Official Feedback Thread for Sorcerers

Morimizo

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

With the shields all being reduced to 6 or 8 sec, buffing is worthless. I guess that's the point, huh?

Shield stacking bad in PVP.

Ruin it for everyone by creating a situation where if a player only uses two buffs, by the time the player rushes in to the fight, they're both gone.

Brilliantly exasperating fix.

Here I thought ZOS might increase the Sun Shield of the Templar from 6 to 20 to bring it line with other class' shields, but,

I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

Learn to reapply buffs on the fly. Why is it a one and done with you people.

For Talos Sake, are you serious? I know everyone in the world must be a rank amateur compared to YOU, but "buffing on the fly" has been done just fine until now; what YOU expect should be fine is that now we should have to do this 3X as often. Which is arbitrary busywork. I take it you don't buff, and that you are irritated by folks who do in PVP?

I very seriously doubt that anyone in PVE complained about shields lasting too long.

Pallio

If they offered a class/race change in the crown store people would buy them like candy.. even at 10k, sure it would appear to be a nerf and switch scheme, but, it would make ZOS a lot of $$

CP5

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

AfkNinja wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

I always think Stam Sorc is a contradiction in terms as Sorcs run on Magicka. I have never seen such a thing in other MMO's.

HOWEVER

If people want to play like that, that is fine and ZOS should give them more tools than they currently have.

It's cause a melee warrior mage "Sorcerer" exists in Elderscrolls lore. Our lore is unique

all the spells STILL used magicka in the past games, it was a hybrid build, it did not SOLELY rely on stamina, only the weapon attacks did, and that is why im not to keen on the class skills having any stamina morphs.


but the stamina thing is a much much much smaller issue to the ward duration changes, so this is the only time ill remark on this in this thread

And all the past games weren't mmo's. What was zos supposed to do, not have skills that cost stamina? And with how they balanced the game they needed to have some skills cost stamina so that weapon damage based builds could use abilities. Unless you expect weapon based characters to rely on heavy and light attacks for combat...

Rylana

Morimizo wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

With the shields all being reduced to 6 or 8 sec, buffing is worthless. I guess that's the point, huh?

Shield stacking bad in PVP.

Ruin it for everyone by creating a situation where if a player only uses two buffs, by the time the player rushes in to the fight, they're both gone.

Brilliantly exasperating fix.

Here I thought ZOS might increase the Sun Shield of the Templar from 6 to 20 to bring it line with other class' shields, but,

I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

Learn to reapply buffs on the fly. Why is it a one and done with you people.

For Talos Sake, are you serious? I know everyone in the world must be a rank amateur compared to YOU, but "buffing on the fly" has been done just fine until now; what YOU expect should be fine is that now we should have to do this 3X as often. Which is arbitrary busywork. I take it you don't buff, and that you are irritated by folks who do in PVP?

I very seriously doubt that anyone in PVE complained about shields lasting too long.

Constant reapplication of buffs shields and HoTs is a natural progression to pro status in PvP. If its still difficult for you, and youre not willing to do it, there is the easy mode over there, its called PvE

ArvenAldmeri

Ridicolous change to not giving abilities magicka morphs (fighters guild, undaunted) and nerfing hardned ward. 6 seconds is far too much. DONE.

Morimizo

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

With the shields all being reduced to 6 or 8 sec, buffing is worthless. I guess that's the point, huh?

Shield stacking bad in PVP.

Ruin it for everyone by creating a situation where if a player only uses two buffs, by the time the player rushes in to the fight, they're both gone.

Brilliantly exasperating fix.

Here I thought ZOS might increase the Sun Shield of the Templar from 6 to 20 to bring it line with other class' shields, but,

I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

Learn to reapply buffs on the fly. Why is it a one and done with you people.

For Talos Sake, are you serious? I know everyone in the world must be a rank amateur compared to YOU, but "buffing on the fly" has been done just fine until now; what YOU expect should be fine is that now we should have to do this 3X as often. Which is arbitrary busywork. I take it you don't buff, and that you are irritated by folks who do in PVP?

I very seriously doubt that anyone in PVE complained about shields lasting too long.

Constant reapplication of buffs shields and HoTs is a natural progression to pro status in PvP. If its still difficult for you, and youre not willing to do it, there is the easy mode over there, its called PvE

Actually that's my point; why should it be a change to PVE as well? The rotation you speak of is perfectly normal (certainly more laidback in PVE), and not a matter of difficulty. So everyone in the game, including your apparently despised PVE counterparts, need to embrace"pro status." Interesting.

deximasb14_ESO

JD2013 wrote: »

I always think Stam Sorc is a contradiction in terms as Sorcs run on Magicka. I have never seen such a thing in other MMO's.

