Maintenance for the week of September 8:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – September 8
• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – September 8
• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
Auction house is a must!
-
Allyah✭✭✭
You are right that it won't significantly effect any self-sufficient person to have an AH in the game but my point in that quote was that people don't really need any type of market at the moment.lecarcajou_ESO wrote: »
And so they shall continue... while the rest of us shops in the AH.methjester wrote: »[...]The anti crowd will be begging for an auction house when guilds won't let them play.
Or they'll be playing the way they already have been... self-sufficiently.
Why not have it both ways, after all?
There are people who want some type of market to make things more convenient. People have already given plenty of good reasons why an AH is bad for a game. To be honest, I would have a problem with the kiosks that have already been decided on if it wasn't so easy to get everything you need on your own. And I enjoy games that promote the social aspects of it (and an AH just doesn't allow for that). Edit: The kiosks will allow for it.Edited by Allyah on May 3, 2014 7:38PM2 -
methjester✭✭✭I'm just going to sign off on this argument. Zenimax is obviously going to do what they're going to do. A month in quests are still bugged, class skills are still bugged, and the game itself has some major problems. If they can't give an ounce of convenience towards the sub base, they'll have to atone for that down the road.
At this point, I no longer care because it's obvious they can't fix little things let alone set up the base for an economy.4 -
Greydog✭✭✭✭@Chryos hit it right on the head. It is ALL about undercutting
I agree with @Drachenfier ..prices on common items are supposed to go down in a free market. Just as prices on rare items are supposed to go up depending on the rarity. That is how a properly working market is supposed to pan out.
If you're arguing that you prefer to keep the prices artificially high or low then you are the problem ..not the market
"I Plan on living forever ..so far so good"
Sanguine's DiscipleAsylum Amoebaeus ..A refuge for those who normally fly solo.
Message me here or in game for an invite4 -
Kiwi✭✭✭✭
you think your junk is special and the entire hemisphere is gagging to throw gold at you for it?
half of the crap people try to sell isnt even worth vendoring and the other half are quest rewards.
sure you might be able to make something worth using, but guess what, so can 100.000 other people.Edited by Kiwi on May 3, 2014 8:45PMA large yellow rectangle
2 -
Allyah✭✭✭
you think your junk is special and the entire hemisphere is gagging to throw gold at you for it?
half of the crap people try to sell isnt even worth vendoring and the other half are quest rewards.
sure you might be able to make something worth using, but guess what, so can 100.000 other people.
True... if a little bluntly put.1 -
Khandi✭✭✭alphawolph wrote: »So if we have a guild kiosk, wouldn't that mean the biggest trade guilds would have the kiosk most often? If so, wouldn't that mean that that guild (or 2 or 3 of the biggest guilds) will control all the pricing? Like a monopoly?
Yes, all the people that don't want an AH cause people control it, are going to hate it when a couple powerful guilds hold them forever.
So do we need to ask ZOS if there is any antitrust clauses in the Code of Conduct??
Or if there is a Fair Trade Commission set up in the by laws???
One should always be in love. That is the reason one should never marry.
~Oscar Wilde2 -
Khandi✭✭✭@Allyah
Seriously? (OK that was meant to be funny)
I was just commenting on the fact that a handful of the biggest guilds will control the market price on things in the open 'world'/'faction', hence the need for antitrust laws
One should always be in love. That is the reason one should never marry.
~Oscar Wilde4 -
Kiwi✭✭✭✭I was just commenting on the fact that a handful of the biggest guilds will control the market price on things in the open 'world'/'faction'
they have zero effect on anything outside their own guild
thats why this works but you naive greedy little piggys will never understand thatEdited by Kiwi on May 5, 2014 9:57PMA large yellow rectangle
4 -
I like the idea of stands, and the bazaar on Everquest was one of my favorite places. The whole buying everything from an AH is a little unauthentic. No one up till a certain point bought weapons and armor among other things from an AH or even an auction block or warehouse unless it was large amounts for blacksmiths, breweries, and the like. When it comes to games we're dealing with small item amounts. Not entire blacksmith shops full.1
-
a public auctions house is needed, at the moment noone is playing together in a guild, because they are in 4 guilds, that ruined the game.3
-
Alurria✭✭✭✭✭
✭A public auction house is not needed, the most powerful guilds may control a kiosk for a week. But, you will still be able to buy and sell within the guilds you belong to. A public auction house is not needed because it will devalue weapons, armor and mats. It will also allow the most powerful guilds to control prices and gold sellers to control price. What do you think all those bots are doing in game now? Gathering to sell for high prices to feed the jerks who buy gold for real money.2 -
Khandi✭✭✭@pieceofyarnb14_ESO I totally disagree with your reasoning.
