Final straw.

LadyNalcarya · February 2016

starkerealm wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

hydrocynus wrote: »

OP Simple honest question: you are doing it in veteran mode right?

If so count yourself lucky. You are one of the few that can actually finish it. I can't even get past round 3 so I don't even get a shot at opening the chest.

Well, clearing vMA is not about luck...
Getting weapons is another story.

Lucky enough to be both good enough to clear it and have friends (or at least guildmates) who are also good enough to clear it.

I've certainly gotten screwed out of endgame progression in games on the second part, and, unfortunately, that is luck based.

Well... I have extremely bad luck with vMA. Im getting terrible lag and random fps drops, Im getting kicked to login screen, I'm getting mobs stuck with 0% hp and still alive... But still, Im able to beat it.
Getting weapons with this rng is another story. But just clearing it is quite possible for a decent player.

Yeah, I've been in runs, (not in ESO, mind you), where the entire team ground our faces off on a boss because one or two players couldn't carry their weight. I've had a few bad Vet Dungeon runs, but most of those boiled down to all of us being a little off our feed. It happens. It's still luck, though.

But vMA is a solo instance, so you can only rely on yourself.
And just clearing vMA is not about luck, its about knowing spawn points and boss mechanics. No amount of luck will help you if you let the dremoras summon that bone colossus, for example.
Luck is only needed if you want certain weapons or no-death run.

starkerealm · February 2016

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

hydrocynus wrote: »

OP Simple honest question: you are doing it in veteran mode right?

If so count yourself lucky. You are one of the few that can actually finish it. I can't even get past round 3 so I don't even get a shot at opening the chest.

Well, clearing vMA is not about luck...
Getting weapons is another story.

Lucky enough to be both good enough to clear it and have friends (or at least guildmates) who are also good enough to clear it.

I've certainly gotten screwed out of endgame progression in games on the second part, and, unfortunately, that is luck based.

Well... I have extremely bad luck with vMA. Im getting terrible lag and random fps drops, Im getting kicked to login screen, I'm getting mobs stuck with 0% hp and still alive... But still, Im able to beat it.
Getting weapons with this rng is another story. But just clearing it is quite possible for a decent player.

Yeah, I've been in runs, (not in ESO, mind you), where the entire team ground our faces off on a boss because one or two players couldn't carry their weight. I've had a few bad Vet Dungeon runs, but most of those boiled down to all of us being a little off our feed. It happens. It's still luck, though.

But vMA is a solo instance, so you can only rely on yourself.
And just clearing vMA is not about luck, its about knowing spawn points and boss mechanics. No amount of luck will help you if you let the dremoras summon that bone colossus, for example.
Luck is only needed if you want certain weapons or no-death run.

You know, somehow, every time someone talks about vMA, I always think of VDSA... so... you know, that one's on me. >.<

failkiwib16_ESO · February 2016

starkerealm wrote: »

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

NoMoreChillies wrote: »

Bind on Pickup = Cancer of ESO MMOs

Fixed that for you...

But, you know, seriously, it's kinda true. BoP problems go way beyond just ESO. On top of that Bind to Character are the worst. At which point, we can just be thankful that this stuff isn't BtC. But, if they're insisting on sticking with a BoP system, at least make it token based.

X_X
Trophy achievements in eso used to be bound-on-pickup, now they are all bound-on-character. Since you can't really get loot other than leather/hide from animals way below your level, many veteran characters can't get collectibles achievements that they want, because those animals/creatures don't exist or there are too few of them in other parts of the game.

I have deconstructed a ton of engine guardian shoulders and helmets, and many other things such as vDSA master weapons - and I still miss my damn v16 divine spell power cure shoes - meanwhile my friends got v16 divine spell power cure shoes, but they want essense thief and jolting...so they deconstruct those Q.Q we can't trade, we can't sell, we don't get what we want = the system feels unrewarding and annoying.

I'm getting more and more angry while I type this... I really hate RNG and unrewarding BoP/BoC poop.

You're preaching to the choir here. I spent about five hours farming up a damn nix hound eye before the switch over happened, for my V15 pact character on a Dominion NB.

The trophy drops really should be account wide. I don't mean account bound, just, you unlock it on one, ALL of them get it. Same with Fish. Those achievements are such a pain. Especially since the only place you can get some of the Cyrodiil fish are down next to one of the Dominion gates.

I am a little worried, as my EP char is level 13 already. I am unsure wether I can continue farming nix hounds in stonefalls and continue to gain loot.

