Shaming Console Users Should Be Stopped.

Ragnarok0130 · July 2022

OP your own statement contracts your title. Nobody is blaming console players, they are blaming old hardware which inevitably is holding ESO back. Looking at the system requirements from Steam it looks like the PC specs from 2014 so those old PCs are holding ESO back too not just the old consoles.

spartaxoxo · July 2022

Nomadic_Atmoran wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

saar wrote: »

The fact that they are still supporting such old consoles must mean that last-gen players hold a decent share of revenue..which is worrying for a brand. Must mean they are not making enough profit in newer consoles and PC market to drop support in outdated tech. FFXIV dropped support and it is thriving at the moment.

It becomes a vicious cycle where ZOS are holding onto last gen support to retain that playerbase, but over time newer players get put off by the lack of innovation and proper features as a result, and don't stay on. They kind of shot themselves in the foot with regards to long-term growth in the playerbase.

FFIV has not dropped support of PS4.

ETA:

And Yoshida's statement about PS4

Yoshida elaborated on this a bit more in the interview and discussed why he decided to share this information. When asked about how long the PS4 version of FFXIV would receive support, Yoshida said this:

I don’t know yet. One of the core tenants of Final Fantasy XIV is to develop for multiple platforms, and have as many people as possible play the game.. With the current situation where the shipment volume of the PlayStation 5 is fairly slow due to the parts shortage, I expect there are many people that want to buy the console but can’t. I made the statement at that time so that players can play with peace of mind.

Everyone I know on consoles are impatiently waiting to buy a PS5.

I'm in that boat. And most others are too. I have tried to buy a PS5 on multiple occasions and got outsniped by bots every single time. It's not that I won't make the switch, it's that I can't. And the vast majority of Playstation users are in this boat with me. I actually don't know any of the PS4 MMOs that have dropped support of PS4, and for that reason. Not even FFXIV which has dropped PS3 support in the past, so obviously has no issues with dropping support of a unprofitable console holding things back.

TheGreatBlackBear · July 2022

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

OP your own statement contracts your title. Nobody is blaming console players, they are blaming old hardware which inevitably is holding ESO back. Looking at the system requirements from Steam it looks like the PC specs from 2014 so those old PCs are holding ESO back too not just the old consoles.

Stop the cap. It's largely console players who get blamed for the dev's inability or unwillingness to innovate in ESO. It's intellectually dishonest to pretend otherwise.

Four_Fingers · July 2022

Installing an SSD in your PS4 eliminates a lot of the black character and loading delays.
Night and day difference.

SerafinaWaterstar · July 2022

In some countries you can sign up via Playstation/psn to be in with a chance to buy a ps5 direct from them.

Signed up, then about 2 weeks later invited to event & logged in to page & bought ps5 no problem - now very happier owner! Makes ESO look amazing!

spartaxoxo · July 2022

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

In some countries you can sign up via Playstation/psn to be in with a chance to buy a ps5 direct from them.

Signed up, then about 2 weeks later invited to event & logged in to page & bought ps5 no problem - now very happier owner! Makes ESO look amazing!

I have done that but never got a response for going on 2 months now. You're so lucky to have it!

Vilhone · July 2022

It is not realistic to assume xbox one with only ddr3 and ps4 and the jaquar cpu can run game like eso. Maybe if eso had wow like cartoon graphics but eso actually look very good on series x/ps5 and pc.

Ps4 and xbox one should not be allowed to dictate raiding and pvp battlegrounds. If you save money next gen console is easy to get i got ps5 and seriex no problem. You may have to do little searching, but it certainly isnt imposible to get.

You didnt see ps3 getting new killzones and horizons when ps4 released why we have this time to keep suppirting old tech forever. Specially now when we got the perfect consoles this time. Powerfull cpu/gpu with super fast ssds and custom ssd driver tech, dont let the last gen ruin todays gaming.

jaws343 · July 2022

Vilhone wrote: »

It is not realistic to assume xbox one with only ddr3 and ps4 and the jaquar cpu can run game like eso. Maybe if eso had wow like cartoon graphics but eso actually look very good on series x/ps5 and pc.

Ps4 and xbox one should not be allowed to dictate raiding and pvp battlegrounds. If you save money next gen console is easy to get i got ps5 and seriex no problem. You may have to do little searching, but it certainly isnt imposible to get.

You didnt see ps3 getting new killzones and horizons when ps4 released why we have this time to keep suppirting old tech forever. Specially now when we got the perfect consoles this time. Powerfull cpu/gpu with super fast ssds and custom ssd driver tech, dont let the last gen ruin todays gaming.

