Which difficulty should the dungeons in Update 12 have?

Asardes · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

I had completed all normal dungeons and all non-DLC veteran ones save VCoA by VR2, in level 44 green gear. The latter I finally completed at VR4 in VR3 blue gear; this was long before they nerfed it. I continued using the same gear up to VR16, with dungeons scaling accordingly. This is my 1st MMO and I had been playing for less than 2 months by the time I hit vet ranks. Today, with good gear and max CP they are really cakewalks, I don't even bother boosting my health to run them, unless I run as a DD/Tank hybrid in medium and I need that extra boost to compensate for the lack of passives and tri-glyphs on my heavy armor. Most runs are in the 10-15 minutes time range and I seldom die. That says a lot about the difficulty.

Make veteran dungeons veteran again!

WuffyCerulei · September 2016

Difficulty between base game and DLC dungeons

Apherius wrote: »

wolfninja101b14_ESO wrote: »

so like vet City of Ash.

like City of ash before nerfs ? or now ? because now ... sorry but i don't find the difficulty you can do this dungeon at 2 man !

Are you one of those extreme hard-core PVEers? Hell if you find vWGT or vICP easy, then vCOA is a cake walk for ya. However, like most of us, we aren't hard-core PVEers but do like a challenge. vCoA is one of those.

Asardes · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

All 3 dungeons were nerfed at DB update if I recall correctly, in terms of boss health at least, but the mechanics are still there. Not much but enough that you can finish them with low CP and lackluster gear - was possible even before, as I said in the previous comment - provided that you abide by the mechanics: tank the adds away from Ash Titan and don't overlap circles, block Skoria's attacks and break free when he CCs you, use grenades on zombies at Ibomez and prioritize atronachs, watch the portals at Warden, rotate fast on the pinion at Inhibitor, place yourself correctly and block the lightning waves in Kenna etc. The difficulty in all dungeons is really the mechanics, not DPS checks. You don't have to be "hardcore". Just think a bit and discuss strategy with the others. If you don't get it by simply seeing where you failed go to youtube and watch the videos. Those dungeons are old and there are plenty of guides, with detailed explanations. It's better to look there for 20 minutes than wipe at the same boss for an hour repeating the same obvious mistakes.

RoyJade · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

@The-Baconator
I think you missed a point. There will not be a vet version of Arx Corinium, 4 tier dungeon and 5 tier dungeon, with a new story. All dungeons with two stories will now be separated, and each dungeons in the game can be done in normal mode and vet mode like DLC dungeons. That's mean you can do Spindleclutch first story (with the Whisperer) in vet mode, and City of Ash second story (Valkyn Skoria) in normal mode.
We don' have 16 normal dungeons, 8 vet dungeons and 4 dlc dungeons with two difficulties anymore, but 22 dungeons + 4 dlc, all with two difficulties. And this thread ask what we expect for the normal version and the vet version of the difficulty.

IMO, normal version should be the same at what we know now, with perhaps a little tweak on actual "vet" dungeon (especially vCoA and vCoH, who can be hard for a group who already have troubles on vWayrest sewer). Like that, everyone may be able to do all the dungeons in the game, exactly as they can now do all the raid pretty easily. The most important point is that now, you'll get in normal dungeon exactly the same thing than you get in vet, only the number of reward change.
For people who are looking for a real challenge, with sophisticated strats and dangerous mechanisms, the vet version (including dungeons such Spindle, Banished or Fungal) should be on par with DLC dungeon in veteran.

Destruent · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Why do people even want a second easy-mode version of the dungeons? I think they will make a hard version and an easy-version. The easy version is the one we have now, the harder one will be harder and i think the difficulty will be somewhere around vWGT....vCoS.
That's also fair for everyone, those who want a slight challenge can do the harder version, those who don't can just do the easier version. You get the same key for all dailys, just more for higher difficulty.

Wolfchild07 · September 2016

other

ALL dungeons should come in 4 difficulty modes.

Easy - green monster sets

Medium - blue monster sets

Hard - purple monster sets

Nightmare - gold monster sets

Asardes · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

They should also adds pompous new titles for the normal dungeons done on hard mode, like
"Snowdrift Savvy" for Direfrost Keep
"Pirate den challenger" for Blackheart Haven
"Goblin Overlord" for Fungal Grotto
"Rat'n'rabble destroyer" for Wayrest Sewers

sebban · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

As base game. Not sure why people demand harder and harder content, games are meant to be fun not infuriating. You want a challenge? Go play outside

Hard content is fun. Easy content is boring.

RoyJade · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Wolfchild07 wrote: »

ALL dungeons should come in 4 difficulty modes.

