Get rid of Rushing Agony from PvP right NOW please

xylena_lazarow · February 6

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

But truthfully, the idea that you think you shouldn't have been able to have be killed by a whole group of players is absolutely wild.

Yeah it's wild that I think I one skilled player should be able to survive a mid group (without automated proc effects doing that group's very difficult 12v1 work for them). Not wipe that group, just survive and get away. Almost as wild as thinking that 12 skilled should in fact be able to endlessly wipe a whole 60+ faction and never die.

What do sweaty organized groups even need Rushing Agony for? Do they struggle to kill disorganized zergers without it? This is like a school bully complaining that he can't bully if he's not allowed to bring his Super Soaker to math class.

MincMincMinc · February 6

I just think more of you need to be holding zos accountable for breaching basic design fundamentals. A stun with no immunity just shouldn't exist. Counterplay mechanics need to have clear counterplay. Biggest example was probably the ambush spam meta. Just design a functional skill instead of undermining the counterplay system. I still have a problem with leap where they failed to design a functional skill on one of the most fun class defining ultimates.

Like for leap we want a gap closer that moves my character (that already exists). Then we need to do aoe damage at the final location (that already exists). Then it needs to do a knockback in that aoe (which already exists)........... So why does this need the root that bypasses all immunity? To get some single target functionality work around? Just make the skill properly and that wont be necessary.

Thumbless_Bot · February 6

We can talk about how roa is buggy and how dc and roa are blockable all day. The real issue imho is that both of these sets are not balanced. That is it.

ROA
Is
Not
Balanced

DC
Is
Not
Balanced

It does not matter whether they are telegraphed and/or blockable.

It does not matter how much damage they do.

It does not matter if they are bugged.

It does not matter if they have a very long cool down.

It does not matter that everyone can wear this set.

No one should be able to slap on a 5-piece or even 12-piece and control an entire battlefield every 8 or even 25 seconds. It's too strong for even an ultimate that cost 300. These sets ruin pvp, have no place there. and should be monsters only.

Kartalin · February 6

I do think people would feel less cheated by this set with a more obvious telegraph -- some mentioned similar to meteor or tarnished. At least you would have a clearer window between the set being activated and the pull being activated via a ground based indicator which would turn this into more of a skill issue than a mechanics issue.

necro_the_crafter · February 6

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

"There are several flops on this". No. Everything I said is completely accurate and 100% manageable for players to do. Could there be adjustments made that would make it even easier to avoid? Sure. Do they actually need to be made to make it possible to avoid this set entirely? Absolutely not.

They could completely remove the damage from the set and it would make absolutely zero difference. Rush doesn't kill, the Fear that follows the Rush is what kills. Rush just makes it easier to stack 6 people in the fear Radius, it isn't essential.

If you "can't see the animation" of an enemy gap closing to your postion, that is an awareness issue. You were probably mindlessly zerging and stacking without situational awareness. Exactly the behavior it was the design intent of this set to counter, but the truth is you would have died to that ballgroup in that scenario RoA or no RoA, because of the bad positioning choices you made.

Also, re the cooldown, Ballgroups are absolutely not using Rush offensively every 8 seconds. Rush isn't strictly a bomb set. It is a utility pull, and can also be used defensively too and that is where the shorter cooldown can be valuable.

If we actually want to talk about sets that are "unfair"; the problem isn't Rush; it's the chain kill sets like Plague and VD that, yes, are a punishment for stacking, but mostly a punishment for mistakes someone other than you made.

Well would it be balanced if leashing soul/DC/DK's chain/warden runes/necros beckoning armor/silver leash didnt trigger cc immunity on targets? Based on your logic:

1. Any other pull also have a clear telegraph, so if you cant avoid it - its awarness issue;
2. Any other pull doesnt deal nearly as much damage as RoA proc;
3. Any other pull is a gcd waste wich means that it cannot be followed up immidiatly with a skill (unlike RoA that is delayed and allows for a setup);

So why does any other pull in the game applies cc immunity and RoA is special?
Its also impossible to follow up any other pull with a dawnbraker, if target is activly kiting you.

Would it be balanced if dk's could chain-fossilise peoople? or necros could pull peole into fear totem?

