Everyone is upset about ink and....
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AlterBlika✭✭✭✭Why people are so upset about drop rates when you can just buy ink from another players0 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm quite sure that question was answered on an earlier page.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....4 -
CP5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
https://youtu.be/v-v_D282bHs
So, I need to emphasize again that this is a "lucky" run for me. I looted 186 ink sources in 19 minutes and got one ink. Other people's lucky runs yield 12-20 ink per hour. I typically average around 1-2 ink per hour when doing dedicated node harvesting like this. It feels like a monumental waste of my time. It certainly doesn't feel "efficient." I want to actually be able to play the game. Mind you, there are people who are just playing the game normally without farming at all who already have more overall ink acquired than I do -- suggesting, again, that there may be a bug affecting some players.
A question for those of you with good RNG luck who are staunchly against ZOS doing anything about the drop rate: are you opposed to the idea of one guaranteed ink drop per account from the first daily quest or RND/BG completion of the day? If so, why are you opposed? What's your rationale?
That's not on the best side of rng, but not terrible with amount of nodes gathered (especially if you don't factor in mob count, which you shouldn't because they have very different, much lower drop rate). Within reason still. Sometimes this happens, sometimes the opposite. I had worse results than that myself and did not consider my account to be cursed or suspect some stealth nerf overnight.
There's really no reason to shove ink into inventories of players who aren't even looking for it. Like with any other material, if you want it, actively farm for it or just buy it, it's true for most things in game and other materials that are part of paid DLCs (like rheum, clam gall, powdered mother of pearl, chaurus egg). There is no daily use for ink, skills don't have duration like food, there are no master writs involving ink, no furnishing plans requiring ink. Once you are done with your skills, there is no more use for it, keep some in stock for potential changes and the rest only sell, nothing else to do with it. Like OP said, you are not meant to complete every skill on entire account within one month.
You can see already in guild stores, more and more posted every week, it moves slower and price halves every week, because more and more players no longer have use for it and it keeps dropping. Definitely there is no shortage, and there will be even more ink once patch drops.
Until people go to try out different combinations, return to old skills that they liked, or ZOS adds new skills, the need for ink on a day to day basis is low, but people who actively engage with the system will still need to spend ink regularly, depending on how often they want to try different things. Take this pts for example, adding more frost damage skills, or changing the duration of buffs and debuffs. You now have to pay ink to adapt to patch notes, no free respecs for a week after a patch lands.
As for the prices of ink, how much of that is due to players having such a bad impression of the system that they choose to ignore it, rather than buying into it even more by buying ink from traders? Make a system abrasive enough that players don't want to touch it, and the resource that people were selling for that system would be sold to a much smaller audience.
The same is true for gear, if ZOS changes something and you want to try it, you will need crafting mats, upgrade mats, transmutes, glyphs etc. If there's new set you want to try, you have to farm it first.
I can only imagine the outrage if gear crafting was added just last patch and was exactly like what we have today
Year of research, need to level every craft separately, need to invest skill points, need to farm or buy mats for every piece and every change...
Do you need to use a consumable resource to equip said gear? Encouraging you to stick with a particular set of gear because equipping new gear would cost you that resource, and returning to what you had on cost resources? No, once you get the gear you can freely switch between pieces as much as you like. When you get scripts you need to pay to make the skill and pay to change it, and pay to change it back, and pay to work around nerfs and buffs. Those are very different.3 -
wolfie1.0.✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭at current prices, and the likely rate its going Ink is going to be plentiful enough with trading that complaining about how to get it is going to be a moot point.
once things settle in the next month the only times that you will consume ink eventually are when new scribing skills get released, combat changes, new characters, and/or new classes release. outside of that its just stockpiling.
1 -
EF321✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭https://youtu.be/v-v_D282bHs
So, I need to emphasize again that this is a "lucky" run for me. I looted 186 ink sources in 19 minutes and got one ink. Other people's lucky runs yield 12-20 ink per hour. I typically average around 1-2 ink per hour when doing dedicated node harvesting like this. It feels like a monumental waste of my time. It certainly doesn't feel "efficient." I want to actually be able to play the game. Mind you, there are people who are just playing the game normally without farming at all who already have more overall ink acquired than I do -- suggesting, again, that there may be a bug affecting some players.
A question for those of you with good RNG luck who are staunchly against ZOS doing anything about the drop rate: are you opposed to the idea of one guaranteed ink drop per account from the first daily quest or RND/BG completion of the day? If so, why are you opposed? What's your rationale?
That's not on the best side of rng, but not terrible with amount of nodes gathered (especially if you don't factor in mob count, which you shouldn't because they have very different, much lower drop rate). Within reason still. Sometimes this happens, sometimes the opposite. I had worse results than that myself and did not consider my account to be cursed or suspect some stealth nerf overnight.
There's really no reason to shove ink into inventories of players who aren't even looking for it. Like with any other material, if you want it, actively farm for it or just buy it, it's true for most things in game and other materials that are part of paid DLCs (like rheum, clam gall, powdered mother of pearl, chaurus egg). There is no daily use for ink, skills don't have duration like food, there are no master writs involving ink, no furnishing plans requiring ink. Once you are done with your skills, there is no more use for it, keep some in stock for potential changes and the rest only sell, nothing else to do with it. Like OP said, you are not meant to complete every skill on entire account within one month.
