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Templar Skills Bugged/made useless - IGNORED

  • Saeryne
    Saeryne
    Soul Shriven
    Whilst I have done my best to catch up on this large thread.. I am a returning Beta player (never actually bought the game when it came out...)

    Will be playing June 9 when re-released and Templar would be my first pick... is this a good idea or should I go somewhere else? Is it still THAT bad? Bare in mind I will not be pvping.

    Thanks.
  • SeptimusDova
    SeptimusDova
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yolokin Swagonborn

    Correct chaining EC-WB-EC-WB-EC gives no CC until the application of the second WB...

    Now that I am rested I will make a series of video shorts

    on will be the single channel Barky bitey jabs/ Puncturing Sleeps CC bug.

    The other will be the EC-WB-EC-WB-EC combo that only has cc on the second wrecking blow.

    I noticed that both EC and TC still put you through the target. And a quick way to turn around is Reverse slice/executioner.

    and now that the Khajiit is out of the bag on the EC-WB-EC-WB-EC thingamabob. Watch Zeninerf push a hotfix like Spellscar into the game . They taketh away but they addith not.

    and i will see if vampires bane is slower than reflective disco lights.
    Edited by SeptimusDova on May 24, 2015 4:34PM
    Templar Operators Union #420
    Call to Strike
    No more in game heals anywhere except for self.
    Stand now or get buried Later

    You can find me on Star Citizen aka SneakyPete

    Youtube SneakyPete's Racing

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p1

    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Nightblade retired
    VR3 DK retired
    VR3 Sorc retired
  • glak
    glak
    ✭✭✭
    Saeryne wrote: »
    Whilst I have done my best to catch up on this large thread.. I am a returning Beta player (never actually bought the game when it came out...)

    Will be playing June 9 when re-released and Templar would be my first pick... is this a good idea or should I go somewhere else? Is it still THAT bad? Bare in mind I will not be pvping.

    Thanks.
    If you're healing, it's slightly better than DK and NB for pugs.

    If you're stamina DPS, you'll be OK in PvE but not competitive.

    Our ability to tank was reduced to give us a magicka execute.

    Magicka DPS lags behind Stamina DPS because of a disparity between armor sets, destro staff DPS lost all the weapon damage buffs, and light armor is much squishier now.
  • CPT_CAPSLOCK
    CPT_CAPSLOCK
    ✭✭✭
    Heres another annoying hp bug, i am losing ~3k hp when i cast cleansing ritual while blocking (150524-000761)


    and pls fix that eclipse bug -.-
    Edited by CPT_CAPSLOCK on May 24, 2015 5:26PM
  • david.haypreub18_ESO
    david.haypreub18_ESO
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    nagarjunna wrote: »
    Also do remember not to shoot the Messenger. Gina and the others who have been answering us are in a very difficult position and whilst we might get really frustrated with what they are saying there is very little point in shooting them... much as we might like to! :)

    I do feel badly for Gina and Gary. In fact, I feel badly for lead combat designer Eric as well. All of these people just assumed the Global Cool Down on charge was a bug. But in the end, they were overruled by someone deep in the bowels of ZOS who simply refuses to let it go, and will not explain to anyone why.

    At least Gina, Gary, and Eric tried to give some answers. It's not their fault... but someone at ZOS needs to step up and explain why the Templar charge needs a GCD if no other charges in the game need one.
    Templars are 'just slower... by design'
    Yes, Gina actually said that (at least regarding Rushed Ceremony) right here:
    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p24
    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Sorcerer
    38 Nightblade
    24 DK
  • Bouvin
    Bouvin
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Nightblades have been waiting over a year for fixes.

    Instead what we got were usefull skills replaced with crap.. but no fixes.

    Don't expect your templar to be fixed any time soon....
  • SeptimusDova
    SeptimusDova
    ✭✭✭✭✭


    This is the Expletive Charge and Home Wrecker Blow Chain

    The music is the number one Hit Khajiit Song in all of Nirn
    Edited by SeptimusDova on May 24, 2015 8:58PM
    Templar Operators Union #420
    Call to Strike
    No more in game heals anywhere except for self.
    Stand now or get buried Later

    You can find me on Star Citizen aka SneakyPete

    Youtube SneakyPete's Racing

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p1

    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Nightblade retired
    VR3 DK retired
    VR3 Sorc retired
  • Yolokin_Swagonborn
    Yolokin_Swagonborn
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭


    This is the Expletive Charge and Home Wrecker Blow Chain

    The music is the number one Hit Khajiit Song in all of Nirn

    Have you run any permutations or controls on that setup?
    • Does two home wrecking blows without the expletive charge between them always grant immunity on the first blow?
    • What about just starting with WB>EC>WB?
    • Does it need that first EC to remove the CC of WB?
    • Does this work for any other CC ability? Can I EC>CC>EC>CC again or CC>EC>CC again?

