Official Feedback Thread for New Item Sets

Minsc

Pretty sure that you don't need to wear heavy in order to have the benefit from Fasalla's ( as there is also shield )

Ishammael

Minsc wrote: »

Pretty sure that you don't need to wear heavy in order to have the benefit from Fasalla's ( as there is also shield )

Where does it drop?

Kryank

Ishammael wrote: »

Minsc wrote: »

Pretty sure that you don't need to wear heavy in order to have the benefit from Fasalla's ( as there is also shield )

Where does it drop?

In rewards for the worthy along with vicious death jewellery

Cinbri

Yes, i sadly fount that all new pvp sets has jewel part, so any 5 Light DD can wear 5 Fasalla. Despite i like diversity, i see only 2 ways how zos can balance it:
1. Nerf set, so it will became just another trash. Maybe change it major Defile than, but it will hurt hard too.
2. Remove jewel for this set from loot table so its users wont be able to have 5pc bonuses from medium and light armor.
However as i said - all new pvp/trial sets have weapon/jewel parts, so maybe leave it as it is, depends on how strong other sets combos can be.

timidobserver

Cinbri wrote: »

Yes, i sadly fount that all new pvp sets has jewel part, so any 5 Light DD can wear 5 Fasalla. Despite i like diversity, i see only 2 ways to balance it:
1. Nerf set, so it will became just another trash.
2. Remove jewel for this set from loot table so its users wont be able to have 5pc bonuses from medium and light armor.
And i highly reccomend ZOS second option.

Maybe just remove the rings but leave the neck, so you can't wear 5 light/medium with the set?

Cinbri

timidobserver wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Yes, i sadly fount that all new pvp sets has jewel part, so any 5 Light DD can wear 5 Fasalla. Despite i like diversity, i see only 2 ways to balance it:
1. Nerf set, so it will became just another trash.
2. Remove jewel for this set from loot table so its users wont be able to have 5pc bonuses from medium and light armor.
And i highly reccomend ZOS second option.

Maybe just remove the rings but leave the neck, so you can't wear 5 light/medium with the set?

I definetly can't answer now, with all new sets we got insane set combo diversity(thing we waited for long time). Some combos that noone used for now can be incredibly strong. Only more prolonged test will show. Testing new trial sets right now and must say that for sets intended for group pve they are pretty strong in pvp.
EDIT: however as we know for now several facts:
a. Changes in CP didn't make healing/healing debufs equal. Not a single healing buff CP was changed, and Fasalla can be this answer.
b. Befoul CP wasn't changed to be addictive, so even now it doesn't counter 3 healing CP, probably zos afraid too harsh changes to debuffs coz nerfs for Purge and rest of "train" staff.

sabresandiego_ESO

Fasallas is a brilliant set, because healing is quite overpowered in pvp. The only problem is that heal debuff stacking is broken. You should not be able to stack multiple different types of heal debuffs, esentially lowering healing to almost nothing.

Disease procs, major defile, and set bonus like fasallas should NOT stack.

That being said, the set needs to remain as is with no cooldown or it will be worthless.

The best fix is to simply make the 5 piece bonus major defile, and also make all other heal debuffs major or minor defile so that none stack. Yes its a huge nerf to the set, but it will still be a great set for people who are not running major defile on an ability.

mike.eso

What sets come with jewelry?

cschwingeb14_ESO

Fasallas will be OP even if if it is changed to Major Defile with no cooldown. I understand the intent is to make people regret spamming AE attacks, but this set is all that people will wear, because Defile is so strong.

We run a werewolf for AE Defile in our small group, because it's so strong.

Give it a 5-10s cool down and have it pulse Defile in an AE around the attacker

ScruffyWhiskers

Can we get a new light armor set that has the old Stygian 5 piece effect. Maybe for the Dark Brotherhood DLC?

Anhedonie

The only thing I liked is worm cult jewelry. But I don't play as healer anymore, so it felt just nice and nothing else.
I didn't like new sets.

mike.eso

Does marksman set come with jewelry??

