1.6.5 Sorcerer detailed balance feedback

Tankqull · February 2015

michael.patersonrwb17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys, thanks for your patience. We do have a status to share regarding Sorcerers as they currently stand.

First, there is one outstanding issue with Crystal Fragments not proccing when you cast Bolt Escape; we are aiming to fix this by time Update 6 is live. While we aren’t planning to implement any additional changes before Update 6 goes live, we will be keeping a very close eye on how Sorcerers – and all classes – perform in a Live environment, and will make tweaks as necessary. With Update 6 just around the corner, we don’t want to make any drastic changes that could affect gameplay in a negative way.

That said, we do have plans to make the Sorcerer more effective as a stamina DPS, tank, and healer. The first change we already made towards that direction is allowing the Clannfear to heal the caster based on their maximum health when the Clannfear is killed or dismissed. In a future update, we will be looking at giving the Sorcerer unique ways to fulfill the healer role, or deal damage with stamina-based abilities. Some specific issues we will also be evaluating are the number of toggled abilities on the class, Surge healing cooldown, and tweaks to make Dark Exchange more useful.

Please continue to report any issues you may come across, and thank you for all your support and feedback!

Alright, I feel as if I want to highlight the points you made, I'm an avid fan of the Sorc healing capability as it stands right now, in PvE, Sorcs dominate all over Templars in terms of healing. Reason being, I have healed Sanctum, and Dragonstar Arena (I have the 58minute time healing it without a Templar). The ONLY change that you should make is revert the Suppression Field, I haven't played PTS but from what I read was that was that it no longer stuns enemies? If that is the case, it's totally contradicting the name "Suppression Field", having it give the major buffs that it does in PTS is honestly pointless and useless. Negate is the one thing that made Sorcs stand far above Templars in terms of healing.

Please take this from me

you forgott the change to healing stuffs beeing no longer weapon dmg thus sorcs advantage by surge is gone too. so the healingoutput of staffes in normalized between all classes making sorc heals (wich i quite liked previous aswell) drop by a large margin as we have nothing to add to the staff heals by ourselves.

pppontus · February 2015

Inubis wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Honestly, everyone including a blind man can see that 3600 CP balance is non-existant at the moment. The entire game is upside down with 3600 CP, flat out broken.. but since it will be 2 years until we get there.. I've just completely left it out because it's just one of those things that I might as well deal with another day.. as in when someone actually gets there.

Well said... I do not think I will actually get through to you but for the sake of trying in the words of Billy Eichner "Away... We... Go"

(^x is the precentage of its maximum capability. The higher the output the better)

You have two Objects:
Object-A^100 and Object-B^100

Object-B^100 has an output of 1,000 but Object-A^100 only has an output of 200

It would be a clear assesment that Object-A^100 is inferior? correct?

So would it be safe to assume that after this testing Object-B^25 would be superior to Object-A^25?

Now sure you could account for all the variables between ^0 to ^100 (since the points are not applied uniform in real world application) but when you really evaluate the CP system there are only a small ammount of trees that would contribute to stamina DPS and Magicka DPS so its safe to assume (as a end game DPSer) that you will be applying these points evenly depending on your build. Obviously this requires a fair ammount computational thinking to comprehend (I do not mean this as an insult).

I apologize that I am not as articulate as the OP. My real concern is viable magicka based DPS in comparison with stamina based DPS at a 1 for 1 ratio. Not whether or not points might be spent for something like sneaking or whatever. The testing at this level demonstrates there is an inherent problem not in the CP system but on the class level. If it was corrected now the problem wouldnt even have to exist in the first place.

I prefer testing things that will affect me now and in the upcoming few months, as opposed to in 2 years. I don't plan longer for my in-game future than I even do for my RL one.

ZOS_ShannonM · February 2015

Hello folks,

While we understand your frustration regarding sorcerers, we would like to reiterate that we encourage constructive feedback. Please keep your posts civil and do not resort to personal attacks and insults.

