The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Stop Buffing Things. Start Nerfing More Things
Yoyuyi999
✭✭✭✭
I'm ready for the forum hate, but frankly, at this point I could care less.
This game is becoming more and more stale. Rarely anyone runs out of resources, people are able to hit incredibly hard, and still be incredibly survivable. Its why dueling is becoming less and less popular. Fights are becoming less skill based and more about your spec, stats, class, race, etc.
I constantly see people say on the forums "nerfs are bad, just buff Y to make it as good as X." To that I say, no. That's a horrible idea. Does anyone remember the 1.6 PTS? When everyone had 3600 CP? Do you find that skillful at all? When everyone is immensely powerful no one truly is. It's just all stats and power at that point. HOWEVER, when everyone was 'weak' (when softcaps were around) people had actual skillful fights. People relied less on their stats, skills, etc and used their actual player skill to carry themselves and fight.
Thats all I have to say. People hate the idea of nerfs, and I do too honestly. But at this poinr this game needs a major revamp. The only class I find truly balanced as of right now is Magicka DK. If you want perfect sustain you lose damage. If you want good damage you lose sustain. The class requires a lot of sacrifice and takes true skill. Everything else is OP outside of Magicka DK. Nerf (or revamp) everything to make them live the magicka dk.
This game is becoming more and more stale. Rarely anyone runs out of resources, people are able to hit incredibly hard, and still be incredibly survivable. Its why dueling is becoming less and less popular. Fights are becoming less skill based and more about your spec, stats, class, race, etc.
I constantly see people say on the forums "nerfs are bad, just buff Y to make it as good as X." To that I say, no. That's a horrible idea. Does anyone remember the 1.6 PTS? When everyone had 3600 CP? Do you find that skillful at all? When everyone is immensely powerful no one truly is. It's just all stats and power at that point. HOWEVER, when everyone was 'weak' (when softcaps were around) people had actual skillful fights. People relied less on their stats, skills, etc and used their actual player skill to carry themselves and fight.
Thats all I have to say. People hate the idea of nerfs, and I do too honestly. But at this poinr this game needs a major revamp. The only class I find truly balanced as of right now is Magicka DK. If you want perfect sustain you lose damage. If you want good damage you lose sustain. The class requires a lot of sacrifice and takes true skill. Everything else is OP outside of Magicka DK. Nerf (or revamp) everything to make them live the magicka dk.
Characters:
Magicka Dragonknight, Yoyuyi
Stamina Dragonknight, -Jombo
Magicka Templar, -Dombo
Magicka Sorceror, -Mombo
Magicka Nightblade, -Wombo
Magicka Dragonknight, -Combo
~~~
Youtube
Twitch
~~~
Former GM of Mighty
~~~
http://imgur.com/a/RWZZ7
Magicka Dragonknight, Yoyuyi
Stamina Dragonknight, -Jombo
Magicka Templar, -Dombo
Magicka Sorceror, -Mombo
Magicka Nightblade, -Wombo
Magicka Dragonknight, -Combo
~~~
Youtube
Twitch
~~~
Former GM of Mighty
~~~
http://imgur.com/a/RWZZ7
30
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Ghost-Shot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I agree, as a DK since launch I totally understand that seeing what you play get nerfed sucks but at this point, how out of control are things going to be if they keep buffing things?1 -
PainfulFAFA✭✭✭✭✭
✭Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance. Prolly gonna need 30 maybe 40 threads for that one...Edited by PainfulFAFA on July 29, 2016 6:08PM0 -
Ghost-Shot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance.
Should apply major defile.3 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance.
I knew it. So you guys have a nerf list? What is after Fasalla?Edited by timidobserver on July 29, 2016 6:16PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)3 -
PainfulFAFA✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ghost-Shot wrote: »PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance.
Should apply major defile.
Exactly and should apply to enemies within a certain range.
I can be hitting somebody with my caltrops from far away and still get defile... Lol think about the server ffs!1 -
Ghost-Shot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Ghost-Shot wrote: »PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance.
Should apply major defile.
Exactly and should apply to enemies within a certain range.
I can be hitting somebody with my caltrops from far away and still get defile... Lol think about the server ffs!
Yeah its really annoying that after they went and converted the whole damn game over to the major/minor buff system they turn around and make sets like Fasalla and Malubeth make the whole system irrelevant.2 -
PainfulFAFA✭✭✭✭✭
✭timidobserver wrote: »PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance.
