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PTS Update 16 - Feedback Thread for Dragonknights
-
Weps✭✭✭✭Ehm...not really. The issues of the MagDk don't just come down to templars being able to purge.
It's the lack of mobility that won't allow a MagDK to keep up with a nightblade who's able to cloak constantly.
Or to keep up with a sorc ability to move away from pressure and heal through it.
Or with the ability of the Warden to purge and counter-burst.
MagDK is not in a ugly spot but still needs plenty of love for both PvE and PvP.
In a 2v2 situation can be lethal and in 1vX can still be able to survive when facing pugs but you cannot consider just the only two situations where the mDK is going to be really strong and pat yourself on the shoulders and say "Ah, this class is done".
No, the class not done not AT ALL.PS4 EU - CP 1000+ - EP Loyal
My EU PreciousesAemon Dk | Imperial Dragonknight Tank
Guari Gaburiefu | PvP Stamplar - Soon PvE tank
Nadija Zenobia | 45k+ PvE Dk - PvP Leaper
Naga del Serpente | High Elf Magicka Sorc PVE DPS - Soon tb 2nd crafter
Azor Ahai V | Dunmer Magicka DK for PVP and Pve
Jabba D'Cat | Khajiit Stamplar
Gennarino Auditore | 7k Weapon damage Bosmer Stamblade / Ganking experimental build
Rina Inbasu | Dunmer Magblade, my bomblade
Zelgadis Greywords | High Elf Magplar
Nachael Jordan | Redguard Stamsorc DPS
Orghuz Diul | StamWar DPS
This-Will-Buff-If | Argonian Warden Trial Off tank
Amelia Tesla Sallilune | Breton Magden PvP DD / PvE healer
Sap-My-Shield | PvP Nooblade, now dead PvE Tank1 -
Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certinaly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
One of the things Gilliam points out in his video is effective sustain via class passives. NBs and Templars, for example, have around 500 effective magicka sustain from their passives/actives (excluding heavy attacking). mDK has like 200 effective magicka sustain. In no universe is that "perfectly fine."Invictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT1 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certinaly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
One of the things Gilliam points out in his video is effective sustain via class passives. NBs and Templars, for example, have around 500 effective magicka sustain from their passives/actives (excluding heavy attacking). mDK has like 200 effective magicka sustain. In no universe is that "perfectly fine."
Have you noticed that sorcs tend to consider other classes as "perfectly fine"? I'm starting to believe they do that on purpose...
Regarding DK Passives, I'm gonna say it again: Zenimax, change combustion, it is a bad passive that does nothing...
Edit: By the way, I want to know how a NB can heal himself while cloaked.... Maybe Rinaldo was referring to HoT ticks...
Edited by Xvorg on October 18, 2017 3:38PMSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique1 -
Vesper_BR✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certinaly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
One of the things Gilliam points out in his video is effective sustain via class passives. NBs and Templars, for example, have around 500 effective magicka sustain from their passives/actives (excluding heavy attacking). mDK has like 200 effective magicka sustain. In no universe is that "perfectly fine."
Have you noticed that sorcs tend to consider other classes as "perfectly fine"? I'm starting to believe they do that on purpose...
Regarding DK Passives, I'm gonna say it again: Zenimax, change combustion, it is a bad passive that does nothing...
Edit: By the way, I want to know how a NB can heal himself while cloaked.... Maybe Rinaldo was referring to HoT ticks...
LfmaoVESPER BR - MAGICKA DRAGONKNIGHT - GRAND OVERLORD + FLAWLESS CONQUEROR (1070 CP / 01-01-2018)
XBOX ONE - NA - EBONHEART PACT BRASIL0 -
Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certinaly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
One of the things Gilliam points out in his video is effective sustain via class passives. NBs and Templars, for example, have around 500 effective magicka sustain from their passives/actives (excluding heavy attacking). mDK has like 200 effective magicka sustain. In no universe is that "perfectly fine."
Have you noticed that sorcs tend to consider other classes as "perfectly fine"? I'm starting to believe they do that on purpose...
Regarding DK Passives, I'm gonna say it again: Zenimax, change combustion, it is a bad passive that does nothing...
Edit: By the way, I want to know how a NB can heal himself while cloaked.... Maybe Rinaldo was referring to HoT ticks...
The forum sorcs have become completely unhinged over the last year.Invictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT0 -
lucky_Sage✭✭✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certinaly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
dk as the DoT class should have a counter to purgeDC PC NA
Magdk - main
Stamcro - alt
AD PS4 NA -retired (PC runs way better to play on console)
magdk
magblade
stamplar
magden
magsorc3 -
Weps✭✭✭✭Combustion does a lot in terms of PvE damage, that's one of the top reasons why Mag and StamDKs can still do good damage in parses. And stamblades can just cloak and use the second cast of rally to have a huge burst heal.PS4 EU - CP 1000+ - EP Loyal
My EU PreciousesAemon Dk | Imperial Dragonknight Tank
Guari Gaburiefu | PvP Stamplar - Soon PvE tank
Nadija Zenobia | 45k+ PvE Dk - PvP Leaper
Naga del Serpente | High Elf Magicka Sorc PVE DPS - Soon tb 2nd crafter
Azor Ahai V | Dunmer Magicka DK for PVP and Pve
Jabba D'Cat | Khajiit Stamplar
Gennarino Auditore | 7k Weapon damage Bosmer Stamblade / Ganking experimental build
Rina Inbasu | Dunmer Magblade, my bomblade
Zelgadis Greywords | High Elf Magplar
Nachael Jordan | Redguard Stamsorc DPS
Orghuz Diul | StamWar DPS
This-Will-Buff-If | Argonian Warden Trial Off tank
Amelia Tesla Sallilune | Breton Magden PvP DD / PvE healer
Sap-My-Shield | PvP Nooblade, now dead PvE Tank0 -
Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Combustion does a lot in terms of PvE damage, that's one of the top reasons why Mag and StamDKs can still do good damage in parses. And stamblades can just cloak and use the second cast of rally to have a huge burst heal.
