Balanced.

myrrrorb14_ESO

Should of used potions. Death cap don't lie.

Pretty easy to get ganked while riding a horse. Not sure this was the best example on why to nerf templars.

Lyar09

blabafat wrote: »

Here we go again, ladies and gentlemen.

I brought the popcorn this time. Gonna be a great show

Sallington

Let's stand still and face each other. You spam Vigor, I'll spam RD. Let's see how fast I "melt" you.

Zheg

@OdinForge of course wings shuts down a magplar. Does that mean the magplar will always lose? Of course not. Well timed CC, burst from prox and ult can do it if you've gotten them damaged already. But does that mean a DK will always die to RD? No, it doesn't. The point is that DK and magplars are in a position right now where they counter each other, though I would argue DK is a stronger counter. When I see DKs whining about RD, it's abundantly clear to me that they would not want to give up their strengths (talons, wings) against a magplar, but want the one counter to them to be done away with for obvious reasons - reasons that have little to do with actual balance.

If the discussion is about RD in an outnumbered situation, why is the OP about a guy on a horse being ganked by a single templar? Hmmmmmmm? The discussion is about whining, plain and simple, because people do in fact want easy mode.

The outnumbered argument has been done already, and sorry, but you aren't capable of making a strong enough argument for why skills should be balanced around a 1vX situation at the expense of 1v1, small groups, and mid-large scale groups. You're just not that important guys, sorry to burst your bubble. You also don't get to cherry pick a single skill in outnumbered situations when you'd die just as quick if all of those templars were NBs. I don't die to jesus beam in outnumbered situations very often, most of the time it's because of a WB or a bowtard after I've exhausted all my stam and am rooted and can't CC break. That's because it's not a counter to my build. You don't see me making multiple threads complaining about every counter to my build, do you? No, because that would be silly.

Takllin

Radiant is also bugged and will show ticks that happened after the person died. It's been like this since they released the skill.

This is a pretty poor example for your argument. I don't really like RD, but the QQ about this is ridiculous.

OdinForge

Zheg wrote: »

@OdinForge of course wings shuts down a magplar. Does that mean the magplar will always lose? Of course not. Well timed CC, burst from prox and ult can do it if you've gotten them damaged already. But does that mean a DK will always die to RD? No, it doesn't. The point is that DK and magplars are in a position right now where they counter each other, though I would argue DK is a stronger counter. When I see DKs whining about RD, it's abundantly clear to me that they would not want to give up their strengths (talons, wings) against a magplar, but want the one counter to them to be done away with for obvious reasons - reasons that have little to do with actual balance.

If the discussion is about RD in an outnumbered situation, why is the OP about a guy on a horse being ganked by a single templar? Hmmmmmmm? The discussion is about whining, plain and simple, because people do in fact want easy mode.

The outnumbered argument has been done already, and sorry, but you aren't capable of making a strong enough argument for why skills should be balanced around a 1vX situation at the expense of 1v1, small groups, and mid-large scale groups. You're just not that important guys, sorry to burst your bubble. You also don't get to cherry pick a single skill in outnumbered situations when you'd die just as quick if all of those templars were NBs. I don't die to jesus beam in outnumbered situations very often, most of the time it's because of a WB or a bowtard after I've exhausted all my stam and am rooted and can't CC break. That's because it's not a counter to my build. You don't see me making multiple threads complaining about every counter to my build, do you? No, because that would be silly.

At the expense of 1v1 or raid? That skill isn't even good for those scenarios, at best ZOS should be providing a better designed skill for these situations.

You don't see me making multiple threads complaining about every counter to my build, do you? No, because that would be silly.

Wrecking blow had its time in the sun, and now they split the effects between two morphs. Maybe you didn't make threads about it, but people did and that's how it works.

You're over-complicating this, and since you aren't a solo player, you're incapable of understanding what anyone here is saying. Your argument is just as opinionated as the rest of us, you're just on the opposite side of the fence. You think you're on some high throne, but really you haven't done anything more than banter opinions yourself.

