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The Death of the Dragonknight- updated 3/15/16
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Azarath_tiberius✭✭✭AzubuFrosts wrote: »Azarath_tiberius wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.
https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
Quick question. Are you emperor in that video or are you just wearing the costume?
just the costume, my stats in that video are 34k health, 19k magika, 16k stam, which any1 would be able to get as they scale u up
Damnit! To be honest I was hoping you 'd say yes. I had such a nice answer ready for that
Regardless. That video doesn't prove that Dks are "fine", neither does it counter any points of the OP.
Also Im watching a video of you doing PvE in a thread thats clearly about DKs in PvP..
Not to mention that Its the same build 've seen a 1000 times in PvP... WB spam.
I seriously don't get all you people saying DK is fine, regardless of stamina or magicka.. Like, would you say no if ZOS gave you a magicka gap closer or a stamina whip on the spot? Think before you post stuff..
Edited by Azarath_tiberius on September 29, 2015 1:49PM1 -
bertenburnyb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Azarath_tiberius wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »Azarath_tiberius wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
Quick question. Are you emperor in that video or are you just wearing the costume?
just the costume, my stats in that video are 34k health, 19k magika, 16k stam, which any1 would be able to get as they scale u up
Like, would you say no if ZOS gave you a stamina whip on the spot?
yes I would say no, since as playing a mag DK, it would probablly take away the morph I wanted to use, and screw me over,
like I said before, make those skills scale off the highest stat, instead of making one morph mag/other stam, and so limiting people in their build optionsHaze Ramoran Dunmer Dragonknight Tank/Dps – Smoked-Da-Herb Saxheel Templar Tank/Healer
Red Diamond, Protect us 'til the end (EU EP Thorn)1 -
What would some pve vid proof anyway? Of course I can solo some boss too as magicka dk. Noone denies that dk is good in pve. However this is a pvp forum and pve stuff is pretty irrelevant when it comes to pvp.AzubuFrosts wrote: »
[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.DisgracefulMind wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »I soloed a sewer boss with dk after imperial city patch, I think they do fine
https://youtu.be/HhV7KyPY-y8
First off, that boss is bugged, you're not getting hit by most of his attacks. Second off, you're a stamina DK, and this thread has already established that stamina DK is fine, but it is magicka DK that is sitting in a tight spot.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
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Wollust✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭bertenburnyb16_ESO wrote: »Azarath_tiberius wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »Azarath_tiberius wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
Quick question. Are you emperor in that video or are you just wearing the costume?
just the costume, my stats in that video are 34k health, 19k magika, 16k stam, which any1 would be able to get as they scale u up
Like, would you say no if ZOS gave you a stamina whip on the spot?
yes I would say no, since as playing a mag DK, it would probablly take away the morph I wanted to use, and screw me over,
like I said before, make those skills scale off the highest stat, instead of making one morph mag/other stam, and so limiting people in their build options
I wouldn't mind them taking molten whip and make it a stamina flame leash. Molten is not being used in pvp and dks are super strong in pve dpswise anyway. Wouldn't hurt them to lose the small bonus damage from molten whip.
Susano'o
Zerg Squad0 -
Azarath_tiberius✭✭✭bertenburnyb16_ESO wrote: »yes I would say no, since as playing a mag DK, it would probablly take away the morph I wanted to use, and screw me over,
like I said before, make those skills scale off the highest stat, instead of making one morph mag/other stam, and so limiting people in their build options
That would have been the best scenario. But facing reality, ZOS would never do that.
I'm not going to start an argument which morph of Whip should become stamina, first and foremost, because ZOS hasnt even thought about that idea yet (...) and second ,regardless what each of us want, an instant dmg ability for DK is needed for pvp.
You disagree on the second one? I do not care.. Keep the discussion on the OP, if you want to see some good changes for DKs.1 -
Wollust✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭AzubuFrosts wrote: »
What would some pve vid proof anyway? Of course I can solo some boss too as magicka dk. Noone denies that dk is good in pve. However this is a pvp forum and pve stuff is pretty irrelevant when it comes to pvp.AzubuFrosts wrote: »
[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.DisgracefulMind wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »I soloed a sewer boss with dk after imperial city patch, I think they do finehttps://youtu.be/HhV7KyPY-y8
First off, that boss is bugged, you're not getting hit by most of his attacks. Second off, you're a stamina DK, and this thread has already established that stamina DK is fine, but it is magicka DK that is sitting in a tight spot.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
Wtf you are seriously comparing some random mobs with no brain to players?
