Well, if it is still in the game and is not mention in the patch notes, and will go live like that and still won't be mention in the patch notes - then I guess we should all treat it as a bug and something that is not intended - so we should report it as a bug.

If ZOS is fully transparent with player base - then they would say that this is intended as for example they may want to test something on live server. Silence means that it is a bug. Not being transparent and ninja-pushing huge change like this is just silly. We are not kids. We will understand, ZOS. Players just want to know if they should waste their own, private time to bug report it, or maybe prepare for it once (or if) it will goes live.

I mean stuff like this.... it even looks like a bug. 100 meters tooltip. It does not matter if it is a skill, passive, set or potion. 100 meters tooltip on everything looks ridiculous

The strongest NB builds don't even use Cloak and the builds this affects that weren't affected before (Snipe) still have a range advantage. If a nightblade with a Bow can't outpace [insert x build] running at them from Snipe range, it's a L2P issue.

IAVITNI wrote: »

The strongest NB builds don't even use Cloak and the builds this affects that weren't affected before (Snipe) still have a range advantage. If a nightblade with a Bow can't outpace [insert x build] running at them from Snipe range, it's a L2P issue.

Yes - better NB player don't rely solely on invisibility as it is way too unreliable & easy to predict. But, still, you know what is funny ? If those potion changes will go live, then every time someone will complain about cloak / invisibility / stealth it will be imho a "L2P issue". Because you know... "that NB got away by one-button reset fight cloak trick" won't be an argument anymore. It will be the fault of the one chasing them if they refuse to use tools that the game provides (100 m detection potions). With 100 m detection no NB will ever get away. Not even the fastest ones. 100 meters is like opening a safe with atom bomb lol. And besides... what ganker uses Snipe nowadays ? It has range, but it is not a skill that can kill. It is not what it used to be in the past. Snipe based gank builds are actually not viable.

But the worst thing imho is not how it will affect NBs or Gankers or Bombers or PvP-ers in general. It is how it will affect the more "casual" aspect of Cyro / IC player base and how it will change the open world PvPvE experience (every class can crouch - sneak). I strongly recommend to test it even on a live server what "100 meters" range is. It is ridiculous. It is more or less the distance between Craglorn Belkarth wayshrine and trading spot (in a straight line). Some simple predictions:
- City "questing hubs" in Cyro will be impossible to stay in undetected to avoid ganks / getting outnumbered / zerged while doing PvE. Same for IC.
- It will be impossible to stay inside a keep if it is captured & wait for it to be re-taken.
- It won't be even possible to stay anywhere near the keep or resources hidden, waiting for reinforcements.
- Many not so obvious "hiding spots" will become just a memory. This of course means less diversity.
- Observing enemy to get Intel where they are heading will also be impossible. You are literally better off with re-loging as an enemy player & literally "spying" lol.
- Any solo play in IC or Cyro will be kinda gone.
- Doing mixed PvPvE in Cyro (like Delves) will also be impossible as you will be detected inside the entire dungeon.
- Personally, I have not checked this, but I assume if a player detects you, then if you are within the range of PvE or PvP mobs then they will also fight you and even if detection potions will run out - mobs will detect you as long as they have agro on you.
- As far as I am aware, it is impossible to say who is using Detection Potions, so it is impossible to counter the one who uses it (killing one player or getting away from that particular player & ignoring the rest).
- Some one here also mentioned a "snow ball" effect; if enemy player is detected more players around are likely to use detected potions making the 100% uptime trivial.

At first I had not defended the change and I don't really want to,; but it's the rhetoric about how damaging it is that makes me think it's not that bad. I play NB and either don't use cloak, or use it just to get a crit, conceal weapon and vampire damage buff

But this isn't about cloak really, is it? It's more about sneaking. Cloak in this case, has just been a tool to get to crouched version of sneaking while spotted. And the fact people are so upset about this that they can't even AFK out in the open somewhere; or basically largely avoid he intended risk situations of IC by stealth makes this sound like maybe it should not be so effective.

NB will be fine. Other classes crouching will generally be fine

Ganking can still happen; but you probably won't want to gank someone inside a zerg unless you also have good line of site to hide in as well; as maybe it really should have been more of a concern before.

You could still bomb or be a bomber in a fight. Just probably not going to stay hidden inside a keep waiting for a mega LOL bomb on a flag or somewhere people will be expecting it.

When you lose a fight; it also will be more difficult to sneak around to reset to try again or just stick in that area. It will likely be more definitive.

So there is a huge reaction, and I get it. For all I posted above; it has been part of the game for 9 years and suddenly it appears to maybe be a complete 180. Least they could do is address if it's intentional, going to stay or not, and why.

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Nothing happens without reason. Every balance change has a reason. I think that maybe it is some kind of silent preparation for some additional changes in the future. Maybe they want to add some Mythics item that boost sneaking or something. Idk. I think that if this is intended - then for sure we don't have all pieces of the puzzle here. The lack of communication is just plain annoying.

man, you put way to much faith in eso combat team. this is just a mess to make us wait for another mess that wont fix anything but mess it all up a way that it will maybe skip this one and so on for infinity.

that's what they have been doing since day1

If I was being positive, I would like to think that someone on the zos team is stress testing cyrodill. And one of the pain points is people going in and out of stealth.
So for that they need to temporarily set the reveal distance absurdly high to really stress out the servers as they track down the pain points.

But any move by me to be positive about anything beyond zos’s creative team always comes back to aggravate me somehow.

IncultaWolf wrote: »

AuraNebula wrote: »

What is happening to this game? No risk in PvP? Just let zergs take over the map? Everyone just make a DK and call it a day. Lol.

I was just thinking about that actually with these balance directions, like..do they just want everyone to play dragonknight?

Considering it's been the meta class for almost two years...yes they do. No other class has ever remained at the top for this long. I stopped playing for a while came back a month or two ago and I remembered why I stopped playing... because tanky healing metas are boring. PvP is sad. So many names I used to see are gone, streamers I loved moved on to other games.

It's not just the performance that's driving people away...it's the combat choices.