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Templar Update

  • david.haypreub18_ESO
    david.haypreub18_ESO
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    Soooo..... how's that Templar magicka recovery buff coming?

    It's been over a month since the first bumps to Templars were announced. Some of them have helped, and the buff to Sun Shield will too, but the major complaint of nearly all Templar players (poor mana resource management) remains largely unaddressed.

    So how is that coming?
    Templars are 'just slower... by design'
    Yes, Gina actually said that (at least regarding Rushed Ceremony) right here:
    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p24
    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Sorcerer
    38 Nightblade
    24 DK
  • monden1980b16_ESO
    monden1980b16_ESO
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    Soooo..... how's that Templar magicka recovery buff coming?

    It's been over a month since the first bumps to Templars were announced. Some of them have helped, and the buff to Sun Shield will too, but the major complaint of nearly all Templar players (poor mana resource management) remains largely unaddressed.

    So how is that coming?

    This, or reduce templar ability costs *significantly*.

    If a templar uses light armor and enchants that decreases magicka costs, the problem might not be that significant. If a templar wears medium or heavy armor, he will run out of resources midways of almost any 1vs1 situation.
  • Reco
    Reco
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    If a templar uses light armor and enchants that decreases magicka costs, the problem might not be that significant. If a templar wears medium or heavy armor, he will run out of resources midways of almost any 1vs1 situation.

    You see, but all of you saying that light armor mitigates the problem for templars seem to be forgetting one crucial thing: All the other classes can (and do) use light armor with all its passives too!

    So the result is that :
    1. in group PvE everyone is ready to go after each pack of mobs while me templar is begging everyone to wait before attacking the next group because I'm zero on magicka. Or worse, that during fight when I run out of magicka, everyone of other classes in the group is going for one more minute.
    2. in PvP, our opponents have much larger pools of magicka at their disposal and on top of that, their DPS is vastly superior to ours.
    3. when I heal groups, I am supposed to use magicka only (templars are the healer class -- so why should they get enough magicka right?)

    And I am light armor rank 50, I've unlocked all ranks of all the light armor passives, and all the other passives that help reduce spell costs in other skill lines, and I wear all the appropriate jewelry to support my magicka management.

    And on top of that, we have pretty sub-par DPS compared to all the other classes.

    So yes, templar needs some proper fixing.

    All of the above problems could be solved by providing a passive skill to siphon magicka based on damage dealt to enemies, and another passive in a templar skill line to boost max magicka by xx%. It would increase the pitiful dps to average, and it would mitigate the insufficient-magicka problems. Restoring Spirit seems like an ideal candidate for that change.

    Or maybe you want everyone to play as DK or sorc? So why put templar in the game? Sorcs can heal too.


    Edited by Reco on July 28, 2014 8:16AM
  • Evarwyn
    Evarwyn
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    I just hit VR1, and haven't seen too much of an issue with my magicka. Mind you, I have 20 stat points in Magicka and use only 3 DPS skills on my bar that require the resource, and lets face it, I've been in the leveling content this whole time, too.

    It seems to me (and this is just my silly opinion, I'm sure many of you know better) like the best overall answer would be to slightly reduce magicka costs across the board (300+ Magicka for any skill is very expensive) while increasing the amount of magicka gained from stat points.

    I appreciate getting +15 points to my health when I spend a stat point on it, but as a Templar, I feel like getting the same amount of points (+10) as I would for stamina, just seems off.

    My 2 septims, for what they're worth :smiley:
  • monden1980b16_ESO
    monden1980b16_ESO
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    Reco wrote: »
    If a templar uses light armor and enchants that decreases magicka costs, the problem might not be that significant. If a templar wears medium or heavy armor, he will run out of resources midways of almost any 1vs1 situation.

    You see, but all of you saying that light armor mitigates the problem for templars seem to be forgetting one crucial thing: All the other classes can (and do) use light armor with all its passives too!

    So the result is that :
    1. in group PvE everyone is ready to go after each pack of mobs while me templar is begging everyone to wait before attacking the next group because I'm zero on magicka. Or worse, that during fight when I run out of magicka, everyone of other classes in the group is going for one more minute.
    2. in PvP, our opponents have much larger pools of magicka at their disposal and on top of that, their DPS is vastly superior to ours.
    3. when I heal groups, I am supposed to use magicka only (templars are the healer class -- so why should they get enough magicka right?)