When you say stuff like this.

but you aren't capable of making a strong enough argument for why skills should be balanced around a 1vX situation at the expense of 1v1, small groups, and mid-large scale groups

You're just not that important guys, sorry to burst your bubble.

You're just flexing your opinion, you aren't an authority. This isn't your pie to choose how to share, you play the same game everyone else does. Until ZOS gives the small player a place to stretch their legs you have to deal with our play style.

frozywozy

That moment when @Zheg complains about talon spam from a stamDK or that other moment when he says that RD is the only counter to any stam build. lol

_Chaos

@OdinForge I just see a lot of whiney bitching and no rebuttal as to why a skill should be balanced for outnumbered situations. Hell, you said "you" more than 10 times and expect to have your opinion taken seriously? Taking things way too personal champ.

Why in the world would we start taking into consideration skill balance in a 1v3(e.g.)? Of course three players are going to have an advantage over one. Every build has counters, stamina's just happens to be RD. Just because you're a great player doesn't mean you get to counter everything in all situations. I can't counter Chief when he drains my stam from 5WB's in a row even after being cc'd, meteored, prox det, and flame lashed. It is what it is, every build has a weakness. Welcome to balance. (coming from an mDK )

OdinForge

_Chaos wrote: »

@OdinForge I just see a lot of whiney bitching and no rebuttal as to why a skill should be balanced for outnumbered situations. Hell, you said "you" more than 10 times and expect to have your opinion taken seriously? Taking things way too personal champ.

Why in the world would we start taking into consideration skill balance in a 1v3(e.g.)? Of course three players are going to have an advantage over one. Every build has counters, stamina's just happens to be RD. Just because you're a great player doesn't mean you get to counter everything in all situations. I can't counter Chief when he drains my stam from 5WB's in a row even after being cc'd, meteored, prox det, and flame lashed. It is what it is, every build has a weakness. Welcome to balance. (coming from an mDK )

And I just see a lot of bias and opinionated logic from group players, with no actual facts to back up your own points. This type of debate isn't going to have a lot of natural fact citing, you have a group of solo minded players annoyed with how easy it is to spam RD. And you have a group of, well group players defending it with your own opinions. Which is okay, but get off your high horses acting like you guys have some basis. Zheg outright said solo players aren't important, and somehow that means his logic is correct, it isn't.

You're losing all your stam on 5 wrecking blows? I mean even for a magicka DK, you can't manage your resources that well? Maybe the reason you can't counter Chief is because he knows how to outplay your resource management..you're a group player Chaos, and no slight in that direction as VE is accomplished. However Chief knows how to defend himself alone and he plays many classes. You haven't convinced me that losing to Chief has any relevance to noobs spamming RD.

vortexman11

#NerfScorchedEarth

More importantly, why does ZOS tell us we lose armour durability when we die in PvP?

Zheg

frozywozy wrote: »

That moment when @Zheg complains about talon spam from a stamDK or that other moment when he says that RD is the only counter to any stam build. lol

Talon spam? I pretty clearly implied tactical use when sweeps are happening to ensure they hit air. And one would assume RD is the only counter given how much whining you and other stam DKs do over it. I don't hear you calling for your strengths to be nerfed, just your counters to be nerfed. The rest of us smell the BS from a mile away.

Odin, you and those of similar opinions have been incapable of providing sound evidence of Jesus beam overperforming when it shouldn't be. Incapable. It's been over a month, most of you record and make videos, so if it was so broken you'd all be using that evidence in these threads. You're not. You're not because we both know the truth. People will continue insulting each other and your crowd will continue trying to portray the situation as hysterical Templars trying to hold onto an OP skill, but the bottom line is none of you have produced a video showing it's actually overperforming because it isn't and you don't want to embarass yourselves.

