Console players - We want text typing chat?

NewBlacksmurf

No, voice chat is enough

uberkull wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

That in my opinion is where we all need to point out attention.

Are there lingering issues, yes, is everyone happy, no but do we have options...YES we have A LOT of options
This game is one of the very few that is positioned to capture a lot of different audiences in one game
PC, PC casuals, PC elitist, console casuals, console elitist, curious PC/console, TES fans all around, handicap, verbal and auditory challenged, controller and voice chats people.

This is a job well done in just 12-18 months

Im pretty sure the only point I made this poll for is to get the opinion of the community that plans to play on console. I never would have made this poll if ZOS didn't originally announce in their VLog that they WOULD have text chat ('everything that's on PC will be there on console, including text chat'), then posted they were pulling it.

Why would I care to put all this effort in if I didn't support ZOS and this game? I'm a MMO veteran, with 10 years with WoW...along with numerous other PC MMOs. Now that next gen is bringing some solid MMOs to the cinsole, I want ESO to succeed.

So I'm pushing for text chat because I'm 'predicting' that people may not get the full MMO experience, especially those that are new to MMOs, without a text chat system. Then they finish the solo story and leave.

Seeing productive and positive conversations in text chat when you login to a MMO add to the social experience that there are real people doing things, not just some single player npcs. Sure, there are also the negatives of text chat, but as in real life...you should be able to filter those out, ignore them. I do however always get entertained by the text chat banter I see at times, it's comical.

The poll speaks for itself. A poll in a PC forum where people know MMOs best.

The poll speaks for but a very very small fraction of existing "PC" TESO players.
Of all who may buy this on console who didn't buy on PC, this poll cannot and does not capture any of their input.

We all know that only a small group even use the forums compared to the entire player base...
This poll does speak to that group but it doesn't even address the actual potential customers.

Maybe it gets at April - June PC customers and a few who came around after the transfer cut off. It doesn't even poll BETa console players

Respectfully this is good data for who it captures but logically there are a possible other 1.4 million or more votes unheard

Uberkull

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

uberkull wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

That in my opinion is where we all need to point out attention.

Are there lingering issues, yes, is everyone happy, no but do we have options...YES we have A LOT of options
This game is one of the very few that is positioned to capture a lot of different audiences in one game
PC, PC casuals, PC elitist, console casuals, console elitist, curious PC/console, TES fans all around, handicap, verbal and auditory challenged, controller and voice chats people.

This is a job well done in just 12-18 months

Im pretty sure the only point I made this poll for is to get the opinion of the community that plans to play on console. I never would have made this poll if ZOS didn't originally announce in their VLog that they WOULD have text chat ('everything that's on PC will be there on console, including text chat'), then posted they were pulling it.

Why would I care to put all this effort in if I didn't support ZOS and this game? I'm a MMO veteran, with 10 years with WoW...along with numerous other PC MMOs. Now that next gen is bringing some solid MMOs to the cinsole, I want ESO to succeed.

So I'm pushing for text chat because I'm 'predicting' that people may not get the full MMO experience, especially those that are new to MMOs, without a text chat system. Then they finish the solo story and leave.

Seeing productive and positive conversations in text chat when you login to a MMO add to the social experience that there are real people doing things, not just some single player npcs. Sure, there are also the negatives of text chat, but as in real life...you should be able to filter those out, ignore them. I do however always get entertained by the text chat banter I see at times, it's comical.

The poll speaks for itself. A poll in a PC forum where people know MMOs best.

Respectfully this is good data for who it captures but logically there are a possible other 1.4 million or more votes unheard

Fair enough. I will just say in my experience. people that participate on gaming forums have a vested interest in making their game better and voicing their opinions for devs to read. And it's really the main feedback mechanism that the developers use to consider changes.

So unless I can participate in ZOS developer standups...err meetings, this is the only channel I have.

NewBlacksmurf

No, voice chat is enough

uberkull wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

uberkull wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

That in my opinion is where we all need to point out attention.

Are there lingering issues, yes, is everyone happy, no but do we have options...YES we have A LOT of options
This game is one of the very few that is positioned to capture a lot of different audiences in one game
PC, PC casuals, PC elitist, console casuals, console elitist, curious PC/console, TES fans all around, handicap, verbal and auditory challenged, controller and voice chats people.

This is a job well done in just 12-18 months

Im pretty sure the only point I made this poll for is to get the opinion of the community that plans to play on console. I never would have made this poll if ZOS didn't originally announce in their VLog that they WOULD have text chat ('everything that's on PC will be there on console, including text chat'), then posted they were pulling it.

Why would I care to put all this effort in if I didn't support ZOS and this game? I'm a MMO veteran, with 10 years with WoW...along with numerous other PC MMOs. Now that next gen is bringing some solid MMOs to the cinsole, I want ESO to succeed.

So I'm pushing for text chat because I'm 'predicting' that people may not get the full MMO experience, especially those that are new to MMOs, without a text chat system. Then they finish the solo story and leave.

Seeing productive and positive conversations in text chat when you login to a MMO add to the social experience that there are real people doing things, not just some single player npcs. Sure, there are also the negatives of text chat, but as in real life...you should be able to filter those out, ignore them. I do however always get entertained by the text chat banter I see at times, it's comical.

