The problem with VCoA, VICP and VWGT

Magdalina

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

They don't just require you to know the tactics, but also require massive dps. As a healer I can't control that very much and usually get people with average dps and no matter how much I can heal, eventually things get messy and we die if we can't kill the boss fast enough.

I'd imagine even if I was a good dps I'd need the other one to be also very good and the healer and tank to do their jobs well.

I did beat all of them on hard mode a couple of times, the problem is actually trying to get the items they drop.

Every 5 teams I get one team that can actually do them and even with that we wipe quite a few times and we all have done them before and know the tactics very well, how can I get Kena helm that way let alone spellpower cure set.

I believe that lowering boss healths while making them invulnerable to do a tactic every now and then will fix the dps race this game has become, but its true these dungeon need a slight nerf so that people without the crazy high dps can actually play them or at least do their dailies!!

All the group content was designed around DPS with no thought to CC or Tanking mechanics.

Actually ICP is probably the last dungeon in the game where you might have to think about mechanics rather than just dps(though OP dps will still let you bypass most mechanics).

And now they're going to nerf it. Of course everything is about dps race - when there're no mechanics featured it just comes down to how fast you can melt the boss...>.<

In 1.5 we actually had a great ton of mechanics requiring great tanking and healing, you know. Gods forbid you tried to do 1.5 Spindle without a tank. Better yet BC(speaking about CC...). But the way it's been nerfed now? Yeah it's just a dps race because everything hits like a wet noodle and there's close to 0 punishment for just ignoring mechanics.

failkiwib16_ESO

>.<

Honestly if ZOS gives us a new dungeon, I think people will be fine with getting these dungeons nerfed.

Destruent

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

>.<

Honestly if ZOS gives us a new dungeon, I think people will be fine with getting these dungeons nerfed.

This....nerf them into the ground, make them as easy as the starter-zones, i don't mind. but give us one or two dungeons with endgame-difficulty

failkiwib16_ESO

Destruent wrote: »

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

>.<

Honestly if ZOS gives us a new dungeon, I think people will be fine with getting these dungeons nerfed.

This....nerf them into the ground, make them as easy as the starter-zones, i don't mind. but give us one or two dungeons with endgame-difficulty

It's kinda sad to think about, because I don't really get exitement anymore even from ICP, WGT and COA.

COA is a complete joke, if didn't join groups as a healer but as a DD, I could carry most groups through. Last time I spent 3+ hours in there though, as a healer in warlock + seducer spamming BoL nonstop and we never finished the endboss ...so I also understand why people want it nerfed.

Magdalina

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

>.<

Honestly if ZOS gives us a new dungeon, I think people will be fine with getting these dungeons nerfed.

This....nerf them into the ground, make them as easy as the starter-zones, i don't mind. but give us one or two dungeons with endgame-difficulty

It's kinda sad to think about, because I don't really get exitement anymore even from ICP, WGT and COA.

COA is a complete joke, if didn't join groups as a healer but as a DD, I could carry most groups through. Last time I spent 3+ hours in there though, as a healer in warlock + seducer spamming BoL nonstop and we never finished the endboss ...so I also understand why people want it nerfed.

I don't understand why people must ask for nerfs rather than help/advice

Inig0

A las, not only is ZOS pushing away its innately talented players but now the community is trying to push them away too.

I get it, these dungeons arent easy for everyone and some people feel left out because they cant complete it. Honestly thats great! That means that people like Deltias existence actually has a purpose! He can and will help you.

The content in this game has always gone from very difficult to nerfed to the ground beyond recognition. Is that really what people want? The content to be nerfed so hard the group content becomes soloable like whats happening to dungeons like spindle.

Anyone who cant complete these dungeons you have all the resources you need to get them done and trust me you -- when you complete it you will feel great about it. All you need is a build video and walk through video which are all readily available. The most important thing though that you need is the dedication to perform!

The idea that you feel you should be able to do dailies at non-lvl cap is absurd. The whole purpose for dailies is to give people at level cap something to do beside broken pvp. If youre not level cap and youre complaining about content being too hard you are sorely misrepresenting the content. You still have quests or grinding to do go level!

