Morrowind...and ESO+

esotoon

sevomd69 wrote: »

But they should have had an idea, because ToS says they can change their services whenever they want, so if they had read the ToS they could have weighed the pros and cons of the 6 month sub and they would know that the discount they are getting for the 6 month sub comes with risks clearly stated in the ToS... not anyone else's problem that they failed to read the ToS...

So you buy the Morrowind Chapter. Only the advertised 12 man trial is only a 8 man trial. And the 30 hour content, turns out to be 10 hours. Would you a) be happy about it because after all the T&Cs say they can change anything at any time, and make no mention of the content they are delivering the 'chapter' pack. Or would you feel aggrieved that they told you there would be a 12 man trial, and they told you there would be 30 hours of content, and they also stated this on the web page you bought the DLC from, yet by using a clause in the t&c's they didn't deliver on that content?

(And yes, Im aware this not exactly what happened, I'm just using a dumb example to make a point. the point being just because t&cs says they can change anything at any time, it doesn't mean the customer can't feel aggrieved at perceived changes in value of the product due to those changes)

sevomd69

esotoon wrote: »

sevomd69 wrote: »

But they should have had an idea, because ToS says they can change their services whenever they want, so if they had read the ToS they could have weighed the pros and cons of the 6 month sub and they would know that the discount they are getting for the 6 month sub comes with risks clearly stated in the ToS... not anyone else's problem that they failed to read the ToS...

So you buy the Morrowind Chapter. Only the advertised 12 man trial is only a 8 man trial. And the 30 hour content, turns out to be 10 hours. Would you a) be happy about it because after all the T&Cs say they can change anything at any time, and make no mention of the content they are delivering the 'chapter' pack. Or would you feel aggrieved that they told you there would be a 12 man trial, and they told you there would be 30 hours of content, and they also stated this on the web page you bought the DLC from, yet by using a clause in the DLC they didn't deliver on that content?

I wouldn't be happy about it, but I made the decision pre-order, knowing their ToS and history, so the only person that I could blame is myself... Like I said... you have the option to not pre-order and wait to see what exactly is in the new content, but if you choose to pre-order than its on you if they change their content not to your liking...

maxjapank

henrycupcakerwb17_ESO wrote: »

You can of course purchase it from the store if you want to

Jesus , how old are you , talking like this is some of kind a big deal violation..pathetic

You cannot purchase Morrowind from the crown store. That is the biggest problem. Subscribers and those who used real money to buy crowns to purchase DLCs outright cannot use those crowns now to purchase Morrowind. That is the biggest issue. People have used real money in support of the game. But now they are telling us that Crowns we purchased are worthless to use for purchasing Morrowind. They want additional money on top of what we already spent. Does that make sense?

corrosivechains

maxjapank wrote: »

henrycupcakerwb17_ESO wrote: »

You can of course purchase it from the store if you want to

Jesus , how old are you , talking like this is some of kind a big deal violation..pathetic

You cannot purchase Morrowind from the crown store. That is the biggest problem. Subscribers and those who used real money to buy crowns to purchase DLCs outright cannot use those crowns now to purchase Morrowind. That is the biggest issue. People have used real money in support of the game. But now they are telling us that Crowns we purchased are worthless to use for purchasing Morrowind. They want additional money on top of what we already spent. Does that make sense?

you think it would but no matter how much we state this, we might as well be speaking greek

mandrakethebard_ESO

The distinction between Expansion and DLC is common in all computer games and shouldn't be such a mystery to people. I've already put in my order for ESO:Morrowind.

corrosivechains

mandrakethebard_ESO wrote: »

The distinction between Expansion and DLC is common in all computer games and shouldn't be such a mystery to people. I've already put in my order for ESO:Morrowind.

And I imagine that's why ZoS is making the distinction that this isn't an expansion, but that it's a "chapter".

nimander99

I can understand those who think this is just another DLC and should be included as part of ESO Plus or be purchasable with crowns... I also understand the argument those are making comparing it to Heart of Thornes GW2 expac...