    And I am light armor rank 50, I've unlocked all ranks of all the light armor passives, and all the other passives that help reduce spell costs in other skill lines, and I wear all the appropriate jewelry to support my magicka management.

    And on top of that, we have pretty sub-par DPS compared to all the other classes.

    So yes, templar needs some proper fixing.

    All of the above problems could be solved by providing a passive skill to siphon magicka based on damage dealt to enemies, and another passive in a templar skill line to boost max magicka by xx%. It would increase the pitiful dps to average, and it would mitigate the insufficient-magicka problems. Restoring Spirit seems like an ideal candidate for that change.

    Or maybe you want everyone to play as DK or sorc? So why put templar in the game? Sorcs can heal too.


    Maybe I did express myself a bit unclear, you are absolutely right. I'm a medium armor Templar (Bow, Sword/Shield) myself and I have huge magicka problems (Consistently running out of magicka in PvP, in PvE I even have downtime after killing a trash mob! I use mainly weapon abilities but I still burn through magicka pots to keep up a minimum of magicka).

    I just wanted to say that with light armor the problem might be a bit reduced, but of course a light armor Templar will still be far behind other classes.

    Overall, Templar DPS and magicka cost / cost reduction / magicka management needs significant improvement!
    Your proposal to boost magicka pool by a certain % (alternatively: reduce spell costs) and to rework Restoring Spirit seems reasonable.
    Edited by monden1980b16_ESO on July 29, 2014 7:52AM
  • p_tsakirisb16_ESO
    p_tsakirisb16_ESO
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    Magicka management is indeed pretty bad on Templars even in 7/7 Light.
    All our abilities cost almost double of what the other classes abilities do, for the same damage. Even our best Ultimate (Nova) costs more and lasts less than the equivalent abilities of eg Standard.

    Look at the Javelin. 400 Magicka for 1 shot that actually does 0 damage, CC can be broken, which has pitiful duration to boot compared to eg petrify.

    Imho other than the Aedric Spear line, the other 2 lines have only 1 useful pvp skill each. Vampire Bane and Breath of Life. (still sparingly used on emergencies due to huge cost even in 7/7 light).

    But must admit Aedric Spear is pretty good to the point of awesomeness. Yes big magicka sinks, if you are not Altmer or Breton (I have Khajiit) but is the best we have and supported with 2 gold power glyphs, plus two swords of Spell & Armour penetration they do pretty good damage.

    On the last. Do we know which Aedric Spear abilities rely on Weapon Critical and which on Spell Critical? Not that I care of, but I would love to lose the Inner light and put something better on 5th slot.
  • Reco
    Reco
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    Evarwyn wrote: »
    I just hit VR1, and haven't seen too much of an issue with my magicka. Mind you, I have 20 stat points in Magicka and use only 3 DPS skills on my bar that require the resource, and lets face it, I've been in the leveling content this whole time, too.

    It seems to me (and this is just my silly opinion, I'm sure many of you know better) like the best overall answer would be to slightly reduce magicka costs across the board (300+ Magicka for any skill is very expensive) while increasing the amount of magicka gained from stat points.

    I appreciate getting +15 points to my health when I spend a stat point on it, but as a Templar, I feel like getting the same amount of points (+10) as I would for stamina, just seems off.

    My 2 septims, for what they're worth :smiley:
    If you play any group dungeons of your level or do PvP you will run into magicka problems with a templar soon. And you will be wondering why you are out of it 1 minute sooner than the other classes.

  • david.haypreub18_ESO
    david.haypreub18_ESO
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    I think that ZOS got the message that the central problem with the class is the ability to regenerate magicka... I would say they definitely got it, but until we see some sort of help for the Templars in this regard (and it has been a while now, and no help so far), I can't say for sure they understand it.

    ZOS seem to have assumed that the problem with the Templars' DPS was that Biting Jabs didn't do enough damage. That was not really the problem. The problem was that the Templar couldn't sustain the Jabs (or any other of the Tempars' better class skills) because the cost of the spell was too high and the Templar has poor mana management.