I know this is a lot of people first mmo but mmos are suppose to be hard and require people to work together to accomplish things. So please take the time use your resources and learn from your mistakes before you start claiming very doable content is too hard.

ps in the TG build doing 18dps is the standard. On the high end people are breaking 40k dps. So please take that into consideration. We are given ways to do that high dps and youre asking to make the content easier.. do you want them to just mail you the loot too?

Destruent

Inig0 wrote: »

ps in the TG build doing 18dps is the standard. On the high end people are breaking 40k dps. So please take that into consideration. We are given ways to do that high dps and youre asking to make the content easier.. do you want them to just mail you the loot too?

This....my V2-Stam-DK is usually doing 10k...15k (sometimes even 20k) DPS ST. Gear is purple and V1, no setjewelry, all crafted gear. If you can't reach this at V16 you really need to think about build/playstyle if you want to do the hardest dungeons. If you can, it's enough for those 4-men-dungeons.

Rafishul

I liked that FFXIV had normal, hard, and extreme modes. Adding another, higher level of difficulty whetted the appetites of many of the higher-end players and provided another stepping stone for folks looking to achieve. Perhaps something like this could be implemented?

Shunravi

Rafishul wrote: »

I liked that FFXIV had normal, hard, and extreme modes. Adding another, higher level of difficulty whetted the appetites of many of the higher-end players and provided another stepping stone for folks looking to achieve. Perhaps something like this could be implemented?

sure. but guess what would be next to be nerfed

zergbase_ESO

This post I can agree with somewhat. Due to pugs are random some can be good and others tend to be... Lets leave it at that. But from what has been said these dungeons are getting a nerf soon. So content might be passable for the un-average joe, Or person that dislikes finding a group of like minded individuals that can coordinate properly for them.

failkiwib16_ESO

Magdalina wrote: »

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

>.<

Honestly if ZOS gives us a new dungeon, I think people will be fine with getting these dungeons nerfed.

This....nerf them into the ground, make them as easy as the starter-zones, i don't mind. but give us one or two dungeons with endgame-difficulty

It's kinda sad to think about, because I don't really get exitement anymore even from ICP, WGT and COA.

COA is a complete joke, if didn't join groups as a healer but as a DD, I could carry most groups through. Last time I spent 3+ hours in there though, as a healer in warlock + seducer spamming BoL nonstop and we never finished the endboss ...so I also understand why people want it nerfed.

I don't understand why people must ask for nerfs rather than help/advice

I think it's because of these 3 types of players:

• Innocent: group up, pick up pledge and head for dungeon - do their best and can not complete, don't have enough experience to know that some dungeons are much harder than others - and since ESO doesn't provide difficulty indicators at pledges, they think it is supposed to be achieveable.
• Guilty: they know better, they have experience but choose to bring their experimental play-as-you-want build and gear to random groups, and contribute poorly with their role. Due to the fact that these players are experienced, they have friends that can carry them through content, mainly because they are fun to hang around with - when they join like minded players or the "innocent" cathegory players, they typically end up hitting a wall and can not complete the dungeon - which ruins their fun and they want it nerfed, so they can have fun builds in hard dungeons.
• Self entitled: these players defeat Molag Bal and go straight for whatever dungeon that seems like the most shiny, and just because they can enter it, they also demand to be able to beat it without dedication. Roleplayers who demand the skin from vMOL for roleplaying purpose fall into this cathegory. They demand the skin to be given to them as a reward for roleplaying and not completing vMOL- despite roleplaying not being in any part of ESO's gameplay.

RedRoomGaming

Why do people complain about vCoA? Yeah sure public groups are annoying because people don't know their roles properly but it is pretty darn easy once you have done it once.

disintegr8

I think the biggest issue with these dungeons and PUG is communications. I play on PS4, always run dungeons through PUG, and am always on group chat, but I would say that less than 10% of the time is everyone on group chat. I know that not everyone has a working mic, maybe the one that came with their PS4 got eaten by the dog or something, but if they cannot talk to you and make no other attempt to communicate, many dungeons are harder than they need to be.