HOWEVER

If people want to play like that, that is fine and ZOS should give them more tools than they currently have.

Wow has the shaman enhancement spec. That is my draw to this class

Rylana

Morimizo wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

With the shields all being reduced to 6 or 8 sec, buffing is worthless. I guess that's the point, huh?

Shield stacking bad in PVP.

Ruin it for everyone by creating a situation where if a player only uses two buffs, by the time the player rushes in to the fight, they're both gone.

Brilliantly exasperating fix.

Here I thought ZOS might increase the Sun Shield of the Templar from 6 to 20 to bring it line with other class' shields, but,

I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

Learn to reapply buffs on the fly. Why is it a one and done with you people.

For Talos Sake, are you serious? I know everyone in the world must be a rank amateur compared to YOU, but "buffing on the fly" has been done just fine until now; what YOU expect should be fine is that now we should have to do this 3X as often. Which is arbitrary busywork. I take it you don't buff, and that you are irritated by folks who do in PVP?

I very seriously doubt that anyone in PVE complained about shields lasting too long.

Constant reapplication of buffs shields and HoTs is a natural progression to pro status in PvP. If its still difficult for you, and youre not willing to do it, there is the easy mode over there, its called PvE

Actually that's my point; why should it be a change to PVE as well? The rotation you speak of is perfectly normal (certainly more laidback in PVE), and not a matter of difficulty. So everyone in the game, including your apparently despised PVE counterparts, need to embrace"pro status." Interesting.

Because quite honestly if you cant pay attention to your shields and just wanna hardcast spam frags and overload without worrying at all about defense, its time you learned your class and started upping your game.

Hell in PvE a sorc normally doesnt even need shields.

NBrookus

So... magicka sorcs still have no functioning heal and our escape is still nerfed into uselessness. Now we also not only get our primary defense massively nerfed (with no reduction in cost), but also every other class and type out there gets the matching equivalent of our formerly class defining ability.

Who on earth thought this was a reasonable exchange? If you nerf Ward this bad you have to give us something back to work with. Get rid of the escalating streak cost, maybe.

vyndral13preub18_ESO

NBrookus wrote: »

So... magicka sorcs still have no functioning heal and our escape is still nerfed into uselessness. Now we also not only get our primary defense massively nerfed (with no reduction in cost), but also every other class and type out there gets the matching equivalent of our formerly class defining ability.

Who on earth thought this was a reasonable exchange? If you nerf Ward this bad you have to give us something back to work with. Get rid of the escalating streak cost, maybe.

Well if it makes you feel any better, they gave sorcs the Templar class defining ability and then nerfed the Templar version. Twice, with no reduction in cost. So it isnt just sorcs.

I guess they did give Templars lazer beams of death. And the heal is on your pet... So... Im sorry?

Morimizo

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

With the shields all being reduced to 6 or 8 sec, buffing is worthless. I guess that's the point, huh?

Shield stacking bad in PVP.

Ruin it for everyone by creating a situation where if a player only uses two buffs, by the time the player rushes in to the fight, they're both gone.

Brilliantly exasperating fix.

Here I thought ZOS might increase the Sun Shield of the Templar from 6 to 20 to bring it line with other class' shields, but,

I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

Learn to reapply buffs on the fly. Why is it a one and done with you people.

For Talos Sake, are you serious? I know everyone in the world must be a rank amateur compared to YOU, but "buffing on the fly" has been done just fine until now; what YOU expect should be fine is that now we should have to do this 3X as often. Which is arbitrary busywork. I take it you don't buff, and that you are irritated by folks who do in PVP?

I very seriously doubt that anyone in PVE complained about shields lasting too long.

Constant reapplication of buffs shields and HoTs is a natural progression to pro status in PvP. If its still difficult for you, and youre not willing to do it, there is the easy mode over there, its called PvE

Actually that's my point; why should it be a change to PVE as well? The rotation you speak of is perfectly normal (certainly more laidback in PVE), and not a matter of difficulty. So everyone in the game, including your apparently despised PVE counterparts, need to embrace"pro status." Interesting.

Because quite honestly if you cant pay attention to your shields and just wanna hardcast spam frags and overload without worrying at all about defense, its time you learned your class and started upping your game.

Hell in PvE a sorc normally doesnt even need shields.