I agree that it should be account wide, these achievements are heavily based on RNG and which faction you are from. My main is from AD, and I've farmed warewolves in Glenumbra for hours to get the collectible and haven't gotten any yet. Same goes with Everfrost from Frost Atronachs ....I've farmed those for hours in Spellscar in craglorn and Imperial City, but 0 collectible.

starkerealm · February 2016

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

NoMoreChillies wrote: »

Bind on Pickup = Cancer of ESO MMOs

Fixed that for you...

But, you know, seriously, it's kinda true. BoP problems go way beyond just ESO. On top of that Bind to Character are the worst. At which point, we can just be thankful that this stuff isn't BtC. But, if they're insisting on sticking with a BoP system, at least make it token based.

X_X
Trophy achievements in eso used to be bound-on-pickup, now they are all bound-on-character. Since you can't really get loot other than leather/hide from animals way below your level, many veteran characters can't get collectibles achievements that they want, because those animals/creatures don't exist or there are too few of them in other parts of the game.

I have deconstructed a ton of engine guardian shoulders and helmets, and many other things such as vDSA master weapons - and I still miss my damn v16 divine spell power cure shoes - meanwhile my friends got v16 divine spell power cure shoes, but they want essense thief and jolting...so they deconstruct those Q.Q we can't trade, we can't sell, we don't get what we want = the system feels unrewarding and annoying.

I'm getting more and more angry while I type this... I really hate RNG and unrewarding BoP/BoC poop.

You're preaching to the choir here. I spent about five hours farming up a damn nix hound eye before the switch over happened, for my V15 pact character on a Dominion NB.

The trophy drops really should be account wide. I don't mean account bound, just, you unlock it on one, ALL of them get it. Same with Fish. Those achievements are such a pain. Especially since the only place you can get some of the Cyrodiil fish are down next to one of the Dominion gates.

I am a little worried, as my EP char is level 13 already. I am unsure wether I can continue farming nix hounds in stonefalls and continue to gain loot.

I agree that it should be account wide, these achievements are heavily based on RNG and which faction you are from. My main is from AD, and I've farmed warewolves in Glenumbra for hours to get the collectible and haven't gotten any yet. Same goes with Everfrost from Frost Atronachs ....I've farmed those for hours in Spellscar in craglorn and Imperial City, but 0 collectible.

IIRC, you can still farm the Frost Atronachs outside of the hollow city on your vet. It's the flesh atronachs that Dominion are screwed over on.

LadyNalcarya · February 2016

My char has tons of multifaceted eyes from dsa. At least 1 from every run, and once I got 4.
Would be nice if collectibles dropped in vMA, that would give it some extra value.

khele23eb17_ESO · February 2016

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

This is a game man, if you don't enjoy it, why are you doing it? Treating a game like a job will kill your drive to play, and your capacity to enjoy it.

Its a game, man. Why is it designed so that its guaranteed someone will always get screwed out of their rewards??

starkerealm · February 2016

khele23eb17_ESO wrote: »

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

This is a game man, if you don't enjoy it, why are you doing it? Treating a game like a job will kill your drive to play, and your capacity to enjoy it.

Its a game, man. Why is it designed so that its guaranteed someone will always get screwed out of their rewards??

It's not guaranteed, it's RNGesus taking bloody retribution on us for our perceived slights.

khele23eb17_ESO · February 2016

starkerealm wrote: »

khele23eb17_ESO wrote: »

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

This is a game man, if you don't enjoy it, why are you doing it? Treating a game like a job will kill your drive to play, and your capacity to enjoy it.

Its a game, man. Why is it designed so that its guaranteed someone will always get screwed out of their rewards??

It's not guaranteed, it's RNGesus taking bloody retribution on us for our perceived slights.

It is guaranteed. Its not guaranteed that YOU will get screwed but someone will. If 100k people try it some will get it on first, second or third try and some will need 100+ attempts to get what they need... Its statistics at this point. And its quite possible a few on the ass end of the bell curve wont get it at all (everyone's patience has limits).

And its not RNGesus, its a sucky design choice.

themdogesbite · February 2016

I love opening my rewards on mondays only too see my 6th bow and my 7th 1 hand and shield. Great reward system zos!!!

MishMash · February 2016

I agree with the OP. I think the majority can agree that so many bound items we get end up being destroyed. Another thing how many times have you ran the undaunted daily or not even the daily... and that one person the group was getting what we all were hoping for MULTIPLE times (multiple runs)... but the rest of us were NOT. In the end one person got the same amazing item 4 times in a row, and the rest of us got nothing! It was not based on whom did the most damage or lived the most or whatever ... it was not even random.

