Everything you feared about stones is true... from their live broadcast...

alainjbrennanb16_ESO · July 2015

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

I have just seen and oddly jolly broadcast from ZOS in which they confirm that IC is basically a w... gankfest for griefers over PvE and proper PvP players... so good luck subscribers or crown paying PvE players ZOS are giggly like loons about you being ganked by griefers... not only that but if groups zerg individuals the group shares the stones... 20 vs 1 is their new sad meta...

This is so frelling sad I am shocked to watch them drool over it..

I had really hoped this would be player friendly but it isn't - this is all about feeding sad trolls...

I must watch the episode and see what you are talking about, i hope for god sake that was not the case they where laughing at the fact they are incourging ganking, that would be truely sad thing to do and avertise, (come and play eso and be ganked). The pvpers are rubbing ther hands at easy kills the pve players are cursing zos for putting pve content in a pvp zone. The pvpers are saying then stay out of a pvp zone, but what they forget is zos touted it not as a pvp zone but as a pve/pvp zone, eso already has a bad rep for ganking as it is, with solo players getting ganked by a full group when they are doing pve. Before the pvpers start i am a raid leader for pvp and one of the rules is if you see a solo player doing pve (which is quite clear) then they must be left alone. All i can see happening from this is if a solo player or a group of 4 are ganked by a full group they will shout to guild and gank back with an entire guild. I know zos will say this will not happen but when you have a pve guild after doing the content and one of there ranks keeps getting ganked they are going to get feed up and make the gankers lives in there hell, by remembering them and when they are in calling to the guild. Please zos for the sake of the players and the game say this is not how you feel and re-tracked the laughing from live

FooWasHere · July 2015

DDuke wrote: »

(...)

We don't even know how they have changed other gear sets in game (which have allegedly gone through a revamp).

(...)

Re sets: But we know that the level of the content (trials/arena/dungeons) will remain at VR12/13/14, which due to the new gear tier, will drop loot that's sub-par both in terms of set bonuses and enchantments. And that assuming that they even update the obsolete sets.

What @ZOS_RichLambert basically wrote reads as "the end-game is no longer for you" to many players. I PvP regularly, and I've got gold enough to buy all the gear that I ever could want, but both ZoS and you must understand why the IC in itself is a great and well deserved DLC, but in the context of update 7 leaves a lot of players feeling excluded/coerced. And that's not a good thing if one wants to provide enduring entertainment.

DDuke · July 2015

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

But as a PvP player I have severe doubts about this one single mechanic - that being hit by a single kill removes everything you may have done since entering the zone and rewards someone for scoring one single kill when they may have not one single thing I can loot when I turn the tables on them.

Like @ZOS_BrianWheeler mentioned yesterday on ESO Live - we'll be watching PTS closely, tracking the data and feedback. We'll test out a couple of different loss percentages and see what strikes the right balance.

You guys want this to sell right? As it is you arent going to sell very many of these and when the people who dont use the forums figure out what you have done there will be an uproar like you have never seen.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/196972/do-you-plan-on-getting-the-imperial-city-dlc/p1

Yeah right, they're not going to sell much...

With 99% confidence & 8.5% margin of error, 49% of player population will buy this DLC.

But hey, keep pounding your chest & making noise lol

DDuke · July 2015

FooWasHere wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

(...)

We don't even know how they have changed other gear sets in game (which have allegedly gone through a revamp).

(...)

Re sets: But we know that the level of the content (trials/arena/dungeons) will remain at VR12/13/14, which due to the new gear tier, will drop loot that's sub-par both in terms of set bonuses and enchantments. And that assuming that they even update the obsolete sets.

What @ZOS_RichLambert basically wrote reads as "the end-game is no longer for you" to many players. I PvP regularly, and I've got gold enough to buy all the gear that I ever could want, but both ZoS and you must understand why the IC in itself is a great and well deserved DLC, but in the context of update 7 leaves a lot of players feeling excluded/coerced. And that's not a good thing if one wants to provide enduring entertainment.

They said in last ESO Live that every dungeon will scale to V16, and that existing armour sets will be getting revamped.

I will have to assume that means they might actually become worth using, which they currently aren't (which you should know, if you're doing end game content in ESO).

