The problem with VCoA, VICP and VWGT

Tonnopesce · April 2016

I found the mechanics in wgt really fun to do but sometimes the randomness of this game is crazy, yesterday we spent 30 minutes on the atronach boss due to the portals... damn portals.
On 6 try 4 of them where really nasty, the tank get 8-10 portals at once and while if it appens to me i can easy one shot them as a dd ( even when i tank i switch to full dd for this boss) our tank required 2 attacks to close them and it was to slow, finally in one round i got the portals two times and the heal got the third time and we done it.

The other big issue is Molag kena , ok you start with her and a random atronach pops at the beginning while she ' s doing the windscreen wiper all in the first 30 seconds... come on.
Other rounds is fine but then out of no where she kills tree people at once tank included...
too random imho, the mechanics are not predictable and the " easy mode" is too easy compared to the hard mode.

Is hard ok but is even punishing, a little too much for a 4 man group dungeon, while in the VMSA i'm the only one there, and if i screw up something is my fault, in this dungeons you cannot carry on bad players.
In conclusion i'm ok with the nerf but if you nerf it remove the double undaunted reward.

Edit. Keep it hard those are the best dungeons done till now dont hit too hard with the nerf hammer.

OR do it like if you do the hard mode you get 2 keys and if you do the normal you get 1.

Magdalina · April 2016

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

I found the mechanics in wgt really fun to do but sometimes the randomness of this game is crazy, yesterday we spent 30 minutes on the atronach boss due to the portals... damn portals.
On 6 try 4 of them where really nasty, the tank get 8-10 portals at once and while if it appens to me i can easy one shot them as a dd ( even when i tank i switch to full dd for this boss) our tank required 2 attacks to close them and it was to slow, finally in one round i got the portals two times and the heal got the third time and we done it.

The other big issue is Molag kena , ok you start with her and a random atronach pops at the beginning while she ' s doing the windscreen wiper all in the first 30 seconds... come on.
Other rounds is fine but then out of no where she kills tree people at once tank included...
too random imho, the mechanics are not predictable and the " easy mode" is too easy compared to the hard mode.

Is hard ok but is even punishing, a little too much for a 4 man group dungeon, while in the VMSA i'm the only one there, and if i screw up something is my fault, in this dungeons you cannot carry on bad players.
In conclusion i'm ok with the nerf but if you nerf it remove the double undaunted reward.

The Inhibitor spawns more portals the more time goes by, the number isn't random. Portals also have what, like 4k health I think? Typically a tank uses some dps gear there(as you don't really need a tank) or something in order to be able to kill them faster. Alternatively, now that they removed the pinion DoT you could just have the tank hold Inhibitor full time(with someone taking her off him for the blue phase, then tank grabbing it again) pretty much - the person having agro there never gets portals. Also when she falls low on health she starts spawning crazy numbers of portals but you also get 2 people able to close them, not just one so that helps.

Kena mechanics are a little weird right now. I'm not sure if the stage overlap you get very frequently now is intended. Wall of lightning+atro? Had that happen maaaany times, it does hurt. I kind of like the challenge sometimes but I'm not even sure it's intended, there have never been any mentions of it in the patch notes or anything. This used to never happen before TG, she'd always finish one mechanic before starting another.

I don't think she's capable of killing "3 people at once" though, my guess is you got killed by DoT(or perhaps sweeped back to into the fire? There is that wonderful bug where you get knocked back by her frontal cone aoe even if you block). It really does hurt but you can avoid it or shield it off if you're magicka build(I'm not sure if it can be purified, too?)

EDIT: Imo the only fight that could really use less RNG is Warden. That one can be extremely painful even with a good team if RNG gods decide to hate you that day. Most other fights' mechanics are 100% predictable/counterable.

Bigevilpeter · April 2016

Apparently you are all awesome players who can do miracles!! From what i see having played with so many people is that they are not as easy as many of you claim them to be.

Those who claim they can do it as 2 or do it without healer are either maxed out with perfect everything or are just ***.

In both cases that doesn't prove any point.

soon enough i'll find someone saying i can solo vet VMoL its too easy!! LoL

Magdalina · April 2016

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

Apparently you are all awesome players who can do miracles!! From what i see having played with so many people is that they are not as easy as many of you claim them to be.

Those who claim they can do it as 2 or do it without healer are either maxed out with perfect everything or are just ***.

