This is a pvp set, not a tank only set. I really like the idea of this set, the fact that its so much worse than agility/willpower and molag kena/x means that it wont be used by everyone.

All the suggestions in this thread would make this set worth nothing, like every other set, and everyone will still be wearing agility/willpower with kena/x.

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

This is a pvp set, not a tank only set. I really like the idea of this set, the fact that its so much worse than agility/willpower and molag kena/x means that it wont be used by everyone.

All the suggestions in this thread would make this set worth nothing, like every other set, and everyone will still be wearing agility/willpower with kena/x.

Agility rings + Molag Kena even without any kind of drawbacks and considering every single bonus from these sets do not add up to 100% "relative" damage increase on healing targets (probably closer to 30% damage increase WITH KENA PROC). This set achieves 100% damage increase with 1 bonus. Also by having it as 2x weapons 3x jewels you can also get a monster set plus a basic 5 piece set....win. You just critted item diversification in PvP for 1000000000 points of dev damage....

Not exactly, stamina builds only need to do 1 or 2 dodge rolls before using their heal, for full effect heal. Magicka builds can cleanse the debuff before casting their heal without attacking again. Magicka builds often rely on sields rather than healing anyways.

With the debuff at only 2 seconds long it is very easy to counter by a skilled player. This set is only a massive relative damage increase vs wingnuts that wont stop attacking and trying to heal simultaneously.

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

This is a pvp set, not a tank only set. I really like the idea of this set, the fact that its so much worse than agility/willpower and molag kena/x means that it wont be used by everyone.

All the suggestions in this thread would make this set worth nothing, like every other set, and everyone will still be wearing agility/willpower with kena/x.

Agility rings + Molag Kena even without any kind of drawbacks and considering every single bonus from these sets do not add up to 100% "relative" damage increase on healing targets (probably closer to 30% damage increase WITH KENA PROC). This set achieves 100% damage increase with 1 bonus. Also by having it as 2x weapons 3x jewels you can also get a monster set plus a basic 5 piece set....win. You just critted item diversification in PvP for 1000000000 points of dev damage....

Not exactly, stamina builds only need to do 1 or 2 dodge rolls before using their heal, for full effect heal. Magicka builds can cleanse the debuff before casting their heal without attacking again. Magicka builds often rely on sields rather than healing anyways.

With the debuff at only 2 seconds long it is very easy to counter by a skilled player. This set is only a massive relative damage increase vs wingnuts that wont stop attacking and trying to heal simultaneously.

And you just ignored reapplication of the debuff in the case of DoTs....and the effect of the debuff on DoT heals (the most important stamina heals apart from Rally burst heal) which will get cut down due to reapplication anyway unless you are considering to stop hitting your target for the duration of the vigor while your enemy is obviously sitting idle watching you....

@DeanTheCat You could wear this heal debuff set with Shield Breaker xD .. yeah you loose damage but when your opponet's healing is cut by so many %'s.. it wont really matter.

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

It is extremely difficult to find a better pvp combo than willpower/agility and molag kena. The new pvp sets, including fasallas, MIGHT compete. Nerfing them would solidify IC jewelry even more.

That being said, I do believe that dots, and things like caltrops should not proc the debuff.

Willpower/Agility + Molag Kena is a solid combination yes, but creating a set that is extremely powerful in group play and broken in solo/small-group isn't the solution.

Which would you rather have in your group? Someone who is wearing Willpower + Kena or Fasalla's? I'd pick the Fasalla's user 100% of the time because of the fact that the set as-is is doubling my group's damage, just by the fact that healing is half as effective, which means that damage "sticks" better causing a relative increase of 100%.

Fasalla's Guile is a support set, not a be-all-end-all silver bullet. Thus it is important to ensure that the only people who dedicated to the support role will wear it. Hence the need to tone it down and remove jewellery, else the ones wearing this set will be damage focused players as the set hard-counters tanks and tanks are the natural hard counter to damage focused builds.

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Healing is overpowered right now, particularly in large groups. This makes large groups next to impossible to kill, especially by a smaller group. Fasallas should improve the game tremendously by making the zergs more killable.

Its one of the best additions to small scale pvp you could ask for.