Glory

@Mikmak yes it does.

I agree with @sabresandiego_ESO. Remove the debuff stack, and this set will be useful at the cost of sustain or damage.

GreenSoup2HoT

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Fasallas is a brilliant set, because healing is quite overpowered in pvp. The only problem is that heal debuff stacking is broken. You should not be able to stack multiple different types of heal debuffs, esentially lowering healing to almost nothing.

Disease procs, major defile, and set bonus like fasallas should NOT stack.

That being said, the set needs to remain as is with no cooldown or it will be worthless.

The best fix is to simply make the 5 piece bonus major defile, and also make all other heal debuffs major or minor defile so that none stack. Yes its a huge nerf to the set, but it will still be a great set for people who are not running major defile on an ability.

Now that it's been confirmed this set come's in jewelry, you can effectively run a burst weapon damage build in medium or light Armour while stacking healing debuff's. This is way to strong.


The "Fasallas Guile" set need's to be changed and only applie Major Defile. Even if it was changed to Major Defile, having no cool-down would still be overpowered

Change the set to Major Defile and give the set a 10 second cool-down per enemy effected. This way the set is still effective while multiple people are attacking you but also not blatantly overpowered in 1v1's.

REMEMBER!

In the hand's of a player with burst, this is way to effective in it's current implementation and will most likely ruin the game



@sabresandiego_ESO I know you said you don't want to see a cool-down but i fear even that would still be too good. We will see what Zos does because something obviously has to change.

Imagine a Magicka Sorc or Magicka DK running this set. A class that has no way to applie major defile. It would be very hard to contest them if they had this.


A quick fit would be to CAP healing reduction taken from debuff's to 50%. 30% From Major, 15% from Minor and the other 5% from CP.

mike.eso

ebethke_ESO wrote: »

@Mikmak yes it does.

I agree with @sabresandiego_ESO. Remove the debuff stack, and this set will be useful at the cost of sustain or damage.

Sweeeet, thanks bud.

Cinbri

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Fasallas is a brilliant set, because healing is quite overpowered in pvp. The only problem is that heal debuff stacking is broken. You should not be able to stack multiple different types of heal debuffs, esentially lowering healing to almost nothing.

Disease procs, major defile, and set bonus like fasallas should NOT stack.

That being said, the set needs to remain as is with no cooldown or it will be worthless.

The best fix is to simply make the 5 piece bonus major defile, and also make all other heal debuffs major or minor defile so that none stack. Yes its a huge nerf to the set, but it will still be a great set for people who are not running major defile on an ability.

Now that it's been confirmed this set come's in jewelry, you can effectively run a burst weapon damage build in medium or light Armour while stacking healing debuff's. This is way to strong.


The "Fasallas Guile" set need's to be changed and only applie Major Defile. Even if it was changed to Major Defile, having no cool-down would still be overpowered

Change the set to Major Defile and give the set a 10 second cool-down per enemy effected. This way the set is still effective while multiple people are attacking you but also not blatantly overpowered in 1v1's.

REMEMBER!

In the hand's of a player with burst, this is way to effective in it's current implementation and will most likely ruin the game



@sabresandiego_ESO I know you said you don't want to see a cool-down but i fear even that would be too good. We will see what Zos does because something obviously has to change.

It won't be OP without cd coz as i said,

Cinbri wrote: »

a. Changes in CP didn't make healing/healing debufs equal. Not a single healing buff CP was changed, and Fasalla can be this answer.
b. Befoul CP wasn't changed to be addictive, so even now it doesn't counter 3 healing CP, probably zos afraid too harsh changes to debuffs coz nerfs for Purge and rest of "train" staff.

Healing outpoot still heavily OP in compare with counterpart heal depression and this is what everyone who pvp is talked about endlessly since IC realease.
any style of cd will ruin set for 100%.

