Do You Want Progressive Raiding in ESO?

Impiouz

No, I don't believe this type of content has a place in the Elder Scrolls Universe.

DDuke wrote: »

Impiouz wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Impiouz wrote: »

Progressive Raiding would be a death sentence for this game.
It just takes way too long to develop and balance and with every new raid the old content becomes worthless...

Best example for this would be WOW! It took them like 10 years to implement some kind of housing because all their resources go into creating new raid tiers.

I would prefer the ESO devs to create content that stays relevant even after the next patch, unlike progressive raid content!!!!

I agree, the best example would be WoW, the most played MMO out there.

Congratulations, you just made a fool out of yourself.

Well, first.. most bought or most played does not necessarily mean BEST!

and second that horribly boring new xpac = new raid, throw away old gear WoW scheme just does not fit into an Elder Scrolls game, in my foolish opinion

WoW in the end is little more than a glorified Diablostyle gear grinder...why don"t you go play it if you like that kind of game so much !

Oh I would go play it, if people didn't have 7+ years in experience & achievements over me at this point, and if casual gamers hadn't ruined it in the past few expansions.

Do tell me when there's another game geared towards gamers (like vanilla WoW was), instead of credit card warriors who like pretending to be one.

I'll leave you simple folk with your "Skyrim with friends" hack&slash gameplay & casual quest adventures, and do something that actually requires skill & intelligence.

LOL you are telling me WoW PVE requires intelligence ?
Just go play that game and leave us alone

DDuke

Yes, I think progressive raiding would be good for the longevity of the game.

Impiouz wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Impiouz wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Impiouz wrote: »

Progressive Raiding would be a death sentence for this game.
It just takes way too long to develop and balance and with every new raid the old content becomes worthless...

Best example for this would be WOW! It took them like 10 years to implement some kind of housing because all their resources go into creating new raid tiers.

I would prefer the ESO devs to create content that stays relevant even after the next patch, unlike progressive raid content!!!!

I agree, the best example would be WoW, the most played MMO out there.

Congratulations, you just made a fool out of yourself.

Well, first.. most bought or most played does not necessarily mean BEST!

and second that horribly boring new xpac = new raid, throw away old gear WoW scheme just does not fit into an Elder Scrolls game, in my foolish opinion

WoW in the end is little more than a glorified Diablostyle gear grinder...why don"t you go play it if you like that kind of game so much !

Oh I would go play it, if people didn't have 7+ years in experience & achievements over me at this point, and if casual gamers hadn't ruined it in the past few expansions.

Do tell me when there's another game geared towards gamers (like vanilla WoW was), instead of credit card warriors who like pretending to be one.

I'll leave you simple folk with your "Skyrim with friends" hack&slash gameplay & casual quest adventures, and do something that actually requires skill & intelligence.

LOL you are telling me WoW PVE requires intelligence ?
Just go play that game and leave us alone

Can't speak for the current WoW (Mythic raiding is supposed to be still difficult), but I can tell you vanilla Molten Core & BWL required a lot of planning, good players & good execution.
You had to actually CC adds & keep them CC'ed, you had to kite mobs, different classes had different roles etc.
It took first guild 5 months to clear MC.

kieso

No, I don't believe this type of content has a place in the Elder Scrolls Universe.

progressive raiding would be a massive nail on the coffin for this game.

DDuke

Yes, I think progressive raiding would be good for the longevity of the game.

kieso wrote: »

progressive raiding would be a massive nail on the coffin for this game.

That coffin has already been buried for a while.

Did you miss the B2P announcement, how we're not getting content until late 2015, and how that content will be for people who want "Skyrim with friends"?

Khivas_Carrick

Yes, I think progressive raiding would be good for the longevity of the game.

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

LOL, I couldn't disagree more with the OP. This type of content only encourages snobby guild culture and the enrage timers create a mandate for cookie cutter min-max FOTM builds.

So.... No, just NO.

And Trials doesn't do this now? FotM happens no matter what you do, same with Cookie Cutters. What changes/determines to what degree they control things is the game itself; How encounters are designed, how classes are made, etc.

