I really really hope you make more changes than the ones you've indicated so far. I'd love to be able to keep supporting ESO, but I can't see how I can do that if the game starts including these unethical and predatory crates. Lottery boxes can be done without being predatory! If they're going to be put in the game regardless of how many people tell you they don't want them, please do it in an ethical manner!ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hey guys! Thanks to everyone for taking part in testing Crown Crates. Tomorrow after our scheduled maintenance (which includes the PTS), Crown Crates will no longer be available for testing. If you have any Crown Crates in your inventory after the maintenance tomorrow, you will still be able to open them, but no new Crown Crates can be purchased. Additionally, when you run out of Crown Crates, the UI to open them will also no longer be accessible.
Just a reminder that we do plan on making some changes based on all the feedback we received, which you can read here, before Crown Crates are released later this year.
Edit: Also, just want to confirm that the email some of you received is legit.
Caius Drusus Imperial DK (DC) Bragg Ironhand Orc Temp (DC) Neesha Stalks-Shadows Argonian NB (EP) Falidir Altmer Sorcr (AD) J'zharka Khajiit NB (AD) |
Isabeau Runeseer Breton Sorc (DC) Fevassa Dunmer DK (EP) Manut Redguard Temp (AD) Tylera the Summoner Altmer Sorc (EP) Svari Snake-Blood Nord DK (AD) |
Ashlyn D'Elyse Breton NB (EP) Filindria Bosmer Temp (DC) Vigbjorn the Wanderer Nord Warden (EP) Hrokki Winterborn Breton Warden (DC) Basks-in-the-Sunshine Argonian Temp |
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hey guys! Thanks to everyone for taking part in testing Crown Crates. Tomorrow after our scheduled maintenance (which includes the PTS), Crown Crates will no longer be available for testing. If you have any Crown Crates in your inventory after the maintenance tomorrow, you will still be able to open them, but no new Crown Crates can be purchased. Additionally, when you run out of Crown Crates, the UI to open them will also no longer be accessible.
Just a reminder that we do plan on making some changes based on all the feedback we received, which you can read here, before Crown Crates are released later this year.
Edit: Also, just want to confirm that the email some of you received is legit.
lordrichter wrote: »JR_Returns wrote: »This system is designed to rip us off and it will go way out of control.
You may be correct about ripping us off but it could also be the standard White Elephant effect.
1. Come up with what looks on paper to be a great idea.
2. Roll it out and find it just doesn't work.
3. Tweak it and throw more money at it.
4. Rinse and repeat a few times.
5. You've now spent too much money and you can't to let it fail because you'll look a total tw*t.
6. Spend yet more money and get it sort of working.
7. Call it a sensational success whilst pushing it into a corner to be quietly forgotten.
At my age I've seen this sort of thing happen lots of times. Normally because people haven't got the guts to admit they've made a total f*** up and say stop.
I fear you may have just described the last 30 months of ESO...aheck1111_ESO wrote: »And so it begins. Not even a mention of the many concerns raised in this thread or the mega thread on General Discussion forum.
You expected otherwise?
Lottery boxes can be done without being predatory!
Lottery boxes can be done without being predatory!
Quoted for emphasis. Even with the extremely minor tweaks that have been proposed, these boxes are a literal scam. Even the sketchiest casinos in Vegas publish the odds to their games. That bar is so low it's practically painted on the floor, but the crown crates we've seen have no hope of reaching it.
Publish the drop rates or accept that ZOS is willfully scamming their customers out of their hard-earned money.
lordrichter wrote: »I suspect that the drop rates are going to be changing every couple of weeks as they "tune" it. No way they could keep up with that if they had to update tool tips.
lordrichter wrote: »I suspect that the drop rates are going to be changing every couple of weeks as they "tune" it. No way they could keep up with that if they had to update tool tips.
They are absolutely going to be doing this which is exactly why they need to publish the odds. What if a casino "tuned" the number of aces in their blackjack decks? What would we call those guys?
Scam artists or criminals, but around these parts it's called "electronic entertainment monetization" or whatever.
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hey guys! Thanks to everyone for taking part in testing Crown Crates. Tomorrow after our scheduled maintenance (which includes the PTS), Crown Crates will no longer be available for testing. If you have any Crown Crates in your inventory after the maintenance tomorrow, you will still be able to open them, but no new Crown Crates can be purchased. Additionally, when you run out of Crown Crates, the UI to open them will also no longer be accessible.
Just a reminder that we do plan on making some changes based on all the feedback we received, which you can read here, before Crown Crates are released later this year.
Edit: Also, just want to confirm that the email some of you received is legit.
silvereyes wrote: »Between how cheap the game has gotten and the addition of microtransactions with the scamboxes, I wouldn't be surprised if they go fully F2P with update 13.
Prepare to get popup ads every time you log in.