GreenSoup2HoT

@Cinbri

I remember Wrobel saying Befoul was additive and that the tooltip's are wrong in the CP passive rework thread. He then changed his comment for clarity but i remember him saying that in the first place. That's one of the reason's i recently switched to Disease enchant's.

We need people in pts to test if Befoul is additive or not to make sure.


I'm fine with this set having no cd but it need's to applie Major Defile. If it is not changed to Major Defile then a cooldown must be set in place.

I've seen first hand this set crushing people and this was on a tanking setup. If this setup was used with jewelry and weapon's, any type of player can utilize this and be very overpowered. You loose damage but you can then just wear the new potion set and get 700 weapon damage for 15 second's. You won't need any more time then that since healing is currently reduced to nothing when stacked.


I would much rather see the set be changed to Major Defile. I want tank's to use this set for group play and debuff everyone who attack's him. It's true a cool down would potentially ruin this set but only for group play. For 1v1's it would still be very strong if it maintained the 50% debuff with a cd though.


We need to wait for Zos to respond to are feedback on Monday.

Minsc

Also Bahraha's curse ( the 4-piece bonus) offers 40% damage resistance to quite a few more things than just traps
Working as intended ?

Xsorus

Again...Fasilla Curse doesn't need a cooldown..or to even change as a debuff..

It just needs the old 20% chance back that it had on Duroks bane (Seriously..this set has been in the game for bloody years...i've ran it before)

Faulgor

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Now that it's been confirmed this set come's in jewelry, you can effectively run a burst weapon damage build in medium or light Armour while stacking healing debuff's. This is way to strong.

How about adding "When having 5 or more pieces of Heavy Armor equipped" to the 5 piece effect?

GreenSoup2HoT

@Faulgor

I still think 50% would need to be toned down some.... however that would not make sense to implement because it come's in jewelry (not sure how acquired but exists) and you can craft this set into weapon's. You can achieve the 5 piece without wearing any heavy Armour.

The suggestion's already mentioned are really the only way to go about fixing this set. This set will still be very powerful even with the mentioned changes above.

It's just Zos's turn to choose how this set will be used. The set will work 1 of 2 way's imo, it will be a set great for group's and applie Major Defile to tons of enemy's without a cool-down if you attack the target wearing this set or a very good 1v1 set with a cool-down.

Zos could throw a curve ball and do something completely different as well. We just gotta wait and see what they do.

In the mean time we need to add more to the discussion so they make the right choice and everyone is happy.

Faulgor

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

@Faulgor

I still think 50% would need to be toned down some.... however that would not make sense to implement because it come's in jewelry (not sure how acquired but exists) and you can craft this set into weapon's. You can achieve the 5 piece without wearing any heavy Armour.

I see no problem here. If you have 3 jewelry + 2 weapon pieces and are otherwise naked, the set bonus simply wouldn't work. You'd have to equip any 5 pieces of Heavy Armor, which seems to be the original intent with this set (Durok's Bane is heavy as well).
This is no different than 5 armor pieces of Torug's Pact without a weapon equipped, or without an enchantment on your weapon.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Someone needs to re-check this set to make sure it isn't procing off of NPCs.

I was solo defending a keep and was hit with this:


So either it procced on me BEFORE i died, procced on someone else I didn't see, or it procced on an NPC. This would be a terrible set to enter into live being bugged or being able to explode NPCs.

Imagine what would happen to keep fights if every flag guard, mender, and squishy siege quartermaster became a bomb?

Note that I was wearing 5pc heavy armor with 15% magicka mitigation CP, and other defensive sets when i was hit with this. It hits hard.

Elijah_Crow

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

I see no reason why the below set should only give increased damage against players. Making this a % increase in damage across the board would go a long way toward making this a viable PvE Endgame set for dungeons and trials and currently bow is underpowered in that aspect.

I suggest making it a flat 8% across the board to players and mobs.