Zheg

OdinForge wrote: »

_Chaos wrote: »

@OdinForge I just see a lot of whiney bitching and no rebuttal as to why a skill should be balanced for outnumbered situations. Hell, you said "you" more than 10 times and expect to have your opinion taken seriously? Taking things way too personal champ.

Why in the world would we start taking into consideration skill balance in a 1v3(e.g.)? Of course three players are going to have an advantage over one. Every build has counters, stamina's just happens to be RD. Just because you're a great player doesn't mean you get to counter everything in all situations. I can't counter Chief when he drains my stam from 5WB's in a row even after being cc'd, meteored, prox det, and flame lashed. It is what it is, every build has a weakness. Welcome to balance. (coming from an mDK )

And I just see a lot of bias and opinionated logic from group players, with no actual facts to back up your own points. This type of debate isn't going to have a lot of natural fact citing, you have a group of solo minded players annoyed with how easy it is to spam RD. And you have a group of, well group players defending it with your own opinions. Which is okay, but get off your high horses acting like you guys have some basis. Zheg outright said solo players aren't important, and somehow that means his logic is correct, it isn't.

You're losing all your stam on 5 wrecking blows? I mean even for a magicka DK, you can't manage your resources that well? Maybe the reason you can't counter Chief is because he knows how to outplay your resource management..you're a group player Chaos, and no slight in that direction as VE is accomplished. However Chief knows how to defend himself alone and he plays many classes. You haven't convinced me that losing to Chief has any relevance to noobs spamming RD.

Uhhh, when did I say solo players weren't important? I said you 1vXers thinking that balance needs to be catered to you and your desire to fight and win against obscene numbers, at the expense of every other type of combat, is not important. That's a point I stand behind, and if you want to argue that your capacity to 1vX is more important than every other type of fighting, not only will you look like a moron doing so, but you'll demonstrate the mentality behind your crowd calling for unsubstantiated nerfs.

Again, if it's so broken, show proof. Until then, I'm going to keep calling all of you out for BS.

_Chaos

OdinForge wrote: »

_Chaos wrote: »

@OdinForge I just see a lot of whiney bitching and no rebuttal as to why a skill should be balanced for outnumbered situations. Hell, you said "you" more than 10 times and expect to have your opinion taken seriously? Taking things way too personal champ.

Why in the world would we start taking into consideration skill balance in a 1v3(e.g.)? Of course three players are going to have an advantage over one. Every build has counters, stamina's just happens to be RD. Just because you're a great player doesn't mean you get to counter everything in all situations. I can't counter Chief when he drains my stam from 5WB's in a row even after being cc'd, meteored, prox det, and flame lashed. It is what it is, every build has a weakness. Welcome to balance. (coming from an mDK )

And I just see a lot of bias and opinionated logic from group players, with no actual facts to back up your own points. This type of debate isn't going to have a lot of natural fact citing, you have a group of solo minded players annoyed with how easy it is to spam RD. And you have a group of, well group players defending it with your own opinions. Which is okay, but get off your high horses acting like you guys have some basis. Zheg outright said solo players aren't important, and somehow that means his logic is correct, it isn't.

You're losing all your stam on 5 wrecking blows? I mean even for a magicka DK, you can't manage your resources that well? Maybe the reason you can't counter Chief is because he knows how to outplay your resource management..you're a group player Chaos, and no slight in that direction as VE is accomplished. However Chief knows how to defend himself alone and he plays many classes. You haven't convinced me that losing to Chief has any relevance to noobs spamming RD.

You're terrible at spin doctoring. I said every class has a counter and weaknesses that you take advantage of, RD is stams, and I gave an example of a counter to my mDK. Zheg said 1vX players don't have a right to call for balance for that playstyle. because it's not even a playstyle, it's quite literally just running over ill-informed players that don't know how to counter certain builds. There's a reason you don't see good players getting 1vX'd, everyone knows this holds true.

When it come's to facts, we're not the ones screaming for a nerf. If the only argument you can scratch up is that RD kills you when you're fighting MULTIPLE PEOPLE, you don't have a leg to stand on.