I knew it. So you guys have a nerf list?
The only buffs i wanna see in the game from now on are PET buffs and buffing mDKs witsome form of execute since all classes have one. Id like to see burning embers work as an execute like poison injection.
All they need to do is nerf Fasalla and then merf aoe caps and the game would be perfect
0 -
Ghost-Shot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance.
I knew it. So you guys have a nerf list?
The only buffs i wanna see in the game from now on are PET buffs and buffing mDKs witsome form of execute since all classes have one. Id like to see burning embers work as an execute like poison injection.
All they need to do is nerf Fasalla and then merf aoe caps and the game would be perfect
I was actually just thinking that last night, having embers scale up to make it actually somewhat scary to have on you <50% hp.0 -
KenaPKK✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance. Prolly gonna need 30 maybe 40 threads for that one...
Only after they nerf healing.Kena
Legion XIII
Excellence without elitism
Premier small scale PvP
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NA/PC original dueling and general PvP community guild
Now the hub of competitive dueling and the joined PvP communities of NA and EU/PC
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Here's a great thread collecting community ideas for PvP updates.
[MEGATHREAD] Feedback Threads for Class Reps
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Dragonknight Discussion:
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Sorcerer Discussion:
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Templar Discussion:
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Werewolf Discussion:
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Vampire Discussion:
https://discord.gg/yfzck8Q4 -
Yoyuyi999✭✭✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance. Prolly gonna need 30 maybe 40 threads for that one...
Only after they nerf healing.
They dont need to do that. What they could do is nerf sustain, which would cause less healing overtime in the span of a fight. If I go full defensive its resource intensive on a magicka build. However, on a stamina build I can recover easily due to how little sustain it costs to recover and heal.Characters:
Magicka Dragonknight, Yoyuyi
Stamina Dragonknight, -Jombo
Magicka Templar, -Dombo
Magicka Sorceror, -Mombo
Magicka Nightblade, -Wombo
Magicka Dragonknight, -Combo
~~~
Youtube
Twitch
~~~
Former GM of Mighty
~~~
http://imgur.com/a/RWZZ74 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The power creep is real easy to notice . Balance is difficult from this point on . Buffing or nerfing increases combat times both ways . It's hard to say which works better .0 -
OdinForge✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I miss 1.5 ESO so much, it's hard to sign into ESO these days while thinking about how good the game used to be.
I agree with Yoyuyi however that resource management needs to be looked at, the amount we heal and the damage we do should be high. But we should have more to think about in terms of resource management, and the entire system needs to be tuned in general. Bring back bashable heavy attacks, maybe increase the value heavy attacks return. Mindless spamming of high damage skills with no sustain, because it's too easy is garbage and boring gameplay.The Age of Wrobel.4 -
Manoekin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Ghost-Shot wrote: »
1.5 w/ gnd oils?
Revert siege damage to what it was originally, scrap the lighting patch, remove AOE caps, fix purge bug, fix heal debuff stacking, implement the new buff/debuff system so you don't get randomly 1 shot, dragon scales only reflect 4 projectiles and make force shock a single projecile. I'd probably play that game.1 -
KenaPKK✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance. Prolly gonna need 30 maybe 40 threads for that one...
Only after they nerf healing.
They dont need to do that. What they could do is nerf sustain, which would cause less healing overtime in the span of a fight. If I go full defensive its resource intensive on a magicka build. However, on a stamina build I can recover easily due to how little sustain it costs to recover and heal.
All I heard was "Major Mending + CP makes Vigor heal too much." lol
CP overinflates stats across the board. Hots tick for over 2k without Major Mending, Honor the Dead heals for 20k+, people are one shotting each other, people are tanking small zergs (albeit mostly with broken sets, not CP), no one ever runs out of resources...ugh. I'm so tired of it all.Kena
Legion XIII
Excellence without elitism
Premier small scale PvP
Legend
NA/PC original dueling and general PvP community guild
Now the hub of competitive dueling and the joined PvP communities of NA and EU/PC
Apex Predator.
Here's a great thread collecting community ideas for PvP updates.
[MEGATHREAD] Feedback Threads for Class Reps
Class Representative Feedback Discords:Nightblade Discussion:
https://discord.gg/t2Xhnu6
Dragonknight Discussion:
https://discord.gg/UHtZhz8
Sorcerer Discussion:
https://discord.gg/e3QkCS8
Templar Discussion:
https://discord.gg/WvVuSw7
Warden Discussion:
https://discord.gg/sTFY4ys
General Healing Discussion:
https://discord.gg/6CmzBFb
TONKS!
https://discord.gg/DRNYd39
Werewolf Discussion:
https://discord.gg/aDEx2ev
Vampire Discussion:
https://discord.gg/yfzck8Q0 -
Ishammael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Ghost-Shot wrote: »
1.5 w/ gnd oils?