In both cases that doesn't prove any point.

soon enough i'll find someone saying i can solo vet VMoL its too easy!! LoL

You didn't answer which fights you find to be impossible without high dps

And yes a lot of us are good players. Only reason it's that easy for us though is because we don't mind practising and trying new things. It doesn't mean that's what you have to like of course, but it really can be fun

Dubhliam · April 2016

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

They don't just require you to know the tactics, but also require massive dps. As a healer I can't control that very much and usually get people with average dps and no matter how much I can heal, eventually things get messy and we die if we can't kill the boss fast enough.

I'd imagine even if I was a good dps I'd need the other one to be also very good and the healer and tank to do their jobs well.

I did beat all of them on hard mode a couple of times, the problem is actually trying to get the items they drop.

Every 5 teams I get one team that can actually do them and even with that we wipe quite a few times and we all have done them before and know the tactics very well, how can I get Kena helm that way let alone spellpower cure set.

I believe that lowering boss healths while making them invulnerable to do a tactic every now and then will fix the dps race this game has become, but its true these dungeon need a slight nerf so that people without the crazy high dps can actually play them or at least do their dailies!!

Simply not true.
The only DPS race in those three dungeons is Valkyn Skoria, and we can all agree that vCoA is the easiest of the three. Also, not activating HM simply grants you a silver key instead of gold.

You have completed them.
Basically, you're saying that you PUG those dungeons often and that you get people that don't have gear and/or knowledge to complete them.
Meaning that the problem lies in educating newer players, not in the dungeon themselves.

If you wish to farm gear (not mandatory, you can perform well without the SPC set), either form a group that you know will perform well in those dungeons, or simply PUG normal mode. Sets drop in normal mode also.

Asking for nerfs so that you can farm those dungeons easily is just plain selfish.

EDIT: @Bigevilpeter , add me to your buddy list, same as forum name. I'll gladly guide you though the dungeons provided you have TS installed. I prefer to tank, but can also DD.

oibam · April 2016

For players (group) who nuke the Inhibitor down, when he reaches his first blue burning phase, for those the nerf of vWGT / iCP / CoA is like making the game even more boring.

For players who attack the wrong shadow image at Lord Warden fight and miss every portal, for those a nerf will change nothing - they keep wiping for hours.

So I suggest: Nerf CP System. Fix lag. AND: Think about the well fitted rage trait and rng loot aswell.

Dubhliam · April 2016

Zerok wrote: »

I developed a profound dislike for vWGT and vICP because they are very unforgiving. If one person in your team makes a small mistake, all the group will die.

I consider myself a casual player. I like a challenge, but these dungeons are just too much for my playstyle. When they are the gold pledge, I (usually) skip them.

I made an exception today because some guildmates requested my help for vWGT. We made it to the final boss, and then we spent 30-45 minutes trying to finish it.

After 10+ wipes, the best we could do is to get her to 18%. In the end, I lost 2 hours for nothing (it was not even fun).

I'm not doing this again (at least before they nerf it). I have other things to do.

If these dungeons are intended for the hardcore players, I think they should at least make another gold pledge for the casual players.

That very same gold pledge will grant you a silver key if you do it on normal mode.
Consider doing that, for it is good practice.

LadyNalcarya · April 2016

STOP SPREADING FALSE INFORMATION! - Yeah, in caps, just because it really annoying.
You dont have to have vr16 gear or super high dps to beat these dungeons. If you think so, you're just trying to find excuses and fooling yourself.
There's only a few dps checks in these dungeons - Valkyn Skoria and enraging atronachs.
Atronachs have 1 milliion hp on vr16. They enrage after 40 seconds. So, you'll need 12,5k dps from each dd to take them down before they enrage. But actually its less since the tank will do 2-5k dps with taunts and cc already, and healer will throw some shard, perhaps heavy attacks and execute...
Also normally there's only one in time (if youre getting more you either aggroed multiple trash pulls, including one optional, or ingnored the mechanics of the second boss. And that mechanic doesnt require dps at all)
Valkyn has 2,8 million health, and on hardmode there's 3 platforms. He breaks them after 40 seconds or so. So you have 120 seconds to kill him safely (+you can survive some time in execute phase). That means 11,6k dps required from each dd, and actually its less since tanks and healers spells also do some damage. And even less in you consider executing him in lava.
Those numbers are easily achievable in vr14 or vr15 purple gear. I was pulling 20k with vr14 gear and 300 cps, without an optimized race, so its possible.
Most of times that pugs fail it happens because they are not paying attention to the mechanics (they get overwhelmed with atronachs, or die from dot on planar inhibitor because they werent picking the pinion, or they stand in fire geyser at Valky nSkoria). Deaths all over the place significantly lower group dps (basically if dd dies, group does 0 dps, since another dd needs to rez). Those issues can only be solved by playing as a team, and nerf wont save you from the things I mentioned.