Fun Fact: I solo more than I play in a group.

rfennell_ESO

_Chaos wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

_Chaos wrote: »

@OdinForge I just see a lot of whiney bitching and no rebuttal as to why a skill should be balanced for outnumbered situations. Hell, you said "you" more than 10 times and expect to have your opinion taken seriously? Taking things way too personal champ.

Why in the world would we start taking into consideration skill balance in a 1v3(e.g.)? Of course three players are going to have an advantage over one. Every build has counters, stamina's just happens to be RD. Just because you're a great player doesn't mean you get to counter everything in all situations. I can't counter Chief when he drains my stam from 5WB's in a row even after being cc'd, meteored, prox det, and flame lashed. It is what it is, every build has a weakness. Welcome to balance. (coming from an mDK )

And I just see a lot of bias and opinionated logic from group players, with no actual facts to back up your own points. This type of debate isn't going to have a lot of natural fact citing, you have a group of solo minded players annoyed with how easy it is to spam RD. And you have a group of, well group players defending it with your own opinions. Which is okay, but get off your high horses acting like you guys have some basis. Zheg outright said solo players aren't important, and somehow that means his logic is correct, it isn't.

You're losing all your stam on 5 wrecking blows? I mean even for a magicka DK, you can't manage your resources that well? Maybe the reason you can't counter Chief is because he knows how to outplay your resource management..you're a group player Chaos, and no slight in that direction as VE is accomplished. However Chief knows how to defend himself alone and he plays many classes. You haven't convinced me that losing to Chief has any relevance to noobs spamming RD.

You're terrible at spin doctoring. I said every class has a counter and weaknesses that you take advantage of, RD is stams, and I gave an example of a counter to my mDK. Zheg said 1vX players don't have a right to call for balance for that playstyle. because it's not even a playstyle, it's quite literally just running over ill-informed players that don't know how to counter certain builds. There's a reason you don't see good players getting 1vX'd, everyone knows this holds true.

When it come's to facts, we're not the ones screaming for a nerf. If the only argument you can scratch up is that RD kills you when you're fighting MULTIPLE PEOPLE, you don't have a leg to stand on.

Fun Fact: I solo more than I play in a group.

I'll clue you in, you can argue with him forever and when you make an irrefutable counter to his bizarre arguments... he will just go back and edit what he said.

frozywozy

Zheg wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

That moment when @Zheg complains about talon spam from a stamDK or that other moment when he says that RD is the only counter to any stam build. lol

Talon spam? I pretty clearly implied tactical use when sweeps are happening to ensure they hit air. And one would assume RD is the only counter given how much whining you and other stam DKs do over it. I don't hear you calling for your strengths to be nerfed, just your counters to be nerfed. The rest of us smell the BS from a mile away.

I've yet to see any solo stamDK using talons. It's a good skill, don't get me wrong. But a stamDK just doesn't have the room for it. 7 skills on 10 are for supportive/defensive purposes exclusively.

Why would I call for my strengths to be nerfed ?! do you ?! lol. I have not been complaining about any ability other than cloak spam and RD in a long time. There are multiple counters to stam classes that I think are totally legit. Fear is probably the most brutal one with Fossilize / Power Bash not very far behind. Spears, Streak, Talons, heavy lightning / resto attacks, or the good old combo Prox into Flare into Topling Charge into Sweeps into RD. I don't have to name all the counters. You already known them but are denying them to save your precious.

Rohamad_Ali

The Talon spam is real . Also I can hear the caltrops slapping the ground still when I go to bed like a wearhouse full of angry carpet installers . Followed by the ping // Ding // an *** of shield charge , crit Rush Spartans reverberating their shields till my head spins like a coocoo clock with little birdies whirling everywhere . I awake in a cold sweat after the ground shakes from the final Dragon leap at the end .

cdobratz

#nerflavawhip2016

OdinForge

Zheg you and I both know that no solo player is going to record themselves losing fights. Aside from the attempted Jules or Alcast videos where they show a controlled and static test environment between two players, which isn't the situation we discuss. Those videos aren't representative of real world application, and they missed the point people tried to make early on.