PS5 sells out immediately every time it is posted available somewhere.

They certainly are not easy to get.

Ragnarok0130 · July 2022

TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

OP your own statement contracts your title. Nobody is blaming console players, they are blaming old hardware which inevitably is holding ESO back. Looking at the system requirements from Steam it looks like the PC specs from 2014 so those old PCs are holding ESO back too not just the old consoles.

Stop the cap. It's largely console players who get blamed for the dev's inability or unwillingness to innovate in ESO. It's intellectually dishonest to pretend otherwise.

No it's really not. I guarantee you that there are casuals still using their 8+year old PC from Best Buy to play ESO every day. Consoles are an easy target of opportunity for people on the forums because their hardware is frozen in time whereas most PCs can at least be upgraded to a point. And I play on PC, Xbox, and Playstation so my previous comment was not a shot at console players it was stating that supporting old hardware - both PC and Console - IS holding ESO back and eventually ZoS will have to make a decision to either update the minimum system requirements for ESO and expand its capabilities or explain why a live game is limiting its own potential for a diminishing segment of the population.

Wolfpaw · July 2022

Well the older consoles due hold the game and next gen players back, but I don't think tossing blame around is a good thing, but it's a fact.

Vevvev · July 2022

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

OP your own statement contracts your title. Nobody is blaming console players, they are blaming old hardware which inevitably is holding ESO back. Looking at the system requirements from Steam it looks like the PC specs from 2014 so those old PCs are holding ESO back too not just the old consoles.

Stop the cap. It's largely console players who get blamed for the dev's inability or unwillingness to innovate in ESO. It's intellectually dishonest to pretend otherwise.

No it's really not. I guarantee you that there are casuals still using their 8+year old PC from Best Buy to play ESO every day.

I actually knew a couple of people who struggled to run ESO on low graphics, and my last computer ended up degrading to the point the only way I could play ESO was on low.

So yes, you're right in that those people do exist.

blktauna · July 2022

TheGreatBlackBear wrote: »

Stop the cap. It's largely console players who get blamed for the dev's inability or unwillingness to innovate in ESO. It's intellectually dishonest to pretend otherwise.

Not true at all. Old hardware in consoles can not be upgraded. Old PC hardware is fairly easily upgraded without being force to buy a whole new rig.

The devs are handcuffed by many things in ESO and backwards compatibility is one of those things.

endgamesmug · July 2022

I too have to upgrade to a better pc in the next 8 months to the tune of $3000 nz dollars because my current pc is allinone unupgradeable to keep playing this game xD . "Expensive eso life"

TaSheen · July 2022

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

No it's really not. I guarantee you that there are casuals still using their 8+year old PC from Best Buy to play ESO every day. Consoles are an easy target of opportunity for people on the forums because their hardware is frozen in time whereas most PCs can at least be upgraded to a point. And I play on PC, Xbox, and Playstation so my previous comment was not a shot at console players it was stating that supporting old hardware - both PC and Console - IS holding ESO back and eventually ZoS will have to make a decision to either update the minimum system requirements for ESO and expand its capabilities or explain why a live game is limiting its own potential for a diminishing segment of the population.

Well, actually my PC is almost 10 years old. I've added a couple years newer GPU (still old - NVIDIA GTX 960 4 GB) and a larger faster SSD a couple years ago. And for Christmas last year I bought 2 4k Acer 28" monitors because my old 24" 1080p ones were dying.

ESO runs really well for me. I get between 50 and 70 fps (unless my ping is REALLY high), and don't have a heat issue with it so far. I'm unlikely to get it replaced this year the way things are going; maybe next spring.

I didn't get it at Best Buy; I had it built by CyberpowerPC.

Mr_Stach · July 2022

I play on both Console and on PC. at the end of the day you can't use the Console as an excuse, because ff14 exists. And it works just fine on Console.

it's a deflection, just like U35 is supposed to be about "Accessibility"

Just a bunch of Buzzwords, if Zos wanted to but the man power behind it, they could improve a lot of things, Consoles are not the hurtle that they claim.

Carcamongus · July 2022

Marolf wrote: »

Regularly I'm seeing last gen console users get blamed for holding the game back. This game is still going largely due to those said console users. I think the community should slack up on the negativity projected. No one likes logging into the forums and seeing thread after thread about how they are the sole reason that the game can't progress. And yes, I'm one of those console users. It's not like consoles are exactly easy to purchase right now, at least at a reasonable price. On top of that, the economy I'm part of isn't in a "ideal" place for me to shell out even the base price of new console. I bought this game on my current console, I see no reason I should feel bad about playing the game on said console.

