Should add-ons be allowed?

Carnage2K4

Blackwidow wrote: »

Carnage2K4 wrote: »

Ok... so.. I'm not really seeing how thats an issue with crafting... also asking for an example, and getting an answer like "the minimap, helps with crafting" starts to make me think you don't really know what you're talking about.

Wow. I'll repeat it.

I think the minimap is a cheat. Is shows players where the nodes are for crafting materials.

There is a skill tree you can put points into that help you find these, but the minimap makes these points useless and the minmap works better than the skill line.

You don't see the connection between crafting materials and crafting?

So yeah, don't go around assuming that, giving 2 vague sentences about an unnamed addon, that not all of us know even exists is going to be enough info to understand what you are talking about.

you got a name for this addon? you got a link so we can read the description?
see what it does, or are you just going to toss out some vaguely related sentences and just hope we all know what you are talking about...

magic_is_might

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

I love when people click LOL on my posts because it means they lost the argument and have nothing else to back up their point.

Or they think the disconnect between having a minimap that shows crafting nodes is equal to cheating is hilarious

I'll just agree to disagree. Your notion of cheating is a lot different than most people here. That's the issue.

Giving an edge in the game that should not be there is a cheat. Plain and simple.

Okay man. If automated fishing (which should be banned) or having a research timer on screen or being able to see possible node spawn locations something easily google-able) is giving me a noticeable edge over another player, then they're not that great of a player to begin with.

Loco_Mofo

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

Carnage2K4 wrote: »

Ok... so.. I'm not really seeing how thats an issue with crafting... also asking for an example, and getting an answer like "the minimap, helps with crafting" starts to make me think you don't really know what you're talking about.

Wow. I'll repeat it.

I think the minimap is a cheat. Is shows players where the nodes are for crafting materials.

There is a skill tree you can put points into that help you find these, but the minimap makes these points useless and the minmap works better than the skill line.

You don't see the connection between crafting materials and crafting?

Really? That's what this is all about?

You're willing to remove the plethora of useful add-ons, because someone might be able to see possible node locations on their map?

I'm sorry but that's ridiculous. You could just as easily find them with a simple Google search. I don't even use this mod, because it clogs up my map.

cliveklgb14_ESO

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

That does not mean they should all be allowed. Some are cheats.

Can you be specific, or is this just hyperbole on your part?

And no botting programs are not addon ons. We are talking specific addons within the architecture provided.

Blackwidow

No. They give players too many advantages/disadvantages.

Arsenic_Touch wrote: »

At this point you're pretty much arguing for the sake of arguing.

Just because you do not agree with me does not mean I do not have a valid point.

Also, saying that is rude. I never argue just to argue. I argue if I feel i have a point to make. As do all of you.

I can do the exact same thing the addon does with a website of the map running on my second monitor or my laptop or a print out the map and keep it on my desk.

Which is also cheating.

Blackwolfe5

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

magic_is_might wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

I love when people click LOL on my posts because it means they lost the argument and have nothing else to back up their point.

Or they think the disconnect between having a minimap that shows crafting nodes is equal to cheating is hilarious

I'll just agree to disagree. Your notion of cheating is a lot different than most people here. That's the issue.

Giving an edge in the game that should not be there is a cheat. Plain and simple.

Okay man. If automated fishing (which should be banned) or having a research timer on screen or being able to see possible node spawn locations something easily google-able) is giving me a noticeable edge over another player, then they're not that great of a player to begin with.

What's funny is that the automated fishing part was from when he talked about a third party software, a fishing bot, for wow. Something that is not allowed in wow and is not allowed in ESO.

magic_is_might

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

cliveklgb14_ESO wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

That does not mean they should all be allowed. Some are cheats.

Can you be specific, or is this just hyperbole on your part?

And no botting programs are not addon ons. We are talking specific addons within the architecture provided.

It's all or nothing with him. All hyperbole. Because someone may automate fishing or something dumb like that, all add-ons must not be allowed. Because you Google the location of a skyshard, you are cheating.

cliveklgb14_ESO

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

[
Which is also cheating.

Your opinion does not make it fact.

That node map addon doesn't track them in real time. All it does is create a map point, that anyone could do with pen and paper on their own. Should we track them down also then?

magic_is_might

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwolfe5 wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

I love when people click LOL on my posts because it means they lost the argument and have nothing else to back up their point.

Or they think the disconnect between having a minimap that shows crafting nodes is equal to cheating is hilarious

I'll just agree to disagree. Your notion of cheating is a lot different than most people here. That's the issue.

Giving an edge in the game that should not be there is a cheat. Plain and simple.