    This doesn't seem to be what we were initially looking for but its quite interesting.
    everyone is running this set it seems if everyone is running it you know it has to be op
    - Jake1576
    The difference between a "Chapter" and a DLC

    The Root of All Problems (and nerfs) in this game.

    PVP catch and release program

    Historical Agree/LOL Ratio: 1.92 Why are the LOLs gone?!?!
  • SeptimusDova
    SeptimusDova
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yolokin It wasn't what I was looking for either. It is very difficult to get a single channel bitey jabby thing to CC two peeps in a group at the same time. But multiple channels can be cast fairly rapidly. and you end up cc the whole damn bunch.

    I did try two WB back to back the second one gives a CC. EC I think does to. I will try again and nail down all possible EC-wb combinations. As we can see from the video ec-wb-ec-wb-ec the cc is on the last wb. EC by itself in a single use has no CC and it appears WB does not either. I will look at this now ok WB-WB the second one does a CC

    EC-EC-EC-EC-EC no CC so EC has no CC

    WB cc's only on the second blow.. Actually you can get two in before the first WB-CC kicks in

    WB-EC no cc

    EC-WB then a CC after a delay will confirm this now...

    If the first blow of WB has a CC it is delayed in application and the hysteresis of such is enough to sneak in another ec-wb before the first cc is applied.

    OK final confirmation WB does have a CC a one second or more delayed CC. thats enough time to sneak in an EC -WB-EC-WB as seen in the video.

    If you back off of the target as soon as it gets on its,feet,paws, hooves the CC begins engage. If you beat it you interrupt it.

    Edited by SeptimusDova on May 25, 2015 12:54AM
    Templar Operators Union #420
    Call to Strike
    No more in game heals anywhere except for self.
    Stand now or get buried Later

    You can find me on Star Citizen aka SneakyPete

    Youtube SneakyPete's Racing

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p1

    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Nightblade retired
    VR3 DK retired
    VR3 Sorc retired
  • Soris
    Soris
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Heres another annoying hp bug, i am losing ~3k hp when i cast cleansing ritual while blocking (150524-000761)


    and pls fix that eclipse bug -.-
    o_0 What happened here? Did you lose emperor buff?
    I tried but couldn't reproduce
    Edited by Soris on May 25, 2015 1:22AM
    Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]
  • Yolokin_Swagonborn
    Yolokin_Swagonborn
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    WB-EC no cc

    EC-WB then a CC after a delay will confirm this now..
    So you can animation cancel a CC on an enemy if you use EC quickly after WB? But if you just WB once and wait till they get up, it gives immunity. I wonder what other skills can interrupt an CC like that. Is EC unique? We risk getting off topic talking about this since it doesn't really tell us much about the cooldown on Toppling charge or any of the other templar bugs but it is interesting.
    everyone is running this set it seems if everyone is running it you know it has to be op
    - Jake1576
    The difference between a "Chapter" and a DLC

    The Root of All Problems (and nerfs) in this game.

    PVP catch and release program

    Historical Agree/LOL Ratio: 1.92 Why are the LOLs gone?!?!
  • SeptimusDova
    SeptimusDova
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    That is what is puzzling me as Focused charge morphs into either Toppling Delay Charge or Explosive Vomit Charge. Yet only EC does this TC does not. EC has a different Animation than TC. So it leads me to believe that the TC animation is where the bug lies in TC.

    Your question #1 Im not sure its animation cancelling. But something is happening when EC is applied after Rectum Blow.And in that time delay while the target is on the ground you can EC them and then apply another Wrecking blow. If you look at the last wrecking blow in the video it looks like two cc's are stacked. Which may mean that EC is delaying the effects of the first WB.

