Shield Breaker - AKA "I win button"

Darnathian

TheBull wrote: »

L2block. Seriously, I have buddy running Shield Breaker atm. It's funny as hell watching some sorcs go full "mentally challenged person". They don't hit block, they don't dodge, they don't LoS. They stand there waving their arms and die.

I'm seeing A lot of sorcs never learned to play the game.

Yup. A lot were fotm. They were use to being gods. Now they can be hurt and their lack of skill shows. They have to hit more than two buttons.

Septimus_Magna

Shieldbreaker is ridiculously OP, with ability (average 6k dmg) + light attack (average 3k dmg) weave you get 2k unresistable dmg boost against all magicka builds. Thats a 20% damage boost from a 5pc set that has good 2-4pc boni.

But yeah, 20% increased damage that is unresistable isnt OP, just L2P and start spamming healing springs+rapid regen+combat prayer to survive because thats how things are balanced now.

Tankqull

Xeniph wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Lets talk about what a light armor shield guy can do against this. In a 1v1 he would have to run an instant burst heal and keep pressure on the guy. Sorcs dont have one so they'll now be forcd to use resto. Armor doesnt help. He CANNOT drop his shield because then he will get wrecked with everything else. It's a 1 button hard counter, I win button.

What about all the bow users camping spawn, sniping anyone with a shield? What do we do about that? If this set stays like this, Light Armor will die in PvP, and with it, Magicka Builds will die as well.

Remove shield stacking.

Remove this set, make it have a cooldown, or give it a shield debuff instead.

Or I tell you what... Make Light mitigation equal to Medium, remove all shields, and give us a magicka Vigor morph. I'll roll with that...

but this... this gives us zero options...

While I don't agree with your opinion about the set being OP, I do agree that it's not the solution.

Currently a Sorc can achieve 14-16k Hardened wards without sacrificing any dps. This gives them 30k-32k effective health, renders all crits and most bleed/dot damage moot. Tie that with the massive buff they got in 1.6 being able to apply a new shield over a damaged one, looking at it objectively, stacking is not the only issue.

No medium, let alone light armored person should have 30k+ health (14-16k of it being immune to so much stuff), in a zone where the average health pool sits around 16-22k, without significant investment into armor, health and survivability. Regardless of class, playstyle.

What pvp in this game needs is proper debuff and skill lockout abilities. Offensive purges, targeted silences, skill lockouts all immune to CC break. Allowing for skilled gameplay. Also, shields should not be able to attain such high numbers and be immune to anything or be able to be stacked or rewrote.

I completely agree with one poster I read propose shields being put on the current buff table. Ie.. Major shield, Minor shield and preventing them from being refreshed until they have expired.

thats in pve - in any pvp area those numbers are down to 6-8k im at the lower 7k reach as i allways preferred higher dmg and mana sustain over max magica this includes absolutly nothing in life so the total amount of "healthpool" is at 20-25k. so your numbers are a lindslide away from reality. those numbers where even impossible before 1.7 without cheating in form of multiple mundi and magica inflation by overload.

Angarato

i've seen a sorc with shields tanking an emperor. its *** silly. nobody likes it when a counter shows up to their overpowered playstyle. theres also a new set that gives people that wear it insane stealth detection. it counters my entire class. how about you equip that? using shield breaker i cant use any other 5 set bonus. its useless against people without shields.

you relied too much on your shields to protect you. you ask for a medium armor breaker but you dont need 1. im squishy as *** and our dodge roll got nerfed HARD and you dont even need to use a 5set to benefit from that nerf like we do.

Alcast

Xeven wrote: »

This is not counter play. This is toxic game design. This is an I win button.

There is an easy fix, dont spam shields like there is no tomorrow
Hint: If there is no shield up, shieldbreaker does no damage

Septimus_Magna

Alcast wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

This is not counter play. This is toxic game design. This is an I win button.

There is an easy fix, dont spam shields like there is no tomorrow
Hint: If there is no shield up, shieldbreaker does no damage

And you die from the ability and light attack damage in 5 seconds, how can you consider that to be a counter?