    It seems like ZOS has taken the hard road to balancing the Templars. They are fiddling with individual skills, when just reducing the cost of Templar skills in general, and giving the Templar some ways of regenerating mana, would have save them a lot of time and effort.
    Edited by david.haypreub18_ESO on July 29, 2014 5:46PM
    Templars are 'just slower... by design'
    Yes, Gina actually said that (at least regarding Rushed Ceremony) right here:
    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p24
    VR 16 Templar (retired until Templars get fixed)
    VR 16 Sorcerer
    38 Nightblade
    24 DK
  • JLB
    JLB
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    I'm a big fan of the magika-over-time mechanic of Honor the Dead (now that it works) and Channeled Focus.
    I think it would be very interesting to see the same mechanic implemented in more abilities, or even a passive that would return a % of the ability cost over time. That would effectively reduce the costs, in a very templarish way.
  • Reco
    Reco
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    JLB wrote: »
    I'm a big fan of the magika-over-time mechanic of Honor the Dead (now that it works) and Channeled Focus.
    I think it would be very interesting to see the same mechanic implemented in more abilities, or even a passive that would return a % of the ability cost over time. That would effectively reduce the costs, in a very templarish way.

    Sorry but magika-return-over-time isn't going to fix the problems templars have. It won't increase the pitiful DPS and it won't prevent you from getting out of magicka.

    Magicka over-time-regen boost is simply useless in real combat situations. You will end up waiting 10 seconds for magicka regen, while the other classes are still going. This is more or less the current state of things already. Nothing would be fixed.
    Edited by Reco on July 30, 2014 12:55PM
  • GTech_1
    GTech_1
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    Reco wrote: »
    JLB wrote: »
    I'm a big fan of the magika-over-time mechanic of Honor the Dead (now that it works) and Channeled Focus.
    I think it would be very interesting to see the same mechanic implemented in more abilities, or even a passive that would return a % of the ability cost over time. That would effectively reduce the costs, in a very templarish way.

    Sorry but magika-return-over-time isn't going to fix the problems templars have. It won't increase the pitiful DPS and it won't prevent you from getting out of magicka.

    Magicka over-time-regen boost is simply useless in real combat situations. You will end up waiting 10 seconds for magicka regen, while the other classes are still going. This is more or less the current state of things already. Nothing would be fixed.

    It would actually provide less burst, but more sustain. YMMV
  • Reco
    Reco
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    GTech_1 wrote: »
    It would actually provide less burst, but more sustain. YMMV
    I define "sustain" differently. Waiting 10 seconds to regen 150 magicka is not what I call sustain. For me, sustained DPS means how long you are able to deal sustained (not burst) damage until you run out of magicka. DKs and Sorcs can do that for a longer time than Templars, and on top of that, they deal 50% more damage than Templars.
    Edited by Reco on July 30, 2014 3:50PM
  • Soris
    Soris
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    Regain is good. It would work nice with the new regen softcaps.

    70ish mana regain per second via natural regain + some tweaked templar regain via skills/passives and reduced cost of spells(balanced with other classes) would be solve the magicka problem in a very "teplarish" way like he said. Plus maybe they can add a passive works like "battle roar"
    Edited by Soris on July 30, 2014 4:53PM
    Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]
  • timidobserver
    timidobserver
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    Two changes.
    1. Change Radiant Aura from Stamina and Health to Stamina, Health, and Magicka.
    2. Add a chance to reduce or remove the cast time of dark flare based on some stipulation. Crit is the most obvious choice.
    V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
    V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
    V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
    V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
    V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)

  • contact.opiumb16_ESO
    contact.opiumb16_ESO
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    Imo aedric spear is more or less good enough as it is, except for the shield, mana regen is needed, compared to my sorc and is spamable heavy deadric shield, the templar one is weak.

    Dawns wrath needs some rework on almost the whole tree except the fire ball.

    And for restoring light, I guess restoring spirit should be 4/8 instead of 2/4, radiant aura should go for magica regen too instead of increased radius (12 meters radius are enough anyway), the rune focus armor and regen buff should work on self even if you are not in the circle, your allies just have the buff if they are inside. Master ritualist should give back some mana health and vigor when you rez a guy for let's say 5 minutes, not stackable.
    Edited by contact.opiumb16_ESO on August 2, 2014 2:31PM
  • MeowGinger
    MeowGinger
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    Why not switch back the "Restoring Spirit" passive back to what it was in beta?