The poll speaks for itself. A poll in a PC forum where people know MMOs best.

Respectfully this is good data for who it captures but logically there are a possible other 1.4 million or more votes unheard

Fair enough. I will just say in my experience. people that participate on gaming forums have a vested interest in making their game better and voicing their opinions for devs to read. And it's really the main feedback mechanism that the developers use to consider changes.

So unless I can participate in ZOS developer standups...err meetings, this is the only channel I have.

No problem there and I support what your doing.
If only there were a way to capture the others....

Alphashado

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

You can entertain the same audiences while having options that can be turned on/off. If you don't like text chat, you can turn it off. I do not think it's awesome that ZoS is alienating 2/3ds of a potential customer base. I want the game to make money because I want new content and customer support.

I think it's silly to believe that ZoS is intentionally excluding text chat because they want to cater to a very small niche crowd. There are likely technical reasons for it being excluded.

NewBlacksmurf

No, voice chat is enough

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

You can entertain the same audiences while having options that can be turned on/off. If you don't like text chat, you can turn it off. I do not think it's awesome that ZoS is alienating 2/3ds of a potential customer base. I want the game to make money because I want new content and customer support.

I think it's silly to believe that ZoS is intentionally excluding text chat because they want to cater to a very small niche crowd. There are likely technical reasons for it being excluded.

You cannot entertain the same audiences...which is proof through all the threads for and against

I don't think it's silly at all. If it was silly then all these threads about add it in would also be silly.
While I don't support adding it back, the threads aren't silly they are insightful but none of us should expect changes just because good or valid points are being discussed again within a very smal audience

The turn if off if you don't want it or like is the same argument as play on PC if you don't like or when people say we'll go play another game for other threads.

There is an obvious and distinct difference in audiences even evident in this very small group that use the forums who may or may not play on console

Edits above

darthbelanb14_ESO

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

I wish they'd left it out of NWO.

It's just NW, there is no "Online" in the title.

Text chat isn't necessary. Not even in the PC version.

Alphashado

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

You can entertain the same audiences while having options that can be turned on/off. If you don't like text chat, you can turn it off. I do not think it's awesome that ZoS is alienating 2/3ds of a potential customer base. I want the game to make money because I want new content and customer support.

I think it's silly to believe that ZoS is intentionally excluding text chat because they want to cater to a very small niche crowd. There are likely technical reasons for it being excluded.

You cannot entertain the same audiences...which is proof through all the threads for and against

I don't think it's silly at all. If it was silly then all these threads about add it in would also be silly.
While I don't support adding it back, the threads aren't silly they are insightful but none of us should expect changes just because good or valid points are being discussed again within a very smal audience

The turn if off if you don't want it or like is the same argument as play on PC if you don't like or when people say we'll go play another game for other threads.

There is an obvious and distinct difference in audiences even evident in this very small group that use the forums who may or may not play on console

Edits above

You don't seem to understand the "MMOs need revenue in order to survive" concept.

NewBlacksmurf

No, voice chat is enough

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

You can entertain the same audiences while having options that can be turned on/off. If you don't like text chat, you can turn it off. I do not think it's awesome that ZoS is alienating 2/3ds of a potential customer base. I want the game to make money because I want new content and customer support.

I think it's silly to believe that ZoS is intentionally excluding text chat because they want to cater to a very small niche crowd. There are likely technical reasons for it being excluded.

You cannot entertain the same audiences...which is proof through all the threads for and against

I don't think it's silly at all. If it was silly then all these threads about add it in would also be silly.
While I don't support adding it back, the threads aren't silly they are insightful but none of us should expect changes just because good or valid points are being discussed again within a very smal audience

The turn if off if you don't want it or like is the same argument as play on PC if you don't like or when people say we'll go play another game for other threads.

There is an obvious and distinct difference in audiences even evident in this very small group that use the forums who may or may not play on console

Edits above

You don't seem to understand the "MMOs need revenue in order to survive" concept.

Hmmm, I believe I do have a grasp on that concept.
Creating a game that addressed two audiences with two distinct experiences creates opportunity for some to buy both and others to buy the experience traditionally on PC and another experience crafted towards console.

This achieves more of an audience that attempting to pull the same audience on three platforms
It even offers logic to playing on both simultaneously

Please ellobarate on why you feel I don't grasp the revenue concept?

Uberkull

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

You can entertain the same audiences while having options that can be turned on/off. If you don't like text chat, you can turn it off. I do not think it's awesome that ZoS is alienating 2/3ds of a potential customer base. I want the game to make money because I want new content and customer support.

I think it's silly to believe that ZoS is intentionally excluding text chat because they want to cater to a very small niche crowd. There are likely technical reasons for it being excluded.

You cannot entertain the same audiences...which is proof through all the threads for and against

I don't think it's silly at all. If it was silly then all these threads about add it in would also be silly.
While I don't support adding it back, the threads aren't silly they are insightful but none of us should expect changes just because good or valid points are being discussed again within a very smal audience

The turn if off if you don't want it or like is the same argument as play on PC if you don't like or when people say we'll go play another game for other threads.

There is an obvious and distinct difference in audiences even evident in this very small group that use the forums who may or may not play on console

Edits above

You don't seem to understand the "MMOs need revenue in order to survive" concept.