Revert siege damage to what it was originally, scrap the lighting patch, remove AOE caps, fix purge bug, fix heal debuff stacking, implement the new buff/debuff system so you don't get randomly 1 shot, dragon scales only reflect 4 projectiles and make force shock a single projecile. I'd probably play that game.
Yea, this is the better list.0 -
Koolio✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭One problem I see with this is that people who now a familiar with their build gets nerfed and leaves. I now hit x amount. You would nerf it and send me back to level 50. I don't want to be weak again.1 -
Zheg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance. Prolly gonna need 30 maybe 40 threads for that one...
Only after they nerf healing.
They dont need to do that. What they could do is nerf sustain, which would cause less healing overtime in the span of a fight. If I go full defensive its resource intensive on a magicka build. However, on a stamina build I can recover easily due to how little sustain it costs to recover and heal.
All I heard was "Major Mending + CP makes Vigor heal too much." lol
CP overinflates stats across the board. Hots tick for over 2k without Major Mending, Honor the Dead heals for 20k+, people are one shotting each other, people are tanking small zergs (albeit mostly with broken sets, not CP), no one ever runs out of resources...ugh. I'm so tired of it all.
OK. Let's really try and not exaggerate. Most of us are in agreement on a lot of the broken things, but a very very strong HtD on someone with all CP in healing will crit around 15k-ish with major mending on. Even a major vitality potion wouldn't bring you that high, you'd need both that and malubeth proc.
If you don't know the numbers, just say "high" or "hits hard". There's enough misinformation on these forums as it is, we don't need to exaggerate on top of that.Edited by Zheg on July 29, 2016 10:57PM6 -
NBrookus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭If you want to play without huge sustain of your own or opponents, try the no-CP campaigns.
I agree: power creep is a problem. But there is a solution you can apply in the meantime to your own experience.3 -
KenaPKK✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance. Prolly gonna need 30 maybe 40 threads for that one...
Only after they nerf healing.
They dont need to do that. What they could do is nerf sustain, which would cause less healing overtime in the span of a fight. If I go full defensive its resource intensive on a magicka build. However, on a stamina build I can recover easily due to how little sustain it costs to recover and heal.
All I heard was "Major Mending + CP makes Vigor heal too much." lol
CP overinflates stats across the board. Hots tick for over 2k without Major Mending, Honor the Dead heals for 20k+, people are one shotting each other, people are tanking small zergs (albeit mostly with broken sets, not CP), no one ever runs out of resources...ugh. I'm so tired of it all.
OK. Let's really try and not exaggerate. Most of us are in agreement on a lot of the broken things, but a very very strong HtD on someone with all CP in healing will crit around 15k-ish with major mending on. Even a major vitality potion wouldn't bring you that high, you'd need both that and malubeth proc.
If you don't know the numbers, just say "high" or "hits hard". There's enough misinformation on these forums as it is, we don't need to exaggerate on top of that.
Lyric's record when I was hanging out on K-Hole TS as of a couple months back was 22k, Michael hit a 24k yesterday. They're above the norm, but they're doable. I wouldn't make up a number like that, so please don't imply that I am.Edited by KenaPKK on July 29, 2016 11:37PMKena
Legion XIII
Excellence without elitism
Premier small scale PvP
Legend
NA/PC original dueling and general PvP community guild
Now the hub of competitive dueling and the joined PvP communities of NA and EU/PC
Apex Predator.
Here's a great thread collecting community ideas for PvP updates.
[MEGATHREAD] Feedback Threads for Class Reps
Class Representative Feedback Discords:Nightblade Discussion:
https://discord.gg/t2Xhnu6
Dragonknight Discussion:
https://discord.gg/UHtZhz8
Sorcerer Discussion:
https://discord.gg/e3QkCS8
Templar Discussion:
https://discord.gg/WvVuSw7
Warden Discussion:
https://discord.gg/sTFY4ys
General Healing Discussion:
https://discord.gg/6CmzBFb
TONKS!
https://discord.gg/DRNYd39
Werewolf Discussion:
https://discord.gg/aDEx2ev
Vampire Discussion:
https://discord.gg/yfzck8Q1 -
Ghost-Shot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance. Prolly gonna need 30 maybe 40 threads for that one...
