Not going back to veteran Maelstrom Arena until it is nerfed on consoles.

Justice31st

I am tired of seeing a majority of these 1% players who keep posting veteran Malestrom Arena videos who have the best gear, items, maxed out champion points and the majority being sorcerers (for an much easier run). Many use keyboard macros and some use other cheats or have addons to also help do the work for them. I don't know why ZOS even uses the 1% as the epitome of the current dungeon difficulty. In reality, the majority of ESO players are struggling to even complete veteran maelstrom arena once; let alone have a chance at the new master weapons (especially on console). Just look at the leader boards or trophy % achievement. I do not understand why ZOS wants the majority % of eso players to be set up for failure or even rage quit the game. @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert (Tagged just to hopefully get a "soon" or /lurk) @ZOS_Alex ( tagged because he enjoys giving me warnings)

@L2P_Groupies @elitist (And also tagged inb4 the elitist and L2P groupies.)

Here is a quick list of reasons why Malestrom Arena needs to be nerfed on console.

1. 9 trait gear needed.
2. Massive repair, food, potion cost.
3. Horribly designed catered to ranged and primarily sorcerers.
4. Having to respect to a min/max build in order to get the best chance possible.
5. Champion point heavily dependent.
6. No addons on consoles which give a big advantage.
7. Class imbalances

Solution: Drop the current difficulty of veteran Malestrom Arena and there should be three difficulties added into the game to keep the PC players (with there unfair advantages) happy. Normal, Veteran, Hardcore. The vMA and hMA would both have a % chance at dropping the master weapons. But with hardcore Maelstrom Arena also having the higher percent chance of dropping a master item with a better trait.

People claiming that their needs to be content for solo players is fine. However, end game gear only obtained by solo gameplay should NOT be included in an MMO. This goes against the very nature of what an massively multiplayer online game is; playing and grouping with other people.

Feel free to add to the list below with your own frustrations about the veteran Maelstrom Arena. And thanks for your time.

remilafo

Justice31st wrote: »

3. Horribly designed catered to ranged and primarily sorcerers.

I agree 99% with your post except this one part.. Let me modify it for you..

3. Horribly designed catered to ranged and primarily Magicka characters with strong self heals.

ch.ris317b14_ESO

Justice31st wrote: »

I am tired of these 1% players who keep posting veteran malestrom arena videos who have the best gear, items and maxed out champion points. Many use keyboard macros and other cheats. I don't know why ZOS even cares to use these players as the dungeon difficulty example. In reality, the majority of eso players are struggling to even complete veteran maelstrom arena; let alone have a chance at the new master weapons, and especially on console. Just look at the leaderboards. I do not understand why ZOS wants the majority % of eso players to rage quit the game.

And also inb4 the elitist and L2P groupies.

Here is a quick list of reasos why malestrom arena needs to be nerfed on console.

1. 9 trait gear needed.
2. Massive repair, food, potion cost.
3. Horribly designed catered to ranged and primarily sorcerers.
4. Having to respect to a min/max build in order to get the best chance possible.
5. Champion point heavily dependent.
6. No addons on consoles which give a big advantage.

Feel free to add to the list below with your own frusterations about the veteran Maelstrom Arena.

Isn't the point of leader boards to find the top 1% of players?

.... Also, I don't care what game it is... if it is PVE, ranged is going to be heavily biased, its just the way AI mechanics work... even the ranged AI will have a harder time hitting, a player who can deal damage on the move, or range out their attacks.

Artjuh90

...

i like having hard content that you can't actually complete easly.
for point 4 all content will be like this.
point 5 all challenging content will be like this. especially solo cause you can't ride along with others.
point one most 5-6 trait gear is beter then the 9 but nvm.
6 is disadvantage not advantage

[Moderator Note: Removed moderated quote]

Justice31st

remilafo wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

3. Horribly designed catered to ranged and primarily sorcerers.

I agree 99% with your post except this one part.. Let me modify it for you..