Completed my first ever run though WGT (non vet) the other day through random dungeon and group finder with my Vr2 tank. I told the group I had not done it before and was explained the mechanics as we went. We wiped a couple of times against Planar Inhibitor and I died a couple of times against Molag Kena (no wipes though) but we got the job done - through communicating.

I know it was only on normal but I now have far less fear of this dungeon thanks to the guys in the group.

Vangy

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

Oh come on guys 12k??? I been in parties way more than that and since the bosses didnt get burned fast enough things got really out of hand.

Don't know where you got the 12k number, but i'm sure its a lot more than that, if i spam my shards I can do 14k.

Yeah i have a PvE guild but they are not always available and so I need to search in general.

I'm in PC EU btw

12k IS enough if everyone does the mechanics properly. For instance, horvatund the firemaw fight. If your DPS are only capable of putting out 12k ST, they should be able to put out 20k+ aoe damage easily. For this fight, ensure adds go down asap. They are triggered based on boss health. Not timer. So once adds start spawning STOP dps on boss and frag adds. Avoid bad red circles and boss smashy smashy. Rinse and repeat. = win. For valkys (another example), dont do it on hard mode because you simply dont have the damage with 12k (which is verrrrrry low.) With 15k, just follow mechanics and boss will go down by the time last platform is down. -_-"

The people who burn boss before adds even spawn and bypass mechanics are running a perfect group. Ie, I run this with 3 friends. 1 sorc DPS, Me(stam DK), templar heals and sap tank. We run warhorn, combat prayer, SPC and overload. Basically boss dead in under 45 seconds with DPS pulling 30-40k. But thats with EVERY buff in the game and ultis burned lol. You cant expect this kind of DPS in a pug...

Tonnopesce

Destruent wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

I found the mechanics in wgt really fun to do but sometimes the randomness of this game is crazy, yesterday we spent 30 minutes on the atronach boss due to the portals... damn portals.
On 6 try 4 of them where really nasty, the tank get 8-10 portals at once and while if it appens to me i can easy one shot them as a dd ( even when i tank i switch to full dd for this boss) our tank required 2 attacks to close them and it was to slow, finally in one round i got the portals two times and the heal got the third time and we done it.

The other big issue is Molag kena , ok you start with her and a random atronach pops at the beginning while she ' s doing the windscreen wiper all in the first 30 seconds... come on.
Other rounds is fine but then out of no where she kills tree people at once tank included...
too random imho, the mechanics are not predictable and the " easy mode" is too easy compared to the hard mode.

Is hard ok but is even punishing, a little too much for a 4 man group dungeon, while in the VMSA i'm the only one there, and if i screw up something is my fault, in this dungeons you cannot carry on bad players.
In conclusion i'm ok with the nerf but if you nerf it remove the double undaunted reward.

The Inhibitor spawns more portals the more time goes by, the number isn't random. Portals also have what, like 4k health I think? Typically a tank uses some dps gear there(as you don't really need a tank) or something in order to be able to kill them faster. Alternatively, now that they removed the pinion DoT you could just have the tank hold Inhibitor full time(with someone taking her off him for the blue phase, then tank grabbing it again) pretty much - the person having agro there never gets portals. Also when she falls low on health she starts spawning crazy numbers of portals but you also get 2 people able to close them, not just one so that helps.

Kena mechanics are a little weird right now. I'm not sure if the stage overlap you get very frequently now is intended. Wall of lightning+atro? Had that happen maaaany times, it does hurt. I kind of like the challenge sometimes but I'm not even sure it's intended, there have never been any mentions of it in the patch notes or anything. This used to never happen before TG, she'd always finish one mechanic before starting another.

I don't think she's capable of killing "3 people at once" though, my guess is you got killed by DoT(or perhaps sweeped back to into the fire? There is that wonderful bug where you get knocked back by her frontal cone aoe even if you block). It really does hurt but you can avoid it or shield it off if you're magicka build(I'm not sure if it can be purified, too?)

EDIT: Imo the only fight that could really use less RNG is Warden. That one can be extremely painful even with a good team if RNG gods decide to hate you that day. Most other fights' mechanics are 100% predictable/counterable.