Okay man. If automated fishing (which should be banned) or having a research timer on screen or being able to see possible node spawn locations something easily google-able) is giving me a noticeable edge over another player, then they're not that great of a player to begin with.

What's funny is that the automated fishing part was from when he talked about a third party software, a fishing bot, for wow. Something that is not allowed in wow.

My point, that is a mod not an addon. He refuses to acknowledge there is a difference between a mod and addon because sometimes people interchange them.

Arsenic_Touch

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

cliveklgb14_ESO wrote: »

Your opinion does not make it fact.

That node map addon doesn't track them in real time. All it does is create a map point, that anyone could do with pen and paper on their own. Should we track them down also then?

Also anyone with good memory is also cheating because they can like totally remember the locations of the nodes as they've gathered them. I've pretty much committed to memory quite a few circuits on each map on where to go like I usually do in an mmo that has gathering and crafting. Guess I'm a filthy cheater.

magic_is_might

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

cliveklgb14_ESO wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

[
Which is also cheating.

Your opinion does not make it fact.

That node map addon doesn't track them in real time. All it does is create a map point, that anyone could do with pen and paper on their own. Should we track them down also then?

No, that's cheating. Also, don't dare remember the location of node. That is also cheating

Blackwidow

No. They give players too many advantages/disadvantages.

magic_is_might wrote: »

It's all or nothing with him. All hyperbole. Because someone may automate fishing or something dumb like that, all add-ons must not be allowed. Because you Google the location of a skyshard, you are cheating.

Again, I never said all addons should not be allowed, but you are too thick headed to get that.

magic_is_might

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

It's all or nothing with him. All hyperbole. Because someone may automate fishing or something dumb like that, all add-ons must not be allowed. Because you Google the location of a skyshard, you are cheating.

Again, I never said all addons should not be allowed, but you are too thick headed to get that.

You voted no. That is all or nothing. Simply because someone might use a node map or a fishing bot or something that is an outlier.

Blackwidow

No. They give players too many advantages/disadvantages.

Arsenic_Touch wrote: »

Also anyone with good memory is also cheating because they can like totally remember the locations of the nodes as they've gathered them. I've pretty much committed to memory quite a few circuits on each map on where to go like I usually do in an mmo that has gathering and crafting. Guess I'm a filthy cheater.

Going to a website to find out information is not the same as finding it yourself.

Do I really need to explain the difference?

Blackwidow

No. They give players too many advantages/disadvantages.

magic_is_might wrote: »

My point, that is a mod not an addon. He refuses to acknowledge there is a difference between a mod and addon because sometimes people interchange them.

Synonym. Look the word up.

magic_is_might

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

Arsenic_Touch wrote: »

Also anyone with good memory is also cheating because they can like totally remember the locations of the nodes as they've gathered them. I've pretty much committed to memory quite a few circuits on each map on where to go like I usually do in an mmo that has gathering and crafting. Guess I'm a filthy cheater.

Going to a website to find out information is not the same as finding it yourself.

Do I really need to explain the difference?

Please do, I'm too thick-headed

Blackwolfe5

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

magic_is_might wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

It's all or nothing with him. All hyperbole. Because someone may automate fishing or something dumb like that, all add-ons must not be allowed. Because you Google the location of a skyshard, you are cheating.

Again, I never said all addons should not be allowed, but you are too thick headed to get that.

You voted no. That is all or nothing. Simply because someone might use a node map or a fishing bot or something that is an outlier.

Actually, the voting options sucked. There was simply no inbetween if going purely by what the voting options said.

AlexanderTheGreat

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

The game wouldn't even have half its functionality without addons such as FTC. Why add skills that have a chance to proc if you can't tell if they proc or not? Nonsensical, lazy, underdeveloped, garbage.

magic_is_might

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

My point, that is a mod not an addon. He refuses to acknowledge there is a difference between a mod and addon because sometimes people interchange them.

Synonym. Look the word up.

Nah, you want to argue semantics and ignore the context that these two terms are being presented in and cling desperately to that point.

Blackwidow

No. They give players too many advantages/disadvantages.

magic_is_might wrote: »

You voted no. That is all or nothing. Simply because someone might use a node map or a fishing bot or something that is an outlier.

So, that is what is causing this hissyfit of yours? My vote?

Did you even bother to read my first post? I said, "There should not be a need for addons."

It was not just about cheating addons.

The poll sucked. It was black and white.

Moderator Edit: Removed comments attacking another user

magic_is_might wrote: »

Please do, I'm too thick-headed

True.

