i'm wrong this time.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Tandor wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

No because its an issue of morality. If we just sit idly by and let game companies take advantage of us, more and more games will come out with less and less value. This trend of providing as little value as possible while continuously increasing the costs, micro-pays, pay gates etc is immoral, disgusting and there is rightly a consumer backlash.

Then if it's an issue of morality, why are you even still here? It's like another poster who resigned over the crown crates, and is back again complaining about how she won't have any more to do with Zenimax or any of its companies or games - and yet she's still posting here about trying out Morrowind.

If these were genuinely held moral principles you guys would be gone. Period. End of.

So if you don't like how your country is run, how your local city runs, how anything in life is done, you run away? Does that fix it? Does that help the people you care about that are going to stay no matter what because they are addicted?

Someone needs to be the voice of reason in this insane world. If all the critics leave, then all we would have left would be the apologist fanbois making post after post about how much they love crown crates, or anything else ZOS throws at them.

Comparing a computer game to how a country is run is a bit over the top, wouldn't you say?

No, its actually not. I'm sick of everyone giving low quality a free pass just because this is a game. If you pay real money for it, then its important.

It is my theory that ESO only exists the way it does because it is difficult to compare to other games and beyond that, harder to compare to the quality you get from other things you spend money on.

• Would you go to a movie theater where the movie slowed down to 10FPS half way through during action scenes?
• Would you continue to subscribe to a magazine that promised you 12 issues per year, but then only delivered 10 issues and for the last two months produces a double sized "booklet" instead of a magazine with a flashy holographic cover and charged an extra $40 for it?

This game is a product you pay money for, and should be, at the very least compared quality wise to other things you pay money for be they small like movie tickets or large like taxes.

DaveMoeDee

Tandor wrote: »

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

So if they find out that they can make more money by releasing an expansion every year, you'll gladly admit that you are willing to pay and take the chance away from new players to enter the game by making the entry fee higher. I mean look at MMOs like wow, there are no new players, just people who return to check out a new expansion for 2 months then leave again and the game is empty for 10 months.

The entry fee is the same as it's been for a while now, the cost of the game - half price at the moment according to another thread. New players aren't having anything taken away, they can even buy the Gold Edition at a bargain price with most of the DLCs included, or they can still subscribe and get everything included except Morrowind for which they pay the same price as the rest of us.

"Except Morrowind" and every single dlc, which comes after it. Thats the issue. If you want to enjoy the full content of the game as a new player, you have to buy morrowind to make your subscription worth something. I mean nobody'd want to join in the game after 2-3 expansions, when another players subscription unlock 15+ dlcs, while yours only 4-5.
On the other hand, if you can buy it for crowns, but it's not available for the subscription, you could get the content when you finished the previous ones, which makes your subscription the most valueable.

That sounds pretty messed up to be honest. Morrowind, plus one chapter per year, is all subscribers pay for - nothing different for new players in that. "Every single DLC, which comes after it" relates to DLCs which are part of the subscription or else available in the crown store. I've no doubt that the Gold Edition will be expanded in time to come to include most of the DLCs up to that point - it's the way the base game is usually treated in MMOs, new players get the chance to buy either the very basic base game or else a combined edition including all the DLCs except the most recent which remains available separately. In the case of ESO, of course, the DLCs are included in the subscription anyway. So the most a new player has to pay for is the base game, a subscription, and an annual chapter - the same as everyone else. Like all MMO developers, ZOS have no interest in pricing new players out of the game.

All a new player needs is the Gold edition, that goes on sale for quite cheap. $20 last week. That is a ton of content. There is no need for a sub and even less need for any additional chapters.

Tandor

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

So if they find out that they can make more money by releasing an expansion every year, you'll gladly admit that you are willing to pay and take the chance away from new players to enter the game by making the entry fee higher. I mean look at MMOs like wow, there are no new players, just people who return to check out a new expansion for 2 months then leave again and the game is empty for 10 months.