Combustion only adds like 500 dps I thought?
Searing Heat, Elder Dragon, and Scaled Armor are pitiful passives though.Edited by Kilandros on October 18, 2017 3:49PMInvictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT0 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Combustion does a lot in terms of PvE damage, that's one of the top reasons why Mag and StamDKs can still do good damage in parses. And stamblades can just cloak and use the second cast of rally to have a huge burst heal.
Buf forces you as a mDK to run flame based attacks, hoping the RGN god to help you to improve your DPS through a status that sometimes doesn't come.
In the case of StamDKs it is even worst, or you run a DoT build or you can't use the passive (unless you slot Poison arrow and lethal arrow which is almost the same). There are plenty of stam PvP builds that doesn't use it.
The other option for stamDK is to run a poison/flame glyph on a charged weapon, but who would do that having access to Infused and disease glyph... or even better, a charged + shock glyph?
Edited by Xvorg on October 18, 2017 3:55PMSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certainly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
One of the things Gilliam points out in his video is effective sustain via class passives. NBs and Templars, for example, have around 500 effective magicka sustain from their passives/actives (excluding heavy attacking). mDK has like 200 effective magicka sustain. In no universe is that "perfectly fine."
Have you noticed that sorcs tend to consider other classes as "perfectly fine"? I'm starting to believe they do that on purpose...
Regarding DK Passives, I'm gonna say it again: Zenimax, change combustion, it is a bad passive that does nothing...
Edit: By the way, I want to know how a NB can heal himself while cloaked.... Maybe Rinaldo was referring to HoT ticks...
Forum Sorc?
I gave up on the Sorc class about a year ago honestly...the class has been trash since TG.....I mean if you like a Mine Camping Turret Class that stacks shields, that is outclassed by every stam build in the game then yes play Mag Sorc...if you want to play the mobile Squishy Caster Sorc from 1.x? Well thats been dead for a very long time....
I run a Destro/Resto Mag DK now (I don't even see anyone on PC-NA running any build close to mine) and its better then my Mag Sorc in every way...AND it can actually kill those annoying perma block tanks(unlike my Sorc who simply can't).
I am not saying Mag DK is perfect, but its far more "fun" then Mag Sorc, and with the right setup is every bit as strong...the Destro/Resto Mag DK Pyromancer build from 1.x is back, and its better then ever....with the proper setup...it performs very well, and can fill multiple roles in pvp while dishing out considerable damage....
Yes, Battle Roar needs to be adjusted to be on par with other classes sustain passives. They also need a passive that perhaps makes the enemy take a set % of damage from a DOT if they cleanse it since Mag DK are literally reliant on them....
I am just saying DK isn't as bad as its parroted on here, just like Sorc isn't as good as parroted on here...Warden is the best Stamina and Magicka PVP class in the game by a large margin for folks who know how to use them....but thats a topic for another post.Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak2 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certainly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
One of the things Gilliam points out in his video is effective sustain via class passives. NBs and Templars, for example, have around 500 effective magicka sustain from their passives/actives (excluding heavy attacking). mDK has like 200 effective magicka sustain. In no universe is that "perfectly fine."
Have you noticed that sorcs tend to consider other classes as "perfectly fine"? I'm starting to believe they do that on purpose...
Regarding DK Passives, I'm gonna say it again: Zenimax, change combustion, it is a bad passive that does nothing...
Edit: By the way, I want to know how a NB can heal himself while cloaked.... Maybe Rinaldo was referring to HoT ticks...
Forum Sorc?
I gave up on the Sorc class about a year ago honestly...the class has been trash since TG.....I mean if you like a Mine Camping Turret Class that stacks shields, that is outclassed by every stam build in the game then yes play Mag Sorc...if you want to play the mobile Squishy Caster Sorc from 1.x? Well thats been dead for a very long time....
I run a Destro/Resto Mag DK now (I don't even see anyone on PC-NA running any build close to mine) and its better then my Mag Sorc in every way...AND it can actually kill those annoying perma block tanks(unlike my Sorc who simply can't).
I am not saying Mag DK is perfect, but its far more "fun" then Mag Sorc, and with the right setup is every bit as strong...the Destro/Resto Mag DK Pyromancer build from 1.x is back, and its better then ever....with the proper setup...it performs very well, and can fill multiple roles in pvp while dishing out considerable damage....