You assume a lot here. I use neither of these, and only buff during boss fights in Public/Group/Trial Dungeons, or WB encounters (PVE-wise). My game is "UP" just fine, thanks for your sincere concern.

Valrien

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

With the shields all being reduced to 6 or 8 sec, buffing is worthless. I guess that's the point, huh?

Shield stacking bad in PVP.

Ruin it for everyone by creating a situation where if a player only uses two buffs, by the time the player rushes in to the fight, they're both gone.

Brilliantly exasperating fix.

Here I thought ZOS might increase the Sun Shield of the Templar from 6 to 20 to bring it line with other class' shields, but,

I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

Learn to reapply buffs on the fly. Why is it a one and done with you people.

For Talos Sake, are you serious? I know everyone in the world must be a rank amateur compared to YOU, but "buffing on the fly" has been done just fine until now; what YOU expect should be fine is that now we should have to do this 3X as often. Which is arbitrary busywork. I take it you don't buff, and that you are irritated by folks who do in PVP?

I very seriously doubt that anyone in PVE complained about shields lasting too long.

Constant reapplication of buffs shields and HoTs is a natural progression to pro status in PvP. If its still difficult for you, and youre not willing to do it, there is the easy mode over there, its called PvE

I don't see a vMoL achievement. Are you just too pro for the easy mode that is vMoL?

covenant_merchant

Do you even realize that given the constant lag there is in PVP, even at 4am sometimes, you simply cannot swap bars fast enough to reapply shields "on the fly" ? And even without the lag, by the time you rush in to do your burst, your shields will be expired. This is a stupid nerf, really. Speaking of burst, WHAT THE HELL IS UP WITH THE DAWNBREAKER CHANGE?

WHY.. JUST WHY? Seriously, didn't anyone notice that most sorcs use it in PVP since it's by far the cheapest and most effective ulti? Who on earth thought "hm, it would be a good idea to make both morphs deal physical damage. Sorcs will have negate and pets, and isn't it just great?"

If you're unwilling to change the duration of shields to a more reasonable one, at least please reconsider the dawnbreaker changes. It just deprives quite a lot of sorcs in PVP of any good burst or damage for that matter.

Strider_Roshin

Love the changes! Thundering Presence + Steel Tornado is going to be phenomenal! And thank you for the Flurry Changes. It is now going to be a viable single target attack with Dawnbreaker of Smiting as an awesome Ultimate. Job well done ZOS =]

NativeJoe

Just throwing it out there. We're screwed lol... been playing pts...and yeah. hope u got ur cookie cutter build...cuz that is all we're going to be doing from now on.

RoxyPhoenix

NBrookus wrote: »

So... magicka sorcs still have no functioning heal and our escape is still nerfed into uselessness. Now we also not only get our primary defense massively nerfed (with no reduction in cost), but also every other class and type out there gets the matching equivalent of our formerly class defining ability.

This. Magplar, Magblade and MagDK will have their own hardened wards and all other stam users will run bone shield, welcome to Elders Shield Online.

Punn

1st. The shield duration is to low, 10-12 sec would be a better time frame.
2nd. The changes to dawnbreaker is a worse nerf to sorcs than the shield time.

You should make dawnbreaker have one magicka morph, and one stamina one.
this is also bad for magicka templars as-well. Plus dawnbreaker is far easier skill to
than meteor. you should really reconsider the changes you have made to this skill.

Bfish22090

The sorcerer is the most over-nerfed and useless class in pvp when DB comes around
The nerfs keep coming!
Sorcs have nothing left after the shield nerf.

@XEVENEX we can't let this change go live

Dixa

Anyone tested pet performance in pve?

Lucky28

Dixa wrote: »

Anyone tested pet performance in pve?

Having to apply ward on them every 6 seconds. they're not worth a damn. take them off your bar they are more of a hindrance then a benefit.

cschwingeb14_ESO

The nerf to ward is pretty bad. It definitely removes the ability to back bar ward without a ton of work.

Also, I'll need to check values, but with the change to annulment, every one can just have their own Hardened ward when using Dampen magic. I know for a fact that the value of my Ward is 27k and magicka harness is 18k. Wearing 5-7 light armor bonus should bring that up to a 23-25k Dampen.

Ward for everyone? Right, so what is the point of sorcs main defense being Ward when you can have Dampen+invisibility. Dampen+reflect. Or Dampen+channeled focus/purify

Templars and NB both have ready access to Minor protection, which just makes Dampen that much better (yes, it stacks with shield)

THE SOLUTION: Use Ward to give sorcs their mobility back. Keep the duration short, but make it remove snares/roots (not immunity)

Now we just need to figure out a way to fix stam sorcs. I'll work on that in another post

Dixa

all these pvp nerfs and suggestions but nothing about pve.

this game does have a second part to it, y'know.