    Restoring Spirit currently reduces magicka, stamina, and ultimate costs by 4%. In beta, it returned 4% of the user's maximum magicka whenever an ability was cast. This could be changed from "any" ability to magicka-depleting abilities only, templar class abilities only, or Dawn's Wrath skills only.

    Reddit thread from March 8, re: Restoring Spirit nerf
    One from Tamriel Foundry

    Or maybe something on par with the Dragonknight's Battle Roar -- whenever an ultimate is activated, health, magicka, and stamina are restored equal to 70% of the ultimate's cost. For templars, maybe something along the lines of magicka restoration equal to 100% of the ultimate's cost, or magicka and health restoration equal to 85% of the ultimate's cost.
    Edited by MeowGinger on August 2, 2014 6:10PM
  • MeowGinger
    MeowGinger
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    Re: ultimates

    I would like to see the Dawn's Wrath ultimate (Nova & morphs) addressed further. It does virtually the same thing as the Dragonknight's favorite, Standard of Might, but is weaker as a whole.

    This is how they compare with my stats (~1900 magicka, 88 spell damage); click spoiler tag for specifics:
    Standard of Might:
    Cost: 200 ultimate
    Duration: 15 seconds
    DoT: 137 fire dmg/sec
    Total damage: 2055
    Enemy effect: 50% less healing for 15 sec
    Caster effect: deals 20% more dmg, takes 20% less dmg
    Synergy: damages & immobilizes enemies
    Other considerations: close-range, "smart" placement; in PvP, only vampires and dunmer have fire resist (other morph does 143 fire dmg/sec for a total of 2145 damage, and caster effect is replaced with the ability to change the standard's location and refresh the standard's duration)

    Solar Prison:
    Cost: 300 ultimate (288 with max passive)
    Duration: 8 seconds
    DoT: 199 magic dmg/sec
    Total damage: 1592
    Enemy effect: 30% less damage for 8 sec (other morph snares 60%, with weaker synergy)
    Caster effect: none
    Synergy: damages & stuns enemies (supposedly stronger synergy than other morph)
    Other considerations: can be ranged, but the placement of the ultimate takes time and is problematic on uneven terrain; in PvP, EVERYONE has high spell resist (probably over softcap for light armor users)

    Negatives of Solar Prison: 1) 150% of the cost of Standard, 2) 53% of the duration, 3) 77% of the damage, 4) more broadly mitigated damage in PvP (spell resist vs. fire resist), 5) no additional caster effects (can't change location & refresh, don't deal 20% more damage), and 6) absence of 50% less healing for enemies
    Positives: 1) +10% damage decrease for enemies, 2) a synergy that stuns instead of immobilizes (or a weaker synergy for a 60% snare effect), and 3) a wider range (more of a negative than a positive, explained below).

    Since Nova morphs don't have "smart" positioning like the Standard morphs, it takes longer to execute a Nova morph because you need the time to place that glowing circle instead of just pressing R. In normal play, this isn't a big deal, maybe a second.

    If you're fighting on uneven ground or in a small, enclosed space (ex. in a cave), this is more problematic, because you'll keep getting a red X until you find the exact "right" position to drop your ultimate. That can take several seconds longer, and time is precious in battle. If you're inside a keep, you may not even have sufficient space to cast a Nova morph due to the placement circle (this does not apply to ultimates like Meteor or Standard). And if you rush with ult placement and miss, congrats! You just wasted ~300 ultimate.

    One ultimate clearly blows the other out of the water, so to speak.
  • Soris
    Soris
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    Agree with the ranged placement. It can be very problematic in some situations like rocky terrains and some choke points.

    I'm not talking about that big red cross which you're not able to place it. It's another problem but my point is, it can completely miss your target and drop some other place because of the terrain itself.

    For example:
    -Stand on edge of a rock/wall which has thin place to stand on it
    -Then aim your feet and cast nova
    -Boom! %50 of change it will miss your position and drop on muddy land

    Or vice versa..
    -Bunch of enemy players fighting at first flag of a keep (near the gate)
    -You're at second floor, pouring oil on them. Then you decide to cast nova.
    -Aim the flag, stand steady and fire!
    -But no my friend, Nova drops on YOUR position instead of flag!. How pity...
    Edited by Soris on August 2, 2014 8:11PM
    Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]
  • madangrypally
    madangrypally
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    I have each class to Vet Rank. Templar and Sorcerer to Vet 12, and ill have my DK and Nightblade to Vet 12 sometime this month. Templars by far has the worst abilities and magicka management.