This ^^

That's my whole point to this poll. I believe if you don't include text chat, a standard in MMOs, you will lose people within months on console.

Again, seeing the constant chatter in the text area keeps you playing as you might see a person selling something, LF1M in something you are interested in, or making a quick sale yourself. Then there's always that entertaining banter between people, great to read while grinding.

Taking this aspect out completely is like removing an entire feature from the game, people miss out on so much more.

Guilds with no Guild text chat? Really?

Sausage

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

I was running dungeon today and I had to explain the tactics, so I started to wonder how I do this on consoles, its going to take awfully long to do that, hopefully they figure this out.

NewBlacksmurf

No, voice chat is enough

uberkull wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

You can entertain the same audiences while having options that can be turned on/off. If you don't like text chat, you can turn it off. I do not think it's awesome that ZoS is alienating 2/3ds of a potential customer base. I want the game to make money because I want new content and customer support.

I think it's silly to believe that ZoS is intentionally excluding text chat because they want to cater to a very small niche crowd. There are likely technical reasons for it being excluded.

You cannot entertain the same audiences...which is proof through all the threads for and against

I don't think it's silly at all. If it was silly then all these threads about add it in would also be silly.
While I don't support adding it back, the threads aren't silly they are insightful but none of us should expect changes just because good or valid points are being discussed again within a very smal audience

The turn if off if you don't want it or like is the same argument as play on PC if you don't like or when people say we'll go play another game for other threads.

There is an obvious and distinct difference in audiences even evident in this very small group that use the forums who may or may not play on console

Edits above

You don't seem to understand the "MMOs need revenue in order to survive" concept.

This ^^

That's my whole point to this poll. I believe if you don't include text chat, a standard in MMOs, you will lose people within months on console.

Again, seeing the constant chatter in the text area keeps you playing as you might see a person selling something, LF1M in something you are interested in, or making a quick sale yourself. Then there's always that entertaining banter between people, great to read while grinding.

Taking this aspect out completely is like removing an entire feature from the game, people miss out on so much more.

Guilds with no Guild text chat? Really?

Is it possible that that's part of the marketing plan?

They removed the sub which also goes hand in hand with an MMO
They removed the call n respose combat
They removed text chat
They removed customized UI
They removed keyboard and mouse support
They added controller support
They added voice chat
They added the crown store
EDIT: they intentionally never added a global AH

To me that is pretty clear that the market isn't towards a traditional MMO crowd.
Maybe I'm wrong but paying for the rights of TES to create an online game that we see as an MMO but without a lot of its traditional features and now the above...BIG change in the marketing plan and we all know that the forum polls were heavily against this

I think it's intentional for console

Sausage

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

Sausage wrote: »

I was running dungeon today and I had to explain the tactics, so I started to wonder how I do this on consoles, its going to take awfully long to do that, hopefully they figure this out.

Im going to shamelessly reply to my own post.

Would it be great if there was some tradeable/sellable notes. For example, player writes Banishes Cell tactics, and could trade or give them to another player.

Uberkull

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

uberkull wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

You can entertain the same audiences while having options that can be turned on/off. If you don't like text chat, you can turn it off. I do not think it's awesome that ZoS is alienating 2/3ds of a potential customer base. I want the game to make money because I want new content and customer support.

I think it's silly to believe that ZoS is intentionally excluding text chat because they want to cater to a very small niche crowd. There are likely technical reasons for it being excluded.

You cannot entertain the same audiences...which is proof through all the threads for and against

I don't think it's silly at all. If it was silly then all these threads about add it in would also be silly.
While I don't support adding it back, the threads aren't silly they are insightful but none of us should expect changes just because good or valid points are being discussed again within a very smal audience

The turn if off if you don't want it or like is the same argument as play on PC if you don't like or when people say we'll go play another game for other threads.

There is an obvious and distinct difference in audiences even evident in this very small group that use the forums who may or may not play on console

Edits above

You don't seem to understand the "MMOs need revenue in order to survive" concept.

This ^^

That's my whole point to this poll. I believe if you don't include text chat, a standard in MMOs, you will lose people within months on console.

Again, seeing the constant chatter in the text area keeps you playing as you might see a person selling something, LF1M in something you are interested in, or making a quick sale yourself. Then there's always that entertaining banter between people, great to read while grinding.

Taking this aspect out completely is like removing an entire feature from the game, people miss out on so much more.

Guilds with no Guild text chat? Really?

Is it possible that that's part of the marketing plan?

They removed the sub which also goes hand in hand with an MMO
They removed the call n respose combat
They removed text chat
They removed customized UI
They removed keyboard and mouse support
They added controller support
They added voice chat
They added the crown store


To me that is pretty clear that the market isn't towards a traditional MMO crowd.
Maybe I'm wrong but paying for the rights of TES to create an online game that we see as an MMO but without a lot of its traditional features and now the above...BIG change in the marketing plan and we all know that the forum polls were heavily against this

I think it's intentional for console

You know Smurf...before I made this poll, I knew you would be the main counterpoint to this whole discussion.

You are missing the point of the development effort for a console PORT. They didn't make a new game, they made a port to console. The year delay was because they decided that the initial console UI they had wasn't sufficient and they started from scratch and redid the UI.