You can see already in guild stores, more and more posted every week, it moves slower and price halves every week, because more and more players no longer have use for it and it keeps dropping. Definitely there is no shortage, and there will be even more ink once patch drops.
Until people go to try out different combinations, return to old skills that they liked, or ZOS adds new skills, the need for ink on a day to day basis is low, but people who actively engage with the system will still need to spend ink regularly, depending on how often they want to try different things. Take this pts for example, adding more frost damage skills, or changing the duration of buffs and debuffs. You now have to pay ink to adapt to patch notes, no free respecs for a week after a patch lands.
As for the prices of ink, how much of that is due to players having such a bad impression of the system that they choose to ignore it, rather than buying into it even more by buying ink from traders? Make a system abrasive enough that players don't want to touch it, and the resource that people were selling for that system would be sold to a much smaller audience.
The same is true for gear, if ZOS changes something and you want to try it, you will need crafting mats, upgrade mats, transmutes, glyphs etc. If there's new set you want to try, you have to farm it first.
I can only imagine the outrage if gear crafting was added just last patch and was exactly like what we have today Year of research, need to level every craft separately, need to invest skill points, need to farm or buy mats for every piece and every change...
Do you need to use a consumable resource to equip said gear? Encouraging you to stick with a particular set of gear because equipping new gear would cost you that resource, and returning to what you had on cost resources? No, once you get the gear you can freely switch between pieces as much as you like. When you get scripts you need to pay to make the skill and pay to change it, and pay to change it back, and pay to work around nerfs and buffs. Those are very different.
You don't need ink every time you equip scribed skill either and can slot different scribed skills as you like. And yes, getting new set instead of the one I am using right now will cost me material or gold and inventory space too, which is not unlimited, I can't have infinite combinations of sets on me to mix and match. Sooner or later I will have to decide what to keep and what to throw away to make room, or stop making changes to my character. Changing trait or enchant would require material, changing weight would require completely new crafted/reconstructed piece, nothing is free.0 -
Aurielle✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
I’ll ask the question again, because it still hasn’t been answered: would those of you who don’t want the drop rate to change be OK with us having a guaranteed single ink drop from the first daily quest or RND/BG completed on an account per day? If not, why?
I feel as if they wouldn't want that to happen either - a lot of people (not necessarily those posting here) are making bank on selling ink....
Given that none of them have responded, I suspect you may be correct.
I personally would be absolutely fine with keeping the drop rate as it is if I could get just one guaranteed ink every day by completing one of a number of activities I actively enjoy. I suspect I’m not the only one who’d be happy with that. It would give us a slow, but stable path to scribing that would not break the economy.4 -
Vonnegut2506✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I’ll ask the question again, because it still hasn’t been answered: would those of you who don’t want the drop rate to change be OK with us having a guaranteed single ink drop from the first daily quest or RND/BG completed on an account per day? If not, why?
I feel as if they wouldn't want that to happen either - a lot of people (not necessarily those posting here) are making bank on selling ink....
Given that none of them have responded, I suspect you may be correct.
I personally would be absolutely fine with keeping the drop rate as it is if I could get just one guaranteed ink every day by completing one of a number of activities I actively enjoy. I suspect I’m not the only one who’d be happy with that. It would give us a slow, but stable path to scribing that would not break the economy.
Completing the Indrik wing with an alt guarantees you 3 a day and takes about 20 minutes if you have the wayshrines and about 40 minutes if you don't.1 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
I’ll ask the question again, because it still hasn’t been answered: would those of you who don’t want the drop rate to change be OK with us having a guaranteed single ink drop from the first daily quest or RND/BG completed on an account per day? If not, why?
I feel as if they wouldn't want that to happen either - a lot of people (not necessarily those posting here) are making bank on selling ink....
Given that none of them have responded, I suspect you may be correct.
I personally would be absolutely fine with keeping the drop rate as it is if I could get just one guaranteed ink every day by completing one of a number of activities I actively enjoy. I suspect I’m not the only one who’d be happy with that. It would give us a slow, but stable path to scribing that would not break the economy.
Yeah, even though I'm not fussed at all about bothering with scribing, a 1 ink per day perma source would be nice....______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....2 -
sarahthes✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Why should the system only be readily accessible to those who do this kind of farming? Anyone who doesn't have their face planted against resource nodes grinding away is heavily barred from this system, and even those who do grind can have horrible luck and get nothing.
It's not.
People continue to talk about ink like it's account bound. It's a tradable commodity.
I'm not into harvesting, so I haven't harvested a single ink. NP though, I can do things I enjoy and sell the items I get to buy ink like I do for the vast majority of my crafting resources, motifs, recipes, etc...
It’s a tradable commodity, but it should be acquirable at comparable rates for everyone who grinds crafting nodes in this game — not just the lucky minority who are currently profiting off it. I won’t pay other players for ink until I, too, get to consistently enjoy lucky streaks of 12-20 ink per hour like they do.