You just disqualified yourself from participating in this thread and being taken serious.Susano'o
Zerg Squad2 -
Azarath_tiberius✭✭✭AzubuFrosts wrote: »if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
Edited by Azarath_tiberius on September 29, 2015 2:04PM8 -
Ishammael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭AzubuFrosts wrote: »
What would some pve vid proof anyway? Of course I can solo some boss too as magicka dk. Noone denies that dk is good in pve. However this is a pvp forum and pve stuff is pretty irrelevant when it comes to pvp.AzubuFrosts wrote: »
[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.DisgracefulMind wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »I soloed a sewer boss with dk after imperial city patch, I think they do finehttps://youtu.be/HhV7KyPY-y8
First off, that boss is bugged, you're not getting hit by most of his attacks. Second off, you're a stamina DK, and this thread has already established that stamina DK is fine, but it is magicka DK that is sitting in a tight spot.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
This is ridiculous. Mobs do not equal players, no matter how bad the players are. Next, console is totally different than PC, the biggest difference being ultimate generation which helps DKs enormously. Third, nobody 1vXs players of equivalent skill -- that is a straw man statement (I.e. no bearing on strength or weakness of magicka DK). Everyone on this forum can cherry pick 1vX fights and make videos for entertainment. Finally, before offering meaningless statements like "DKs are fine", run some numbers and construct some arguments: the OP did.1 -
Bashev✭✭✭✭✭
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Probably he thinks that console players act as mobsAzubuFrosts wrote: »
What would some pve vid proof anyway? Of course I can solo some boss too as magicka dk. Noone denies that dk is good in pve. However this is a pvp forum and pve stuff is pretty irrelevant when it comes to pvp.AzubuFrosts wrote: »
[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.DisgracefulMind wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »I soloed a sewer boss with dk after imperial city patch, I think they do finehttps://youtu.be/HhV7KyPY-y8
First off, that boss is bugged, you're not getting hit by most of his attacks. Second off, you're a stamina DK, and this thread has already established that stamina DK is fine, but it is magicka DK that is sitting in a tight spot.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
Wtf you are seriously comparing some random mobs with no brain to players?
You just disqualified yourself from participating in this thread and being taken serious.
Because I can!1 -
RadioheadSh0t✭✭✭✭✭Stam whip would make DKs fit into the meta better now, it's the biggest thing Stam DKs are missing.
Still, even though I'd agree that DKs could use a buff, DKs were relatively stronger in the past more than they are relatively weaker now. ZOS is clearly both making up for launch imbalance issues, and incentivizing players to re-roll (buy those crown scrolls!), but I'll take one class being somewhat weaker as opposed to one class to rule them all, like DKs were for some time.
Let's not forget that wings are still the only reflect that reflects ranged physical projectiles. Against a ranged class like Sorc, they're still pretty hard to beat because you HAVE to be running Lightning staff and Curse to beat them. Also, why defensive stance doesn't reflect physical is beyond me - it's a one-off cast, so how OP could it be?
But yeah, I'd much rather play my Sorc or NB than my DK ATM, but they also fit my playstyle better. The old permablock DK was pretty boring for my taste.Aldonius Direnni - Vet Altmer Sorc (AD)
Tyrus Telvanni - Vet Dunmer DK (AD)
Al Donius Bundy - Vet Imperial NB (AD)
Aldonius Brutus - Vet Orc DK (DC)0 -
Wollust✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭RadioheadSh0t wrote: »
Still, even though I'd agree that DKs could use a buff, DKs were relatively stronger in the past more than they are relatively weaker now. ZOS is clearly both making up for launch imbalance issues, and incentivizing players to re-roll (buy those crown scrolls!), but I'll take one class being somewhat weaker as opposed to one class to rule them all, like DKs were for some time.
Let's not forget that wings are still the only reflect that reflects ranged physical projectiles. Against a ranged class like Sorc, they're still pretty hard to beat because you HAVE to be running Lightning staff and Curse to beat them. Also, why defensive stance doesn't reflect physical is beyond me - it's a one-off cast, so how OP could it be?