Thank you for understanding.

Morvul · February 2015

pppontus wrote: »

Inubis wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Inubis wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

For real? I definitely have NOT seen that. I've seen one Stam DK claim to do 15K with 2H. It seems 2H is quite OP atm, but that's an issue with 2H and every class can do like 15K just wrecking blow.. if that is the issue I can support it, because that's just silly. Doesn't make other builds less viable really, just atm anyone not having a 2H sword is comparably gimped..

+ I'll repeat something I always say when people bring up DKs: never compare your burst DPS to a DK because if he has Standard of Might he'll boost all his DPS by 20% for 20 seconds = OP, problem is now he can only do that for 20 secs out of 83 per fight. So the fight needs to be 80 secs + to give accurate results with SOM.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBwEoj14_68

^^ Just because I am not in a lazy mood.

Well, obviously we can instantly discount the tests on Nomeg as you never DPS test on undead. That's like DPS testing 101.

His results on Blood Spawn is impressive to say the least. Is there any info on CP used and such? I mean, I sure as hell can't do that DPS with my DK and my measly 70 CP, not a chance in hell. He could obviously just be 100x better than me at Stamina DPS, but .. it seems absolutely crazy imo. Either way, if that is the way it is then maybe certain Stam builds need nerfs to be brought in line with the rest of the game. Because my NB DW, NB Magicka, Sorc Magicka and DK Magicka all seem to be pretty even otherwise and compares well to the Stam/Mag Templars I've seen and well, anything apart from that video....

Edit: I just followed the link, mate, that is with full CP.... don't compare 70 CP to 3600 please.

Well I agree. The first test is moot (but he also ranges higher at 22k if I believe so we could just offset it by 2k) secondly why not compare it to full CP? I was comparing it to full CP on a sorc... Its not like I am comparing apples to oranges. I am comparing a 3600 template to a 3600 template. If you have a 3600 thats hitting 20k with a magicka build please send it my way because I have yet to see it.

Edit: Just to clarify when I do my testing I am not testing with my current characters build but rather trying to test the maximum that can be achived. For example if your testing at different CP allotments your test is worthless because obviously there will be so much variation. But if you take 2 classes put them as high as you can and test them side by side and one clearly out performs the other then the issue is across the board.

Honestly, everyone including a blind man can see that 3600 CP balance is non-existant at the moment. The entire game is upside down with 3600 CP, flat out broken.. but since it will be 2 years until we get there.. I've just completely left it out because it's just one of those things that I might as well deal with another day.. as in when someone actually gets there.

pretty much agree.
CP system gives strong boosts to pretty much everything, but a select few builds gain not strong but insane boosts.

However, I believe we will start seeing said insanity already when people aproach the 900 point level - no need to wait for the 3600 CP completion.
soo.... ~half a year before stamina builds start to blow magicka builds completely out of the water

but, enough derailing from me, the thread should be about sorc feedback, not CP feedback

posthumecaver · February 2015

pppontus wrote: »

Not that I really have time with it, but because you ask so nicely..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqAUP0Ox_Ak

I hate summons, I hate minions, this is not the sorcerer I want to be

Inubis · February 2015

ZOS_ShannonM wrote: »

Hello folks,

While we understand your frustration regarding sorcerers, we would like to reiterate that we encourage constructive feedback. Please keep your posts civil and do not resort to personal attacks and insults.

Thank you for understanding.

There are a few jabs here and there but I dont think anyone is getting out of hand at the moment...

And while a Mod is here... I cant speak for everyone but we send pleanty of constructive feedback. I know a dozen people who write out feedback to the devs in word then submit it via in game/help. Plus some of the stuff stated in this thread is perfectly valid. It is up to your lovely company to use that feedback.

pppontus · February 2015

posthumecaver wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Not that I really have time with it, but because you ask so nicely..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqAUP0Ox_Ak

I hate summons, I hate minions, this is not the sorcerer I want to be

Then drop it, the difference is going to be marginal if any. Honestly it would have probably been better to go with Inner Light instead... I was just making fun at this point.