    Answer to your second question -Yes-

    EC only stuns or interrupts if the enemy is casting . Could the CC be a Counter spell and EC is interrupting the spell?

    The animation code of TC seems to have a pause in it that is not present with EC I haven't used FC (Focused charge for a long time but if it does not have the TC induced delay then it goes to show that TC was deliberately singled out. In which case it is not a bug but a deliberate action by Zenimax to cripple this one skill.

    Either way neither of these two anomaly in the Focused Charge skill line should exist.


    And that delay in Because of Lag almost got us all killed in a group delve today. In such anticipation that we must have. We need 10,000,000 Magic points so we can spam BOL in a raid,Dungeon , trial and so on. You know because we are anticipating something.

    Templar Operators Union #420
    Call to Strike
    No more in game heals anywhere except for self.
    Stand now or get buried Later

    You can find me on Star Citizen aka SneakyPete

    Youtube SneakyPete's Racing

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p1

    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Nightblade retired
    VR3 DK retired
    VR3 Sorc retired
  • Soris
    Soris
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    LMAO that facepalm man.. :D So much true. They definitely should swap this with ingame description.
    Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]
  • SeptimusDova
    SeptimusDova
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    That is an Instant Classic.. We should all get that to be our avatar :)
    Templar Operators Union #420
    Call to Strike
    No more in game heals anywhere except for self.
    Stand now or get buried Later

    You can find me on Star Citizen aka SneakyPete

    Youtube SneakyPete's Racing

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p1

    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Nightblade retired
    VR3 DK retired
    VR3 Sorc retired
  • nagarjunna
    nagarjunna
    ✭✭✭✭

    Mbgru5t.png

    Perfect!
    @nagarjunna- PC / NA / AD / DC
    Zazarakel - Max CP Magicka Templar
    Tartys - Max CP Stamina Nightblade
    Temelechus - Max CP Magicka Sorcerer
    Assaku - Max CP Stamina DragonKnight
    Truthforge - Sub 50 Stamina Templar
    Yang Wudi Sub 50 Stamina Sorceror [DC]
    Shou Chung Sub 50 Magicka DragonKnight
    Chen Tuan Sun 50 Magicka Nightblade
  • Saeryne
    Saeryne
    Soul Shriven
    glak wrote: »
    Saeryne wrote: »
    Whilst I have done my best to catch up on this large thread.. I am a returning Beta player (never actually bought the game when it came out...)

    Will be playing June 9 when re-released and Templar would be my first pick... is this a good idea or should I go somewhere else? Is it still THAT bad? Bare in mind I will not be pvping.

    Thanks.
    If you're healing, it's slightly better than DK and NB for pugs.

    If you're stamina DPS, you'll be OK in PvE but not competitive.

    Our ability to tank was reduced to give us a magicka execute.

    Magicka DPS lags behind Stamina DPS because of a disparity between armor sets, destro staff DPS lost all the weapon damage buffs, and light armor is much squishier now.

    Thank you for the heads up!
  • cazlonb16_ESO
    cazlonb16_ESO
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    WB-EC no cc

    EC-WB then a CC after a delay will confirm this now..
    So you can animation cancel a CC on an enemy if you use EC quickly after WB? But if you just WB once and wait till they get up, it gives immunity. I wonder what other skills can interrupt an CC like that. Is EC unique? We risk getting off topic talking about this since it doesn't really tell us much about the cooldown on Toppling charge or any of the other templar bugs but it is interesting.

    Has little to do with specific Templar skills but is a "perk" of the broken CC immunity system we all have to come to love so much. Immunity kicks in only after the hard CC effect ends and before that you can use another hard CC effect for good measure. To make matters more confusing it doesn't work that way for all hard CC, just some, like the infamous Wrecking Blow ( like it needed any more help ).

    What parts of this mess are working as intended, who knows.
    Edited by cazlonb16_ESO on May 25, 2015 8:32AM
  • Saft
    Saft
    ✭✭✭
    nagarjunna wrote: »

    Mbgru5t.png

    Perfect!

    Agree, thats sum up skill well, and why developers put a delay on this "instant" ability.