Bofrari · April 2016

12k dps? Dude that's horrible I do that on my tank build in full tank gear the average dpser should be doing 20k easily if they aren't they have no clue what they are doing join a good guild and don't waste your time with these people it'll drive you to quitting.

Marktoneth3 · April 2016

Some people who play like a year told newbies that everything is easy for them.

LMAO

Magdalina · April 2016

JDC1985 wrote: »

12k dps? Dude that's horrible I do that on my tank build in full tank gear the average dpser should be doing 20k easily if they aren't they have no clue what they are doing join a good guild and don't waste your time with these people it'll drive you to quitting.

You're honestly fine in all of those dungeons with 12k dps if everyone knows their roles and follows mechanics.

LadyNalcarya · April 2016

@Marktoneth3 wrote: »

Some people who play like a year told newbies that everything is easy for them.

LMAO

I beat vCoA after 2 months of playing without any cps (they werent around at that time).
Also I got my first no death as a vampire (and at these times fire debuff used to be 40%).
But you can continue fooling yourself if it makes you feel better.

Marktoneth3 · April 2016

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

@Marktoneth3 wrote: »

Some people who play like a year told newbies that everything is easy for them.

LMAO

I beat vCoA after 2 months of playing without any cps (they werent around at that time).
Also I got my first no death as a vampire (and at these times fire debuff used to be 40%).
But you can continue fooling yourself if it makes you feel better.

City of Ash is easy bruh If you have a good team.

Magdalina · April 2016

Marktoneth3 wrote: »

Some people who play like a year told newbies that everything is easy for them.

LMAO

Well yes. We also told "newbies" we are more than willing to teach them and even run them through if this helps, and that ultimately there's no difference between us and them but experience(and maybe willingness to learn).
What's wrong with that?

LadyNalcarya · April 2016

Marktoneth3 wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

@Marktoneth3 wrote: »

Some people who play like a year told newbies that everything is easy for them.

LMAO

I beat vCoA after 2 months of playing without any cps (they werent around at that time).
Also I got my first no death as a vampire (and at these times fire debuff used to be 40%).
But you can continue fooling yourself if it makes you feel better.

City of Ash is easy bruh If you have a good team.

It wasnt that easy in 1.5. Its easy now, but still they are gonna nerf it.
And I beat IC dungeons when they were significantly harder with vr14 purple gear and ~300 cps. I was unexperienced as a dd back then and tactics werent well-known.

So its really funny when people bring "awww you need vr16 golden gear and maxed cps for it!"

Bigevilpeter · April 2016

The problem with low dps is not that its undoable, its that it takes so long and the longer you go the more you are bound to make mistakes, and these dungeons are completely unforgiving.

i cant name a single boss thats the main problem, of course some are more difficult than others, but the problem is one mistake and the whole team starts wiping. Faster dps helps a lot with that.

LadyNalcarya · April 2016

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

The problem with low dps is not that its undoable, its that it takes so long and the longer you go the more you are bound to make mistakes, and these dungeons are completely unforgiving.

i cant name a single boss thats the main problem, of course some are more difficult than others, but the problem is one mistake and the whole team starts wiping. Faster dps helps a lot with that.

With any difficulty optimized build will do better than not optimized.
And yeah, you can wipe with a minmaxed build if youre careless.
Also, please keep in mind that high dps builds are literally glass cannons. They have 16k hp, 0 sustain, and depend on the rotation and group buffs/support. So there's a huge tradeoff for facerolling these dungeons, and not that much room for error.
You're just making assumptions based on videos you saw or maybe players you've met, but how can you judge if you never tried these builds?
In any case, less than 10k dps and more than 30 are extremes. With average dps, average all-around sustain, gear and cps, these dungeons are doable if players are paying attention.