Currently end game is all about leaderboards & bragging rights, the rewards suck.

That said, I do hope the two new group dungeons in Imperial City have good sets as well, and that they bring some quality raid content in next PvE DLC.

RustedValor · July 2015

newtinmpls wrote: »

RustedValor wrote: »

I think you strongly underestimate the size of the gaming community that loves making other players suffer lol.

I don't underestimate them.

I also don't want to game with them.

This is why I have been grateful for ZoS for mostly separating PvE and PvP.

I also think that there is an inherent flaw in designing a game that starts with pretty much all PvE then essentially switches to either PvP or endless repeats of the same PvE dungeon groups.

PvP players are sort of forced to PvE to get to what they really want

PvE players are given PvP as an endgame/reward and they never wanted it in the first place. I'd like to see more options for both (separately) along the way with choice.

Like opt in/opt out toggles with 1 week cooldowns on dueling, justice system and so on.

You don't have to play with them. This is a DLC, which means you don't pay for it if you don't want it. All i'm saying is, there is definatelly a large population of gamers who will buy the DLC as is and enjoy it. If the DLC flops, then they will simply adjust the system until it does. Its not gonna flop though because pretty much everyone is going to get it that plays the game regularly.

Attorneyatlawl · July 2015

RazzPitazz wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

But as a PvP player I have severe doubts about this one single mechanic - that being hit by a single kill removes everything you may have done since entering the zone and rewards someone for scoring one single kill when they may have not one single thing I can loot when I turn the tables on them.

Like @ZOS_BrianWheeler mentioned yesterday on ESO Live - we'll be watching PTS closely, tracking the data and feedback. We'll test out a couple of different loss percentages and see what strikes the right balance.

Can you sPeak real quick if PvErs will be able to obtain equivalent gear outside of IC? I think this is one of the major concerns at the moment.

Yep! All of it can be traded for by pve drops and gold.

Attorneyatlawl · July 2015

newtinmpls wrote: »

RustedValor wrote: »

I think you strongly underestimate the size of the gaming community that loves making other players suffer lol.

I don't underestimate them.

I also don't want to game with them.

This is why I have been grateful for ZoS for mostly separating PvE and PvP.

I also think that there is an inherent flaw in designing a game that starts with pretty much all PvE then essentially switches to either PvP or endless repeats of the same PvE dungeon groups.

PvP players are sort of forced to PvE to get to what they really want

PvE players are given PvP as an endgame/reward and they never wanted it in the first place. I'd like to see more options for both (separately) along the way with choice.

Like opt in/opt out toggles with 1 week cooldowns on dueling, justice system and so on.

It switches to what every mmo does when story content (essentially extended tutorials and lore) is over: dungeons, raids, and farming. In an RvR game like ESO, you also get the territory control and non instanced, persistent Alliance War and soon the Imperial City as a high risk, high reward area (furthered by running in smaller groups, duo, or solo by earning more but being more vulnerable, and how much you choose to carry before banking to benefit from the earnings multiplier when carrying larger amounts of stone currency). Orsinium will be along soon for more story, and probably a new trial if I were to speculate as well as an Arena like vDSA between the City through around (or as) Orsinium comes in.

TheBull · July 2015

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

Awesome Rich. A lot of us love the way things are or at least the way it seems they will play out. I'm in Cyrodiil all day. From multiple Teamspeaks to zone chat people love the idea.

Soulshine · July 2015

This thread has gone from bad to worse it seems.

This update is supposed to be the SO of PvP - for lack of another analogy... it is supposed to be a place where the stakes are higher, the rewards are better and not a place where the people who are comfortable just zergballing around Cyrodiil need play if they don't want to, anymore than people who hate PvP altogether.

It is supposed to be a place for a different kind of PvP experience. Arguing that the entire basis upon which that experience is grounded is some evil, sinister, deliberate plan by the devs to set up PvE players as food for the PvP crowd, because that is the only motivating factor that really matters to the people who want to play this expansion is just about the most ridiculous bunch of arguements I have ever heard on a game forum yet.

