Tommy1979AtWar wrote: »
These companions gone now for good but if I know 3 then how many more are leaving because of this. I will always support ESO especially on console and I will never stop fighting for this essential addition.
I started this game with 6 friends whom like me eagerly awaited launch for so long, however the week IC dropped 1unsubbed and left over the nerfs, 4 unsubbed and left as against all logic chat wasn't added, the remaining 2 of us have unsubbed and are just waiting for fallout to come in a few weeks and we'll be gone too, i really hope a text chat is added to the game as not having one will be the only thing preventing us from returning in the new year.
Amen to that.
DaveTheMinion wrote: »It's never bothered me, besides if I want text chat I would go play on the PC, to be honest I think not having text chat is a good thing, most other games I have played with TChat its usually filled with abusive comments, or people trying to sell everything from a sword to their grandmother.
DaveTheMinion wrote: »If the developers come on here today and said NO to text chat, that would definitely not be the end of it, people will still moan and continue to ask for it and blame the developers for not listening.
anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »
Define "many", LOL.
99,9998765% of the usability professionals.
I'm in good company, thank you.
BaldusMageezack wrote: »I find it Ironic that certain people will sit here hours on end communicating in text chat to debate against text chat.
You are just another one who doesn't understand context. Or at least just ignores it. You're not alone, it's one of the main reasons why so many usability flaws exist.
Most of us are typing the forum messages behind a pc, keyboard on a desk or table in front of us.
If we had to use the same keyboard while sitting in our couches, we would react less.
If we had to use the gamepad for creating replies, we would react less.
It’s just showing again and again that opinions about UI don’t work.
Guys, you're seriously wasting your time argueing with pino, its not that he doesnt understand, he just doesnt want to. He's always gonna keep coming back with some crap that has nothing to do with the discussion. We've pretty much countered everything he's come up with, yet still keeps going. He doesnt want text chat, we aint gonna convince him otherwise.
Since when are you the spokesman of the entire community?
kaskel2000 wrote: »Pino you keep saying that many people do not want text chat. Please give me your statistical analysis of this as you also say that you are not representing "the voice of the community" just yourself? These two statements are contidictory.
I'd add also that saying you will help one disability and then going back on that and actively not helping by not including subtitles and text chat from the word go and in fact going back on that is slightly wrong ethically. I agree games should try and help other forms of disability too but when you say that hard of hearing will be supported and then do not that seems incredibly unfair. Especially as they might have bought the game and are only able to enjoy a part of it.
And you say that text chat doesn't work. I'll say that voice doesn't work. So far I've managed to get into one dungeon group where anyone was using voice chat. Even in Pvp I've heard maybe one or two voices. Instead to get into groups I'm forced into using group finder which doesn't really work. Or in Pvp I'm forced to spam "yes" over and over till someone takes pitty and invites me to group. Now your argument will be that grouping needs to be improved which I would agree. Thing is even if you improve that very few will be using a mic and so no communication takes place what so ever.
So yes again I'll try and level as far as I can but this isn't an mmo without adequate forms of communication. Voice chat only would be great if that's how the real world works. My typical day at work I spend as much time talking to my colleagues as I do typing to them on Skype. The amount of emails that fly around vastly out ways the number of phone calls. Humans communicate in a variety of ways and we shouldn't be limited in a social game.
Also sadly my ZOS reaction I'm realising that this MMO has very little dev interaction with the community. Which is sad as the best MMOs usually have a really good dialogue with there community.
Want? No, need. Some want it, few need it.
And the need can be derived from the context of use.
To fine-tune, you have to watch the users while playing.
We don't work like "87% wants this, so we build it".
We don't care about what they want. But we do care about what they need, determined by their behaviour and interaction with the system.
About the deaf people, read this, it will be more clear:
Why should they take care about the disabled ones, if they don't care about the common people?
Sure, VoiceChat has its issues as well and can be improved. Just like other communication features.
Looking at this thread already alone, I understand very well why the dev people don't want to interact anymore.
It has no meaning, it's pointless. It's scientists versus believers. They have more to lose than to win.
And some people here are rather very impolite. These are the ones who created a toxic atmosphere. Who likes to talk with such people? Few. And certainly not for a long time.
NewBlacksmurf wrote: »
Lets use Destiny as an example...where users felt the grouping options offered were not ideal for how some wanted to play so they created LFG websites and apps.
For grouping the same has occurred in this game. There are sites like ESOTUlfg.com and others that offer solutions to this topic of discussion. Regarding trading or other ideas that text chat is desired to be used for, I think there are enough who are for the idea who can use this forum to birth ideas to better solve your concerns.
If you've not joined Facebook and other social media sites who use a ESOTU page to allow trading and sharing of screenshots to trade as well as guild recruit, group, etc. Those are also available opportunities.