Even if we consider that RoA requires a gap close first and that somehow puts it in a worse spot than range pulls - imagine DK's unrelenting grip to pull you back after 2s delay without cc applied; DK, that gap closes on you with major expedition and major berserk, have a delay to set up his molten whip, applies ulfilds, pulls you back and fossilises immidiatly for a whip + ult follow up. Would it be balanced?

I cant see how RoA is special. If it aplied cc immunity to target, based on devs logic, it would be imposible to combo it with a big ult hit, but pulls CC aplication was implemented to DENY PLAYERS stunning people after pull/ bursting people after pull, because thats BREAKS IMPORTANCE OF POSITIONING.

Also after nerfs to DC, ZOS themselves stated that AoE pulls is a ultimate like capability, but procceeded with a much more potent and broken version with RoA that have much less CD and aplies no cc to targets.

I would be okay with AoE pulls if it were on an ultimate synergy like templars nova - gravity crush. Then, it would have an at least 20 sec cooldown per player, couldnt be used solo, require much more coordination then RoA, and it is ground based instead of following a player which is esier for servers to calculate positions, which would result in less pulls from across the walls/terrain.
But on the proc sets - it has to have 1m cooldown atleast, and definetly apply cc immunity after a pull, or be a 12 piece set withot bonuses, only with a proc on a 12th piece.

TechMaybeHic · February 6

Thumbless_Bot wrote: »

We can talk about how roa is buggy and how dc and roa are blockable all day. The real issue imho is that both of these sets are not balanced. That is it.

ROA
Is
Not
Balanced

DC
Is
Not
Balanced

It does not matter whether they are telgraphed and/or blockable.

It does not matter how much damage they do.

It does not matter if they are bugged.

It does not matter if they have a very long cool down.

It does not matter that everyone can wear this set.

No one should be able to slap on a 5-piece or even 12-piece and control an entire battlefield every 8 or even 25 seconds. It's too strong for even an ultimate that cost 300. These sets ruin pvp, have no place there. and should be monsters only.

Yep. It's not fun to deal with. It's way more impactful to melee than range and that power dynamic is already getting unbalanced. I prefer just get rid of it.

Thumbless_Bot · February 6

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Thumbless_Bot wrote: »

We can talk about how roa is buggy and how dc and roa are blockable all day. The real issue imho is that both of these sets are not balanced. That is it.

ROA
Is
Not
Balanced

DC
Is
Not
Balanced

It does not matter whether they are telgraphed and/or blockable.

It does not matter how much damage they do.

It does not matter if they are bugged.

It does not matter if they have a very long cool down.

It does not matter that everyone can wear this set.

No one should be able to slap on a 5-piece or even 12-piece and control an entire battlefield every 8 or even 25 seconds. It's too strong for even an ultimate that cost 300. These sets ruin pvp, have no place there. and should be monsters only.

Yep. It's not fun to deal with. It's way more impactful to melee than range and that power dynamic is already getting unbalanced. I prefer just get rid of it.

Yeah. These sets have turned competitve pvp in eso into a carnival sideshow.

CatoUnchained · February 6

Free pull sets have no place in a PvP environment. Period.

We can talk about all the other details, but free pulls should not exist in PvP in any game.

Joy_Division · February 7

That there somehow is a debate about this set is why the PvP in the game is stale, unappealing to the majority of the population - to say nothing of the larger MMO community - and is a fringe game-system played by the same tiny community night after night.

Just because the set can be countered isn't enough of a justification for it playing such a dominant role in PvP. And let's be clear, no other set in the game is as dominant as this one. Every ball group has since this set has been introduced have used this in every one of their comps, and every "tactic" they ever do centers around this set's functionality and only this set's functionality. That is in itself a huge screaming red flag suggesting this set is overpowered, unfun, and destroys any diversity when it comes to comps and strategies for group Vs group or group Vs PuG gameplay. The whole point for having 600+ different gear sets, 7 classes, multiple weapon lines, etc., is that there would be numerous and effective ways to play the game to keep it fresh, varied, and interesting. This set violates that fundamental principle because for all the apologia, justifications, and pro-ball group propaganda that basically says, "you suck, git gud at the game, it's not this set that is killing you" misses the obvious point that because so many players are not the 5 star, high twitch super experienced I play every-night and know all the PvP patterns try-hards, they do very often get killed by the gameplay pattern this set enables. If it was so easy to avoid, counter, and nullify this set, then every single ball group would at least try to use something different. They all use RoA because it is a far more effective way to kill many people in a short amount of time than the other 600+ sets which it is competing against. This is by definition, over powered.