1vX is just another way of saying outnumbered, which solo players are by nature in Cyrodiil. To say that a 1vXer or solo player or whatever you call us aren't important, that's flawed reasoning.

Chaos that doesn't show any build countering lol, magicka DK is pretty bad in any scenario. You played a magicka DK and you lost to Chief by running out of resources, there isn't a leg for you to stand on here either. You either cannot manage resources, or you need to put down magicka DK and try playing something that actually works better.

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

_Chaos wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

_Chaos wrote: »

@OdinForge I just see a lot of whiney bitching and no rebuttal as to why a skill should be balanced for outnumbered situations. Hell, you said "you" more than 10 times and expect to have your opinion taken seriously? Taking things way too personal champ.

Why in the world would we start taking into consideration skill balance in a 1v3(e.g.)? Of course three players are going to have an advantage over one. Every build has counters, stamina's just happens to be RD. Just because you're a great player doesn't mean you get to counter everything in all situations. I can't counter Chief when he drains my stam from 5WB's in a row even after being cc'd, meteored, prox det, and flame lashed. It is what it is, every build has a weakness. Welcome to balance. (coming from an mDK )

And I just see a lot of bias and opinionated logic from group players, with no actual facts to back up your own points. This type of debate isn't going to have a lot of natural fact citing, you have a group of solo minded players annoyed with how easy it is to spam RD. And you have a group of, well group players defending it with your own opinions. Which is okay, but get off your high horses acting like you guys have some basis. Zheg outright said solo players aren't important, and somehow that means his logic is correct, it isn't.

You're losing all your stam on 5 wrecking blows? I mean even for a magicka DK, you can't manage your resources that well? Maybe the reason you can't counter Chief is because he knows how to outplay your resource management..you're a group player Chaos, and no slight in that direction as VE is accomplished. However Chief knows how to defend himself alone and he plays many classes. You haven't convinced me that losing to Chief has any relevance to noobs spamming RD.

You're terrible at spin doctoring. I said every class has a counter and weaknesses that you take advantage of, RD is stams, and I gave an example of a counter to my mDK. Zheg said 1vX players don't have a right to call for balance for that playstyle. because it's not even a playstyle, it's quite literally just running over ill-informed players that don't know how to counter certain builds. There's a reason you don't see good players getting 1vX'd, everyone knows this holds true.

When it come's to facts, we're not the ones screaming for a nerf. If the only argument you can scratch up is that RD kills you when you're fighting MULTIPLE PEOPLE, you don't have a leg to stand on.

Fun Fact: I solo more than I play in a group.

I'll clue you in, you can argue with him forever and when you make an irrefutable counter to his bizarre arguments... he will just go back and edit what he said.

How are those l33t macros and shuffle stacking holding up for you?

Minno

OdinForge wrote: »

Zheg you and I both know that no solo player is going to record themselves losing fights. Aside from the attempted Jules or Alcast videos where they show a controlled and static test environment between two players, which isn't the situation we discuss. Those videos aren't representative of real world application, and they missed the point people tried to make early on.

1vX is just another way of saying outnumbered, which solo players are by nature in Cyrodiil. To say that a 1vXer or solo player or whatever you call us aren't important, that's flawed reasoning.

Chaos that doesn't show any build countering lol, magicka DK is pretty bad in any scenario. You played a magicka DK and you lost to Chief by running out of resources, there isn't a leg for you to stand on here either. You either cannot manage resources, or you need to put down magicka DK and try playing something that actually works better.

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

_Chaos wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

_Chaos wrote: »

@OdinForge I just see a lot of whiney bitching and no rebuttal as to why a skill should be balanced for outnumbered situations. Hell, you said "you" more than 10 times and expect to have your opinion taken seriously? Taking things way too personal champ.