I already mentioned how to farm efficiently and your video shows you're not following it. 75% of ink drops from regular ore nodes, let there be 2 or 3 per hour coming from other nodes.
Where’s your proof that 75% of ink drops are from ore nodes? This is the first I’ve seen about this anywhere. And, for what it’s worth, my ink in that video dropped from a woodworking node, and I harvested plenty of regular ore nodes during that run without getting any ink from them.
Most of mine are from plants and water.
RNG is RNG.
Also - I have days where my drop rates are low. I think you don't understand just how much I farm though. I farm enough that the good days/runs balance the bad ones.0 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭More anecdotally.... I have 8 mains (4 accounts, playing both PC megaservers). I have ONE of them (the "youngest" one, level 22 on my 4th account on PC EU) who has in the last couple of days - while running around to do the Vvardenfell Zone Quest (she's the last one who needs that lovely recall) has found 4 inks as she grabbed whatever nodes she was near. None of the other 7 found any doing the quest line.
2 of the inks came from wood nodes (oak in her case). The other 2 came from a water node (lake not skin) and a runestone. That's not enough info of course. But aside from my oldest main on PC NA (who found 1 ink in a silk node) none of my others has anything but the ones from the quests.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....2 -
oldbobdude✭✭✭✭✭Ishtarknows wrote: »A little off topic, but I'd like a title for accumulating the 500 ink. It's be interesting how long it takes to see someone with it
Less than a month
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8139855/#Comment_8139855
90 minutes of farming nodes this morning, with a plug in to help. No ink drops. Lord above, something is so broken with this RNG. Until the increase the drop rates, or fix those of us whom have broken RNG, I doubt I could finish that achievement in my lifetime.
That’s really horrible. I usually only farm for an hour and get 5ish inks.
Are you farming an area rich in nodes? And grabbing every source? The number of nodes you hit is really more important than the time. Remember to have plentiful harvest slotted in crafting tree.
Hope it gets better for you.
0 -
CP5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭https://youtu.be/v-v_D282bHs
So, I need to emphasize again that this is a "lucky" run for me. I looted 186 ink sources in 19 minutes and got one ink. Other people's lucky runs yield 12-20 ink per hour. I typically average around 1-2 ink per hour when doing dedicated node harvesting like this. It feels like a monumental waste of my time. It certainly doesn't feel "efficient." I want to actually be able to play the game. Mind you, there are people who are just playing the game normally without farming at all who already have more overall ink acquired than I do -- suggesting, again, that there may be a bug affecting some players.
A question for those of you with good RNG luck who are staunchly against ZOS doing anything about the drop rate: are you opposed to the idea of one guaranteed ink drop per account from the first daily quest or RND/BG completion of the day? If so, why are you opposed? What's your rationale?
That's not on the best side of rng, but not terrible with amount of nodes gathered (especially if you don't factor in mob count, which you shouldn't because they have very different, much lower drop rate). Within reason still. Sometimes this happens, sometimes the opposite. I had worse results than that myself and did not consider my account to be cursed or suspect some stealth nerf overnight.
There's really no reason to shove ink into inventories of players who aren't even looking for it. Like with any other material, if you want it, actively farm for it or just buy it, it's true for most things in game and other materials that are part of paid DLCs (like rheum, clam gall, powdered mother of pearl, chaurus egg). There is no daily use for ink, skills don't have duration like food, there are no master writs involving ink, no furnishing plans requiring ink. Once you are done with your skills, there is no more use for it, keep some in stock for potential changes and the rest only sell, nothing else to do with it. Like OP said, you are not meant to complete every skill on entire account within one month.
You can see already in guild stores, more and more posted every week, it moves slower and price halves every week, because more and more players no longer have use for it and it keeps dropping. Definitely there is no shortage, and there will be even more ink once patch drops.
Until people go to try out different combinations, return to old skills that they liked, or ZOS adds new skills, the need for ink on a day to day basis is low, but people who actively engage with the system will still need to spend ink regularly, depending on how often they want to try different things. Take this pts for example, adding more frost damage skills, or changing the duration of buffs and debuffs. You now have to pay ink to adapt to patch notes, no free respecs for a week after a patch lands.
As for the prices of ink, how much of that is due to players having such a bad impression of the system that they choose to ignore it, rather than buying into it even more by buying ink from traders? Make a system abrasive enough that players don't want to touch it, and the resource that people were selling for that system would be sold to a much smaller audience.
The same is true for gear, if ZOS changes something and you want to try it, you will need crafting mats, upgrade mats, transmutes, glyphs etc. If there's new set you want to try, you have to farm it first.
I can only imagine the outrage if gear crafting was added just last patch and was exactly like what we have today Year of research, need to level every craft separately, need to invest skill points, need to farm or buy mats for every piece and every change...
Do you need to use a consumable resource to equip said gear? Encouraging you to stick with a particular set of gear because equipping new gear would cost you that resource, and returning to what you had on cost resources? No, once you get the gear you can freely switch between pieces as much as you like. When you get scripts you need to pay to make the skill and pay to change it, and pay to change it back, and pay to work around nerfs and buffs. Those are very different.