I mean come on now if I am wearing a v16 necklace, v16 ring, and a v15 ring... can the intelligence of this game not determine I need that last v16? Sure, I have to work for it, but I've been trying since Nov 2nd, I've done daily World Boss runs, opened well over 50 cases a day, but still no luck. Is there any intelligence in this game to determine what we already have?

I can understand where the OP is coming from. We have the patience to go all those rounds but after a LONG while... it starts to get old real quick.

Hope499 · February 2016

NoS_smoke wrote: »

I can no longer obtain cps and I don't need 20 staffs and 1h+s maelstrom weapons so am I missing something here. Or is this just how the game is suppose to work...I no this is on deaf ears I just had to vent man. So upset right now.

Just think how bored you would be if you got it your first run though. At least there is still something left for you to do, even if the RnG sucks.

Azarath_tiberius · February 2016

Yet an other thread for this games RNG system which the developers will completely ignore... This omerta from ZOS side needs to break fast.

@Wrobel we need to have a discussion about your RNG system. You can't avoid this all the time.. No, highering the drop rates of certain items wont do it this time. You need to remove certain RNG checks. For example (and as I said on an other thread):

Don't reward crap sets in last chests of vMA... No sane person wants Jack of Para Bellum (well-fitted) ffs.. 2 RNG checks are enough. 1) getting the item you want or not, 2) with the trait you want or no. And to make it even better make the sets BoE (Succesion, Glory, Winter Born etc etc).. Don't worry if your DLC is any good, people will buy it..
Up (by a lot imo) the cost of the Undaunted sets from the PvP vendor but at least let us choose the trait. There are 10 Undaunted sets right now (head + shoulder, so 20 items in total), IF each piece has a chance to come in only 3 out of the 9 traits (impen, divines, infused) AND the vendor has new sets available ONCE per week === ...well do the math your self but I'm pretty sure its more than 52 weeks for a chance to get ONE undaunted item in the trait you want..

khele23eb17_ESO · February 2016

Hope499 wrote: »

NoS_smoke wrote: »

I can no longer obtain cps and I don't need 20 staffs and 1h+s maelstrom weapons so am I missing something here. Or is this just how the game is suppose to work...I no this is on deaf ears I just had to vent man. So upset right now.

Just think how bored you would be if you got it your first run though. At least there is still something left for you to do, even if the RnG sucks.

This is even more reason why RNG is a bad choice. Getting BiS gear right away and never getting it are equally bad situations in an MMO reward system. And they are both inherent to RNG.

WalkingLegacy · February 2016

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

This is a game man, if you don't enjoy it, why are you doing it? Treating a game like a job will kill your drive to play, and your capacity to enjoy it.

Time input into game should be rewarding. It's ridiculous that if OP really has run 100 times and hasn't received an item drop he's looking for...

I would uninstall ESO in a fit of rage by throwing my whole PC into the horse pen and watch that crazy B uninstall games from my life.

failkiwib16_ESO · February 2016

starkerealm wrote: »

IIRC, you can still farm the Frost Atronachs outside of the hollow city on your vet. It's the flesh atronachs that Dominion are screwed over on.

True, but I still haven't gained a single Everfrost yet, because of poopy RNG, its the last one I need to unlock that dye Q.Q

I have given up on Flesh Atronachs, I can't think of a single place I can farm those, since my main is v16 AD.

@KoshkaMurka I have also recieved multifaced eye from the nix hounds in vDSA, however I gained it with my AD char. It will be very hard for me to find a competent group to do vDSA with in EP, since most of my friends from EP are pvp players.

There are like 4 nix hounds that spawn throughout the Slavers Pit stage.

LiquidSchwartz · February 2016

at least you can beat it :]

Essiaga · February 2016

NoS_smoke wrote: »

Age old tale I know but this is ridiculous. I'm coming up on my 120th VMA run and still no 2h. Not from weekly rewards and not one in any of my runs. I have lost so much time and my life doing content that was initially fun but now just feels like a never ending time suck. I did the same thing for Engine guardian shoulders and never got those. There has to be some other way...I have friends who got both the needed Maelstrom weapons in 10 runs. Yet I'm well over 100. So yeah man, I just don't get it. I feel like if you do the work you should get rewarded. I can no longer obtain cps and I don't need 20 staffs and 1h+s maelstrom weapons so am I missing something here. Or is this just how the game is suppose to work...I no this is on deaf ears I just had to vent man. So upset right now.

This is an issue throughout the game and it just gets more annoying at "end game" because the content doesn't change. In fact 'end game' content is shrinking (Craglorn and Trials) to force people into buying DLC for another grind towards the new gear. I only play low level characters now because the rewards don't matter at all, but of course they still stink. Once you can craft you have no reason to want non-set quest items.