Why in the world would we start taking into consideration skill balance in a 1v3(e.g.)? Of course three players are going to have an advantage over one. Every build has counters, stamina's just happens to be RD. Just because you're a great player doesn't mean you get to counter everything in all situations. I can't counter Chief when he drains my stam from 5WB's in a row even after being cc'd, meteored, prox det, and flame lashed. It is what it is, every build has a weakness. Welcome to balance. (coming from an mDK )

And I just see a lot of bias and opinionated logic from group players, with no actual facts to back up your own points. This type of debate isn't going to have a lot of natural fact citing, you have a group of solo minded players annoyed with how easy it is to spam RD. And you have a group of, well group players defending it with your own opinions. Which is okay, but get off your high horses acting like you guys have some basis. Zheg outright said solo players aren't important, and somehow that means his logic is correct, it isn't.

You're losing all your stam on 5 wrecking blows? I mean even for a magicka DK, you can't manage your resources that well? Maybe the reason you can't counter Chief is because he knows how to outplay your resource management..you're a group player Chaos, and no slight in that direction as VE is accomplished. However Chief knows how to defend himself alone and he plays many classes. You haven't convinced me that losing to Chief has any relevance to noobs spamming RD.

You're terrible at spin doctoring. I said every class has a counter and weaknesses that you take advantage of, RD is stams, and I gave an example of a counter to my mDK. Zheg said 1vX players don't have a right to call for balance for that playstyle. because it's not even a playstyle, it's quite literally just running over ill-informed players that don't know how to counter certain builds. There's a reason you don't see good players getting 1vX'd, everyone knows this holds true.

When it come's to facts, we're not the ones screaming for a nerf. If the only argument you can scratch up is that RD kills you when you're fighting MULTIPLE PEOPLE, you don't have a leg to stand on.

Fun Fact: I solo more than I play in a group.

I'll clue you in, you can argue with him forever and when you make an irrefutable counter to his bizarre arguments... he will just go back and edit what he said.

How are those l33t macros and shuffle stacking holding up for you?

I guess I'll post my death recaps then?
I think last night I had 3-5 RD on my Templar at the ash milegate, the healing being thrown around completely outhealed the DMG (used shield and block too but was CC'd too much for comfort).

In the end I tried to fight AD in 1vx away from the main DC groups and died to a rough estimate RD tick of 5k after being hit by 10 players. Actually it's possible that wasn't even the killing blow.

Shrugs. I'm more scared of a stam NB solo/group situations than Templar spamming RD.

Zheg

frozywozy wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

That moment when @Zheg complains about talon spam from a stamDK or that other moment when he says that RD is the only counter to any stam build. lol

Talon spam? I pretty clearly implied tactical use when sweeps are happening to ensure they hit air. And one would assume RD is the only counter given how much whining you and other stam DKs do over it. I don't hear you calling for your strengths to be nerfed, just your counters to be nerfed. The rest of us smell the BS from a mile away.

I've yet to see any solo stamDK using talons. It's a good skill, don't get me wrong. But a stamDK just doesn't have the room for it. 7 skills on 10 are for supportive/defensive purposes exclusively.

Why would I call for my strengths to be nerfed ?! do you ?! lol. I have not been complaining about any ability other than cloak spam and RD in a long time. There are multiple counters to stam classes that I think are totally legit. Fear is probably the most brutal one with Fossilize / Power Bash not very far behind. Spears, Streak, Talons, heavy lightning / resto attacks, or the good old combo Prox into Flare into Topling Charge into Sweeps into RD. I don't have to name all the counters. You already known them but are denying them to save your precious.

Do you realize how dumb it sounds to say I'm trying to save my precious when it's a skill I almost never even slot? You come after me in pvp like a moth to a flame, even when im solo or in a small group, how often do you see me Jesus beaming you? Dumb.