They did that once. I remember I was playing on PC and they had a text add. I went to the forums and people were furious.
silvereyes wrote: »I agree that it would have been nice to get the changes on PTS for testing this week, but they never promised they would be in this week. In fact, Matt F specifically expressed doubt in the reddit AMA that the changes would be on the PTS.AmberLaTerra wrote: »So yet another lie from you ZOS? All you did other then bring the consumables closer to P2W was graphical and voice changes. Non the promised drop rate changes, not the promised ability to turn in consumables for gems, and not the better in game recipes.
I can't really defend ZOS against anything with these scamboxes, but as a software developer myself, I will defend them against the general idea that they can make changes instantaneously. Gina just announced the planned changes last Friday. Implementing a trade-in system for gems, or even "just" tweaking drop rates, is something that will take a week or two at best. Not just for the development, but also for internal testing and probably about 2-3 levels of business-level manager approval, since this will affect the profitability of the crates.
It's unfortunate, but it's just the way it is. It's a shame they waited 2 weeks to introduce the crates on PTS. If they hadn't, there's a chance they would have had time for a round of major feedback-related changes. But as the situation stands, there just isn't any time.
WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »
I have once decided to not assume malice if ignorance or lack of thought is another valid explanation. But I have a hard time doing this here. I think they must have anticipated our feedback.Something I would like to know is why they didn't throw this idea out to us in a poll on the forums to get our thoughts before they even began working on it. This is a very large change in their marketing system of items to us, and it would have been nice if we could have given them our feelings before they even started it instead of when it makes its first PTS debut
Consequence means walking even the wrong track to the bitter end.But isn't it disconcerting that the one change they had in the chamber ready to pull the trigger on was increasing the strength of the consumables, a change that inches closer to P2W? Shows their commitment to this travesty.
Seriously, I think they are planning that "Housing" will be the thing that gets people to buy Crown Crates.
Housing. I bet that will be great on the pts too. Then it will be sliced up and put into rng box system as well.
Has it been confirmed that housing will be linked to the gambling crates? I'm still hoping it will be made available as an ingame gold sink.
I really want to like this company. I feel a bit like I'm struggling with Stockholm Syndrome here. I'm emotional about that, and I'm on the autistic spectrum, and the emotions that I feel are not the fuzzy good kind of emotions that I used to associate with ESO six months ago.but please, ZOS, you're scaring the s**t out of me with how you respond your your player base. It's sad that I continue to pay despite how you treat us, but I guess that's my problem.
Gina Bruno wrote:Just a reminder that we do plan on making some changes based on all the feedback we received, which you can read here, before Crown Crates are released later this year.
The sad fact is that they *will* be implemented on live. I'd love to fantasize that ZOS will see all the negative feedback and scrap the whole idea, but it's not going to happen.
However, I suspect we won't see them again until they are on live server with slight improvements. Very slight. They will reassure us that they are much improved though. I can't believe ZOS is going here.
At the very beginning, crown store messages were displayed ingame as system messages. You know, the ones reserved for important info like servers going down. The ones we shouldn't be conditioned to ignore because they suddenly turn into marketing spam.likelolwhat wrote: »WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »
Wait what?! When was this? O______o
likelolwhat wrote: »Wait what?! When was this? O______o
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone, here’s where we are with Crown Crates:
We put systems on the PTS for player feedback for a reason – we have sifted (and continue to analyze) your feedback on Crown Crates, and as such, we’re going to make at least the following changes to the system before it goes live later this year:We may well find other changes we want to make as well, and will let everyone know what we have done when this initial round of changes are in and can test them internally.
- We are working to change the way the system works to ensure that you get higher tiered items more often.
- We will allow you to convert unwanted Crown Crate consumables into Crown Gems. This way, you won’t be stuck with consumables you may not want, and you will also have more Gems to purchase the items that you do want.
- We will also take another look at Crown Crate potions, food, XP scrolls, etc. with an eye towards boosting their effectiveness and/or duration. This may entail us adding new recipes to allow crafters to make similar items.
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone, here’s where we are with Crown Crates:
We put systems on the PTS for player feedback for a reason – we have sifted (and continue to analyze) your feedback on Crown Crates, and as such, we’re going to make at least the following changes to the system before it goes live later this year:We may well find other changes we want to make as well, and will let everyone know what we have done when this initial round of changes are in and can test them internally.
- We are working to change the way the system works to ensure that you get higher tiered items more often.
- We will allow you to convert unwanted Crown Crate consumables into Crown Gems. This way, you won’t be stuck with consumables you may not want, and you will also have more Gems to purchase the items that you do want.
- We will also take another look at Crown Crate potions, food, XP scrolls, etc. with an eye towards boosting their effectiveness and/or duration. This may entail us adding new recipes to allow crafters to make similar items.