I am glad however that your ESO experience has been a good one. I think that a lot of people that are saying that they would like to see some sort of AH are NOT having your experience. When I get to the last little piece of whatever I'm trying to level I just want to go and see if it is available and not spend 2 hours BSing around.
On a personal note I left my guild because of the impersonal nature of it. There was no camaraderie or people playing together, it was strictly for the guild shop which had horrible pricing and limited items. Not having a AH, even if it is limited to the zone has, in my opinion, killed the guilds.One should always be in love. That is the reason one should never marry.
~Oscar Wilde1 -
Alurria✭✭✭✭✭
✭@pieceofyarnb14_ESO I totally disagree with your reasoning.
I am glad however that your ESO experience has been a good one. I think that a lot of people that are saying that they would like to see some sort of AH are NOT having your experience. When I get to the last little piece of whatever I'm trying to level I just want to go and see if it is available and not spend 2 hours BSing around.
On a personal note I left my guild because of the impersonal nature of it. There was no camaraderie or people playing together, it was strictly for the guild shop which had horrible pricing and limited items. Not having a AH, even if it is limited to the zone has, in my opinion, killed the guilds.
Join a friendlier guild, that's not ESOs fault.2 -
Khandi✭✭✭pieceofyarnb14_ESO wrote: »@pieceofyarnb14_ESO I totally disagree with your reasoning.
I am glad however that your ESO experience has been a good one. I think that a lot of people that are saying that they would like to see some sort of AH are NOT having your experience. When I get to the last little piece of whatever I'm trying to level I just want to go and see if it is available and not spend 2 hours BSing around.
On a personal note I left my guild because of the impersonal nature of it. There was no camaraderie or people playing together, it was strictly for the guild shop which had horrible pricing and limited items. Not having a AH, even if it is limited to the zone has, in my opinion, killed the guilds.
Join a friendlier guild, that's not ESOs fault.
No matter how many times you say it, it keeps coming up on the forums. This is ESO's fault for dividing the community and destroying player camaraderie.
Edited by ZOS_TristanK on May 13, 2014 3:10PMOne should always be in love. That is the reason one should never marry.
~Oscar Wilde1 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
As I understand the issue is that the majority of players who sell loot don't know much about the current prices and is mostly interested in a quick and fast sale.Drachenfier wrote: »@Chryos hit it right on the head. It is ALL about undercutting
That's called supply and demand. That's how it works...when supply exceeds demand, prices fall, or get "undercut". All that means is that you and the other guy up there crying about undercutting can't continue to overcharge for common items. Dude, I've played just about every triple A MMO to be released since 1999, and pretty much everything you say about global markets is flat out incorrect. You're already shown your true colors, ie, ripping off the unsuspecting. You and your kind have reason to fear a centralized market.
@NukaCola - everyone already looks the same, your argument is pointless. Everyone in heavy looks the same, everyone in light looks the same. The only people that look different are the ones wearing VR costumes, and those can't be sold.
And to the lady screeching about this game being a WoW clone if we add an AH - by that logic, its already a WoW clone because it has elves and heals. Give that crap a rest.
With an global AH it will be loads of items for sale so many will sell their one gold cheaper than the lowest price and prices will fall until its just as smart to sell to npc or it get so low crafter will buy in bulk for deconstruct.
rare items on the other hand will have the opposite effect, here the prices will skyrocket as players with lots of gold buy them.
Think part of the reason rare motifs is so expensive is that we have more serious rich players with more gold than they can use. 14 days ago far more still had to buy the extra fast horse and more bag spaceGrinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.2 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
The only downside with multiple guild is that the guild chat get confusing with multiple conversations going on at once.torstenb16_ESO8 wrote: »a public auctions house is needed, at the moment noone is playing together in a guild, because they are in 4 guilds, that ruined the game.
Tried an addon who should let me have multiple windows but it did not work.