Yes, Battle Roar needs to be adjusted to be on par with other classes sustain passives. They also need a passive that perhaps makes the enemy take a set % of damage from a DOT if they cleanse it since Mag DK are literally reliant on them....
I am just saying DK isn't as bad as its parroted on here, just like Sorc isn't as good as parroted on here...Warden is the best Stamina and Magicka PVP class in the game by a large margin for folks who know how to use them....but thats a topic for another post.
How do you sustain on a mDK? I mean, everyone of us wants to know that considering how bad is mDK sustain.
Regarding permablockers, they have never been an issue for DKs in general. Talons and petrify are the way to go in that case and will be pretty much the same next patch.
Regarding permablocking... I have a permablocking magsorc... quite funSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certainly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
One of the things Gilliam points out in his video is effective sustain via class passives. NBs and Templars, for example, have around 500 effective magicka sustain from their passives/actives (excluding heavy attacking). mDK has like 200 effective magicka sustain. In no universe is that "perfectly fine."
Have you noticed that sorcs tend to consider other classes as "perfectly fine"? I'm starting to believe they do that on purpose...
Regarding DK Passives, I'm gonna say it again: Zenimax, change combustion, it is a bad passive that does nothing...
Edit: By the way, I want to know how a NB can heal himself while cloaked.... Maybe Rinaldo was referring to HoT ticks...
I run a Destro/Resto Mag DK now (I don't even see anyone on PC-NA running any build close to mine) and its better then my Mag Sorc in every way...AND it can actually kill those annoying perma block tanks(unlike my Sorc who simply can't).
People don't run that build because it isn't particularly effective as a solo/small-scale build. I don't know what group sizes you run that build in, but at a certain number of people you can kind of run whatever you want and the class/build weaknesses can be compensated by the group. But once you reach a certain group size, assuming you want to add the most you can to the group make up, you need to start asking yourself do you bring anything to the table that another class can't do better.
For me, that's been the big problem of mDK in PvP since IC came out. The class is weak solo, strong in groups of 2-4, and then is quickly eclipsed by other classes in groups of 5+. There's a reason Kodi's mDK solo streams all end in him rage switching to another class, and a reason the competitive guilds like Invictus and Dracarys aren't running any mDKs in larger groups.
You should watch the first 20 minutes of Gilliam's video he does a pretty good job addressing the major problems of the DK class. Though it's mostly slanted towards PvE, many of the DK issues are shared between the two game modes. Mainly, sustain is terrible. If our sustain was better, solo play would be more viable since it would open up more build variety. Second, DoTs are generally weak in PvP and DK is the DoT class. That's pretty self explanatory. If Shifting Standard was mobile, or if DK had an ability to spread DoTs (a contagion type skill) then the class would become viable in larger groups again.
Edited by Kilandros on October 18, 2017 4:15PMInvictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT2 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certainly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
One of the things Gilliam points out in his video is effective sustain via class passives. NBs and Templars, for example, have around 500 effective magicka sustain from their passives/actives (excluding heavy attacking). mDK has like 200 effective magicka sustain. In no universe is that "perfectly fine."
Have you noticed that sorcs tend to consider other classes as "perfectly fine"? I'm starting to believe they do that on purpose...
Regarding DK Passives, I'm gonna say it again: Zenimax, change combustion, it is a bad passive that does nothing...
Edit: By the way, I want to know how a NB can heal himself while cloaked.... Maybe Rinaldo was referring to HoT ticks...
I run a Destro/Resto Mag DK now (I don't even see anyone on PC-NA running any build close to mine) and its better then my Mag Sorc in every way...AND it can actually kill those annoying perma block tanks(unlike my Sorc who simply can't).
People don't run that build because it isn't particularly effective as a solo/small-scale build. I don't know what group sizes you run that build in, but at a certain number of people you can kind of run whatever you want and the class/build weaknesses can be compensated by the group. But once you reach a certain group size, assuming you want to add the most you can to the group make up, you need to start asking yourself do you bring anything to the table that another class can't do better.
For me, that's been the big problem of mDK in PvP since IC came out. The class is weak solo, strong in groups of 2-4, and then is quickly eclipsed by other classes in groups of 5+. There's a reason Kodi's mDK solo streams all end in him rage switching to another class, and a reason the competitive guilds like Invictus and Dracarys aren't running any mDKs in larger groups.
You should watch the first 20 minutes of Gilliam's video he does a pretty good job addressing the major problems of the DK class. Though it's mostly slanted towards PvE, many of the DK issues are shared between the two game modes. Mainly, sustain is terrible. If our sustain was better, solo play would be more viable since it would open up more build variety. Second, DoTs are generally weak in PvP and DK is the DoT class. That's pretty self explanatory. If Shifting Standard was mobile, or if DK had an ability to spread DoTs (a contagion type skill) then the class would become viable in larger groups again.
The other say I tried the Full HA + stonefist build soloing (in light armor)... I was so dissapointed that I logged off and went to my mageblade do do basically the same with almost the same set up and a better success rate.Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
Weps✭✭✭✭Combustion does a lot in terms of PvE damage, that's one of the top reasons why Mag and StamDKs can still do good damage in parses. And stamblades can just cloak and use the second cast of rally to have a huge burst heal.