A DK and NB can reach the same DPS in 5 different ways each if they wanted to (5 might be give-or-take number) for instance, and just like that cookie cutters are out the window. Make fights about either dire survivability or evasion, or tanking, whichever, you can't fully avoid FotM builds but you can limit them, which ZoS has kinda sort not done so far lol.

Khivas_Carrick

Yes, I think progressive raiding would be good for the longevity of the game.

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

hiyde wrote: »

Krinaman wrote: »

I don't care if they add such content so long as you aren't forced to do it to get the best gear in the game. Of course, without such rewards you won't get a group to do it so effectively I am voting against them.

Well, why do you need the best gear in the game if you aren't running the content that requires it? It's the best gear in the game for raiding. If you don't raid, then you aren't negatively impacted.

Totally disagree. This is like saying "Why do you need a titanium/platinum/unobtainium putter like Tiger Woods if you're never going to play in the Masters?"

I want the best gear because I want my toon to be the best sorcerer she can be. I don't want to go through life wondering "Man, if only she had that extra 4% spell crit from Wise Mage..." What difference does it make what dungeons she uses it for?

Tiger Woods doesn't care if you use the same putter he does, so why should anyone else care what gear my toon has?

Then go get that gear.

I don't see the issue, as long as good gear can be achieved by doing other content as well (e.g. PvP). As long as it requires equal amount of effort & skill.

If you don't want to go through the effort & time other players go through to get that gear... well, tough luck.
What makes you better & entitled to get that gear right away?

I'm not talking about PVP gear, which I have no major problem with. At any rate, effort and skill have NOTHING to do with acquiring the best PVE gear... I've seen the videos on YouTube. A bunch of guys standing around in robes clicking Crushing Shock for 20 minutes while a healer heals them and a tank distracts the boss.

The other day I solo'd Volenfell with VR12 scaled mobs... you think that s--t is easy? Sure it would be easy with 4 guys, but solo it takes some practice. And all I got was a bunch of foul hides and a POS item from the bosses that wasn't even a decent set piece.

Don't even TRY to tell me this has anything to do with "effort and skill" when we all know what endgame raiding is all about:

1) Kissing some strangers' a-sses so they let you join their little club.

2) Installing 3rd party software like Teamspeak so some jerk can scream in your ear.

3) Chugging 10K worth of Tri-pots that you probably bought with gold from a Chinese gold farmer. And on and on...

You really had a bad experience in the past huh? Wanna talk about it?

Because it might help remove the stick from your ass and enlighten you that there is a hell of a lot more to raiding then that ***.

Khivas_Carrick

Yes, I think progressive raiding would be good for the longevity of the game.

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

hiyde wrote: »

@Emma_Eunjung‌ by "required", I meant that it would be unfair if you weren't able to effectively do the things you like in game (such as solo PvE or PvP) unless you completed content you don't want to play (such as raids).

There's NO content in the game I don't want to play. I would love to complete Trials, DSA and everything else. However, there are certain game design flaws and certain ridiculously OP boss mechanics that make it impossible for a solo player or even a 2-3 man group to complete certain content. Those Trials where you have to have 12 guys standing on teleport pads at the same time are an example. There are even outdoor quests in Craglorn that require 4 guys just to pull a lever or something. That's just nuts.

And again you just don't get it. Trials was designed specifically for 12 people, to be group content, not something only a few could go.

I will give you Craglorn though, that annoys me. It should've been done as a solo zone, that way people can go out and do what they want when they wanted and not be bogged down with having to find people and other such *** like that.

KhajitFurTrader

I'm not sure. I think that...

In other games, there were times when I could enjoy prog raiding tremendously. Part of this was because the content in question was engaging, diverse, interesting, and challenging in just the right amounts.

Another part of my enjoyment were the people I raided with, and I consider myself lucky to have met them. The group's chemistry determines whether continuos wiping during a prog night becomes a frustrating experience or not. Likewise, it will determine whether the boredom during farm nights gets deadly or not. If both the group and each individual are in harmony about tactical approach, execution, performance, and will to succeed, raiding can belong to the best experiences an MMO has to offer.