Yes, I will resto heavy attack a DK, not because it's such a good counter, but because sometimes it's all I can do. You try killing someone with that while they get to use their skills and not have to worry about reflects buddy. Jesus beam is not the only counter, but it is one of the best, and that's why you're crusading so hard to nerf it.

You don't need talons because you can fossilize, but if you were in a small group facing another, it's an aoe root that does physical dmg and grants minor maim. whether solo or in a group, you have options to root, and root is the counter to sweeps. Wings is the counter to everything else, that was the point. It's laughable that DKs are such a strong counter to magplar, but unabashedly call for nerfs to the one skill magplars can use that will be a threat to them.

I'll say it again and again. You guys claim something is broken and are unable to provide solid video proof. The others are whining because they can't 1vX as well as they used to (a good thing), and are flabbergasted that some people don't want 1v1 and small scale combat balance to be negatively impacted so they can regain their 'precious' they lost with the TG patch.

MichYodias

Thank god i have imolen

vortexman11 wrote: »

#NerfScorchedEarth

More importantly, why does ZOS tell us we lose armour durability when we die in PvP?

Thank god i have impen for next patch.

rfennell_ESO

It's really only OP versus people that rely on dodge to get away and heal up before they start WB spamming you.

In that case, I think it's quite balanced as no one else can do squat to that type of run away with retreating and dodging everything "play style"

nordsavage

A few things to note. For all you know the guy on the horse just took fall damage and had broken gear. Maybe he had a non-pvp CP or low CP to begin with. Maybe his food buff was not up. There is no way that picture tells a full story. Video or its just another blurry lockness monster photo. This is just an attempt to shame and smear the name talented player.

Zyle

KenaPKK wrote: »

A friend linked this to me from Reddit. Apparently the poster was riding by on his horse when Jace bopped him.

Jace wears a full dps PvE spec, as do most beamplars in Cyrodiil these days, so this is about as painful as a radiant will get.

One channel KOing the guy. lmfao Regardless of the target's level or gear or traits, this should not be tolerated.

Just now realizing the victim is in the fetal position

IN all seriousness though, I don't have any problem with teh jeezus beam in 1v1, in fact I rarely see competent templars use it for more than 2 ticks. I do get rekt by multiple beams if I can't get to a nice LOS point but I feel like that is simply being outnumbered. Everyone will get mad at the person who "did the least" to kill them but end up getting a killing blow out of it. Do I think it's EZmode being a beamplar build in a group? Absolutely, but they contribute next to nothing to a serious group by just spamming it, it's a waste of time in most situations.

OdinForge

Minno wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Zheg you and I both know that no solo player is going to record themselves losing fights. Aside from the attempted Jules or Alcast videos where they show a controlled and static test environment between two players, which isn't the situation we discuss. Those videos aren't representative of real world application, and they missed the point people tried to make early on.

1vX is just another way of saying outnumbered, which solo players are by nature in Cyrodiil. To say that a 1vXer or solo player or whatever you call us aren't important, that's flawed reasoning.

Chaos that doesn't show any build countering lol, magicka DK is pretty bad in any scenario. You played a magicka DK and you lost to Chief by running out of resources, there isn't a leg for you to stand on here either. You either cannot manage resources, or you need to put down magicka DK and try playing something that actually works better.

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

_Chaos wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

_Chaos wrote: »

@OdinForge I just see a lot of whiney bitching and no rebuttal as to why a skill should be balanced for outnumbered situations. Hell, you said "you" more than 10 times and expect to have your opinion taken seriously? Taking things way too personal champ.

Why in the world would we start taking into consideration skill balance in a 1v3(e.g.)? Of course three players are going to have an advantage over one. Every build has counters, stamina's just happens to be RD. Just because you're a great player doesn't mean you get to counter everything in all situations. I can't counter Chief when he drains my stam from 5WB's in a row even after being cc'd, meteored, prox det, and flame lashed. It is what it is, every build has a weakness. Welcome to balance. (coming from an mDK )

And I just see a lot of bias and opinionated logic from group players, with no actual facts to back up your own points. This type of debate isn't going to have a lot of natural fact citing, you have a group of solo minded players annoyed with how easy it is to spam RD. And you have a group of, well group players defending it with your own opinions. Which is okay, but get off your high horses acting like you guys have some basis. Zheg outright said solo players aren't important, and somehow that means his logic is correct, it isn't.