I'm in the middle on this one, I think Zenimax is obviously taking full advantage of what they know is the biggest fan favorite game in the Scrolls series and they are wielding that power to charge money for access... Honestly, I don't really blame them for it, its what id do if I owned this game.

AzuraKin

JasonSilverSpring wrote: »

AzuraKin wrote: »

esotoon wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

It all depends, did you agree to allow them to make changes at any time for any reason like you did when you agreed to the TOS before you were allowed to play ESO?!?

They can make whatever changes they like. However that doesn't make it right or mean the customer has no right to feel aggrieved by it. And in some countries, due to consumer laws, taking money and not providing the promised services for that money is...shall we say, frowned upon. No matter what the T&C's might say.

well, there is this thing that rights and laws of nations generally do not apply to the internet, this is why american companies, run by americans have deleted, censored, posts and banned accounts for arbitrary reasons against american companies, all of which is a violation of the freedom of speech clause. you have no rights on the internet except what the company whose site you are using grants to you.

Freedom of speech has nothing to do with a forum hosted by a company. I am not sure if you are from the USA, but in the USA freedom of speech has no bearing on this, internet or not.

actually the constitution applies to all. fed gov, state gov, local gov, individual citizens, corporate entitiies.

probablyafk

mandrakethebard_ESO wrote: »

The distinction between Expansion and DLC is common in all computer games and shouldn't be such a mystery to people. I've already put in my order for ESO:Morrowind.

It's not a mystery really here. The problem is the announced content for the expansion is hardly bigger than for the DLCs.

If this was 5 zones, 10 dungeons, 2 trials, a new class and some new features then almost no one would be complaining - only the crazy die hard idiots.

But people are confused because they expect to see some real fundamental difference between DLC and Expac and this doesn't have it.

And the Chapters renaming thing is such a bad sign. This is turning into SWOTOR way faster than anyone though. Loot Crates, Useless Housing, now Chapters. Yay.

xeNNNNN

notimetocare wrote: »

NovaShadow wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

NovaShadow wrote: »

I was hyped, never played Morrowind so I was excited to see what it was about. I liked the trailer and everything they mentioned in the stream, especially the Warden class.

They didn't mention ESO+ in the live stream so I came here to see if there was an FAQ anywhere only to find out I've been supporting the game via a sub for the past 3 ish years on the promise I'd have access to ALL (yes all, that was the ORIGINAL - I see they've since changed the wording to crown store only - promise) new content and yet, this time they're calling Morrowind an 'expansion' not a 'dlc' (yet in my opinion it's practically the same size as Wrothgar and that was FREE with a sub).

This is what is called BAIT AND SWITCH. You promise one thing yet deliver another.

My sub is cancelled, I have no interest in housing anymore. What interest I had in Morrowind is now gone.

All I view it as now is a cash grab from Morrowind fanboys. Release it on the anniversary for extra nostalgia and you can guarantee those fanboys will look past the utter shadiness this 'expansion' is and throw their cash at ZOS.

I feel sorry for every one of you.

Bye, nobody will miss you.

Really, if you unsub and ignore an expansion because the company needs to FUND your game then you will not be missed.

NovaShadow wrote: »

I was hyped, never played Morrowind so I was excited to see what it was about. I liked the trailer and everything they mentioned in the stream, especially the Warden class.

They didn't mention ESO+ in the live stream so I came here to see if there was an FAQ anywhere only to find out I've been supporting the game via a sub for the past 3 ish years on the promise I'd have access to ALL (yes all, that was the ORIGINAL - I see they've since changed the wording to crown store only - promise) new content and yet, this time they're calling Morrowind an 'expansion' not a 'dlc' (yet in my opinion it's practically the same size as Wrothgar and that was FREE with a sub).

This is what is called BAIT AND SWITCH. You promise one thing yet deliver another.

My sub is cancelled, I have no interest in housing anymore. What interest I had in Morrowind is now gone.

