Official Discussion Thread for Crown Crates

S'yn

In short, the concept of crown crates is OK, but you get WAY too many crown consumable items and the gem conversion is abysmal. I'm all for having tons of cosmetic items in the crown store, don't get me wrong. The possibility of spending 400 crowns on a crate and rolling the dice and wing a 5000 crown mount is appealing, BUT, none of the crown crate items should be exclusively available via dumb luck and RNG. I would rather spend 3000 crowns and buy the mount I want then spent 12000 crowns and just have people tell me "you're just unlucky... BS!"

I get that you want revenue for your game- no one blames you for that, but making crate items exclusive will frost many people and even make some walk. This does not help you. Get rid of gems. Make unwanted items from crates refundable in crowns. No one needs 2 tiers of real money currency, one is plenty- simplify. Create 2 paths to crown store items: direct purchase with crowns OR crate gambling. Why do this you ask? This gives everyone the option to skip frustration or roll the dice as THEY see fit, everyone can make sure they get what they want (happy customer base keeps people playing and paying), people who enjoy gambling still get the thrill of "being lucky" and get to brag they got the same 3000 crown mount for 400 crowns.... Which might convince a non-member to try your crate system.

If you want to succeed in generating revenue, listen to your customers. Your game survives not on our short term investment, but our long term commitment and how we praise/bash your products to our friends. Just something to think on, since you asked for feedback.

MornaBaine

S'yn wrote: »

In short, the concept of crown crates is OK, but you get WAY too many crown consumable items and the gem conversion is abysmal. I'm all for having tons of cosmetic items in the crown store, don't get me wrong. The possibility of spending 400 crowns on a crate and rolling the dice and wing a 5000 crown mount is appealing, BUT, none of the crown crate items should be exclusively available via dumb luck and RNG. I would rather spend 3000 crowns and buy the mount I want then spent 12000 crowns and just have people tell me "you're just unlucky... BS!"

I get that you want revenue for your game- no one blames you for that, but making crate items exclusive will frost many people and even make some walk. This does not help you. Get rid of gems. Make unwanted items from crates refundable in crowns. No one needs 2 tiers of real money currency, one is plenty- simplify. Create 2 paths to crown store items: direct purchase with crowns OR crate gambling. Why do this you ask? This gives everyone the option to skip frustration or roll the dice as THEY see fit, everyone can make sure they get what they want (happy customer base keeps people playing and paying), people who enjoy gambling still get the thrill of "being lucky" and get to brag they got the same 3000 crown mount for 400 crowns.... Which might convince a non-member to try your crate system.

If you want to succeed in generating revenue, listen to your customers. Your game survives not on our short term investment, but our long term commitment and how we praise/bash your products to our friends. Just something to think on, since you asked for feedback.

This right here. I no longer recommend this game to friends and I won't be buying copies as Xmas gifts this year, which I had originally planned on. Zeni, do what this very smart person suggests and that will change.

Phinix1

Danikat wrote: »

I think they're a terrible idea and I was extremely disappointed to hear they would be added to the game.

Items like these prey on gullible individuals, forcing them to spend far more than they would for a straight-forward sale because they hear rumors that a friend of a friend's sisters boyfriends cousin got an amazing item on the first try. Or more likely because there is simply no other way to obtain items they want. Typically the drop rates on anything which is worth having are extremely poor which results in some people spending hundreds of dollars (or equivalent in other currencies) and being left with nothing of use.

I'm going to test the drop rates as soon as my game has updated and will report back on them to make other players aware.

Once they're off the PTS and onto the live game I will not buy them. I accept this means I will miss out on many special items, likely all of the best mounts and skins, but I'd rather not waste my money or encourage this kind of item which takes advantage of players instead of offering a fair sale.

AMEN.

ZOS should be ashamed of themselves for throwing the game down this drain and I sincerely hope the idea costs the greedy suits responsible dearly.

Asmoloma

So I spent 5k crowns yesterday on crates and find it to be a total ripoff.