NewBlacksmurf wrote: »
Lets use Destiny as an example...where users felt the grouping options offered were not ideal for how some wanted to play so they created LFG websites and apps.
For grouping the same has occurred in this game. There are sites like ESOTUlfg.com and others that offer solutions to this topic of discussion. Regarding trading or other ideas that text chat is desired to be used for, I think there are enough who are for the idea who can use this forum to birth ideas to better solve your concerns.
If you've not joined Facebook and other social media sites who use a ESOTU page to allow trading and sharing of screenshots to trade as well as guild recruit, group, etc. Those are also available opportunities.
And a ton of people left Destiny that were there at launch because the grouping system didn't work at all. Now,, it still doesn't exist for raids and even though there have been improvements in Destiny, many people won't return because it's a matter of a 'too little, too late'. The negative impact to Destiny players by the lack of proper MMO communication/grouping tools resulted in their initial downfall. I look at my friends list on Xbox at all the people I met at launch of Destiny, not a single one plays anymore. They have all moved on, and to a person it's because of the lack of communication/grouping tools in the game in addition to mixing in the bad loot system.
Bottomline, no one wanted to go to an external website to group, to look at Grimore cards that were collected IN the game. It was a complete failure.
Now the pattern repeats in ESO console. You are saying the proper solution is to go to website outside of the game to properly group or communicate with the community. And in order to go to an external website, YOU NEED A KEYBOARD TO TYPE. You need to bring up a virtual keyboard or use a real keyboard to use ESOTUlfg.com.
How ironic and stupid is that solution?
NewBlacksmurf wrote: »
you keep partially quoting me.....either work together or go do something that helps you and others.
Stop picking, fights, arguing and attacking others
maybe go meet some ppl vs. fighting on the forums
There are opportunities to get a form of what you and others want but you seem to only want it your way.
-Go make a game, go apply to work for ZOS, make and design something for Xbox or whatever but what you're doing isn't helping you or anyone else who feels as you feel about this.
anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »
you keep partially quoting me.....either work together or go do something that helps you and others.
Stop picking, fights, arguing and attacking others
maybe go meet some ppl vs. fighting on the forums
There are opportunities to get a form of what you and others want but you seem to only want it your way.
-Go make a game, go apply to work for ZOS, make and design something for Xbox or whatever but what you're doing isn't helping you or anyone else who feels as you feel about this.
I don't think people are arguing or being aggressive just for the sake of it, @NewBlacksmurf . But you must understand that we've had to deal for two days on this thread with someone who repeated ad nauseam that IT users' self-expressed wishes are not valid, since the only reliable way to identify users' needs is to observe their behaviour. While that might be true to a certain extent, bringing it here on this forum is obviously a trolling attitude because, obviously, people on a forum cannot be "observed". All they can do with a forum is express and explain what they want.
While you're nice to talk to and with a positive attitude, your attitude seems quite out of place too. People on this thread want to express their experience without text chat and still hope to convince ZOS to implement text chat.
What you're saying is "let's accept we'll never get text chat and elaborate alternatives instead". While that might be a very wise attitude, it's just the exact opposite of the thread's purpose. That's why people react a little bit agressively. Like everyone who's told to "shut up" and "deal with it" when trying to express a concern.
If you want to think of viable alternatives to text chat for consoles, maybe it's better to create another thread for that purpose.
As to "esolfg", it is obviously a very nice and useful work that the whole community should be thankful for. Nonetheless, I bet even its creators would be very happy to dump it if it can be efficiently replaced by ergonomic and working in-game functions.
So ZOS should print on the package of the box: keyboard required.
anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »
you keep partially quoting me.....either work together or go do something that helps you and others.
Stop picking, fights, arguing and attacking others
maybe go meet some ppl vs. fighting on the forums
There are opportunities to get a form of what you and others want but you seem to only want it your way.
-Go make a game, go apply to work for ZOS, make and design something for Xbox or whatever but what you're doing isn't helping you or anyone else who feels as you feel about this.
I don't think people are arguing or being aggressive just for the sake of it, @NewBlacksmurf . But you must understand that we've had to deal for two days on this thread with someone who repeated ad nauseam that IT users' self-expressed wishes are not valid, since the only reliable way to identify users' needs is to observe their behaviour. While that might be true to a certain extent, bringing it here on this forum is obviously a trolling attitude because, obviously, people on a forum cannot be "observed". All they can do with a forum is express and explain what they want.
While you're nice to talk to and with a positive attitude, your attitude seems quite out of place too. People on this thread want to express their experience without text chat and still hope to convince ZOS to implement text chat.
What you're saying is "let's accept we'll never get text chat and elaborate alternatives instead". While that might be a very wise attitude, it's just the exact opposite of the thread's purpose. That's why people react a little bit agressively. Like everyone who's told to "shut up" and "deal with it" when trying to express a concern.