Tankqull · February 2015

pppontus wrote: »

posthumecaver wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Not that I really have time with it, but because you ask so nicely..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqAUP0Ox_Ak

I hate summons, I hate minions, this is not the sorcerer I want to be

Then drop it, the difference is going to be marginal if any. Honestly it would have probably been better to go with Inner Light instead... I was just making fun at this point.

why hasitate to use a magica build to do spellscar way to much attention involved.
go mainstream use brawler and have 4 skillslots+ulti for what ever needs to be lvled...

pppontus · February 2015

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

posthumecaver wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Not that I really have time with it, but because you ask so nicely..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqAUP0Ox_Ak

I hate summons, I hate minions, this is not the sorcerer I want to be

Then drop it, the difference is going to be marginal if any. Honestly it would have probably been better to go with Inner Light instead... I was just making fun at this point.

why hasitate to use a magica build to do spellscar way to much attention involved.
go mainstream use brawler and have 4 skillslots+ulti for what ever needs to be lvled...

Well, because it's boring so I wouldn't do it. It's a game, it's supposed to be fun..

Nifty2g · February 2015

Tankqull wrote: »

michael.patersonrwb17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys, thanks for your patience. We do have a status to share regarding Sorcerers as they currently stand.

First, there is one outstanding issue with Crystal Fragments not proccing when you cast Bolt Escape; we are aiming to fix this by time Update 6 is live. While we aren’t planning to implement any additional changes before Update 6 goes live, we will be keeping a very close eye on how Sorcerers – and all classes – perform in a Live environment, and will make tweaks as necessary. With Update 6 just around the corner, we don’t want to make any drastic changes that could affect gameplay in a negative way.

That said, we do have plans to make the Sorcerer more effective as a stamina DPS, tank, and healer. The first change we already made towards that direction is allowing the Clannfear to heal the caster based on their maximum health when the Clannfear is killed or dismissed. In a future update, we will be looking at giving the Sorcerer unique ways to fulfill the healer role, or deal damage with stamina-based abilities. Some specific issues we will also be evaluating are the number of toggled abilities on the class, Surge healing cooldown, and tweaks to make Dark Exchange more useful.

Please continue to report any issues you may come across, and thank you for all your support and feedback!

Alright, I feel as if I want to highlight the points you made, I'm an avid fan of the Sorc healing capability as it stands right now, in PvE, Sorcs dominate all over Templars in terms of healing. Reason being, I have healed Sanctum, and Dragonstar Arena (I have the 58minute time healing it without a Templar). The ONLY change that you should make is revert the Suppression Field, I haven't played PTS but from what I read was that was that it no longer stuns enemies? If that is the case, it's totally contradicting the name "Suppression Field", having it give the major buffs that it does in PTS is honestly pointless and useless. Negate is the one thing that made Sorcs stand far above Templars in terms of healing.

Please take this from me

you forgott the change to healing stuffs beeing no longer weapon dmg thus sorcs advantage by surge is gone too. so the healingoutput of staffes in normalized between all classes making sorc heals (wich i quite liked previous aswell) drop by a large margin as we have nothing to add to the staff heals by ourselves.

Well that is true, but I hardly used Crit Surge. The main big factor is Negate honestly which is just pathetic why doesn't it silence enemies anymore? PvP cause way too many peoples tears affecting the way PvE plays out, this change honestly gives no use to PvE Sorcs as a Healer or as DPS.

Tankqull · February 2015

pppontus wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

posthumecaver wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Not that I really have time with it, but because you ask so nicely..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqAUP0Ox_Ak

I hate summons, I hate minions, this is not the sorcerer I want to be

Then drop it, the difference is going to be marginal if any. Honestly it would have probably been better to go with Inner Light instead... I was just making fun at this point.

why hasitate to use a magica build to do spellscar way to much attention involved.
go mainstream use brawler and have 4 skillslots+ulti for what ever needs to be lvled...