It's just TOO DAMNED EXPENSIVE. We're talking roughly $3-$4 per play (400 Crowns). I don't mind the gambling aspect of it, but chrissakes, give the kids a break! $4 of RL money is too damned high!

I did win a mount (Palomino), which was the high point of the experience. Plus several cosmetic features and a boatload of consumables, all of which would amount to maybe 30 gems if I converted them, which amounts to squat. That means if I were weak willed, and REALLY had to have the mount I could potentially blow hundreds of dollars trying to get one. That is wrong on so many levels.

The concept of a mini game where you gamble with a Khajit is pretty cool, and I enjoy the animation and commentary.
Make it an option to use in-game gold to gamble with a Khajit for in-game items and you have my full support, as there is role-play value, and no potential for abusing people who don't know any better.

I just feel like the current pricing takes advantage of people with poor impulse control, or addiction/ gambling issues. Not to lecture, but If you feel that it's worth $300 to ride around on a flashy mount in a video game, you may want to reconsider your priorities. I guess my point is, you should not have to pay big RL dollars to gamble for in-game items.

Whoever determines the cost of Crown Store items is taking advantage of people. Plain and simple.

I'm a premium member, so I get crowns along with my subscription. I chose to gamble those crowns as an experiment, and lost... fine. I'm an adult and I made the decision to gamble. What grinds my gears is the thought of some kids getting hooked on the Crown Crates because they want an Atronach mount, and blowing hundreds of dollars. Dangerous territory.

If ZOS has to resort to shady practices in order to generate revenue, then I will have to re-think whether or not I want to continue to support them.

It's an effing game... make it fun and of value!

STREET_BLAZER

Asmoloma wrote: »

So I spent 5k crowns yesterday on crates and find it to be a total ripoff.

It's just TOO DAMNED EXPENSIVE. We're talking roughly $3-$4 per play (400 Crowns). I don't mind the gambling aspect of it, but chrissakes, give the kids a break! $4 of RL money is too damned high!

I did win a mount (Palomino), which was the high point of the experience. Plus several cosmetic features and a boatload of consumables, all of which would amount to maybe 30 gems if I converted them, which amounts to squat. That means if I were weak willed, and REALLY had to have the mount I could potentially blow hundreds of dollars trying to get one. That is wrong on so many levels.

The concept of a mini game where you gamble with a Khajit is pretty cool, and I enjoy the animation and commentary.
Make it an option to use in-game gold to gamble with a Khajit for in-game items and you have my full support, as there is role-play value, and no potential for abusing people who don't know any better.

I just feel like the current pricing takes advantage of people with poor impulse control, or addiction/ gambling issues. Not to lecture, but If you feel that it's worth $300 to ride around on a flashy mount in a video game, you may want to reconsider your priorities. I guess my point is, you should not have to pay big RL dollars to gamble for in-game items.

Whoever determines the cost of Crown Store items is taking advantage of people. Plain and simple.

I'm a premium member, so I get crowns along with my subscription. I chose to gamble those crowns as an experiment, and lost... fine. I'm an adult and I made the decision to gamble. What grinds my gears is the thought of some kids getting hooked on the Crown Crates because they want an Atronach mount, and blowing hundreds of dollars. Dangerous territory.

If ZOS has to resort to shady practices in order to generate revenue, then I will have to re-think whether or not I want to continue to support them.

It's an effing game... make it fun and of value!

Yeah I totally agree, this is why I got rid off ESO. I can't stand this kind of business practice.

austinwalter87ub17_ESO

Crown Crates are straight up priced way to high. Yes you can get good stuff from them. But what people want from them is usually the mounts.

I don't care for the mounts that much to spend that much real life gold on a small chance.

SydneyGrey

Since someone else bumped this thread, I thought I'd add my two cents.

I bought several crates (I didn't count how many). I hate that only the consumables can be traded for gems. There were a few things in there I thought were ugly and that I hated, but I couldn't trade them for gems, and now they're stuck in my game permanently. (This was not on the PTS.) PLEASE let us trade anything we want for gems, not just the consumables. I hate that those ugly things are cluttering up my Collections folder.