The entry fee is the same as it's been for a while now, the cost of the game - half price at the moment according to another thread. New players aren't having anything taken away, they can even buy the Gold Edition at a bargain price with most of the DLCs included, or they can still subscribe and get everything included except Morrowind for which they pay the same price as the rest of us.

"Except Morrowind" and every single dlc, which comes after it. Thats the issue. If you want to enjoy the full content of the game as a new player, you have to buy morrowind to make your subscription worth something. I mean nobody'd want to join in the game after 2-3 expansions, when another players subscription unlock 15+ dlcs, while yours only 4-5.
On the other hand, if you can buy it for crowns, but it's not available for the subscription, you could get the content when you finished the previous ones, which makes your subscription the most valueable.

That sounds pretty messed up to be honest. Morrowind, plus one chapter per year, is all subscribers pay for - nothing different for new players in that. "Every single DLC, which comes after it" relates to DLCs which are part of the subscription or else available in the crown store. I've no doubt that the Gold Edition will be expanded in time to come to include most of the DLCs up to that point - it's the way the base game is usually treated in MMOs, new players get the chance to buy either the very basic base game or else a combined edition including all the DLCs except the most recent which remains available separately. In the case of ESO, of course, the DLCs are included in the subscription anyway. So the most a new player has to pay for is the base game, a subscription, and an annual chapter - the same as everyone else. Like all MMO developers, ZOS have no interest in pricing new players out of the game.

All a new player needs is the Gold edition, that goes on sale for quite cheap. $20 last week. That is a ton of content. There is no need for a sub and even less need for any additional chapters.

I totally agree about the Gold Edition. I was making the extreme case to counter the view even on that basis that by paying for an annual expansion I was taking away the chance for a new player to enter the game by making the entry fee higher.

Tandor

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

No because its an issue of morality. If we just sit idly by and let game companies take advantage of us, more and more games will come out with less and less value. This trend of providing as little value as possible while continuously increasing the costs, micro-pays, pay gates etc is immoral, disgusting and there is rightly a consumer backlash.

Then if it's an issue of morality, why are you even still here? It's like another poster who resigned over the crown crates, and is back again complaining about how she won't have any more to do with Zenimax or any of its companies or games - and yet she's still posting here about trying out Morrowind.

If these were genuinely held moral principles you guys would be gone. Period. End of.

So if you don't like how your country is run, how your local city runs, how anything in life is done, you run away? Does that fix it? Does that help the people you care about that are going to stay no matter what because they are addicted?

Someone needs to be the voice of reason in this insane world. If all the critics leave, then all we would have left would be the apologist fanbois making post after post about how much they love crown crates, or anything else ZOS throws at them.

Comparing a computer game to how a country is run is a bit over the top, wouldn't you say?

No, its actually not. I'm sick of everyone giving low quality a free pass just because this is a game. If you pay real money for it, then its important.

It is my theory that ESO only exists the way it does because it is difficult to compare to other games and beyond that, harder to compare to the quality you get from other things you spend money on.

• Would you go to a movie theater where the movie slowed down to 10FPS half way through during action scenes?
• Would you continue to subscribe to a magazine that promised you 12 issues per year, but then only delivered 10 issues and for the last two months produces a double sized "booklet" instead of a magazine with a flashy holographic cover and charged an extra $40 for it?

This game is a product you pay money for, and should be, at the very least compared quality wise to other things you pay money for be they small like movie tickets or large like taxes.

I don't disagree with the last sentence, and I'm perfectly satisfied with the game in that respect. I have never had any performance issues with it and I have no objection to paying for one chapter per annum. I've played as a subscriber since PC launch with additional DLC purchases on a second non-subscribed account and am very happy with the value for money I've received from the game, not least when the monthly outlay is compared per hour of entertainment with any other hobby or pastime, or indeed with any other computer game I've played over the past 34 years. However, if I felt as strongly against the game and/or its developers as some purport to do I would move on to something else rather than stay as some sort of moral crusade.

Fingolfinn01

I don't mind paying for morrowind. if it helps more than just keeping the lights on.