You don't need ink every time you equip scribed skill either and can slot different scribed skills as you like. And yes, getting new set instead of the one I am using right now will cost me material or gold and inventory space too, which is not unlimited, I can't have infinite combinations of sets on me to mix and match. Sooner or later I will have to decide what to keep and what to throw away to make room, or stop making changes to my character. Changing trait or enchant would require material, changing weight would require completely new crafted/reconstructed piece, nothing is free.
You miss my point. Once you have gear (script like part) you can swap what pieces of gear you have out freely to make a gear set (spell like part). You don't need to pay a resource to swap the gear out to make new gear sets, and even if you do need to break things down to get some space back, crafted sets are easy to make due to the amount of materials that can be sourced by breaking gear down, and dropped sets can be made and converted back into transmute stones. If you want to do anything to a scribed skill you need to pay ink. Do you have one skill you like for both tanking and dps'ing on the same character? Too bad, each time you want to change any single thing out, 1 ink one way, 1 ink the other. Not everyone has hours and a perfected farming build to allow them to source ink at a usable rate. Because that's what people want, a usable amount of ink so they can actually use the system to experiment and try things out.4 -
Aurielle✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Vonnegut2506 wrote: »
I’ll ask the question again, because it still hasn’t been answered: would those of you who don’t want the drop rate to change be OK with us having a guaranteed single ink drop from the first daily quest or RND/BG completed on an account per day? If not, why?
I feel as if they wouldn't want that to happen either - a lot of people (not necessarily those posting here) are making bank on selling ink....
Given that none of them have responded, I suspect you may be correct.
I personally would be absolutely fine with keeping the drop rate as it is if I could get just one guaranteed ink every day by completing one of a number of activities I actively enjoy. I suspect I’m not the only one who’d be happy with that. It would give us a slow, but stable path to scribing that would not break the economy.
Completing the Indrik wing with an alt guarantees you 3 a day and takes about 20 minutes if you have the wayshrines and about 40 minutes if you don't.
None of my alts have the wayshrines. And after a certain point, you run out of alts… making and deleting characters just to farm guaranteed ink every day sounds incredibly tedious. Know what’s not tedious and doesn’t waste 20-40 minutes of my time? Getting a guaranteed ink for doing something I would have done anyway.
Edit: typo.Edited by Aurielle on July 14, 2024 1:24AM4 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Vonnegut2506 wrote: »
I’ll ask the question again, because it still hasn’t been answered: would those of you who don’t want the drop rate to change be OK with us having a guaranteed single ink drop from the first daily quest or RND/BG completed on an account per day? If not, why?
I feel as if they wouldn't want that to happen either - a lot of people (not necessarily those posting here) are making bank on selling ink....
Given that none of them have responded, I suspect you may be correct.
I personally would be absolutely fine with keeping the drop rate as it is if I could get just one guaranteed ink every day by completing one of a number of activities I actively enjoy. I suspect I’m not the only one who’d be happy with that. It would give us a slow, but stable path to scribing that would not break the economy.
Completing the Indrik wing with an alt guarantees you 3 a day and takes about 20 minutes if you have the wayshrines and about 40 minutes if you don't.
None of my alts have the wayshrines. And after a certain point, you run out of alts… making and deleting characters just to farm guaranteed ink every day sounds incredibly tedious. Know what’s not tedious and doesn’t waste 20-40 minutes of my time? Getting a guaranteed ink for doing something I would have been done anyway.
Now I admit that I have all the time in the world to play - and I really really enjoy the scribing quest line. But.... I do also have other irons in the fire, so running a gazillion alts through the quest line just for ink is.... not going to happen. Unless.... I just run out of things to do in ESO.
And in that case.... I won't be subbing 4 accounts annually. Serious. So.... I guess.... put that in your pipe and smoke it. I'm sure I'm not the only one thinking this.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....2 -
Aurielle✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Why should the system only be readily accessible to those who do this kind of farming? Anyone who doesn't have their face planted against resource nodes grinding away is heavily barred from this system, and even those who do grind can have horrible luck and get nothing.
It's not.
People continue to talk about ink like it's account bound. It's a tradable commodity.
I'm not into harvesting, so I haven't harvested a single ink. NP though, I can do things I enjoy and sell the items I get to buy ink like I do for the vast majority of my crafting resources, motifs, recipes, etc...
It’s a tradable commodity, but it should be acquirable at comparable rates for everyone who grinds crafting nodes in this game — not just the lucky minority who are currently profiting off it. I won’t pay other players for ink until I, too, get to consistently enjoy lucky streaks of 12-20 ink per hour like they do.
I already mentioned how to farm efficiently and your video shows you're not following it. 75% of ink drops from regular ore nodes, let there be 2 or 3 per hour coming from other nodes.
Where’s your proof that 75% of ink drops are from ore nodes? This is the first I’ve seen about this anywhere. And, for what it’s worth, my ink in that video dropped from a woodworking node, and I harvested plenty of regular ore nodes during that run without getting any ink from them.