3. Horribly designed catered to ranged and primarily Magicka characters with strong self heals.

Magicka Templars have to be up close to spam puncturing sweeps though.

code65536

Vet Maelstrom is a frustrating pain in the ass experience that makes me want to pound a hole in my desk...

...but don't you dare nerf that. Add an intermediate difficulty that's harder than the current joke of an easy mode. But the game needs aspirational content. Content that challenges people to become better. Did you know that the original Sanctum trial was something that groups practiced for weeks on, wiping over and over again, just to get past the first boss?

Furthermore, you need to stop spreading falsehoods.

• Nobody in those videos are using macros. That's absolutely laughable, esp. considering how fluid and dynamic the arena is. Even if they wanted to, it's not a place where such things would even make sense. Wait, do you even know what macros are?
• You only need 6-trait gear. Ever since 2.2.4, Hunding/Julianos is actually better than TBS.
• You do not need to be absolutely min/maxed. There are people who have beaten it with under 300cp, and there are people who have beaten it with less than optimal gear. Yes, it would be nice to have the best gear available, esp. if you want to do it competitively. But player skill count for much, much more than squeezing out an extra percentage or two out of gear.

NewBlacksmurf

It's suppose to be extremely hard and for the elite by design according to ZOS remarks.


Misconceptions on if you had 500 CP's and all maxed gear is a myth. It's doable with far less as I've gotten into it and die a lot but I know why I'm dying and it's not due to CP, gear, food but due to me not being reactive fast enough and not thinking or acting as best fits each scenario.

You may also want to consider a massive respect for skills and CPs

PBpsy

...

You do realize that when you are the OP you do not have to say inb4 since by definition you are inb4.
The more you know.

[Moderator Note: Removed moderated quote]

The-Baconator

From the first person that completed vMA on PS4 NA (albeit on a sorc),

1. I know dozens who have done the arena in non legendary v16 gear with all classes.

2. Agree, there needs to be better rewards for doing the arena. I would prefer all dropped sets be BoE.

3. Agree, but the first nightblade to beat the arena(PS4 NA) was a stamblade with 300cp. He also had a 300k score after a week. Its harder but certainly not impossible or overly difficult.

4. So that hardest content in the game shouldn't demand a good setup?

5. See #3, most who completed this in the first week had 250-450 (once again PS4 NA) and I know people who have ran it on temp and nb with 0-150 just for lols.

6. An inconvenience but hardly debilitating.

Dagoth_Rac

ch.ris317b14_ESO wrote: »

Isn't the point of leader boards to find the top 1% of players?

Yes, absolutely. But we are not talking about content where the top players get the leaderboard spots and bragging rights and weekly rewards. We are talking content where only the Top 1% (actually, much much less than 1%) can even finish the content. That is ridiculous.

One of the major reasons games have leaderboards is to provide to players with something to strive for besides just completing the content. But when 99.9% of the player base cannot even complete the content, you have taken difficulty way too far.

Catblade

Too much AOE for me. It's a lazy, lazy , lazy design to have a huge part of the map one shot AOE and then have it rain down from the sky too. Or give you a safe area but have it smashed out from under you. It's like running simulator. i want to see the devs playing it and thier live reactions on stream. If they won't do that someone else needs to step in and take over development

Casdha

Simple request, and I applaud the ones who do it ahead of time.

To: Someone who can complete Vet Maelstrom

Please make a video of completing it with all add-ons turned off.

Thanks,

Catblade

Casdha wrote: »

Simple request, and I applaud the ones who do it ahead of time.

To: Someone who can complete Vet Maelstrom

Please make a video of completing it with all add-ons turned off.