YES the level cap has increased a lowsy two numbers. SO what?!! By all accounts from ESO Live info, the XP rate increase coupled with needed amount to level descrease is going to allow you to get there in pretty much a few lousy hours of play without ever having setting foot in IC, doing everything people are currently doing anyway.

YES there is new gear to be found in IC. The costs of any of these items, their value and relevance to builds we still know utterly ZERO about. People are getting completely worked into a froth over this without any factual information.

Even if the gear turns out to be decent and desirable, what we DO know is that there ARE going to be other methods of getting stones besides PvP kills. Those stones no one can take from you. It is your CHOICE to try and earn them by any other means available no one is "forcing" anyone to do anything, but then like everyone else doing this you will have to deal with the consequences.

All the people up in arms about the TV system are demanding it be removed because they just don't want to deal with those consequences.

Well, there is a simpler way to achieve that: choose another path, and stop destroying the game for everyone else.

timidobserver · July 2015

I am pretty confused by all of the outrage.

The way I understand it, all of the gear that can be purchased with Telvar Stones can be traded, so you don't need to go even go in there or even buy the DLC to get the gear. Currently players are paying stupid amounts for Cyrodiil's Light, Ravager, and Morag Tong. So buying the new gear earned in PvP won't be a new concept. As far as I can discern from the information we have been given, the only thing in IC that you can't buy from other players is some of the Dungeon Gear, and you don't have to PvP extensively to do the new dungeons.

ThePonzzz · July 2015

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

I don't think the people who are offering constructive criticism before this goes live are misunderstanding the intent of the Imperial City. What you're seeing a lot of, even from PvP players, is the major concern of this new mechanic of loss. You're also hearing from a lot of subpar to mediocre players explain how death comes in Cyrodiil. This isn't about PvE players wanting it handed to them. I've been enjoying PvP and I come from over a year of PvE-only experience. This is a concern about the mechanics of 100% loss.

Arato · July 2015

Vote with your wallet, don't buy IC.

DDuke · July 2015

ThePonzzz wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

I don't think the people who are offering constructive criticism before this goes live are misunderstanding the intent of the Imperial City. What you're seeing a lot of, even from PvP players, is the major concern of this new mechanic of loss. You're also hearing from a lot of subpar to mediocre players explain how death comes in Cyrodiil. This isn't about PvE players wanting it handed to them. I've been enjoying PvP and I come from over a year of PvE-only experience. This is a concern about the mechanics of 100% loss.

You act as if this was applied to everywhere in PvP.

If you want risk free PvP, go elsewhere in Cyrodiil & let the people who enjoy different type of PvP enjoy it.

Problem solved.

Also, how can you claim the criticism is "constructive", when its aim is to destroy a mechanic that many consider fun?

Just in order to get more "zerg zerg, die (whatever), respawn, zerg zerg" PvP that you already have plenty of outside Imperial City.

To me, this doesn't sound like "constructive criticism", it sounds like destructive criticism.

newtinmpls · July 2015

RustedValor wrote: »

You don't have to play with them. This is a DLC, which means you don't pay for it if you don't want it. All i'm saying is, there is definatelly a large population of gamers who will buy the DLC as is and enjoy it. If the DLC flops, then they will simply adjust the system until it does. Its not gonna flop though because pretty much everyone is going to get it that plays the game regularly.

I sub. I'll get it - heck I'll get it twice (two accounts).

TheBull · July 2015

Soulshine wrote: »

This thread has gone from bad to worse it seems.

It is supposed to be a place for a different kind of PvP experience. Arguing that the entire basis upon which that experience is grounded is some evil, sinister, deliberate plan by the devs to set up PvE players as food for the PvP crowd, because that is the only motivating factor that really matters to the people who want to play this expansion is just about the most ridiculous bunch of arguements I have ever heard on a game forum yet.

Awesome post. It has not been said better.

DDuke wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

If you want risk free PvP, go elsewhere in Cyrodiil & let the people who enjoy different type of PvP enjoy it.

Problem solved.

Spot on.