Most of mine are from plants and water.
RNG is RNG.
Also - I have days where my drop rates are low. I think you don't understand just how much I farm though. I farm enough that the good days/runs balance the bad ones.
I don’t do a dedicated node farm every single day. Some days, I actually try to play the game instead of hunting for ink. But I’ve farmed often enough that I should have had at least ONE good run, yes? One streak of 12+ ink in a hour, right? Alas no … they have all been consistently bad runs. A “good” run for me at this point is getting one ink in less than half an hour — which is probably what you’d consider a bad run. 3 -
AllenaNightWood✭✭✭✭Except ZOS themselves have confirmed they also think ink drop is too low and will adjust it.
Also, that's great for you if you want to roleplay and spend ages on scribing, but most people don't and will take their time and money elsewhere. ZOS is a business and understands this.
theres low and grindy low, and ink is currently grindy low so i agree it should be increased but not by to much0 -
Aurielle✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Vonnegut2506 wrote: »
I’ll ask the question again, because it still hasn’t been answered: would those of you who don’t want the drop rate to change be OK with us having a guaranteed single ink drop from the first daily quest or RND/BG completed on an account per day? If not, why?
I feel as if they wouldn't want that to happen either - a lot of people (not necessarily those posting here) are making bank on selling ink....
Given that none of them have responded, I suspect you may be correct.
I personally would be absolutely fine with keeping the drop rate as it is if I could get just one guaranteed ink every day by completing one of a number of activities I actively enjoy. I suspect I’m not the only one who’d be happy with that. It would give us a slow, but stable path to scribing that would not break the economy.
Completing the Indrik wing with an alt guarantees you 3 a day and takes about 20 minutes if you have the wayshrines and about 40 minutes if you don't.
None of my alts have the wayshrines. And after a certain point, you run out of alts… making and deleting characters just to farm guaranteed ink every day sounds incredibly tedious. Know what’s not tedious and doesn’t waste 20-40 minutes of my time? Getting a guaranteed ink for doing something I would have been done anyway.
Now I admit that I have all the time in the world to play - and I really really enjoy the scribing quest line. But.... I do also have other irons in the fire, so running a gazillion alts through the quest line just for ink is.... not going to happen. Unless.... I just run out of things to do in ESO.
And in that case.... I won't be subbing 4 accounts annually. Serious. So.... I guess.... put that in your pipe and smoke it. I'm sure I'm not the only one thinking this.
Yeah, it’s just really not feasible, and I really wish the naysayers would stop bringing it up whenever other ideas are discussed. There’s so much to do in this game as it is, so repeating the same scribing quest every day or two simply to have a reliable source of ink probably isn’t anyone’s idea of a good time. Having one guaranteed ink drop from the first daily completion on an account would be a far more efficient, much more player-friendly alternative to repeating the scribing quests.0 -
tsaescishoeshiner✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Ink prices are down to 13k-20k on PC already. I can see them getting much lower, which would make them pretty usable for me. I don't think the additional drop sources will help that much, but we'll have to see.PC-NA
in-game: @tsaescishoeshiner0 -
EF321✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭https://youtu.be/v-v_D282bHs
So, I need to emphasize again that this is a "lucky" run for me. I looted 186 ink sources in 19 minutes and got one ink. Other people's lucky runs yield 12-20 ink per hour. I typically average around 1-2 ink per hour when doing dedicated node harvesting like this. It feels like a monumental waste of my time. It certainly doesn't feel "efficient." I want to actually be able to play the game. Mind you, there are people who are just playing the game normally without farming at all who already have more overall ink acquired than I do -- suggesting, again, that there may be a bug affecting some players.
A question for those of you with good RNG luck who are staunchly against ZOS doing anything about the drop rate: are you opposed to the idea of one guaranteed ink drop per account from the first daily quest or RND/BG completion of the day? If so, why are you opposed? What's your rationale?
That's not on the best side of rng, but not terrible with amount of nodes gathered (especially if you don't factor in mob count, which you shouldn't because they have very different, much lower drop rate). Within reason still. Sometimes this happens, sometimes the opposite. I had worse results than that myself and did not consider my account to be cursed or suspect some stealth nerf overnight.
There's really no reason to shove ink into inventories of players who aren't even looking for it. Like with any other material, if you want it, actively farm for it or just buy it, it's true for most things in game and other materials that are part of paid DLCs (like rheum, clam gall, powdered mother of pearl, chaurus egg). There is no daily use for ink, skills don't have duration like food, there are no master writs involving ink, no furnishing plans requiring ink. Once you are done with your skills, there is no more use for it, keep some in stock for potential changes and the rest only sell, nothing else to do with it. Like OP said, you are not meant to complete every skill on entire account within one month.
You can see already in guild stores, more and more posted every week, it moves slower and price halves every week, because more and more players no longer have use for it and it keeps dropping. Definitely there is no shortage, and there will be even more ink once patch drops.
Until people go to try out different combinations, return to old skills that they liked, or ZOS adds new skills, the need for ink on a day to day basis is low, but people who actively engage with the system will still need to spend ink regularly, depending on how often they want to try different things. Take this pts for example, adding more frost damage skills, or changing the duration of buffs and debuffs. You now have to pay ink to adapt to patch notes, no free respecs for a week after a patch lands.