Because this set and this set alone imposes so many preconditions for players to not-insta die to it, it is not fun or competitive to pay against: they must by familiar with ball group patterns, they must be hyper aware of their surroundings, they must perfectly time their blocks (no you can;t roll dodge and if you keep block up too ling, the 11 other ball groupers will kill you will steel tornados, Warden Shalks, DBs, etc), There is no other set, skill, or weapon in the game that demands a player must do so many things just not to die. Not Cloak. Not Hardened Ward. Not Jesus Beam. Not Tarnished Nightmare. Not standing under flaming oil. Not even the set's cousin Dark Convergence. Against everything else players will face in Cyrodiil, they do not impose such strict conditions on a player just to survive. That again is by definition overpowered and it is made worse that RoA is a huge enabler of another dubious gameplay element of ball-groups. It isn't fun. It's the reason why people who use to play this game, come back, and says [snip] when they first get sucked in by this set and die. They say [snip] because for years and years, as strong as ball groups were, they did not make such demands just for players to survive. That such power even exists in the game now completely blows their mind because ball groups were never able to do anything like that.

So of course, they don't come back. The "casuals" do even bother coming. Even the vets get bored and they don;t log in. So, we go from having multiple pop locked servers with much higher pop caps and ques of 200 to the sad and sorry state of 2024-2025 where I can que in on primetime Friday night and have a que of 2 to the "zerg" server. That is the MMO community screaming the PvP in this game is bad and boring. A set imposing very restrictive demands on how to counter/deal with it is not rock, paper, scissors. That's I have something so strong, you must play the game differently around me and only me. Sets and skills such as that take away options, rather than enabling different variations of gameplay.

There is nothing less fun in any RPG/fantasy game/PvP than losing control of your character. It's one thing to die to a fire-breathing dragon, or get cleaved in half by a raging barbarian's axe, or make a poor decision to attack a goblin camp and just get overwhelmed by numbers. In each of those scenarios, the player is in full control of their character and in the introspective afterward, can easily see how better builds or decisions could have changed the outcome. Or at least convince themselves that next time, they might win. But when a Game-Master or a computer game sets up much more sinister encounter that involve taking away a player's ability to make their turns (such as by stuns, charms, forced movement, etc) and then kills them by fire-breathing dragons or zerging goblins, it's a completely different experience because the player no longer feels as if they are/were in control of their destiny - not wrongly because they literally cannot control their character. Every RPG system warns its Game-Master to use such mechanics rarely, judiciously, and to give players ample warning of the potential dangers, otherwise, they will soon find their game table empty. That a ball group - already too strong because of poor balance decisions - would be able to have the ability to consistently forcibly and simultaneously move groups of players from distances at range and prevent them from regaining control of their characters easily falls in this category.

The moment Rush of Agony was suggested, anyone understanding the human element that separates NPCs from living breathing paying customers should have immediately insisted that such power the set enabled ought to be accompanied by the condition "against monsters."

[edited for profanity bypass]

xFocused · February 7

It's a crutch set that is without a doubt broken, plain and simple. Ball groups rely heavily on it. Small scale groups rely heavily on it, there doesn't seem to be ANY kind of cooldown to the set whatsoever so if you have 1-3 people using RoA, you're now getting pulled nonstop by the chains. At least with Dark Convergence, you can tell when and where that's proccing and you at least have a chance to block/walk out of it. RoA, you have no idea where it's coming from, where you're getting pulled from and how many times it's going to yank you around. I don't even want to bother in PvP right now because of many ball groups, small scale and large scale zerg groups are using it. I get it, it's incredibly OP and obviously the meta but it needs to be either nerfed or removed until it's not so unstoppable.

It would be nice if Snake in the Stars didn't get absolutely gutted on the PTS as that seemed to be a viable counter to these groups using RoA and so forth but it is what it is I guess

ioResult · February 7

What I find most interesting is the optics around the ZOS devs here.