ThePonzzz · July 2015

DDuke wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

I don't think the people who are offering constructive criticism before this goes live are misunderstanding the intent of the Imperial City. What you're seeing a lot of, even from PvP players, is the major concern of this new mechanic of loss. You're also hearing from a lot of subpar to mediocre players explain how death comes in Cyrodiil. This isn't about PvE players wanting it handed to them. I've been enjoying PvP and I come from over a year of PvE-only experience. This is a concern about the mechanics of 100% loss.

You act as if this was applied to everywhere in PvP.

If you want risk free PvP, go elsewhere in Cyrodiil & let the people who enjoy different type of PvP enjoy it.

Problem solved.

Also, how can you claim the criticism is "constructive", when its aim is to destroy a mechanic that many consider fun?

Just in order to get more "zerg zerg, die (whatever), respawn, zerg zerg" PvP that you already have plenty of outside Imperial City.

To me, this doesn't sound like "constructive criticism", it sounds like destructive criticism.

Come on now, don't be daft. You should know what constructive criticism means. Again, no one is saying to remove it. People are saying that 100% is too much. The developers need to play in the live instance, more than testing, to understand these issues.

Soulshine · July 2015

ThePonzzz wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

I don't think the people who are offering constructive criticism before this goes live are misunderstanding the intent of the Imperial City. What you're seeing a lot of, even from PvP players, is the major concern of this new mechanic of loss. You're also hearing from a lot of subpar to mediocre players explain how death comes in Cyrodiil. This isn't about PvE players wanting it handed to them. I've been enjoying PvP and I come from over a year of PvE-only experience. This is a concern about the mechanics of 100% loss.

You act as if this was applied to everywhere in PvP.

If you want risk free PvP, go elsewhere in Cyrodiil & let the people who enjoy different type of PvP enjoy it.

Problem solved.

Also, how can you claim the criticism is "constructive", when its aim is to destroy a mechanic that many consider fun?

Just in order to get more "zerg zerg, die (whatever), respawn, zerg zerg" PvP that you already have plenty of outside Imperial City.

To me, this doesn't sound like "constructive criticism", it sounds like destructive criticism.

Come on now, don't be daft. You should know what constructive criticism means. Again, no one is saying to remove it. People are saying that 100% is too much. The developers need to play in the live instance, more than testing, to understand these issues.

Since naming and shaming is against the CoC, I will not repost the number of comments in threads which are currently demanding this mechanic be done away with altogether, but there ARE plenty of people saying that. The developers HAVE already said that there will be further testing and adjusting to this percentage on PTS; was said within the very first few minutes of the ESO Live presentation. People need to calm the heck down and stop blowing everything out of proportion.

Soulharvester · July 2015

I like the idea of possibly losing something in pvp, should bring some excitement to the game!

Now if we could take everything? That would be even better!

ThePonzzz · July 2015

Soulshine wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

I don't think the people who are offering constructive criticism before this goes live are misunderstanding the intent of the Imperial City. What you're seeing a lot of, even from PvP players, is the major concern of this new mechanic of loss. You're also hearing from a lot of subpar to mediocre players explain how death comes in Cyrodiil. This isn't about PvE players wanting it handed to them. I've been enjoying PvP and I come from over a year of PvE-only experience. This is a concern about the mechanics of 100% loss.

You act as if this was applied to everywhere in PvP.

If you want risk free PvP, go elsewhere in Cyrodiil & let the people who enjoy different type of PvP enjoy it.

Problem solved.

Also, how can you claim the criticism is "constructive", when its aim is to destroy a mechanic that many consider fun?

Just in order to get more "zerg zerg, die (whatever), respawn, zerg zerg" PvP that you already have plenty of outside Imperial City.

To me, this doesn't sound like "constructive criticism", it sounds like destructive criticism.

Come on now, don't be daft. You should know what constructive criticism means. Again, no one is saying to remove it. People are saying that 100% is too much. The developers need to play in the live instance, more than testing, to understand these issues.

Since naming and shaming is against the CoC, I will not repost the number of comments in threads which are currently demanding this mechanic be done away with altogether, but there ARE plenty of people saying that. The developers HAVE already said that there will be further testing and adjusting to this percentage on PTS; was said within the very first few minutes of the ESO Live presentation. People need to calm the heck down and stop blowing everything out of proportion.

