Official Feedback Thread for Enchanting

myrrrorb14_ESO

SantaOrc wrote: »

Since this thread technically consists of a hand full of people confirming their dislikes repetitively without contributing much new after page 1, i humbly want to ask everyone to calm down a bit and give @ZOS_GinaBruno a chance to explain the reasons behind this change before this thread gets way to messy.

Btw there are people who don't hate the change, just to be less onesided in here.

I think I can count on one hand the times ZOS has explained a change, especially in a feedback thread.


The only reason I can think of for the change in potency nodes ares for a more efficient coding.

I think the traits are well overdo for a revamp and it looks interesting. Unfortunately it will take me forever to figure out what to do with it all. The training change for instance could be a lot of fun for a new alt.

Daraugh

Shadowfx1970 wrote: »

Tried to make some enchants last night spent about an hour looking for potency runes and decided to give up and break down some runes I wasn't using, didn't occur to me that they would be for sale now.

I don't think anyone should be forced to buy mats to craft as part of crafting is the ability to gather materials, ok it could be a choice for someone who needs a rune fast, but it should not be the only option.

I think it's actually made the process slower as you now have to go to the merchant first before crafting unless you have a stack of them already on you and I for one don't want to spend 2500 gold on the potency runes for cp160 and then if I am short on Kuta aspect runes have to spend another 6-8k on those too from guild merchants.

So did the potency runes still drop out of glyphs at least? I haven't gotten back on the pts yet to check.

Shadowfx1970

Daraugh wrote: »

Shadowfx1970 wrote: »

Tried to make some enchants last night spent about an hour looking for potency runes and decided to give up and break down some runes I wasn't using, didn't occur to me that they would be for sale now.

I don't think anyone should be forced to buy mats to craft as part of crafting is the ability to gather materials, ok it could be a choice for someone who needs a rune fast, but it should not be the only option.

I think it's actually made the process slower as you now have to go to the merchant first before crafting unless you have a stack of them already on you and I for one don't want to spend 2500 gold on the potency runes for cp160 and then if I am short on Kuta aspect runes have to spend another 6-8k on those too from guild merchants.

So did the potency runes still drop out of glyphs at least? I haven't gotten back on the pts yet to check.

Yeah but you only get one or two of each after breaking down about 20 enchants

SickDuck

I don't know if I'm missing a point here. Potency runes will still exist right? Just not the blue nodes?

So hirelings will still bring more than enough? Since last DLC v16 runes are dropping like flies and will be the only thing needed on any level onwards? We still get potency runes by deconstruction right?

Can't remember when was the last time I needed to harvest a rune. I only do Aspect ones and even those not really worth the effort. There are so many ways to get them apart from harvesting. Or have I missed something?

Daraugh

Shadowfx1970 wrote: »

Daraugh wrote: »

Shadowfx1970 wrote: »

Tried to make some enchants last night spent about an hour looking for potency runes and decided to give up and break down some runes I wasn't using, didn't occur to me that they would be for sale now.

I don't think anyone should be forced to buy mats to craft as part of crafting is the ability to gather materials, ok it could be a choice for someone who needs a rune fast, but it should not be the only option.

I think it's actually made the process slower as you now have to go to the merchant first before crafting unless you have a stack of them already on you and I for one don't want to spend 2500 gold on the potency runes for cp160 and then if I am short on Kuta aspect runes have to spend another 6-8k on those too from guild merchants.

So did the potency runes still drop out of glyphs at least? I haven't gotten back on the pts yet to check.

Yeah but you only get one or two of each after breaking down about 20 enchants

Ugh. Thanks for the reply! Not nearly enough to do writs and gear your own characters, let alone sell any for a reasonable price.

newtinmpls

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for Enchanting. We’ve removed the Potency Runestones from nodes, and put them on the Enchanting vendors instead. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Is it easy to tell where to get these now?
• Does it feel easier to start from scratch to make a rune?
• How does it feel to put lower-level enchants on higher-level gear?
• Do you have any other general feedback?

To address the second question - NO - it feels harder.