A thread was started on nerfing Azureblight - a set which was detrimental to ball groups - and nearly instantly we see it nerfed in a PTS update.

However, THIS set is beneficial to ball groups, has been a topic of disgust for moths by the vast majority of people who don't run in ball groups ruining everyone else's game play, and has been a thread here for nearly a month but we see nothing about this set being nerfed in any PTS patch and we're already nearing the end of all the changes going into this patch.

This is exactly why notions that all devs suck at PvP and run only in ball groups in Cyrodiil flourish.

This is exactly why sentiment that the ZOS devs don't listen to the player community flourish.

This is exactly why long time PvPers have cancelled their ESO Plus subscriptions and/or left the game completely.

No one but a tiny minority in ESO PvP actually want RoA and DC sets in the game and the rest want them either nerfed to affect only monsters or taken out of the game completely.

Yet we hear nothing. Crickets.

Bad Optics ZOS. Bad Optics which only reinforce the skepticism that you care about the player base or PyP at all.

The literally ONLY thing you're doing regarding PvP is testing changes with the goal of making ball groups cause less lag, because we all know their play style is what causes the lag in Cyrodiil.

Go into a 3x pop locked campaign and there is little to no lag unless a bunch of zerglings are concentrated in one area spamming multi-effect AoEs just like ball groups do ALL THE TIME.

So the optics are that ZOS still only cares about enabling their ball group buddies and might as well just admit their only Cyrodiil experience is to act trolly and run in ball groups.

That ZOS is what you're saying to the PvP community by not even commenting on this thread in any meaningful way let alone doing what 99% of your PvP user base wants - which is to see a PTS release which at least has RoA affecting monsters only.

xFocused · February 7

It just needs to be adjusted, not fully removed in my opinion. The big issues with Rush like I and others have mentioned in this thread is that you can't always plan on blocking it especially if it's being stacked by multiple people in a group which does happen. I've been yanked 2 and 3 times in a row by Rush because there seems to be no cooldown to it, that's a problem. Dark con, another pull set at least seems to have a cool down. Dark con is also way easier to avoid since it's a giant purple ruin on the ground you can see forming. Rush, you just hear the chains then see the actual animation seconds later, most of the time you don't even see the chains, just hear the proc go off and hope you can block it.

I see others trying to defend the set saying it's fine the way it is, it's blockable, etc...but if that was the case this thread (and previous ones) wouldn't have 5 almost 6 pages now of PvP players asking for it's removal or to be adjusted. It's a buggy set that is overperforming at the moment, pair the set with the current server lag and yes, you are getting yanked up stairs, through walls, around corners...Zos has this bad habit of nerfing sets that don't need it and keeping ones like Rush around that are absolutely gamebreaking

StaticWave · February 7

Good groups don’t need RoA to perform, but the difference between bombing with and without RoA is massive. I’ve done a fair amount of small scaling and our bombs are multiple times more effective when we slot RoA.

In the heat of a fight, nobody is going to look for that 1 RoA user when they’re busy defending themselves against 4+ others pounding on their arse. Ever been chained by a DK while kiting? Now remove the CC immunity from it and you have RoA.

RoA is broken because it doesn’t apply CC immunity. Everybody knows you can block to counter it. That doesn’t take away the fact that RoA is still broken.

RoA needs to apply CC immunity for a start. That would eliminate a lot of the issues people currently have with the set.

Turtle_Bot · February 7

Something I have found to be a very interesting aspect on the topic of Rush of Agony (which is something I mentioned a while ago on another RoA thread):

The design/state of the RoA set is 1 of only 2 (or maybe 3) things in the history of this game that Sorc mains and NB mains agree on. The other thing that I can think of is that ball groups (i.e. sweaty organized PvP raids, not the casual PuG zergs) are currently way too overpowered compared to everything else in PvP.

If something is so inherently problematic that NB mains and Sorc mains are in agreement on it being an issue, that's when it should be clear as a mid-summer's day to whoever is in charge of adjusting it, that whatever that thing is, should be addressed immediately for the overall health of the game, because NB mains and Sorc mains never agree on anything.

And yes, I know it's not just NB and Sorc mains that agree this set needs changing, just putting some perspective out there on how significant the issue of the current state of Rush of Agony really is.