Again, that's part of the job that ZOS has to filter through. Finding people who are offering constructive criticism against those that are just demanding or might not really understand everything that goes into development. I know I'm definitely calm. I'm a mediocre PvP player, I'll likely be fine in the long run. Doesn't change me from wanting to express my concerns.

Soulshine · July 2015

ThePonzzz wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

I don't think the people who are offering constructive criticism before this goes live are misunderstanding the intent of the Imperial City. What you're seeing a lot of, even from PvP players, is the major concern of this new mechanic of loss. You're also hearing from a lot of subpar to mediocre players explain how death comes in Cyrodiil. This isn't about PvE players wanting it handed to them. I've been enjoying PvP and I come from over a year of PvE-only experience. This is a concern about the mechanics of 100% loss.

You act as if this was applied to everywhere in PvP.

If you want risk free PvP, go elsewhere in Cyrodiil & let the people who enjoy different type of PvP enjoy it.

Problem solved.

Also, how can you claim the criticism is "constructive", when its aim is to destroy a mechanic that many consider fun?

Just in order to get more "zerg zerg, die (whatever), respawn, zerg zerg" PvP that you already have plenty of outside Imperial City.

To me, this doesn't sound like "constructive criticism", it sounds like destructive criticism.

Come on now, don't be daft. You should know what constructive criticism means. Again, no one is saying to remove it. People are saying that 100% is too much. The developers need to play in the live instance, more than testing, to understand these issues.

Since naming and shaming is against the CoC, I will not repost the number of comments in threads which are currently demanding this mechanic be done away with altogether, but there ARE plenty of people saying that. The developers HAVE already said that there will be further testing and adjusting to this percentage on PTS; was said within the very first few minutes of the ESO Live presentation. People need to calm the heck down and stop blowing everything out of proportion.

Again, that's part of the job that ZOS has to filter through. Finding people who are offering constructive criticism against those that are just demanding or might not really understand everything that goes into development. I know I'm definitely calm. I'm a mediocre PvP player, I'll likely be fine in the long run. Doesn't change me from wanting to express my concerns.

I am aware of that. I responded to you because you stated "no one is saying to remove it." Clearly if anyone bothers to read what is flying around here last couple of days, that is not the case.

ThePonzzz · July 2015

Soulshine wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

I don't think the people who are offering constructive criticism before this goes live are misunderstanding the intent of the Imperial City. What you're seeing a lot of, even from PvP players, is the major concern of this new mechanic of loss. You're also hearing from a lot of subpar to mediocre players explain how death comes in Cyrodiil. This isn't about PvE players wanting it handed to them. I've been enjoying PvP and I come from over a year of PvE-only experience. This is a concern about the mechanics of 100% loss.

You act as if this was applied to everywhere in PvP.

If you want risk free PvP, go elsewhere in Cyrodiil & let the people who enjoy different type of PvP enjoy it.

Problem solved.

Also, how can you claim the criticism is "constructive", when its aim is to destroy a mechanic that many consider fun?

Just in order to get more "zerg zerg, die (whatever), respawn, zerg zerg" PvP that you already have plenty of outside Imperial City.

To me, this doesn't sound like "constructive criticism", it sounds like destructive criticism.

Come on now, don't be daft. You should know what constructive criticism means. Again, no one is saying to remove it. People are saying that 100% is too much. The developers need to play in the live instance, more than testing, to understand these issues.

Since naming and shaming is against the CoC, I will not repost the number of comments in threads which are currently demanding this mechanic be done away with altogether, but there ARE plenty of people saying that. The developers HAVE already said that there will be further testing and adjusting to this percentage on PTS; was said within the very first few minutes of the ESO Live presentation. People need to calm the heck down and stop blowing everything out of proportion.

Again, that's part of the job that ZOS has to filter through. Finding people who are offering constructive criticism against those that are just demanding or might not really understand everything that goes into development. I know I'm definitely calm. I'm a mediocre PvP player, I'll likely be fine in the long run. Doesn't change me from wanting to express my concerns.

I am aware of that. I responded to you because you stated "no one is saying to remove it." Clearly if anyone bothers to read what is flying around here last couple of days, that is not the case.

I typically skip over ragey posts. I haven't seen anyone really expressing it in a coherent manner that is saying to outright remove it.

