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What do you think of Crown Store Random boxes/Lottery box?
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Graydon✭✭✭✭✭Yes but I just want it to be pay to win items, plus cosmeticsHilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.5 -
Iselin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.lordrichter wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »...You have me curious. Why would they want to limit the ammount of sales they get? Why would they want to limit the size of a product in game?
Why would they -care-?
Remember that ZOS makes no money at all off of the purchase of items in the Crown Store. ZERO. ZOS makes all of their money selling the initial "box" license, ESO Plus, and Crowns. It is all about actual real money, not virtual items in the Crown Store. They want to price things in the Crown Store so that people are purchasing Crowns. Therefore, the entire purpose of the Crown Store is to make people want to buy Crowns above and beyond what they can get from ESO Plus.
After that, it is all supply and demand, coupled with some social engineering. By creating artificial scarcity in the supply, they increase the desire for the item and the price people are willing to pay rises accordingly. This is how they maximize the sale of Crowns to players for real cash.
Actually I don't think that's true at all. ESO+ is structured in a way that there is very little need to do anything else if you do the sub option. The crown store is an alternative to the sub. Other games that do it the way you describe where sub AND cash purchases are both needed from the same players for their business model to be successful don't give you nearly as much with the optional sub...certainly not access to all DLC. They bundle several DLCs worth of content into "expansions" and sell those in addition to the sub.
I've always viewed ESO since the B2P conversion as "sub optional (but very beneficial and encouraged)" It's still very much a sub game at heart.
Nah. They have to price things so that ESO Plus members are purchasing additional Crowns. Artificial inflation. If you are not purchasing Crowns in addition to the 1500 from ESO Plus, you are under performing as a customer. Please review the customer Meta and restructure your build.
You need to get out more
Go play some of these other games that really go after your wallet... Neverwinter, Rift and SWTOR come to mind.
As much as I dislike this loot box thingie, ZOS is still one of the "good guys" and not nearly as predatory as others.3 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticslordrichter wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »...You have me curious. Why would they want to limit the ammount of sales they get? Why would they want to limit the size of a product in game?
Why would they -care-?
Remember that ZOS makes no money at all off of the purchase of items in the Crown Store. ZERO. ZOS makes all of their money selling the initial "box" license, ESO Plus, and Crowns. It is all about actual real money, not virtual items in the Crown Store. They want to price things in the Crown Store so that people are purchasing Crowns. Therefore, the entire purpose of the Crown Store is to make people want to buy Crowns above and beyond what they can get from ESO Plus.
After that, it is all supply and demand, coupled with some social engineering. By creating artificial scarcity in the supply, they increase the desire for the item and the price people are willing to pay rises accordingly. This is how they maximize the sale of Crowns to players for real cash.
Actually I don't think that's true at all. ESO+ is structured in a way that there is very little need to do anything else if you do the sub option. The crown store is an alternative to the sub. Other games that do it the way you describe where sub AND cash purchases are both needed from the same players for their business model to be successful don't give you nearly as much with the optional sub...certainly not access to all DLC. They bundle several DLCs worth of content into "expansions" and sell those in addition to the sub.
I've always viewed ESO since the B2P conversion as "sub optional (but very beneficial and encouraged)" It's still very much a sub game at heart.
Nah. They have to price things so that ESO Plus members are purchasing additional Crowns. Artificial inflation. If you are not purchasing Crowns in addition to the 1500 from ESO Plus, you are under performing as a customer. Please review the customer Meta and restructure your build.
You need to get out more
Go play some of these other games that really go after your wallet... Neverwinter, Rift and SWTOR come to mind.
As much as I dislike this loot box thingie, ZOS is still one of the "good guys" and not nearly as predatory as others.
if he is playing these other games how can he get out more?4 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsSorataArisugawa wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »These are going to be optional, you know. Anyone would think we're being coerced into giving our life savings away in the delusional hope that we might pick up some worthless trinket at the end of the day.
Note that I'm not saying I'd choose to have these boxes in the game, any more than I'd choose to have the Crown Store in it either, but while the first part of the topic was rationally and relatively calmly debated it has descended into way over-the-top and rather silly arguments that don't help to make the strong case against having these boxes in the game. Nor is the critics' case strengthened by the lobbing of petty insults at individual developers who can't realistically use this forum to defend themselves. They just get their words twisted and turned and thrown back at them in some cases months or even years down the line - and people wonder why the developers don't bother to post here!
There was a decent argument to be made against the boxes and that argument peaked a good few pages ago, most of what's been added since is just chipping away at the strength of that argument. I personally think this topic has run its course. If the developers have been following it then they'll have got the message a while back.