SickDuck

Daraugh wrote: »

Shadowfx1970 wrote: »

Daraugh wrote: »

Shadowfx1970 wrote: »

Tried to make some enchants last night spent about an hour looking for potency runes and decided to give up and break down some runes I wasn't using, didn't occur to me that they would be for sale now.

I don't think anyone should be forced to buy mats to craft as part of crafting is the ability to gather materials, ok it could be a choice for someone who needs a rune fast, but it should not be the only option.

I think it's actually made the process slower as you now have to go to the merchant first before crafting unless you have a stack of them already on you and I for one don't want to spend 2500 gold on the potency runes for cp160 and then if I am short on Kuta aspect runes have to spend another 6-8k on those too from guild merchants.

So did the potency runes still drop out of glyphs at least? I haven't gotten back on the pts yet to check.

Yeah but you only get one or two of each after breaking down about 20 enchants

Ugh. Thanks for the reply! Not nearly enough to do writs and gear your own characters, let alone sell any for a reasonable price.

Writs are still v15 runes right? Aren't those like 100 gold... in case you don't get swarmed by them from hireling mails.

NewBlacksmurf

SantaOrc wrote: »

Since this thread technically consists of a hand full of people confirming their dislikes repetitively without contributing much new after page 1, i humbly want to ask everyone to calm down a bit and give @ZOS_GinaBruno a chance to explain the reasons behind this change before this thread gets way to messy.

Btw there are people who don't hate the change, just to be less onesided in here.

respectfully whatever the reasons are...the feedback is don't do this.

The reason doesn't change the outcome. The outcry and feedback is specific to the outcome and not any reasoning. Knowing why a change was made that literally makes a bad situation worse is of no value other than conversation.

myrrrorb14_ESO

SickDuck wrote: »

I don't know if I'm missing a point here. Potency runes will still exist right? Just not the blue nodes?

So hirelings will still bring more than enough? Since last DLC v16 runes are dropping like flies and will be the only thing needed on any level onwards? We still get potency runes by deconstruction right?

Can't remember when was the last time I needed to harvest a rune. I only do Aspect ones and even those not really worth the effort. There are so many ways to get them apart from harvesting. Or have I missed something?

Don't how you define more than enough, but here's a couple scenarios.

You are the guild crafter. Your hirelings are not going to bring you enough runes for your guild. Your guild members not being crafters will not have hirelings at all. Since they are no longer harvestable, you guild members will not puck them up as they adventure and deposit them in the guild bank. You will not have enough potency runes.

You are leveling a new character. Your crafter will not get low level runes to put on your new character. You can no longer pick up potency runes as you adventure. You will not have enough potency runes.


Unless potency runes now drop in containers (like trait stones) this is not a very good change. I guess decon still works, but by the time you find enough glyphs to actually get enough runes you will probably out level it.

Nestor

Saltypretzels wrote: »

I just don't understand (or support) this change. I think we all deserve an explanation. Its not a game breaker or anything, but why break something that doesn't need to be fixed?

Fixed that for you.....

Nestor

SickDuck wrote: »

Writs are still v15 runes right? Aren't those like 100 gold... in case you don't get swarmed by them from hireling mails.

Try 2500 It appears that VR15 Potencies are 111 Gold

Haulinash

i'd love to see a way to upgrade exess aspects.. or maybe some sort of exchange... as a hoar... collector in quantity of most things, maybe a way to exchange say 200 ta for 25 jejota... after a while, its just not feasable to use ta for anything... even folks leveling their crafter doesn't want to have to make that many glyphs.

loving the dlc-

Daraugh

Nestor wrote: »

SickDuck wrote: »

Writs are still v15 runes right? Aren't those like 100 gold... in case you don't get swarmed by them from hireling mails.

Try 2500

Yikes! 2500
I'm not getting swarmed by my hireling in any case. Besides, I have characters of all levels. Some above 50 and some below that will need different levels of runes that my hireling won't supply to my vr16 main.

SantaOrc

Ahnastashia wrote: »

... needing to spend 25k just to make their own runes for their gear?

Everyone needs those enchants, not just the enchanter himself. So if you feel like you have to compensate your investements, maybe selling glyphs for more than the material costs could be an option. Sounds like a little more interessting aspect of trading than the calculation of a item just by its rarity (offer/demand). Maybe that counts for the possibly more expensive way to level up enchanting now, too.