/ignore

cliveklgb14_ESO

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

Again, I never said all addons should not be allowed, but you are too thick headed to get that.

But the one example you cite is flawed.

So what are these cheating addons that are ruining the system?

By your node example, then skyshard maps are cheating, googling skyshard locs are cheating, googling quest solutions is cheating.

Give us an example using the addon architecture that gives a real game play advantage or cheat?

indytims_ESO

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Add-ons should most certainly be allowed.

Blackwolfe5

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Let's just completely ignore any addons that place custom map markers on the map/minimap/compass. What else can addons do that you define as cheating @Blackwidow?

magic_is_might

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwolfe5 wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

It's all or nothing with him. All hyperbole. Because someone may automate fishing or something dumb like that, all add-ons must not be allowed. Because you Google the location of a skyshard, you are cheating.

Again, I never said all addons should not be allowed, but you are too thick headed to get that.

You voted no. That is all or nothing. Simply because someone might use a node map or a fishing bot or something that is an outlier.

Actually, the voting options sucked. There was simply no inbetween if going purely by what the voting options said.

You're right. Unfortunately he is arguing against the 1% of the bad addons (which I've never seen). And those somehow invalidate the rest of the good ones. And his reasons for those bad ones aren't even legitimate reasons or even the purpose of add-ons.

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

Please do, I'm too thick-headed

True.

/ignore

Teach me a lesson You're the one tossing insults around.

Reignskream

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

Arsenic_Touch wrote: »

At this point you're pretty much arguing for the sake of arguing.

Just because you do not agree with me does not mean I do not have a valid point.

Also, saying that is rude. I never argue just to argue. I argue if I feel i have a point to make. As do all of you.

I can do the exact same thing the addon does with a website of the map running on my second monitor or my laptop or a print out the map and keep it on my desk.

Which is also cheating.

By your logic, if i play through the game, and create maps of my own with a pencil and paper, showing lore books and sky shards, you'd consider it cheating, lol.

Carnage2K4

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

My point, that is a mod not an addon. He refuses to acknowledge there is a difference between a mod and addon because sometimes people interchange them.

Synonym. Look the word up.

You saying it does not make it true, there are differences between the two.
The fact you don't seem to, or wilfully refuse to see the differences seems to suggest you are just generalising. And that is a fallacious assumption.

also, you ever going to provide a name for that map/crafting addon?
Or do I need to assume you're not just making it up?

Blackwidow

No. They give players too many advantages/disadvantages.

Blackwolfe5 wrote: »

Let's just completely ignore any addons that place custom map markers on the map/minimap/compass. What else can addons do that you define as cheating @Blackwidow?

Not alot. Look guys. I'm not against addons in general. Most are just fine. You are all attacking me(well most of you) in some kind of panic that I want to ban all addons.

That is simply not the case.

There should not be a need for addons. That is my main point.

ZOS is lazy is 99% of the reason I voted no.

The skyshards and spellbooks are a cheat. You should have to find them in game. If you go to a website or have the mod, it is a cheat.

Sorry, you are giving yourself an advantage others would not have unless they too used the addon.

cliveklgb14_ESO

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

Going to a website to find out information is not the same as finding it yourself.

Do I really need to explain the difference?

So if someone created a website that mapped all the nodes, that is fine, but not an addon that just pulls up a similar map?

Do you not see how ridiculous your differentiating that is?

Oh wait but I have dual monitors. So I can play the game and have that website map up at the same time. So, now would I be cheating or not by your strange logic?

What I'd be doing is all the mod would be doing. So how is that mod a cheat?

magic_is_might

Yes. They're part of what makes this game great.

Blackwidow wrote: »

magic_is_might wrote: »

You voted no. That is all or nothing. Simply because someone might use a node map or a fishing bot or something that is an outlier.

So, that is what is causing this hissyfit of yours? My vote?

Did you even bother to read my first post? I said, "There should not be a need for addons."

It was not just about cheating addons.

The poll sucked. It was black and white.

You are a neanderthal.

magic_is_might wrote: »

Please do, I'm too thick-headed

True.

/ignore

Hissyfit? You're the one getting a little bent out of shape over it. Especially with the insults Neanderthal, thickheaded, etc. Sounds like you're the one who needs to chill out.

Very few people agree with you. And I see no one who agrees with the very few and weak points you are presenting.

Blackwidow

No. They give players too many advantages/disadvantages.

Reignskream wrote: »

By your logic, if i play through the game, and create maps of my own with a pencil and paper, showing lore books and sky shards, you'd consider it cheating, lol.

No, only if you go to a website to get that information.