That being said, I'd welcome the eventual addition of a progress raid to ESO. Right now, I don't see it as a high priority, and ESO surly has its own strengths, even without one. ZOS should build on these strengths first and foremost, rather than ticking off the check list of "things other MMOs do". Besides, for me to take up raiding again and spent any serious amount of time at it, both conditions I mentioned above need to be fulfilled -- ZOS can only ever be responsible for one of them.

TipsyDrow

No, I don't believe this type of content has a place in the Elder Scrolls Universe.

Nope, I don't believe progressive raiding adds much to ANY MMO to be honest. Only a few people out of the entire population actually go through this type of end game stuff. they are quite vocal but always the minority in comparison to over all game population. Now having said that. Putting in *fun* end game roup content is entirely different. Not encounters that take 5 hours to clear but maybe an hour or so with 6-8 people would be great.

Aevric

Count on any raid zones being DLC. That'll weed out a lot of people to raid with, as most of the people praising the new B2P model have absolutely no intention of spending any money whatsoever.

SIN-X

Yes, I think progressive raiding would be good for the longevity of the game.

Mondo wrote: »

It might be a MMO but it is not like others and it should not be like others

Not like others? will be like most f2p/b2p so yea it is like others...
even more so when players understand what Zos means by "we have no PLANS to sell armor/weps or any p2w items...That response should have been will NOT sale those items ever, even if we want more money

Emma_Overload

No, I don't believe this type of content has a place in the Elder Scrolls Universe.

Khivas_Carrick wrote: »

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

hiyde wrote: »

Krinaman wrote: »

I don't care if they add such content so long as you aren't forced to do it to get the best gear in the game. Of course, without such rewards you won't get a group to do it so effectively I am voting against them.

Well, why do you need the best gear in the game if you aren't running the content that requires it? It's the best gear in the game for raiding. If you don't raid, then you aren't negatively impacted.

Totally disagree. This is like saying "Why do you need a titanium/platinum/unobtainium putter like Tiger Woods if you're never going to play in the Masters?"

I want the best gear because I want my toon to be the best sorcerer she can be. I don't want to go through life wondering "Man, if only she had that extra 4% spell crit from Wise Mage..." What difference does it make what dungeons she uses it for?

Tiger Woods doesn't care if you use the same putter he does, so why should anyone else care what gear my toon has?

Then go get that gear.

I don't see the issue, as long as good gear can be achieved by doing other content as well (e.g. PvP). As long as it requires equal amount of effort & skill.

If you don't want to go through the effort & time other players go through to get that gear... well, tough luck.
What makes you better & entitled to get that gear right away?

I'm not talking about PVP gear, which I have no major problem with. At any rate, effort and skill have NOTHING to do with acquiring the best PVE gear... I've seen the videos on YouTube. A bunch of guys standing around in robes clicking Crushing Shock for 20 minutes while a healer heals them and a tank distracts the boss.

The other day I solo'd Volenfell with VR12 scaled mobs... you think that s--t is easy? Sure it would be easy with 4 guys, but solo it takes some practice. And all I got was a bunch of foul hides and a POS item from the bosses that wasn't even a decent set piece.

Don't even TRY to tell me this has anything to do with "effort and skill" when we all know what endgame raiding is all about:

1) Kissing some strangers' a-sses so they let you join their little club.

2) Installing 3rd party software like Teamspeak so some jerk can scream in your ear.

3) Chugging 10K worth of Tri-pots that you probably bought with gold from a Chinese gold farmer. And on and on...

You really had a bad experience in the past huh? Wanna talk about it?

LOL, nope.... I got all that just from reading the forums and watching vids on YouTube. From the point of view of someone who's never been on a big raid, the things you hear and see from other players is a HUGE deterrent.

For example, the forums are full of complaints by sorcs that no one wants them in their raid because they don't do as much DPS, blah blah blah. Who needs that aggravation? From what I see the problem isn't this build or that class, but MMO culture itself.

Maybe I *do* have a stick in my ass, but when I joined this thread, it was already full of comments by supposedly elite players calling other people "peasants". Who wouldn't be a little hostile or defensive after that?

DDuke

Yes, I think progressive raiding would be good for the longevity of the game.