@Epona222: What i did was asking very politely not to repeat the same matter over and over again. Quoting whole posts just to write "i agree so much omg" instead of just hitting the "agree" button as well as expressing the same opinion over and over again just with other words (or going off-topic) does only lead to a very long thread ZOS has to work through without any benefit to the topic. I guess we are on the same side when we are looking for an answer to our doubts. Exept we are just here to express our feelings, then i apologise for interfering.

Nestor wrote: »

Something else I just thought of, it will now cost me 2500 gold to do a Writ in Wrothgar for Enchanting. And I get 600 gold back.

Up to now the quest always asked me for vr15 glyphes, which should have potency costs of 111g, am i wrong?

MissBizz wrote: »

Even Jehade and Rejera (both level 10) are available for 111 gold, [...]

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

The reason doesn't change the outcome. The outcry and feedback is specific to the outcome and not any reasoning.

That is the reason why Warhammer Online died. They listened to the loudest of the 1% of which was using the forums. The progression of ESO shows us that Zenimax is smarter than that.

Sorry for inconsistence timeline of replies, took a while.

Nestor

SantaOrc wrote: »

Up to now the quest always asked me for vr15 glyphes, which should have potency costs of 111g, am i wrong?

Low Level Potencies are around 100, they go up, and by the time you are at VR16 they cost around 2500 gold. I have not loaded the PTS yet so don't know exact prices.

EDIT Someone reported later in this thread that they potencies are all 111 gold, up to Rejera/Itade

Epona222

This change isn't just going to affect the 1% @SantaOrc - in fact the people it is going to hit hardest is people new to the game who are trying to level enchanting.

I'm not vocal on this issue because I view myself as some sort of elite enchanter trying to corner the market, I've never sold a glyph in my life, only ever done enchanting for myself - and know how hard it can be leveling up. Without being able to harvest *all* runes in the wild, that leveling will be so much more difficult for newcomers to the game.

Nestor

Epona222 wrote: »

Without being able to harvest *all* runes in the wild, that leveling will be so much more difficult for newcomers to the game.

Certainly more expensive. While buying the Potencies in the stores to use to level will be easier, farming the gold to buy them is an added complexity that does not need to be there.

MissBizz

SantaOrc wrote: »

Ahnastashia wrote: »

... needing to spend 25k just to make their own runes for their gear?

Everyone needs those enchants, not just the enchanter himself. So if you feel like you have to compensate your investements, maybe selling glyphs for more than the material costs could be an option. Sounds like a little more interessting aspect of trading than the calculation of a item just by its rarity (offer/demand). Maybe that counts for the possibly more expensive way to level up enchanting now, too.

@Epona222: What i did was asking very politely not to repeat the same matter over and over again. Quoting whole posts just to write "i agree so much omg" instead of just hitting the "agree" button as well as expressing the same opinion over and over again just with other words (or going off-topic) does only lead to a very long thread ZOS has to work through without any benefit to the topic. I guess we are on the same side when we are looking for an answer to our doubts. Exept we are just here to express our feelings, then i apologise for interfering.

Nestor wrote: »

Something else I just thought of, it will now cost me 2500 gold to do a Writ in Wrothgar for Enchanting. And I get 600 gold back.

Up to now the quest always asked me for vr15 glyphes, which should have potency costs of 111g, am i wrong?

MissBizz wrote: »

Even Jehade and Rejera (both level 10) are available for 111 gold, [...]

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

The reason doesn't change the outcome. The outcry and feedback is specific to the outcome and not any reasoning.

That is the reason why Warhammer Online died. They listened to the loudest of the 1% of which was using the forums. The progression of ESO shows us that Zenimax is smarter than that.

Sorry for inconsistence timeline of replies, took a while.

Alright. May I ask why you believe making potency runes available in the world AND for sale from a vendor is not a good idea?

As well, I still don't understand why you do enjoy the change of no longer being able to harvest potency runes.

Epona222

Nestor wrote: »

Epona222 wrote: »

Without being able to harvest *all* runes in the wild, that leveling will be so much more difficult for newcomers to the game.