All I view it as now is a cash grab from Morrowind fanboys. Release it on the anniversary for extra nostalgia and you can guarantee those fanboys will look past the utter shadiness this 'expansion' is and throw their cash at ZOS.

I feel sorry for every one of you.

Really, the people that call this shady must have never played an MMO. Intelligent people should have little issue with this. This isnt small content, it is massive.

I didn't realise we knew each other personally and you were aware of every single person I know in game, who I talk to, the guilds I'm involved in and who would miss me if I were to leave for good.

My sub has actually lapsed due to work if you really really must know and given the announcement today I don't see the point in renewing it any time soon as ZOS has now changed their position on what content I can and cannot access via subscribing.

I'm sorry, I must've missed the part where ZOS earns money from Subs, Crowns, Base Game purchases & Gold Edition purchases. No, they cannot possibly have any other source of income.

Grow up. You say an intelligent person should have little issue with it. Clearly you haven't read a single thing anyone with a legitimate complaint has said.

Its NOT about the money, its about the deception/lies/promises clearly displayed/advertised/repeated that have been blatantly forgotten about/rewritten/ignored all for more money.

An intelligent person not blinded by shiny collectables that bring back nostalgia can see this for what it is. It is shady. It is deceptive. It feels like a betrayal for those that paid their subscription under the belief that it'd grant them access to ALL future content as was SPECIFIED. Being lied to sucks, even more so when it's done in such a sneaky/underhanded manor.

Wrothgar: 20 hours
Morrowind: 30 hours

I wouldn't call that massive. Large, sure, but not massive. Seems to be a popular word with fanboys to justify their blind hype.

Sneaky and underhanded? It was announced with 5 months until release.

It is all about money, almost ever complaint. All talking about the money and that they "paid" for it.

Not blinded by nostalgia, I understand business enough to see this as perfectly fine. Most games give patches of free content and have expansions every few uears. This is the norm even in f2p. If you didn't expect this you are a total fool.

I stated nobody will miss you because eventually all your ingame friends will move on and forget you ever existed. Because gods forbid a business put out higher quality content with more features and expect people to buy it.

[snip]

Here is some fact checks for you;

1) Yes we knew about about the vardenfell DLC (now known as morrowind) and we thought it would be all future content because thats what they said infact we knew in the first year of the game after the clockwork city was showcased and then a couple of months back we got more info thanks to data mining and yeah sure they talked about it but they NEVER even remotely mentioned what they would do with said content interms of promotion, announcement and policy changes, they might be able to change their policies whenever they like but that doesn't change the fact that it was a *** move. Yeah "business is business" but your consumer base matters, if you're so smart and knowledgeable when it came to business practices you know you dont flip off your loyal consumer base.

2) Yes it was sneaky and underhanded.. why? No update prior to the sudden "maintenance" after the leak. No good will towards subs by telling us before hand weeks before. They took the web server down and changed it and brought it back up and announced morrowind. So yeah I would call that sneaky and underhanded as they knew exactly what kind of response they would get by doing it this way.

3) You see this as perfectly fine? The price of the expansion is absurd, it offs almost 3x times less than most major MMO's out there when they release expansions. £20 for upgrade £40 for collectors maybe. But £64 for collectors and £40 for an upgrade? 1 region? Seriously? No thats not "fine" thats a price hike.

4) Incredible "all your ingame friends will move on and forget you ever existed" - I wonder are you speaking from experience? [snip]


Have a nice day.

[Edited to remove inflammatory comments]

Duukar

I'm done paying these crooks a single dime. I've been an ESO subscriber since day one.

I feel betrayed. $50 bucks Canadian is a huge chunk of coin on top of the two(ish) years of $17.99 Canadian a month. My understanding was this fee was basically a seasons pass.

Now I can't even use Crowns I've saved up for a race change to purchase this expansion.

None of the items I want fixed are being fixed or even acknowledged.

This is just money grab after money grab after money grab.

I've just lost all the fun that used to be here.

No, you cant have my stuff, because I'm BROKE AF!!!!!!