Using your points:
They removed the sub which also goes hand in hand with an MMO
- They removed subs because people weren't willing to pay to subs in this age of FTP MMOs. The sub model doesn't work as well as it did in 2004. This had nothing to do with console.
They removed the call n respose combat
- No idea what this is referring to
They removed text chat
- They had it in and removed it.
They removed customized UI
- This wasn't in the PC...unless you are referring to addons. If so that's because Sony and Microsoft don't allow them.
They removed keyboard and mouse support
- They were making a console port...for a controller
They added controller support
- Duh...it's a console port
They added voice chat
- That's default functionality of the consoles...they didn't add anything other than integrating it into the game. People might even ignore it and use Xbox Live party chat for small groups of friends. Another reason why text chat is important, people don't want to invite people to THEIR Live party chat
They added the crown store
- This has nothing to do with console. It's their revenue system because they dropped the failing sub system.

Heromofo

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

Holy hell if this poll does not do the trick i dont know what will.
I do agree we need it because as pointed out by deltia on the beta doing the dungeon.
Bloke was not using the chat and he could not talk to him unless he sent him a message over psn soooo that didnt work well.
But the console version looks so god dam good i cant wait to try also i recommend all pc peeps give it a look and consider comming with us.

Uberkull

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

Heromofo wrote: »

But the console version looks so god dam good i cant wait to try also i recommend all pc peeps give it a look and consider comming with us.

Hero...I'll go a little off topic. On all the Twitch streams I watched, and it was alot this past weekend(Thur-Sun), I noticed the console version colors looked washed out. Did you notice this?

I asked Ruben to do a side by side on Twitch with Xbox One console and his PC account. It looked washed out LINK

Were you able to play beta and notice this washed out look?

NewBlacksmurf

No, voice chat is enough

uberkull wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

uberkull wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

You can entertain the same audiences while having options that can be turned on/off. If you don't like text chat, you can turn it off. I do not think it's awesome that ZoS is alienating 2/3ds of a potential customer base. I want the game to make money because I want new content and customer support.

I think it's silly to believe that ZoS is intentionally excluding text chat because they want to cater to a very small niche crowd. There are likely technical reasons for it being excluded.

You cannot entertain the same audiences...which is proof through all the threads for and against

I don't think it's silly at all. If it was silly then all these threads about add it in would also be silly.
While I don't support adding it back, the threads aren't silly they are insightful but none of us should expect changes just because good or valid points are being discussed again within a very smal audience

The turn if off if you don't want it or like is the same argument as play on PC if you don't like or when people say we'll go play another game for other threads.

There is an obvious and distinct difference in audiences even evident in this very small group that use the forums who may or may not play on console

Edits above

You don't seem to understand the "MMOs need revenue in order to survive" concept.

This ^^

That's my whole point to this poll. I believe if you don't include text chat, a standard in MMOs, you will lose people within months on console.

Again, seeing the constant chatter in the text area keeps you playing as you might see a person selling something, LF1M in something you are interested in, or making a quick sale yourself. Then there's always that entertaining banter between people, great to read while grinding.

Taking this aspect out completely is like removing an entire feature from the game, people miss out on so much more.

Guilds with no Guild text chat? Really?

Is it possible that that's part of the marketing plan?

They removed the sub which also goes hand in hand with an MMO
They removed the call n respose combat
They removed text chat
They removed customized UI
They removed keyboard and mouse support
They added controller support
They added voice chat
They added the crown store


To me that is pretty clear that the market isn't towards a traditional MMO crowd.
Maybe I'm wrong but paying for the rights of TES to create an online game that we see as an MMO but without a lot of its traditional features and now the above...BIG change in the marketing plan and we all know that the forum polls were heavily against this

I think it's intentional for console

You know Smurf...before I made this poll, I knew you would be the main counterpoint to this whole discussion.

You are missing the point of the development effort for a console PORT. They didn't make a new game, they made a port to console. The year delay was because they decided that the initial console UI they had wasn't sufficient and they started from scratch and redid the UI.

Using your points:
They removed the sub which also goes hand in hand with an MMO
- They removed subs because people weren't willing to pay to subs in this age of FTP MMOs. The sub model doesn't work as well as it did in 2004. This had nothing to do with console.
They removed the call n respose combat
- No idea what this is referring to
They removed text chat
- They had it in and removed it.
They removed customized UI
- This wasn't in the PC...unless you are referring to addons. If so that's because Sony and Microsoft don't allow them.
They removed keyboard and mouse support
- They were making a console port...for a controller
They added controller support
- Duh...it's a console port
They added voice chat
- That's default functionality of the consoles...they didn't add anything other than integrating it into the game. People might even ignore it and use Xbox Live party chat for small groups of friends. Another reason why text chat is important, people don't want to invite people to THEIR Live party chat
They added the crown store
- This has nothing to do with console. It's their revenue system because they dropped the failing sub system.

I think I've shared valid points of view and you have too but it doesn't seem that your open to accepting that our views differ which drive reason for separated experiences by platform. I'm not budging and neither are you OR those on either side and not in the middle.

I'm not ignoring your points or anyone that is for adding text chat to console.
The revenue of ZOS in some people's eyes is failing but we've yet to see any revenue articles to suggest such.
For all we know, they crown store and ESO plus offset the sub revenue as I can personally share that in addition to ESO plus, I've spent an extra $25 since the sub dropped. So instead of $14.99 they got $40 so I covered me and a few other people.
Then you have all those people who bought $30-$130 worth of game time for the senche mount.