DRXHarbinger · April 2016

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

The problem with low dps is not that its undoable, its that it takes so long and the longer you go the more you are bound to make mistakes, and these dungeons are completely unforgiving.

i cant name a single boss thats the main problem, of course some are more difficult than others, but the problem is one mistake and the whole team starts wiping. Faster dps helps a lot with that.

With any difficulty optimized build will do better than not optimized.
And yeah, you can wipe with a minmaxed build if youre careless.
Also, please keep in mind that high dps builds are literally glass cannons. They have 16k hp, 0 sustain, and depend on the rotation and group buffs/support. So there's a huge tradeoff for facerolling these dungeons, and not that much room for error.
You're just making assumptions based on videos you saw or maybe players you've met, but how can you judge if you never tried these builds?
In any case, less than 10k dps and more than 30 are extremes. With average dps, average all-around sustain, gear and cps, these dungeons are doable if players are paying attention.

That's not true at all. My Sorc has 840 recovery and with no sustain you'd never be flawless like me, glass cannon well ward handles that. NBs spam heals 24/7 and hit like trucks and have siphoning, DKs well proper DKs know how to convert magika into stamina and gain magika back, seems like your groups are awful and just don't know to how to self sustain.

Glass cannon ftw, faster burn = faster rewards. If you want to struggle in and spend 30mins killing the overfiend then go for it

LadyNalcarya · April 2016

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

The problem with low dps is not that its undoable, its that it takes so long and the longer you go the more you are bound to make mistakes, and these dungeons are completely unforgiving.

i cant name a single boss thats the main problem, of course some are more difficult than others, but the problem is one mistake and the whole team starts wiping. Faster dps helps a lot with that.

With any difficulty optimized build will do better than not optimized.
And yeah, you can wipe with a minmaxed build if youre careless.
Also, please keep in mind that high dps builds are literally glass cannons. They have 16k hp, 0 sustain, and depend on the rotation and group buffs/support. So there's a huge tradeoff for facerolling these dungeons, and not that much room for error.
You're just making assumptions based on videos you saw or maybe players you've met, but how can you judge if you never tried these builds?
In any case, less than 10k dps and more than 30 are extremes. With average dps, average all-around sustain, gear and cps, these dungeons are doable if players are paying attention.

That's not true at all. My Sorc has 840 recovery and with no sustain you'd never be flawless like me, glass cannon well ward handles that. NBs spam heals 24/7 and hit like trucks and have siphoning, DKs well proper DKs know how to convert magika into stamina and gain magika back, seems like your groups are awful and just don't know to how to self sustain.

Glass cannon ftw, faster burn = faster rewards. If you want to struggle in and spend 30mins killing the overfiend then go for it

I have a flawless achievement lol

I also have glass cannon builds.
But they do require l2p, so Im speaking from "Im a casual, I cant l2p" perspective. I also saw people who just mindlessly copied the builds from the internet and cant play them.
You need to watch out for your movement and resources.
Also, just lol about "horrible groups".

Tonnopesce · April 2016

Magdalina wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

I found the mechanics in wgt really fun to do but sometimes the randomness of this game is crazy, yesterday we spent 30 minutes on the atronach boss due to the portals... damn portals.
On 6 try 4 of them where really nasty, the tank get 8-10 portals at once and while if it appens to me i can easy one shot them as a dd ( even when i tank i switch to full dd for this boss) our tank required 2 attacks to close them and it was to slow, finally in one round i got the portals two times and the heal got the third time and we done it.

The other big issue is Molag kena , ok you start with her and a random atronach pops at the beginning while she ' s doing the windscreen wiper all in the first 30 seconds... come on.
Other rounds is fine but then out of no where she kills tree people at once tank included...
too random imho, the mechanics are not predictable and the " easy mode" is too easy compared to the hard mode.

Is hard ok but is even punishing, a little too much for a 4 man group dungeon, while in the VMSA i'm the only one there, and if i screw up something is my fault, in this dungeons you cannot carry on bad players.
In conclusion i'm ok with the nerf but if you nerf it remove the double undaunted reward.

The Inhibitor spawns more portals the more time goes by, the number isn't random. Portals also have what, like 4k health I think? Typically a tank uses some dps gear there(as you don't really need a tank) or something in order to be able to kill them faster. Alternatively, now that they removed the pinion DoT you could just have the tank hold Inhibitor full time(with someone taking her off him for the blue phase, then tank grabbing it again) pretty much - the person having agro there never gets portals. Also when she falls low on health she starts spawning crazy numbers of portals but you also get 2 people able to close them, not just one so that helps.