If Camelot Unchained fails or For Honor sucks maybe ill pony up the cash. Lets be honest. The price will drop over time. You pay 50 or 79 today and I will pay 25 in a year. Perhaps then some of the bugs will be worked out.

This is just dumb.

Duuk

vyndral13preub18_ESO

I cant wait for next years road ahead...

So when we started we were doing four major dlcs a year. This approach was to aggressive. We found ourselves hamstrung.. hamstringed? Whatever! Anyway as a way to solve this it seemed like the only answer was to to make ourselves more work, by giving you 3 dlcs and one larger dlc we like to call chapters! We like to call them chapters because really we had to call them something so we could charge you for them.

Now as the year progressed we discovered that again this approach was to aggressive. So next year we will be doing 2 dlc updates and 2 larger updates we like to call chapters. Ok honestly we dont like to call them chapters, but i already explained that. Now this might seem like we are again adding more work, when we just said we didnt have time, but the truth of the matter is, DUCK!

heaven13

silvereyes wrote: »

I don't get where the claims of ESO+ giving access to "all future DLC" keep coming from either. All the published marketing materials are very clear that your sub is just for the duration of your membership, and gives access to only current DLC purchasable in the Crown Store. There's never a guarantee of future content.

From Your Guide to ESO Plus:

So, what do you get as an ESO Plus member? Let’s go over the benefits:

• An allotment of crowns to spend in the new in-game Crown Store based on your membership period (more below)
• Access to all of ESO’s downloadable content (or DLC) game packs for the duration of your membership
• A 10% bonus to XP and gold gain, crafting research, and inspiration

From the ESO Plus store page:

PRODUCT DETAILS
PC/Mac only.

• Access to all DLC Game Packs available in the Crown Store as long as ESO Plus™ membership is current.
• 1500 Crowns per 30 day membership, all Crowns given at time of payment.
• +10% Upgrade to Character Progression.
• Please see "Additional Requirements" tab below and Terms of Service.

[snip]

ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENTS
.... The Elder Scrolls® Online service may be discontinued, and content modified, disabled, suspended or removed, at any time....

That's brand new. As of the maintenance that happened on the account/store pages very recently. Before that, there was absolutely no wording about being limited to content available on the crown store at all.

That's part of why people are calling this shady. The Terms were changed, without any notice or information from the devs at all. Just discovered after the announcement for Morrowind happened. Then Gina comes into a thread and says that nope, also can't be purchased with crowns. The post from Matt also came after the Morrowind announcement with a blurb on chapters.

This is a quote from someone else in a different thread, but I think it rings true for some people.

BlueViolet wrote: »

You know, for me, If Zenimax had opened a thread perhaps saying something like "look, we're going to release this very large expansive content bundle / whatever, and although we know subscribers are billed to get all upcoming content included in their subs, we really feel that this content is worthy of being called an expansion not just a DLC pack, so, we were planning on pricing it at $X amount of dollars for everybody . We've backtracked a little from our original spiel in regard to sub content, but we really think you will find it worthwhile - Discuss."

I would have been fine with that. They would have acknowledged that they were reneging on their earlier decision, and they would have been open about it.
Instead, they just went about changing the wording on their subscription ad page & going back on something they had stressed prior, without saying anything to the players and customers that they profess to care about. To me that's just sly and sneaky and underhanded and I take exception to that kind of thing. [snip]

vyndral13preub18_ESO

heaven13 wrote: »

silvereyes wrote: »

I don't get where the claims of ESO+ giving access to "all future DLC" keep coming from either. All the published marketing materials are very clear that your sub is just for the duration of your membership, and gives access to only current DLC purchasable in the Crown Store. There's never a guarantee of future content.

From Your Guide to ESO Plus:

So, what do you get as an ESO Plus member? Let’s go over the benefits:

• An allotment of crowns to spend in the new in-game Crown Store based on your membership period (more below)
• Access to all of ESO’s downloadable content (or DLC) game packs for the duration of your membership
• A 10% bonus to XP and gold gain, crafting research, and inspiration

From the ESO Plus store page:

PRODUCT DETAILS
PC/Mac only.