I think your applying your points as valid against no factual information and a limited amount of opinion who are inside the pro MMO PC market only.

I honestly don't know if you're correct or if I'm correct or if we are both wrong but evidence suggests that ZOS marketing plan is moving forward regardless of our opinions.

Edit : so regardless of where people stand. It's get on board or keep sailing
Choose one of three boats and that's it

Heromofo

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

uberkull wrote: »

Heromofo wrote: »

But the console version looks so god dam good i cant wait to try also i recommend all pc peeps give it a look and consider comming with us.

Hero...I'll go a little off topic. On all the Twitch streams I watched, and it was alot this past weekend(Thur-Sun), I noticed the console version colors looked washed out. Did you notice this?

I asked Ruben to do a side by side on Twitch with Xbox One console and his PC account. It looked washed out LINK

Were you able to play beta and notice this washed out look?

Aaah uuum i can explain this for you bud ok so when people stream or record they need to adjust there options to match the tv if they dont they have problems like this.

Ima show ya what the game truly looks like hold on bud

Here @uberkull
https://youtu.be/26TrNMEsXEE

Uberkull

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

Heromofo wrote: »

uberkull wrote: »

Heromofo wrote: »

But the console version looks so god dam good i cant wait to try also i recommend all pc peeps give it a look and consider comming with us.

Hero...I'll go a little off topic. On all the Twitch streams I watched, and it was alot this past weekend(Thur-Sun), I noticed the console version colors looked washed out. Did you notice this?

I asked Ruben to do a side by side on Twitch with Xbox One console and his PC account. It looked washed out LINK

Were you able to play beta and notice this washed out look?

Aaah uuum i can explain this for you bud ok so when people stream or record they need to adjust there options to match the tv if they dont they have problems like this.

Ima show ya what the game truly looks like hold on bud

Here @uberkull
https://youtu.be/26TrNMEsXEE

That's what I heard. Capture cards not set properly. Thanks for sharing the video!

Heromofo

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

uberkull wrote: »

Heromofo wrote: »

uberkull wrote: »

Heromofo wrote: »

But the console version looks so god dam good i cant wait to try also i recommend all pc peeps give it a look and consider comming with us.

Hero...I'll go a little off topic. On all the Twitch streams I watched, and it was alot this past weekend(Thur-Sun), I noticed the console version colors looked washed out. Did you notice this?

I asked Ruben to do a side by side on Twitch with Xbox One console and his PC account. It looked washed out LINK

Were you able to play beta and notice this washed out look?

Aaah uuum i can explain this for you bud ok so when people stream or record they need to adjust there options to match the tv if they dont they have problems like this.

Ima show ya what the game truly looks like hold on bud

Here @uberkull
https://youtu.be/26TrNMEsXEE

That's what I heard. Capture cards not set properly. Thanks for sharing the video!

Np alot of guildies and mates going to ps4 so o figure i will as well.
I hope people get to see the real version of console eso because it is really well done.
Going to be really odd to play a mmo via controller lol.

Ser Lobo

No, voice chat is enough

darthbelanb14_ESO wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

I wish they'd left it out of NWO.

It's just NW, there is no "Online" in the title.

Text chat isn't necessary. Not even in the PC version.

The "Online' was a distinction beta players made when the game first came out, because there was already a Neverwinter in many peoples mind (even though that was actually 'Neverwinter Nights'

I'm still holding it, but yeah, it's not an official title. More or less now it's to insult Cryptic for their money hungry approach by attaching the negative connection to the new world order. But that's a little off topic.

Ser Lobo

No, voice chat is enough

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

uberkull wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

And...if I can add

It's not about winning or loosing the argument but realizing that ZOS the company is and has been listening since 2013!!!
How awesome is it that very soon the same game can entertain two to three different audiences simultaneously.

You can entertain the same audiences while having options that can be turned on/off. If you don't like text chat, you can turn it off. I do not think it's awesome that ZoS is alienating 2/3ds of a potential customer base. I want the game to make money because I want new content and customer support.

I think it's silly to believe that ZoS is intentionally excluding text chat because they want to cater to a very small niche crowd. There are likely technical reasons for it being excluded.

You cannot entertain the same audiences...which is proof through all the threads for and against

I don't think it's silly at all. If it was silly then all these threads about add it in would also be silly.
While I don't support adding it back, the threads aren't silly they are insightful but none of us should expect changes just because good or valid points are being discussed again within a very smal audience

The turn if off if you don't want it or like is the same argument as play on PC if you don't like or when people say we'll go play another game for other threads.

There is an obvious and distinct difference in audiences even evident in this very small group that use the forums who may or may not play on console

Edits above

You don't seem to understand the "MMOs need revenue in order to survive" concept.

This ^^

That's my whole point to this poll. I believe if you don't include text chat, a standard in MMOs, you will lose people within months on console.

Again, seeing the constant chatter in the text area keeps you playing as you might see a person selling something, LF1M in something you are interested in, or making a quick sale yourself. Then there's always that entertaining banter between people, great to read while grinding.

Taking this aspect out completely is like removing an entire feature from the game, people miss out on so much more.

Guilds with no Guild text chat? Really?