Well, because it's boring so I wouldn't do it. It's a game, it's supposed to be fun..

grinding is boring anyway that way i can atleast read a book while grinding and beeing able to lvl some skills i havent jet^^

beside that lightning splash needs the 70% snare that ash cloud provides aswell. [the most fragile class needs atleast comparable cc options - if not better but i doubt that will ever happen^^]

Jahosefat · February 2015

I think saying "Sorcs are fine and have been" when ~half of end-game content (PVE/PVP) is filled with DKs is.... something.

pppontus · February 2015

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

posthumecaver wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Not that I really have time with it, but because you ask so nicely..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqAUP0Ox_Ak

I hate summons, I hate minions, this is not the sorcerer I want to be

Then drop it, the difference is going to be marginal if any. Honestly it would have probably been better to go with Inner Light instead... I was just making fun at this point.

why hasitate to use a magica build to do spellscar way to much attention involved.
go mainstream use brawler and have 4 skillslots+ulti for what ever needs to be lvled...

Well, because it's boring so I wouldn't do it. It's a game, it's supposed to be fun..

grinding is boring anyway that way i can atleast read a book while grinding and beeing able to lvl some skills i havent jet^^

beside that lightning splash needs the 70% snare that ash cloud provides aswell. [the most fragile class needs atleast comparable cc options - if not better but i doubt that will ever happen^^]

As long as they do it with the other morph, I don't want to lose the insane DPS from Liquid Lightning

Tankqull · February 2015

pppontus wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

posthumecaver wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Not that I really have time with it, but because you ask so nicely..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqAUP0Ox_Ak

I hate summons, I hate minions, this is not the sorcerer I want to be

Then drop it, the difference is going to be marginal if any. Honestly it would have probably been better to go with Inner Light instead... I was just making fun at this point.

why hasitate to use a magica build to do spellscar way to much attention involved.
go mainstream use brawler and have 4 skillslots+ulti for what ever needs to be lvled...

Well, because it's boring so I wouldn't do it. It's a game, it's supposed to be fun..

grinding is boring anyway that way i can atleast read a book while grinding and beeing able to lvl some skills i havent jet^^

beside that lightning splash needs the 70% snare that ash cloud provides aswell. [the most fragile class needs atleast comparable cc options - if not better but i doubt that will ever happen^^]

As long as they do it with the other morph, I don't want to lose the insane DPS from Liquid Lightning

why should it lose anything? ashcloud provides the same dps last 80% longer and gives a 70% snare ...

pppontus · February 2015

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

posthumecaver wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Not that I really have time with it, but because you ask so nicely..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqAUP0Ox_Ak

I hate summons, I hate minions, this is not the sorcerer I want to be

Then drop it, the difference is going to be marginal if any. Honestly it would have probably been better to go with Inner Light instead... I was just making fun at this point.

why hasitate to use a magica build to do spellscar way to much attention involved.
go mainstream use brawler and have 4 skillslots+ulti for what ever needs to be lvled...

Well, because it's boring so I wouldn't do it. It's a game, it's supposed to be fun..

grinding is boring anyway that way i can atleast read a book while grinding and beeing able to lvl some skills i havent jet^^

beside that lightning splash needs the 70% snare that ash cloud provides aswell. [the most fragile class needs atleast comparable cc options - if not better but i doubt that will ever happen^^]

As long as they do it with the other morph, I don't want to lose the insane DPS from Liquid Lightning

why should it lose anything? ashcloud provides the same dps last 80% longer and gives a 70% snare ...

Eh.. what`? Since when does Ash Cloud do 750*2/s?