Buf forces you as a mDK to run flame based attacks, hoping the RGN god to help you to improve your DPS through a status that sometimes doesn't come.
In the case of StamDKs it is even worst, or you run a DoT build or you can't use the passive (unless you slot Poison arrow and lethal arrow which is almost the same). There are plenty of stam PvP builds that doesn't use it.
The other option for stamDK is to run a poison/flame glyph on a charged weapon, but who would do that having access to Infused and disease glyph... or even better, a charged + shock glyph?
Well of course if you think about it purely for PvP it quickly becomes utter-trash so yeah, a tweak here and there might be good. Like turn it into the execution passive or something like thatPS4 EU - CP 1000+ - EP Loyal
My EU PreciousesAemon Dk | Imperial Dragonknight Tank
Guari Gaburiefu | PvP Stamplar - Soon PvE tank
Nadija Zenobia | 45k+ PvE Dk - PvP Leaper
Naga del Serpente | High Elf Magicka Sorc PVE DPS - Soon tb 2nd crafter
Azor Ahai V | Dunmer Magicka DK for PVP and Pve
Jabba D'Cat | Khajiit Stamplar
Gennarino Auditore | 7k Weapon damage Bosmer Stamblade / Ganking experimental build
Rina Inbasu | Dunmer Magblade, my bomblade
Zelgadis Greywords | High Elf Magplar
Nachael Jordan | Redguard Stamsorc DPS
Orghuz Diul | StamWar DPS
This-Will-Buff-If | Argonian Warden Trial Off tank
Amelia Tesla Sallilune | Breton Magden PvP DD / PvE healer
Sap-My-Shield | PvP Nooblade, now dead PvE Tank0 -
Hope they keep up the good work. You leaping , perma blocking damage dealing DK's need to be neutered even more.
Keep abusing your abilities in Cyro. Its helping your cause , sooo much1 -
krathos✭✭✭✭✭@RinaldoGandolphi i want to address your sustain comment although not all of this wall of text is directed at you.
With perfect ulti gen (3 per second, no sets such as bloodspawn) DK gets ~290 recovery. Looking at a 100 cost ulti taking ~33 seconds to build (or ~16 potential regen ticks).
It's not bad even after the nerf, right? Well. That's the only sustain mechanic MagDKs have. Sure helping hands can give some decent stam sustain (990 for each earthen heart ability cast) but magicka sustain isn't all that great for magdk now seeing as i used to get like, 3-4k more magicka per battle roar.
DKs have no other sustain than the ones listed above. Compare that to other classes:
- Nightblade: magicka (and now stam) returned for killing an opponent (~2k iirc), 15% to all recovery, active sustain abilities such as siphoning attacks (4200 over 20 seconds)
- Warden: 4029 of their primary resource over 25 seconds (no cast cost). That alone is equivalent to magdk for primary resource sustain. 12% stam/magicka recovery. 250 stam/magicka for every green balance ability casted.
- Sorc: magicka back when pet dies (eh kinda whatever but including just to show), health/stam recov by 20%, reduce costs by 5%, 10% magicka recov, 4.5k magicka back when killing a target with their execute.
So wardens get more primary sustain by casting a free skill that also gives major sorcery and a small purge or major brutality on top of their recovery bonuses and other passives.
Nightblades get a lot of recovery and recovery for kills as well as a pretty good active ability for sustain (that alone gives more per second to primary stat than battle roar).
If a sorc kills just 1 person in 33 seconds theyve got the same magicka back than DK does for battle roar in the same time, if they manage to get 1 dark deal off they will get more magicka back than a dk does in 33 seconds with battleroar. Just 1 kill OR 1 cast of darkdeal in 33 seconds and they've got the sustain we do around battleroar.
I left out templar because i feel their sustain is not great either. They get some cost reduction and rune but it's meh compared to what the other 3 classes have.
This affects overall gameplay as DK (and templar) are often forced to run more sustain oriented sets and being the so called "stand your ground" classes the expend more of their secondary and tertiary resource pools than others. For example, most warden, nightblade, and sorc magicka builds don't need nearly the stam sustain that DK does (and templar).
Even some of the other class defining passives (such as 12% healing w/ draconic power) is nearly passed up by other classes. Nightblades get minor vitality w/ swallow soul and 3% global healing bonus for each siphoning ability. The same line that has some good damage/cc abilities also grants them their typical class ulti gen passive on top of additional ulti gen from pots.
Warden gets 2% healing for each green balance ability and access to major mending.
So that's not really special about DK.
What makes DK special then? Talons? Nah, warden has that and sorc has an even better version for most situations. Mobility? nope. Burst? Nope. Tanky passives? nope, templar and warden both have bonus resists and templar has bonus to block damage too. Chains? Nope, worse than every other gap closer in the game. DoTS? Nope, templar and warden both have a really strong DoTs even AoE dots. There's really not much that separates DK from other classes.
DKs just look cool and are fun to play. That's why people play DK. They don't play it for any edge, that's why none of the big streamers both to play it much or at all - and when they do it's short lived. Go watch Sypher (who was a very competent DK in the olden days). He played magdk yesterday and it was sad compared to what he can do on other classes.