• Access to all DLC Game Packs available in the Crown Store as long as ESO Plus™ membership is current.
• 1500 Crowns per 30 day membership, all Crowns given at time of payment.
• +10% Upgrade to Character Progression.
• Please see "Additional Requirements" tab below and Terms of Service.

[snip]

ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENTS
.... The Elder Scrolls® Online service may be discontinued, and content modified, disabled, suspended or removed, at any time....

That's brand new. As of the maintenance that happened on the account/store pages very recently. Before that, there was absolutely no wording about being limited to content available on the crown store at all.

That's part of why people are calling this shady. The Terms were changed, without any notice or information from the devs at all. Just discovered after the announcement for Morrowind happened. Then Gina comes into a thread and says that nope, also can't be purchased with crowns. The post from Matt also came after the Morrowind announcement with a blurb on chapters.

This is a quote from someone else in a different thread, but I think it rings true for some people.

BlueViolet wrote: »

You know, for me, If Zenimax had opened a thread perhaps saying something like "look, we're going to release this very large expansive content bundle / whatever, and although we know subscribers are billed to get all upcoming content included in their subs, we really feel that this content is worthy of being called an expansion not just a DLC pack, so, we were planning on pricing it at $X amount of dollars for everybody . We've backtracked a little from our original spiel in regard to sub content, but we really think you will find it worthwhile - Discuss."

I would have been fine with that. They would have acknowledged that they were reneging on their earlier decision, and they would have been open about it.
Instead, they just went about changing the wording on their subscription ad page & going back on something they had stressed prior, without saying anything to the players and customers that they profess to care about. To me that's just sly and sneaky and underhanded and I take exception to that kind of thing. [snip]

Ive wondered about that as well. If they had announced the change a couple weeks ago, sure there might have been just as much noise, and they would have spoiled the dlc surprise. But it would have died down by the time the actual dlc was announced.

Maybe they thought they hype would just over run the noise. Or the surprise was worth it? I dont know. I guess it is easy to look back and ask for something different given how this went, but who knows.

silvereyes

Well, some folks are just going to feel like victims no matter what, I guess.

Things change. There was always going to be a point in time at which an announcement of the changes came out and people had to assess whether their sub was still worth it.

No matter when that announcement happened, there were going to be some people that got the better or worse end of the stick based on when they subbed and for how long.

If they had made these announcements even before 1T was released, people would have complained just as much, probably with exactly the same arguments.

4 months notice is plenty of advanced notice. It gives all but a select handful of 6+ month subscribers the opportunity to unsub before the changes go into effect.

ESO+ has always been a bad deal for DLC alone. Be happy, because now you know it's a bad deal. Unsubscribe, and enjoy your extra money.

Or, if you, like me, use all your crowns every month and think the ~$8/mo net difference between buying those crowns on sale and getting them from a sub is worth it for all the other ESO+ perks, then feel free to keep subscribing.

In practical terms, ZOS has increased the cost of all-content access by $3.6 a month, taken over the course of a year. I for one am happy to pay them the equivalent of a regular coffee per month to get a bigger content update than we've ever gotten before. If they change the model again next year, so what? It's worth it to me now, so I'll buy it.

ZOS_DaryaK

Hey folks, just a friendly reminder here to keep your comments civil. We understand this is a divisive issue, but there's still no reason to insult other members of the community.

P3ZZL3

A valid Point @ZOS_DaryaK

Just out of interest, is there likely to be comments from the powers that be about this "divisive" issue?