Easy - green monster sets

Medium - blue monster sets

Hard - purple monster sets

Nightmare - gold monster sets

Except for the gold one, there is no difference between these loot. A level difference or a drop rate difference should work, also a different trait panel. With your suggestion, the reward is not high enough between easy and hard.
I hope that normal dungeon will drop monster mask 160cp with all trait available at 100% or nearly that drop rate, when vet one give us these mask with only a few good traits (no reinforced, training, prosperous, nirn, well fitted or sturdy, only divine for dps, infused for tank/pvp and impen for pvp).

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

sebban wrote: »

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

As base game. Not sure why people demand harder and harder content, games are meant to be fun not infuriating. You want a challenge? Go play outside

Hard content is fun. Easy content is boring.

To you.

Destruent · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

sebban wrote: »

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

As base game. Not sure why people demand harder and harder content, games are meant to be fun not infuriating. You want a challenge? Go play outside

Hard content is fun. Easy content is boring.

To you.

Yep, and bc of this there will be 2 different difficulties. Easy for people like you, hard for people like @sebban and me. Just accept that not all the content is for you, just like i have to do it. Some dungeons are too easy to have fun with them, some are too hard. Not a big deal imo, everyone needs fun-content

edit: linked wrong person

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

Destruent wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

sebban wrote: »

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

As base game. Not sure why people demand harder and harder content, games are meant to be fun not infuriating. You want a challenge? Go play outside

Hard content is fun. Easy content is boring.

To you.

Yep, and bc of this there will be 2 different difficulties. Easy for people like you, hard for people like @sebban and me. Just accept that not all the content is for you, just like i have to do it. Some dungeons are too easy to have fun with them, some are too hard. Not a big deal imo, everyone needs fun-content

edit: linked wrong person

If you get dungeons, I get vet Maw.

If you get to reappropreate content for your difficulty fix, I get to farm Vet Maw, at puggable faceroll difficulty, ad infinitum.

Dont sound so good when it's you losing content is it? And that's the fundemental problem I have with these changes. Instead of a third difficulty option, we are choosing to repurpose content people have been doing for two years.

Destruent · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

you don't get it. You don't loose any content. They will just add a higher difficulty on top of it (atleast i hope so). What is wrong with it? You understand what the word "add" in this content means?

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

Destruent wrote: »

you don't get it. You don't loose any content. They will just add a higher difficulty on top of it (atleast i hope so). What is wrong with it? You understand what the word "add" in this content means?

If the difficulty goes up to the point where I wont be able to pug it, I will lose it. Get it through your thick skull.

If you get this, I get Maw.

Destruent · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

you don't get it. You don't loose any content. They will just add a higher difficulty on top of it (atleast i hope so). What is wrong with it? You understand what the word "add" in this content means?

If the difficulty goes up to the point where I wont be able to pug it, I will lose it. Get it through your thick skull.

If you get this, I get Maw.

If the hard version is too hard for you, do the easier version. You get the same key, loot, whatever. What's the problem?

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

Destruent wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

you don't get it. You don't loose any content. They will just add a higher difficulty on top of it (atleast i hope so). What is wrong with it? You understand what the word "add" in this content means?

If the difficulty goes up to the point where I wont be able to pug it, I will lose it. Get it through your thick skull.

If you get this, I get Maw.

If the hard version is too hard for you, do the easier version. You get the same key, loot, whatever. What's the problem?

That this could have been done, AND BETTER, with tweaks to how CP scales, and a third difficulty tier. That we're inherently *** with the system for a minority of players.

I've stated stories in this thread before, people cursing me for even mentioning people not doing content for difficulty who werrent queueing in the first place. You will see the people running this decrease.

Destruent · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

you don't get it. You don't loose any content. They will just add a higher difficulty on top of it (atleast i hope so). What is wrong with it? You understand what the word "add" in this content means?

If the difficulty goes up to the point where I wont be able to pug it, I will lose it. Get it through your thick skull.

If you get this, I get Maw.

If the hard version is too hard for you, do the easier version. You get the same key, loot, whatever. What's the problem?

That this could have been done, AND BETTER, with tweaks to how CP scales, and a third difficulty tier. That we're inherently *** with the system for a minority of players.

lol, if you can't accept, that something is too hard for you, a third difficulty won't change anything. In this case the problem is you not accepting that something is too hard, not the system/dungeon itself. I am also pretty sure people would help you doing those dungeons if you would ask them on the forum, in guilds and so on. Communication is key with this and as long as you want to improve, there is no reason not to do any of the dungeons ingame. Most of them are more about mechanics than about DPS or whatever.

Apherius · September 2016

Burning_Talons wrote: »

VMaw difficulty

ok , but with skin for complete all achivement of the dungeon , very good 2 piece set . and i'm ok

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

Destruent wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

you don't get it. You don't loose any content. They will just add a higher difficulty on top of it (atleast i hope so). What is wrong with it? You understand what the word "add" in this content means?