I genuinely encourage people who want to call out DKs to go try one and tell me how it plays out for you. I play most classes or have in the past and DK is my main because it's fun and kills feel rewarding but not because it's strong or because it's unique at this point. I could (and do) play the same style as my magdk on other classes and be more effective.Edited by krathos on October 18, 2017 5:02PMFlapjack Palmdale
<ANIMOSITY>
Grand Overlord - Magicka Dragonknight2 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certinaly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
I think you and every non-templar overestimate cleanse.
DKs were crazy OP at Launch when my Templar Purify was better than it is now, yes? That's not the issue. If a tempar purifies a dot you happen to cast as a DK, cast it again. Your DoT is cheaper and still actually does damage. The templar cannot sustain such a strategy. And if a templar waits to purge all those DoTs, don't pretend like the poor DK wasted her magicka because she didn't: by waiting the Templar still took damage from those DoTs and purifying does not heal the damage that was inflicted. Fraction of a cost? Embers 1350 + Burning Breath 2700 = 4050 cost. Purifying Ritual 3705 + 518 nerf (not satisfied you want more) = 4223.7 cost. Oh and those DoTs have already done damage to me.
And it's not like DKs have a monopoly on DoTs such that the class is the only one screwed over by cleanse. DKs use embers, burning breath, and talons. I use Reflective Light, Purifying Light, Jesus Beam.
Purify pisses you off as a DK and you want to get it nerfed? Fine, lobby the all-mighty nerf hammer Wrobel wields will impunity. Get him to eviscerate templars such that they suck so bad nobody will want to play them. Just don't get bent out of shape when the non-DKs get Wrobel to gut your class such that you start looking at Destiny 2 Youtube clips. Oh wait, he already did that.
Well then, I guess that how we devolved in ESO. The classes we play have been so eviscerated and struggle to do anything useful or distinctive, we'll just sit back and cheer when the nerfhammer comes down on anyone as long as it isn't us even though we know it will perpetuate the very problem all these nerfs have brought about in the first place: we have classes that are boring and frustrating to play.2 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@RinaldoGandolphi i want to address your sustain comment although not all of this wall of text is directed at you.
With perfect ulti gen (3 per second, no sets such as bloodspawn) DK gets ~290 recovery. Looking at a 100 cost ulti taking ~33 seconds to build (or ~16 potential regen ticks).
It's not bad even after the nerf, right? Well. That's the only sustain mechanic MagDKs have. Sure helping hands can give some decent stam sustain (990 for each earthen heart ability cast) but magicka sustain isn't all that great for magdk now seeing as i used to get like, 3-4k more magicka per battle roar.
DKs have no other sustain than the ones listed above. Compare that to other classes:
- Nightblade: magicka (and now stam) returned for killing an opponent (~2k iirc), 15% to all recovery, active sustain abilities such as siphoning attacks (4200 over 20 seconds)
- Warden: 4029 of their primary resource over 25 seconds (no cast cost). That alone is equivalent to magdk for primary resource sustain. 12% stam/magicka recovery. 250 stam/magicka for every green balance ability casted.
- Sorc: magicka back when pet dies (eh kinda whatever but including just to show), health/stam recov by 20%, reduce costs by 5%, 10% magicka recov, 4.5k magicka back when killing a target with their execute.
So wardens get more primary sustain by casting a free skill that also gives major sorcery and a small purge or major brutality on top of their recovery bonuses and other passives.
Nightblades get a lot of recovery and recovery for kills as well as a pretty good active ability for sustain (that alone gives more per second to primary stat than battle roar).
If a sorc kills just 1 person in 33 seconds theyve got the same magicka back than DK does for battle roar in the same time, if they manage to get 1 dark deal off they will get more magicka back than a dk does in 33 seconds with battleroar. Just 1 kill OR 1 cast of darkdeal in 33 seconds and they've got the sustain we do around battleroar.
I left out templar because i feel their sustain is not great either. They get some cost reduction and rune but it's meh compared to what the other 3 classes have.
This affects overall gameplay as DK (and templar) are often forced to run more sustain oriented sets and being the so called "stand your ground" classes the expend more of their secondary and tertiary resource pools than others. For example, most warden, nightblade, and sorc magicka builds don't need nearly the stam sustain that DK does (and templar).
Even some of the other class defining passives (such as 12% healing w/ draconic power) is nearly passed up by other classes. Nightblades get minor vitality w/ swallow soul and 3% global healing bonus for each siphoning ability. The same line that has some good damage/cc abilities also grants them their typical class ulti gen passive on top of additional ulti gen from pots.
Warden gets 2% healing for each green balance ability and access to major mending.
So that's not really special about DK.
What makes DK special then? Talons? Nah, warden has that and sorc has an even better version for most situations. Mobility? nope. Burst? Nope. Tanky passives? nope, templar and warden both have bonus resists and templar has bonus to block damage too. Chains? Nope, worse than every other gap closer in the game. DoTS? Nope, templar and warden both have a really strong DoTs even AoE dots. There's really not much that separates DK from other classes.