Dutchrebel

My opinion is the warden class and BG should be added for free to the vanilla game .so everybody can enjoy that and should have been in the game from the beginning in the first place !.
if this was the case the morrowind map itself would have been a dlc aswell .
Dont use excuses oh you got a trial you got blablabla , remember thief's guild that came with MoL this is accesable with eso+.
So basicly your paying 40$ for some cosmetic *** and a map that probarly is gonne be 50% of the size and the rest of it mountains to fill up the space.
and 30+ hours yeah right .just some casual Mobs wich you can kill in 2 blows Exiting !
So in my eyes Zenimax is milking the cow on the morrowind name .

p.s its funny to see that you can buy the base game for under 10$ so tell me why i should pay 40$ for a "Expansion"
doesnt make any sense

sevomd69

Dutchrebel wrote: »

My opinion is the warden class and BG should be added for free to the vanilla game .so everybody can enjoy that and should have been in the game from the beginning in the first place !.
if this was the case the morrowind map itself would have been a dlc aswell .
Dont use excuses oh you got a trial you got blablabla , remember thief's guild that came with MoL this is accesable with eso+.
So basicly your paying 40$ for some cosmetic *** and a map that probarly is gonne be 50% of the size and the rest of it mountains to fill up the space.
and 30+ hours yeah right .just some casual Mobs wich you can kill in 2 blows Exiting !
So in my eyes Zenimax is milking the cow on the morrowind name .

p.s its funny to see that you can buy the base game for under 10$ so tell me why i should pay 40$ for a "Expansion"
doesnt make any sense

Nobody is forcing you to pay $40 for an "expansion"... you have the power to say no and not buy it... simple as that...

Elsonso

sirston wrote: »

and....2017 since you know ESO+ Don't get Morrowind because Its Not DLC its a chapter? which ever way you think of it DLC/Chapter/Expansion there all the same. Additions to the game.

... which is part of my problem with ESO Plus going forward. I really don't care about the number of updates, the number of DLC, and what they said, or did not say, in the past. My problem is where they are going.

A big problem with ESO Plus, right now, is that the value of the subscription is not as attractive as it was. What they are adding as a benefit in Homestead is a mixed message. They are boosting the number of items in the house, and then selling those items in the Crown Store, while making it a grind to avoid the Crown Store. It is no favor to me and is not attractive. It is just a way to get ESO Plus members to spend twice as much in the Crown Store (or grind twice as much) for furniture. It is nice that they are boosting the cap, but I am paying monthly for the game, and I don't feel that my "reward" should be that I can pay twice as much in the Crown Store.

With the introduction of Chapters, ESO Plus changes in a manner that reduces the value of DLC rental. I can just buy the DLC outright. There is no need for ESO Plus rental, so any time they do content that is not covered by ESO Plus, it becomes more attractive to just buy the DLC and be done with it. The crafting bag and costume dyes are benefits that persist over time, with no strings leading back to the Crown Store, and this is the future of ESO Plus for me.

I eagerly await news from ZOS on how they intend to move ESO Plus forward for this whole Next Chapter, and provide recurring value for the duration of the subscription.

Ojustaboo wrote: »

I disagree. They say named content that will be free while we sub, but for sale in the store. Hence some people subbed expecting to get free access to stuff 4 times a year that non subbers were going to have to pay for. Hence for them (me) it made the sub seem worthwhile.

See, when I read that quote (or listen) I don't think the same thing. My initial purchase of ESO Plus, back in 2015, was not even based on DLC. There were no DLC, just the promise of DLC. I paid for ESO Plus because I wanted the 10% boost due to the fact that I had only one "VR" character and no max skills, plus I felt the game was worth spending the money on. The Crowns and DLC were, at that time, unrealized benefits with no clear value.

ESO is not an investment. It might be expensive, for what I get, but I am getting what I paid for because I make the decision based on what I have, and what has been announced for the horizon. I don't make these decisions expecting that some benefit will happen just over the horizon.

Consequently, I am not upset about there being no Vvardenfell DLC. Yeah, I expected them to go that way, but that is a decision for renewal this year, not part of the reason that I renewed last year. This is why I am saying that they need to roll out news about what they plan to do with ESO Plus.

If I had to make the decision to renew today, I would let my subscription lapse. I still think the game is worth spending money on, but maybe not as an ESO Plus subscriber.

Night_Wolf2112

Here's the real story.... 'ZoS/ESO/Zeni wants more money now!' They slapped 'Morrowind' on this 'chapter' and will keep charging for future 'chapters' because.....