I'm not trying to take away the AoE healing debuff aspect of Fasalla's

I disagree about this being "one of the best additions to small scale PvP" as anything that can create a stack of 80+% healing debuff will just break small-scale vs small-scale. The game will turn into nothing more than a DPS race, as with healing being so ineffective, it is pointless to try and heal and the best tactics is really just to keep whacking till one or the other falls dead. Is that the gameplay you want to see?

Do not forget that this set is usable by both the large group and the small one. The most effective way for a small group to take down a larger group is AoE, and the presence of just 1 Fasalla's user in the group will completely wreck your healing. This issue is exacerbated by the fact that the large group will always have more healers then your small group can ever muster, which means concentrated Rushed Ceremony spam can still counteract the 50% of Fasalla's while you'll be inflicted with 80+% as if the group is competent, they will Reverb Bash you to cut your healing even further, cementing your healing disadvantage even more. In such a situation, the large group will have more damage, more healers, more players and healing for 50% while you have less damage, less healers and only healing for 20%. Who is likely to win?

Also, with all the attention this set is getting, I'd bet you 100 bottles of Skooma that many people are going to wear this when patch goes live if a change is not made. It's what happened with Shieldbreaker after all.

I must say, as a small group player (groups ranging from 2 to 4 mostly), I find this set very scary as a magicka DK, especially now that the good DK heals rely on 1) dots 2) aoe damage.

Its not a troll build. Damage shields are broken overpowered and so are heals. Duels and small scale turn into never ending battles because of these things.

Fasallas should help to make fights actually end. This improves the game. Shield breaker + fassalas is a great combo, i will definitely run it and compare it to agility/kena.

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Its not a troll build. Damage shields are broken overpowered and so are heals. Duels and small scale turn into never ending battles because of these things.

Fasallas should help to make fights actually end. This improves the game. Shield breaker + fassalas is a great combo, i will definitely run it and compare it to agility/kena.

Fasalla's Guile certainly helps to make fights end faster, but 80+% healing reduction isn't the solution either. If anyone here still remembers 1.5 and Lethal Arrow... Well, it's going to be something similar next patch when plenty of people wear this due to the attention the set is getting.

Speaking about Lethal Arrow, that new Mighty CP change is going to bring a lot more users of Lethal Arrow as currently CP dictates that Focused Aim is the optimal morph. This means that Major Defile is going to be everywhere, and it's going to be silly when you also have Fasalla's Guile users in every corner of Cyrodiil.

This set means:

1) Play Magicka based builds reliant on shields to avoid the debuff as shields >>> heals.

2) Forget about heavy armour, as heavy means nothing when you cannot pair mitigation with health restoration.

3) Stack damage so you can kill the Fasalla's Guile user before you die due to lack of healing.

4) Forget about DoTs, as you cannot heal while a DoT is active on someone.

5) Just snipe people from stealth, as a no healing doesn't matter if the target is dead before he can react.

Edit: Forget about Strife, Surge, Puncturing Sweeps and Burning Embers as well, due to Fasalla's Guile gutting these skills.

Sharee wrote: »

DeanTheCat wrote: »

This set means:

1) Play Magicka based builds reliant on shields to avoid the debuff as shields >>> heals.

2) Forget about heavy armour, as heavy means nothing when you cannot pair mitigation with health restoration.

3) Stack damage so you can kill the Fasalla's Guile user before you die due to lack of healing.

4) Forget about DoTs, as you cannot heal while a DoT is active on someone.

5) Just snipe people from stealth, as a no healing doesn't matter if the target is dead before he can react.

To be fair - those five points are not all that much different from what we are playing right now, even without that set
Shields> heals, heavy useless, dots useless, everyone stacks damage...

We don't need to exacerbate the issue either

I mean, they make DoTs and Heavy Armor worth something this upcoming patch, and they couple it with this set. Currently I'm using a DoT build at the moment to see how viable DoTs actually are, and the results have been surprisingly good. It's harder to pull off sure, but at least it's still somewhat viable. Fasalla's Guile is undermining the changes that they are putting in with the TG patch.

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

I must say, as a small group player (groups ranging from 2 to 4 mostly), I find this set very scary as a magicka DK, especially now that the good DK heals rely on 1) dots 2) aoe damage.