Certainly more expensive. While buying the Potencies in the stores to use to level will be easier, farming the gold to buy them is an added complexity that does not need to be there.

Aye and as I've said many times, I don't have a problem with them being made available through NPC vendors (although the prices will not be good), it's the removal of them as harvestable items as well that I strongly object to.

SantaOrc

Mind that there will be more runes in the game than before, since a runestone now gives at least two runes.
What did you need to make a glph when you leveled up?
At least one Aspect, one Essence and one Potency runestone.
What do you need now? One runestone and a little gold.

At the end of the day you may have spend the time you saved for farming those extra runes to earn a little gold and everything works out fine.

Another issue, less important:
You end up with lets say 10 aspect and 10 essense runes from 10 runestones, which make 10 glyphes. Sounds better than 3 aspect and 17 essence in the first place (which could have happened by chance, dunno the average ratio of aspect and essence runestones though).
But the chances to get an essence rune back when deconstructing are higher than getting an aspect rune back, right?

mateoz

This is a Feedback Thread and while everyone are on the same side, ZOS is probably reading all of it with popcorn and thinking : they don't know but we ain't going to change it, like we didn't reverted stam on block nor templar BoL why on earth would change it? its working than be it...

failkiwib16_ESO

Sorry, I can't access pts in any way, since ...got some issues with my bank card, and need a new computer to actually play, I currently play very limited on my friend's comp.

• Are v15 and v16 potencies still available at the tel var merchant?
• If yes: are there any changes in prices for the potencies?

Despite the pvp element, IC DLC is still my favorite location to spend some time, when I am alone and not helping out guildies.

hiyde

Some random thoughts:

Agree there is some redundancy in what is being said in this post, but I think every person with an opinion should weigh in so that ZoS gets an idea of how many people have opinions on this matter.

Also agree with the overwhelming majority here that this is a bad change. I enjoy harvesting the different types of rune nodes. Dislike the idea of purchasing them. Not to mention slippery slope.

It would be extremely helpful if the reasoning for the change was revealed. Perhaps there's a pressing reason that we aren't aware of and that could change some of our views, or give us an opportunity to propose alternatives?

ZoS is finding ways to deal with zone/level issues with the other craft mats, why not apply same to enchanting nodes??

And finally, I love the idea of a bartering system for aspect runes.

(x)Ta for 1 Jejota,
(x) Jejota for (1) Denata
(x) Denata for (1) Rekuta, etc.

It should be very high barter requirements.
Maybe 100-200 Ta would ultimately get you a Kuta as you barter through the different levels. Low enough barter amount to make it worthwhile to hold onto Ta but not a get-rich-quick process, or something that would destablize the price of Kuta (one of the few things that has reliably held a good value).

-H

Epona222

It would probably be the 1 thing that would be most likely to break my wanting to continue with a sub tbh, if I can no longer farm my own crafting mats.

Daraugh

Ok, so you *can* buy provisioning mats if you want to from a vendor. They exist and if you're not a compulsive crate-checker like me, I could see grabbing one or two ingredients from them on occasion for a writ or when you need food right before a dungeon. Having the mats available both by harvesting and through a vendor has a precedent so we can see it works fine. In fact, the streamlining of provisioning went very nicely compared to this half-hearted pass at enchanting we're seeing now.

Could we see this as a placeholder and request a mat overhaul like provisioning had to streamline mats without losing the flavor of the craft?

Joy_Division

SantaOrc wrote: »

Mind that there will be more runes in the game than before, since a runestone now gives at least two runes.
What did you need to make a glph when you leveled up?
At least one Aspect, one Essence and one Potency runestone.
What do you need now? One runestone and a little gold.

At the end of the day you may have spend the time you saved for farming those extra runes to earn a little gold and everything works out fine.