Nope. This is not how balancing works. If a class was super strong in prior patches, you go and balance them with all the other classes. You do not make the class on purpose weaker just to make up for past faults. This is an insanely stupid argument and completely unreasonable.
Cool we have wings, which bugs out quite frequently. But how does that make up the missing damage? The missing survivability? The inbalance to the other classes?
Susano'o
Zerg Squad1 -
RadioheadSh0t✭✭✭✭✭RadioheadSh0t wrote: »
Still, even though I'd agree that DKs could use a buff, DKs were relatively stronger in the past more than they are relatively weaker now. ZOS is clearly both making up for launch imbalance issues, and incentivizing players to re-roll (buy those crown scrolls!), but I'll take one class being somewhat weaker as opposed to one class to rule them all, like DKs were for some time.
Let's not forget that wings are still the only reflect that reflects ranged physical projectiles. Against a ranged class like Sorc, they're still pretty hard to beat because you HAVE to be running Lightning staff and Curse to beat them. Also, why defensive stance doesn't reflect physical is beyond me - it's a one-off cast, so how OP could it be?
Nope. This is not how balancing works. If a class was super strong in prior patches, you go and balance them with all the other classes. You do not make the class on purpose weaker just to make up for past faults. This is an insanely stupid argument and completely unreasonable.
Cool we have wings, which bugs out quite frequently. But how does that make up the missing damage? The missing survivability? The inbalance to the other classes?
QQ more buddy. I wasn't saying I agreed with it, but it's clearly what they're doing. They may have went overboard in their attempt to balance them, but it's still better than the alternative of what DKs used to be.
Like I said, Stam whip would help DKs. Some other suggestions here could make DKs more balanced. But if you're complaining about DKs getting nerfed without acknowledging WHY they've been getting nerfed, you're making an incomplete argument.
I think many of the complaints are valid about DKs, others are people QQing because they're used to being completely unbalanced and just simply aren't as good as they think they are. There are still players who are effective as DKs, so they aren't completely useless, they just are a higher skill class now than what they used to be, which was very low-skill IMHO, speaking as someone who has a DK.Edited by RadioheadSh0t on September 29, 2015 2:35PMAldonius Direnni - Vet Altmer Sorc (AD)
Tyrus Telvanni - Vet Dunmer DK (AD)
Al Donius Bundy - Vet Imperial NB (AD)
Aldonius Brutus - Vet Orc DK (DC)0 -
Wollust✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭RadioheadSh0t wrote: »RadioheadSh0t wrote: »
Still, even though I'd agree that DKs could use a buff, DKs were relatively stronger in the past more than they are relatively weaker now. ZOS is clearly both making up for launch imbalance issues, and incentivizing players to re-roll (buy those crown scrolls!), but I'll take one class being somewhat weaker as opposed to one class to rule them all, like DKs were for some time.
Let's not forget that wings are still the only reflect that reflects ranged physical projectiles. Against a ranged class like Sorc, they're still pretty hard to beat because you HAVE to be running Lightning staff and Curse to beat them. Also, why defensive stance doesn't reflect physical is beyond me - it's a one-off cast, so how OP could it be?
Nope. This is not how balancing works. If a class was super strong in prior patches, you go and balance them with all the other classes. You do not make the class on purpose weaker just to make up for past faults. This is an insanely stupid argument and completely unreasonable.
Cool we have wings, which bugs out quite frequently. But how does that make up the missing damage? The missing survivability? The inbalance to the other classes?
QQ more buddy. I wasn't saying I agreed with it, but it's clearly what they're doing. They may have went overboard in their attempt to balance them, but it's still better than the alternative of what DKs used to be.
Like I said, Stam whip would help DKs. Some other suggestions here could make DKs more balanced. But if you're complaining about DKs getting nerfed without acknowledging WHY they've been getting nerfed, you're making an incomplete argument.
I think many of the complaints are valid about DKs, others are people QQing because they're used to being completely unbalanced and just simply aren't as good as they think they are. They're still players who are effective as DKs, so they aren't completely useless, they just are a higher skill class now than what they used to be, which was very low-skill IMHO, speaking as someone who has a DK.