The devs haven't got the message until they remove the unique items from the rng boxes. It's attempting to exploit people, plain and simple. For shame.
isn't all business an attempt to 'exploit' people?
and if you fear you would be 'exploited' your recourse is simple..... don't buy them.
Yeah right. If there would be great gear in this boxes would a " just don't buy it" help? It would be considered Pay2Win even if just some people use this opportunity. For people who like greate styls the game is allready P2W und now they a completly unable to get the items they desire except if they collect the whole shop and gather replacment currentcy...
your argument seems to be 'if this, if that, if the other' rather than focusing on what we know. i'm fine with people condemning the idea on what is known but i find the notion of condemning it on speculation less than sensible.2 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsclayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »These are going to be optional, you know. Anyone would think we're being coerced into giving our life savings away in the delusional hope that we might pick up some worthless trinket at the end of the day.
Note that I'm not saying I'd choose to have these boxes in the game, any more than I'd choose to have the Crown Store in it either, but while the first part of the topic was rationally and relatively calmly debated it has descended into way over-the-top and rather silly arguments that don't help to make the strong case against having these boxes in the game. Nor is the critics' case strengthened by the lobbing of petty insults at individual developers who can't realistically use this forum to defend themselves. They just get their words twisted and turned and thrown back at them in some cases months or even years down the line - and people wonder why the developers don't bother to post here!
There was a decent argument to be made against the boxes and that argument peaked a good few pages ago, most of what's been added since is just chipping away at the strength of that argument. I personally think this topic has run its course. If the developers have been following it then they'll have got the message a while back.
The devs haven't got the message until they remove the unique items from the rng boxes. It's attempting to exploit people, plain and simple. For shame.
After 86 pages they've got the message. All that more pages of what has now become over-the-top arguments and personal insults will do is force them into a position where they feel they have to dig in and maintain their position rather than lose face. The arguments have been made, now let them weigh the situation up and come up with a response. Driving them further into a corner won't achieve anything.
Are you naive? They have to dig in and maintain their position. These have been in development for months. You think they are just going to throw all of that away?
Ric Flair says it best
if you think it is a done deal why are you continuing to post about it?
Because I am bored and someone said they wanted 100 pages so just trying to help.
/shrug...0 -
Iselin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.jedtb16_ESO wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »...You have me curious. Why would they want to limit the ammount of sales they get? Why would they want to limit the size of a product in game?
Why would they -care-?
Remember that ZOS makes no money at all off of the purchase of items in the Crown Store. ZERO. ZOS makes all of their money selling the initial "box" license, ESO Plus, and Crowns. It is all about actual real money, not virtual items in the Crown Store. They want to price things in the Crown Store so that people are purchasing Crowns. Therefore, the entire purpose of the Crown Store is to make people want to buy Crowns above and beyond what they can get from ESO Plus.
After that, it is all supply and demand, coupled with some social engineering. By creating artificial scarcity in the supply, they increase the desire for the item and the price people are willing to pay rises accordingly. This is how they maximize the sale of Crowns to players for real cash.
Actually I don't think that's true at all. ESO+ is structured in a way that there is very little need to do anything else if you do the sub option. The crown store is an alternative to the sub. Other games that do it the way you describe where sub AND cash purchases are both needed from the same players for their business model to be successful don't give you nearly as much with the optional sub...certainly not access to all DLC. They bundle several DLCs worth of content into "expansions" and sell those in addition to the sub.
I've always viewed ESO since the B2P conversion as "sub optional (but very beneficial and encouraged)" It's still very much a sub game at heart.
Nah. They have to price things so that ESO Plus members are purchasing additional Crowns. Artificial inflation. If you are not purchasing Crowns in addition to the 1500 from ESO Plus, you are under performing as a customer. Please review the customer Meta and restructure your build.
You need to get out more
Go play some of these other games that really go after your wallet... Neverwinter, Rift and SWTOR come to mind.
As much as I dislike this loot box thingie, ZOS is still one of the "good guys" and not nearly as predatory as others.
if he is playing these other games how can he get out more?
Meditate on it padawan, the obvious answer come it will.0 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsjedtb16_ESO wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »...You have me curious. Why would they want to limit the ammount of sales they get? Why would they want to limit the size of a product in game?
Why would they -care-?
Remember that ZOS makes no money at all off of the purchase of items in the Crown Store. ZERO. ZOS makes all of their money selling the initial "box" license, ESO Plus, and Crowns. It is all about actual real money, not virtual items in the Crown Store. They want to price things in the Crown Store so that people are purchasing Crowns. Therefore, the entire purpose of the Crown Store is to make people want to buy Crowns above and beyond what they can get from ESO Plus.