As for the prices of ink, how much of that is due to players having such a bad impression of the system that they choose to ignore it, rather than buying into it even more by buying ink from traders? Make a system abrasive enough that players don't want to touch it, and the resource that people were selling for that system would be sold to a much smaller audience.
The same is true for gear, if ZOS changes something and you want to try it, you will need crafting mats, upgrade mats, transmutes, glyphs etc. If there's new set you want to try, you have to farm it first.
I can only imagine the outrage if gear crafting was added just last patch and was exactly like what we have today Year of research, need to level every craft separately, need to invest skill points, need to farm or buy mats for every piece and every change...
Do you need to use a consumable resource to equip said gear? Encouraging you to stick with a particular set of gear because equipping new gear would cost you that resource, and returning to what you had on cost resources? No, once you get the gear you can freely switch between pieces as much as you like. When you get scripts you need to pay to make the skill and pay to change it, and pay to change it back, and pay to work around nerfs and buffs. Those are very different.
You don't need ink every time you equip scribed skill either and can slot different scribed skills as you like. And yes, getting new set instead of the one I am using right now will cost me material or gold and inventory space too, which is not unlimited, I can't have infinite combinations of sets on me to mix and match. Sooner or later I will have to decide what to keep and what to throw away to make room, or stop making changes to my character. Changing trait or enchant would require material, changing weight would require completely new crafted/reconstructed piece, nothing is free.
You miss my point. Once you have gear (script like part) you can swap what pieces of gear you have out freely to make a gear set (spell like part). You don't need to pay a resource to swap the gear out to make new gear sets, and even if you do need to break things down to get some space back, crafted sets are easy to make due to the amount of materials that can be sourced by breaking gear down, and dropped sets can be made and converted back into transmute stones. If you want to do anything to a scribed skill you need to pay ink. Do you have one skill you like for both tanking and dps'ing on the same character? Too bad, each time you want to change any single thing out, 1 ink one way, 1 ink the other. Not everyone has hours and a perfected farming build to allow them to source ink at a usable rate. Because that's what people want, a usable amount of ink so they can actually use the system to experiment and try things out.
What you are describing is problem with armory not saving/loading different skill versions, not ink drops. Scribed skills should definitely be saved and loaded with armory build, as it is now it makes no sense.0 -
ThoraxtheDark✭✭✭✭Speak for yourself the drop rates are horrid and scribing is utterly useless. You made a comment about finally being able to heal without a resto. I'm sorry but this is a troll comment right5 -
I_killed_Vivec✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It's a grind to make you forget that we only get "QoL" updates instead of new content.
2 -
oldbobdude✭✭✭✭✭https://youtu.be/v-v_D282bHs
So, I need to emphasize again that this is a "lucky" run for me. I looted 186 ink sources in 19 minutes and got one ink. Other people's lucky runs yield 12-20 ink per hour. I typically average around 1-2 ink per hour when doing dedicated node harvesting like this. It feels like a monumental waste of my time. It certainly doesn't feel "efficient." I want to actually be able to play the game. Mind you, there are people who are just playing the game normally without farming at all who already have more overall ink acquired than I do -- suggesting, again, that there may be a bug affecting some players.
A question for those of you with good RNG luck who are staunchly against ZOS doing anything about the drop rate: are you opposed to the idea of one guaranteed ink drop per account from the first daily quest or RND/BG completion of the day? If so, why are you opposed? What's your rationale?
That's not on the best side of rng, but not terrible with amount of nodes gathered (especially if you don't factor in mob count, which you shouldn't because they have very different, much lower drop rate). Within reason still. Sometimes this happens, sometimes the opposite. I had worse results than that myself and did not consider my account to be cursed or suspect some stealth nerf overnight.
There's really no reason to shove ink into inventories of players who aren't even looking for it. Like with any other material, if you want it, actively farm for it or just buy it, it's true for most things in game and other materials that are part of paid DLCs (like rheum, clam gall, powdered mother of pearl, chaurus egg). There is no daily use for ink, skills don't have duration like food, there are no master writs involving ink, no furnishing plans requiring ink. Once you are done with your skills, there is no more use for it, keep some in stock for potential changes and the rest only sell, nothing else to do with it. Like OP said, you are not meant to complete every skill on entire account within one month.
You can see already in guild stores, more and more posted every week, it moves slower and price halves every week, because more and more players no longer have use for it and it keeps dropping. Definitely there is no shortage, and there will be even more ink once patch drops.
Until people go to try out different combinations, return to old skills that they liked, or ZOS adds new skills, the need for ink on a day to day basis is low, but people who actively engage with the system will still need to spend ink regularly, depending on how often they want to try different things. Take this pts for example, adding more frost damage skills, or changing the duration of buffs and debuffs. You now have to pay ink to adapt to patch notes, no free respecs for a week after a patch lands.