Lava_Croft · July 2015

Waiting to invade Orsinium forum threads with requests for PvP in Orsinium DLC.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · July 2015

MsPtibiscuit wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

But as a PvP player I have severe doubts about this one single mechanic - that being hit by a single kill removes everything you may have done since entering the zone and rewards someone for scoring one single kill when they may have not one single thing I can loot when I turn the tables on them.

Like @ZOS_BrianWheeler mentioned yesterday on ESO Live - we'll be watching PTS closely, tracking the data and feedback. We'll test out a couple of different loss percentages and see what strikes the right balance.

The right balance is losing ZERO of your stones to players. If the PVP people want stones let them do like everyone else and EARN them instead of stealing them. You guys want this to sell right? As it is you arent going to sell very many of these and when the people who dont use the forums figure out what you have done there will be an uproar like you have never seen.

Just bewilders me why you guys dont learn from the history of other games that player looting is a huge no-no. I guess you will be forced to learn the hard way. When you lose even more of the players one of these days you guys will start listening to us.

So, basically, because we shouldn't force PvP content to PvE players, we should lose 0 stones when we die so that PvP players are forced to do PvE content to get stones.

Yes exactly. You want stones then go get them. Nothing is stopping you.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · July 2015

DDuke wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

But as a PvP player I have severe doubts about this one single mechanic - that being hit by a single kill removes everything you may have done since entering the zone and rewards someone for scoring one single kill when they may have not one single thing I can loot when I turn the tables on them.

Like @ZOS_BrianWheeler mentioned yesterday on ESO Live - we'll be watching PTS closely, tracking the data and feedback. We'll test out a couple of different loss percentages and see what strikes the right balance.

You guys want this to sell right? As it is you arent going to sell very many of these and when the people who dont use the forums figure out what you have done there will be an uproar like you have never seen.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/196972/do-you-plan-on-getting-the-imperial-city-dlc/p1

Yeah right, they're not going to sell much...

With 99% confidence & 8.5% margin of error, 49% of player population will buy this DLC.

But hey, keep pounding your chest & making noise lol

Did you pay attention to the numbers? Fact is 99% of the players never use these forums. These forums are basically all one demographic. Its why companies should get their feedback from more than just the small amount who use these forums.

That poll has less than 500 total votes.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · July 2015

I have a question. Is the pvp crowd saying they cannot pvp unless they can loot other players? Because everyone keeps saying its a pvp expansion. Yet unless they can gank newbies and loot them it isnt really pvp?

Pallmor · July 2015

I will at least applaud ZOS for their honesty in admitting that there is no reason for PvE players to buy this expansion. Will do like they said and wait for Orsinium.

Samadhi · July 2015

ThePonzzz wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

I don't think the people who are offering constructive criticism before this goes live are misunderstanding the intent of the Imperial City. What you're seeing a lot of, even from PvP players, is the major concern of this new mechanic of loss. You're also hearing from a lot of subpar to mediocre players explain how death comes in Cyrodiil. This isn't about PvE players wanting it handed to them. I've been enjoying PvP and I come from over a year of PvE-only experience. This is a concern about the mechanics of 100% loss.

You act as if this was applied to everywhere in PvP.

If you want risk free PvP, go elsewhere in Cyrodiil & let the people who enjoy different type of PvP enjoy it.

Problem solved.

Also, how can you claim the criticism is "constructive", when its aim is to destroy a mechanic that many consider fun?

Just in order to get more "zerg zerg, die (whatever), respawn, zerg zerg" PvP that you already have plenty of outside Imperial City.

To me, this doesn't sound like "constructive criticism", it sounds like destructive criticism.

Come on now, don't be daft. You should know what constructive criticism means. Again, no one is saying to remove it. People are saying that 100% is too much. The developers need to play in the live instance, more than testing, to understand these issues.

Why is it somehow appropriate to say that 100% is too much before the system is tested,
But that saying 100% could be the right value before the system is tested seems ludicrous?

100% is the only value that makes this zone really unique -- it's the closest ZOS will come to a full-loot PvP system.
A system that many serious PvPers have been asking for since launch.