If the difficulty goes up to the point where I wont be able to pug it, I will lose it. Get it through your thick skull.

If you get this, I get Maw.

If the hard version is too hard for you, do the easier version. You get the same key, loot, whatever. What's the problem?

That this could have been done, AND BETTER, with tweaks to how CP scales, and a third difficulty tier. That we're inherently *** with the system for a minority of players.

lol, if you can't accept, that something is too hard for you, a third difficulty won't change anything. In this case the problem is you not accepting that something is too hard, not the system/dungeon itself. I am also pretty sure people would help you doing those dungeons if you would ask them on the forum, in guilds and so on. Communication is key with this and as long as you want to improve, there is no reason not to do any of the dungeons ingame. Most of them are more about mechanics than about DPS or whatever.

I have tanked normal trials. I know vet trials will be too hard for me so I dont even try.

I've tanked veteran ICP and WGT AT LAUNCH. (And I beat them hardmode both times, by the by.)

I've tanked VCOS and VROM -now-. The only reason I dont have hard mode experience, is no DPS I've met has been able to keep up. TS or no TS.

I complete this content at the highest tier allready and have been for a while. I almost have full CP. I wont accept that its 'just too hard for me'. I'll accept your a idiot, and I'll accept there are very real design issues, particularly with CP scaling in some area's. I'll accept COS and ROMS final bosses go a bit overboard.

I've damn near mastered my build and roll, as much as I can without new mechanics to put it through it's paces. I know I'm good enough. Find another excuse.

RoyJade · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

If you get dungeons, I get vet Maw.

If you get to reappropreate content for your difficulty fix, I get to farm Vet Maw, at puggable faceroll difficulty, ad infinitum.

Dont sound so good when it's you losing content is it? And that's the fundemental problem I have with these changes. Instead of a third difficulty option, we are choosing to repurpose content people have been doing for two years.

You have normal dungeons, we have vet dungeons. You have normal MaW, we have vet MaW. Everyone with his type of content.
Skins and other are reward. You don't need them. Nobody need them. It's a little fun addition in order to reward people who win against the difficulty and the trial the game has. Not a "give to everyone" think.

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

RoyJade wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

If you get dungeons, I get vet Maw.

If you get to reappropreate content for your difficulty fix, I get to farm Vet Maw, at puggable faceroll difficulty, ad infinitum.

Dont sound so good when it's you losing content is it? And that's the fundemental problem I have with these changes. Instead of a third difficulty option, we are choosing to repurpose content people have been doing for two years.

You have normal dungeons, we have vet dungeons. You have normal MaW, we have vet MaW. Everyone with his type of content.
Skins and other are reward. You don't need them. Nobody need them. It's a little fun addition in order to reward people who win against the difficulty and the trial the game has. Not a "give to everyone" think.

I refer you to the above post where I list accolades. The only thing you have over me is Vet Maw. Find. Another. Excuse. To decry me.

Destruent · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Why do you want new content to be faceroll easy? That's just nonsense.
CP is also just an excuse for bad gameplay. Those new dungeons were not that hard on PTS with templates, play the mechanic and it works. Why do you want content where you don't need to play the mechanics (which are sometimes really great) or don't even need an healer or tank?
I don't want all content to be hard, but it would be great if atleast some content requires you to do the mechanics.

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

Destruent wrote: »

Why do you want new content to be faceroll easy? That's just nonsense.
CP is also just an excuse for bad gameplay. Those new dungeons were not that hard on PTS with templates, play the mechanic and it works. Why do you want content where you don't need to play the mechanics (which are sometimes really great) or don't even need an healer or tank?
I don't want all content to be hard, but it would be great if atleast some content requires you to do the mechanics.

Because I know what I like. Because I know I have to Pug this crap. Because unlike you, I do not feel the need to repurpose everything to be NES hard to stay cool.

Go play Volgar the viking if you want difficult. Dark souls. Games specifically designed for it. What I want, is interesting, and engaging. Not content ballanced for these people who minmax to all buggery, who allready have trials, which allready rewards minmaxing with leterboard status.

Again with the assumptions! I am a tank! I main a tank! Tanks allready make things more expedient, despite what people say. Find. Another. Excuse. This time one with some evidence or basis in fact. And quit puting words in my mouth.

There isn't a way to reward the one percent in a way they will enjoy beyond a everchanging thing like the scoreboard. Anything else, and your making them bored and making us frustraited. And if you cant understand that, It's not my job to be a miracle worker.

Destruent · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

And bc you can't find 3 other players who are able to do content above faceroll difficulty you don't want anyone to have content like this. Sounds a bit selfish to me, isn't it?
Why do you expect to beat highest difficulty with a bad group? For this you will have the lower difficulty, what is wrong with it? You get the same loot, monstermasks, everything from them...only the difficulty will be different.

