SilverBride wrote: »Difficulty is subjective, and our perceptions of how challenging something is, or isnt, in no way indicates how much time ZoS put into developing mechanics.
It is very common for threads on the same subject to pop up multiple times. If a proposal garnered sufficient support the first time it was presented, there would be no need for further threads on the same subject.
We have acknowledged that they may be difficult for some new and/or casual players. (EDIT: Note some, not all, clearly) They are not the only players here..
By the time you're level 50, no matter your CP, and even dabbled in dungeons & arenas - story bosses just don't make the cut.
(EDIT: Even before then, I have seen many players quit because they found the majority of the combat too stale, except for dungeons)
You yourself acknowledged that the Bosses are easy and said you like them that way.SilverBride wrote: »I don't need to struggle to enjoy the story. In fact I find the opposite to be true. I can only believe I am really a hero if I am strong enough to crush my enemies.
This is why people have proposed a separate instance with higher difficulty and adjustments to mechanics.
SilverBride wrote: »We have acknowledged that they may be difficult for some new and/or casual players. (EDIT: Note some, not all, clearly) They are not the only players here..
By the time you're level 50, no matter your CP, and even dabbled in dungeons & arenas - story bosses just don't make the cut.
(EDIT: Even before then, I have seen many players quit because they found the majority of the combat too stale, except for dungeons)
I disagree. I am CP 881, not as high as many but not new. The story bosses are quite fine for me because I see them for what they are. They are the end protagonist in a story quest chain, not a veteran dungeon or trial boss... nor should they be
SilverBride wrote: »I have played quite awhile myself, and not one person I knew who left ever stated it was because overland was too easy. For most it's real life, work, school, or just plain old burnout.
SilverBride wrote: »There are not enough players supporting this to make it feasible.
SilverBride wrote: »I disagree. I am CP 881, not as high as many but not new. The story bosses are quite fine for me because I see them for what they are. They are the end protagonist in a story quest chain, not a veteran dungeon or trial boss... nor should they be.
SilverBride wrote: »I have played quite awhile myself, and not one person I knew who left ever stated it was because overland was too easy. For most it's real life, work, school, or just plain old burnout.
SilverBride wrote: »
It’s not fun when it practically hands you the victory on a silver platter.
SilverBride wrote: »It may not be fun for you, but it is for me, and many others. I love that I've gotten strong enough that I can enjoy the base story without struggling.
It’s not fun when it practically hands you the victory on a silver platter.SilverBride wrote: »It may not be fun for you, but it is for me, and many others. I love that I've gotten strong enough that I can enjoy the base story without struggling.
This is the quote I was looking for, where you acknowledged that those fights are easy and you like it that way.
SilverBride wrote: »It’s not fun when it practically hands you the victory on a silver platter.SilverBride wrote: »It may not be fun for you, but it is for me, and many others. I love that I've gotten strong enough that I can enjoy the base story without struggling.
This is the quote I was looking for, where you acknowledged that those fights are easy and you like it that way.
I never once said they weren't. It's the story.. not a dungeon or trial.
SilverBride wrote: »Thechuckage wrote: »Something I think we could agree on - lower the population of enemies running around overland. I would prefer them to be replaced with weightier enemies, but not having a pack of wolves or a bandit gang every few hundred feet would make things nicer.SilverBride wrote: »We need these mobs roaming around overland to make the world feel alive. They can be a nuisance if they are hanging around a node you want to harvest, but at least they are a minor nuisance rather than a major challenge.
Plus they add an additional obstacle to just gathering so many of this or that, because you often have to fight them to get to your quest objectives.
Reducing overland mobs would make overland questing even easier, and as some would say more boring, which is what this thread has presented as an issue.
Thechuckage wrote: »Now if the enemies has more capabilities/power but were more scattered, one could kill them off, sneak past or the current option of simply ignore.
The real problem with these threads is the fact that the majority of the player base doesn't visit the forums.