It won't be long and ES VI will be released and ESO will die off completely, or all subs will at least cease. Since 'Subs' are constantly being disenfranchised and not getting anything worth it (including explanations)... they will all quit and just go play Elder Scrolls VI: Valenwood

Ojustaboo

The thing is, while I suspect it's not legally binding (probably depends where you live) I just watched the ESO Live of One Tameriel and they did say that Clockwork City can be purchased or got with ESO plus.

Watch from 16:50 to 18:40

Right now you are looking at Orsinium or Wrothgar which is probably scheduled to be one of our earlier packs and you know, if you decide you want to buy it separately as dlc you can do that, if you decide you want to become an ESO Plus member, then this will come with ESO Plus, and I think thats one of the cool things, so for people who still like kind of the model that goes with subscription, the dlc will absolutely support that, here you can see some work we've done with Clockwork City. So there's a lot of cool places that people are going to want to visit and open up and there's multiple ways to get to these areas, and its basically just allowing people who want the option of how they want the dlc, how they want to pay for it, it's giving them more option.

That being the case, maybe those saying the expansion shouldn't be an additional cost have a point?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RxYZLOS5Jw

Sorry, I know I've posted this in a few threads, not my fault there's so many discussing exactly the same thing

Aliniel

ZOS_DaryaK wrote: »

Hey folks, just a friendly reminder here to keep your comments civil. We understand this is a divisive issue, but there's still no reason to insult other members of the community.

But why are you insulting us by changing your decisions so drastically without consulting with the most important group of people - your players. You deceived all your subscribers and shamelessly ask of us to pay you even more since 13 EUR/month isn't enough anymore.

reiverx

One of my concerns about this is if some of the best gear gets locked behind the Morrowind paywall. We already have this with VMA weapons.

sevomd69

Aliniel wrote: »

ZOS_DaryaK wrote: »

Hey folks, just a friendly reminder here to keep your comments civil. We understand this is a divisive issue, but there's still no reason to insult other members of the community.

But why are you insulting us by changing your decisions so drastically without consulting with the most important group of people - your players. You deceived all your subscribers and shamelessly ask of us to pay you even more since 13 EUR/month isn't enough anymore.

They certainly have not deceived me... I got exactly what ZOS told me I would be getting at that time and that they reserved the right to change what they were offering at anytime... so "all" subscribers were not deceived... in fact according to a poll here in the forum, it looks like a majority of subbers don't feel deceived....

silvereyes

lordrichter wrote: »

I really don't care about the number of updates, the number of DLC, and what they said, or did not say, in the past. My problem is where they are going.

A very valid concern, but there's a flip side to that coin. I would argue that adding new retail expansions is exactly what the developers need so that they *don't* have to keep chasing the crown store as their sole profit source.

It's a near-guaranteed major cash injection every year tied directly to the quality and size of content produced. I much prefer that business incentive to the slow creep towards F2P that the crown store seems to be experiencing.

In fact, it's a major reason I just decided to re-sub - well, that, and craft bags.

I was so disappointed with how the crown store seemed to be steering the all game development before, what with crown crates, 6k crown motifs, and the crazy grind that is housing.

The model change to retail expansions gives me a tiny bit of hope for the longevity of the game. It's a subdued hope of course, given ZOS' unique ability to screw things up that could be amazing and make them just meh.

vyndral13preub18_ESO

Dutchrebel wrote: »

My opinion is the warden class and BG should be added for free to the vanilla game .so everybody can enjoy that and should have been in the game from the beginning in the first place !.
if this was the case the morrowind map itself would have been a dlc aswell .
Dont use excuses oh you got a trial you got blablabla , remember thief's guild that came with MoL this is accesable with eso+.
So basicly your paying 40$ for some cosmetic *** and a map that probarly is gonne be 50% of the size and the rest of it mountains to fill up the space.
and 30+ hours yeah right .just some casual Mobs wich you can kill in 2 blows Exiting !
So in my eyes Zenimax is milking the cow on the morrowind name .

p.s its funny to see that you can buy the base game for under 10$ so tell me why i should pay 40$ for a "Expansion"
doesnt make any sense

While it isnt really a matter of cost to me I do worry about the BG and to some extent the warden.