Jollygoodusername

DoShazarr wrote: »

entitlement rant here

I just got back from a pool party I hosted. I ordered Pizza for everyone, which included some extras, one of which was not delivered. So I called the company and let them know that what I paid for, was not delivered. That is NOT entitlement, complaining about *** service, is not entitlement. When I pay someone a federally recognized form of currency, I expect fair trade and all goods to be delivered. That is not entitlement.

This whole Morrowind fiasco was about Crowns that were earned through paying for the Morrowind DLC with subs, are now useless and more so going into the future of DLC. Who the hell knows if new content releases will require Morrowind? That's a disgusting thought to many of us, which should include you as you've paid for probably more than me. No, the entitlement is coming from the company who constantly produces bad business practices and asks for your money, more and more each time, like you OWE THEM! >_<

Nelson_Rebel

The damage is done, right or wrong, ZoS is excluding this from ESO plus.

i'm not saying it should have been but ZoS made this a matter of profit and expanding the games reputation

Jollygoodusername

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

The damage is done, right or wrong, ZoS is excluding this from ESO plus.

i'm not saying it should have been but ZoS made this a matter of profit and expanding the games reputation

Yeah, I'm certain they're expecting a whole new review from Steam and all the other critic sites. Shady af. They knew Morrowind would really tie the room together.

Nelson_Rebel

Jollygoodusername wrote: »

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

The damage is done, right or wrong, ZoS is excluding this from ESO plus.

i'm not saying it should have been but ZoS made this a matter of profit and expanding the games reputation

Yeah, I'm certain they're expecting a whole new review from Steam and all the other critic sites. Shady af. They knew Morrowind would really tie the room together.

IMO this was all a sales play, stir up conversation and get press on it. More visibility=more sales

Ever heard that saying even bad press is good press? Unfortunately it's quite real,
just take that "cash me ousside" girl now making thousands off of adds and commercials

clocksstoppe

DoShazarr wrote: »

Because it's NOT a DLC. It's an EXPANSION . When will you people finally learn to understand the difference?!

It doesn't matter what you or ZOS say, Morrowind is a DLC, that they excluded from ESO+ for no reason other than greed. Literal greed. I hope you enjoy your underwhelming dlc (which is smaller than Orsinium lmao) that you will pay 50 bucks for. These are the hard facts that everyone knows and understands, even if some fanboys here are in denial about it.

Rhoric

Morrowind is an Expansion plain and simple. It is not a DLC never was and never will be a DLC.

D0ntevenL1ft

Well i will certainly not be buying this expansion for costs outside my ESO subscription fee that i paid for for many months to access content, and since everything in the subscription free will essentially be useless i will cancel that upon release.

0/2 for ZOS.

Galwylin

Look, folks. Morrowind is not a DLC. Nor is it an expansion. Its something different. A chapter. Is it fair that ESO+ have to pay for it too and that you can't use crowns? Maybe not. Obviously, they needed (or wanted) to change things on these DLC/Expaction/Chapters. That's just how it is sometimes. I don't feel slighted myself. Companies sometimes change how things once were. Every company has done something along these lines. The bills have to be paid after all.

My problem is the sneaking around changing webpages then going on like this is somehow different. I'm sure that Morrowind was meant to be a DLC. Somewhere that had to change. The warden comes on board (I mean, if you're adding a new class in an expansion, why does it seem so unrelated?). Battlegrounds were probably going to be a regular live update but got added to buff up this DLC. I mean expansion.

I think they have done pretty good on the base upgrade myself. that's considering everything they've thrown into this. They could have just put Vvanderfell out there for $40. No warden. No battlegrounds. No whatever that stuff is that comes with pre=order.

Have we been throwing our money away with ESO+? Ah, probably. We get more storage and who doesn't need more useless crap? They're going to have to buff ESO+ though since they've just told everyone once you're done with the old four DLCs you can cancel. I just wished they'd be honest in the approach. "Hey, guys. We're having to change things a bit with ESO+..." And had the ESO+ improvements in place for the Morrowind announcement. But I guess its great to fit improvements on something unrelated to the expansion you're set to release.