It was not our guild top team doing it i was with my stamplar with 16k of health the tank was our pure melee dude the other dd have some problems with the portals, the heal was really good, but even when we go with the top team where i usually tank we have some issues with the atronach portals and with the kena randomness.
Is not an easy mode dungeon and is fine like this but some rebalance will allow everyone in my guild to do it and is fine i believe .

I personally find icp more easy that wgt. Except for two bosses (the big fat flash atronac and the stop people with the poo) the rest is really easy.

There is nothing random in the kena fight...maybe the attronachs spawn. But hey, shouldn't be that big of a deal.

So you are telling me that when she spawns the lightning and tree atronach in a row, or when you can take her to 80% without no mechanics or when the atronach spawn right in the head of the target is not ruled by RNG gods?

attronach spawn is random. And she chooses to either spawn the lanes or those little lightnings all over the floor. But she has a some seconds long animation to spawn them. Btw. if the attronach did spawn on top of his target you just didn't understand the mechanic and did something wrong.

What exactly ? Except killing the boss, avoid the lightning, don't get close to the border ecc.
Is fun since you are only telling me that i'm wrong nothing else, now i can do the VWGT without much of an issue but only when the whole team is at my level and it happens maybe 20% of the times, we are discussing the nerf because a lot of people cannot get even close to the final boss, and IMHO a good way to solve this can be Cap the number of portals spawn, reduce the dot damage for the atronach boss , and remove the mechanic randomness for Molag kena without destroying the entire dungeon, if the fights get predictable even if hard can be completed.

Or give a gold key even for the normal fight with Kena and move on.

Destruent

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

What exactly ? Except killing the boss, avoid the lightning, don't get close to the border ecc.
Is fun since you are only telling me that i'm wrong nothing else, now i can do the VWGT without much of an issue but only when the whole team is at my level and it happens maybe 20% of the times, we are discussing the nerf because a lot of people cannot get even close to the final boss, and IMHO a good way to solve this can be Cap the number of portals spawn, reduce the dot damage for the atronach boss , and remove the mechanic randomness for Molag kena without destroying the entire dungeon, if the fights get predictable even if hard can be completed.

Or give a gold key even for the normal fight with Kena and move on.

The attronach is attacking the target which has the biggest distance to his spawn location, so just spread out after attronach spawn (or make sure, the attronach just melts in AoE).

I'd support one goldkey for beating veteran-nonhardmode

edit: What??? Portals ARE capped. this number isn't random it doesn't grow indefinitely. And the DoT-Damage is already a joke. We did this with two magicka-NBs without any problems. As a templar heal i usually don't have to use BoL, bc rapid regen outheals most of the damage. Looks more like a problem with your tactic and/or group coordination.
I agree, this fight needs a bit of practice, but i think it's nice and completely unique. It's something different from stack and burn like on nearly all other bosses.
It's actually one out of 2 bosses in all 4-men-dungeons which cannot be done (or atleast not that easy) by just straight burning the boss and maybe adds near the boss.

And guess what will happen next? Someone will create a threat called: "Pls make some nice mechanics, only dpsing bosses and straight burn them is boring!" -->ZOS creates nice and new mechanics --> People complain about difficulty bc they are too lazy/dumb/unorganized to do the mechanics.

Magdalina

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

IMHO a good way to solve this can be Cap the number of portals spawn, reduce the dot damage for the atronach boss , and remove the mechanic randomness for Molag kena without destroying the entire dungeon, if the fights get predictable even if hard can be completed.

...the number of portals is capped? I won't tell you the exact number but I don't think it grows indefinitely. She spawns more as she drops low yes, but also 2 people get enabled to close them after some point. Fyi, with "OP"(OP being about 20k or even less btw, my core team doesn't pull 40k or anything) dps it's entirely possible to even close all the portals she spawns as she gets low with ONE person(when in fact you're able to do it with two). Also, once she drops to like 10-15% it's generally more practical to simply burn her, that's execute phase so you should generally be able to kill her way before anything spawns from those portals.