After that, it is all supply and demand, coupled with some social engineering. By creating artificial scarcity in the supply, they increase the desire for the item and the price people are willing to pay rises accordingly. This is how they maximize the sale of Crowns to players for real cash.
Actually I don't think that's true at all. ESO+ is structured in a way that there is very little need to do anything else if you do the sub option. The crown store is an alternative to the sub. Other games that do it the way you describe where sub AND cash purchases are both needed from the same players for their business model to be successful don't give you nearly as much with the optional sub...certainly not access to all DLC. They bundle several DLCs worth of content into "expansions" and sell those in addition to the sub.
I've always viewed ESO since the B2P conversion as "sub optional (but very beneficial and encouraged)" It's still very much a sub game at heart.
Nah. They have to price things so that ESO Plus members are purchasing additional Crowns. Artificial inflation. If you are not purchasing Crowns in addition to the 1500 from ESO Plus, you are under performing as a customer. Please review the customer Meta and restructure your build.
You need to get out more
Go play some of these other games that really go after your wallet... Neverwinter, Rift and SWTOR come to mind.
As much as I dislike this loot box thingie, ZOS is still one of the "good guys" and not nearly as predatory as others.
if he is playing these other games how can he get out more?
Meditate on it padawan, the obvious answer come it will.
ah.... i see, he should play them on a mobile device....
very interesting, but.....0 -
JamilaRaj✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes but I just want it to be pay to win items, plus cosmeticsDoctordarkspawn wrote: »These are going to be optional, you know. Anyone would think we're being coerced into giving our life savings away in the delusional hope that we might pick up some worthless trinket at the end of the day.
Note that I'm not saying I'd choose to have these boxes in the game, any more than I'd choose to have the Crown Store in it either, but while the first part of the topic was rationally and relatively calmly debated it has descended into way over-the-top and rather silly arguments that don't help to make the strong case against having these boxes in the game. Nor is the critics' case strengthened by the lobbing of petty insults at individual developers who can't realistically use this forum to defend themselves. They just get their words twisted and turned and thrown back at them in some cases months or even years down the line - and people wonder why the developers don't bother to post here!
There was a decent argument to be made against the boxes and that argument peaked a good few pages ago, most of what's been added since is just chipping away at the strength of that argument. I personally think this topic has run its course. If the developers have been following it then they'll have got the message a while back.
And yet we're still bloody well here. Why? Because we are passionate about this issue. I wanna hit 100 pages, and hammer that point home, personally.
As for the developers who have been individually attacked...individual people can be help accountable and should. The quotemining, the individuals being held accountable, this is not a thing centric to this forum. Though, I think the discussion about just how much we should hold people to their word as time goes by is a discussion worth having.
And as for the 'it's going to be optional you know', that misses the point of why people hate these entirely. They hate the system. They hate the practice. Just because it does not effect them directly does not mean it does not effect them indirectly.
If you no longer have anything to add to the discussion then by all means, take your leave of it. But enough with the parting shots on the way out. Crap, or get off the pot.
You've pretty much made my point for me, to be honest. The good arguments were made a while back in the topic, now it's just overblown rhetoric and personal abuse for no other purpose than to extend the topic a few more pages. All it's doing is weakening the strong case that is already established (and giving the mods an excuse to close the topic because it's run its course). If you want to keep up the argument at least keep it on track and leave out all the personal stuff whether directed at the developers or other players. That's the only way an argument is ever won.
But there is no way to win the argument, scamboxes do work, they make money, like slot machines, there is no way to prove they do not, and there is no way we could convince greedy people to choose to lose money. We are doomed.
Instead of trying to win what is lost, we should seize the opportunity with both hands and sling some insults at ZOS while it lasts.anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »
These Firor jokes are becoming a bit stale though.0 -
Recremen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.
Exactly. I would gladly spend money for a cosmetic I like, and I do. With this approach, the crown store updates each month for the rng boxes would have to include much more appealing stuff then the other store offerings otherwise no one will buy them. This is going to kill their sales for the average consumer. They are trying to target the big spenders willing to pay hundreds a month. They should show a little integrity and continue with transparent business practices.starkerealm wrote: »Another thing that hit me today: how much money do they want from me (figuratevely) as a customer? I pay sub (6 month lapse) , i normally buy about 3 largest crown packs within the same amont of time, so i spend just under $200 every 6 months, about $400 yearly.
This is a pretty crazy sum of money. This game costs me the same as all my entertainment related memberships (hulu, netflix, etc) altogether. How much more am i expected to pay? I don't think that this game has too many people that don't spend anything (0, to be precise, since there's also one-time box cost involved).