Playing together in a guild is guild activities for me like helping an guildmate or getting help, doing dungeon and pvp, the chat is for asking about stuff but socializing is also important.Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.1 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
And an Auction House is not a monopoly. It's just a tool to open up the market to everyone - which results in the most competitive market possible. So if it's competition in the market you like - I think you should throw your support behind implementing one of those.
There is no way you have played MMOs to any level of seriousness and have that opinion. No way. You are so off base it's crazy. Competitive? Really? It's not competition in a good sense, it's an Undercutting War. What do you think will happen to the cost of white materials (like crafting mats) when there is a global auction house? They go down. Why? Because all the stacks of Jute being put up will be I gold less than the previous guy. Competitive undercutting maybe. And when the prices of mats go down and easily available to everyone, guess what else that does? Creates an influx of gear/epics/etc, and lowers the value again.
Now consider you need to go out and farm 1500 stacks of item X, Y, and Z yourself to start crafting epics. Bit of a difference in availability then because some people won't do it, or take considerable longer time to do so. When items are harder to find, they retain value.
Because of the AH in WoW, I cant sell level 476 epics for more than a few hundred gold. Without that AH, I could probably find some fresh 90s willing to pay more.
It's really not that hard to see this. Anyone with a long history of MMOs, playing Auction Houses, or have reached milestones in other MMOs can tell you the negative effects of an AH. I have made 4-5 million gold in WoW since last year playing the AH. I made 200-250mill credits a week in Star Wars Galaxies owning the #1 Armorsmith business on the Valcyn server. I have an advantage when my competition can't see my prices, and then adjust theirs. I have an advantage when materials are equally available to the other competitors or they are forced to farm and work as hard as I did.
What advantage do I have an ESO right now? Well, I am only level 20 and completing the dungeons in that level range. So the BOE blues I get are going up on my trade guilds. If we had a global AH, about 200-500 of those would probably be listed and would be 1 gold cheaper than the next guy. Maybe I'd get 50 gold for it whereas right now I can get 300-500 for it.
Sorry but you are just wrong about me. I have played many MMORPGs for years at a time and never have I had any problems using an auction house. I've always been able to buy and sell successfully with them.
Also - you act as if being able to find things up for sale for cheap prices is a bad thing. It's actually not.
And yes, undercutting is basically what competition in this context means. People lower their prices to attract more business. So if you are having a hard time selling things on an auction house - that probably just means you are wanting too much for your items where as others are content with less profit.Edited by Jeremy on May 13, 2014 2:29PM4 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Not really. Just because you ridicule and trivialise the point about people wanting a wow clone does not mean that it's incorrect. A lot of people do want a wow clone in the eso universe. I hope the game won't go that way. Wow is a great game, but this is Elder Scrolls and please, let it stay different. Not every mmo needs to be the same.
She wasn't ridiculing you Elirienne.
All she was doing was emphasizing how your last post made her earlier point that people assume just because a game has an auction house that immediately makes it a WoW clone. And that's just not the case and really doesn't do Elder Scrolls justice.
If the only thing ESO had apart from WoW was lack of an auction house then I would hate the game. Because out of all the things ESO does that WoW does not - lack of an auction house is at the very bottom of that list in terms of superiority.
For examples: ESO gives you a lot more freedom in how you design your character. Something that has been missing in many MMORPGs, not just WoW. It emphasizes open world content and actually makes questing and exploration productive and fun again like it used to be back in the old days. It's not designed to be just an instance or daily quest grind for a few extra stats on your gear - which is the typical norm.
I could name many more things that set this game apart from WoW. But this post is already starting to get too wordy so I'll end it here. Just know that what sets this game apart from WoW is not its lack of an auction house. It's the superiority of its gameplay and the immersion of its world. The auction house is the one thing this game could learn from WoW (and many other games). Because if this game has one obvious weakness in its design its the player-based economy.
I know she was not ridiculing me. She was ridiculing the "wow clone" argument, which , in fairness, can get ridiculous, but it does not necessarily mean that there is no truth to it. And I agree with you on many points, but I am looking at it from a solo perspective, and in this game there are many more soloers than in other mmos. I personally would prefer if the game did not sacrifice immersion and the focus on solo play for the sake of the mmo aspects, but as long as they coexist without compromises, i really don't mind.