Kena mechanics are a little weird right now. I'm not sure if the stage overlap you get very frequently now is intended. Wall of lightning+atro? Had that happen maaaany times, it does hurt. I kind of like the challenge sometimes but I'm not even sure it's intended, there have never been any mentions of it in the patch notes or anything. This used to never happen before TG, she'd always finish one mechanic before starting another.

I don't think she's capable of killing "3 people at once" though, my guess is you got killed by DoT(or perhaps sweeped back to into the fire? There is that wonderful bug where you get knocked back by her frontal cone aoe even if you block). It really does hurt but you can avoid it or shield it off if you're magicka build(I'm not sure if it can be purified, too?)

EDIT: Imo the only fight that could really use less RNG is Warden. That one can be extremely painful even with a good team if RNG gods decide to hate you that day. Most other fights' mechanics are 100% predictable/counterable.

It was not our guild top team doing it i was with my stamplar with 16k of health the tank was our pure melee dude the other dd have some problems with the portals, the heal was really good, but even when we go with the top team where i usually tank we have some issues with the atronach portals and with the kena randomness.
Is not an easy mode dungeon and is fine like this but some rebalance will allow everyone in my guild to do it and is fine i believe .

I personally find icp more easy that wgt. Except for two bosses (the big fat flash atronac and the stop people with the poo) the rest is really easy.

Zerok · April 2016

Samphaa wrote: »

Zerok wrote: »

I developed a profound dislike for vWGT and vICP because they are very unforgiving. If one person in your team makes a small mistake, all the group will die.

I consider myself a casual player. I like a challenge, but these dungeons are just too much for my playstyle. When they are the gold pledge, I (usually) skip them.

I made an exception today because some guildmates requested my help for vWGT. We made it to the final boss, and then we spent 30-45 minutes trying to finish it.

After 10+ wipes, the best we could do is to get her to 18%. In the end, I lost 2 hours for nothing (it was not even fun).

I'm not doing this again (at least before they nerf it). I have other things to do.

If these dungeons are intended for the hardcore players, I think they should at least make another gold pledge for the casual players.

The first time I did tower it took us 5 1/2 hours, we got stuck on kena for half of that time. Now we clear tower in under 30 mins and I've 3 manned it on hard mode. It's just practise and group synergy, nothing special.

Find a team and stick with them, learn each others strength, don't go in there with a random group everytime, fail and then complain it's too hard, because it's not, it just requires a small amount of coordination.

And you already have 8 other pledges for casual players...

Good for you, but I don't have time for this.

I'm not asking for a nerf, I'm asking for an alternative gold key when these dungeons are the pledges.

Destruent · April 2016

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

I found the mechanics in wgt really fun to do but sometimes the randomness of this game is crazy, yesterday we spent 30 minutes on the atronach boss due to the portals... damn portals.
On 6 try 4 of them where really nasty, the tank get 8-10 portals at once and while if it appens to me i can easy one shot them as a dd ( even when i tank i switch to full dd for this boss) our tank required 2 attacks to close them and it was to slow, finally in one round i got the portals two times and the heal got the third time and we done it.

The other big issue is Molag kena , ok you start with her and a random atronach pops at the beginning while she ' s doing the windscreen wiper all in the first 30 seconds... come on.
Other rounds is fine but then out of no where she kills tree people at once tank included...
too random imho, the mechanics are not predictable and the " easy mode" is too easy compared to the hard mode.

Is hard ok but is even punishing, a little too much for a 4 man group dungeon, while in the VMSA i'm the only one there, and if i screw up something is my fault, in this dungeons you cannot carry on bad players.
In conclusion i'm ok with the nerf but if you nerf it remove the double undaunted reward.

The Inhibitor spawns more portals the more time goes by, the number isn't random. Portals also have what, like 4k health I think? Typically a tank uses some dps gear there(as you don't really need a tank) or something in order to be able to kill them faster. Alternatively, now that they removed the pinion DoT you could just have the tank hold Inhibitor full time(with someone taking her off him for the blue phase, then tank grabbing it again) pretty much - the person having agro there never gets portals. Also when she falls low on health she starts spawning crazy numbers of portals but you also get 2 people able to close them, not just one so that helps.