The real problem with these threads is the fact that the majority of the player base doesn't visit the forums. I wouldn't mind a difficulty setting like normal veteran or hardcore. Star Trek Online has this. If you group up the group leader's setting will be for all to see. And players could request what group setting they are looking for. It works really well in Star Trek Online.
If Zos can do this, WITHOUT diminishing the quality and amount of content for the greater bulk of the population I have zero issue with any of it, provided they don't try and push any extra cost onto the rest of us I'm A-ok with it. In fact I really wish they'd say or do something instead of just shutting these down once they inevitable go downhill.
Honestly, I'll farm the hell outta it like so many others because just like all the souls games or even here with MA/VMA, once you learn the limited number of moves and spawn points that can be programmed into an npc/area, the challenge is gone and it will be a gold mine from that point. You don't have to admit, but it's just a fact. In no way am I implying that's a motive for anyone else, that's all me.
Extremely small population will lead to less competition for resources which will lead to big profits for those players. So I'm looking forward to enjoying being one of those players.
My only opposition to this proposal is if it has any negative effects on the regularly scheduled content releases for the bulk of us. If it has any impact on the greater population, then this "optional" content indeed affects me.
Good day to all.
SilverBride wrote: »Thechuckage wrote: »Now if the enemies has more capabilities/power but were more scattered, one could kill them off, sneak past or the current option of simply ignore.
What would be the point of having stronger enemies if we can just sneak past or ignore them?
Jeffrey530 wrote: »Thechuckage wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »Thechuckage wrote: »@SilverBride Stories need weight. If the hero never has to struggle, never has to overcome challenges then it is a poor story. "Going to save the world from an evil god" loses all meaning when the difficulty curve makes the Great Plains look mountainous by comparison.
I don't need to struggle to enjoy the story. In fact I find the opposite to be true. I can only believe I am really a hero if I am strong enough to crush my enemies.
The story is fine just as it is.
Are you familiar with the Heroes Journey narrative? (For anyone not familiar) It is extremely common in writing and story telling. And not in the modern sense. This predates (AFAIK) Greek and other ancient civilizations. The Hero must overcome some obstacle, trial, enemy what have you. Regardless of how powerful the hero is, the struggle remains.
Hercules( a demigod for cripes sake) taking on the 7 tasks which challenged him greatly. John Henry literally killing himself to beat a drilling machine. Spiderman going from weak nerd to superpowers and learning to control them, himself and take on new responsibilities. The common thread is they all have to work to succeed.
Now if you specifically SilverBride enjoy just being super OP. Fine, but the centuries of story telling has shown people like the hero to work for their success. Not have it handed to them.
Honestly this is so outdated. Popular ( especially) asian novels/ tv shows/anime these days are all about a new genre- insanely powerful protagonists right from the star. People don't care about progression or work to succeed anymore, it is simply about how the protagonist can crush enemies instantly, show off their power in different ways. You may not like it, but it is a fact that this genre is one of the most popular in Japan/korea/china at this moment.
SilverBride wrote: »Thechuckage wrote: »Now if the enemies has more capabilities/power but were more scattered, one could kill them off, sneak past or the current option of simply ignore.
What would be the point of having stronger enemies if we can just sneak past or ignore them?
Jeffrey530 wrote: »Thechuckage wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »Thechuckage wrote: »@SilverBride Stories need weight. If the hero never has to struggle, never has to overcome challenges then it is a poor story. "Going to save the world from an evil god" loses all meaning when the difficulty curve makes the Great Plains look mountainous by comparison.
I don't need to struggle to enjoy the story. In fact I find the opposite to be true. I can only believe I am really a hero if I am strong enough to crush my enemies.
The story is fine just as it is.
Are you familiar with the Heroes Journey narrative? (For anyone not familiar) It is extremely common in writing and story telling. And not in the modern sense. This predates (AFAIK) Greek and other ancient civilizations. The Hero must overcome some obstacle, trial, enemy what have you. Regardless of how powerful the hero is, the struggle remains.
Hercules( a demigod for cripes sake) taking on the 7 tasks which challenged him greatly. John Henry literally killing himself to beat a drilling machine. Spiderman going from weak nerd to superpowers and learning to control them, himself and take on new responsibilities. The common thread is they all have to work to succeed.