I don't understand why you think an auction house would hurt your immersion or affect your solo play.4 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭"And an Auction House is not a monopoly. It's just a tool to open up the market to everyone - which results in the most competitive market possible. So if it's competition in the market you like - I think you should throw your support behind implementing one of those."
While I can see why you would think like this would seem like a good idea. It doesent work out like that in MMOs. It turns into the normal player never getting to sell anything or turn a profit because "Billy the nonstop mat farmer" has 484838284 of the same item as you, and constantly undercuts you so you can never sell your item. Someone else could better explain it than I can.
Basically, it would be like Walmart moving into your small town, putting small business "out of business".
As I've said, I've played many MMORPGs and never had trouble selling things on an auction house for profit. This argument that everything becomes worthless and you can't sell anything just doesn't reflect reality.
And Wal Mart is a bad example and doesn't relate to this debate.
The reason Wal Mart is able to stomp out the competition is because they take advantage of cheap labor in china to manufacture the lion's share of their goods. It has absolutely nothing to do with an auction house.Edited by Jeremy on May 13, 2014 2:36PM3 -
ZOS_TristanK✭✭✭✭✭
✭Hi, all. We want to let you know that we are reading your feedback about auction houses and the ESO economy. We'd like to continue reading this feedback here, but do ask that you keep all comments civil, constructive, and on-topic. Thank you!1 -
Drachenfier✭✭✭✭✭
✭
As I understand the issue is that the majority of players who sell loot don't know much about the current prices and is mostly interested in a quick and fast sale.Drachenfier wrote: »@Chryos hit it right on the head. It is ALL about undercutting
That's called supply and demand. That's how it works...when supply exceeds demand, prices fall, or get "undercut". All that means is that you and the other guy up there crying about undercutting can't continue to overcharge for common items. Dude, I've played just about every triple A MMO to be released since 1999, and pretty much everything you say about global markets is flat out incorrect. You're already shown your true colors, ie, ripping off the unsuspecting. You and your kind have reason to fear a centralized market.
@NukaCola - everyone already looks the same, your argument is pointless. Everyone in heavy looks the same, everyone in light looks the same. The only people that look different are the ones wearing VR costumes, and those can't be sold.
And to the lady screeching about this game being a WoW clone if we add an AH - by that logic, its already a WoW clone because it has elves and heals. Give that crap a rest.
With an global AH it will be loads of items for sale so many will sell their one gold cheaper than the lowest price and prices will fall until its just as smart to sell to npc or it get so low crafter will buy in bulk for deconstruct.
rare items on the other hand will have the opposite effect, here the prices will skyrocket as players with lots of gold buy them.
Think part of the reason rare motifs is so expensive is that we have more serious rich players with more gold than they can use. 14 days ago far more still had to buy the extra fast horse and more bag space
Yes, that's how supply and demand works. All the small markets do is artificially inflate prices by limiting the supply.0 -
KariTR✭✭✭✭✭ZOS_TristanK wrote: »Hi, all. We want to let you know that we are reading your feedback about auction houses and the ESO economy. We'd like to continue reading this feedback here, but do ask that you keep all comments civil, constructive, and on-topic. Thank you!
Hi Tristan.
I don't want to see an AH in Tamriel, so I don't contribute to these threads ordinarily. I suspect many, many players are of the same mind as me.
I hope you take that into account when considering feedback.
Thank you!1 -
Xithian✭✭✭I don't understand why you think an auction house would hurt your immersion or affect your solo play.
And that's why this is such a hot topic on the forums. Most people that want an AH don't even understand why anyone would want to not have one. The points have been made over and over. It comes down to community. Most trading right now is done person to person, with actual interaction. Look at the first reply in this thread. Guilds are making deals with other guilds for supplies.
You may not think (or care if) it makes much of an impact on the community, but clearly many do...including ZoS.
People are still able to "play the market". It's actually fairly easy, as prices can vary from zone to zone and at different times of day. The only difference as far as I've been able to tell is that buyers might have to wait if they want a good deal. It comes around to wanting instant gratification. "I want to dump my items in an AH and not deal with it again" or "I want to type in what I'm looking for and just click the best priced." Which affects the community. It cuts out a large chunk of player interaction and draws a different crowd of players.2 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ZOS_TristanK wrote: »Hi, all. We want to let you know that we are reading your feedback about auction houses and the ESO economy. We'd like to continue reading this feedback here, but do ask that you keep all comments civil, constructive, and on-topic. Thank you!