The second is that the gems you get from converted cards must be at least half of what it is listed for in the store. So a card that costs 16 gems must be convertable to 8 gems. A card that costs 100 gems must be redeemable for at least 50 gems. That way, when you get a card you don't want, but want a card of similar rarity, you at least got half of that card. And that is almost palatable.
VERY slippery slope. If you make it like the ambrosia with rare materials players will have to work hard to get... as opposed to how it is now when every provisioner can make the best food with easy to get ingredients.
Maybe just make the crown ones similar to the crafted ones but please don`t add a system and recipes that have a single purpose: to make the crown ones more desirable vs crafted ones, nobody wants that. Foods/drinks are like a permanent buff now, don`t make them harder to make, everyone likes them easily available, gathering herbs is hard enough.
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone, here’s where we are with Crown Crates:
We put systems on the PTS for player feedback for a reason – we have sifted (and continue to analyze) your feedback on Crown Crates, and as such, we’re going to make at least the following changes to the system before it goes live later this year:We may well find other changes we want to make as well, and will let everyone know what we have done when this initial round of changes are in and can test them internally.
- We are working to change the way the system works to ensure that you get higher tiered items more often.
- We will allow you to convert unwanted Crown Crate consumables into Crown Gems. This way, you won’t be stuck with consumables you may not want, and you will also have more Gems to purchase the items that you do want.
- We will also take another look at Crown Crate potions, food, XP scrolls, etc. with an eye towards boosting their effectiveness and/or duration. This may entail us adding new recipes to allow crafters to make similar items.
The second is that the gems you get from converted cards must be at least half of what it is listed for in the store. So a card that costs 16 gems must be convertable to 8 gems. A card that costs 100 gems must be redeemable for at least 50 gems. That way, when you get a card you don't want, but want a card of similar rarity, you at least got half of that card. And that is almost palatable.
More like the full price... why cheat people into getting the same thing 10 times and only getting 50% or less for it...
I think what most want is to never have to pay more than say 5.000 crowns for a mount. Ever. Makes sense considering a DLC is much less.
Also maybe no exclusive items? Crates should be OPTIONAL as in you can just buy the stuff, forcing people like me who will buy a mount but will never ever touch the crates unless i find it reasonably priced(aka a mount is never more than 4-5k) to use the crates will only result in people leaving the game.
Gambling should be left for casinos not dressed up all nice and made to look harmless.
lordrichter wrote: »VERY slippery slope. If you make it like the ambrosia with rare materials players will have to work hard to get... as opposed to how it is now when every provisioner can make the best food with easy to get ingredients.
Maybe just make the crown ones similar to the crafted ones but please don`t add a system and recipes that have a single purpose: to make the crown ones more desirable vs crafted ones, nobody wants that. Foods/drinks are like a permanent buff now, don`t make them harder to make, everyone likes them easily available, gathering herbs is hard enough.
Since the Bethesda marketing person only joined the party this year, I have to wonder what she thinks of this "crafted is better" theory. I have to wonder if her advice to ZOS is that the Crown Store will never work as long as they insist on doing that. That, in turn, makes me wonder how much such an opinion from Bethesda will erode the gap until the crafted is only better when looked at from the right angle, under the right light, so that we can fool ourselves into thinking it is better. Meanwhile, Bethesda Marketing has won the war and is now free to monetize the game as necessary with attractive, and better, items in the store.
It is all part of the thought that I have regarding who made these Crown Crates. I lump it under "ZOS", but really, I have to wonder if all the Crown Store stuff is funded by Bethesda separately. It might be funded from Bethesda's marketing budget and ZOS really has little to do with it aside from technical implementation, if even that. Bethesda certainly has access to talent of their own that can work on stuff like this. It would explain why even Firor sounds like he is just reading off a spec sheet when he talks about Crown Crates, and why Crown Crates have so much more polish and finish than what ZOS normally does.
WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »likelolwhat wrote: »Wait what?! When was this? O______o
@likelolwhat That was when they released the limited-time leopard senche (the first time). 'We don't want anyone to miss the limited time offer!' was the reason given. -_- And as @Rosveen mentioned, yes they used the system shutdown messaging system to spam us.
WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »likelolwhat wrote: »Wait what?! When was this? O______o
@likelolwhat That was when they released the limited-time leopard senche (the first time). 'We don't want anyone to miss the limited time offer!' was the reason given. -_- And as @Rosveen mentioned, yes they used the system shutdown messaging system to spam us.
They also felt that using the server messaging was the appropriate way to inform us it was national pet day.
WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »likelolwhat wrote: »Wait what?! When was this? O______o
@likelolwhat That was when they released the limited-time leopard senche (the first time). 'We don't want anyone to miss the limited time offer!' was the reason given. -_- And as @Rosveen mentioned, yes they used the system shutdown messaging system to spam us.
They also felt that using the server messaging was the appropriate way to inform us it was national pet day.