Needless to say, i do not hesitate to buy things i want from crown store whenever they are offered. Now i will need to gamble and spend more money to be able to buy/randomly get the same thing i could buy at my own will, and probably spend more crowns/money while at it.
This is confusing. I like supporting this game, but i'd like to do it without going broke.
Yeah, the irony is, if they were offering these new mounts at 40 a piece, like the Dro'm'athra mount, they'd probably get substantially more money out of me as I chased the ones I want. But, with this approach? I'll pass.
The most messed-up thing is that even the ones willing to pay hundreds a month won't be guaranteed to get The Cool Thing. They are somewhat more likely to get it, but it's no guarantee, which is the problem with all pure RNG systems, most especially ones that cost real money.
ZOS can already milk people willing to pay hundreds or any arbitrary sum. This new measure will help milk people generally unwilling to pay hundreds, sometimes not even $4, but that can be tricked into paying that and much more.
If ZOS rolled out a scambox, guarantee the epic X is inside (at which point it would stop being a scambox, or at least of this particular kind) and asked for $400, nobody but a whale or two would buy it.
But if ZOS rolls out a scambox, says the epic X may be inside (and makes sure there are nice pictures of X everywhere on it) and puts $4 price tag on it, gullible players will conclude X = $4 and buy it, including those who would normally not buy a $4 thing, because they will be offered X, that would otherwise cost, say, $40, for mere $4, and that is bloody good deal, isn't it? If there is nothing in a scambox, they will buy another, because $40 X for $8 is almost as good, and so on.
Though as I wrote earlier, ZOS is doing it in rather clever way, so deceptive prices are not deceptive and gambling is not gambling.
I don't see the normal Crown Store offerings as "milking", it's paying a fixed price (albiet in a nonreturnable fiat currency) for a digital good. There's no compulsion there, you're just getting what you want. The only thing that's currently "milking" in relation to the Crown Store is the nonreturnable fiat currency, which I also opposed back when they were announcing the Crown Store. It's complete crap that you're always going to have Crowns left over even after you've bought everything you want.
Men'Do PC NA AD Khajiit
Grand High Illustrious Mid-Tier PvP/PvE Bussmunster1 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.So even though my questions were NOT in the realm of what I think about this subject the powers that be decided to lock that thread and shunt me back over here. So, being left with not choice, there are my questions then and hopefully the OP ofTHIS thread will forgive the tangent!
So there' this article out now. mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/feature/11112/Elder-Scrolls-Online-All-About-the-Crown-Crates-Coming-in-One-Tamriel.html
While I personally find it disappointing that instead of actually engaging the customers here they chose to do a PR article (which would have been fine if they had ALSO chosen to engage their customers here) I found that it also left me with more questions than answers. Here are some of the things that were not answered and that many of us would like specific answers to.
Matt Firor says, "Crown Crates are obtainable exclusively in the Crown Store, and the consumables they contain are the same ones that you are probably already purchasing directly in the Crown Store. The difference is that you have a chance to get additional items in a Crown Crate – the same items that are on sale in the Crown Store. There is also a rarer chance to receive a discontinued limited-time-offer Crown Store item. The rarest items are Crown-Crate only items that we will cycle out every quarter or so for a new set."
You've also already said there would be special, exclusive mounts that will only be available via the RNG boxes.
So what we want to know is this...
1. Will there be costumes that are ONLY available via RNG boxes and that have NEVER been offered in the crown store before?
2. Will there be hairstyles that will ONLY be available via the RNG boxes?
3. Will there be tattoos that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
4. Will there be makeup that is ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
5. Will there be scars that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
6. Will there be pets that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
7. Will there be adornments that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
8. Will there be dyes that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
9. Will there be emotes that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
10. Will there be personalities that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
11. Will there be new hair colors that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
12. Will there be polymorphs that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
13. Will there be trinkets that are ONLY available via the RNG boxes?
Also, regarding the "gems" Firor had this to say, "There is a very good chance – especially if you are a regular collector of Crown Store items – that you will receive a collectible from a Crown Crate that you already have. When that happens, instead of a duplicate item, you will receive a new form of currency, the Crown Gem. You can then spend Crown Gems in a new section of the Crown Store where you can purchase the item that you want – including Crown Crate-exclusive items. The gem store will contain all of the collectibles available in all the Crown Crates, so you will be able to acquire the collectible you want, even if you don’t get it directly from a Crown Crate."