How was DK too op in 1.5? I think back then the balance was better as in 1.6 and one thousand times better than 1.7. You can not seriously tell me that 1.5 DK was more op than 1.6 sorcs and stamblades? I don't mind those classes being strong, and I don't like the nerfs they took with this update. I dislike any nerfs tbh. But as a matter of fact, DK has been nerfed many times with a lot of nerfs not being justified anymore. How is a nerf in 1.7 being justified? DK was nowhere near op in 1.6. it was an decent class to play with but now?
Yes stam whip would help stam dk, but I think this thread is more about the magicka dk anyway. So we should probably let the stamina discussion fade out a bit.
And I'm not qq and hoping to get the DKs back that could wreck whole trains of noobs. I'd happy with having my 1.6 DK already. Would this kinda buffs be too much to ask for? Seriously?
And yes, there are good players around with DKs. But did you notice that those are going down in numbers recently? I think I wasn't too bad of a DK myself in 1.6, but this update just ruined the class completely imo. And I'm not alone with this point.Susano'o
Zerg Squad0 -
AzubuFrosts wrote: »
What would some pve vid proof anyway? Of course I can solo some boss too as magicka dk. Noone denies that dk is good in pve. However this is a pvp forum and pve stuff is pretty irrelevant when it comes to pvp.AzubuFrosts wrote: »
[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.DisgracefulMind wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »I soloed a sewer boss with dk after imperial city patch, I think they do finehttps://youtu.be/HhV7KyPY-y8
First off, that boss is bugged, you're not getting hit by most of his attacks. Second off, you're a stamina DK, and this thread has already established that stamina DK is fine, but it is magicka DK that is sitting in a tight spot.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
This is ridiculous. Mobs do not equal players, no matter how bad the players are. Next, console is totally different than PC, the biggest difference being ultimate generation which helps DKs enormously. Third, nobody 1vXs players of equivalent skill -- that is a straw man statement (I.e. no bearing on strength or weakness of magicka DK). Everyone on this forum can cherry pick 1vX fights and make videos for entertainment. Finally, before offering meaningless statements like "DKs are fine", run some numbers and construct some arguments: the OP did.
First off there are plenty of mobs that are way harder then any single player, I have yet to see any single player drop 4 people's hp to close to nothing in an instant i.e DSA vet boss, second you want to talk about numbers? OP compared DK values per/post patch, get a skill calculator and run some numbers, a magica DK easily puts out more dps then magic night blades or anything else, and they singlehandedly stood on top as dps per IC. So I'd rather they work on bugs instead of buffing a already beastly class
Edited by AzubuFrosts on September 29, 2015 3:16PM0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭AzubuFrosts wrote: »
What would some pve vid proof anyway? Of course I can solo some boss too as magicka dk. Noone denies that dk is good in pve. However this is a pvp forum and pve stuff is pretty irrelevant when it comes to pvp.AzubuFrosts wrote: »
[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.DisgracefulMind wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »I soloed a sewer boss with dk after imperial city patch, I think they do finehttps://youtu.be/HhV7KyPY-y8
First off, that boss is bugged, you're not getting hit by most of his attacks. Second off, you're a stamina DK, and this thread has already established that stamina DK is fine, but it is magicka DK that is sitting in a tight spot.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
If you honestly feel PvE experience is applicable to PvP, then you do not play experienced players.
Please watch your video again and examine how the flame atrnoachs were attacking you. Please watch what they gladiators do when they get taloned. Watched again how the Harvester was 100% incapable of even scratching you. Your video is a showcase on how to exploit AI mechanics, not on how strong a magicka DK is.
When magicka DKs fight opponents with a functional brain and a modicum of experience, then all the PvE magicka DK tricks do not work: the will cleanse dots, they will use non-projectile attacks, they will actually cause damage and force DKs to rely on that terrible heal you have slotted, they will heal themselves and expose a DKs lack of burst, they will move away from the DK and expose their lack of mobility.