DKs just look cool and are fun to play. That's why people play DK. They don't play it for any edge, that's why none of the big streamers both to play it much or at all - and when they do it's short lived. Go watch Sypher (who was a very competent DK in the olden days). He played magdk yesterday and it was sad compared to what he can do on other classes.
I genuinely encourage people who want to call out DKs to go try one and tell me how it plays out for you. I play most classes or have in the past and DK is my main because it's fun and kills feel rewarding but not because it's strong or because it's unique at this point. I could (and do) play the same style as my magdk on other classes and be more effective.
It is funny... a guy trying a mDK asked for a set to use in the PvP combat section to avoid snare. I suggested hi him Wyrd tree and he told me he will never use that set because "it's not great on anything"...
When you have a class that has such a bad resource recover and no purge, you are forced to use crappy sets...Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
krathos✭✭✭✭✭necronyteub17_ESO wrote: »Hope they keep up the good work. You leaping , perma blocking damage dealing DK's need to be neutered even more.
Keep abusing your abilities in Cyro. Its helping your cause , sooo much
Go play DK. Let's see how that turns out for you.
Flapjack Palmdale
<ANIMOSITY>
Grand Overlord - Magicka Dragonknight2 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭necronyteub17_ESO wrote: »Hope they keep up the good work. You leaping , perma blocking damage dealing DK's need to be neutered even more.
Keep abusing your abilities in Cyro. Its helping your cause , sooo much
Go play DK. Let's see how that turns out for you.
Just a troll... he did the same in the NB sectionSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique1 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certinaly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
I think you and every non-templar overestimate cleanse.
DKs were crazy OP at Launch when my Templar Purify was better than it is now, yes? That's not the issue. If a tempar purifies a dot you happen to cast as a DK, cast it again. Your DoT is cheaper and still actually does damage. The templar cannot sustain such a strategy. And if a templar waits to purge all those DoTs, don't pretend like the poor DK wasted her magicka because she didn't: by waiting the Templar still took damage from those DoTs and purifying does not heal the damage that was inflicted. Fraction of a cost? Embers 1350 + Burning Breath 2700 = 4050 cost. Purifying Ritual 3705 + 518 nerf (not satisfied you want more) = 4223.7 cost. Oh and those DoTs have already done damage to me.
And it's not like DKs have a monopoly on DoTs such that the class is the only one screwed over by cleanse. DKs use embers, burning breath, and talons. I use Reflective Light, Purifying Light, Jesus Beam.
Purify pisses you off as a DK and you want to get it nerfed? Fine, lobby the all-mighty nerf hammer Wrobel wields will impunity. Get him to eviscerate templars such that they suck so bad nobody will want to play them. Just don't get bent out of shape when the non-DKs get Wrobel to gut your class such that you start looking at Destiny 2 Youtube clips. Oh wait, he already did that.
Well then, I guess that how we devolved in ESO. The classes we play have been so eviscerated and struggle to do anything useful or distinctive, we'll just sit back and cheer when the nerfhammer comes down on anyone as long as it isn't us even though we know it will perpetuate the very problem all these nerfs have brought about in the first place: we have classes that are boring and frustrating to play.
The purify is a wee bit strong. Many people think that. My once main is a magplar. It removes defiles and dots, making it hard to 1v1 templar.
However the rest of Templar is absolute suck. Like the damage abilities are worse than DKs. I would personally like one effect purged every 1/half a second instead of everything gone straight away and make everything else stronger.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.0 -
necronyteub17_ESO wrote: »Hope they keep up the good work. You leaping , perma blocking damage dealing DK's need to be neutered even more.
Keep abusing your abilities in Cyro. Its helping your cause , sooo much
Go play DK. Let's see how that turns out for you.
Just a troll... he did the same in the NB section
Troll BS,
DK and NB BOTH have plenty of ability's and need NERFs. Both of those classes are the sole reason changes are being made to pvp.
Then they come here and cry because they get nerfed . Pick a build and be dps or tank , but NO class should have both the ability to do mass damage AND survive equally as well. THATS why most are upset with the pvp.
Dont sugar coat it like DK and NB are SOOO bad and need buffs. They need nerfed plain and simple. Take it however you want to look at it but changes are coming and ZoS knows it will fail if they dont tone dk and nb down.0 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certinaly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
I think you and every non-templar overestimate cleanse.
DKs were crazy OP at Launch when my Templar Purify was better than it is now, yes? That's not the issue. If a tempar purifies a dot you happen to cast as a DK, cast it again. Your DoT is cheaper and still actually does damage. The templar cannot sustain such a strategy. And if a templar waits to purge all those DoTs, don't pretend like the poor DK wasted her magicka because she didn't: by waiting the Templar still took damage from those DoTs and purifying does not heal the damage that was inflicted. Fraction of a cost? Embers 1350 + Burning Breath 2700 = 4050 cost. Purifying Ritual 3705 + 518 nerf (not satisfied you want more) = 4223.7 cost. Oh and those DoTs have already done damage to me.
And it's not like DKs have a monopoly on DoTs such that the class is the only one screwed over by cleanse. DKs use embers, burning breath, and talons. I use Reflective Light, Purifying Light, Jesus Beam.