They really had a nice announcement and its too bad they mucked it up with the disregard of ESO+ members and now this patch that coming with it. Just self created bad mojo.

MakoFore

stop complaining - for any working adult- 50 bucks and 15 bucks a month is nothing. for the hours that you put into the game and get out of it in terms of etnertainment- stop whinging. dont see it as a tax and a fee or a cost- but a chance to support a game that you spend hours a week plugging into . see it as a chance to keep the people that make this game a chance to make some money and put better content into it. i just spent 200 bucks on dinner with my girlfriend for 2 hours of crappy overpriced food and average service. i pay not half that much a year to ZOS and i spend 2 hours a day having a great old time. no not everything is perfect- they need help- but as a contributor to the game- i feel it my duty to be a part of that- thru constructive criticism, support- and yes- financial support. if you think that s too much to ask- then you area broke ass

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Medakon

I love that Zenimax remembers the difference between a dlc, and a expansion. This concept has been lost a long time ago, and mixed into eachother.

A DLC used to be a small addon to the game, maybe a costume, maybe a new map.

An Expansion used to be new level cap, new story, new area with dailiys, new raid, new battleground, and new class.

Soo.. Is morrowin a new expansion, or dlc?

IT has new level cap from 600cp to 630, it has new story content, it has new areas with dailiy zone, it has a new raid, also new battleground, and brings a new class to the game. Definitly an Expansion.

Am I mad because eso subs has to buy expansion? no, this is pretty normal.
Just look at world of warcraft, they are paying X ammount a month JUST TO PLAY, AND has to buy expansions each second year to continue playing endgame content. Elderscrollsonline offers a free to play option, allowing you to play whenever you want without paying.

Edit: fixed typo

zakriel

PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »

MakoFore wrote: »

for any working adult- 50 bucks and 15 bucks a month is nothing.

Flat out lie. Do show me your research that proves that everyone gets paid 1000+ per month to not worry about taxes, etc. I'll wait.

MakoFore wrote: »

for the hours that you put into the game and get out of it in terms of etnertainment- stop whinging. dont see it as a tax and a fee or a cost- but a chance to support a game that you spend hours a week plugging into . see it as a chance to keep the people that make this game a chance to make some money and put better content into it.

So your opinion on this content "being worth every penny" should matter more than the opinion of someone who is disappointed with content? Talk about being an egomaniac. Not to mention some people only play a few hours a week. Besides, they started with the P2P business model (which they should return to), and had ESO+ for how long? And they still charge almost full price for a expansion Chapter.

MakoFore wrote: »

i just spent 200 bucks on dinner with my girlfriend for 2 hours of crappy overpriced food and average service. i pay not half that much a year to ZOS and i spend 2 hours a day having a great old time

Good for you. You spend (waste) your money how you want; if only you supported that as well, rather than tell people to just sub or buy to support something they may or may not like.

MakoFore wrote: »

no not everything is perfect- they need help- but as a contributor to the game- i feel it my duty to be a part of that- thru constructive criticism, support- and yes- financial support.

Financial support? So if you pay someone to clean your house monthly and poops all over the place - you continue to pay said person and tell them not to? They got your money, know you keep paying them - so why should they change it?

MakoFore wrote: »

if you think that s too much to ask- then you area broke ass

Now that's just pathetic.

Thank you. As a university student who works part time, paying my rent and food is enough headache on its own. I kept up my subscription as long as i had the extra money for it. 50 bucks is 1/2 of the money i'm left with after i pay for my necessities. So yeah, i'm not kept alive by my daddy and i'm pretty sure spending his money on it would not give me joy.

klowdy1

zakriel wrote: »

klowdy1 wrote: »

Martan wrote: »

I don't see the problem here. World of Warcraft among other MMORPG's requires you to purchase all new expansions along with paying a non-mandatory monthly fee.

It is a mandatory sub, can't play without it.

I've used to play a lot when they implemented the option to buy tokens (subscription) with in-game money. With the auchion house of wow, it takes no time to get the gold (2 days grind with some luck). I've never had to pay for subscription from that point and i usually made enough for 2 months every 3 weeks just by playing the game casually.