If you want to think of viable alternatives to text chat for consoles, maybe it's better to create another thread for that purpose.
As to "esolfg", it is obviously a very nice and useful work that the whole community should be thankful for. Nonetheless, I bet even its creators would be very happy to dump it if it can be efficiently replaced by ergonomic and working in-game functions.
anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »Oh it was a general "peace" talk then. Well, I guess there's nothing anyone can say against it :-) They're always welcome ;-)
anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »Oh it was a general "peace" talk then. Well, I guess there's nothing anyone can say against it :-) They're always welcome ;-)
Pass the pipe then
I think you need to give people more credit man.
And how can we fix humans their cognitive capacities and limits?
I'm all ears when you have a solution.
You, you probably play the game every day. At least a lot or you probably did.
So, I really do understand your view.
But you assume that Johnny, who's playing the game once a month, could do what you are doing.
But he can't. He will forget commands and best case he will forget them partly.
At that moment you created a threshold for Johnny. The idea is to minimize the thresholds as much as possible.
The game isn't designed for your type of players alone, but also for the Johnnies. At least it should.
And that's why a command system is maybe (and I'm even not sure) nice for you, but not for Johnny.
Its funny, you want text chat - optional. You don't want it? MY WAY OR THE HIGHWAY.
Optional is good.
Just my 2.2 cents
No, options are not necessary good, but good options are.
A good option is one that's used by a significant share of the audience.
A good option is one that's not influencing the gameplay and forcing the player to buy eventual extra hardware
A good option should also not break other functionality
You can't compare apple and zos. apple is a company that works on something more serious than video games.
and also you didn't get what steve said there, steve wasn't trying to say "devs! underdeliver your products! make them overpriced! sell bits and pieces as dlcs" He was trying to say "do your damn research right, do your design right. make products that fit everyone."
ZoS not giving a text option to console players is like apple not giving writing text with a virtual keyboard option.
Does the iPhone have an UI? Yes.
Does ESO have an UI? Yes.
And are both UI's used by people? Yes.
That's what they share. You use exactly the same techniques and procedures to determine what's the best UI in both worlds.
The outcome could be different due so many parameters:
- The characteristics of the user
- The tasks and goals of the users
- The context of use, where are they using it and how?
- Are there any other artefacts used?
- Hardware and other constraints
- …
You have to analyze the above (and more) and not just feel ‘we need this or we need that’.
Feelings don’t work in designing an UI. Keep your feelings for the bedroom.
NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »
Lets use Destiny as an example...where users felt the grouping options offered were not ideal for how some wanted to play so they created LFG websites and apps.
For grouping the same has occurred in this game. There are sites like ESOTUlfg.com and others that offer solutions to this topic of discussion. Regarding trading or other ideas that text chat is desired to be used for, I think there are enough who are for the idea who can use this forum to birth ideas to better solve your concerns.
If you've not joined Facebook and other social media sites who use a ESOTU page to allow trading and sharing of screenshots to trade as well as guild recruit, group, etc. Those are also available opportunities.
And a ton of people left Destiny that were there at launch because the grouping system didn't work at all. Now,, it still doesn't exist for raids and even though there have been improvements in Destiny, many people won't return because it's a matter of a 'too little, too late'. The negative impact to Destiny players by the lack of proper MMO communication/grouping tools resulted in their initial downfall. I look at my friends list on Xbox at all the people I met at launch of Destiny, not a single one plays anymore. They have all moved on, and to a person it's because of the lack of communication/grouping tools in the game in addition to mixing in the bad loot system.
Bottomline, no one wanted to go to an external website to group, to look at Grimore cards that were collected IN the game. It was a complete failure.
Now the pattern repeats in ESO console. You are saying the proper solution is to go to website outside of the game to properly group or communicate with the community. And in order to go to an external website, YOU NEED A KEYBOARD TO TYPE. You need to bring up a virtual keyboard or use a real keyboard to use ESOTUlfg.com.
How ironic and stupid is that solution?
you keep partially quoting me.....either work together or go do something that helps you and others.
Stop picking, fights, arguing and attacking others
maybe go meet some ppl vs. fighting on the forums
There are opportunities to get a form of what you and others want but you seem to only want it your way.
-Go make a game, go apply to work for ZOS, make and design something for Xbox or whatever but what you're doing isn't helping you or anyone else who feels as you feel about this.
What? The same way "anti-text" chat folk try to pigeonhole the pro-text chat folk as strictly PC players sticking their oar in on a console issue?Kleptobrainiac wrote: »I like how the pro text chat folks try to pigeonhole the anti text chat players as strictly console players who have never played a PC MMO or gamers new to MMOs altogether.