Is it possible that that's part of the marketing plan?

They removed the sub which also goes hand in hand with an MMO
They removed the call n respose combat
They removed text chat
They removed customized UI
They removed keyboard and mouse support
They added controller support
They added voice chat
They added the crown store
EDIT: they intentionally never added a global AH

To me that is pretty clear that the market isn't towards a traditional MMO crowd.
Maybe I'm wrong but paying for the rights of TES to create an online game that we see as an MMO but without a lot of its traditional features and now the above...BIG change in the marketing plan and we all know that the forum polls were heavily against this

I think it's intentional for console

These pretty much sum up my experiences as well. The trend of ZOS's judgement calls and decisions are in many ways counter to traditional MMO thinking. I'd add some in-game mechanics to this list that, to me, highlighted that console adaptability or even focus was intended from the start:

- No Tab Targeting
- No DPS timers/scrolling numbers (any written information has a difficult time scaling per TV and aspect ratio)
- Five power configuration
- 1st Person Focus
- No innate macro support
- No traditional 'cooldown' mechanics, focusing more on 'twitch' gameplay.

I believe thier decisions from the very beginning have been entirely focused on console or at the very least had consoles in mind. I also believe that ZOS intentionally stepped away from many common MMO elements, and many PC players have noticed and complained ... adamantly.

As an Action RPG that includes some grouping, this game has been spectactular. Skyrim with Friends, and it works great. As a traditional MMO, it has a very difficult time being accepted by the MMO community. Graphics are great, but with so many mechanics being absent that the MMO player of the last decade has grown dependent on, it's betrayed a large portion of that playerbase, or forced another portion to rely on unreliable addon support to compensate ... poorly.

It is my honest opinion that, text chat or no, the impact this game will have on Consoles will be great. I feel it'll be far more popular on consoles than on PC, and far more popular with non-MMO players and those used to single-player RPG's than it ever has with MMO players.

The only reason I've argued over text chat, is because I can forsee it betraying many more console users than it's lack will betray PC converts. But that is unprovable until after the fact.

Alphashado

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

This is from a different thread but I will post it here as well because it applies:

"This is not an RPG. This is an MMORPG. There is a huge difference. One of the major problems with ESO is the blurred distinction between the two. Too many people are looking at ESO as just another ES game.

It will be a terrible mistake if ZoS continues down the road of trying to make both crowds happy. Excluding text chat from an MMORPG in any platform is a terrible, terrible idea. There are simply too many aspects to an MMORPG that require multiple forms of communication. If the game was designed to facilitate a few friends playing together, that would be fine. But then the classification of the game would be COOP RPG, not MMORPG. Every single aspect of an MMORPG is designed around fluid, concise, multiple ways of instantly communicating with multitudes of other people."

NewBlacksmurf

No, voice chat is enough

Alphashado wrote: »

This is from a different thread but I will post it here as well because it applies:

"This is not an RPG. This is an MMORPG. There is a huge difference. One of the major problems with ESO is the blurred distinction between the two. Too many people are looking at ESO as just another ES game.

It will be a terrible mistake if ZoS continues down the road of trying to make both crowds happy. Excluding text chat from an MMORPG in any platform is a terrible, terrible idea. There are simply too many aspects to an MMORPG that require multiple forms of communication. If the game was designed to facilitate a few friends playing together, that would be fine. But then the classification of the game would be COOP RPG, not MMORPG. Every single aspect of an MMORPG is designed around fluid, concise, multiple ways of instantly communicating with multitudes of other people."

Also from another thread...

Respectfully the traditional definition of an MMO if we use that, yes it's not an RPG but an MMO is a type of RPG game.

Terrible....hey, I respect your opinion but it doesn't appear that they are making a terrible mistake.

I thinkit's helpful to not apply "our own" must have features when using the category mmorpg game because while this version is different, it's no different than any other online multiplayer game that uses voice chat only for console.

I recall the "an MMO will not survive without a sub" argument and now we see a lot of B2P and F2P MMO games.
Maybe this is the start of a voice chat only MMO genre

Ser Lobo

No, voice chat is enough

Alphashado wrote: »

This is from a different thread but I will post it here as well because it applies:

"This is not an RPG. This is an MMORPG. There is a huge difference. One of the major problems with ESO is the blurred distinction between the two. Too many people are looking at ESO as just another ES game.

It will be a terrible mistake if ZoS continues down the road of trying to make both crowds happy. Excluding text chat from an MMORPG in any platform is a terrible, terrible idea. There are simply too many aspects to an MMORPG that require multiple forms of communication. If the game was designed to facilitate a few friends playing together, that would be fine. But then the classification of the game would be COOP RPG, not MMORPG. Every single aspect of an MMORPG is designed around fluid, concise, multiple ways of instantly communicating with multitudes of other people."

And as an MMO, its consistently failed and lacked key features MMO players were comfortable with and many considered necessary to make the game playable.

It's possible that ZOS has a broader definition of 'massively multiplayer online' than some of the MMO playerbase. Or it's possible that they are attempting to redifine a stagnant genre that hasn't seen true innovation in over 10 years (World of Warcraft and EvE Online being the examples given).

I mean, the biggest hyped MMO of 2014, Wildstar, defined itself as being 'original WoW'. That was it's advertising point. And one of ESO's biggest advertising points was 'RvRvR just like you remembered it in Dark Age of Camelot'.

Who knows. I do know that some people hate ESO for not having scrolling damage numbers and a full power toobar and tab targetting and more defined and limited classes and power cooldowns and epic gear grinds and arena pvp ....

Wow. That list gets pretty long. I wonder what the real Console playerbase will complain that the game doesn't have?

Alphashado

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

And some people will simply always defend a minority opinion just because they enjoy defending minority opinions. While this is fairly admirable in a political or social injustice debate, it has no helpful bearing on a service designed by it's very nature to facilitate multitudes of people with a majority interest that are partaking in such a service due to the implied components of the service based on the very nature of the service itself.

Many people miss the good old days of 8 tracks and cassette tapes. There is even a very niche market for them as well as records.

But you don't see many major music labels producing modern music on them because there simply isn't enough demand for it. Just like there isn't much demand for an MMORPG with no text chat.

Alphashado

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

This is from a different thread but I will post it here as well because it applies:

"This is not an RPG. This is an MMORPG. There is a huge difference. One of the major problems with ESO is the blurred distinction between the two. Too many people are looking at ESO as just another ES game.

It will be a terrible mistake if ZoS continues down the road of trying to make both crowds happy. Excluding text chat from an MMORPG in any platform is a terrible, terrible idea. There are simply too many aspects to an MMORPG that require multiple forms of communication. If the game was designed to facilitate a few friends playing together, that would be fine. But then the classification of the game would be COOP RPG, not MMORPG. Every single aspect of an MMORPG is designed around fluid, concise, multiple ways of instantly communicating with multitudes of other people."

And as an MMO, its consistently failed and lacked key features MMO players were comfortable with and many considered necessary to make the game playable.

It's possible that ZOS has a broader definition of 'massively multiplayer online' than some of the MMO playerbase. Or it's possible that they are attempting to redifine a stagnant genre that hasn't seen true innovation in over 10 years (World of Warcraft and EvE Online being the examples given).

I mean, the biggest hyped MMO of 2014, Wildstar, defined itself as being 'original WoW'. That was it's advertising point. And one of ESO's biggest advertising points was 'RvRvR just like you remembered it in Dark Age of Camelot'.

Who knows. I do know that some people hate ESO for not having scrolling damage numbers and a full power toobar and tab targetting and more defined and limited classes and power cooldowns and epic gear grinds and arena pvp ....

Wow. That list gets pretty long. I wonder what the real Console playerbase will complain that the game doesn't have?

All of that stuff is absolute fluff compared to the basic fundamental issue of communication.

I could just say "oh well, I'm playing on PC, why do I care what they do on consoles". But as usual I try to see the bigger picture here. I learned a very long time ago that it's wise to think outside of the box. And this is not a good idea from a revenue standpoint. I want good customer service for the PC version. I want good, new content updates for the PC version. I want good maintenance done on the PC version.

None of that will happen if the console version falls flat on its face. And alienating 2/3ds of the potential customer base is the very definition of failure.

Ser Lobo

No, voice chat is enough

Alphashado wrote: »

And some people will simply always defend a minority opinion just because they enjoy defending minority opinions. While this is fairly admirable in a political or social injustice debate, it has no helpful bearing on a service designed by it's very nature to facilitate multitudes of people with a majority interest that are partaking in such a service due to the implied components of the service based on the very nature of the service itself.

Many people miss the good old days of 8 tracks and cassette tapes. There is even a very niche market for them as well as records.

But you don't see many major music labels producing modern music on them because there simply isn't enough demand for it. Just like there isn't much demand for an MMORPG with no text chat.

But plenty of demand for a multiplayer action RPG with a persistent world on consoles. Or at least I, and I assume ZOS, feel so.

From the sales numbers floating around, it seems there isn't much demand for MMORPGs in general anymore. A shame to me, because they have been one of my favorite genre's (at one point, my favorite hands down) for over two decades. But in the past ten years, if you didn't like WoW, you pretty much didn't like any new MMO that came out either because they were all so bloody similar to WoW. I had my heart set on SWTOR at one time.

Thank god for EvE. Up until I started running into the action-based combat of Neverwinter (which then led me to Skyrim with Friends), there was simply download-delete of game after game that failed to do anything new or different enough.

Course, this is all just my personal opinion. I don't see myself as a champion of ***, just a person who has been around a long time and is tired of seeing the same things over and over. Text chat isn't that, but I can admit, I am a little tired of spam. oh, am I tired ...

Uberkull

Yes, there has to be text chat in a MMO

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

It's possible that ZOS has a broader definition of 'massively multiplayer online' than some of the MMO playerbase. Or it's possible that they are attempting to redifine a stagnant genre that hasn't seen true innovation in over 10 years (World of Warcraft and EvE Online being the examples given).

I wouldn't say there is anything stagnant over at Blizzard with WoW. Current subscribers at 8 million. They are constantly adding content and groundbreaking innovations to the MMO genre that other games copy. It is the standard in MMOs like EQ was before them.

I would hope ZOS pays attention to their success and what they've added to their game.

NewBlacksmurf

No, voice chat is enough

uberkull wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

It's possible that ZOS has a broader definition of 'massively multiplayer online' than some of the MMO playerbase. Or it's possible that they are attempting to redifine a stagnant genre that hasn't seen true innovation in over 10 years (World of Warcraft and EvE Online being the examples given).

I wouldn't say there is anything stagnant over at Blizzard with WoW. Current subscribers at 8 million. They are constantly adding content and groundbreaking innovations to the MMO genre that other games copy. It is the standard in MMOs like EQ was before them.

I would hope ZOS pays attention to their success and what they've added to their game.

Hold on...it's two different games. For a different age group. WoW is teen rating and TESO is mature

That a pretty big difference
Also WoW is now 10+ years old and their success was BEING different than any other MMO at the time. I think they are paying attention to WoW's success

And capitalizing on it. How many ppl were asking Blizzard to port wow to console. A lot but for some reasons Blizzard didn't do it. Maybe ZOS and Blizzard know something we don't

Ser Lobo

No, voice chat is enough

Alphashado wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

This is from a different thread but I will post it here as well because it applies:

"This is not an RPG. This is an MMORPG. There is a huge difference. One of the major problems with ESO is the blurred distinction between the two. Too many people are looking at ESO as just another ES game.

It will be a terrible mistake if ZoS continues down the road of trying to make both crowds happy. Excluding text chat from an MMORPG in any platform is a terrible, terrible idea. There are simply too many aspects to an MMORPG that require multiple forms of communication. If the game was designed to facilitate a few friends playing together, that would be fine. But then the classification of the game would be COOP RPG, not MMORPG. Every single aspect of an MMORPG is designed around fluid, concise, multiple ways of instantly communicating with multitudes of other people."

And as an MMO, its consistently failed and lacked key features MMO players were comfortable with and many considered necessary to make the game playable.

It's possible that ZOS has a broader definition of 'massively multiplayer online' than some of the MMO playerbase. Or it's possible that they are attempting to redifine a stagnant genre that hasn't seen true innovation in over 10 years (World of Warcraft and EvE Online being the examples given).

I mean, the biggest hyped MMO of 2014, Wildstar, defined itself as being 'original WoW'. That was it's advertising point. And one of ESO's biggest advertising points was 'RvRvR just like you remembered it in Dark Age of Camelot'.

Who knows. I do know that some people hate ESO for not having scrolling damage numbers and a full power toobar and tab targetting and more defined and limited classes and power cooldowns and epic gear grinds and arena pvp ....

Wow. That list gets pretty long. I wonder what the real Console playerbase will complain that the game doesn't have?

All of that stuff is absolute fluff compared to the basic fundamental issue of communication.

I could just say "oh well, I'm playing on PC, why do I care what they do on consoles". But as usual I try to see the bigger picture here. I learned a very long time ago that it's wise to think outside of the box. And this is not a good idea from a revenue standpoint. I want good customer service for the PC version. I want good, new content updates for the PC version. I want good maintenance done on the PC version.

None of that will happen if the console version falls flat on its face. And alienating 2/3ds of the potential customer base is the very definition of failure.

In essence I agree. The only real point is the '2/3rds' argument. I feel those numbers, just like the numbers of this poll, are pretty horribly skewed by our opinions and bias, as well as our limited personal perspectives (unless you work as a marketing rep for a large cross-platform developer, at which point I'd say your perspective is a little better than mine, a simple gamer, hehehe). I say our, because I am just as guilty.

Then again I'm not against adding it for the sake of extra options. I'm against setting it as a feature that must be relied upon in any way by a playerbase which may not be familiar, ready, or equipped to use it.

Like forcing PC players to use voice chat would fail. Almost every PC has a keyboard, and nowadays most of them have a microphone hooked up *somewhere*. But unless the user goes out and invests in a decent headset, the experience will be far from pleasing or acceptable. We all know what 'aquarium voice' does to our gaming experiences.

Forcing a keyboard on console players would, in my opinion, have the same effect. As an option to use as we need it, sure. But since the on-screen keyboard is so clunky (on Xbox, which is all I'll speak for), keypads aren't built to allow us to use headphones (which all have to be connected to the controller, 'wireless' or not), and wired/wireless keyboards take up important USB ports and may force us to be closer to the TV than we can be, the impact on console gamers may be 'less than ideal', and could push some away.

We all talk obliquely about options to turn off, sure. And surely ZOS in it's great wisdom wouldn't forget to add such a feature, right? And while some so calmly state 'you can just ignore it', and others calmly state 'you can buy a $10 keyboard', it's no different than an ignorant console player telling a PC player to just 'buy a $10 headset' or 'just ignore the voices'. In the end, it's disrespectful to our perspective sides, and ignores the real issues that concern those players.



Ahh, the decision is ZOS's. I feel very comfortable that I've done a good job expressing my opinions as a console player with no intent or impact of disrespecting the opinions of any PC converts out there. Others may disagree, but that's their right. Others may dislike me for disagreeing with them ... but hey, nobodies perfect.

IF chat makes it onto consoles with an option to turn it off, I'll happily do so, advise friends how to do so, and go about adding NewBlackSmurf to my friends list and playing to my hearts content. If they don't add chat, I'm still happy and unbothered. And if they add it with only a 'fade out' feature or no option to remove it, I'll be back here doing exactly what many who want chat are doing ... stating my opinion and asking for a change.

Oh, and I'll probably keep replying. These are the best discussions I've had on these forums in months.