My point was you still have to have a sub, no matter how it is obtained, in order to play. It isn't "non mandatory" as stated in the post I quoted.

klowdy1

zakriel wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I'm amazed it's taken 40 pages and 3 months to reach a point where some people still don't get the simple truth of it.

If it's worth it to you, you'll buy Morrowind.

If it isn't, you won't.

If you have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll play something else.

If you don't have a problem with the way ZOS are running things, you'll stay - whether as an ESO+ subscriber or not.

Can we move on now?

So if they find out that they can make more money by releasing an expansion every year, you'll gladly admit that you are willing to pay and take the chance away from new players to enter the game by making the entry fee higher. I mean look at MMOs like wow, there are no new players, just people who return to check out a new expansion for 2 months then leave again and the game is empty for 10 months.

There are regular sales for WoW with all of its expansions, excluding current content, that comes out to what the base game cost during vanilla. Usually before an expansion is released, they push the bundled expansions, and put the current expansion on sale as well. There is nothing saying ESO wouldn't do the same as the game grows.

To say WoW has no new players is narrow-minded, too. When I actually play that game, I regularly run into people in random dungeons that state they are new players, and don't know the dungeon mechanics.

DaveMoeDee

Medakon wrote: »

I love that Zenimax remembers the difference between a dlc, and a expansion. This concept has been lost a long time ago, and mixed into eachother.

A DLC used to be a small addon to the game, maybe a costume, maybe a new map.

An Expansion used to be new level cap, new story, new area with dailiys, new raid, new battleground, and new class.

Soo.. Is morrowin a new expansion, or dlc?

IT has new level cap from 600cp to 630, it has new story content, it has new areas with dailiy zone, it has a new raid, also new battleground, and brings a new class to the game. Definitly an Expansion.

Am I mad because eso subs has to buy expansion? no, this is pretty normal.
Just look at world of warcraft, they are paying X ammount a month JUST TO PLAY, AND has to buy expansions each second year to continue playing endgame content. Elderscrollsonline offers a free to play option, allowing you to play whenever you want without paying.

Edit: fixed typo

You really don't understand Type I and Type II errors.



So Wrothgar has a new level cap, new story, new area with dailies, new single player battleground = Expansion!!!

You mentioned WoW. I have never played wow. Please list the WoW DLC zones like Wrothgar please. Or WoW DLC zones like Gold Coast even. Or IC. I'm curious if the WoW DLC zones are similar. Maybe this will help illustrate the difference between "DLC" and "expansion" that you are talking about.

Galwylin

Apologist will always defend. But why did they sneak change ESO+ description page? Why have they themselves called it all sorts of things except DLC. Is it a chapter? Are chapters expansions? They're coming out every year so every year we pay them extra? Do DLCs exist any more and if so, what are they like? If you want and example of WoW expansion I can tell you the last one I played. It had around six new zones (maybe more), a huge number of dungeons, they made changes to existing zones, the pushed the storyline forward, added new abilities to all characters, I believe it had a few raids but they continue to add those as the storyline progresses and raised the level cap. That is a typical WoW expansions. There's no way in hell Morrowind is an expansion. Its barely an extension.

Shadowmaster

3/7/2016 Maw of Lorkhaj was released, and if Morrowind is not purchased, ESO+ subscribers will have access to no new trial content at least through 6/6/2017 and realistically until 2018 so 2+ years of no new trial content, even though you paid 2 years of fees? Is that an intended cadence going forward or can we expect to see new trial content more than once every 2+ years if we are ESO+ members. I know WoW had a roughly 2 year per endgame cycle but they released multiple endgame raids with most updates.

newtinmpls

nick_dean14 wrote: »

But how do we know that future 'DLC' that had been included in our monthly subscriptions won't all of a sudden start to be renamed as 'expansions'?.

We don't.

Absolut_Turkey

Sounds fair to me. Games do cost money to maintain after all. And it's not like this a new practice. Don't quite understand what the big deal is.