Thanks,

With a blind build you can't test or even see dmg numbers or how much you're taking

RinOkumara

If you're not good enough to beat it, that is what normal is for.

asneakybanana

Justice31st wrote: »

I am tired of these 1% players who keep posting veteran malestrom arena videos who have the best gear, items and maxed out champion points. Many use keyboard macros and other cheats. I don't know why ZOS even cares to use these players as the dungeon difficulty example. In reality, the majority of eso players are struggling to even complete veteran maelstrom arena; let alone have a chance at the new master weapons, and especially on console. Just look at the leaderboards. I do not understand why ZOS wants the majority % of eso players to rage quit the game. @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert

And also inb4 the elitist and L2P groupies.

Here is a quick list of reasos why malestrom arena needs to be nerfed on console.

1. 9 trait gear needed.
2. Massive repair, food, potion cost.
3. Horribly designed catered to ranged and primarily sorcerers.
4. Having to respect to a min/max build in order to get the best chance possible.
5. Champion point heavily dependent.
6. No addons on consoles which give a big advantage.

Feel free to add to the list below with your own frusterations about the veteran Maelstrom Arena.

Stop complaining.
1. You don't need 9 trait gear. I got world first dk with 3 and 4 trait gear and 1 piece of molag kena but could have done ithw without the kena.
2. Ya the consumables get expensive after a while but you shouldn't really spend more than 50k or so on that and then after your first clear that cost will go wayyyy down until its maybe 5k a run.
3. Melee builds work awesome with all their burst you just have to use a lot of mobility such as gap closers and speed boosts and stay on your toes the entire time so you don't get hit by the dodgeable abilities.
4. What do you mean by respect a minmax build? Running a minmax damage or healing build will make it near impossible to clear. Every build needs some damage, some heals, and some survivability skills.
5. Have cleared with 300 cp and know people who have gotten no death runs with less.
6. No addons suck but the basics are still there. Do damage and dont stand in red the addons won't help you with that. All they do is a little help with buff tracking.

If you need help I am more than willing to wall you through exactly what you need to do to get past wherever you're stuck on.

Alec508

Catblade wrote: »

Casdha wrote: »

Simple request, and I applaud the ones who do it ahead of time.

To: Someone who can complete Vet Maelstrom

Please make a video of completing it with all add-ons turned off.

Thanks,

With a blind build you can't test or even see dmg numbers or how much you're taking

Maybe I misread your comment but that's exactly what he was trying to make a point of, how do you expect console players with no add ons to complete it ?

The-Baconator

Alec508 wrote: »

Catblade wrote: »

Casdha wrote: »

Simple request, and I applaud the ones who do it ahead of time.

To: Someone who can complete Vet Maelstrom

Please make a video of completing it with all add-ons turned off.

Thanks,

With a blind build you can't test or even see dmg numbers or how much you're taking

Maybe I misread your comment but that's exactly what he was trying to make a point of, how do you expect console players with no add ons to complete it ?

As someone who played on both pc and console, why would you expect people to not be able to complete it JUST because they don't have addons? I would love having them available on PS4 and I hope ZOS adds in damage numbers at a bare minimum, but I don't see how missing this information could prevent someone from completing vMA.

NewBlacksmurf

Alec508 wrote: »

Catblade wrote: »

Casdha wrote: »

Simple request, and I applaud the ones who do it ahead of time.

To: Someone who can complete Vet Maelstrom

Please make a video of completing it with all add-ons turned off.

Thanks,

With a blind build you can't test or even see dmg numbers or how much you're taking

Maybe I misread your comment but that's exactly what he was trying to make a point of, how do you expect console players with no add ons to complete it ?

I think you're right....BUT

The OP needs to realize.....You do not need addons you need to know what you're doing, be able to do it and know how to adjust on the fly when something doesn't go as planned.

I think many ppls issue with this is that they have these MMO builds instead of an ESO build.
I wish the game went back to difficulty is closed beta Where basically Vet Maelstrom arena was just barely above how the normal game was 3-49 zones.

That type of player build was able and is able to progress in vet maelstrom as my first time I got to the first boss after less than 5 deaths. And I have less than 200 CP's and am on Xbox one

Catblade

The-Baconator wrote: »

Alec508 wrote: »

Catblade wrote: »

Casdha wrote: »

Simple request, and I applaud the ones who do it ahead of time.