This does not address players like me who have deliberately passed on many costumes or other items because I did not like them or want them. Yet if I get one of these items that I did not ever want in the first place it appears that I am stuck with it and cannot "trade it in" for "gems" to put towards an item I DO want. Is this in fact the case?
These are the questions I, and many others, would like the answers to @ZOS_MattFiror , @ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom . Can you please answer them? Doing so will likely allay much of the discontent your customers have been feeling about this new and under-explained development. Thank you.
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!8 -
nimander99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.I AM UPDATING MY PRIVACY POLICY
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
∽∽∽ 2 years of Elder Scrolls Online ∼∼∼
"Give us money" = Box sales & monthly sub fees,
"moar!" = £10 palomino horse,
"MOAR!" = Switch to B2P, launch cash shop,
"MOAR!!" = Charge for DLC that subs had already paid for,
"MOAR!!!" = Experience scrolls and riding lessons,
"MOARR!!!" = Vampire/werewolf bites,
"MOAARRR!!!" = CS exclusive motifs,
"MOOAARRR!!!" = Crown crates,
"MOOOAAARRR!!!" = 'Chapter's' bought separately from ESO+,
"MOOOOAAAARRRR!!!!" = ???
Male, Dunmer, VR16, Templar, Aldmeri Dominion, Master Crafter & all Traits, CP4504 -
Morimizo✭✭✭✭✭No I dislike the random crown store boxes, to much of a gambleGreat post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?2 -
Bouldercleave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsGreat post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?
Then simply do what I plan to do - OPT OUT. I just can't comprehend why everyone is so up in arms about you don't have to do, buy, partake, or even think about.1 -
Graydon✭✭✭✭✭Yes but I just want it to be pay to win items, plus cosmeticsnimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
Players are going to play. Gamblers are going to gamble.
0 -
nimander99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.@MornaBaine I believe the answer to all your questions is a resounding Yes.
I'll say this also though it certainly doesn't apply to everyone I think it does apply to a lot of gamers in the online market. Our character appearance is central to our own self images or desires to be perceived in an online environment, so we craft unique sets or chase monster sets etc. We also buy costumes and skins to differentiate ourselves.
This is especially important in this game as entire systems have been built around cosmetic features. Now enter the Crown Lockboxes which only the most rare and unique items will ever be available and you have, in essence, not necessarily a P2W scenario, but a gamble to look the most unique...
And in a game with whole systems designed around a cosmetic approach, this is in essence a P2W formula.
And what's to stop Zenimax from putting yellow mats or mats of any kind in lock boxes? That's convenient isn't it? It's not really P2W after all they are just mats, not gear.I AM UPDATING MY PRIVACY POLICY
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
∽∽∽ 2 years of Elder Scrolls Online ∼∼∼
"Give us money" = Box sales & monthly sub fees,
"moar!" = £10 palomino horse,
"MOAR!" = Switch to B2P, launch cash shop,
"MOAR!!" = Charge for DLC that subs had already paid for,
"MOAR!!!" = Experience scrolls and riding lessons,
"MOARR!!!" = Vampire/werewolf bites,
"MOAARRR!!!" = CS exclusive motifs,
"MOOAARRR!!!" = Crown crates,
"MOOOAAARRR!!!" = 'Chapter's' bought separately from ESO+,
"MOOOOAAAARRRR!!!!" = ???
Male, Dunmer, VR16, Templar, Aldmeri Dominion, Master Crafter & all Traits, CP4504 -
Recremen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.Bouldercleave wrote: »Great post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?
Then simply do what I plan to do - OPT OUT. I just can't comprehend why everyone is so up in arms about you don't have to do, buy, partake, or even think about.
@Bouldercleave
Some of us like supporting this game, and realize that the development time spent making gambling-box-exclusive content detracts from making legitimate Crown Store items. It's not like they have two separate art teams working on gambling box content and Crown Store content. So every item we would have purchased is instead a lost opportunity to both support the game and to buy something nice. And of course we can't just buy "enough" gambling boxes to guarantee we get the item, since that's not how probability works. This represents a dramatic change from what we expect from our service provider. It sends the message "we don't care if some of you don't get the things you want regardless of how much money you spend trting". I think that's a perfectly justifiable reason to feel hurt and angry.Men'Do PC NA AD Khajiit
Grand High Illustrious Mid-Tier PvP/PvE Bussmunster6 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.Bouldercleave wrote: »Great post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?
Then simply do what I plan to do - OPT OUT. I just can't comprehend why everyone is so up in arms about you don't have to do, buy, partake, or even think about.
First they came with the lockboxes, but I did not buy lockboxes, so I said nothing.
Silence is allowance. I refuse to allow it.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on August 29, 2016 5:36PM7 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsnimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.1 -
Bouldercleave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsDoctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Great post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?