Purify pisses you off as a DK and you want to get it nerfed? Fine, lobby the all-mighty nerf hammer Wrobel wields will impunity. Get him to eviscerate templars such that they suck so bad nobody will want to play them. Just don't get bent out of shape when the non-DKs get Wrobel to gut your class such that you start looking at Destiny 2 Youtube clips. Oh wait, he already did that.
Well then, I guess that how we devolved in ESO. The classes we play have been so eviscerated and struggle to do anything useful or distinctive, we'll just sit back and cheer when the nerfhammer comes down on anyone as long as it isn't us even though we know it will perpetuate the very problem all these nerfs have brought about in the first place: we have classes that are boring and frustrating to play.
@Joy_Division
You misunderstand me, and my post was cut short due to my work break being over. I don't want to nerf Templars, I want to BUFF them in areas they actually need such as:
1. Total Dark being changed from what it is now to an unblockable and undodgable CC ability that does a little bit of damage when broken out of, and a set amount when it expires.
2. Returning the Stun to Spear Shards and its morphs
3. Making Radiant Ward Shield size scale on Max Magicka or Max Stamina whichever is higher
4. Reverting the Nerf to Repentance
5. Reverting the nerf to Breath of Life.
Im sorry but all 5 of those changes are far better for the overall Templar toolkit then a 5 debuff purge, and those changes free Templars from being so bound to Sword and Board and Heavy Armor making them stronger with far larger build diversity. Yes, Extended Ritual is too strong, but as you point out, the rest of the Templar toolkit is weak and the changes above addresses those problems and puts Templars back where they should be compared to other classes.Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak0 -
krathos✭✭✭✭✭necronyteub17_ESO wrote: »necronyteub17_ESO wrote: »Hope they keep up the good work. You leaping , perma blocking damage dealing DK's need to be neutered even more.
Keep abusing your abilities in Cyro. Its helping your cause , sooo much
Go play DK. Let's see how that turns out for you.
Just a troll... he did the same in the NB section
Troll BS,
DK and NB BOTH have plenty of ability's and need NERFs. Both of those classes are the sole reason changes are being made to pvp.
Then they come here and cry because they get nerfed . Pick a build and be dps or tank , but NO class should have both the ability to do mass damage AND survive equally as well. THATS why most are upset with the pvp.
Dont sugar coat it like DK and NB are SOOO bad and need buffs. They need nerfed plain and simple. Take it however you want to look at it but changes are coming and ZoS knows it will fail if they dont tone dk and nb down.
Go play a DK.Edited by krathos on October 18, 2017 7:02PMFlapjack Palmdale
<ANIMOSITY>
Grand Overlord - Magicka Dragonknight1 -
lucky_Sage✭✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Mag DK's themselves are perfectly fine, the issue is easy access to purge skills.
DOT's are intended to be the "hard counter" to folks who like to hold block. However, both the Alliance War Purge and the Templar Purge are simply OP for their cost. Also, Cloak should NOT suppress DOT damage...this is stupid...if a Nightblade can heal while he is cloaked, he shouldn't be able to supress damage too...this is the definition of poor game balance....a DOT should not reveal the Cloaked nightblade, but it shouldn't suppress the damage either.
Templars can remove 5 DOTS in one Global Cooldown for a fraction of the cost it costs a DK to apply the said DOT's. thats a BIG problem for class balance.
Address the OP Purge abilities in the game(you should still be able to purge, but not 5 effects at once, not for such a low cost, and most certinaly not spamable) and DK's will be in a good spot
I think you and every non-templar overestimate cleanse.
DKs were crazy OP at Launch when my Templar Purify was better than it is now, yes? That's not the issue. If a tempar purifies a dot you happen to cast as a DK, cast it again. Your DoT is cheaper and still actually does damage. The templar cannot sustain such a strategy. And if a templar waits to purge all those DoTs, don't pretend like the poor DK wasted her magicka because she didn't: by waiting the Templar still took damage from those DoTs and purifying does not heal the damage that was inflicted. Fraction of a cost? Embers 1350 + Burning Breath 2700 = 4050 cost. Purifying Ritual 3705 + 518 nerf (not satisfied you want more) = 4223.7 cost. Oh and those DoTs have already done damage to me.
And it's not like DKs have a monopoly on DoTs such that the class is the only one screwed over by cleanse. DKs use embers, burning breath, and talons. I use Reflective Light, Purifying Light, Jesus Beam.
Purify pisses you off as a DK and you want to get it nerfed? Fine, lobby the all-mighty nerf hammer Wrobel wields will impunity. Get him to eviscerate templars such that they suck so bad nobody will want to play them. Just don't get bent out of shape when the non-DKs get Wrobel to gut your class such that you start looking at Destiny 2 Youtube clips. Oh wait, he already did that.
Well then, I guess that how we devolved in ESO. The classes we play have been so eviscerated and struggle to do anything useful or distinctive, we'll just sit back and cheer when the nerfhammer comes down on anyone as long as it isn't us even though we know it will perpetuate the very problem all these nerfs have brought about in the first place: we have classes that are boring and frustrating to play.
so a magdk spending 10,231 magcika with 4 GDC to 1 GDC and 3,410 magickaDC PC NA
Magdk - main
Stamcro - alt
AD PS4 NA -retired (PC runs way better to play on console)
magdk
magblade
stamplar
magden
magsorc1 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭necronyteub17_ESO wrote: »necronyteub17_ESO wrote: »Hope they keep up the good work. You leaping , perma blocking damage dealing DK's need to be neutered even more.
Keep abusing your abilities in Cyro. Its helping your cause , sooo much
Go play DK. Let's see how that turns out for you.
Just a troll... he did the same in the NB section
Troll BS,
DK and NB BOTH have plenty of ability's and need NERFs. Both of those classes are the sole reason changes are being made to pvp.
Then they come here and cry because they get nerfed . Pick a build and be dps or tank , but NO class should have both the ability to do mass damage AND survive equally as well. THATS why most are upset with the pvp.
Dont sugar coat it like DK and NB are SOOO bad and need buffs. They need nerfed plain and simple. Take it however you want to look at it but changes are coming and ZoS knows it will fail if they dont tone dk and nb down.
ever tried any of them? I highly doubt it.
Saddly for you, patch is coming next Monday so go cry somewhere else.Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique2 -
reiverx✭✭✭✭✭I was watching a sorc on Twitch on the EU server and they were excited about the 'New Petrify' that they are getting.
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Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I was watching a sorc on Twitch on the EU server and they were excited about the 'New Petrify' that they are getting.
I have a permablocker magsorc and I tell you, that skill completes my build
Combined with asylum S/B it will be a real threat. Stun enemies and proc fragsSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
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People don't run that build because it isn't particularly effective as a solo/small-scale build. I don't know what group sizes you run that build in, but at a certain number of people you can kind of run whatever you want and the class/build weaknesses can be compensated by the group. But once you reach a certain group size, assuming you want to add the most you can to the group make up, you need to start asking yourself do you bring anything to the table that another class can't do better.
My group size is usually my self and @Minno so two (And sometimes Makkir The Stormcaller will play with us when he isn't on console) so 3 people mostly and yes it most certainly is effective IF you know how to play it. Its not as easy as Sword and Board, but its far more powerful...i beat 2 EP max CP level Mag DK's last night in a 2v1 with that build....and both of those guys were using Sword and Board....yeah you can't just hold block all the time but you don't need to if you play it right.
with 24k Physical, 25k Spell Resist, 2.8k SD, 2100 Crit resist, 39kish max magicka, and 3000+ Mag recovery buffed, im not squishy by any means, and I can still Talon and control people without being killed while not blocking...I can perform the traditional tank DK role of control while dishing out very high damage and being pretty tanky... I can also heal very well, and even stack close to 20k worth of damage shields if i want to try and feel like a Sorc. Yes, im stuck with Mist form for mobility and I have to get close, but thats ok...Empowering Chains is a hidden gem for small group play, Ferious Leap is just money(i hit two guys in BG the other night for like 19k it was an instant kill Leap @Minno laughed hard about it)
So much potential for DK's if folks would just open their minds and drop Sword and Board...im actually set up to bypass block completely and layering 7-8 DOTS on another Mag DK while he holds block spamming Coagulating Blood and 1 second later back down to 20% health is beautiful...The synergy with Fire staff is ridic...a 100% increased chance for Ardent Flame to apply Burning as long as Destro Staff is equipped, Burning status was buffed like 100% in the amount of damage it does, having a Fire Staff ability slotted makes my Flame Lash hit 8% harder, if your willing to play risk and wear BSW you can pretty much always get.
Yes i give up 10% survivability for about a 70% increase in damage output its so worth it..and Destro+ Resto gives you options to flex slot things,Stack Shields, + Mist, Layer Mutagen, Blessing of Restoration, etc. your not going to tank 10 people, because you don't need to0...Your role in a 2-4 man group is to assit in control(Talons/Fossilize), and layer Dots and burn people as quick as possible and it does that role very well.
in order to play a Destro/Resto Pyromage MagDK in pvp you have to re-think what you think about how the class function...DK don't have to jsut be tanks...many new armor sets since One Tam have left the old Pyromancer set up from 1.x overlooked by many.
Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
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Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak1 -
necronyteub17_ESO wrote: »necronyteub17_ESO wrote: »Hope they keep up the good work. You leaping , perma blocking damage dealing DK's need to be neutered even more.
Keep abusing your abilities in Cyro. Its helping your cause , sooo much
Go play DK. Let's see how that turns out for you.
Just a troll... he did the same in the NB section
Troll BS,
DK and NB BOTH have plenty of ability's and need NERFs. Both of those classes are the sole reason changes are being made to pvp.
Then they come here and cry because they get nerfed . Pick a build and be dps or tank , but NO class should have both the ability to do mass damage AND survive equally as well. THATS why most are upset with the pvp.
Dont sugar coat it like DK and NB are SOOO bad and need buffs. They need nerfed plain and simple. Take it however you want to look at it but changes are coming and ZoS knows it will fail if they dont tone dk and nb down.
ever tried any of them? I highly doubt it.
Saddly for you, patch is coming next Monday so go cry somewhere else.
I have a max NB so shut up ***0