To: Someone who can complete Vet Maelstrom

Please make a video of completing it with all add-ons turned off.

Thanks,

With a blind build you can't test or even see dmg numbers or how much you're taking

Maybe I misread your comment but that's exactly what he was trying to make a point of, how do you expect console players with no add ons to complete it ?

As someone who played on both pc and console, why would you expect people to not be able to complete it JUST because they don't have addons? I would love having them available on PS4 and I hope ZOS adds in damage numbers at a bare minimum, but I don't see how missing this information could prevent someone from completing vMA.

Because you're a sorc, right? Who needs numbers when you can ward through it? Mines almost leveled so it's whatever

Alucardo

People have begged for challenging PVE content - they get it, then want it nerfed. I'm lolling.
It's good they've made fixes for the unfair challenges in the arena (stranglers for example), but I think that's where it should end. No more nerfs.

Jaronking

I hope they will never Nerf it just fix it that thing is crazy and just stupidly bugged.

Evergnar

I don't have a problem with the difficulty as much as I do the gold, time sink, no save option. If it were only 3-5 rounds I'd view Maelstrom totally differently.

PrinceBoru

What?
I disagree.
Nerfing has done enough to this game.
Maelstrom is indeed aspirational for me.
But I will prevail.

zornyan

Justice31st wrote: »

I am tired of these 1% players who keep posting veteran malestrom arena videos who have the best gear, items and maxed out champion points. Many use keyboard macros and other cheats. I don't know why ZOS even cares to use these players as the dungeon difficulty example. In reality, the majority of eso players are struggling to even complete veteran maelstrom arena; let alone have a chance at the new master weapons, and especially on console. Just look at the leaderboards. I do not understand why ZOS wants the majority % of eso players to rage quit the game. @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert

And also inb4 the elitist and L2P groupies.

Here is a quick list of reasos why malestrom arena needs to be nerfed on console.

1. 9 trait gear needed.
2. Massive repair, food, potion cost.
3. Horribly designed catered to ranged and primarily sorcerers.
4. Having to respect to a min/max build in order to get the best chance possible.
5. Champion point heavily dependent.
6. No addons on consoles which give a big advantage.

Feel free to add to the list below with your own frusterations about the veteran Maelstrom Arena.

Just to help you out a bit here, since your obviously very salty.

1. People are using sets like hundings or julianos. This is 6 trait gear. They have done deathless runs with 6 trait gear.
2. Repair costs have been nerfed, gold is easy to come by, pots are dropped everywhere and cheap to buy in stacks
3. Not catered to sorcs, every build in the game can be ranged, sorcs have an easier time because of shields
4. Not really, just use a decent build, you actually need a bit more health and regen so min/max isn't optimal
5. Again nope, people have done deathless runs on 150cp, with the catch up mechanic every new player making a vr16 char will have 200 cp by vr16.
6. Addons help, but not an advantage , is knowing your dps going to make you avoid the water on round 3? Is having addons going to prevent the poison from killing you in round 7? Nope.


It's not that bad actually, many people have completed it on console, just because you lack the skill doesn't mean it needs nerfing, go player normal.

I think the issue is console players haven't had their skills tested before, when I played on console nobody really did vet pledges, those that did struggled to understand builds and mechanics, I've seen so many people struggle on even normal arena which is a walk in the park.

The first time I did normal it took my ps4 friends a week to beat, they told me it was extemely difficult and they struggled, I went in and did it in under an hour, with 1 death. Because it's easy.

The-Baconator

Catblade wrote: »

The-Baconator wrote: »

Alec508 wrote: »

Catblade wrote: »

Casdha wrote: »

Simple request, and I applaud the ones who do it ahead of time.

To: Someone who can complete Vet Maelstrom

Please make a video of completing it with all add-ons turned off.