Mythk

Quite skeptical about this change to the shields... Sure now we have harness magicka protecting us from physical as well, but this doesn't really solve any of the problems people have with sorc, if anything it adds even more issues.

One of the biggest reasons people always hated on sorcerers was because with spamming shields, it was nearly impossible to kill them. Now, you can just spam harness and hardened and soak up all of the damage being thrown your way if you keep spamming them. It does nothing but makes sorcerers more annoying because now they can turtle up forever, since you can now spam harness and hardened without needing to worry about getting hit by a physical attack when you re cast harness.

On the other hand, this change really hurts sorcerers offensively when dealing with small amounts of numbers (say maybe outnumbered 3 to 1), because now you re cast your shields and CC someone. You are doing damage to them while they can't attack back, but your shields will disappear before they ever do any damage to you. Your applied defense is completely useless because it has expired by the time your enemy is finally attacking back at you.

It is going to make shielding a more tedious task rather than really fixing shield stacking. Sure, all the pro players will still do fine, they will just be exponentially more annoying as you see them cast their shields 3x as often and you get frustrated trying to attack them because you realize they are doing less damage to you than before (because they spend so much more time shield stacking), yet it is harder to kill them because harness now absorbs all damage.


If you really want to fix shields (and quite honestly nearly everything else that is broken), just bring back softcaps. Is it that complex of a concept to grasp?

Lucky28

Dixa wrote: »

all these pvp nerfs and suggestions but nothing about pve.

this game does have a second part to it, y'know.

with these changes. sorcs are worse off in PvE then they are in PvP. if you're in to PvE and you're playing a sorc, re-roll if these changes go live.

susmitds

Well @Valrien @MrBM and the rest, I warned you this would happen.

exiledtyrant

I like hurricane a lot. Its flashy and does fairly good damage for a duration ability. It works really well in proc and multi hit builds. I think I will be seeing how well it scales with penetration as surge still can't be used with dots.

Huggalump

Templar

Aedric Spear

Burning Light: This passive ability now deals Physical Damage or Magic Damage, based on whether your Weapon Damage or Spell Damage is higher respectively.

waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaait wait wait wait wait

So you CAN do this, but then you only do it for one single ability? Why the hell would you not do this for multiple abilities? Or at the very least, for at least one direct damage morph for every class? Holy hell ZoS, this is very simple stuff.

Lokey0024

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

With the shields all being reduced to 6 or 8 sec, buffing is worthless. I guess that's the point, huh?

Shield stacking bad in PVP.

Ruin it for everyone by creating a situation where if a player only uses two buffs, by the time the player rushes in to the fight, they're both gone.

Brilliantly exasperating fix.

Here I thought ZOS might increase the Sun Shield of the Templar from 6 to 20 to bring it line with other class' shields, but,

I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

Learn to reapply buffs on the fly. Why is it a one and done with you people.

For Talos Sake, are you serious? I know everyone in the world must be a rank amateur compared to YOU, but "buffing on the fly" has been done just fine until now; what YOU expect should be fine is that now we should have to do this 3X as often. Which is arbitrary busywork. I take it you don't buff, and that you are irritated by folks who do in PVP?

I very seriously doubt that anyone in PVE complained about shields lasting too long.

Constant reapplication of buffs shields and HoTs is a natural progression to pro status in PvP. If its still difficult for you, and youre not willing to do it, there is the easy mode over there, its called PvE

This makes shield stacking unwieldy, as im sure was the intention, and reactively applying shields to midigate damage. It seems that zos is doing a good job balancing this go around. There isn't going to be much facerolling to victory.

Mojomonkeyman

Some brilliant changes in there, ZOS. Did you hire someone new?

Reducing duration of wards is, finally, making its use a bit more skillful. It was obscenely easy until now to just be untouchable in situations were other setups wouldve died without any doubt. Now it almost is a timed window, not a perma second hp bar.

DB Stam morph is awesome, wrecking blow nerf is awesome! Negate changes sound awesome!

I love it, now lets wait how it plays out.

DisgracefulMind

If they truly wanted to fix shield stacking why not use the Major and Minor buffs to do so.

No, reduce timer on shields, make harness absorb physical damage, and give stamina builds a shield xDDD

Still, the good sorcs will be fine, but these are people who know the class in and out, but for players who are not extremely serious, I worry for them. Ah well, we'll see what it brings (: