Race buffs

Joy_Division · February 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

The 3% cost reduction with bretons is a great mag resourse passive, better then the 9% that high elfs get. Not sure what you guys are about.

The average mag cost in the game is around 3k on the low end, so 3% of that is 90. Which in regen terms is 180. To get 180 regen out of the 9% passive you would need 2000 base regen. Noone has that.

Oversimplifying.

Regen is always active. Cost reduction is not.

Regen amps with other bonuses. Cost reduction has diminishing returns.

2000 Regen is not uncommon for healers and PvP

Ermiq · February 2018

Breton needs a buff? What?!
Did you ever tried to compare Breton & Dunmer? I did last night.
Both are magWardens, identical builds, identical gear (the same gear actually), the same rotation.
Damage difference was 3%, Dunmer did more damage, yes.
But, I almost ran out of magicka on Dunmer while Breton's magicka pool was like 30-50% full all the time (with the same rotation).
Also, Breton has a good amount of mag resistance. Dunmer's 2000 fire resist is just nothing compared to Breton.

So, Breton has a very good sustain. Yeah, -3% cost is a very very good, if you make some testing in practice you'll see it. Breton has a good mag resist (much better than Dunmer). And Breton deals 3% less damage, Dunmer 22.3K, Breton 21.6K.
I see everywhere that Dunmers are very good and strong race, and I see everywhere that Bretons are not that good. I wonder, why? Is it that ESO elitists' mindset "DPS is all you need! Sacrifce everything for +0.5% damage!"?

Skander wrote: »

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

Major in this priority:
-Nord
-Imperial
Minor:
Breton (that 3% is laughable, at least 5 thanks.)

Nord -okay
Imperial - #2 tank? nope don't need buffed
Breton -#1 healer? nope don't need buffed

veil_ wrote: »

Remove race passives that lock a race into a certain class, ie, Stealthy.

Brets need +4% magic damage, or a boost to 4% for its cost reduction passive

Nords need some sustain passive for stamina (and frost damage perhaps?)

Imperials could use mag/stam recov, or both.

Other way around, every race should have a useless passive for that play style.

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Nords are fine sure lack of substain but at least you are surviving more hits than usual. Imperials are just fine too. Bretons maybe more love since 1% increase ap isn’t enough for so called buff. And argonians are mainly healers compared to Bretons. Back then it was Bretons who had good healing mostly due to the substain.

1% AP, 1% gold, 1% xp sounds like its right on target

Cheveyo wrote: »

IMO, they need to remove Max <stat> and <stat> Regen from racial skill lines. Move them into the "World" skill tree and let them keep their original level requirements, or similar ones, but let any race choose from them. Create a "Training" tree or "Conditioning". Put all the regen and max stat passives in there, but each separately.

Keep the little bonuses that each race has to keep them different. This would make it so that, while some races stay better for min/maxing, you wont feel crippled by not choosing that race.

For example:
Orcs keep Craftsman and Swift Warrior. Brawny is removed entirely from the game. Unflinching becomes part of the World skill tree. It's a good passive for tanks.

Argonians would lose Resourceful, and the resistances from Argonian Resistance would be combined into Quick to Mend.

Redguard would lose Exhilaration and Conditioning, but keep Adrenaline Rush and Wayfarer.

The biggest issue comes with the elves. Their final passives need to be completely redesigned. Other races can be mixed or combined with their other passives, but the elves are simply either too focused or too strong. Maybe Dunmer keep fire restistance and fire damage? Altmer could get bonus shock damage. This could let Nords have a bonus to frost damage. Bosmer could get a bonus to poison and disease.

The reason I'm for changing things is that there's not really a choice for many people. If they want to play magicka, they have to pick from one of 3 races. Most of the time between 2 races: Dunmer and Altmer. If they want to play Stamina, they can pick between Redguard and Redguard.

And yes, it IS noticeable, before anyone says anything. I had an Imperial Stamplar that I switched to magicka at one point. It was awful. I switched back to stam and eventually race changed to Redguard. You can feel the difference. Even passives like the Bretons make playing magicka way more enjoyable.

Altmer tank, caved and went to Argonian, switch back 2 weeks later. Altmer works better.

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

Creative minds find uses for nearly everything.
That being said - Small adjustments would be fine... As long as the unique flavor of each race, and more importantly it's Lore-based features, remains in place.

Truth

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

The 3% cost reduction with bretons is a great mag resourse passive, better then the 9% that high elfs get. Not sure what you guys are about.

The average mag cost in the game is around 3k on the low end, so 3% of that is 90. Which in regen terms is 180. To get 180 regen out of the 9% passive you would need 2000 base regen. Noone has that.

Truth

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Nords need bonus to frost damage, it might revitalize a dead weapon line. Frost tanks never really caught on...

Some of us figured it out. Words could use something though. Personally I think more like Dunmer Frost Resistance and Frost Damage

If you think that bretons are healers, you are doing something wrong. Becouse they are literally versitile. Just need to buff they last passive which is underwhelming

Bretons are great healers actually. Good resist bonuses let them live through more damage, less cost abilities let them spam more healing spells and shields. These two things are very important for healers.

WuffyCerulei · February 2018

I'd say no to buffing the cost reduction on Bretons and yes to damage bonus for them. Cost reduction has diminished returns and isn't as great as it seems.

ArchMikem · February 2018

ArchMikem wrote: »

Khajiit need that +10% Max Stamina that everyone freaked out over.

This.

Lynx7386 wrote: »

khajiit should get their 8% spell crit back (carnage used to give both melee and spell crit).

And this, and then I'll be completely satisfied with Khajiit.

Soleya · February 2018

Ratzkifal wrote: »

I think you can add Bosmer to minor. They are not really BiS for anything apart from appearance if you are one of these people. They can't even beat the other races of their alliance in any role apart for perhaps going stamina in pvp.

Agree (have 3 bosmer's on my account).

I'd like to see a 5% Bow damage buff for them, since lore wise they are typically bow users.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · February 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

The 3% cost reduction with bretons is a great mag resourse passive, better then the 9% that high elfs get. Not sure what you guys are about.

The average mag cost in the game is around 3k on the low end, so 3% of that is 90. Which in regen terms is 180. To get 180 regen out of the 9% passive you would need 2000 base regen. Noone has that.

Oversimplifying.

Regen is always active. Cost reduction is not.

Regen amps with other bonuses. Cost reduction has diminishing returns.

2000 Regen is not uncommon for healers and PvP

if you mean that other percent amps stack with each other multiplicatively, instead of additively, you know they dont, havent for a while not sure why you would be so vague, so intentionally misleading. . you to have a base regen of 2k on the low end, that means with set bonuses and food and base regen. they is almost no way to have base 2k regen without compromising on damage, short of a back bar lich proc.

my warden healer is a nord, just like your templar one, he runs 2k regen but that is after all percent amps. base would be 514(base)+124(set)+124(set)+319(food)+300(atro with 4 6.5% divines)= 1381 then all other percent amps are calculated off that and then added to it. like Flourish, 12% adds 166, Recovery from light armor, 24% cause i have on 6 light adds 331, 14% from cp adds 193, bringing the total to 2071. 9% more would only be 124 more regen, still less than the 180 that 3% would save on average, on the low end of course, i would bet that the average magic skill cost is actually closer to 3.5k.

cost reduction is also really easy to see, almost no one uses cost reduction glyphs on there jewlery, so most people only have the light armor passives since they took away the cp node oh so long ago. so 10% for most dps, as 5/1/1 is the best for mag dps. so even with diminishing returns, 3000- 10% is 2700 and 2700 * 3% is 81 mag saved on average. on the low end. would need 162 regen to make up for that. or 1800 base regen. or lets add 4% of worm too. so 2700-4% = 2592 and 2592 * 3% is 78. and 78 in regen terms is 156 and 136 is 9% of 1733. so you would need a base regen of 1733 to beat the 3% cost reduction of a breton with the most common set up. on the low end.

most dps don't run any recovery, so you would just get 9% of 514. or maybe witchmothers, then they would have 514+319= 833. 9% of that is clearly nothing compared to 3% cost reduction.

yes regen is always active but so is cost reduction when you are using abilities. and in pvp, i am pretty sure that cost reduction is not impacted by poisons or the siphoner passive from cp.

i have had this "discussion" before. people do not choose high elf over breton for the sustain passives, it is for the DPS passives. simple as that. and if you want a dps passive( ie a percent amp to magic damage) on what is and has always been in elder scrolls lore a defensive and non aggressive based race (outside of the Reachmen of eastern High Rock) , i simply disagree with you.

Animus-ESO · February 2018

Mettaricana wrote: »

Temove racial passives entirely and just leave the flavor passives like stealth, fall height, increased gold, increased exp, increased sprint, swift swim, etc

Then everyone can play what they want zos can then adjust base stats to offer a lil more to compensate the racial loses without gimping 1 race to be far above or below another.

100000000 times yessss I *** hate racial passives

Iccotak · February 2018

Nords also need some room for magicka builds

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · February 2018

Iccotak wrote: »

Nords also need some room for magicka builds

why?

red_emu · February 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

Nords also need some room for magicka builds

why?

Because they would tie in beautifully with an Ice Mage Warden (something that everyone hoped for and instead we got a crappy heal, tiny AoE and a buggy teleport - only good thing is the passives and a 6 sec shield. Not mentioning the ULT because if you're a magicka build, running into enemies with this ulti on makes you an easy target and you'll die as soon as it's over and enemies stop pressing block)

Nemesis7884 · February 2018

one crazy idea: why not have races only have 2 buffs that on one hand fit the lore but on the other are as universal as possible and then the 3rd passive bonus you can choose from a list of options (geared towards tanking, magicka, stamina etc.) - this represents the talents and training of your character...

besides this yeah i only think nords need a buff...+ frost damage could be one way to make them a bit more universal for magicka as well for example

Maura_Neysa · February 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

The 3% cost reduction with bretons is a great mag resourse passive, better then the 9% that high elfs get. Not sure what you guys are about.

The average mag cost in the game is around 3k on the low end, so 3% of that is 90. Which in regen terms is 180. To get 180 regen out of the 9% passive you would need 2000 base regen. Noone has that.

Oversimplifying.

Regen is always active. Cost reduction is not.

Regen amps with other bonuses. Cost reduction has diminishing returns.

2000 Regen is not uncommon for healers and PvP

Actually regen is not always active, block stops it posions reduce it. The only time you're not casting is while you're not in combat. Then you have non-combat regen. Go play a healer for 10 Seconds of a boss burn phase. Then tell me 100 cost of of Springs isn't better than casting an extra one 2 Seconds later.
PvP where actually having good resistances is even more important??

Leogon · February 2018

ArchMikem wrote: »

Khajiit need that +10% Max Stamina that everyone freaked out over.

It was 6% but I agree, Khajjit should get some Max Stamina or maybe something like 3% Stamina and 3% Health.

Skander · February 2018

Khajiit beware is the only class with carnage giving him a lot of dmg.

starkerealm · February 2018

f047ys3v3n wrote: »

Bretons are weak, this is true. They have no heal or dps buff and their sustain buff is rather lackluster. Depending on how you look at it they may be the weakest race now as the races that used to be weaker all got some real buffs. I would like to see a mag damage bonus (7% to mag like the 7% dk fire though the mag would not be as good you would still have better sustain) , much better sustain (Like 8% better as it needs to be strong if it's just a sustain buff), or some of both (like 4% mag damage 5% cost reduction). People only play Bretons because they have cute female toons (same with wood elf lol.)

Nords are not so much weak as 1 dimensional. They are really only set up to be tanks and folks seem to have an issue with this. I have a Nord I made to be a tank. I still think it is the best Non-imp edition race for tank though Argonian is making a case and I may need to re-evaluate.

Imperials actually make both good tanks and decent stam DPS. I don't feel they are weak.

Yeah, pretty much all of this. Imperials and Nords are both aimed heavily at being tanks. To the point that there's a legitimate question if the Imperial or Argonian is actually the best tank race. Nords are better than they used to be in this regard. Still not sure they're a good choice for a tank, but they're at least respectable now.

Bretons... could really use more. Not sure if that's increased damage, or a buff to their cost discount. Maybe pushing that by a few more percent might make them a more legitimate build choice.

Skander · February 2018

starkerealm wrote: »

f047ys3v3n wrote: »

Bretons are weak, this is true. They have no heal or dps buff and their sustain buff is rather lackluster. Depending on how you look at it they may be the weakest race now as the races that used to be weaker all got some real buffs. I would like to see a mag damage bonus (7% to mag like the 7% dk fire though the mag would not be as good you would still have better sustain) , much better sustain (Like 8% better as it needs to be strong if it's just a sustain buff), or some of both (like 4% mag damage 5% cost reduction). People only play Bretons because they have cute female toons (same with wood elf lol.)

Nords are not so much weak as 1 dimensional. They are really only set up to be tanks and folks seem to have an issue with this. I have a Nord I made to be a tank. I still think it is the best Non-imp edition race for tank though Argonian is making a case and I may need to re-evaluate.

Imperials actually make both good tanks and decent stam DPS. I don't feel they are weak.

Yeah, pretty much all of this. Imperials and Nords are both aimed heavily at being tanks. To the point that there's a legitimate question if the Imperial or Argonian is actually the best tank race. Nords are better than they used to be in this regard. Still not sure they're a good choice for a tank, but they're at least respectable now.

Bretons... could really use more. Not sure if that's increased damage, or a buff to their cost discount. Maybe pushing that by a few more percent might make them a more legitimate build choice.

In a pvp point of view Nords and Imperials are useless. People go with Argonians for stamina classes and i've said it all.

starkerealm · February 2018

Cheveyo wrote: »

IMO, they need to remove Max <stat> and <stat> Regen from racial skill lines. Move them into the "World" skill tree and let them keep their original level requirements, or similar ones, but let any race choose from them. Create a "Training" tree or "Conditioning". Put all the regen and max stat passives in there, but each separately.

Keep the little bonuses that each race has to keep them different. This would make it so that, while some races stay better for min/maxing, you wont feel crippled by not choosing that race.

For example:
Orcs keep Craftsman and Swift Warrior. Brawny is removed entirely from the game. Unflinching becomes part of the World skill tree. It's a good passive for tanks.

Argonians would lose Resourceful, and the resistances from Argonian Resistance would be combined into Quick to Mend.

Redguard would lose Exhilaration and Conditioning, but keep Adrenaline Rush and Wayfarer.

The biggest issue comes with the elves. Their final passives need to be completely redesigned. Other races can be mixed or combined with their other passives, but the elves are simply either too focused or too strong. Maybe Dunmer keep fire restistance and fire damage? Altmer could get bonus shock damage. This could let Nords have a bonus to frost damage. Bosmer could get a bonus to poison and disease.

The reason I'm for changing things is that there's not really a choice for many people. If they want to play magicka, they have to pick from one of 3 races. Most of the time between 2 races: Dunmer and Altmer. If they want to play Stamina, they can pick between Redguard and Redguard.

And yes, it IS noticeable, before anyone says anything. I had an Imperial Stamplar that I switched to magicka at one point. It was awful. I switched back to stam and eventually race changed to Redguard. You can feel the difference. Even passives like the Bretons make playing magicka way more enjoyable.

Honestly, the racial modifiers were less of an issue back when we had soft caps. You could get to the soft cap more easily with one race or another, but then you'd need to dump your points somewhere else.

Soft Caps left when Champion Ranks came in, but in a lot of ways, that started the current racial issues. Used to be, it didn't matter if you were a nord or a high elf Magicka sorc, you'd hit the soft cap, and then if you chose to continue pouring points into it, the difference would be negligible, so you were better off putting your points elsewhere.

I'm not a fan of removing attribute modifiers. I don't like them combined with an uncapped system, where you eventually hit a point where your race starts to lock you into one role. Especially not for The Elder Scrolls.

I'm willing to take flak for this, but if I was designing the attribute system from the ground up in ESO, I'd do a 1-100 stat system, like the games used until Oblivion. Your Khajiit may start with higher Agility than your Breton, but in the end, they'd both hard cap at 100, so it would be more a question of, "what else can you do?" rather than, "what role does your race force you into?"

Ladislao · February 2018

It seems to me already that such threads are just a joke. Or the game is so well balanced that the only disbalance in it is the minor racial passive abilities.

If someone is defeated because the enemy has the "right" race, then the matter is not in the race at all.

ArchMikem · February 2018

Leogon wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Khajiit need that +10% Max Stamina that everyone freaked out over.

It was 6% but I agree, Khajjit should get some Max Stamina or maybe something like 3% Stamina and 3% Health.

Three measly percent when say Redguard gets 10%?

Skander · February 2018

Ladislao wrote: »

It seems to me already that such threads are just a joke. Or the game is so well balanced that the only disbalance in it is the minor racial passive abilities.

If someone is defeated because the enemy has the "right" race, then the matter is not in the race at all.

This game is all but balanced (i speak for pvp)

Skander · February 2018

ArchMikem wrote: »

Leogon wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Khajiit need that +10% Max Stamina that everyone freaked out over.

It was 6% but I agree, Khajjit should get some Max Stamina or maybe something like 3% Stamina and 3% Health.

Three measly percent when say Redguard gets 10%?

Yes, and 6% is too much, since Khajiit gets Carnage AND stealthy

lassitershawn · February 2018

I think a lore-friendly way to buff Bretons would be ~5% shield strength tacked on to the third passive. Since in lore Bretons are magically defensive this seems to fit well and gives a small buff without being OP. Magic damage would be cool too though. Regarding Altmer regen vs Breton cost reduc, there is actually more time in combat than you would think where you are not casting. Lots of mechanics involve running, dodging, etc where you get no bonus from cost reduc and you are also spending no magicka while heavy attacking. Which one is better is definitely situational. The disparity between the races comes primarily from the 4% elemental damage versus the spell resist (which isn’t even active while shields are up, and pretty much all mag builds use shields).

Skander · February 2018

lassitershawn wrote: »

I think a lore-friendly way to buff Bretons would be ~5% shield strength tacked on to the third passive. Since in lore Bretons are magically defensive this seems to fit well and gives a small buff without being OP. Magic damage would be cool too though. Regarding Altmer regen vs Breton cost reduc, there is actually more time in combat than you would think where you are not casting. Lots of mechanics involve running, dodging, etc where you get no bonus from cost reduc and you are also spending no magicka while heavy attacking. Which one is better is definitely situational. The disparity between the races comes primarily from the 4% elemental damage versus the spell resist (which isn’t even active while shields are up, and pretty much all mag builds use shields).

Bretons have spell resist, which is lore friendly. They just need a slight buff on the last passive, being the worst of all.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · February 2018

Skander wrote: »

lassitershawn wrote: »

I think a lore-friendly way to buff Bretons would be ~5% shield strength tacked on to the third passive. Since in lore Bretons are magically defensive this seems to fit well and gives a small buff without being OP. Magic damage would be cool too though. Regarding Altmer regen vs Breton cost reduc, there is actually more time in combat than you would think where you are not casting. Lots of mechanics involve running, dodging, etc where you get no bonus from cost reduc and you are also spending no magicka while heavy attacking. Which one is better is definitely situational. The disparity between the races comes primarily from the 4% elemental damage versus the spell resist (which isn’t even active while shields are up, and pretty much all mag builds use shields).