But you shouldn't feel bad. All you're doing is enjoying a service for which you paid. I live in a country where tech stuff is very costly (we got some of the world's most expensive iPhones, for example), so it's pretty easy to understand why you stick to your older machine. Ultimately, it's the devs' job to find a fair (and not very buggy, please and thank you) solution. On the other hand, I shudder to imagine how you manage to perform some basic tasks, such as chatting.

The sad part, though, is that the game's life on older consoles might indeed reach its limit and then comes the question of what options players will have to avoid losing what they built.

Geldauran · July 2022

Mr_Stach wrote: »

I play on both Console and on PC. at the end of the day you can't use the Console as an excuse, because ff14 exists. And it works just fine on Console.

it's a deflection, just like U35 is supposed to be about "Accessibility"

Just a bunch of Buzzwords, if Zos wanted to but the man power behind it, they could improve a lot of things, Consoles are not the hurtle that they claim.

I play FFXIV and what I like about it is that you also have the option of playing on mouse and keyboard if you chose. You can move around and choose the size of UI elements and this was all possible when they released it on the PS3.

Also, you can play on the same account both PC and PS as long as you purchase the game on those platform, unlike ESO where there's no way to transfer to other platforms and they have no plans to.

peacenote · July 2022

I can honestly say I haven't seen a lot of threads shaming console users but I agree it's short-sighted. I don't know if it is still true, as it was an older article, but I'm pretty sure at one point ZOS shared that the population was pretty evenly divided between PlayStation, Xbox, and PC. Which means console accounts for two thirds of the player base!

What I see, which frustrates me, is shaming of PC users and calls for the elimination of mods because console users don't have them. Just like people choose console because they like it, I chose PC because I like it and enjoy mods. I'm a strong advocate for adding useful mods to base game for console users, but it irritates me when people on console ask for their removal.

The bottom line is there are pros and cons to each platform and all players add to the community. Respect for each other and the fact that devs have to balance these platforms would be good for all.

JMadFour · July 2022

Without the Console populations, ESO would die.

That said, the upgrade from Xbox One to Xbox Series S/X is like night and day.

my Series S runs ESO very well and looks very pretty at the same time.

JMadFour · July 2022

peacenote wrote: »

I

What I see, which frustrates me, is shaming of PC users and calls for the elimination of mods because console users don't have them. Just like people choose console because they like it, I chose PC because I like it and enjoy mods. I'm a strong advocate for adding useful mods to base game for console users, but it irritates me when people on console ask for their removal.

The only thing about Mods that bothers me as a console player, is when PC players use their Mods to circumvent every inconvenience about the game (like using TTC to get around shopping with the stupidly inconvenient Guild Trader system), but then fight tooth and nail to keep those same inconveniences in the game as is and fight any attempt at changing them for those of us who don't have access to mods that circumvent the problems.

Otherwise, I don't begrudge anyone using mods, and if Consoles had them I'd use em as well.

starkerealm · July 2022

JMadFour wrote: »

peacenote wrote: »

I

What I see, which frustrates me, is shaming of PC users and calls for the elimination of mods because console users don't have them. Just like people choose console because they like it, I chose PC because I like it and enjoy mods. I'm a strong advocate for adding useful mods to base game for console users, but it irritates me when people on console ask for their removal.

The only thing about Mods that bothers me as a console player, is when PC players use their Mods to circumvent every inconvenience about the game (like using TTC to get around shopping with the stupidly inconvenient Guild Trader system), but then fight tooth and nail to keep those same inconveniences in the game as is and fight any attempt at changing them for those of us who don't have access to mods that circumvent the problems.

Otherwise, I don't begrudge anyone using mods, and if Consoles had them I'd use em as well.

To be honest, TTC helps more for stabilizing prices, than bypassing shopping (though, it does help with tracking down rare items.) AwesomeGuildStore is the one that trivializes shopping, and we've been arguing that more of that should be baked into the base UI for Guild Stores for years.

Tandor · July 2022

Marolf wrote: »

Ratzkifal wrote: »

Marolf wrote: »

Ratzkifal wrote: »

I mean... it was literally the developers who said so, not anyone of us.
Source:

Q: Just to see if we can dispel one of the myths running within The Elder Scrolls Online community, is it true that you'd have problems introducing any additional skill trees due to the limited memory of old-generation consoles (PlayStation 4, Xbox One)?