It would also encourage more people to buy Crates, because they'd be getting a better deal. Thanks.

RAMdisk

My God! People buying these crapshoot-boxes must be beyond educational reach.

MornaBaine

SydneyGrey wrote: »

Since someone else bumped this thread, I thought I'd add my two cents.

I bought several crates (I didn't count how many). I hate that only the consumables can be traded for gems. There were a few things in there I thought were ugly and that I hated, but I couldn't trade them for gems, and now they're stuck in my game permanently. (This was not on the PTS.) PLEASE let us trade anything we want for gems, not just the consumables. I hate that those ugly things are cluttering up my Collections folder.

It would also encourage more people to buy Crates, because they'd be getting a better deal. Thanks.

The ONLY thing that could do to make the gamble boxes "worth it" in my opinion is exactly this.

silvereyes

MornaBaine wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

Since someone else bumped this thread, I thought I'd add my two cents.

I bought several crates (I didn't count how many). I hate that only the consumables can be traded for gems. There were a few things in there I thought were ugly and that I hated, but I couldn't trade them for gems, and now they're stuck in my game permanently. (This was not on the PTS.) PLEASE let us trade anything we want for gems, not just the consumables. I hate that those ugly things are cluttering up my Collections folder.

It would also encourage more people to buy Crates, because they'd be getting a better deal. Thanks.

The ONLY thing that could do to make the gamble boxes "worth it" in my opinion is exactly this.

Yeah, that's been suggested multiple times. The problem for ZOS is that it reduces the worst-case scenario for someone going after a specific item to "only" about 8-9k crowns. That defeats the whole point of the crates, which is to nab those occasional rich folks that will sink hundreds of dollars into the crates to get the one thing they want.

JKorr

New season of crates is coming; Wild Hunt.

Unless a lot of the not themed items remain the same, people are going to be accumulating more junk they don't want and can't get rid of from the new crates because the new items were never for outright sale and no one has them in their collection.

Although I know its totally idiotic, I'm holding onto a little bit of hope that the saber cat mounts and cubs won't be clown crate only.

I would find the clown crates slightly less objectionable if the non themed items were offered for outright sale when the clown crate season ends. People who want to gamble and get things early could; people who want to buy a specific item at a set price could wait and do that. But it won't happen.

Elsonso

MornaBaine wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

Since someone else bumped this thread, I thought I'd add my two cents.

I bought several crates (I didn't count how many). I hate that only the consumables can be traded for gems. There were a few things in there I thought were ugly and that I hated, but I couldn't trade them for gems, and now they're stuck in my game permanently. (This was not on the PTS.) PLEASE let us trade anything we want for gems, not just the consumables. I hate that those ugly things are cluttering up my Collections folder.

It would also encourage more people to buy Crates, because they'd be getting a better deal. Thanks.

The ONLY thing that could do to make the gamble boxes "worth it" in my opinion is exactly this.

To me, the downside of just having them in the game, no matter what they contain or how many Gems we can get, completely eclipses everything else.

MornaBaine

lordrichter wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

Since someone else bumped this thread, I thought I'd add my two cents.

I bought several crates (I didn't count how many). I hate that only the consumables can be traded for gems. There were a few things in there I thought were ugly and that I hated, but I couldn't trade them for gems, and now they're stuck in my game permanently. (This was not on the PTS.) PLEASE let us trade anything we want for gems, not just the consumables. I hate that those ugly things are cluttering up my Collections folder.

It would also encourage more people to buy Crates, because they'd be getting a better deal. Thanks.

The ONLY thing that could do to make the gamble boxes "worth it" in my opinion is exactly this.

To me, the downside of just having them in the game, no matter what they contain or how many Gems we can get, completely eclipses everything else.

We are in complete agreement there. I still regard them as a cancer in this game and wish they'd go away.

Inerar

When Sanguine's Black Goat added to crown crates? I just saw that!

Digfox

Hi All, new PC player here. Bought the game in the recent 50% off sale. Generally really enjoying the game and bought a 3-month ESO+ sub off the bat.