Thanks,

With a blind build you can't test or even see dmg numbers or how much you're taking

Maybe I misread your comment but that's exactly what he was trying to make a point of, how do you expect console players with no add ons to complete it ?

As someone who played on both pc and console, why would you expect people to not be able to complete it JUST because they don't have addons? I would love having them available on PS4 and I hope ZOS adds in damage numbers at a bare minimum, but I don't see how missing this information could prevent someone from completing vMA.

Because you're a sorc, right? Who needs numbers when you can ward through it? Mines almost leveled so it's whatever

Me being a sorc is irrelevant when considering if not having access to numbers gimps you to the point that the arena becomes impossible or unnecessarily difficult. Being able to see EXACTLY how much damage your doing\taking will not instantly make the arena go from impossible to complete to face-roll-easy-mode (though I would still LOVE to see the numbers). Yes it is easier on some specs (I don't even run it for gear anymore because it started to be boring\repetitive after my 3rd flawless and the RNG is just bad) but it is easily doable with practice on literally every class and spec no matter the cp, on console and pc alike.

Ariisen

I have tried only 2 times, my total time spent inside vMSA is like.. 4-5 hours, got to arena 5 stage 3.
I'm mostly levelling my alts and I don't have time to go here for a whole evening trying to memorize spawns ect, for now.

It's hard? yes
Does it need a nerf? IMHO no
Does it needs a bug fix? That's sure.

But it is supposed to be endgame until the next DLC, keep it hard.

Sharmony

My fourth ever run on magicka nightblade, the fourth best time in the world atm, no hacks, lots of mistakes, yes cp capped (like quite a few people are) and yes 'best' gear but that was easy to make and isn't hard to achieve even without good gear.

Run is Here

Catblade

Yeah when i grind 200 more cp i'll be able to do it too. But aside from pc transfers and grinders not too many with that much on console. Most people i ask have less than me and i'm at 301. I can get to the boss fight on the toxic stage for now but i don't have the time or info to keep doing it. Yes having numbers would help me. How can i tell if my adjustments to CP are making a enough of a difference or if i should focus in other areas? Should i go more crit, more dmg like thaumaturge/mighty or a mix of both. Where the sweet spot? I have no idea

acw37162

It's brutal.

So funny watching the few hundred players who can beat it tell the other thousands that try to go play normal or learn to play.

@zos anyone just publish the data to webcode if it's not already there or better yet give a website or interface where every player can go and look to see.......

How many players attempted
How far they got
Race, build, and abilities used
Time to clear
Number of deaths
Etc....

Open source all the Malestrom data, he'll open source all the game data I guarantee you that if you get thousands of people looking it they will see things the forty or fifty (guess) you have working on the game might miss out of familiarity.

All this I beat it, I have dozens of friends that beat it, someone I know beat it with 150 CP while white VR1 gear with no potions is great reading and all but show us the hard data and let us sift through it.

On top of the absurd difficulty, on top of it being slightly harder in console for a couple of reasons (no add ons, and for some reason weapon swap is less responsive on console) I also suggest there are rare to no stamina builds beating Vet Malestrom without Vigor (the lone exception being Stam sorcs b/c well crit surge) a pure PVP skill, if that's the case a not news news flash, that's a balance problem.

UltimaJoe777

Unfortunately this nerf will never happen because it is supposed to be super challenging. Can't have everything handed to ya in an easy-bake oven You'll just have to step up your game is all, or ignore vMA entirely.

pronkg

Casdha wrote: »

Simple request, and I applaud the ones who do it ahead of time.

To: Someone who can complete Vet Maelstrom

Please make a video of completing it with all add-ons turned off.

Thanks,

Eh :S what?

How do addons help you in this? Does it matter if you know how much dmg you do in numbers? What are you aiming at.

If you want to know stats. Heres mine.

2500 spell power
1400 magicka regen
42.000 max magicka
20.000 health
10.000 stamina
48% crit chance
Shadow mundus
About 300 champion points

This is what I used to complete it, hope it helps.