Another issue, less important:
You end up with lets say 10 aspect and 10 essense runes from 10 runestones, which make 10 glyphes. Sounds better than 3 aspect and 17 essence in the first place (which could have happened by chance, dunno the average ratio of aspect and essence runestones though).
But the chances to get an essence rune back when deconstructing are higher than getting an aspect rune back, right?

bunnytrix

Joy_Division wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

• Is it easy to tell where to get these now? - No. Easy is seeing a blue node and harvesting its contents.
• Does it feel easier to start from scratch to make a rune? - No. Because I have to go through the additional step of buying a Potency Rune.
• How does it feel to put lower-level enchants on higher-level gear? - Like putting regular gasoline in a high octane sports vehicle. Why would I do this? Probably because the max mats that I must buy instead of harvest are ridiculously expensive.
• Do you have any other general feedback? Yes. 1) I want to harvest my own potency Runes. 2) You should make it so lower level aspect runes are worth picking up from the nodes. Allowing master enchanters to combines many weaker aspect stones into a stronger one is an obvious possibility you ought to explore. 3) Forcing crafters to buy (expensive) mats is just a bad idea.
  

Fully agree with all of @Joy_Division 's answers.
Removing potency runes from the world is a terrible idea and a massive blow to the fun of enchanting. Harvesting your own runes (or any other crafting materials) is a large part of what makes it a fun activity. Having to visit a vendor and spend gold, (or large amounts of gold if you are max level) every time you want to make glyphs just takes all of the fun out of it for many of us.
I too have a bad feeling about this decision and would like to know why, but the fact that you can now enchant items with lower level runes is obviously tied to the potency rune removal and the price of them from vendors.
If this goes live then seeing potency runes in the crown store for real cash would not surprise me at all.

RedRoomGaming

Before I start please excuse the grammar.

I think buying the potency runes is a complete kick in the teeth to the people that have farmed these but on the other hand it's a good idea because the drop rate for the v15-16 runes is a disgrace. Now when you need one all you Have to do is buy one that is great an all especially for writs.

The essence and aspect nodes are a good thing because I am getting fed up with having stacks and stacks of TA in my bank because once again the drop rate is a disgrace. I do how ever love this idea purely because it's not going to be a fight for rune stones I'm busy areas of you see them etc and someone gets there first you can just have 2 in one.


A question though. How is this going to work with the enchanting writs? I mean I'm wrothgar you have 2 essence, 2 aspect, and 2 potency?
Craglorn you have 2 essence, 2 potency, and roughly 4-6 aspect? Does this mean that the runes will be all aspect and essence with more aspect? Also the people who have the points into the gathering passive will we get 8 runes with the 10% chance or 4 aspect and 2 essence and the other way around?

myrrrorb14_ESO

SantaOrc wrote: »

Mind that there will be more runes in the game than before, since a runestone now gives at least two runes.
What did you need to make a glph when you leveled up?
At least one Aspect, one Essence and one Potency runestone.
What do you need now? One runestone and a little gold.

At the end of the day you may have spend the time you saved for farming those extra runes to earn a little gold and everything works out fine.

Another issue, less important:
You end up with lets say 10 aspect and 10 essense runes from 10 runestones, which make 10 glyphes. Sounds better than 3 aspect and 17 essence in the first place (which could have happened by chance, dunno the average ratio of aspect and essence runestones though).
But the chances to get an essence rune back when deconstructing are higher than getting an aspect rune back, right?

I don't think you get it.

Getting an essence and an aspect hardly matters at all. Aspect runes from nodes are mostly terrible. I use them to level up enchanting for guildmates. So in essence, all you are increasing is the number of Essence (see what I did there) in the world.

Being able to go out and harvest just what you need was more convenient. If I need a yellow or blue, I pass up the greens.

Dagonthir

staracino_ESO wrote: »

I also want to chime in and say that blue runes need to be found in the wild. If you want to make some crazy change to enchanting:
Make all nodes contain 1 potency, 1 essence, and 1 Ta. Jejota, Denata, Rekuta, and Kuta do not drop, but you combine Ta's to upgrade them. 5 Ta = 1 Jejota, 4 Jejota = 1 Denata, 3 Denata = 1Rekuta, 2 Rekuta = 1 Kuta. That makes 120 Ta per Kuta, which seems like a fair amount to me, maybe even a little too many. But this solves the problems of people leaving behind Ta, and the current issue with blues runes needing to be bought. Although with current stockpiles floating around, this would result in a huge amount of Kutas being produced, so maybe it will be too much.

This sounds like a great idea to me!