I wanted to leave my experience of the Crown Crates tho, becuase it's not good.

• I decided the use the 4,500 + 500 (initial new player) crowns on a 15 crate pack. This resulted in 1 legendary reward (100 gems) and that was it. I received 2 hands that had an extra fifth card. I scrapped everything and ended up with 63 gems.
• So not happy with this I decided I wanted another shot. After realising you can't top up subs (my bad) I bought a 5,500 crown pack and again spent 5,000 on a 15 crate pack. This time no Legendary rewards and only one hand that resulted in an extra card. After scrapping everything I could I'm up to 167 gems.

So after 30 crates I have had one legendary reward, no Apex rewards and consumables. I did get the Golden Eye Guar mount, some outfits and a few pets. Given some of the best cosmetic items in the game are gated behind this service it's left me feeling slightly negative about the game. I don't want to spend another £48-72 just to guarantee enough gems to get a cool mount.

I know this isn't exceptional and the reality of modern online game business models but I think the 'loot crate' system is too harsh in it's current configuration. Ideally you should receive more gems to earn the items you want. I also think that a fairer crate system might encourage further spending. Had I won an Apex mount, I'm likely to feel happier to spend more trying to get some of the others. As it stands as much as my luck may be bad, it's left an ill taste.

I doubt I saying anything new, but fwiw.

Elsonso

Digfox wrote: »

Hi All, new PC player here. Bought the game in the recent 50% off sale. Generally really enjoying the game and bought a 3-month ESO+ sub off the bat.

Hey! Welcome to the game!

For the record, this is where you made your mistake:

Digfox wrote: »

• So not happy with this I decided I wanted another shot.

The Gems were added in because early impressions from players (before the Crates were released) indicated a distinct lack of excitement, which differed from the warm fuzzies shared by the development team and marketing. After what I am sure were several days of intense internal meetings, consultations, and meditation to understand what went wrong, they came up with Gems. These are really the most valuable thing in the Crates because they offer the freedom to buy what you want.

Or, at least, that is my story and I am sticking to it!

Digfox

lordrichter wrote: »

Hey! Welcome to the game!

For the record, this is where you made your mistake:

Thank you, and yep I know...a sucker for punishment

lordrichter wrote: »

The Gems were added in because early impressions from players (before the Crates were released) indicated a distinct lack of excitement, which differed from the warm fuzzies shared by the development team and marketing. After what I am sure were several days of intense internal meetings, consultations, and meditation to understand what went wrong, they came up with Gems. These are really the most valuable thing in the Crates because they offer the freedom to buy what you want

Tbf the system isn't different to other games with the same systems. Overwatch has the same system with credits for dupes from their loot boxes.

JimT722

Digfox wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Hey! Welcome to the game!

For the record, this is where you made your mistake:

Thank you, and yep I know...a sucker for punishment

lordrichter wrote: »

The Gems were added in because early impressions from players (before the Crates were released) indicated a distinct lack of excitement, which differed from the warm fuzzies shared by the development team and marketing. After what I am sure were several days of intense internal meetings, consultations, and meditation to understand what went wrong, they came up with Gems. These are really the most valuable thing in the Crates because they offer the freedom to buy what you want

Tbf the system isn't different to other games with the same systems. Overwatch has the same system with credits for dupes from their loot boxes.

The difference is the boxes in overwatch can be earned by playing. I liked how everything in the crown store was obtainable for a set price. If there is something I want, I know the price and can determine if it's worth it. These gamble boxes suck but are here to stay regardless.

Digfox

JimT722 wrote: »

The difference is the boxes in overwatch can be earned by playing. I liked how everything in the crown store was obtainable for a set price. If there is something I want, I know the price and can determine if it's worth it. These gamble boxes suck but are here to stay regardless.

I was specifically referring to how in Overwatch Loot Boxes become credits when you receive a duplicate, and similarity with other loot crate systems in games.