Bretons have spell resist, which is lore friendly. They just need a slight buff on the last passive, being the worst of all.

it is really not. the worst you can say is the it is right in line with other resource passives, it is not too far behind the pot one from argonians(lizards op) and it is better then the 9% regen from high elves. see my post higher up. or just click this- https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4895360/#Comment_4895360.

Skander · February 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

lassitershawn wrote: »

I think a lore-friendly way to buff Bretons would be ~5% shield strength tacked on to the third passive. Since in lore Bretons are magically defensive this seems to fit well and gives a small buff without being OP. Magic damage would be cool too though. Regarding Altmer regen vs Breton cost reduc, there is actually more time in combat than you would think where you are not casting. Lots of mechanics involve running, dodging, etc where you get no bonus from cost reduc and you are also spending no magicka while heavy attacking. Which one is better is definitely situational. The disparity between the races comes primarily from the 4% elemental damage versus the spell resist (which isn’t even active while shields are up, and pretty much all mag builds use shields).

Bretons have spell resist, which is lore friendly. They just need a slight buff on the last passive, being the worst of all.

it is really not. the worst you can say is the it is right in line with other resource passives, it is not too far behind the pot one from argonians(lizards op) and it is better then the 9% regen from high elves. see my post higher up. or just click this- https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4895360/#Comment_4895360.

9% rgen is way better. On a pvp stand of view. Is FAR better. And Altmers also have an insane buff on elemental dmg.

Joy_Division · February 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

The 3% cost reduction with bretons is a great mag resourse passive, better then the 9% that high elfs get. Not sure what you guys are about.

The average mag cost in the game is around 3k on the low end, so 3% of that is 90. Which in regen terms is 180. To get 180 regen out of the 9% passive you would need 2000 base regen. Noone has that.

Oversimplifying.

Regen is always active. Cost reduction is not.

Regen amps with other bonuses. Cost reduction has diminishing returns.

2000 Regen is not uncommon for healers and PvP

if you mean that other percent amps stack with each other multiplicatively, instead of additively, you know they dont, havent for a while not sure why you would be so vague, so intentionally misleading. . you to have a base regen of 2k on the low end, that means with set bonuses and food and base regen. they is almost no way to have base 2k regen without compromising on damage, short of a back bar lich proc.

my warden healer is a nord, just like your templar one, he runs 2k regen but that is after all percent amps. base would be 514(base)+124(set)+124(set)+319(food)+300(atro with 4 6.5% divines)= 1381 then all other percent amps are calculated off that and then added to it. like Flourish, 12% adds 166, Recovery from light armor, 24% cause i have on 6 light adds 331, 14% from cp adds 193, bringing the total to 2071. 9% more would only be 124 more regen, still less than the 180 that 3% would save on average, on the low end of course, i would bet that the average magic skill cost is actually closer to 3.5k.

cost reduction is also really easy to see, almost no one uses cost reduction glyphs on there jewlery, so most people only have the light armor passives since they took away the cp node oh so long ago. so 10% for most dps, as 5/1/1 is the best for mag dps. so even with diminishing returns, 3000- 10% is 2700 and 2700 * 3% is 81 mag saved on average. on the low end. would need 162 regen to make up for that. or 1800 base regen. or lets add 4% of worm too. so 2700-4% = 2592 and 2592 * 3% is 78. and 78 in regen terms is 156 and 136 is 9% of 1733. so you would need a base regen of 1733 to beat the 3% cost reduction of a breton with the most common set up. on the low end.

most dps don't run any recovery, so you would just get 9% of 514. or maybe witchmothers, then they would have 514+319= 833. 9% of that is clearly nothing compared to 3% cost reduction.

yes regen is always active but so is cost reduction when you are using abilities. and in pvp, i am pretty sure that cost reduction is not impacted by poisons or the siphoner passive from cp.

i have had this "discussion" before. people do not choose high elf over breton for the sustain passives, it is for the DPS passives. simple as that. and if you want a dps passive( ie a percent amp to magic damage) on what is and has always been in elder scrolls lore a defensive and non aggressive based race (outside of the Reachmen of eastern High Rock) , i simply disagree with you.