Tankqull · February 2015

since its been changed frmo a pbae defensive tool to a gtae dot with 1.6

Snit · February 2015

There is a better way to resolve this. Please consider the following:

- Sorc Magicka DPS is a means toward earning roster spots in endgame content
- We will have actual data on Trials/ DSA rosters within a month to six weeks. That will be how the playerbase at large communicates its thinking on the state of endgame sorcs (as well with every other class)*
- Data is more useful than theorycraft or small sample-size anecdotes fueled by hefty doses of motivated reasoning

We'll know the answer soon enough. Let's not get the thread locked with increasingly angry back-and-forth in the meantime.

*This is the fly in the ointment, though, as it appears ZOS does not look at this information (or, at least, do not value it). I hope they reconsider this approach

Snit · February 2015

michael.patersonrwb17_ESO wrote: »

in PvE, Sorcs dominate all over Templars in terms of healing. Reason being, I have healed Sanctum, and Dragonstar Arena (I have the 58minute time healing it without a Templar).

Your second sentence does not prove your first.

Also, I suspect you are not familiar with the 1.6 patch notes, particularly as they impact changes in the relative efficiency of Resto Staff heals by the four classes. The primary advantage sorcs had no longer exists.

Lied · February 2015

Snit wrote: »

There is a better way to resolve this. Please consider the following:

- Sorc Magicka DPS is a means toward earning roster spots in endgame content
- We will have actual data on Trials/ DSA rosters within a month to six weeks. That will be how the playerbase at large communicates its thinking on the state of endgame sorcs (as well with every other class)*
- Data is more useful than theorycraft or small sample-size anecdotes fueled by hefty doses of motivated reasoning

We'll know the answer soon enough. Let's not get the thread locked with increasingly angry back-and-forth in the meantime.

*This is the fly in the ointment, though, as it appears ZOS does not look at this information (or, at least, do not value it). I hope they reconsider this approach

This makes sense to me, but I have to wonder how/if class population factors into class performance. If, just for example, there were 5x VR14 DKs for every 1 Sorc, then I could see how there is a problem, but it might not have anything to do with math. That's not an argument against buffs by any means, just a concern regarding expectations based on leaderboards.

florian.billeb16_ESO · February 2015

@ pponttus
just reflexion for you...

In one subject a sorcerer of Hodor guild MrEwan pretend that sorcerer are fine and have good DPS...and you have agreed with that post by proclaiming that sorcerer are fine...
and today one leader of hodor guild just say that in 1.6. they will take 8-10 DK to do raid and no sorcerer...

So what...

Are the DPS of sorcerer enough in comparison of other class (good question ?)
Can a sorcerer do the same AOE DPS as other class ?
Probably not (i haven't testet with the change of lighning spell) but i don't think that sorcerer can do the same AOE damage.

Sorcerers are fine if you want to play a sorcerer, but if you want to play in Teso, sorcerer will be in 1.6.
the worst tank
the worst heal
worst or medium AOE DPS
Medium Single DPS (good for magicka, but magicka is much weaker as stamina)

if I resume
1) worst, worst, medium for AOE, probably medium for DPS...

so my conclusion... if you want to do competitiv raid, don't play a sorcerer

and you, ppontus, pretent that there is no problem, we will see in 1.6. but i will read again all you posts and if sorcerer is again weak, as we tell you, and i hope you will this time defend the sorcerers class in his globality.

Erock25 · February 2015

pppontus wrote: »

Inubis wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

For real? I definitely have NOT seen that. I've seen one Stam DK claim to do 15K with 2H. It seems 2H is quite OP atm, but that's an issue with 2H and every class can do like 15K just wrecking blow.. if that is the issue I can support it, because that's just silly. Doesn't make other builds less viable really, just atm anyone not having a 2H sword is comparably gimped..

+ I'll repeat something I always say when people bring up DKs: never compare your burst DPS to a DK because if he has Standard of Might he'll boost all his DPS by 20% for 20 seconds = OP, problem is now he can only do that for 20 secs out of 83 per fight. So the fight needs to be 80 secs + to give accurate results with SOM.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBwEoj14_68

^^ Just because I am not in a lazy mood.