Edited by Joy_Division on September 29, 2015 3:20PM4 -
Joy_Division wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »
What would some pve vid proof anyway? Of course I can solo some boss too as magicka dk. Noone denies that dk is good in pve. However this is a pvp forum and pve stuff is pretty irrelevant when it comes to pvp.AzubuFrosts wrote: »
[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.DisgracefulMind wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »I soloed a sewer boss with dk after imperial city patch, I think they do finehttps://youtu.be/HhV7KyPY-y8
First off, that boss is bugged, you're not getting hit by most of his attacks. Second off, you're a stamina DK, and this thread has already established that stamina DK is fine, but it is magicka DK that is sitting in a tight spot.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
If you honestly feel PvE experience is applicable to PvP, then you do not play experienced players.
Please watch your video again and examine how the flame atrnoachs were attacking you. Please watch what they gladiators do when they get taloned. Watched again how the Harvester was 100% incapable of even scratching you. Your video is a showcase on how to exploit AI mechanics, not on how strong a magicka DK is.
When magicka DKs fight opponents with a functional brain and a modicum of experience, then all the PvE DK tricks do not work: the will cleanse dots, they will use non-projectile attacks, they will actually cause damage and force DKs to rely on that terrible heal you have slotted, they will heal themselves and expose a DKs lack of burst, they will move away from the DK and expose their lack of mobility.
Yet on that video I'm clearly wearing emperor regalia that I've gotten from being crowned on another character, I've also held emperor for over 8 days, I've done my fair share of pve and pvp, I'm not stating that npc are the same as players I'm stating that your survivability and dps is relatively similar, it's not the class that gotta be changed its your play styleEdited by AzubuFrosts on September 29, 2015 3:24PM0 -
Azarath_tiberius✭✭✭AzubuFrosts wrote: »Yet on that video I'm clearly wearing emperor regalia that I've gotten from being crowned on another character, I've also held emperor for over 8 days
That proves nothing. Its just like what the NPCs say randomly when you pass them "anyone can be crowned emperor, thats the risks we take"..AzubuFrosts wrote: »I'm not stating that npc are the same as players I'm stating that your survivability and dps is relatively similar, it's not the class that gotta be changed its your play style
Again, wrong. Even if you cant find a difference between NPC and a player (...), players will still use different tactics / counters / skills etc etc. What you can do in PvE =/= what you can do in PvP.
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Talcyndl✭✭✭✭✭AzubuFrosts wrote: »I'm not stating that npc are the same as players I'm stating that your survivability and dps is relatively similar
Survivability against predictable (and often stupid) NPCs has zero relevance to the current PvP discussion.
Tal'gro Bol
PvP Vice Officer [Retired] and Huscarl of Vokundein
http://www.legend-gaming.net/vokundein/0 -
See ur missiAzarath_tiberius wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »Yet on that video I'm clearly wearing emperor regalia that I've gotten from being crowned on another character, I've also held emperor for over 8 days
That proves nothing. Its just like what the NPCs say randomly when you pass them "anyone can be crowned emperor, thats the risks we take"..AzubuFrosts wrote: »I'm not stating that npc are the same as players I'm stating that your survivability and dps is relatively similar, it's not the class that gotta be changed its your play style
Again, wrong. Even if you cant find a difference between NPC and a player (...), players will still use different tactics / counters / skills etc etc. What you can do in PvE =/= what you can do in PvP.
Ur kinda missing my point, yes players can use different tactics, but so can you, there are mage npc and giant orges, just like using reflective skills to migrate the damage or using charge to interrupt their charge you would have to change your tactics depending on the mob or player, eso combat is extremely similar to real life combat on the fact that sometimes you have to decide to dodge it or block it or take the hit and heal it back with magicka in order to recover ur stamina pool or which abilities you would have to use to cancel out another. DKs were easily the highest dps, and debatablely one of the best tanks, I'm sorry that they don't have a have a gap close or finishing move, BUT then again you can morph molten weapon to deal more damage to low health targets, but yes DK don't have a spam to win skill, you can't smash a button to win, but they can easily out last most players.