I meant the Atmer regen bonus take into account things like drink, gear, etc, which it does..

People who favor cost reduction (and that's fine if you do, you don;t need to be insulting and say I'm "intentionally misleading" or by putting "discussion" into quotation marks), always assume a spell is being cast every second and that's not true after Morrowind because of all the heavy attack we do. During heavy attacks, regen is active, cost reduction is not. You are not including that into your calculation so I think you were oversimplifying.

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

The 3% cost reduction with bretons is a great mag resourse passive, better then the 9% that high elfs get. Not sure what you guys are about.

The average mag cost in the game is around 3k on the low end, so 3% of that is 90. Which in regen terms is 180. To get 180 regen out of the 9% passive you would need 2000 base regen. Noone has that.

Oversimplifying.

Regen is always active. Cost reduction is not.

Regen amps with other bonuses. Cost reduction has diminishing returns.

2000 Regen is not uncommon for healers and PvP

Actually regen is not always active, block stops it posions reduce it. The only time you're not casting is while you're not in combat. Then you have non-combat regen. Go play a healer for 10 Seconds of a boss burn phase. Then tell me 100 cost of of Springs isn't better than casting an extra one 2 Seconds later.
PvP where actually having good resistances is even more important??

I do heal, it's not necessary to insult me.

Only blocking with an Ice Staff (with the appropriate passive) will stop regen. This is hardly applicable to anyone that's not trying an experimental tank of some sort.

The boss you want me to heal during 10 seconds does not use poisons, so that's also a specific application, only to come up during certain PvP encounters.

I'd like to see a the video of you casting a skill every second in the 10 minute fight against veteran St. Olms. The Morrowind sustain changes makes that unbeleivable that it can be done. Here is a video of a healer point of view and they are not casting skills every second because that can't be done of fights that are challenging, have mechanics to avoid, and last longer that the typical 20 second boss burn in say Splindleclutch.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · February 2018

Skander wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

lassitershawn wrote: »

I think a lore-friendly way to buff Bretons would be ~5% shield strength tacked on to the third passive. Since in lore Bretons are magically defensive this seems to fit well and gives a small buff without being OP. Magic damage would be cool too though. Regarding Altmer regen vs Breton cost reduc, there is actually more time in combat than you would think where you are not casting. Lots of mechanics involve running, dodging, etc where you get no bonus from cost reduc and you are also spending no magicka while heavy attacking. Which one is better is definitely situational. The disparity between the races comes primarily from the 4% elemental damage versus the spell resist (which isn’t even active while shields are up, and pretty much all mag builds use shields).

Bretons have spell resist, which is lore friendly. They just need a slight buff on the last passive, being the worst of all.

it is really not. the worst you can say is the it is right in line with other resource passives, it is not too far behind the pot one from argonians(lizards op) and it is better then the 9% regen from high elves. see my post higher up. or just click this- https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4895360/#Comment_4895360.

9% rgen is way better. On a pvp stand of view. Is FAR better. And Altmers also have an insane buff on elemental dmg.

did you even read my post that i linked? it is not "way better" cost reduction gets better in pvp with cost increase potions and the reduction is not impacted by the siphon passive. like i said, the worst you can say is that they are in line with each other.

i agree that the 4% buff to elemetal damage is more desired then the 6% spell resists that bretons have, though i would never say "insane" about a mere 4%, that is another topic altogether then the resource passives.