Well, obviously we can instantly discount the tests on Nomeg as you never DPS test on undead. That's like DPS testing 101.

His results on Blood Spawn is impressive to say the least. Is there any info on CP used and such? I mean, I sure as hell can't do that DPS with my DK and my measly 70 CP, not a chance in hell. He could obviously just be 100x better than me at Stamina DPS, but .. it seems absolutely crazy imo. Either way, if that is the way it is then maybe certain Stam builds need nerfs to be brought in line with the rest of the game. Because my NB DW, NB Magicka, Sorc Magicka and DK Magicka all seem to be pretty even otherwise and compares well to the Stam/Mag Templars I've seen and well, anything apart from that video....

Edit: I just followed the link, mate, that is with full CP.... don't compare 70 CP to 3600 please.

His second blood spawn parse has 1.65k DPS from evil hunter which seems high for only a 4% proc chance.

Jahosefat · February 2015

florian.billeb16_ESO wrote: »

@ pponttus
just reflexion for you...

In one subject a sorcerer of Hodor guild MrEwan pretend that sorcerer are fine and have good DPS...and you have agreed with that post by proclaiming that sorcerer are fine...
and today one leader of hodor guild just say that in 1.6. they will take 8-10 DK to do raid and no sorcerer...

So what...

Are the DPS of sorcerer enough in comparison of other class (good question ?)
Can a sorcerer do the same AOE DPS as other class ?
Probably not (i haven't testet with the change of lighning spell) but i don't think that sorcerer can do the same AOE damage.

Sorcerers are fine if you want to play a sorcerer, but if you want to play in Teso, sorcerer will be in 1.6.
the worst tank
the worst heal
worst or medium AOE DPS
Medium Single DPS (good for magicka, but magicka is much weaker as stamina)

if I resume
1) worst, worst, medium for AOE, probably medium for DPS...

so my conclusion... if you want to do competitiv raid, don't play a sorcerer

and you, ppontus, pretent that there is no problem, we will see in 1.6. but i will read again all you posts and if sorcerer is again weak, as we tell you, and i hope you will this time defend the sorcerers class in his globality.

I think people have gotten used to DK being the "bread-and-butter" of ESO and don't want that to be shaken up.

Tankqull · February 2015

Erock25 wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Inubis wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

For real? I definitely have NOT seen that. I've seen one Stam DK claim to do 15K with 2H. It seems 2H is quite OP atm, but that's an issue with 2H and every class can do like 15K just wrecking blow.. if that is the issue I can support it, because that's just silly. Doesn't make other builds less viable really, just atm anyone not having a 2H sword is comparably gimped..

+ I'll repeat something I always say when people bring up DKs: never compare your burst DPS to a DK because if he has Standard of Might he'll boost all his DPS by 20% for 20 seconds = OP, problem is now he can only do that for 20 secs out of 83 per fight. So the fight needs to be 80 secs + to give accurate results with SOM.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBwEoj14_68

^^ Just because I am not in a lazy mood.

Well, obviously we can instantly discount the tests on Nomeg as you never DPS test on undead. That's like DPS testing 101.

His results on Blood Spawn is impressive to say the least. Is there any info on CP used and such? I mean, I sure as hell can't do that DPS with my DK and my measly 70 CP, not a chance in hell. He could obviously just be 100x better than me at Stamina DPS, but .. it seems absolutely crazy imo. Either way, if that is the way it is then maybe certain Stam builds need nerfs to be brought in line with the rest of the game. Because my NB DW, NB Magicka, Sorc Magicka and DK Magicka all seem to be pretty even otherwise and compares well to the Stam/Mag Templars I've seen and well, anything apart from that video....

Edit: I just followed the link, mate, that is with full CP.... don't compare 70 CP to 3600 please.

His second blood spawn parse has 1.65k DPS from evil hunter which seems high for only a 4% proc chance.

its the problem in the way dks generate their dps through dots. the more attacks you have persecond the more likely you´ll recive dmg though procs.

pppontus · February 2015

florian.billeb16_ESO wrote: »

@ pponttus
just reflexion for you...