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

Khivas_Carrick wrote: »

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

hiyde wrote: »

Krinaman wrote: »

I don't care if they add such content so long as you aren't forced to do it to get the best gear in the game. Of course, without such rewards you won't get a group to do it so effectively I am voting against them.

Well, why do you need the best gear in the game if you aren't running the content that requires it? It's the best gear in the game for raiding. If you don't raid, then you aren't negatively impacted.

Totally disagree. This is like saying "Why do you need a titanium/platinum/unobtainium putter like Tiger Woods if you're never going to play in the Masters?"

I want the best gear because I want my toon to be the best sorcerer she can be. I don't want to go through life wondering "Man, if only she had that extra 4% spell crit from Wise Mage..." What difference does it make what dungeons she uses it for?

Tiger Woods doesn't care if you use the same putter he does, so why should anyone else care what gear my toon has?

Then go get that gear.

I don't see the issue, as long as good gear can be achieved by doing other content as well (e.g. PvP). As long as it requires equal amount of effort & skill.

If you don't want to go through the effort & time other players go through to get that gear... well, tough luck.
What makes you better & entitled to get that gear right away?

I'm not talking about PVP gear, which I have no major problem with. At any rate, effort and skill have NOTHING to do with acquiring the best PVE gear... I've seen the videos on YouTube. A bunch of guys standing around in robes clicking Crushing Shock for 20 minutes while a healer heals them and a tank distracts the boss.

The other day I solo'd Volenfell with VR12 scaled mobs... you think that s--t is easy? Sure it would be easy with 4 guys, but solo it takes some practice. And all I got was a bunch of foul hides and a POS item from the bosses that wasn't even a decent set piece.

Don't even TRY to tell me this has anything to do with "effort and skill" when we all know what endgame raiding is all about:

1) Kissing some strangers' a-sses so they let you join their little club.

2) Installing 3rd party software like Teamspeak so some jerk can scream in your ear.

3) Chugging 10K worth of Tri-pots that you probably bought with gold from a Chinese gold farmer. And on and on...

You really had a bad experience in the past huh? Wanna talk about it?

LOL, nope.... I got all that just from reading the forums and watching vids on YouTube. From the point of view of someone who's never been on a big raid, the things you hear and see from other players is a HUGE deterrent.

For example, the forums are full of complaints by sorcs that no one wants them in their raid because they don't do as much DPS, blah blah blah. Who needs that aggravation? From what I see the problem isn't this build or that class, but MMO culture itself.

Maybe I *do* have a stick in my ass, but when I joined this thread, it was already full of comments by supposedly elite players calling other people "peasants". Who wouldn't be a little hostile or defensive after that?

Impiouz

No, I don't believe this type of content has a place in the Elder Scrolls Universe.

Meh

I'd still prefer Imperial City or any kind of attention for Cyrodiil instead of raid PVE.
Even though I have to admit I never played vanilla WoW...there was Daoc around at the same time.
I only remember that all the bads went to WoW for its cuddly carebear PvE where they could elaborate on how difficult it is to defeat mobs controlled by something you can not even call AI....
So still NOOO! there is already Wow for the PVE ELITISTS...
That term should be the oxymoron of the year...haha

itsBishop

Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »

All PvE is pointless... so u can kill a scripted AI? So can my 5 yr old daughter.

Can your daughter pull 1.5k dps while navigating mechanics? Get out of this thread with your hyperbolic nonsense.

itsBishop

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

LOL, nope.... I got all that just from reading the forums and watching vids on YouTube. From the point of view of someone who's never been on a big raid, the things you hear and see from other players is a HUGE deterrent.

For example, the forums are full of complaints by sorcs that no one wants them in their raid because they don't do as much DPS, blah blah blah. Who needs that aggravation? From what I see the problem isn't this build or that class, but MMO culture itself.

Maybe I *do* have a stick in my ass, but when I joined this thread, it was already full of comments by supposedly elite players calling other people "peasants". Who wouldn't be a little hostile or defensive after that?

Go run your dailies and be happy. The rest of us want more consistently challeging content in the game and you're spouting nonsense you heard second hand from randoms who had a couple bad experiences. Laughable.