Digiman

Getting really tired of people screaming about shield stacking when that was the result of their argument when they wanted light armor to be as weak as wet tissue paper.

Shield breaker is obviously the combat designers teams announcement of how they hate all light armor wearing ranged magicka casters.

What ever the case the fact is they are going to force that type of playstyle out and into heavy armor WB stamina spammers just to survive.

Hope someone gets fired over this obviously biased design choice.

Shield breaker should also affect blocking and heavy armor. To make it fair.

olsborg

This set is in a desperate need of a 4 second cooldown. Or the dmg hitting the shield itself.

Digiman

olsborg wrote: »

This set is in a desperate need of a 4 second cooldown. Or the dmg hitting the shield itself.

Actually that would work, the bonus set only effecting the shield instead of hurting the caster would be enough to keep pressure on the shield while not utterly crippling light armor magicka DPS.

Personally though this set needs to be scrapped. The fact is that ZoS screwed up everything when they messed around with light armor making 1/4 weaker then heavy. Forcing them to over-compensate with the released caps on the stats and making light armor users require shields to survive.

For Sorcerer's it was compounded by the fact they screwed around with Surge's heal by placing a CD made a greater mess for that class to find something else to keep them alive

Because of that every sorcerer was forced to run around with a bar taking 3 slots just to survive.

This set finally reveals the truth behind ZoS, they don't like Sorcerers or ranged light armor magicka DPS builds and never had a plan for them outside of nerfing and tweaking then waiting to see the results, despite the constant advice and experience given by the community on those tweaks.

I mean come on Unstable Clanfear heals you for 35% when it dies or is unsummoned? Really want to force us into using pets much?

ZoS management needs to start cleaning house, I will be damned before I see my favorite fantasy franchise become besmirched by obviously lazy and biased developer decisions hoping to pigeon hole every class in melee stamina DPS just to survive PvP because it would make it easier for them to sit back and balance.

Araxleon

Does nobody read death recap?
You need to use the group tool!

Xeven

Araxleon wrote: »

Does nobody read death recap?
You need to use the group tool!

Goddamnit Araxleon. This is a serious thread about serious business.


=D

Araxleon

Xeven wrote: »

Araxleon wrote: »

Does nobody read death recap?
You need to use the group tool!

Goddamnit Araxleon. This is a serious thread about serious business.


=D

Bring a friend with you next time.
A serious friend.

Araxleon

Xeven wrote: »

Araxleon wrote: »

Does nobody read death recap?
You need to use the group tool!

Goddamnit Araxleon. This is a serious thread about serious business.


=D

I have too say though, its funny how they add the damage,healing and shield nerfs in the same patch they introduce this set.

Tankqull

well limit shieldbreaker to staminabases melee attacks only. and the problem will be "solved" as it forces the attacker into a direct clinch with the sorc where he is vulnurable to slomo CF and sorc burst.

Xeven

Araxleon wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Araxleon wrote: »

Does nobody read death recap?
You need to use the group tool!

Goddamnit Araxleon. This is a serious thread about serious business.


=D

Bring a friend with you next time.
A serious friend.

With Shield Breaker.

Araxleon

Xeven wrote: »

Araxleon wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Araxleon wrote: »

Does nobody read death recap?
You need to use the group tool!

Goddamnit Araxleon. This is a serious thread about serious business.


=D

Bring a friend with you next time.
A serious friend.

With Shield Breaker.

btw feed your horse

Wing

hahahahahahaha

suck it, we cannot block, you cannot bubble XD

Angarato

LazyLewis wrote: »

I WAS JUST ABOUT TO POST ABOUT THIS. So Call of Duty ESO Imperial City. You Die....YOu spawn easy....Ive been playing for the last 5 hours. I spawn and I 1VX. The same guy has killed me 57 times out of 72 deaths tonight. WITH SHIELD BREAKER SET.

wow he killed you 57 times and you still didnt try anything different?
"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results."