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

Destruent wrote: »

And bc you can't find 3 other players who are able to do content above faceroll difficulty you don't want anyone to have content like this. Sounds a bit selfish to me, isn't it?
Why do you expect to beat highest difficulty with a bad group? For this you will have the lower difficulty, what is wrong with it? You get the same loot, monstermasks, everything from them...only the difficulty will be different.

Because these 'bad groups' arrent as prevelent as you claim. Do you play this game, do you Pug day after day, do you do it at multiple times of day?

No?

Then shut up. And quit speaking about things you clearly know nothing about. The divide between guild runners and Pug runners, is so small, as to be a nonfactor. Find. Another. Excuse.

And oh, selfish. I'm not the one suggesting we rip content from those who have been happily enjoying it for a year just because "WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH, I want a challenge!"

Destruent · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

And bc you can't find 3 other players who are able to do content above faceroll difficulty you don't want anyone to have content like this. Sounds a bit selfish to me, isn't it?
Why do you expect to beat highest difficulty with a bad group? For this you will have the lower difficulty, what is wrong with it? You get the same loot, monstermasks, everything from them...only the difficulty will be different.

Because these 'bad groups' arrent as prevelent as you claim. Do you play this game, do you Pug day after day, do you do it at multiple times of day?

No?

Then shut up. And quit speaking about things you clearly know nothing about.

oh yeah...i get it. Everything must be so easy, that anyone who thinks twice about group/build doesn't have fun with it. i get it.

but again, why do you expect to pug the highest difficulty? You can choose a lower difficulty and will get the same reward, where is the problem with this?

Destruent · September 2016

Difficulty similar to DLC dungeons

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

I've stated my reasons. Scroll up, or is your short term memory that bad?

i read it. You want, that everyone can do those dungeons at the harder difficulty as daily or whatever. But they can also do the lower difficulty for the same loot.

i want:
- lower difficulty for pugs, newer players and so
- higher difficulty for those who don't want to faceroll it

keys for dails will be the same, loot will most likely be the same. what's the problem with it? i don't get it

you want:
- low difficulty for ??
- high difficulty for pugs, newer players which is faceroll easy like it is now

what's the point of a lower difficulty if the higher one is already super-easy?

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

Apherius wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

And bc you can't find 3 other players who are able to do content above faceroll difficulty you don't want anyone to have content like this. Sounds a bit selfish to me, isn't it?
Why do you expect to beat highest difficulty with a bad group? For this you will have the lower difficulty, what is wrong with it? You get the same loot, monstermasks, everything from them...only the difficulty will be different.

Because these 'bad groups' arrent as prevelent as you claim. Do you play this game, do you Pug day after day, do you do it at multiple times of day?

No?

Then shut up. And quit speaking about things you clearly know nothing about.

oh yeah...i get it. Everything must be so easy, that anyone who thinks twice about group/build doesn't have fun with it. i get it.

but again, why do you expect to pug the highest difficulty? You can choose a lower difficulty and will get the same reward, where is the problem with this?

I've stated my reasons. Scroll up, and if you cant figure it out by then that's your problem.

stop insult people now man ... we know than you have no excuse ... it's why you insult people in all your comment OR you can demonstrate this and say your reasons .

I dont like repeating myself. Text is eternal, shouldn't have to.

Destyran · September 2016

other

I hopd its as hard as icp snd wgt were at release:)

Doctordarkspawn · September 2016

Difficulty similar to base game dungeons

Destruent wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

I've stated my reasons. Scroll up, or is your short term memory that bad?

i read it. You want, that everyone can do those dungeons at the harder difficulty as daily or whatever. But they can also do the lower difficulty for the same loot.

i want:
- lower difficulty for pugs, newer players and so
- higher difficulty for those who don't want to faceroll it

keys for dails will be the same, loot will most likely be the same. what's the problem with it? i don't get it

you want:
- low difficulty for ??
- high difficulty for pugs, newer players which is faceroll easy like it is now

what's the point of a lower difficulty if the higher one is already super-easy?

You dont get it because you dont wanna get it. But for the last time. Then I'm leaving you to your hipster difficulty friends.

I want:

Minor difficulty increases and a restructuring of CP scaling in order to create better difficulty on that level, without shooting the experience in the foot. Because that's the true issue here, the ever rising CP is having a greater impact on the game than the designers know how to compensate for.

A ''Elite" difficulty for the people who -do- vet trials, with legendary quality rewards as compensation. So the designers can focus the challenges for those that -want- them, instead of trying to spread it even, and pleasing nobody.

That's it. No conspiracy to make the game noob friendly, no pug conspiracy, that stuffs there because -you want to see it-. I want the CP system looked at, and I want the challenge focused in certain places, WITHOUT needlessly splitting hairs between dungeon versions for little to no reason.

If you cant understand why I want these things, thats. Your. Problem. I will no longer try and save a lost cause.