Kena mechanics are a little weird right now. I'm not sure if the stage overlap you get very frequently now is intended. Wall of lightning+atro? Had that happen maaaany times, it does hurt. I kind of like the challenge sometimes but I'm not even sure it's intended, there have never been any mentions of it in the patch notes or anything. This used to never happen before TG, she'd always finish one mechanic before starting another.

I don't think she's capable of killing "3 people at once" though, my guess is you got killed by DoT(or perhaps sweeped back to into the fire? There is that wonderful bug where you get knocked back by her frontal cone aoe even if you block). It really does hurt but you can avoid it or shield it off if you're magicka build(I'm not sure if it can be purified, too?)

EDIT: Imo the only fight that could really use less RNG is Warden. That one can be extremely painful even with a good team if RNG gods decide to hate you that day. Most other fights' mechanics are 100% predictable/counterable.

It was not our guild top team doing it i was with my stamplar with 16k of health the tank was our pure melee dude the other dd have some problems with the portals, the heal was really good, but even when we go with the top team where i usually tank we have some issues with the atronach portals and with the kena randomness.
Is not an easy mode dungeon and is fine like this but some rebalance will allow everyone in my guild to do it and is fine i believe .

I personally find icp more easy that wgt. Except for two bosses (the big fat flash atronac and the stop people with the poo) the rest is really easy.

There is nothing random in the kena fight...maybe the attronachs spawn. But hey, shouldn't be that big of a deal.

Tonnopesce · April 2016

Destruent wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

I found the mechanics in wgt really fun to do but sometimes the randomness of this game is crazy, yesterday we spent 30 minutes on the atronach boss due to the portals... damn portals.
On 6 try 4 of them where really nasty, the tank get 8-10 portals at once and while if it appens to me i can easy one shot them as a dd ( even when i tank i switch to full dd for this boss) our tank required 2 attacks to close them and it was to slow, finally in one round i got the portals two times and the heal got the third time and we done it.

The other big issue is Molag kena , ok you start with her and a random atronach pops at the beginning while she ' s doing the windscreen wiper all in the first 30 seconds... come on.
Other rounds is fine but then out of no where she kills tree people at once tank included...
too random imho, the mechanics are not predictable and the " easy mode" is too easy compared to the hard mode.

Is hard ok but is even punishing, a little too much for a 4 man group dungeon, while in the VMSA i'm the only one there, and if i screw up something is my fault, in this dungeons you cannot carry on bad players.
In conclusion i'm ok with the nerf but if you nerf it remove the double undaunted reward.

The Inhibitor spawns more portals the more time goes by, the number isn't random. Portals also have what, like 4k health I think? Typically a tank uses some dps gear there(as you don't really need a tank) or something in order to be able to kill them faster. Alternatively, now that they removed the pinion DoT you could just have the tank hold Inhibitor full time(with someone taking her off him for the blue phase, then tank grabbing it again) pretty much - the person having agro there never gets portals. Also when she falls low on health she starts spawning crazy numbers of portals but you also get 2 people able to close them, not just one so that helps.

Kena mechanics are a little weird right now. I'm not sure if the stage overlap you get very frequently now is intended. Wall of lightning+atro? Had that happen maaaany times, it does hurt. I kind of like the challenge sometimes but I'm not even sure it's intended, there have never been any mentions of it in the patch notes or anything. This used to never happen before TG, she'd always finish one mechanic before starting another.

I don't think she's capable of killing "3 people at once" though, my guess is you got killed by DoT(or perhaps sweeped back to into the fire? There is that wonderful bug where you get knocked back by her frontal cone aoe even if you block). It really does hurt but you can avoid it or shield it off if you're magicka build(I'm not sure if it can be purified, too?)

EDIT: Imo the only fight that could really use less RNG is Warden. That one can be extremely painful even with a good team if RNG gods decide to hate you that day. Most other fights' mechanics are 100% predictable/counterable.

It was not our guild top team doing it i was with my stamplar with 16k of health the tank was our pure melee dude the other dd have some problems with the portals, the heal was really good, but even when we go with the top team where i usually tank we have some issues with the atronach portals and with the kena randomness.
Is not an easy mode dungeon and is fine like this but some rebalance will allow everyone in my guild to do it and is fine i believe .

I personally find icp more easy that wgt. Except for two bosses (the big fat flash atronac and the stop people with the poo) the rest is really easy.