TL;DR Change your play style cuz they probably aren't gonna change the game, thanks for not resorting to personal insult thoEdited by AzubuFrosts on September 29, 2015 3:47PM0 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭1. Apples
2. Apples
3. Therefore oranges.
4. Therefore Aliens.Edited by Armitas on September 29, 2015 3:48PMRetired.
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Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭AzubuFrosts wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »
What would some pve vid proof anyway? Of course I can solo some boss too as magicka dk. Noone denies that dk is good in pve. However this is a pvp forum and pve stuff is pretty irrelevant when it comes to pvp.AzubuFrosts wrote: »
[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.DisgracefulMind wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »I soloed a sewer boss with dk after imperial city patch, I think they do finehttps://youtu.be/HhV7KyPY-y8
First off, that boss is bugged, you're not getting hit by most of his attacks. Second off, you're a stamina DK, and this thread has already established that stamina DK is fine, but it is magicka DK that is sitting in a tight spot.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
If you honestly feel PvE experience is applicable to PvP, then you do not play experienced players.
Please watch your video again and examine how the flame atrnoachs were attacking you. Please watch what they gladiators do when they get taloned. Watched again how the Harvester was 100% incapable of even scratching you. Your video is a showcase on how to exploit AI mechanics, not on how strong a magicka DK is.
When magicka DKs fight opponents with a functional brain and a modicum of experience, then all the PvE DK tricks do not work: the will cleanse dots, they will use non-projectile attacks, they will actually cause damage and force DKs to rely on that terrible heal you have slotted, they will heal themselves and expose a DKs lack of burst, they will move away from the DK and expose their lack of mobility.
Yet on that video I'm clearly wearing emperor regalia that I've gotten from being crowned on another character, I've also held emperor for over 8 days, I've done my fair share of pve and pvp, I'm not stating that npc are the same as players I'm stating that your survivability and dps is relatively similar, it's not the class that gotta be changed its your play style
Congratulations on being an Emperor. I'm not exactly sure what repairing walls or spamming mutagen or PvPooring a dead buff campaign has anything to do with the discussion.
Reads the original post again. She did not deny that magicka DKs had good survivability or good sustained dps. Why even bother participating in a discussion if instead of engaging on the issues and points up for discussion if you are going to post videos against an entirely different form of opponent with an entirely different build?
OP: Because of the way the game has changed, magicka DKs now have several fundamental flaws that undermine the potential of the spec and make it susbtanard in comparison with the ohter classes.
You: No. *Posts videos of wrecking blow spam and exploiting AI mechanics*
Like, wut?Edited by Joy_Division on September 29, 2015 3:53PM3 -
Joy_Division wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »
What would some pve vid proof anyway? Of course I can solo some boss too as magicka dk. Noone denies that dk is good in pve. However this is a pvp forum and pve stuff is pretty irrelevant when it comes to pvp.AzubuFrosts wrote: »
[EDIT]ohh my bad, didnt see the part about the Stam DK being fine, ignore this as i dont know how to delete.DisgracefulMind wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »I soloed a sewer boss with dk after imperial city patch, I think they do finehttps://youtu.be/HhV7KyPY-y8
First off, that boss is bugged, you're not getting hit by most of his attacks. Second off, you're a stamina DK, and this thread has already established that stamina DK is fine, but it is magicka DK that is sitting in a tight spot.
how about this then? the whole arena must be bugged.https://youtu.be/wjnVokO4h-s
if you can take that many mobs u should do fine in pvp, if u need proof of pvp i can post solo scroll runs and 1vX for days when i get home, the point of the matter is people are complaining about neffs when i i see it as more of a balence, before dk's can 1vX for days, just because they made it harder to do that doesnt mean they neff the class to ***, just made it more balence, no one should be able to 1v5+ and come out on top if they all loged the same play time and champion ranks
If you honestly feel PvE experience is applicable to PvP, then you do not play experienced players.
Please watch your video again and examine how the flame atrnoachs were attacking you. Please watch what they gladiators do when they get taloned. Watched again how the Harvester was 100% incapable of even scratching you. Your video is a showcase on how to exploit AI mechanics, not on how strong a magicka DK is.
When magicka DKs fight opponents with a functional brain and a modicum of experience, then all the PvE DK tricks do not work: the will cleanse dots, they will use non-projectile attacks, they will actually cause damage and force DKs to rely on that terrible heal you have slotted, they will heal themselves and expose a DKs lack of burst, they will move away from the DK and expose their lack of mobility.