Anyone agree or disagree with this? Marksman should be 8% against players and mobs? I thought there would be more requests for this.

olsborg

The "Fasallas Guile" set need's to be changed and only applie Major Defile. Even if it was changed to Major Defile, having no cool-down would still be overpowered

Yea pretty much this.

James-Wayne

Kerioko wrote: »

Alchemist Set is going to be ridiculous for NB gank builds!

I'm actually loving this set on my Magicka Templar with Julianos, boosted my spell damage to 4156 so now I dont need Molag Kena which only lasts 6 seconds and don't need to be in melee range to get buffed... look out PvP world!

Please do not nerf this set ZOS!

Erondil

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

I see no reason why the below set should only give increased damage against players. Making this a % increase in damage across the board would go a long way toward making this a viable PvE Endgame set for dungeons and trials and currently bow is underpowered in that aspect.

I suggest making it a flat 8% across the board to players and mobs.

Anyone agree or disagree with this? Marksman should be 8% against players and mobs? I thought there would be more requests for this.

I agree, I could make some gold of PvErs then

Cinbri

@GreenSoup2HoT
Well, Wrobel removed his words about Befoul coz he was wrong about it being addictive. And i tested it on pts - Befoul still multiplicative instead of being addictive. So, with not a single change of aoe caps, 3 CPs with healing buff and only 1 muliplicative CP of healing debuff, in PvP still healing > damage. So that set is highly needed. Also i don't think it need to be changed to Major Defile coz we know that most skills that apply this debuff are single-target, only aoe debuffs are WW and Templar, so when equal groups will meet each other, stacked Fasalla+Mejor Defile won't play biggest difference, however it should not be changed to Major Defile only if they will add to 5pc bonus something like "proc only when wear 5 heavy armor parts", otherwise it will be too OP; Also if they will make Befoul addictive(however i doubt), they should change 5pc bonus to Major Defile. Also i think duration of current debuff should be decreased from 5 sec to 3-4 sec.
Also Baharaha Curse 5pc bonus should get Leeching Plate's treatment for PvP.
Marksman set should get PvE treatment.

Faulgor

Ouch!




Broke my right leg with Marksman's legs (female Bosmer). Fixed itself when equipping shoes.
Couldn't reproduce on a male character.

Tankqull

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

This set need's a cool-down. There is hardly any counter play and is it already being classed as the best 1v1 set in the game. Hardly any effort is needed to utilize this set to it's full potential. All you do is stack as much healing reduction as you can.

The problem:

Even if purged, the 5th piece set bonus can immediately return to the attacker. A cool-down must be set in place to achieve build diversity and counter play. Reverberating Bash with this set can applie an 80% healing reduction to your enemy with 100% up time if you include this new set. This can be pushed even further with Disease enchant's and Champion Point's into Befoul (Healing reduction).

If nothing is done, every single player in the game will be using this set.


Sorry @Sypher. It had to be done. You know as well as i do, this set need's a cool-down. Or else everyone will use this set. It is good yes but it is too good. You had a couple hour's worth of fun killing everyone in sight with this set but now it's time to let the Dev's know about this.

This is the same thing that happened when Reactive Armour was released. It was additive and very overpowered till it was changed. The same thing is happening with this set and it will ruin further set testing if nothing is changed.

If you want the live server's to have great balance, a good place to start would be to warn Zos about the implication's this set can have on the game if left un-changed.


There are two change's that i can see being done to make this set balanced:

1- Give this set a cool-down. 5 second's minimum up to 10 second's maximum.

2- Forget the cool-down and make this set grant Major Defile Instead so you cannot stack an insane amount of healing reduction. This set in my eye's was intended for the change to the alliance support skill "Guard". Guard would then applie major defile to anyone who attacked you while you soaked up enemy projectile's because of this unique set. This set would be very effective in group play scenario's, especially for Dragon Knight's who use Reflective Scale's.


@ZOS_GinaBruno @Wrobel @ZOS_RichLambert

not CD but an imunity is needed. otherwise it will lose to be an option outside of a pure duel set.