Kram8ion · February 7

No it’s fine been using it for months, I didn’t kill any healbots before and nothing changed
Tanks very much

xylena_lazarow · February 7

Joy_Division wrote: »

so many players are not the 5 star, high twitch super experienced I play every-night and know all the PvP patterns try-hards

And yet it's high twitch super experienced tryhards that are leading the charge to nerf this set. Hardcore duelers, smallscalers, and even ball groupers alike are all united over Rushing Agony being the worst thing in all of PvP. It took months for so much as a single "git gud" comment to appear on an RoA thread, and look how fast those arguments died.

xFocused · February 7

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

so many players are not the 5 star, high twitch super experienced I play every-night and know all the PvP patterns try-hards

And yet it's high twitch super experienced tryhards that are leading the charge to nerf this set. Hardcore duelers, smallscalers, and even ball groupers alike are all united over Rushing Agony being the worst thing in all of PvP. It took months for so much as a single "git gud" comment to appear on an RoA thread, and look how fast those arguments died.

The whole “it’s fine, leave it alone” arguments are just silly. It’s clearly not fine and anyone who says it is either isn’t playing PvP currently or is one of those groups that heavily relies on it. If you can counter it then why can’t any of us do so on a consistent basis? I’d love to be able to block and walk out of it if I could tell where I’m getting pulled from half of the time. I’m seeing NB’s now pop out of stealth and proc it with lotus which makes it unpredictable at times

MincMincMinc · February 7

IDK something like this is more powerful than most ultimates in the game which are on 30s-150s cooldown essentially. This is 8s, kinda crazy that people can even defend this as balanced or operating reasonably by any means. Id rather see this effect as an ultimate for like undaunted or something. Justify its strength in some way that isn't a gap closer every 8s.

Even meteor which is not as detrimental is basically a 40s ult gen cooldown and has a 2s telegraph with a very clear animation and sound effect.

Joy_Division · February 7

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

so many players are not the 5 star, high twitch super experienced I play every-night and know all the PvP patterns try-hards

And yet it's high twitch super experienced tryhards that are leading the charge to nerf this set. Hardcore duelers, smallscalers, and even ball groupers alike are all united over Rushing Agony being the worst thing in all of PvP. It took months for so much as a single "git gud" comment to appear on an RoA thread, and look how fast those arguments died.

Of course. Those people actually still care enough about the game to play it every night.

That this set has existed for so long and anyone watching that BG stream (now of course deleted) make it perfectly obvious that nobody at ZOS has even played casually in Cyrodiil for years.

RoA and HoT stacking have been so obvious bad mechanics for so long, it is absolutely mind-boggling they both have allowed to persist patch after patch, year after year. Anyone who cared about the game would have attempted to address these a long time ago.

xylena_lazarow · February 7

Joy_Division wrote: »

RoA and HoT stacking have been so obvious bad mechanics for so long, it is absolutely mind-boggling they both have allowed to persist patch after patch, year after year. Anyone who cared about the game would have attempted to address these a long time ago.

This is why Cyro is dead. Vengeance isn't gonna bring it back. Sure the HoT stacking is a complicated problem to solve, but deleting Rushing Agony is relatively not complicated, and would immediately bring players back.

Major_Mangle · February 7

MincMincMinc wrote: »

IDK something like this is more powerful than most ultimates in the game which are on 30s-150s cooldown essentially. This is 8s, kinda crazy that people can even defend this as balanced or operating reasonably by any means. Id rather see this effect as an ultimate for like undaunted or something. Justify its strength in some way that isn't a gap closer every 8s.

Even meteor which is not as detrimental is basically a 40s ult gen cooldown and has a 2s telegraph with a very clear animation and sound effect.

It's the same mental gymnastics from the people who yelled for azureblight to be nerfed because it was the only real counterplay option. Same people will gaslight and come up with non-logical arguments to why RoA is fine as it is. I'd simply ignore those comments and keep asking for sensible balance adjustments to sets, skills, mechanics that are unhealthy for the game. Sure people can disagree on things and it's fine, but it's VERY obvious when you're just after to protect a tool that hardcarries mediocre groups.