Yeah exactly this.. Burning embers are amazing heal (almost close enough to dragon blood b4 nerf), but they require to dmg ur opponent to get the heals.. If som1 wear fasalla it will be impossible to heal with embers as magicka DK, casue this *** will proc on dots, so 100% up time.

But thats mean nothing, most of magicka players use entropy for Major Sorcery buff, as we all know entropy is a dot, so again we have 100% up time on this set, just GG!

@ZOS_GinaBruno guys u should add cooldown to this set, apply 50% healing debuff for 3 sec with 10 sec cooldown..

Cinbri wrote: »

Ryuho wrote: »

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

I must say, as a small group player (groups ranging from 2 to 4 mostly), I find this set very scary as a magicka DK, especially now that the good DK heals rely on 1) dots 2) aoe damage.

Yeah exactly this.. Burning embers are amazing heal (almost close enough to dragon blood b4 nerf), but they require to dmg ur opponent to get the heals.. If som1 wear fasalla it will be impossible to heal with embers as magicka DK, casue this *** will proc on dots, so 100% up time.

But thats mean nothing, most of magicka players use entropy for Major Sorcery buff, as we all know entropy is a dot, so again we have 100% up time on this set, just GG!

@ZOS_GinaBruno guys u should add cooldown to this set, apply 50% healing debuff for 3 sec with 10 sec cooldown..

Any sort of cooldown will kill this set. And as i already said - it looks good on paper but when i met it in duel i didn't have any problem to counter it with my magicka templar. Where is no changes nor to heal nor to healp debuffs that will help to break Springs spamming blob, and only there this set will help.

Agree, in current set state it might be good counter vs zerglins, especially combo with meat catapult.. but i am talkin about small scale.. Well, maybe at least make its effect to not proc on dots to not kill again poor magicka DKs..

Cinbri wrote: »

Ryuho wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Ryuho wrote: »

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

I must say, as a small group player (groups ranging from 2 to 4 mostly), I find this set very scary as a magicka DK, especially now that the good DK heals rely on 1) dots 2) aoe damage.

Yeah exactly this.. Burning embers are amazing heal (almost close enough to dragon blood b4 nerf), but they require to dmg ur opponent to get the heals.. If som1 wear fasalla it will be impossible to heal with embers as magicka DK, casue this *** will proc on dots, so 100% up time.

But thats mean nothing, most of magicka players use entropy for Major Sorcery buff, as we all know entropy is a dot, so again we have 100% up time on this set, just GG!

@ZOS_GinaBruno guys u should add cooldown to this set, apply 50% healing debuff for 3 sec with 10 sec cooldown..

Any sort of cooldown will kill this set. And as i already said - it looks good on paper but when i met it in duel i didn't have any problem to counter it with my magicka templar. Where is no changes nor to heal nor to healp debuffs that will help to break Springs spamming blob, and only there this set will help.

Agree, in current set state it might be good counter vs zerglins, especially combo with meat catapult.. but i am talkin about small scale.. Well, maybe at least make its effect to not proc on dots to not kill again poor magicka DKs..

This is the cost for dk to be OP again

DKs won't be OP, but at least they should be equal in this DLC to others with dot CP system changes and some skill adjustment.. I dueled on PTS with ppls using Fasalla on my DK and I won almost evry fight, but still it was duel environment.. I am not sure how this *** will work in open world, I am not even sure about stacking Fasalla effect, didnt test it.. Just example, 1 vs 2 fight, 2 others use Fasalla - If i fire breath them, do I get 100% healing debuff for 10 seconds in DK case (dot duration)? If yes, its broken as ***.. Should not work at least on dots! Definitly.

Cinbri wrote: »

...it looks good on paper but when i met it in duel i didn't have any problem to counter it with my magicka templar.....

Mate, come on now. Seriously.

You're a magicka Templar. You have Purify and BoL. You don't really use DoTs in PvP either.

If you need a heal you just Purify the Fasalla and/or Reverb Bash, heal your self for a 12k BoL crit, go back on the attack. Of course it's not a problem for you.

Magicka DoT builds like DKs, or stamina builds that have no purge, will get completely annihilated by stam builds that run this combo.