Then simply do what I plan to do - OPT OUT. I just can't comprehend why everyone is so up in arms about you don't have to do, buy, partake, or even think about.
First they came for the lockboxes, but I did not buy lockboxes, so I said nothing.
Silence is allowance. I refuse to allow it.
Good Lord - Did you seriously just equate the RNG boxes with the Holocaust? You people are an absolute mess.
If you are "hurt" or feel personally slighted by this, you really just need to thicken up the skin a bit.
I'm sure that this will be my last post on this thread as one of you will feel hurt and report my terrorist words and I'll get banned.4 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.Bouldercleave wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Great post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?
Then simply do what I plan to do - OPT OUT. I just can't comprehend why everyone is so up in arms about you don't have to do, buy, partake, or even think about.
First they came for the lockboxes, but I did not buy lockboxes, so I said nothing.
Silence is allowance. I refuse to allow it.
Good Lord - Did you seriously just equate the RNG boxes with the Holocaust? You people are an absolute mess.
If you are "hurt" or feel personally slighted by this, you really just need to thicken up the skin a bit.
I'm sure that this will be my last post on this thread as one of you will feel hurt and report my terrorist words and I'll get banned.
Equate? No, I didn't use the full quote because...that's a horrible misuse of it. Plus it does not make sense in context.
But I think the principle behind it still holds. If you say nothing and just -let it happen-, nobody even realizes there's any potential problem. This is how behavior like this becomes normalized, and it should not be normalized.
Maybe this quote will be better for you. "The only way for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing."Edited by Doctordarkspawn on August 29, 2016 5:41PM3 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Silence is allowance. I refuse to allow it.
Except they don't really need your permission, nor your blessing :-)
In this case, silence is allowance but speaking up is a waste of saliva / typing time.
2 -
KatzMainTank✭✭✭No I dislike the random crown store boxes, to much of a gambleThe thirst is so real...
#CashGrabEP - V12 - Crafter
EP - V1 - Stamina NB
EP - 49 - Stamina Templar
EP - 46 - StamSorc
EP - 24 - ManaBlade
DC - 26 - StamSorc
PSN: KMT_Drahc
Left Eye Gang dueling guild recruiter, join us!6 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.As we near 90 pages. I wonder one thing.
Why in the world, is this a forum thread that needs to exist in the current year?Edited by Doctordarkspawn on August 29, 2016 5:46PM3 -
Bouldercleave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsDoctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Great post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?
Then simply do what I plan to do - OPT OUT. I just can't comprehend why everyone is so up in arms about you don't have to do, buy, partake, or even think about.
First they came for the lockboxes, but I did not buy lockboxes, so I said nothing.
Silence is allowance. I refuse to allow it.
Good Lord - Did you seriously just equate the RNG boxes with the Holocaust? You people are an absolute mess.
If you are "hurt" or feel personally slighted by this, you really just need to thicken up the skin a bit.
I'm sure that this will be my last post on this thread as one of you will feel hurt and report my terrorist words and I'll get banned.
Equate? No, I didn't use the full quote because...that's a horrible misuse of it. Plus it does not make sense in context.
But I think the principle behind it still holds. If you say nothing and just -let it happen-, nobody even realizes there's any potential problem. This is how behavior like this becomes normalized, and it should not be normalized.
Maybe this quote will be better for you. "The only way for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing."
No, that quote is no better, because you are still pretending to be the white knight of hope defending us from the big bad corporate monster. A complete and utter over reaction.
Bottom line, it is their company to do with it as they please. They will live with the decisions and directions that they take THEIR company in.
[Edit to remove flaming]Edited by [Deleted User] on August 29, 2016 6:20PM1 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.Bouldercleave wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Great post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?
Then simply do what I plan to do - OPT OUT. I just can't comprehend why everyone is so up in arms about you don't have to do, buy, partake, or even think about.
First they came for the lockboxes, but I did not buy lockboxes, so I said nothing.
Silence is allowance. I refuse to allow it.
Good Lord - Did you seriously just equate the RNG boxes with the Holocaust? You people are an absolute mess.
If you are "hurt" or feel personally slighted by this, you really just need to thicken up the skin a bit.
I'm sure that this will be my last post on this thread as one of you will feel hurt and report my terrorist words and I'll get banned.
Equate? No, I didn't use the full quote because...that's a horrible misuse of it. Plus it does not make sense in context.
But I think the principle behind it still holds. If you say nothing and just -let it happen-, nobody even realizes there's any potential problem. This is how behavior like this becomes normalized, and it should not be normalized.