You're losing all your stam on 5 wrecking blows? I mean even for a magicka DK, you can't manage your resources that well? Maybe the reason you can't counter Chief is because he knows how to outplay your resource management..you're a group player Chaos, and no slight in that direction as VE is accomplished. However Chief knows how to defend himself alone and he plays many classes. You haven't convinced me that losing to Chief has any relevance to noobs spamming RD.

You're terrible at spin doctoring. I said every class has a counter and weaknesses that you take advantage of, RD is stams, and I gave an example of a counter to my mDK. Zheg said 1vX players don't have a right to call for balance for that playstyle. because it's not even a playstyle, it's quite literally just running over ill-informed players that don't know how to counter certain builds. There's a reason you don't see good players getting 1vX'd, everyone knows this holds true.

When it come's to facts, we're not the ones screaming for a nerf. If the only argument you can scratch up is that RD kills you when you're fighting MULTIPLE PEOPLE, you don't have a leg to stand on.

Fun Fact: I solo more than I play in a group.

I'll clue you in, you can argue with him forever and when you make an irrefutable counter to his bizarre arguments... he will just go back and edit what he said.

How are those l33t macros and shuffle stacking holding up for you?

I guess I'll post my death recaps then?
I think last night I had 3-5 RD on my Templar at the ash milegate, the healing being thrown around completely outhealed the DMG (used shield and block too but was CC'd too much for comfort).

In the end I tried to fight AD in 1vx away from the main DC groups and died to a rough estimate RD tick of 5k after being hit by 10 players. Actually it's possible that wasn't even the killing blow.

Shrugs. I'm more scared of a stam NB solo/group situations than Templar spamming RD.

Zerg surfing isn't playing solo.

Satiar

I completely see how this skill would mess people up in a 1vX situation.

But the whole point is that 1vX isn't something you balance for, it's something you build to achieve. If RD is wrecking you, that just became part of the challenge for being a successful 1vXer.

Sallington

My favorite is how there's all of this whining about RD, but I haven't seen a thread in at least a week regarding bombard spam.

We can all agree that dying is annoying. And dying to an under-powered Templar no less. Boy, that must really hurt the ego.

Maybe ask for a stamina-based cleanse or something, or stamina-based purge morph? Why is the demand always more nerfs instead of more tools?

AfkNinja

Satiar wrote: »

I completely see how this skill would mess people up in a 1vX situation.

But the whole point is that 1vX isn't something you balance for, it's something you build to achieve. If RD is wrecking you, that just became part of the challenge for being a successful 1vXer.

QFT THIS.

rfennell_ESO

Sallington wrote: »

My favorite is how there's all of this whining about RD, but I haven't seen a thread in at least a week regarding bombard spam.

We can all agree that dying is annoying. And dying to an under-powered Templar no less. Boy, that must really hurt the ego.

Maybe ask for a stamina-based cleanse or something, or stamina-based purge morph? Why is the demand always more nerfs instead of more tools?

It would probably be a non-issue if we asked ZOS for a death recap/combat log that is reliable.

Rohamad_Ali

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

My favorite is how there's all of this whining about RD, but I haven't seen a thread in at least a week regarding bombard spam.

We can all agree that dying is annoying. And dying to an under-powered Templar no less. Boy, that must really hurt the ego.

Maybe ask for a stamina-based cleanse or something, or stamina-based purge morph? Why is the demand always more nerfs instead of more tools?

It would probably be a non-issue if we asked ZOS for a death recap/combat log that is reliable.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/264622/asking-for-a-better-death-recap-info-tray#latest