As for the prices of ink, how much of that is due to players having such a bad impression of the system that they choose to ignore it, rather than buying into it even more by buying ink from traders? Make a system abrasive enough that players don't want to touch it, and the resource that people were selling for that system would be sold to a much smaller audience.
The same is true for gear, if ZOS changes something and you want to try it, you will need crafting mats, upgrade mats, transmutes, glyphs etc. If there's new set you want to try, you have to farm it first.
I can only imagine the outrage if gear crafting was added just last patch and was exactly like what we have today Year of research, need to level every craft separately, need to invest skill points, need to farm or buy mats for every piece and every change...
Do you need to use a consumable resource to equip said gear? Encouraging you to stick with a particular set of gear because equipping new gear would cost you that resource, and returning to what you had on cost resources? No, once you get the gear you can freely switch between pieces as much as you like. When you get scripts you need to pay to make the skill and pay to change it, and pay to change it back, and pay to work around nerfs and buffs. Those are very different.
You don't need ink every time you equip scribed skill either and can slot different scribed skills as you like. And yes, getting new set instead of the one I am using right now will cost me material or gold and inventory space too, which is not unlimited, I can't have infinite combinations of sets on me to mix and match. Sooner or later I will have to decide what to keep and what to throw away to make room, or stop making changes to my character. Changing trait or enchant would require material, changing weight would require completely new crafted/reconstructed piece, nothing is free.
You miss my point. Once you have gear (script like part) you can swap what pieces of gear you have out freely to make a gear set (spell like part). You don't need to pay a resource to swap the gear out to make new gear sets, and even if you do need to break things down to get some space back, crafted sets are easy to make due to the amount of materials that can be sourced by breaking gear down, and dropped sets can be made and converted back into transmute stones. If you want to do anything to a scribed skill you need to pay ink. Do you have one skill you like for both tanking and dps'ing on the same character? Too bad, each time you want to change any single thing out, 1 ink one way, 1 ink the other. Not everyone has hours and a perfected farming build to allow them to source ink at a usable rate. Because that's what people want, a usable amount of ink so they can actually use the system to experiment and try things out.
I agree. But, that goes back to scribed skills should be in the armory just like CP, skills, sets and mundus. It’s crazy that didn’t happen from the get go.1 -
CP5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭oldbobdude wrote: »https://youtu.be/v-v_D282bHs
So, I need to emphasize again that this is a "lucky" run for me. I looted 186 ink sources in 19 minutes and got one ink. Other people's lucky runs yield 12-20 ink per hour. I typically average around 1-2 ink per hour when doing dedicated node harvesting like this. It feels like a monumental waste of my time. It certainly doesn't feel "efficient." I want to actually be able to play the game. Mind you, there are people who are just playing the game normally without farming at all who already have more overall ink acquired than I do -- suggesting, again, that there may be a bug affecting some players.
A question for those of you with good RNG luck who are staunchly against ZOS doing anything about the drop rate: are you opposed to the idea of one guaranteed ink drop per account from the first daily quest or RND/BG completion of the day? If so, why are you opposed? What's your rationale?
That's not on the best side of rng, but not terrible with amount of nodes gathered (especially if you don't factor in mob count, which you shouldn't because they have very different, much lower drop rate). Within reason still. Sometimes this happens, sometimes the opposite. I had worse results than that myself and did not consider my account to be cursed or suspect some stealth nerf overnight.
There's really no reason to shove ink into inventories of players who aren't even looking for it. Like with any other material, if you want it, actively farm for it or just buy it, it's true for most things in game and other materials that are part of paid DLCs (like rheum, clam gall, powdered mother of pearl, chaurus egg). There is no daily use for ink, skills don't have duration like food, there are no master writs involving ink, no furnishing plans requiring ink. Once you are done with your skills, there is no more use for it, keep some in stock for potential changes and the rest only sell, nothing else to do with it. Like OP said, you are not meant to complete every skill on entire account within one month.
You can see already in guild stores, more and more posted every week, it moves slower and price halves every week, because more and more players no longer have use for it and it keeps dropping. Definitely there is no shortage, and there will be even more ink once patch drops.
Until people go to try out different combinations, return to old skills that they liked, or ZOS adds new skills, the need for ink on a day to day basis is low, but people who actively engage with the system will still need to spend ink regularly, depending on how often they want to try different things. Take this pts for example, adding more frost damage skills, or changing the duration of buffs and debuffs. You now have to pay ink to adapt to patch notes, no free respecs for a week after a patch lands.
As for the prices of ink, how much of that is due to players having such a bad impression of the system that they choose to ignore it, rather than buying into it even more by buying ink from traders? Make a system abrasive enough that players don't want to touch it, and the resource that people were selling for that system would be sold to a much smaller audience.
The same is true for gear, if ZOS changes something and you want to try it, you will need crafting mats, upgrade mats, transmutes, glyphs etc. If there's new set you want to try, you have to farm it first.
I can only imagine the outrage if gear crafting was added just last patch and was exactly like what we have today Year of research, need to level every craft separately, need to invest skill points, need to farm or buy mats for every piece and every change...