Maybe this quote will be better for you. "The only way for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing."
No, that quote is no better, because you are still pretending to be the white knight of hope defending us from the big bad corporate monster. A complete and utter over reaction.
Bottom line, it is their company to do with it as they please. They will live with the decisions and directions that they take THEIR company in.
I will not be silent because you think I should.
I will not discard my opinion because you think it is rediculous.
I will not develop Stockholm syndrome because you say it's nice this time of year.
...Also, white knight? Really? I dont. I dont even -know- how your drawing these conclusions from one quote paraphrased to the point of memeing (Now there's a word that needs in the dictionary) and another quote ment to make the same point. What in gods holy name are you blathering about?
Edited by [Deleted User] on August 29, 2016 6:23PM3 -
nimander99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Dude... Seriously? I am not even remotely talking about a system of RNG built in to a game... I am talking about GAMBLING. Your response is disingenuous my friend i.e you knowingly applied a strawman argument to divert attention from a valid point.
There is randomness in everything... Grats, you nailed it.I AM UPDATING MY PRIVACY POLICY
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
∽∽∽ 2 years of Elder Scrolls Online ∼∼∼
"Give us money" = Box sales & monthly sub fees,
"moar!" = £10 palomino horse,
"MOAR!" = Switch to B2P, launch cash shop,
"MOAR!!" = Charge for DLC that subs had already paid for,
"MOAR!!!" = Experience scrolls and riding lessons,
"MOARR!!!" = Vampire/werewolf bites,
"MOAARRR!!!" = CS exclusive motifs,
"MOOAARRR!!!" = Crown crates,
"MOOOAAARRR!!!" = 'Chapter's' bought separately from ESO+,
"MOOOOAAAARRRR!!!!" = ???
Male, Dunmer, VR16, Templar, Aldmeri Dominion, Master Crafter & all Traits, CP4504 -
ThePaleItalian✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lets look at it this way:
Crown XP Scroll - 300 Crowns
10 pack of tri-potions - 200 Crowns
Haj Mota Hatching - 1000 Crowns.
I am just using this as an example. Lets say you buy a crown box for 400 crowns and get all of that.... are you happy with your purchase?
I have crowns laying around, I am subbed and I will probably buy 1 or 2.
If a "whale" or someone wants to drop 1,000$ on said boxes, let them... seriously, how in the world is ZOS supposed to continue to make money for this game? You wanna go back to Sub only?? Doubt it, forums would blow up for "ZOMG, 15$ for a crap game is QQ...hate you ZOS you sucks!!!!"
So no sub now but some crown COSMETIC stuff.... wanna know the response to that? Look above ^^^
I got the RNG.. its in every single MMO.. but stop the end of the world stuff until they hit. If you don't wanna buy one, then don't.
I am pretty sure 90% of you have bought something from the crown store. So look back at what you spent and what you spent your crowns on.... stop being a hypocrite just because you don't "like" it.Conan, what is good in life?
Crush your enemies. See them driven before you. Hear the lamentations of their women.
PS4 Screen Name: The_Pale_Italian
ZweiHandler - Orc DK Tank
Solstice StormHaven - Magika Sorc
Oba Nobanaga - Stam NB0 -
Bouldercleave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsDoctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Great post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?
Then simply do what I plan to do - OPT OUT. I just can't comprehend why everyone is so up in arms about you don't have to do, buy, partake, or even think about.
First they came for the lockboxes, but I did not buy lockboxes, so I said nothing.
Silence is allowance. I refuse to allow it.
Good Lord - Did you seriously just equate the RNG boxes with the Holocaust? You people are an absolute mess.
If you are "hurt" or feel personally slighted by this, you really just need to thicken up the skin a bit.
I'm sure that this will be my last post on this thread as one of you will feel hurt and report my terrorist words and I'll get banned.
Equate? No, I didn't use the full quote because...that's a horrible misuse of it. Plus it does not make sense in context.
But I think the principle behind it still holds. If you say nothing and just -let it happen-, nobody even realizes there's any potential problem. This is how behavior like this becomes normalized, and it should not be normalized.
Maybe this quote will be better for you. "The only way for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing."
No, that quote is no better, because you are still pretending to be the white knight of hope defending us from the big bad corporate monster. A complete and utter over reaction.
Bottom line, it is their company to do with it as they please. They will live with the decisions and directions that they take THEIR company in.
The reality of the situation is you have only 2 choices: STFU or GTFO.
I will not be silent because you think I should.
I will not discard my opinion because you think it is rediculous.
I will not develop Stockholm syndrome because you say it's nice this time of year.