There is nothing random in the kena fight...maybe the attronachs spawn. But hey, shouldn't be that big of a deal.

So you are telling me that when she spawns the lightning and tree atronach in a row, or when you can take her to 80% without no mechanics or when the atronach spawn right in the head of the target is not ruled by RNG gods?

Molag_Crow · April 2016

Agreed with OP.

Destruent · April 2016

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

I found the mechanics in wgt really fun to do but sometimes the randomness of this game is crazy, yesterday we spent 30 minutes on the atronach boss due to the portals... damn portals.
On 6 try 4 of them where really nasty, the tank get 8-10 portals at once and while if it appens to me i can easy one shot them as a dd ( even when i tank i switch to full dd for this boss) our tank required 2 attacks to close them and it was to slow, finally in one round i got the portals two times and the heal got the third time and we done it.

The other big issue is Molag kena , ok you start with her and a random atronach pops at the beginning while she ' s doing the windscreen wiper all in the first 30 seconds... come on.
Other rounds is fine but then out of no where she kills tree people at once tank included...
too random imho, the mechanics are not predictable and the " easy mode" is too easy compared to the hard mode.

Is hard ok but is even punishing, a little too much for a 4 man group dungeon, while in the VMSA i'm the only one there, and if i screw up something is my fault, in this dungeons you cannot carry on bad players.
In conclusion i'm ok with the nerf but if you nerf it remove the double undaunted reward.

The Inhibitor spawns more portals the more time goes by, the number isn't random. Portals also have what, like 4k health I think? Typically a tank uses some dps gear there(as you don't really need a tank) or something in order to be able to kill them faster. Alternatively, now that they removed the pinion DoT you could just have the tank hold Inhibitor full time(with someone taking her off him for the blue phase, then tank grabbing it again) pretty much - the person having agro there never gets portals. Also when she falls low on health she starts spawning crazy numbers of portals but you also get 2 people able to close them, not just one so that helps.

Kena mechanics are a little weird right now. I'm not sure if the stage overlap you get very frequently now is intended. Wall of lightning+atro? Had that happen maaaany times, it does hurt. I kind of like the challenge sometimes but I'm not even sure it's intended, there have never been any mentions of it in the patch notes or anything. This used to never happen before TG, she'd always finish one mechanic before starting another.

I don't think she's capable of killing "3 people at once" though, my guess is you got killed by DoT(or perhaps sweeped back to into the fire? There is that wonderful bug where you get knocked back by her frontal cone aoe even if you block). It really does hurt but you can avoid it or shield it off if you're magicka build(I'm not sure if it can be purified, too?)

EDIT: Imo the only fight that could really use less RNG is Warden. That one can be extremely painful even with a good team if RNG gods decide to hate you that day. Most other fights' mechanics are 100% predictable/counterable.

It was not our guild top team doing it i was with my stamplar with 16k of health the tank was our pure melee dude the other dd have some problems with the portals, the heal was really good, but even when we go with the top team where i usually tank we have some issues with the atronach portals and with the kena randomness.
Is not an easy mode dungeon and is fine like this but some rebalance will allow everyone in my guild to do it and is fine i believe .

I personally find icp more easy that wgt. Except for two bosses (the big fat flash atronac and the stop people with the poo) the rest is really easy.

There is nothing random in the kena fight...maybe the attronachs spawn. But hey, shouldn't be that big of a deal.

So you are telling me that when she spawns the lightning and tree atronach in a row, or when you can take her to 80% without no mechanics or when the atronach spawn right in the head of the target is not ruled by RNG gods?

attronach spawn is random. And she chooses to either spawn the lanes or those little lightnings all over the floor. But she has a some seconds long animation to spawn them. Btw. if the attronach did spawn on top of his target you just didn't understand the mechanic and did something wrong.

Dubhliam · April 2016

Zerok wrote: »

Samphaa wrote: »

Zerok wrote: »

I developed a profound dislike for vWGT and vICP because they are very unforgiving. If one person in your team makes a small mistake, all the group will die.

I consider myself a casual player. I like a challenge, but these dungeons are just too much for my playstyle. When they are the gold pledge, I (usually) skip them.

I made an exception today because some guildmates requested my help for vWGT. We made it to the final boss, and then we spent 30-45 minutes trying to finish it.