    Is there a team in charge of all classes or are they being handled as separate entities?

    I see to many problems with the class to be fixed anytime in 2014 and likely wont be a good class for at least another year or more. Which sucks because Templars are what I was most excited about in ESO.
    Edited by madangrypally on August 3, 2014 2:21PM
  • Baphomet
    Baphomet
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    Templars were in top notch shape before they changed restoring spirit. They ought to just revert it but only make it work with abilities that use magicka to cast - and probably reduce the magicka return rate to 2-3% instead of the original 4%. That way they will have a magicka management system that compares to the other three classes. Currently templars don't have anything that comes even close to that.
    - The Psijic Order
    - TKO
    - Dominant Dominion
    - The Noore
  • Reco
    Reco
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    I have each class to Vet Rank. Templar and Sorcerer to Vet 12, and ill have my DK and Nightblade to Vet 12 sometime this month. Templars by far has the worst abilities and magicka management.

    Is there a team in charge of all classes or are they being handled as separate entities?

    I see to many problems with the class to be fixed anytime in 2014 and likely wont be a good class for at least another year or more. Which sucks because Templars are what I was most excited about in ESO.
    Exactly.

  • Timsierramist
    I naively popped into ESO about 1 1/2 weeks ago and chose Templar. I did feel I was having a harder time than some characters in game, but just assumed I was being a noob...but wait a minute. That same level guy just defeated that boss much easier than I did!

    I still like Templar, in general. Would be glad to switch to Dragon Knight, but not restarting.

    Thanks for taking the feedback and fixing the issues Zeni!
  • Elsterchen
    Elsterchen
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    Hi everyone,
    first of all thank you zeni for addressing the problems templars encounter, your effords are appreciated.

    However, as I read the posts its magica-management/-recovery all over and I like to add that some templars do not have any magica issues at all. My playstile is not magica based - so far (lvl 44) I spend 3 attribute points on magica ( and I only did so because it felt weird not to spend any points for it) and still I do not have magica issues, even if I start spamming biting jabs to keep fights short. Well, I only use the aedric light/spear abilities, which are magica based, all my other active skills only require stamina.

    So, for my personal playstile it would be great to have a better stamina-or even health-recovery rate or (and this is for my personal likes even more important) a more balanced damage-dealing/-taking system. In my opinion this might help to lay the path for players that like to play tank - templars instead of healer- templars.

    I understand that magica-use/-abilities are slightly overpowered during the lower levels, this is an issue known from pen-and paper roleplay as well as the one-player elder scrolls games. However, I always thought that this minor advantage is due to the simple fact that a playstile based on dealing and taking physical damage is more of a cummulative kind compared to a more linear progression in magica based abilities. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel that the overall balancing of linear progressing magica based skills compared to cummulative progressing stamina/health based skills needs some fixing.

    Well, thats all for now.
    See you all in cyrodiil ;-)
  • Reco
    Reco
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    Elsterchen wrote: »
    My playstile is not magica based
    Templar skills don't use stamina. They use magicka. Your problem isn't related to templars. It is related to the overall weakness of stamina builds. This is a known issue, also being officially looked-into (see: forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/112513/improvements-for-stamina-based-skills-and-passives )
    Edited by Reco on August 5, 2014 1:37PM
  • timidobserver
    timidobserver
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    They should add an aoe immob to either radiant aura or one of the focused charge morphs. It would make aoe tanking a lot easier.
    V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
    V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
    V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
    V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
    V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)

  • madangrypally
    madangrypally
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    Templar:

    Templars need a serious overhaul and are the worst of the 4 classes by far. Templars 3 skill trees area are all built around a totally different play style thus Templar's lack a overall design.

    Aedric Spear: Is based on melee and tanky type build.
    Dawn's Wrath: Is based on a ranged caster build
    Restoring Light: Is based on a healing build.