...Also, white knight? Really? I dont. I dont even -know- how your drawing these conclusions from one quote paraphrased to the point of memeing (Now there's a word that needs in the dictionary) and another quote ment to make the same point. What in gods holy name are you blathering about?
Wow, you opened my eyes! You are 100% right! Don't be silent because I think you are over reacting - you just keep pounding your fist against the wall and fighting the good fight.
I'll be in game enjoying my afternoon if you need me.2 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.Bouldercleave wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »Great post, @MornaBaine.
Easy, most likely answer to all your questions? YES.
I'm more interested in, will all those item categories you mentioned still have representatives on the honest, normal part of the Crown Store?
Easy , most likely answer? Probably not many, if at all.
Regarding the gems, filling up our collectibles inventory with the items we didn't want in the first place is not an acceptable "consolation" prize, no matter how they try to sell it.
What's the phrase? Don't serve me Guar Urine and tell me it's Colovian Brandy?
Then simply do what I plan to do - OPT OUT. I just can't comprehend why everyone is so up in arms about you don't have to do, buy, partake, or even think about.
First they came for the lockboxes, but I did not buy lockboxes, so I said nothing.
Silence is allowance. I refuse to allow it.
Good Lord - Did you seriously just equate the RNG boxes with the Holocaust? You people are an absolute mess.
If you are "hurt" or feel personally slighted by this, you really just need to thicken up the skin a bit.
I'm sure that this will be my last post on this thread as one of you will feel hurt and report my terrorist words and I'll get banned.
Equate? No, I didn't use the full quote because...that's a horrible misuse of it. Plus it does not make sense in context.
But I think the principle behind it still holds. If you say nothing and just -let it happen-, nobody even realizes there's any potential problem. This is how behavior like this becomes normalized, and it should not be normalized.
Maybe this quote will be better for you. "The only way for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing."
No, that quote is no better, because you are still pretending to be the white knight of hope defending us from the big bad corporate monster. A complete and utter over reaction.
Bottom line, it is their company to do with it as they please. They will live with the decisions and directions that they take THEIR company in.
I will not be silent because you think I should.
I will not discard my opinion because you think it is rediculous.
I will not develop Stockholm syndrome because you say it's nice this time of year.
...Also, white knight? Really? I dont. I dont even -know- how your drawing these conclusions from one quote paraphrased to the point of memeing (Now there's a word that needs in the dictionary) and another quote ment to make the same point. What in gods holy name are you blathering about?
Wow, you opened my eyes! You are 100% right! Don't be silent because I think you are over reacting - you just keep pounding your fist against the wall and fighting the good fight.
I'll be in game enjoying my afternoon if you need me.
Edited by [Deleted User] on August 29, 2016 6:23PM0 -
Abeille✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No I dislike the random crown store boxes, to much of a gambleanitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Silence is allowance. I refuse to allow it.
Except they don't really need your permission, nor your blessing :-)
In this case, silence is allowance but speaking up is a waste of saliva / typing time.
ZOS changed stuff because of the players' feedback before, for better or for worse, depending on who you ask.
I don't think anything we can say would stop them from adding the boxes, but stating what we dislike and what we fear about them can make them tweak them a bit here and there to make them more player-friendly, and to at least delay the addition of potentially harmful items to them.
Or nothing will change. Who knows? Better to speak up and risk nothing changing than to stay quiet and make sure nothing will change.Edited by Abeille on August 29, 2016 6:01PMJust so that everyone knows, my Altmer still can't have black hair. About a dozen of Altmer NPCs in the game have black hair. Just saying.
Meet my characters:Command: Do the thing.
Zadarri, Khajiit Fist of Thalmor: The thing was done, as commanded.
Durza gra-Maghul, Orc blacksmith: The thing was done perfectly, in the most efficient way.
Tegwen, Bosmer troublemaker: You can't prove I didn't do the thing.
Sings-Many-Songs, Argonian fisher: Sure, I'll do the thing... Eventually. Maybe.
Aerindel, Altmer stormcaller: After extensive research, I've come to the conclusion that doing the thing would be a waste of resources.
Liliel, Dunmer pyromancer: Aerindel said I shouldn't do the thing. Something about "resources".
Gyda Snowcaller, Nord cryomancer: I will find a way to do it that won't waste resources and make Aerindel proud of me.
Beatrice Leoriane, Breton vampire: I persuaded someone else into doing the thing. You are welcome, dear.
Sahima, Redguard performer: Doing the thing sounds awfully unpleasant and really not my problem.
Ellaria Valerius, Imperial priestess: I'll pray to the Eight for the thing to be done, if it is Their will.6
This discussion has been closed.