That said you are right of course. Although in Overwatch that loot crate is the entirety of the player progression system. Obviously TESO has a wealth of unlockables which can be earned in-game or via cash shop purchases. And of course that in-game progression rate at which you earn loot boxes in Overwatch gets very slow, very fast.

bluemanjoe_ESO

JimT722 wrote: »

Digfox wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Hey! Welcome to the game!

For the record, this is where you made your mistake:

Thank you, and yep I know...a sucker for punishment

lordrichter wrote: »

The Gems were added in because early impressions from players (before the Crates were released) indicated a distinct lack of excitement, which differed from the warm fuzzies shared by the development team and marketing. After what I am sure were several days of intense internal meetings, consultations, and meditation to understand what went wrong, they came up with Gems. These are really the most valuable thing in the Crates because they offer the freedom to buy what you want

Tbf the system isn't different to other games with the same systems. Overwatch has the same system with credits for dupes from their loot boxes.

The difference is the boxes in overwatch can be earned by playing. I liked how everything in the crown store was obtainable for a set price. If there is something I want, I know the price and can determine if it's worth it. These gamble boxes suck but are here to stay regardless.

would you buy an apex mount for 10-15k? because that's how much it would have to be priced at or more compared to how much people are spending on them now. People would complain it's a rip off. Why would they put a set price for people to complain even more about, when they can do crates and make a ton more money.

MornaBaine

bluemanjoe_ESO wrote: »

JimT722 wrote: »

Digfox wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Hey! Welcome to the game!

For the record, this is where you made your mistake:

Thank you, and yep I know...a sucker for punishment

lordrichter wrote: »

The Gems were added in because early impressions from players (before the Crates were released) indicated a distinct lack of excitement, which differed from the warm fuzzies shared by the development team and marketing. After what I am sure were several days of intense internal meetings, consultations, and meditation to understand what went wrong, they came up with Gems. These are really the most valuable thing in the Crates because they offer the freedom to buy what you want

Tbf the system isn't different to other games with the same systems. Overwatch has the same system with credits for dupes from their loot boxes.

The difference is the boxes in overwatch can be earned by playing. I liked how everything in the crown store was obtainable for a set price. If there is something I want, I know the price and can determine if it's worth it. These gamble boxes suck but are here to stay regardless.

would you buy an apex mount for 10-15k? because that's how much it would have to be priced at or more compared to how much people are spending on them now. People would complain it's a rip off. Why would they put a set price for people to complain even more about, when they can do crates and make a ton more money.

The fact that this may be true and that it has become an industry standard to engage in predatory practices rather than just working hard to put out a solid product that consumers are HAPPY to pay for is extremely disheartening.

ZurinArctus

I find it harder to support ZOS.

What they're producing and how they're marketing these assets is abysmal and does not sit well with me.

For the first time I am thinking of ending my ESO sub and calling it.

silvereyes

My stance on the crates has softened a bit after seeing how many people actually seem to like them. I don't get it, personally, and I have also seen the stories of the folks that get b**** slapped by RNG, which is sad. I still think the crates are overall bad for the game and come with a ton of baggage.

But I've also seen very smart folks who are good at math and whom I greatly respect go absolutely bonkers over these. They love throwing a ton of money at them and getting a ton of stuff in return. They love the emotional surprise of seeing what it is they are going to get. They aren't generally rich irl, but they work hard and play hard.

So at this point, I'm willing to tolerate them in the game ... *IF* one big change is made.

Make the collectible drops refundable for gems. It makes the worst-case scenario more reasonable for someone that only wants that "one" specific thing in the crates.

The folks that love getting all the things will still spend a lot of money. The folks that think most of the collectibles are trash will be able to "vendor" them and - even if they have terrible luck - will end up happier in the end to only have to spend 8-10k crowns instead of 36k or whatever the ungodly high worst-case is right now. Plus their collections tab won't be cluttered with trash.

Adamus

Opened 30-40 crates... No Mounts... Guess who's never buying another crate ever.

silvereyes

BertMoTron wrote: »

Opened 30-40 crates... No Mounts... Guess who's never buying another crate ever.

Ouch, sorry! That's some really rough luck.