    To top off all 3 skill trees being based on entirely different builds, none of them synergies well with each other or other skill trees. This will always make Templars broken until they add more synergies between abilities.

    The Restoring Light Tree is a good example. While it is a healing tree it does not scale well with the Restoration Staff abilities. Most are under the impression that Templars are the best healers but that is far from true. There are just more stubborn Templars healers as that is why they picked Templars in the first place. I can make a higher HPS Sorcerer and Nightblade with much better resource management skills, and a much better HPS and Support Dragonknight with slightly better resource management skills.

    =========
    Suggested changes: I know its impossible to redesign all 3 skill trees so will mostly be slight changes.

    Make Class Abilities scale on Max magicka or Max Stamina based on which stat is highest. This goes for all classes. Abilities that use Spell Crit should use Spell Damage and abilities that use Weapon Crit should use Weapon Damage to base their damage on.

    Lower the magicka cost on many of the Templars abilities.
    =============

    Aedric Spear:
    Blazing Shield: Soft cap damage to 16.5% of a players Max Health, but still allow it to crit over that. This will fix exploits and issues and 16.5% is what it should do now without it bugging/exploiting it.

    Piercing Spear: Keep it the same but remove the requirement that is must be a Aedric Spear ability, though must have a Aedric ability slotted.

    Burning Light: Keep it the same but remove the requirement that is must be a Aedric Spear ability.

    Balanced Warrior: Increase Weapon Damage by 8% instead of the lousy 4%. Consider that Templars have no other reliable way to increase there weapon damage this would help. (right now on average 4% means a lousy at soft cap it would give ~8 (4 if over soft cap) weapon damage for 2 skill points is ridiculous compared to other classes). Sorcerer gets ~74 weapon damage buff that last 20+ seconds.
    =================

    Dawn's Wraith:
    Solar Flare: The weapon damage and spell damage bonus needs to drastically changed. Instead of it lasting for the next attack only make it a buff that lasts 6 seconds. Reduce the values from the current 55 down too 16 spell power and 24 weapon damage. (this will help a ton with templars damage issues).
    Solar Barrage: This is similar to the current form but reduce the spell damage down to 12 and weapon damage to 16. Make it also buff allies for the 6 seconds for those values.
    Vampire Bane: With a name like Vampire's Bane not to cause extra damage to vampires is silly. Make it do an extra 50% damage to vampires. (BTW I run vampire on all my pvp characters and will still like this change due to the name).

    Backlash: Make this explode once it reaches the damage soft cap. The soft cap damage should be better then Sorcerers Crystal Shards and it should be allowed to crit. (IE: 700 is a good Crystal Shard value so Backlash needs to be slightly more then that at around 840 soft cap damage)
    Allow 1 backlash on target per templar. Backlash could absorb Magical/Elemetal damage but deal physical damage to prevent them chaining explosions with backlash only.

    Eclipse: Both morphs sucks and need to be buffed. no suggestions though to what. This base ability is very nice, it would just be better to have better morphs.

    Blinding Light: Recently got a buff so not sure how it is now.

    Prism: Increase this or replace it entirely. None of the of the Dawn's Wrath abilities are used enough even with the above changes to warrant a passive that gives 2 ultimate per use.

    Would rather replace Prism with this: Prism: Restores magicka and stamina when using an ultimate. Amount restored increased based on ultimate cost. (this needs to be enough to be worthwhile). Similar to DK's Dragon Roar but without health and more magicia/stamina.

    Restoring Spirit: Increase the value to 6% at rank 2.
    ===============

    Restoring Light:
    Healing Ritual: Both morphs suck and need to be buffed.

    Restoring Aura: Increase the regeneration to 30% instead of 15%.
    Radiant Aura: Remove the increased radius and make it also add magicka to the regeneration
    Repentance: is fine but it sucks in pvp when there are no corpses because the enemy respawned
    already. Slightly change this based on the enemies killed in last 10 seconds with a cap on numbers.

    Rune Focus: Allow this to be centered on the Templar and have it move with the Templar. Reduce the effectiveness of it and its morph to not make it OP.

    Mending: Remove the requirement of the Restoring Light Ability, but slightly lower the crit strike chance to 20% at rank 2.

    Focused Healing: Remove the requirement of the Restoring Light Ability, but greatly lower the increase healing done to 10% at rank 2.