MincMincMinc · February 7

Major_Mangle wrote: »

MincMincMinc wrote: »

IDK something like this is more powerful than most ultimates in the game which are on 30s-150s cooldown essentially. This is 8s, kinda crazy that people can even defend this as balanced or operating reasonably by any means. Id rather see this effect as an ultimate for like undaunted or something. Justify its strength in some way that isn't a gap closer every 8s.

Even meteor which is not as detrimental is basically a 40s ult gen cooldown and has a 2s telegraph with a very clear animation and sound effect.

It's the same mental gymnastics from the people who yelled for azureblight to be nerfed because it was the only real counterplay option. Same people will gaslight and come up with non-logical arguments to why RoA is fine as it is. I'd simply ignore those comments and keep asking for sensible balance adjustments to sets, skills, mechanics that are unhealthy for the game. Sure people can disagree on things and it's fine, but it's VERY obvious when you're just after to protect a tool that hardcarries mediocre groups.

Reminds me of the gimicky harmony players that cried when it was removed.

TechMaybeHic · February 7

I feel like harmony was not that bad and kept necro head above water. The problem even then was more about mass pulls into that kill zone and that problem is still ignored.

That said, they could still have nerfed harmony and just not made the necro self synergy so weak.

StaticWave · February 7

Joy_Division wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

so many players are not the 5 star, high twitch super experienced I play every-night and know all the PvP patterns try-hards

And yet it's high twitch super experienced tryhards that are leading the charge to nerf this set. Hardcore duelers, smallscalers, and even ball groupers alike are all united over Rushing Agony being the worst thing in all of PvP. It took months for so much as a single "git gud" comment to appear on an RoA thread, and look how fast those arguments died.

Of course. Those people actually still care enough about the game to play it every night.

That this set has existed for so long and anyone watching that BG stream (now of course deleted) make it perfectly obvious that nobody at ZOS has even played casually in Cyrodiil for years.

RoA and HoT stacking have been so obvious bad mechanics for so long, it is absolutely mind-boggling they both have allowed to persist patch after patch, year after year. Anyone who cared about the game would have attempted to address these a long time ago.

It’s funny because when RoA came out, the developer’s comment stated that their internal testing concluded the set to be balanced. Instead of taking feedback from the dedicated PTS testers, they decided to trust their own testings, which we all know how they eventually turned out on the live server lol.

In my opinion, it’s disrespectful to ask players for feed back on the PTS, only to ignore their feedback completely and let the patch play out for few more months. I mean, how hard is it to change a couple values on a set?

xylena_lazarow · February 7

StaticWave wrote: »

In my opinion, it’s disrespectful to ask players for feed back on the PTS, only to ignore their feedback completely and let the patch play out for few more months. I mean, how hard is it to change a couple values on a set?

This ties into my skepticism towards the Vengeance test, especially with no in-game rewards being offered for our time. Watch like they push Vengeance into a live patch while Cloak still has a burst heal attached...

Yeah I think "burst heal invisibility" being spammed every 8 seconds would be even more annoying than RoA every 8 seconds, because it's not just 1 sweaty group, it's 100 randoms on NB rerolls. In conclusion, delete Rushing Agony from PvP.

xFocused · February 7

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

I feel like harmony was not that bad and kept necro head above water. The problem even then was more about mass pulls into that kill zone and that problem is still ignored.

That said, they could still have nerfed harmony and just not made the necro self synergy so weak.

Hard agree. Harmony was fun, it was rather OP but compare it to RoA being used by so many of these groups and it doesn’t even hold a candle. Not to mention harmony was used more by solo players for Cro bombs. RoA is being stacked by multiple players in a group spamming it

YandereGirlfriend · February 8

xFocused wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

I feel like harmony was not that bad and kept necro head above water. The problem even then was more about mass pulls into that kill zone and that problem is still ignored.

That said, they could still have nerfed harmony and just not made the necro self synergy so weak.

Hard agree. Harmony was fun, it was rather OP but compare it to RoA being used by so many of these groups and it doesn’t even hold a candle. Not to mention harmony was used more by solo players for Cro bombs. RoA is being stacked by multiple players in a group spamming it

Magicka Necromancers were done SO DIRTY with that unjustified nerf.

Gutted Harmony and like halved Boneyard damage in the exact same patch. And nobody has seen a MagCro in Cyrodiil ever since. (Somehow, these sorts of things never seem to happen to Nightblades....)