After 10+ wipes, the best we could do is to get her to 18%. In the end, I lost 2 hours for nothing (it was not even fun).

I'm not doing this again (at least before they nerf it). I have other things to do.

If these dungeons are intended for the hardcore players, I think they should at least make another gold pledge for the casual players.

The first time I did tower it took us 5 1/2 hours, we got stuck on kena for half of that time. Now we clear tower in under 30 mins and I've 3 manned it on hard mode. It's just practise and group synergy, nothing special.

Find a team and stick with them, learn each others strength, don't go in there with a random group everytime, fail and then complain it's too hard, because it's not, it just requires a small amount of coordination.

And you already have 8 other pledges for casual players...

Good for you, but I don't have time for this.

I'm not asking for a nerf, I'm asking for an alternative gold key when these dungeons are the pledges.

Why should there be an alternative?
You get a silver key if you complete the White Gold Tower veteran pledge on normal mode.

There's your alternative.

Or is normal WGT also something you don't have time for?

Refuse2GrowUp · April 2016

dimensional wrote: »

nordsavage wrote: »

If you cannot break 15k dps you need to rethink things.

Or maybe you just don't have the gear, or are on the lower end of the veteran spectrum? Remember, these vet dungeons are supposed to be meant for all veteran rank characters, but the gulf of power between a VR1 and a VR 16 is still huge, even with the scaling. Gear is a huge factor. I'd like to be able to some more of the vet dungeons on my lower level vet characters but the numbers difference is huge.

Who says yo are meant to be able to successfully get thru vWGT and vICP at v1? There is nothing wrong with some dungeons being a little bit harder and taking a bit more work and leveling to get thru. Not everything in this game should be a cake walks. Disney makes games for that. Some things should be a bit of a challenge. CoA, WGT, and ICP are too easy as is, with only ICP posing even a little challenge.

Wifeaggro13 · April 2016

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

They don't just require you to know the tactics, but also require massive dps. As a healer I can't control that very much and usually get people with average dps and no matter how much I can heal, eventually things get messy and we die if we can't kill the boss fast enough.

I'd imagine even if I was a good dps I'd need the other one to be also very good and the healer and tank to do their jobs well.

I did beat all of them on hard mode a couple of times, the problem is actually trying to get the items they drop.

Every 5 teams I get one team that can actually do them and even with that we wipe quite a few times and we all have done them before and know the tactics very well, how can I get Kena helm that way let alone spellpower cure set.

I believe that lowering boss healths while making them invulnerable to do a tactic every now and then will fix the dps race this game has become, but its true these dungeon need a slight nerf so that people without the crazy high dps can actually play them or at least do their dailies!!

All the group content was designed around DPS with no thought to CC or Tanking mechanics.

Apherius · April 2016

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

but its true these dungeon need a slight nerf so that people without the crazy high dps can actually play them or at least do their dailies!!

NO !!!!!!!!!!!! go back to banished cell in easy mode if you are no happy with the difficulty . WE HM PVE player , we need Difficulty ! you have 16 dungeon to your lvl , WE HM PVE player's we have only 2 ! ... why people alway's want nerf because it's difficult -_____________-'

daemonios · April 2016

Zerok wrote: »

I developed a profound dislike for vWGT and vICP because they are very unforgiving. If one person in your team makes a small mistake, all the group will die.

I consider myself a casual player. I like a challenge, but these dungeons are just too much for my playstyle. When they are the gold pledge, I (usually) skip them.

I made an exception today because some guildmates requested my help for vWGT. We made it to the final boss, and then we spent 30-45 minutes trying to finish it.

After 10+ wipes, the best we could do is to get her to 18%. In the end, I lost 2 hours for nothing (it was not even fun).

I'm not doing this again (at least before they nerf it). I have other things to do.

If these dungeons are intended for the hardcore players, I think they should at least make another gold pledge for the casual players.

So, because you can't be bothered to learn to deal with the last stage of Kena, it should be nerfed for everyone?

Hint: harness magicka absorbs most damage from the double rotating lightning, as do other shields; stamina builds can roll dodge these AoE with 0 damage but need to manage their stamina and positioning so they don't need to dodge again immediately. If you have the discipline you can have the group stack within a small area and have the healer spam healing springs and breath of life, while the team tried to move out of the AoE as fast as possible to mitigate the damage. In my experience the people who die the most here are DDs who only want to nuke the boss and completely ignore everything else.