Yet on that video I'm clearly wearing emperor regalia that I've gotten from being crowned on another character, I've also held emperor for over 8 days, I've done my fair share of pve and pvp, I'm not stating that npc are the same as players I'm stating that your survivability and dps is relatively similar, it's not the class that gotta be changed its your play style
Congratulations on being an Emperor. I'm not exactly sure what repairing walls or spamming mutagen or PvPooring a dead buff campaign has anything to do with the discussion.
Reads the original post again. She did not deny that magicka DKs had good survivability or good sustained dps. Why even bother participating in a discussion if instead of engaging on the issues and points up for discussion if you are going to post videos against an entirely different form of opponent with an entirely different build?
OP: Because of the way the game has changed, magicka DKs now have several fundamental flaws that undermine the potential of the spec and make it susbtanard in comparison with the ohter classes.
You: No. *Posts videos of exploiting AI and WB spam*
Like, wut?
Please read above post, maybe change your specs0 -
Azarath_tiberius✭✭✭AzubuFrosts wrote: »See ur missiAzarath_tiberius wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »Yet on that video I'm clearly wearing emperor regalia that I've gotten from being crowned on another character, I've also held emperor for over 8 days
That proves nothing. Its just like what the NPCs say randomly when you pass them "anyone can be crowned emperor, thats the risks we take"..AzubuFrosts wrote: »I'm not stating that npc are the same as players I'm stating that your survivability and dps is relatively similar, it's not the class that gotta be changed its your play style
Again, wrong. Even if you cant find a difference between NPC and a player (...), players will still use different tactics / counters / skills etc etc. What you can do in PvE =/= what you can do in PvP.
Ur kinda missing my point, yes players can use different tactics, but so can you, there are mage npc and giant orges, just like using reflective skills to migrate the damage or using charge to interrupt their charge you would have to change your tactics depending on the mob or player, eso combat is extremely similar to real life combat on the fact that sometimes you have to decide to dodge it or block it or take the hit and heal it back with magicka in order to recover ur stamina pool or which abilities you would have to use to cancel out another. DKs were easily the highest dps, and debatablely one of the best tanks, I'm sorry that they don't have a have a gap close or finishing move, BUT then again you can morph molten weapon to deal more damage to low health targets, but yes DK don't have a spam to win skill, you can't smash a button to win, but they can easily out last most players.
TL;DR Change your play style cuz they probably aren't gonna change the game, thanks for not resorting to personal insult tho
Did you just tell me and @Joy_Division to l2p or something?? Like... wut?3 -
Azarath_tiberius wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »See ur missiAzarath_tiberius wrote: »AzubuFrosts wrote: »Yet on that video I'm clearly wearing emperor regalia that I've gotten from being crowned on another character, I've also held emperor for over 8 days
That proves nothing. Its just like what the NPCs say randomly when you pass them "anyone can be crowned emperor, thats the risks we take"..AzubuFrosts wrote: »I'm not stating that npc are the same as players I'm stating that your survivability and dps is relatively similar, it's not the class that gotta be changed its your play style
Again, wrong. Even if you cant find a difference between NPC and a player (...), players will still use different tactics / counters / skills etc etc. What you can do in PvE =/= what you can do in PvP.
Ur kinda missing my point, yes players can use different tactics, but so can you, there are mage npc and giant orges, just like using reflective skills to migrate the damage or using charge to interrupt their charge you would have to change your tactics depending on the mob or player, eso combat is extremely similar to real life combat on the fact that sometimes you have to decide to dodge it or block it or take the hit and heal it back with magicka in order to recover ur stamina pool or which abilities you would have to use to cancel out another. DKs were easily the highest dps, and debatablely one of the best tanks, I'm sorry that they don't have a have a gap close or finishing move, BUT then again you can morph molten weapon to deal more damage to low health targets, but yes DK don't have a spam to win skill, you can't smash a button to win, but they can easily out last most players.
TL;DR Change your play style cuz they probably aren't gonna change the game, thanks for not resorting to personal insult tho
Did you just tell me and @Joy_Division to l2p or something?? Like... wut?
No idea who u or that guy is, sorry0 -
Fruitdog✭✭✭✭Forget about fixing DKs, we need all the console players and PC players combined on one server!Edited by Fruitdog on September 29, 2015 3:59PM0 -
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