Does anyone even use that version of Boneyard in 2025? Seems like a completely dead morph.

StaticWave · February 8

What’s funny to me personally is seasoned 1vXers and small scalers in this thread like @MincMincMinc and @Alchimiste1 are being called “lacking situational awareness” because they think RoA is broken. Keep in mind, these guys are SEASONED and have A LOT more awareness than your average player and also deal with RoA A LOT more. If RoA is that problematic for seasoned players to deal with, then I can’t imagine your average player being yanked around into a full group bomb, not knowing how they died.

Just a few months ago when my group still played, we ran a 5 man team without RoA and fights were challenging. To bomb 10-15+ people, we had to kite for a long time and funnel them through terrain choke points so that our bombs could consistently land on as many people as possible. It didn’t always work because people would spread out. You know what improved our bombing effectiveness? RoA. The moment one of us slotted RoA, our bombs were night and day easier. We didn’t need to funnel anybody into any choke points because RoA created that for us. All we had to do was charge forward and dump our ults after RoA proc and we could wipe at least 5-6 people.

Now picture that same scenario, but add 2-3 more RoAs with 2-3 hard hitting AoE DoT ults that don’t stun like Northern Storm and Eye of Storm, and you’re now yanking people 2-3 times while chunking their HP away every second with those ults, before finally nuking them with 2-3 RoA dmg procs and whatever AoE delayed bursts you cooked up. All of that does not give you CC immunity btw, so some NB can follow up with a juicy Soul Tether stun + burst into Steel Tornado spam, or some Warden can time their Contingency with Warden script and AoE snare you for 70% while you’re still being yanked around by RoA before charming you and forcing you to eat whatever execute comes next.

That’s your average ball group right now. If you defend this type of stale, automated, and downright broken gameplay, then expect PvP in this game to continue being stale forever.

acastanza_ESO · February 8

StaticWave wrote: »

What’s funny to me personally is seasoned 1vXers and small scalers in this thread like @MincMincMinc and @Alchimiste1 are being called “lacking situational awareness” because they think RoA is broken. Keep in mind, these guys are SEASONED and have A LOT more awareness than your average player and also deal with RoA A LOT more. If RoA is that problematic for seasoned players to deal with, then I can’t imagine your average player being yanked around into a full group bomb, not knowing how they died.

No offense intended, but there's a serious undercurrent of "anything that kills me is broken and should be nerfed" and "I should be table to solo tank any group" from the 1vX crowd. So pardon me if I think those category of complaints about RoA are more than a little bad-faith. It's the exact same category of illigitimate complaint as those made about Azureblight.

Dying to RoA is very much an issue with situational awareness, just like Azureblight.

For the record, I was also vocally against the Azureblight nerf as well.

xFocused · February 8

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

What’s funny to me personally is seasoned 1vXers and small scalers in this thread like @MincMincMinc and @Alchimiste1 are being called “lacking situational awareness” because they think RoA is broken. Keep in mind, these guys are SEASONED and have A LOT more awareness than your average player and also deal with RoA A LOT more. If RoA is that problematic for seasoned players to deal with, then I can’t imagine your average player being yanked around into a full group bomb, not knowing how they died.

No offense intended, but there's a serious undercurrent of "anything that kills me is broken and should be nerfed" and "I should be table to solo tank any group" from the 1vX crowd. So pardon me if I think those category of complaints about RoA are more than a little bad-faith. It's the exact same category of illigitimate complaint as those made about Azureblight.

Dying to RoA is very much an issue with situational awareness, just like Azureblight.

For the record, I was also vocally against the Azureblight nerf as well.

I have to disagree with your “dying to RoA is situational.” point. Yes, you can counter it or block it but it shouldn’t be as hard as it is. Why am I hearing the proc before I’m seeing it? I shouldn’t hear the chains go off then have to quickly guess where I’m going to get pulled to, especially when it’s a NB doing this while in cloak which is what is currently happening. I’m seeing players get yanked up stairs, downstairs, yanked in all different directions because you really have no idea where it’s going to hit you. Not to mention, it’s able to be stacked, so now you have BG’s and small scales hitting RoA more than once which is kinda ridiculous. Like I’ve said before, dark con might be annoying but at least I can see where that pull is coming from