Only after they nerf healing.
They dont need to do that. What they could do is nerf sustain, which would cause less healing overtime in the span of a fight. If I go full defensive its resource intensive on a magicka build. However, on a stamina build I can recover easily due to how little sustain it costs to recover and heal.
All I heard was "Major Mending + CP makes Vigor heal too much." lol
CP overinflates stats across the board. Hots tick for over 2k without Major Mending, Honor the Dead heals for 20k+, people are one shotting each other, people are tanking small zergs (albeit mostly with broken sets, not CP), no one ever runs out of resources...ugh. I'm so tired of it all.
OK. Let's really try and not exaggerate. Most of us are in agreement on a lot of the broken things, but a very very strong HtD on someone with all CP in healing will crit around 15k-ish with major mending on. Even a major vitality potion wouldn't bring you that high, you'd need both that and malubeth proc.
If you don't know the numbers, just say "high" or "hits hard". There's enough misinformation on these forums as it is, we don't need to exaggerate on top of that.
Lyric's record when I was hanging out on K-Hole TS as of a couple months back was 22k, Michael hit a 24k yesterday. They're above the norm, but they're doable. I wouldn't make up a number like that, so please don't imply that I am.
I could do 26k BoL's in 1.6 but now? Even with having major mending now that seems a bit exagerated1 -
Edziu✭✭✭✭✭
✭If you want perfect sustain you lose damage. If you want good damage you lose sustain.
this is the best solution for balance...want it again...now almost all build are creating with this max sustain with still very good dps what is nonsense...glass canon build is comming to useless thank this...fighst before was so fast...now you can do only 1 fight maybe hours because this cancer sustain on all...
cant undesrtand this like maybe bursting nb with good sustain...hard to kill, counter him als like just pug tank-healer templar......you cant kill this but this kill you without probles...
sustain, sustain, sustain
where are odl fast fights what dont needed gang to be fast...only fight with dk was longer...because tank class...now all are tanks, dps/and heallers in 1 what is stupid.....you are or tank, or healer/maybe some tankly or dps...no all in 1 like it is now with most builds on pvp.
if you are tank build and glass cannon cant kill you then you shouldnt be able to kill this glass cannon in less than few mins play in mouse and cat
edit:
and now going to pure dps burst also is mindles...for what going with this when someone with sustain build have similiary damage like yo...just minimum worse when 2x resistan than you+ much more regens to allEdited by Edziu on July 30, 2016 1:14AM0 -
DisgracefulMind✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭PainfulFAFA wrote: »Fasalla is the next item on the list that needs a HUGE nerf for the sake of Pvp balance AND pvp performance. Prolly gonna need 30 maybe 40 threads for that one...
Only after they nerf healing.
They dont need to do that. What they could do is nerf sustain, which would cause less healing overtime in the span of a fight. If I go full defensive its resource intensive on a magicka build. However, on a stamina build I can recover easily due to how little sustain it costs to recover and heal.
All I heard was "Major Mending + CP makes Vigor heal too much." lol
CP overinflates stats across the board. Hots tick for over 2k without Major Mending, Honor the Dead heals for 20k+, people are one shotting each other, people are tanking small zergs (albeit mostly with broken sets, not CP), no one ever runs out of resources...ugh. I'm so tired of it all.
OK. Let's really try and not exaggerate. Most of us are in agreement on a lot of the broken things, but a very very strong HtD on someone with all CP in healing will crit around 15k-ish with major mending on. Even a major vitality potion wouldn't bring you that high, you'd need both that and malubeth proc.
If you don't know the numbers, just say "high" or "hits hard". There's enough misinformation on these forums as it is, we don't need to exaggerate on top of that.
Lyric's record when I was hanging out on K-Hole TS as of a couple months back was 22k, Michael hit a 24k yesterday. They're above the norm, but they're doable. I wouldn't make up a number like that, so please don't imply that I am.
I'm actually going to defend Kena on this. I've definitely hit a 20k+ BoL in PvP lol. Which is an absurd number, I agree.
I wonder what my PvE heal setup could do... xD
Just have to take the mending passive into account, honestly. The numbers are going to be high the less HP the person you hit has.Unfortunate magicka warden main.
PC/NA Server
Fairweather Friends
Retired to baby bgs forever. Leave me alone.2