Now if you specifically SilverBride enjoy just being super OP. Fine, but the centuries of story telling has shown people like the hero to work for their success. Not have it handed to them.
Honestly this is so outdated. Popular ( especially) asian novels/ tv shows/anime these days are all about a new genre- insanely powerful protagonists right from the star. People don't care about progression or work to succeed anymore, it is simply about how the protagonist can crush enemies instantly, show off their power in different ways. You may not like it, but it is a fact that this genre is one of the most popular in Japan/korea/china at this moment.
Player and fan of the Yakuza series here, I can safely tell you that the "Hero Journey" is still very much a thing, and this is a game series from Japan.
The protagonists still have to overcome challenges, suffer defeat and even have to take steps to avoid enemies. And that is a game that pretty much defies the laws of human physics where people can take all manner of beatings and still shake it off.
Since you mentioned anime, I thought I could bring One Punch Man to attention: Also had a Hero's Journey that made the protagonist reach Superman levels of strength. Funny thing is the guy is also frustrated with how he can overcome everything with ease and doesn't want to have everything fall over with only one punch. So even an anime within the "New genre" timeframe is sitting there showing how being a super-powered God isn't all that it's cracked up to be.
I will agree though, people really have had their interested shift. Must be why I enjoy older games, they still provide a reasonable challenge.
Anecdotal, but literally every IRL friend I've had that's played this game has quit because overworld is just completely, utterly brainless. Even casual players can steamroll everything in their path by the time they've hit the 20s at most. So they wind up in a place where the story and PvE content is completely mindless and boring, yet they're still many hours away from being able to really participate in endgame group content.
So what happens? Well, they quit, by and large. The game is a snooze, and they don't feel engaged. And the few that carry on to veteran content are so woefully unprepared for the insane spike in difficulty that they struggle immensely and begin to feel like they've got a 1000+ CP delta to bridge before they can have a handle on things.
It certainly isn't much of a solution, especially considering if people already don't make use of any "Alt Powers".Play othe the other server EU > NA in my case.
New character with nothing, zilzch, nada. No gold, no banker, merchant, CP and nothing crafted by my Master Crafter. No potions from my magnificent alchemist, no food from my delicious provisioner.
I cannot say that this is a solution for others but I'm bored and over-caffeinated so bear with me.
So last night me and my girlfriend decided to play a bit, going through quests in Craglorn (The regular ones, not the group quests)
She fell asleep next to me while we were running through a Delve. Can't say I blame her since the enemies we were dealing with were falling over deal with one or two Heavy Attacks.
I don't know about you ladies and gentlemen, but having enemies be complete pushovers even in the "Group Zone" is not very pleasant.
I don't care if people want a "Power Fantasy" out of this game or not, but at the very least let people have the option of having the game not be a "Power Fantasy" if they so choose.It certainly isn't much of a solution, especially considering if people already don't make use of any "Alt Powers".Play othe the other server EU > NA in my case.
New character with nothing, zilzch, nada. No gold, no banker, merchant, CP and nothing crafted by my Master Crafter. No potions from my magnificent alchemist, no food from my delicious provisioner.
I cannot say that this is a solution for others but I'm bored and over-caffeinated so bear with me.
All my characters start fresh with no Champion Points or special gear waiting for them. The world around me still proves to be easy against me just either using one ability or just using Heavy Attacks repeatedly.
HalfRain216 wrote: »I’m sorry but I believe you are in a minority like most in this forum.
I also went into craglorn with my girlfriend the other night CP200 & CP 500 and it is definitely harder than normal overland especially the delves. The mobs are stronger and if we’re not paying attention doing rotations we would easily die. To say you can just heavy attack through it is untrue.
I’m not against vet overland but normal overland is pretty difficult to most players in the harder areas. I can guarantee most players can not solo any world boss without dying a few times if it all.
MovesLikeJaguar wrote: »We have Normal and Veteran content for trials and dungeons, so why not Normal and Veteran content for overland PVE?