Having multiple options for different styles of PvP is exactly what ESO needs right now.

Attorneyatlawl · July 2015

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

But as a PvP player I have severe doubts about this one single mechanic - that being hit by a single kill removes everything you may have done since entering the zone and rewards someone for scoring one single kill when they may have not one single thing I can loot when I turn the tables on them.

Like @ZOS_BrianWheeler mentioned yesterday on ESO Live - we'll be watching PTS closely, tracking the data and feedback. We'll test out a couple of different loss percentages and see what strikes the right balance.

You guys want this to sell right? As it is you arent going to sell very many of these and when the people who dont use the forums figure out what you have done there will be an uproar like you have never seen.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/196972/do-you-plan-on-getting-the-imperial-city-dlc/p1

Yeah right, they're not going to sell much...

With 99% confidence & 8.5% margin of error, 49% of player population will buy this DLC.

But hey, keep pounding your chest & making noise lol

Did you pay attention to the numbers? Fact is 99% of the players never use these forums. These forums are basically all one demographic. Its why companies should get their feedback from more than just the small amount who use these forums.

That poll has less than 500 total votes.

It's called a "statistically significant sample size" that is able to get a "confidence" rating. This confidence determines the margin of error. You don't need to survey 80% of people from every place they exist to get a relevant and accurate cross-section of data. @DDuke is completely correct as to what this data means.

DDuke · July 2015

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

But as a PvP player I have severe doubts about this one single mechanic - that being hit by a single kill removes everything you may have done since entering the zone and rewards someone for scoring one single kill when they may have not one single thing I can loot when I turn the tables on them.

Like @ZOS_BrianWheeler mentioned yesterday on ESO Live - we'll be watching PTS closely, tracking the data and feedback. We'll test out a couple of different loss percentages and see what strikes the right balance.

You guys want this to sell right? As it is you arent going to sell very many of these and when the people who dont use the forums figure out what you have done there will be an uproar like you have never seen.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/196972/do-you-plan-on-getting-the-imperial-city-dlc/p1

Yeah right, they're not going to sell much...

With 99% confidence & 8.5% margin of error, 49% of player population will buy this DLC.

But hey, keep pounding your chest & making noise lol

Did you pay attention to the numbers? Fact is 99% of the players never use these forums. These forums are basically all one demographic. Its why companies should get their feedback from more than just the small amount who use these forums.

That poll has less than 500 total votes.

Most people don't vote on electoral polls either, but the interesting thing is that you can determine public opinion even with a small sample size. This is called margin of error.
Please take a moment and educate yourself.

With only 257 votes we can already determine the real number is between 40% & 56%.

EQBallzz · July 2015

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

EQBallzz wrote: »

MsPtibiscuit wrote: »

I can't believe are really complaining about a system like that. This is the first time ESO devs try to do something different than the typical themepark content, and people, without even trying the system, are already unhappy.

You guys really need to get out of this "progression" mentality. Stop thinking that you have to have 62 stones by the end of the evening, and if you can't achieve that, then it is the fault of the game or bad gamedesign.
Just play the game as it is, enjoy victories, learn from defeats. Even if you lose some stones along the way, the frustration will make the next victory sweeter.

People often forget that while full-loot PvP (The way stone works is similar to that) lets jerks play like jerks, it also lets white knights play like white knights. If you don't like the gankers, go form a group and patrol the area to protect the members of your faction.
That's what happened in BDO where a player pacified a region where spawn-killers were active. It's the kind of *** you can't do without spawn-killers in the first place.

Had to give you an awesome for that. You almost paint a positive picture of what Imperial "ganker" City could be and then I remembered human nature and more specifically...human pvp'er nature. Nope. Not gonna happen!

I think its cute people believe that everyone will play fair and people will defend the players who arent as good at pvp. Fact is like every game thats tried this it will end in disaster.

It's also flawed thinking that someone bad at PvP who gets their stones taken away will be able to just "form a group and patrol the area" for great justice. People who are bad at PvP are not going to make very good gank patrols are they? They also likely don't run with other people who are great at PvP. Their gear and skills are not set up to PvP. That advice might be valid for people who like and/or are good at PvP but then they don't need convincing to participate in the PvP system do they?