A:Nothing is impossible. I mean, we do have to be careful. There's only so much memory on those consoles for sure and we have to be smart about what we do. We do have a focus on performance and making the game run really well. So there's a balance.

He is not saying yes, but he is saying as much of a yes as he is allowed to say. They are trying their best to make it work anyhow, but he would have outright denied it if the limiting factor wasn't older generation consoles.

I'll refer you to the first three words of the answer given- "nothing is impossible."

So? That does not disprove the idea that older generation consoles are the main obstacle in the way of adding new skill lines. It just means that if ZOS can find a way to save memory somehow they might still be able to add something. If it weren't for consoles they could start to work on adding something right now without needing to find a way to free up memory first.

Look, I know this is a personal issue to you as a console player, and I really couldn't blame you for that either, but the facts are the facts as long as Rich wasn't lying or gravely mistaken in that interview. Thankfully for you ZOS isn't planning on dropping older consoles any time soon, although the PS6 might not be supported due to the Microsoft takeover and PS5 might be the last Playstation to support ESO. It's just a major bummer for PC players who now have to live with the limitations of a console, when they explicitly haven't been playing on console.
The most fair thing, I think, would be to do away with parity and develop a console version of the game separately from the PC version, but I am sure ZOS doesn't have the resources necessary for that.

Even if consoles were running a separate version, wouldn't lower end PCs be another contributing factor for the PC version? Unless the minimum requirements were increased, I believe so. Then the blame just gets shifted to those who can't afford to upgrade or replace their PC's.

The difference is in the upgradeability of PCs. I play ESO on a couple of PCs that I bought in 2010/2011, but both have had new graphics cards in that time and they continue to run the game flawlessly on high settings.

In the ideal world everyone would be able to run the game on the level of hardware that they can afford, with some able to use higher settings than others, but life isn't always like that and games need to move forward to stay commercially viable. Inevitably that will lead to compatibility problems for those with borderline systems as new software updates impose greater demands on the hardware. It's just an unfortunate fact that console users are harder hit than PC users in that respect because of the difference in upgradeability. I can't see that ever changing because of the way the different devices are assembled and supplied.

Nord_Raseri · July 2022

They're just jealous our in-game economy continues to remain stable

starkerealm · July 2022

Nord_Raseri wrote: »

They're just jealous our in-game economy continues to remain stable

Nah, that's not it at all, we're jealous of your ability to continue happily playing, oblivious to the future that the PTS shows us.

etchedpixels · July 2022

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

OP your own statement contracts your title. Nobody is blaming console players, they are blaming old hardware which inevitably is holding ESO back. Looking at the system requirements from Steam it looks like the PC specs from 2014 so those old PCs are holding ESO back too not just the old consoles.

These specs are bogus. I've repeatedly reported it to Zenimax and Steam but they ignore it as usual It does not run in 3GB of RAM. I tried for the Lolz. Minimum for PC actuially playable is about 8GB and discrete graphics or just about bearably with the better inbuilt graphics.

It's quite impressive how poor a machine a game this size does run on.

Four_Fingers · July 2022

I wish someone would tell Microsoft older PCs are upgradable.
Looking at you Windows 11 and TPM.

Ragnarok0130 · July 2022

Four_Fingers wrote: »

I wish someone would tell Microsoft older PCs are upgradable.
Looking at you Windows 11 and TPM.

Remember they weren’t making ESO for only top end rigs in 2014 so those specs cover older machines from the 2014 era as well. “Runs ESO” for the minimum system requirements doesn’t mean it runs ESO “well” After so many years of adding features.

$spacefracking$ · July 2022

Last gen console is holding the game up. It will have to be closed or something at some point.

The developers have said it, and it's quite obvious that it is a major concern for the longevity of the game.

That said, ya'll are amazing doing some of this content without addons

Sparxlost · July 2022

as an old gen console player id agree that people shouldnt hate the people they DECIDED to continue supplying the game for...

Hey the game is unplayable on your current console upgrade your crap to be able to play it again...
though i doubt the new gen is THAT much of an upgrade. there is no reason they couldnt Just upgrade the pc version..

Riptide · July 2022

I’ve seriously never seen anyone say anything remotely negative about last gen console users. I suppose if you seriously went out of your way to look for it you’d find some incredibly rare thread or poster, but you’d have to be particularly defensive about it to believe it is some kind of relevant sentiment. Really though.