The DoT from the pinion has already been all but REMOVED...you don't even have to close it at all except in the blue stage, that's literally the only part of the fight when you get DoT. I for one am disappointed by this, I think this fight needs old DoT back - it was never a dps or healing check far as DoT goes, it was simply about coordination. You don't close the pinion? You die. Now we have you don't close the pinion - nothing happens til blue stage, then people "suddenly" die and get very surprised apparently.

If what you mean by Kena randomness is the stage overlap(like when you can get atro-stunned into wall of lightning long before execute phase even, or you can get shielding ads-stunned while it's still up as well), I agree it should be removed. It doesn't even look like it was ever intended to me(it also wasn't there before TG), that's just too much randomness. Wall of lightning has to finish before she does her other mechanics, even if it's just 0.5 second before imo. Well unless execute stage, she's always been able to spawn atros during that final wall of lightning. That aside, the only real randomness is who the atro targets I guess, and there is a kind of dps check far as how fast you can kill it, however he won't try to 1shot you until he's caught up with you, so you can dodge him for quite a while(or if you're a sorc, streak also works wonders). It's just important that everyone pays attention - the person targeted has to try to get away from the atro, the dps have to notice him and burn him down, not just get tunnel vision on Kena.

Destruent

Magdalina wrote: »

If what you mean by Kena randomness is the stage overlap(like when you can get atro-stunned into wall of lightning long before execute phase even, or you can get shielding ads-stunned while it's still up as well), I agree it should be removed. It doesn't even look like it was ever intended to me(it also wasn't there before TG), that's just too much randomness. Wall of lightning has to finish before she does her other mechanics, even if it's just 0.5 second before imo. Well unless execute stage, she's always been able to spawn atros during that final wall of lightning. That aside, the only real randomness is who the atro targets I guess, and there is a kind of dps check far as how fast you can kill it, however he won't try to 1shot you until he's caught up with you, so you can dodge him for quite a while(or if you're a sorc, streak also works wonders). It's just important that everyone pays attention - the person targeted has to try to get away from the atro, the dps have to notice him and burn him down, not just get tunnel vision on Kena.

afaik the attro targets the player with the biggest distance to his spawn location.

Zerok

daemonios wrote: »

So, because you can't be bothered to learn to deal with the last stage of Kena, it should be nerfed for everyone?

Did you read my post at all? I was asking for an alternative gold key when vWGT and vICP are the pledges.

Frankly, I don't care what ZOS does to those dungeons.

Hint: harness magicka absorbs most damage from the double rotating lightning, as do other shields; stamina builds can roll dodge these AoE with 0 damage but need to manage their stamina and positioning so they don't need to dodge again immediately. If you have the discipline you can have the group stack within a small area and have the healer spam healing springs and breath of life, while the team tried to move out of the AoE as fast as possible to mitigate the damage. In my experience the people who die the most here are DDs who only want to nuke the boss and completely ignore everything else.

Hint: don't bother with these dungeons and you won't get frustrated

I mean, in the end the goal is to have fun and these dungeons, they are not fun. That's just how it is.

Destruent

Zerok wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

So, because you can't be bothered to learn to deal with the last stage of Kena, it should be nerfed for everyone?

Did you read my post at all? I was asking for an alternative gold key when vWGT and vICP are the pledges.

Frankly, I don't care what ZOS does to those dungeons.

Hint: harness magicka absorbs most damage from the double rotating lightning, as do other shields; stamina builds can roll dodge these AoE with 0 damage but need to manage their stamina and positioning so they don't need to dodge again immediately. If you have the discipline you can have the group stack within a small area and have the healer spam healing springs and breath of life, while the team tried to move out of the AoE as fast as possible to mitigate the damage. In my experience the people who die the most here are DDs who only want to nuke the boss and completely ignore everything else.

Hint: don't bother with these dungeons and you won't get frustrated

I mean, in the end the goal is to have fun and these dungeons, they are not fun for me. That's just how it is.

fify

There are lots of players who enjoyed the difficulty at IC-release.

code65536

Zerok wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

So, because you can't be bothered to learn to deal with the last stage of Kena, it should be nerfed for everyone?