FriedEggSandwich

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Shield stacking is a problem but the reason why Annulment and Conjured Ward are problematic is because of their duration. I mean, Sun Shield is a short-term form of damage mitigation and requires constant upkeep which lowers the user's DPS. Compare that to Conjured Ward and unless the user takes significant damage they have no reason to reapply it. Worse yet they can simply reapply it early whereas Blazing Shield offers no benefit doing the same thing. I agree that ZoS forced Sorcs into this situation but they need to allow them to heal efficiently, reduce the shield duration, or prevent casting it before the shield expires. All of these solutions are superior to what has been offered as a counter to shields.

In 1.5 you were penalised for recasting Hardened Ward before it had expired. Doing so would give you a refresh of the ward duration but not the damage shield, so you'd end up with another 20secs of a broken ward. This made it pretty hard to use to be fair, given that buff trackers are not native to the game.

Alcast

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

This is not counter play. This is toxic game design. This is an I win button.

There is an easy fix, dont spam shields like there is no tomorrow
Hint: If there is no shield up, shieldbreaker does no damage

And you die from the ability and light attack damage in 5 seconds, how can you consider that to be a counter?

block? interrupt? CC enemy? Stun? >.>

FriedEggSandwich

Xeniph wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Lets talk about what a light armor shield guy can do against this. In a 1v1 he would have to run an instant burst heal and keep pressure on the guy. Sorcs dont have one so they'll now be forcd to use resto. Armor doesnt help. He CANNOT drop his shield because then he will get wrecked with everything else. It's a 1 button hard counter, I win button.

What about all the bow users camping spawn, sniping anyone with a shield? What do we do about that? If this set stays like this, Light Armor will die in PvP, and with it, Magicka Builds will die as well.

Remove shield stacking.

Remove this set, make it have a cooldown, or give it a shield debuff instead.

Or I tell you what... Make Light mitigation equal to Medium, remove all shields, and give us a magicka Vigor morph. I'll roll with that...

but this... this gives us zero options...

While I don't agree with your opinion about the set being OP, I do agree that it's not the solution.

Currently a Sorc can achieve 14-16k Hardened wards without sacrificing any dps. This gives them 30k-32k effective health, renders all crits and most bleed/dot damage moot. Tie that with the massive buff they got in 1.6 being able to apply a new shield over a damaged one, looking at it objectively, stacking is not the only issue.

No medium, let alone light armored person should have 30k+ health (14-16k of it being immune to so much stuff), in a zone where the average health pool sits around 16-22k, without significant investment into armor, health and survivability. Regardless of class, playstyle.

What pvp in this game needs is proper debuff and skill lockout abilities. Offensive purges, targeted silences, skill lockouts all immune to CC break. Allowing for skilled gameplay. Also, shields should not be able to attain such high numbers and be immune to anything or be able to be stacked or rewrote.

I completely agree with one poster I read propose shields being put on the current buff table. Ie.. Major shield, Minor shield and preventing them from being refreshed until they have expired.

WTF dude, where did you get your facts from? lol FYI I have all 64 attributes into magicka and none into hp. I have 18.8k hp and 31.7k magicka. I have also just recently put more cp into Bastion so now I have 77cp in there giving me a 20% boost to damage absorbing effects. Wanna know how big my Hardened Ward is? 9.8k. Yep.

FriedEggSandwich

Wing wrote: »

hahahahahahaha

suck it, we cannot block, you cannot bubble XD

Wrong attitude right there. I have never played a dk, tank or even stamina build, and never will. But I was sad for the nerf to block and dodge. Attitudes like yours make me regret being rational.

DisgracefulMind

Alcast wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

This is not counter play. This is toxic game design. This is an I win button.

There is an easy fix, dont spam shields like there is no tomorrow
Hint: If there is no shield up, shieldbreaker does no damage

Telling a Light Armor caster Sorc to not use a shield is absolutely ridiculous. There is no reason that this set should be this out of control just to bypass the only defense a Sorcerer has. Instead of implementing such an insane set, they should have just decreased the bonus shield strength on Hardened Ward and called it good.

Please, you don't understand how to play a Caster Sorcerer at all, your "fix" is not viable at all.

Alcast

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

This is not counter play. This is toxic game design. This is an I win button.