Running dungeons for keys pretty much just guarantees decon items.

Trials are worthless, including DSA. Most dungeons and end game drops are still v14 which gets you no closer to crafting V16 gear (if you're still in that grind), so that you can be geared to the point to compete in VMA and IC dungeons, to be able to grind what they provide ... Even harvesting has been changed to RNG and requires crafting be leveled for a chance at max level mats. WTH was the point of that?

They game just isn't very rewarding and has become very tedious. Mix in some skills that have been broken since launch, lag, etc, and the ESO experience just feels like hassle. Every DLC I see less reason to play as ZOS stinks up new ideas to force us to play the same content again and again.

I hit level 26 yesterday, for 7th time. It feels more rewarding to then running at V16 toon. Which is why I don't plan to purchase DLC ever. It's just more of the same BS.

Heindrich · February 2016

Wow... 120 vMA runs? Serious?! Jeez...

I thought I had it bad with 43 vWGT runs, 0 masks...

reften · February 2016

NoS_smoke wrote: »

Age old tale I know but this is ridiculous. I'm coming up on my 120th VMA run and still no 2h. Not from weekly rewards and not one in any of my runs. I have lost so much time and my life doing content that was initially fun but now just feels like a never ending time suck. I did the same thing for Engine guardian shoulders and never got those. There has to be some other way...I have friends who got both the needed Maelstrom weapons in 10 runs. Yet I'm well over 100. So yeah man, I just don't get it. I feel like if you do the work you should get rewarded. I can no longer obtain cps and I don't need 20 staffs and 1h+s maelstrom weapons so am I missing something here. Or is this just how the game is suppose to work...I no this is on deaf ears I just had to vent man. So upset right now.

So lets say you get the 2H on the first try. Now you have everything you ever wanted in this game. You just play for the content....and you quickly get bored and leave.

Zos thinks that hanging the carrot out front of people will keep them around longer, on average, then giving everyone the opportunity to easily get all the best stuff.

I think with you, Zos is right. You probably paid zos more money with this system, then you would have paid them if you get that item on the first try.

Xeven · February 2016

Back when Orcinium was on PTS, I remember reading that chances are higher to get a weapon for the class you are on. If you're doing vMSA on a magicka sorc, you're likely to get staffs.

I could be wrong but I'm fairly certain it was dev post discussion.

kaithuzar · February 2016

I'm on a magicka nightblade, but apparently ZOS thinks I should be using daggers & 2 handers like a STAMINA based nightblade. =/

DHale · February 2016

Yeah it's very frustrating. I have not done even vma once. That said I have done dozens of pledges. No helms three shoulders none of the good ones and all three are well fitted. Makes me so mad I could spit.

ParaNostram · February 2016

iamnotweakrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Game needs tokens to compensate for fail RNG.

I can agree with this 100%.

starkerealm · February 2016

Xeven wrote: »

Back when Orcinium was on PTS, I remember reading that chances are higher to get a weapon for the class you are on. If you're doing vMSA on a magicka sorc, you're likely to get staffs.

I could be wrong but I'm fairly certain it was dev post discussion.

If that's the case, then why don't they use the attribute distributions to calculate your drops?

Lafer · February 2016

im over 300 run ,i got over 100 maelstrom weapons and i just start dropping some destro staff i got 1 eletrical defending and 1 ice defending within the same week yippie i feel like i might drop a good one soon !!.

The Uninvited · February 2016

NoS_smoke wrote: »

Age old tale I know but this is ridiculous. I'm coming up on my 120th VMA run and still no 2h. Not from weekly rewards and not one in any of my runs. I have lost so much time and my life doing content that was initially fun but now just feels like a never ending time suck. I did the same thing for Engine guardian shoulders and never got those. There has to be some other way...I have friends who got both the needed Maelstrom weapons in 10 runs. Yet I'm well over 100. So yeah man, I just don't get it. I feel like if you do the work you should get rewarded. I can no longer obtain cps and I don't need 20 staffs and 1h+s maelstrom weapons so am I missing something here. Or is this just how the game is suppose to work...I no this is on deaf ears I just had to vent man. So upset right now.

Want to trade 4 shoulders for 1 Engine Guardian helmet, trait is not important...

khele23eb17_ESO · February 2016

reften wrote: »

NoS_smoke wrote: »

Age old tale I know but this is ridiculous. I'm coming up on my 120th VMA run and still no 2h. Not from weekly rewards and not one in any of my runs. I have lost so much time and my life doing content that was initially fun but now just feels like a never ending time suck. I did the same thing for Engine guardian shoulders and never got those. There has to be some other way...I have friends who got both the needed Maelstrom weapons in 10 runs. Yet I'm well over 100. So yeah man, I just don't get it. I feel like if you do the work you should get rewarded. I can no longer obtain cps and I don't need 20 staffs and 1h+s maelstrom weapons so am I missing something here. Or is this just how the game is suppose to work...I no this is on deaf ears I just had to vent man. So upset right now.