Did you read my post at all? I was asking for an alternative gold key when vWGT and vICP are the pledges.

There already is an alternative. It's called nWGT and nICP. Faceroll through those for a silver key. Not 2 gold keys, but then again, beggars can't be choosers.

DisgracefulMind

Okay, I get everyone's point and all, but vCOA should be left untouched. It's completely fine. At this point with the vICP and vWGT arguments everywhere, I don't care enough anymore if they're nerfed or not. They're easy mode for me and the people I play with as is, so once they're nerfed they'll just be easier for me to farm. But vCOA...seriously. It's fine. I've gone in there healerless and no-deathed it ffs. The Maw dies in 10 seconds. Valkyn Skoria doesn't break the second platform most of the time...I understand everyone wants free candy, but don't ask for more nerfs, just learn mechanics. .-.

Zerok

code65536 wrote: »

Zerok wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

So, because you can't be bothered to learn to deal with the last stage of Kena, it should be nerfed for everyone?

Did you read my post at all? I was asking for an alternative gold key when vWGT and vICP are the pledges.

There already is an alternative. It's called nWGT and nICP. Faceroll through those for a silver key. Not 2 gold keys, but then again, beggars can't be choosers.

Beggars? Please keep this thread civilized. I'm merely providing suggestions here. You can disagree with others but you must respect them.

I don't get why some people wouldn't agree with an alternative vet dungeon when vWGT and vICP are the gold pledges.

You would still get 2 gold keys from completing vWGT and vICP, but only one gold key from the alternative dungeon. It seems fair.

If it's not, then I guess nerfing vWGT or vICP could also work. But oh wait, some people don't want that either. According to these people, these dungeons are perfectly balanced because 0.1% of the player base can complete them.

Destruent

Zerok wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Zerok wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

So, because you can't be bothered to learn to deal with the last stage of Kena, it should be nerfed for everyone?

Did you read my post at all? I was asking for an alternative gold key when vWGT and vICP are the pledges.

There already is an alternative. It's called nWGT and nICP. Faceroll through those for a silver key. Not 2 gold keys, but then again, beggars can't be choosers.

Beggars? Please keep this thread civilized. I'm merely providing suggestions here. You can disagree with others but you must respect them.

I don't get why some people wouldn't agree with an alternative vet dungeon when vWGT and vICP are the gold pledges.

You would still get 2 gold keys from completing vWGT and vICP, but only one gold key from the alternative dungeon. It seems fair.

If it's not, then I guess nerfing vWGT or vICP could also work. But oh wait, some people don't want that either. According to these people, these dungeons are perfectly balanced because 0.1% of the player base can complete them.

You get the same from the silver key as you get from the goldkey...so what's the problem with it?

Zerok

Destruent wrote: »

Zerok wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Zerok wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

So, because you can't be bothered to learn to deal with the last stage of Kena, it should be nerfed for everyone?

Did you read my post at all? I was asking for an alternative gold key when vWGT and vICP are the pledges.

There already is an alternative. It's called nWGT and nICP. Faceroll through those for a silver key. Not 2 gold keys, but then again, beggars can't be choosers.

Beggars? Please keep this thread civilized. I'm merely providing suggestions here. You can disagree with others but you must respect them.

I don't get why some people wouldn't agree with an alternative vet dungeon when vWGT and vICP are the gold pledges.

You would still get 2 gold keys from completing vWGT and vICP, but only one gold key from the alternative dungeon. It seems fair.

If it's not, then I guess nerfing vWGT or vICP could also work. But oh wait, some people don't want that either. According to these people, these dungeons are perfectly balanced because 0.1% of the player base can complete them.

You get the same from the silver key as you get from the goldkey...so what's the problem with it?

Silver keys give nothing of interest.

The only good reason to do silver pledges is to level your undaunted skill line.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Destruent wrote: »

You get the same from the silver key as you get from the goldkey...so what's the problem with it?

Of course not. Drop rate of shoulders is muuuuch lower on silver.

Woeler

"massive dps", you're joking right, right?