Hi Tristan.
I don't want to see an AH in Tamriel, so I don't contribute to these threads ordinarily. I suspect many, many players are of the same mind as me.
I hope you take that into account when considering feedback.
Thank you!
No one is trying to force you to use an auction house Kari. And if they were to add one, you could simply stick to the way you are playing and forget its there. But for a lot of us, these guild stores and trade spam simply aren't getting the job done. And we need something that does.
For a recent example: I just hit level 28 and was wanting to craft me a new set of at least green armor. I however ran out of honing stones - checked every single one of my guild stores this morning. Not a single one was up for sale in any of them. Not one.
So again I am going to have to wander around opening chests and collecting loot for hours and hours hoping I get lucky from deconstructing. This game's economy - in its current state - simply doesn't work.
And would it really be so awful to give us one that does so crafters like me can actually use our gold to buy materials we need so we can get more use out of crafting while leveling up? Would that really be such a terrible thing?Edited by Jeremy on May 13, 2014 3:40PM3 -
alphawolph✭✭✭Bottom line for me is ESO plays like a single player game for me 99% of the time cause i vendor everything. Best single player mmo on the market.1 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ZOS_TristanK wrote: »Hi, all. We want to let you know that we are reading your feedback about auction houses and the ESO economy. We'd like to continue reading this feedback here, but do ask that you keep all comments civil, constructive, and on-topic. Thank you!
Hi Tristan.
I don't want to see an AH in Tamriel, so I don't contribute to these threads ordinarily. I suspect many, many players are of the same mind as me.
I hope you take that into account when considering feedback.
Thank you!
No one is trying to force you to use an auction house Kari. And if they were to add one, you could simply stick to the way you are playing and forget its there. But for a lot of us, these guild stores and trade spam simply aren't getting the job done. And we need something that does.
For a recent example: I just hit level 28 and was wanting to craft me a new set of at least green armor. I however ran out of honing stones - checked every single one of my guild stores this morning. Not a single one was up for sale in any of them. Not one.
So again I am going to have to wander around opening chests and collecting loot for hours and hours hoping I get lucky from deconstructing. This game's economy - in its current state - simply doesn't work.
And would it really be so awful to give us one that does so crafters like me can actually use our gold to buy materials we need so we can get more use out of crafting while leveling up? Would that really be such a terrible thing?
How about asking in guild chat?
Two days ago I asked if somebody could buy 5 VR1 glyphs, my armor was destroyed so I thougt I could craft a VR1 set but was not done with main quest so could not buy from vendor.
Someone in guild crafted 8 green glyphs,also sent two staffs and a robe for free.
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.1 -
Xithian✭✭✭No one is trying to force you to use an auction house Kari. And if they were to add one, you could simply stick to the way you are playing and forget its there.
As I said directly above, that's just untrue. It would still affect everyone. It would affect the market and the community in general.For a recent example: I just hit level 28 and was wanting to craft me a new set of at least green armor. I however ran out of honing stones - checked every single one of my guild stores this morning. Not a single one was up for sale in any of them. Not one.
So again I am going to have to wander around opening chests and collecting loot for hours and hours hoping I get lucky from deconstructing. This game's economy - in its current state - simply doesn't work.
Did you once during that time take a trip to a major city and ask if anyone had Honing Stones to sell? Ask in guild? Because most of us tradeskillers have stacks of them sitting in the bank. Literally. Hundreds.1 -
alphawolph✭✭✭
If only there was some way for you to get them to him without playing hide and seek with each other.No one is trying to force you to use an auction house Kari. Anjd if they were to add one, you could simply stick to the way you are playing and forget its there.
As I said directly above, that's just untrue. It would still affect everyone. It would affect the market and the community in general.For a recent example: I just hit level 28 and was wanting to craft me a new set of at least green armor. I however ran out of honing stones - checked every single one of my guild stores this morning. Not a single one was up for sale in any of them. Not one.
So again I am going to have to wander around opening chests and collecting loot for hours and hours hoping I get lucky from deconstructing. This game's economy - in its current state - simply doesn't work.
Did you once during that time take a trip to a major city and ask if anyone had Honing Stones to sell? Ask in guild? Because most of us tradeskillers have stacks of them sitting in the bank. Literally. Hundreds.
2
Thanks!
This discussion has been closed.