In one subject a sorcerer of Hodor guild MrEwan pretend that sorcerer are fine and have good DPS...and you have agreed with that post by proclaiming that sorcerer are fine...
and today one leader of hodor guild just say that in 1.6. they will take 8-10 DK to do raid and no sorcerer...

So what...

Are the DPS of sorcerer enough in comparison of other class (good question ?)
Can a sorcerer do the same AOE DPS as other class ?
Probably not (i haven't testet with the change of lighning spell) but i don't think that sorcerer can do the same AOE damage.

Sorcerers are fine if you want to play a sorcerer, but if you want to play in Teso, sorcerer will be in 1.6.
the worst tank
the worst heal
worst or medium AOE DPS
Medium Single DPS (good for magicka, but magicka is much weaker as stamina)

if I resume
1) worst, worst, medium for AOE, probably medium for DPS...

so my conclusion... if you want to do competitiv raid, don't play a sorcerer

and you, ppontus, pretent that there is no problem, we will see in 1.6. but i will read again all you posts and if sorcerer is again weak, as we tell you, and i hope you will this time defend the sorcerers class in his globality.

I don't understand you fully. I am pretty sure he said they CURRENTLY take 8-10 DKs and no Sorcs. Nothing about 1.6 as far as I've seen.

I believe both Single Target and AOE will be on par now. We will see but with Liquid Lightning and Thundering Prescense + Impulse and Valkyn Skoria I get pretty massive AOE dmg.

Robbmrp · February 2015

Hello @pppontus,

Would you be willing to email me screen prints of your build and rotation? I sent you a message on your profile with my email information.

Thanks!

nagarjunna · February 2015

Actually I'd like to see his build too! If he's getting massive DPS then his build should give an indication of how he does it.

pppontus · February 2015

Robbmrp wrote: »

Hello @pppontus,

Would you be willing to email me screen prints of your build and rotation? I sent you a message on your profile with my email information.

Thanks!

Sorry! You can check it all at Tamriel Foundry, + videos even.

Edit: broken link

nagarjunna · February 2015

Thank you, @ppontus, appreciate the link to the build.

Snit · February 2015

@pppontus I'm curious about how much your build depends on Infallible Mage & Mephala/ Valkyn. I'm unsure how well the build will scale down to sorcs who do not have Best-In-Slot gear (especially as the Valkyn Helm and the Infallible set are fairly difficult to collect, and both provide some hard-to-replicate effects).

I firmly believe balance should apply to players with average-to-good gear, as well. I would very much appreciate it if you could perhaps do a similar test in either crafted gear, a Martial/ Torug setup or something similar. I'm in NA, so it's not really feasible for me to collect some of those items. Also, you testing it would be more of an apples-to-apples, as player skill would remain equal.

(I realize the request is an imposition. It would be enlightening, though).

pppontus · February 2015

Snit wrote: »

@pppontus I'm curious about how much your build depends on Infallible Mage & Mephala/ Valkyn. I'm unsure how well the build will scale down to sorcs who do not have Best-In-Slot gear (especially as the Valkyn Helm and the Infallible set are fairly difficult to collect, and both provide some hard-to-replicate effects).

I firmly believe balance should apply to players with average-to-good gear, as well. I would very much appreciate it if you could perhaps do a similar test in either crafted gear, a Martial/ Torug setup or something similar. I'm in NA, so it's not really feasible for me to collect some of those items. Also, you testing it would be more of an apples-to-apples, as player skill would remain equal.

Honestly my 1.6 doesn't use Infallible at all because it's been nerfed to oblivion. Mephala is maybe 300-500 DPS extra, so not exactly a dealbreaker. All the sets listed in my build are fairly easy to get, all can be bought or crafted.

If you're talking about Live, Mephala + Infallible is about 200 DPS extra. Roughly a 100 each.