Magdalina

Destruent wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

If what you mean by Kena randomness is the stage overlap(like when you can get atro-stunned into wall of lightning long before execute phase even, or you can get shielding ads-stunned while it's still up as well), I agree it should be removed. It doesn't even look like it was ever intended to me(it also wasn't there before TG), that's just too much randomness. Wall of lightning has to finish before she does her other mechanics, even if it's just 0.5 second before imo. Well unless execute stage, she's always been able to spawn atros during that final wall of lightning. That aside, the only real randomness is who the atro targets I guess, and there is a kind of dps check far as how fast you can kill it, however he won't try to 1shot you until he's caught up with you, so you can dodge him for quite a while(or if you're a sorc, streak also works wonders). It's just important that everyone pays attention - the person targeted has to try to get away from the atro, the dps have to notice him and burn him down, not just get tunnel vision on Kena.

afaik the attro targets the player with the biggest distance to his spawn location.

Hm might be I suppose, not sure lol.
I guess that still leaves some randomness as to the spawn location(and possibly being unable to get far enough away from it), but not that much.

Zerok wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

Zerok wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Zerok wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

So, because you can't be bothered to learn to deal with the last stage of Kena, it should be nerfed for everyone?

Did you read my post at all? I was asking for an alternative gold key when vWGT and vICP are the pledges.

There already is an alternative. It's called nWGT and nICP. Faceroll through those for a silver key. Not 2 gold keys, but then again, beggars can't be choosers.

Beggars? Please keep this thread civilized. I'm merely providing suggestions here. You can disagree with others but you must respect them.

I don't get why some people wouldn't agree with an alternative vet dungeon when vWGT and vICP are the gold pledges.

You would still get 2 gold keys from completing vWGT and vICP, but only one gold key from the alternative dungeon. It seems fair.

If it's not, then I guess nerfing vWGT or vICP could also work. But oh wait, some people don't want that either. According to these people, these dungeons are perfectly balanced because 0.1% of the player base can complete them.

You get the same from the silver key as you get from the goldkey...so what's the problem with it?

Silver keys give nothing of interest.

The only good reason to do silver pledges is to level your undaunted skill line.

...silver keys give you the very same shoulders that gold keys do, except in blue quality? The dropchance is lower but I've gotten shoulders from silver chests before. If your issue lies with purple tempers for the upgrade, I can even send you some of my 300-400 purple tempers if you like(and if you're PC NA)...

Zerok wrote: »

I mean, in the end the goal is to have fun and these dungeons, they are not fun. That's just how it is.

Them not being fun for you doesn't make them ultimately unfun
I personally find fishing boring as heck. I cannot be bothered with it even for the achievement. It doesn't mean fishing needs to be removed from the game though, does it?

That said, I kind of like them being in the pledge rotation, it encourages people to try them at least, but they badly need some sort of notification warning people they're much harder than the other. Also, if the choice is between no ICP/WGT pledge+no nerf and ICP/WGT pledge+nerf I'll take the first one.

IwakuraLain42

Zerok wrote: »

Silver keys give nothing of interest.

The only good reason to do silver pledges is to level your undaunted skill line.

That's actually not true, they can yield the same monster pieces as the gold chest but in blue quality and with a lower probability.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Zerok wrote: »

Beggars? Please keep this thread civilized. I'm merely providing suggestions here. You can disagree with others but you must respect them.

I don't get why some people wouldn't agree with an alternative vet dungeon when vWGT and vICP are the gold pledges.

You would still get 2 gold keys from completing vWGT and vICP, but only one gold key from the alternative dungeon. It seems fair.

If it's not, then I guess nerfing vWGT or vICP could also work. But oh wait, some people don't want that either. According to these people, these dungeons are perfectly balanced because 0.1% of the player base can complete them.

Very true.
Good players should realize that the tone they use (here or ingame) is most of the times NOT very like likely to encourage other players to get better and join their ranks.

Actually that's the main reason why I stopped working on my build and rotation after having reached the average 15/18K DPS, and also stopped running those dungeons. I've not interest running with (some) good players anyway. And one is enough to pollute the atmosphere of an entire group.