Do you need to use a consumable resource to equip said gear? Encouraging you to stick with a particular set of gear because equipping new gear would cost you that resource, and returning to what you had on cost resources? No, once you get the gear you can freely switch between pieces as much as you like. When you get scripts you need to pay to make the skill and pay to change it, and pay to change it back, and pay to work around nerfs and buffs. Those are very different.
You don't need ink every time you equip scribed skill either and can slot different scribed skills as you like. And yes, getting new set instead of the one I am using right now will cost me material or gold and inventory space too, which is not unlimited, I can't have infinite combinations of sets on me to mix and match. Sooner or later I will have to decide what to keep and what to throw away to make room, or stop making changes to my character. Changing trait or enchant would require material, changing weight would require completely new crafted/reconstructed piece, nothing is free.
You miss my point. Once you have gear (script like part) you can swap what pieces of gear you have out freely to make a gear set (spell like part). You don't need to pay a resource to swap the gear out to make new gear sets, and even if you do need to break things down to get some space back, crafted sets are easy to make due to the amount of materials that can be sourced by breaking gear down, and dropped sets can be made and converted back into transmute stones. If you want to do anything to a scribed skill you need to pay ink. Do you have one skill you like for both tanking and dps'ing on the same character? Too bad, each time you want to change any single thing out, 1 ink one way, 1 ink the other. Not everyone has hours and a perfected farming build to allow them to source ink at a usable rate. Because that's what people want, a usable amount of ink so they can actually use the system to experiment and try things out.
I agree. But, that goes back to scribed skills should be in the armory just like CP, skills, sets and mundus. It’s crazy that didn’t happen from the get go.
True enough, but even if they were it only solves the 'using a skill in two different ways' problem, and it does nothing to solve the 'eagerly experiment and try new things' problem.3 -
Dragonnord✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Remove me from "everyone" since I'm not upset at all and I'm fine with the rare drop.
4 -
Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭One benefit of node farming for ink is getting mats for crafting, so that aspect I’m OK with.
What I’m not OK with is the lack of other sources, for now. Treasure chests and heavy sacks will have to have a fairly significant chance at ink for it to be meaningful. I can farm dozens of nodes and be lucky to find some ink, but I’m not finding dozens of chests and sacks. The chance cannot be the same or similar.
A slight increase in mob drop chance will help. Haven’t gotten ink from a kill yet.
Now eventually people will have enough ink for all their characters. We are a ways off though. In the meantime we can barely find enough ink to experiment with scribing for a single character let alone alts.3 -
CP5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭LaintalAy, why are your responses so, blunt, if you don't mind my asking?
"All you amateur farmers simply don't know what you're doing."
This makes it sound as though the only way of properly sourcing ink is to have a proper, optimized, min-maxed farming setup, as well as the time needed to run it, things many players don't have and something ZOS likely didn't make the system to focus on.
"I didn't buy Gold Road.
I don't PvP.
I can find easier items to harvest and sell.
I wait for chapters to become part of ESO+.
Most of these shennanigans will be adjusted by then."
You didn't buy Gold Road, so you don't have direct experience on the actual usage of this system, how much ink you get naturally vs how much you expect to use. And these 'shennanigans' will only be adjusted if people keep voicing their disapproval of them, if people keep saying things are fine and those who are not satisfied with how things are should just deal with it, then things won't be adjusted by then. Change from ZOS comes from consistent and vocal reminders, which this thread will hopefully remain until something meaningful happens.
"I'm sorry for your loss. Would you like an "insightful" with that?"
Closing a post like this makes it difficult to believe there is a genuine effort to understand the other users points, and I'll leave it at that.
"It would put more idiots into the daily dungeon for me."
The random dungeon finder is already full of people getting their random dungeon transmutes or doing their pledges, if any first daily quest could reward one ink, those players behaviors wouldn't change. But if ink could drop from first writ, or first battleground game, or first Cyrodiil/IC bounty, then players wouldn't be 'put in your way' because they could actually source ink from something other than node grinding.
"I see your major problem as you don't have enough time to play what is an enormously complicated game."
Is the game supposed to be a part-time job? Not everyone can spend hours running circles farming nodes, and if people's first response to getting ink is 'just buy it from guild traders', many players will just drop the system completely, as has been stated by multiple users and likely reflects how many players in game feel. The system fails if it can't keep players engaged, and ink is required for that engagement.
"Only you can address the problems that you have here. Other players are doing fine."
You say, after having said you don't own the expansion and therefore don't have first-hand experience on what the drop rate actually feels like, or how such a low drop rate would likely just smother any interest in the system, rendering it failure on ZOS's end, putting time into something that players so quickly choose to ignore.
"i hope ypu see reason here somewhere."
Just like before, please try to understand what other users are saying, especially if you haven't spent any time with the system that people are commenting on.10 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Thanks @CP5 - I was partway through a post, decided said post was going to get me in trouble.... so thanks for your post which said everything I wanted to, but couldn't phrase without mouth-frothing.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....7 -
dcam86b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭[Snip]
People want ink to respec into other builds or try out other combos, currently you can't do that unless you throw gold to traders
[Edited for bait]Edited by ZOS_Volpe on July 17, 2024 4:11PM8