So lets say you get the 2H on the first try. Now you have everything you ever wanted in this game. You just play for the content....and you quickly get bored and leave.

Zos thinks that hanging the carrot out front of people will keep them around longer, on average, then giving everyone the opportunity to easily get all the best stuff.

This is exactly what happens with rng tho. Some people get the items very quickly because... rng. Some grind for months and get nothing because... rng. As you said yourself people from both these groups are likely to pack their things and go. A token system on the other hand doesnt have that problem. Devs control item prices and the number of tokens you get for each run. They can make getting the best stuff take as long as they want.

Heck, there are ways to keep the rng but cap it, thus preventing people from getting screwed by it. Have an NPC who will exchange uneeded drops for desired ones. Lets say 5 of those 'junk' items for a random other item, 10 for an item of a selected type (sword, dagger, helmet, etc.) but with random traits, 20 for an item of a selected type and trait (although tbh noone would probably use any option but the last). Too easy? Increase the numbers: 10, 20, 40. Too hard? Reduce them: 2, 4, 8. Problem solved.

code65536 · February 2016

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

This is only an issue because it's solo content. You're playing alone and not sharing any fun with others.

If it were group (4-man) then it's worth doing cause others need gear too.

Again...not ignoring any other concerns, this game should not have any solo-only content. No issues with things being solo-able but why in the world is this solo only.

No logic in this

It being solo does make it harder since it's less enjoyable for most.

But the central problem is still the nasty combination of RNG + BoP because people get screwed in the same way with other content. Engine Guardian shoulders, in the OP's case.

TOKENS NOW!

Sempars · February 2016

120th!!!!!!!!!! I must suck, cause on xbox its hard as hell to even finish it. OH ya, i don't have addons >_>

reften · February 2016

khele23eb17_ESO wrote: »

reften wrote: »

NoS_smoke wrote: »

Age old tale I know but this is ridiculous. I'm coming up on my 120th VMA run and still no 2h. Not from weekly rewards and not one in any of my runs. I have lost so much time and my life doing content that was initially fun but now just feels like a never ending time suck. I did the same thing for Engine guardian shoulders and never got those. There has to be some other way...I have friends who got both the needed Maelstrom weapons in 10 runs. Yet I'm well over 100. So yeah man, I just don't get it. I feel like if you do the work you should get rewarded. I can no longer obtain cps and I don't need 20 staffs and 1h+s maelstrom weapons so am I missing something here. Or is this just how the game is suppose to work...I no this is on deaf ears I just had to vent man. So upset right now.

So lets say you get the 2H on the first try. Now you have everything you ever wanted in this game. You just play for the content....and you quickly get bored and leave.

Zos thinks that hanging the carrot out front of people will keep them around longer, on average, then giving everyone the opportunity to easily get all the best stuff.

This is exactly what happens with rng tho. Some people get the items very quickly because... rng. Some grind for months and get nothing because... rng. As you said yourself people from both these groups are likely to pack their things and go. A token system on the other hand doesnt have that problem. Devs control item prices and the number of tokens you get for each run. They can make getting the best stuff take as long as they want.

Heck, there are ways to keep the rng but cap it, thus preventing people from getting screwed by it. Have an NPC who will exchange uneeded drops for desired ones. Lets say 5 of those 'junk' items for a random other item, 10 for an item of a selected type (sword, dagger, helmet, etc.) but with random traits, 20 for an item of a selected type and trait (although tbh noone would probably use any option but the last). Too easy? Increase the numbers: 10, 20, 40. Too hard? Reduce them: 2, 4, 8. Problem solved.

See I think there is a problem that is created, that shouldn't be there in the first place.

There should never be the "best" equipment in game. Just different.

To me, removing the softcaps, adding the IC jewelry sets, and the maelstrom weapons created a rush for the best equipment and cookie cutter builds. Prior to this equipment, you had tons of choices, and to me, that made it more fun....better theory crafting, I switched from magicka and stam NB and back a few times. Now, I just stay stam as it's to expensive to switch.

Guess that is Zos's way of getting people to play the (buy!) the new content.

Other side of this is, if you get that item you want, then you can cancel your sub as you don't need to play the new content. (If you're like me and just pvp)