SydneyGrey

BertMoTron wrote: »

Opened 30-40 crates... No Mounts... Guess who's never buying another crate ever.

I opened over a hundred crates. The only mount I got was the plain guar mount (not the Wild Hunt one), and I got him twice. No apex mounts at all, for all that money. That doesn't make me want to buy crates any more, either. I ended up spending gems for one apex mount (the horse), and a couple of the non-apex mounts. I wasn't too happy. That does not make me a fan of the crown crates.

I've seen many other people who have had better luck, so I really can't imagine why my luck was THAT bad. Argh. I'm not complaining, but I'm just saying the low chances makes me not want to buy any more. The only reason I even spent that much was because 1) I had crowns from my subscription, and 2) I'd had good luck with the storm atronach crates, which made me want to buy the wild hunt ones.

Yeah, when they make the chances of getting an apex super low, it just frustrates people into not wanting to buy any more.

I really hope that talking about this doesn't open me up to being bullied. Bullies, please take your trolling elsewhere.

MrSaxon

Bought eight crates and got a few okay things - two non-combat pets, two costumes, some weird mementos - but mainly poisons and consumables I'll never use. Got to admit that the mounts are pretty darned nice but it looks like I'm not going to be lucky enough to grab one. I'm happy to stop at eight crates because I think I'll hate myself if I spend more money on these and end up walking away with nothing.

Attica-Centurius

One general feedback idea popped in my mind:
This might have already been suggested but I'm not reading through 36 pages of feedback.

Wouldn't it be an idea to include unavailable/crown-only houses as crown crate only Apex rewards?
A house is perhaps something less wanted then an amazing looking mount but still quite an awesome thing to get. So I think it would even be better accepted if they were crown crate only (not able to buy it from gems) in comparison to the crown crate only mounts, which seem to attract a lot of negative attention.
If the decision has been made to keep crown crate only rewards in the crown crate system adding items to crown crate only rewards might also reduce the negativity surrounding it. Being able to (not) get only 3 items makes those items very wanted and not getting one quickly turns into a negative attitude towards crates. If one would be able to acquire a (or three) house(s) as well it would sooth the people who didn't get one of the other amazing things. (And then people get positive about crown crate only rewards and hence buy extra crates )
I think this would be a way to sell a decent amount of crown crates, because people who missed out on the initial house would be inclined on buying crates since no other way of acquiring the house is present and this could be a way to get an amazing house for just 400 crowns (if the cards are right).

This could also work with the hard-to-get motifs (if they aren't bound on pickup) or other things. But I'll leave that to @ZOS_RichLambert (aka be creative with it ).

MornaBaine

SydneyGrey wrote: »

BertMoTron wrote: »

Opened 30-40 crates... No Mounts... Guess who's never buying another crate ever.

I opened over a hundred crates. The only mount I got was the plain guar mount (not the Wild Hunt one), and I got him twice. No apex mounts at all, for all that money. That doesn't make me want to buy crates any more, either. I ended up spending gems for one apex mount (the horse), and a couple of the non-apex mounts. I wasn't too happy. That does not make me a fan of the crown crates.

I've seen many other people who have had better luck, so I really can't imagine why my luck was THAT bad. Argh. I'm not complaining, but I'm just saying the low chances makes me not want to buy any more. The only reason I even spent that much was because 1) I had crowns from my subscription, and 2) I'd had good luck with the storm atronach crates, which made me want to buy the wild hunt ones.

Yeah, when they make the chances of getting an apex super low, it just frustrates people into not wanting to buy any more.

I really hope that talking about this doesn't open me up to being bullied. Bullies, please take your trolling elsewhere.

Whereas I, who have bought less than a dozen crates not counting the free ones I've received... have a Storm Atronach Senche mount and a Wild Hunt Senche Mount. Neither of which I actually wanted. What I DO want are better more realistic horses that I can buy straight out. But it seems no RNG in the world is going to get that out of ZOS for me. I do wish we could trade in ANYTHING we don't want for the gems. That is the ONE thing that might induce me to buy more crates. As it stands though? Nope.