Skander · February 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

lassitershawn wrote: »

I think a lore-friendly way to buff Bretons would be ~5% shield strength tacked on to the third passive. Since in lore Bretons are magically defensive this seems to fit well and gives a small buff without being OP. Magic damage would be cool too though. Regarding Altmer regen vs Breton cost reduc, there is actually more time in combat than you would think where you are not casting. Lots of mechanics involve running, dodging, etc where you get no bonus from cost reduc and you are also spending no magicka while heavy attacking. Which one is better is definitely situational. The disparity between the races comes primarily from the 4% elemental damage versus the spell resist (which isn’t even active while shields are up, and pretty much all mag builds use shields).

Bretons have spell resist, which is lore friendly. They just need a slight buff on the last passive, being the worst of all.

it is really not. the worst you can say is the it is right in line with other resource passives, it is not too far behind the pot one from argonians(lizards op) and it is better then the 9% regen from high elves. see my post higher up. or just click this- https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4895360/#Comment_4895360.

9% rgen is way better. On a pvp stand of view. Is FAR better. And Altmers also have an insane buff on elemental dmg.

did you even read my post that i linked? it is not "way better" cost reduction gets better in pvp with cost increase potions and the reduction is not impacted by the siphon passive. like i said, the worst you can say is that they are in line with each other.

i agree that the 4% buff to elemetal damage is more desired then the 6% spell resists that bretons have, though i would never say "insane" about a mere 4%, that is another topic altogether then the resource passives.

3999 spell resisnt' isn't 6% less dmg.

And no, since recovery gets buffed by potions, and continuus attack. 9% is way better then a miserable 3% reduction

lassitershawn · February 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

lassitershawn wrote: »

I think a lore-friendly way to buff Bretons would be ~5% shield strength tacked on to the third passive. Since in lore Bretons are magically defensive this seems to fit well and gives a small buff without being OP. Magic damage would be cool too though. Regarding Altmer regen vs Breton cost reduc, there is actually more time in combat than you would think where you are not casting. Lots of mechanics involve running, dodging, etc where you get no bonus from cost reduc and you are also spending no magicka while heavy attacking. Which one is better is definitely situational. The disparity between the races comes primarily from the 4% elemental damage versus the spell resist (which isn’t even active while shields are up, and pretty much all mag builds use shields).

Bretons have spell resist, which is lore friendly. They just need a slight buff on the last passive, being the worst of all.

it is really not. the worst you can say is the it is right in line with other resource passives, it is not too far behind the pot one from argonians(lizards op) and it is better then the 9% regen from high elves. see my post higher up. or just click this- https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4895360/#Comment_4895360.

9% rgen is way better. On a pvp stand of view. Is FAR better. And Altmers also have an insane buff on elemental dmg.

did you even read my post that i linked? it is not "way better" cost reduction gets better in pvp with cost increase potions and the reduction is not impacted by the siphon passive. like i said, the worst you can say is that they are in line with each other.

i agree that the 4% buff to elemetal damage is more desired then the 6% spell resists that bretons have, though i would never say "insane" about a mere 4%, that is another topic altogether then the resource passives.

4% elemental damage would buff my Breton sorc’s PvE DPS by something like 1.5k (maybe more) last time I checked. That is pretty powerful. If Bretons were clearly superior in some other way it would be OK. When comparing the two you must take into account that Altmer passives are ALWAYS active while spell resist is useless with a shield up and cost reduc doesn’t work if you aren’t casting.

EDIT: that’s on a solo parse the raw numbers from the elemental damage would go up even higher with buffs like warhorn cprayer etc.

Silver_Strider · February 2018

Nords
Buff Max Stamina to 9%
Add to Hardy so that it grants back 400 stamina when they take damage once every 3 seconds.

Breton
Add a 5% Magic regen to the cost reduction passive

Imperial
Change Red Diamond to restore 800 Health and 400 Magic or Stamina (whichever is higher) every 4 seconds on light/heavy attacks (regardless if melee or not)

Bosmer and Khajiit
Nerf Stealthy from 10% to 6% with 3% Max Stamina added for both.

Bosmer
Buff Stamina regen to 25%

Khajiit
Change Health regen to 6% Max Health and buff Stamina regen to 12%
Add back Spell Crit to Carnage.