  • SeptimusDova
    SeptimusDova
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Doing EC or TC you get some weird pathing. Instead of charging across a water puddle I sometimes get put on the scenic route. I am waiting for it to put me in a wall.
    Templar Operators Union #420
    Call to Strike
    No more in game heals anywhere except for self.
    Stand now or get buried Later

    You can find me on Star Citizen aka SneakyPete

    Youtube SneakyPete's Racing

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p1

    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Nightblade retired
    VR3 DK retired
    VR3 Sorc retired
  • CPT_CAPSLOCK
    CPT_CAPSLOCK
    ✭✭✭
    Soris wrote: »
    Heres another annoying hp bug, i am losing ~3k hp when i cast cleansing ritual while blocking (150524-000761)


    and pls fix that eclipse bug -.-
    o_0 What happened here? Did you lose emperor buff?
    I tried but couldn't reproduce
    Nope it is a real bug not just some overlooked buff, it happened to me a lot, but I can not reproduce it at any time.
    The amount of health i am losing is similar to the imperial %hp passive, maybe it has something to do with it.
  • Estelee
    Estelee
    ✭✭
    @Arezius I totally understand what you're saying. Agree with most of it too. Templars with no passive regains in trees only have this skill for extra stam regen. Unfortunately if you're stam build its not effective. Also focused rune gives back tons of mp and gives a huge armour buff. Which is what I use on my magicka build for full sustain. Which is an OP Skill ( even though it does nothing to cover the massive problems with the class )

    @Anhedonie <-- +1, or +2 even.

    Backlash//Morphs the 1 second lockout this skill makes it useful. The damage cap was already to small but this makes it more useless than it already was. Please make viable in dps rotations or just replace it with a useful skill.


    P.S WTB > Aoe cc
    Edited by Estelee on May 26, 2015 4:18AM
    Peace to you Friends.
  • Natjur
    Natjur
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Since theses bugs have been around for so long, its almost like the game engine was never designed to handle all this and they can't fix it.
  • glak
    glak
    ✭✭✭
    Natjur wrote: »
    Since theses bugs have been around for so long, its almost like the game engine was never designed to handle all this and they can't fix it.
    At least not designed to be maintainable for the inverse of DK, which is Templar.
    All things DK came first. They tried to make everything DK work the opposite way in the Templar. Because of the healing tree causing a lot of QQ, Templar was bound to become average in every way with no decent specialization (essentially a lesser paladin).

    DK => Templar
    PB fire / pull / ult leap => projectile / Magicka leap
    self reflect => hard CC reflect
    shield self => shield other
    heal other / cleanse / buff self => self heal / buff other
  • Kas
    Kas
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Cinbri wrote: »
    Back to bugs - Eclipse still can cause hp desync.

    Eclipse is the weirdest skill ever. It works as it should but causes all sorts of strange thing to happen when combined with other skills.

    For instance DK's getting super speed while eclipsed and using talons, or if you have eclipse on you, then use a channeled skill (like RD) you will often get locked out of your entire skill bar for 30 seconds.

    2x escape after eclipse-RD gets me back to usabale skills without waiting 30sec
    Edited by Kas on May 26, 2015 8:31PM
    @bbu - AD/EU
    Kasiia - Templar (AR46)
    Kasiir Aberion - Sorc (AR38)
    Dr Kastafari - Warden (~AR31)
    + many others
  • david.haypreub18_ESO
    david.haypreub18_ESO
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Estelee wrote: »

    P.S WTB > Aoe cc

    Exactamundo!

    Templars are 'just slower... by design'
    Yes, Gina actually said that (at least regarding Rushed Ceremony) right here:
    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p24
    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Sorcerer
    38 Nightblade
    24 DK
  • imperial
    imperial
    I use more weapon skills these days than templar skills, kind of makes me sad
  • CPT_CAPSLOCK
    CPT_CAPSLOCK
    ✭✭✭
    As promised, below is an update for some of the issues called out in this thread. Note that we tried to focus on what sounded like potential bugs, and not necessarily all of the ability feedback (though we did pass it along!)

    • Puncturing Strikes grants a CC immunity to every target it hits, regardless if they are hit by the knockback.
      • We looked into this, and found that the only player who gains CC immunity is the closest person who gets hit by the knockback. If you’re seeing otherwise, please pass along some additional information (exact repro steps, videos, etc.)
    This happens if the closest target already has CC immunity

    // thought about making a vid about it, but i dont think it is needed
    Edited by CPT_CAPSLOCK on May 26, 2015 3:33PM
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