    Light Weaver: Passive needs a complete overhaul.

    ============

    I know most of the suggestions above seem extreme but I believe it will help bring Templars in line with the other classes.
  • CaptainSilverbrow
    CaptainSilverbrow
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    Baphomet wrote: »
    Templars were in top notch shape before they changed restoring spirit. They ought to just revert it but only make it work with abilities that use magicka to cast - and probably reduce the magicka return rate to 2-3% instead of the original 4%. That way they will have a magicka management system that compares to the other three classes. Currently templars don't have anything that comes even close to that.

    No it won't, that's no different than just reducing the cost, just by a little more. Working with all casts forced the Templar to interweave abilities that consumed an alternate resource to regen. magicka, but synergized beautifully. Looking at Radiant Aura, I can't help but think this was intended from the get-go. Because they never replaced this mechanic or redesigned the class' regenerative element relative to the other classes before removing Restoring Spirit, it (the class) was essentially reengineered from launch missing a critical component preempting its viability; to wit, the class was redesigned to fail utterly because they amputated its legs and replaced them with a pair of crutches.
    Edited by CaptainSilverbrow on August 7, 2014 4:16AM
  • Isarii
    Isarii
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    MeowGinger wrote: »
    Why not switch back the "Restoring Spirit" passive back to what it was in beta?

    Restoring Spirit currently reduces magicka, stamina, and ultimate costs by 4%. In beta, it returned 4% of the user's maximum magicka whenever an ability was cast. This could be changed from "any" ability to magicka-depleting abilities only, templar class abilities only, or Dawn's Wrath skills only.

    Reddit thread from March 8, re: Restoring Spirit nerf
    One from Tamriel Foundry

    Or maybe something on par with the Dragonknight's Battle Roar -- whenever an ultimate is activated, health, magicka, and stamina are restored equal to 70% of the ultimate's cost. For templars, maybe something along the lines of magicka restoration equal to 100% of the ultimate's cost, or magicka and health restoration equal to 85% of the ultimate's cost.

    I was reading this thread to check up on the state of my favored class since I've been considering actually buying the game due to the enticing Quakecon changes, and was a little disappointed to see the same exact issue we discussed way back then still going unresolved (as that's my Reddit post you're quoting).

    It is my understanding that the Restoring Spirit nerf was largely aimed at healing Templars (because DPS Templars were never good), who at the time had access to some pretty great sustain when geared up to maximize magicka (thus creating huge returns from Restoring Spirit's 4% of maximum magicka refund). At the time, we suggested simply making the return a flat number or capping it at a certain point, but obviously this was never implemented.

    If ZeniMax is happy with the current state of Templar healer regeneration (and as someone not playing the game, I can't be sure whether or not this would be warranted), they could go with Reco's suggestion above to do the following:

    "All of the above problems could be solved by providing a passive skill to siphon magicka based on damage dealt to enemies".

    A proc similar to Red Diamond or Adrenaline Rush, but for magicka, would also work so long as they aren't planning to save it for a future race.

    This would provide an awesome and unique opportunity for DPS only magicka regen, while leaving healers relatively untouched. Ideally, this would be accompanied by an across-the-board reduction in spell costs to be more in line with the other classes.
    Edited by Isarii on August 7, 2014 4:50AM
    Isarii Aloroth - PC-NA | Ebonheart Pact | Dunmer | Magicka Nightblade
  • Reco
    Reco
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    Also please remove the synergy granted to allies by Spear Shards and their morphs. Restoring 25% Stamina is simply useless. Nobody in groups ever uses my synergy and it only gets in the way. I even encountered a group member asking me to stop throwing Spear Shards because "I was blocking his more useful synergy for his friend in the group!" :(
    Edited by Reco on August 7, 2014 9:19AM
  • Kcttocs
    Kcttocs
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    Reco wrote: »
    Also please remove the synergy granted to allies by Spear Shards and their morphs. Restoring 25% Stamina is simply useless. Nobody in groups ever uses my synergy and it only gets in the way. I even encountered a group member asking me to stop throwing Spear Shards because "I was blocking his more useful synergy for his friend in the group!" :(
    25% stamina to your tank is not useless. He should be gobbing those up from you and thanking you. What other synergy was it blocking?
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