There is an easy fix, dont spam shields like there is no tomorrow
Hint: If there is no shield up, shieldbreaker does no damage

Telling a Light Armor caster Sorc to not use a shield is absolutely ridiculous. There is no reason that this set should be this out of control just to bypass the only defense a Sorcerer has. Instead of implementing such an insane set, they should have just decreased the bonus shield strength on Hardened Ward and called it good.

Please, you don't understand how to play a Caster Sorcerer at all, your "fix" is not viable at all.

The set will get nerfed anyway, bc too many QQ.

The biggest issue was that Shieldchanges were useless...ZOS should have had another approach to shieldstack fix.

Like Minor/Major Shield

Angarato

i think most sorc just have to come back down to earth. theyre so used to 1vXing. they thought they were gods but now find out that they actually werent that good at pvp at all. denial is 1 of the stages of grief. dont be so hard on them.

Angarato

Alcast wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

This is not counter play. This is toxic game design. This is an I win button.

There is an easy fix, dont spam shields like there is no tomorrow
Hint: If there is no shield up, shieldbreaker does no damage

Telling a Light Armor caster Sorc to not use a shield is absolutely ridiculous. There is no reason that this set should be this out of control just to bypass the only defense a Sorcerer has. Instead of implementing such an insane set, they should have just decreased the bonus shield strength on Hardened Ward and called it good.

Please, you don't understand how to play a Caster Sorcerer at all, your "fix" is not viable at all.

The set will get nerfed anyway, bc too many QQ.

The biggest issue was that Shieldchanges were useless...ZOS should have had another approach to shieldstack fix.

Like Minor/Major Shield

you're probably right. back in the day we were expected to adapt and l2p. but we live in the QQ tantrum generation.

FriedEggSandwich

Alcast wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

This is not counter play. This is toxic game design. This is an I win button.

There is an easy fix, dont spam shields like there is no tomorrow
Hint: If there is no shield up, shieldbreaker does no damage

Telling a Light Armor caster Sorc to not use a shield is absolutely ridiculous. There is no reason that this set should be this out of control just to bypass the only defense a Sorcerer has. Instead of implementing such an insane set, they should have just decreased the bonus shield strength on Hardened Ward and called it good.

Please, you don't understand how to play a Caster Sorcerer at all, your "fix" is not viable at all.

The set will get nerfed anyway, bc too many QQ.

The biggest issue was that Shieldchanges were useless...ZOS should have had another approach to shieldstack fix.

Like Minor/Major Shield

Tried only using my 9.8k hardened ward yesterday. Kept getting killed by a lotus fan spammer. I could not cast it fast enough to outdo his dps, he killed me. I had rapid regen active too. My point is that currently shield stacking is still necessary to survive, or at least still necessary to get a chance at going offensive. If they removed the stacking they would need to buff individual shields.

Edit: the same is true for wrecking blow spam; 9.8k hardened ward is not enough to get a breather for long enough to go offensive.

Angarato

or you know. try not to get hit all the time? you want to be a tank in light armor yet have all the benefits of light armor. things have strenghts and weaknesses. sorcerers can wear heavy armor in this game, you choose light so you can do more damage. deal with your choice or adjust that choice.

Knootewoot

Looks like someone forgot to block and dodge roll to me. I believe sorcs forgot these 2 existed?

Psilent

Xeven wrote: »

Lets talk about what a light armor shield guy can do against this. In a 1v1 he would have to run an instant burst heal and keep pressure on the guy. Sorcs dont have one so they'll now be forcd to use resto. Armor doesnt help. He CANNOT drop his shield because then he will get wrecked with everything else. It's a 1 button hard counter, I win button.

What about all the bow users camping spawn, sniping anyone with a shield? What do we do about that? If this set stays like this, Light Armor will die in PvP, and with it, Magicka Builds will die as well.

Remove shield stacking.

Remove this set, make it have a cooldown, or give it a shield debuff instead.

Or I tell you what... Make Light mitigation equal to Medium, remove all shields, and give us a magicka Vigor morph. I'll roll with that...

but this... this gives us zero options...

I've been forced into resto staff on my DK due to how pathetic dragon's blood is now. Rapid Regen and Blessing of Restoration are much better heals.