If you limit the amount of people who can get into the BGs all you do is make them not function properly. Longer waits, always fighting the same people. That can kill BGs just like a broken dungeon finder killed random dungeons. Even once it started working better people still never did it, because of the bad wrap.

So I am afraid the limit to who can do it, and then if they make to many game modes those people will be split even further. now you are waiting a 20-40 mins for 12 people and a 5 minute fight. Hope it doesnt go that way.

Less so I am worried about the warden. MMOs have a habit of making new class more powerful then the old. I tend to think they do it to sell xpacs. Then down the line they are nerfed. It is like an MMO tradtion. But it is what it is I suppose.

Zimnel

To everyone complaining about paying for the expansion, I have an only question:
Did Blizzard gave for free any of their expansions just because "people pays every month to play"? No.

Eso has at this time one of the best premium subs, and I've been in some games that ask your blood to be in touch with endgame. Go ask any Skyforge player how much did they pay in order to raid. They would laugh at a 40 dollar complain.

Morrowind won't be a Dlc, they said it's a big expansion. It's not like I'm a Zos fanboy or something, it's the fact the complain seems to me out of place or too big compared with what they ask for it. 40 usd is what you pay for two costumes in other games, for a single costume set in other places, for a "pack" containing rng boxes... C'mon XD

corrosivechains

Ojustaboo wrote: »

The thing is, while I suspect it's not legally binding (probably depends where you live) I just watched the ESO Live of One Tameriel and they did say that Clockwork City can be purchased or got with ESO plus.

Watch from 16:50 to 18:40

Right now you are looking at Orsinium or Wrothgar which is probably scheduled to be one of our earlier packs and you know, if you decide you want to buy it separately as dlc you can do that, if you decide you want to become an ESO Plus member, then this will come with ESO Plus, and I think thats one of the cool things, so for people who still like kind of the model that goes with subscription, the dlc will absolutely support that, here you can see some work we've done with Clockwork City. So there's a lot of cool places that people are going to want to visit and open up and there's multiple ways to get to these areas, and its basically just allowing people who want the option of how they want the dlc, how they want to pay for it, it's giving them more option.

That being the case, maybe those saying the expansion shouldn't be an additional cost have a point?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RxYZLOS5Jw

Sorry, I know I've posted this in a few threads, not my fault there's so many discussing exactly the same thing

Keep that bookmarked, because we do know both were being worked on in tandem.

Elsonso

xeNNNNN wrote: »

3) You see this as perfectly fine? The price of the expansion is absurd, it offs almost 3x times less than most major MMO's out there when they release expansions. £20 for upgrade £40 for collectors maybe. But £64 for collectors and £40 for an upgrade? 1 region? Seriously? No thats not "fine" thats a price hike.

I am comparing Morrowind to Orsinium and Far Harbor. Far Harbor was the biggest DLC land that BGS had ever done, added 20 hours, and cost $25. Orsinium is the largest released DLC for ESO, adds 20 hours, and sells for 3000 crowns ($30). Morrowind will add 30 hours and sells for $40, which is equivalent to 5500 crowns (mentioned for comparison purposes).

Of course, Morrowind includes battlegrounds, a trial, and the new class, in addition to the zone. The zone includes housing, and needs to include standard zone features, like delves and public dungeons, side quests, and other stuff that they have not mentioned. They need to mention. Sooner, rather than later.

Based on this, I pre-ordered.

As I have said before, ZOS needs to get this right. Not just in their mind, but in the mind of the players. They might shoot for average, to cut development costs, and use marketing spin to fill the gap. In their mind, this would be getting it right. Marketing hype is a poor filler, for me, and probably many of us.

Gold Coast was nice, but not as good as Hew's Bane, which was not as good as Wrothgar. Vvardenfell needs to be noticeably better than Wrothgar.