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Cloak Nerf Vs Sorc Shield Spammer
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eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
You're comparing a potion to an ability now? Seriously? How bad is your damage that you can't break a ward? Do you even bother to slot a CC? I mean sorcs run with about 10-16k stam, and about 20k HP in Cyrodiil. You honestly can't force them to use up their stam? You do know that harness magicka does nothing against physical attacks right? You do know that you only get the real benefit of Healing Ward if have actually taken damage? You do know that Healing Ward lasts 6 seconds. I mean C'mon. Get gud bro.Dalsinthus wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »Dalsinthus wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »mr_wazzabi wrote: »If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down.
They do, its called any CC
I'll amend his statement:
If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down with a 5 second lockout that is NOT CC breakable.
This is such a pointless debate. If they include an ability that prevents us from casting shields then they need to include one that prevents you from casting blur, roll dodging, and takes away all of your armor and spell mitigation. See now how ridiculous you are? If you are so terrible that you can't CC and break a 12k ward or find a way to drain our stamina, then it doesn't matter what they do to our class, you're still going to be a terrible player.
Ward with Harness magicka with a low health Healing ward is certainly going to be over 20k. My point is not to nerf sorc shield it's to nerf shield stacking.
The bandwagon is strong with the sorc fanbois.
Nothing is stopping you from using those. At least you have access to shields. We don't exactly get an invis spell.
This is very close to just telling people to drop stamina entirely and play a magic build. Yes, healing ward and harness magika are available to everyone, but they only really work well for builds that are heavily invested in magic and are willing to slot a restoration staff for one of their two bars. Otherwise these universally available shields are going to be trivial compared to a magic build.
Okay, well you don't see me switching to Wrecking Blow, or Steel Tornado, or Vigor, no matter how effective they are. What's your point exactly?
I have no idea what build you run, nor do I care. My point is that saying everyone has access to shields is bogus as these shields are largely worthless for stamina builds.
Additionally, everyone has access to invisibility via potions.
:trollin:0 -
Tiphis✭✭✭✭PlagueMonk wrote: »Emma_Eunjung wrote: »mr_wazzabi wrote: »If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down.
You already have the Shield Breaker set AND a 50% Battle Spirit nerf to shields.... don't be greedy!
Wait....you are telling me I have to wear a special SET of armor (thus severely gimping myself to literally everyone else I might add) JUST to counter a Sorc one ability?
Last time I looked Magelight was a single ability you can slot. Please come back and we will talk when this insane magelight buff is put on a 5 piece armor set (or NB's get a Shield Breaker ability we can slot on our bars)
The set is also a liability on a magicka build, we lose the set bonuses from the armor along with the armor passives to get useless set bonuses except for the 5-piece. So I guess the idea is to then simply only use light attacks and heavy attacks because we can't afford to do much more since magicka reduction/regen is now very gimped.
Also healing ward negates most of the damage anyway because if you use it while at full health and they bypass the shields, it won't damage the shield at all allowing the maximum healing from healing ward possible.
Meanwhile this entire time as long as the sorc isn't a complete idiot he/she will simply dps us down because of the loss of spell resist, magicka regen/reduction, useful set bonuses from the standard set used. And all we get is the passives from med armor skill line... Oh wait why would a pure magicka build invest much in that, and even if you did it would still be useless.0 -
coolermh✭✭✭This convo cracks me up...if you think it is so easy to play magika and all you have to do is spam shield to stay alive then I challenge you to go play a sorc. I have played both stamina nightblade and magika sorc extensively in pvp and magika builds require sooooo much more skill to be effective. Granted with the right pilot both are equally deadly. With stamina though, you never have to worry about getting locked in cc or not being able to sprint or roll dodge, which alone gives your char a massive amount of forgiveness in your playstyle. You also have access to highest damage abilities like WB, lethal arrow and if your a night blade surprise attack.-MrHeid625
Max Chars:
Magika Sorc AD
Stamina NB AD
Stam DK AD
Magika NB-
Magika Temp-
Stam Warden
Stam Sorc
Mag Warden1 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PlagueMonk wrote: »Emma_Eunjung wrote: »mr_wazzabi wrote: »If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down.
You already have the Shield Breaker set AND a 50% Battle Spirit nerf to shields.... don't be greedy!
Wait....you are telling me I have to wear a special SET of armor (thus severely gimping myself to literally everyone else I might add) JUST to counter a Sorc one ability?
Last time I looked Magelight was a single ability you can slot. Please come back and we will talk when this insane magelight buff is put on a 5 piece armor set (or NB's get a Shield Breaker ability we can slot on our bars)
The set is also a liability on a magicka build, we lose the set bonuses from the armor along with the armor passives to get useless set bonuses except for the 5-piece. So I guess the idea is to then simply only use light attacks and heavy attacks because we can't afford to do much more since magicka reduction/regen is now very gimped.
Also healing ward negates most of the damage anyway because if you use it while at full health and they bypass the shields, it won't damage the shield at all allowing the maximum healing from healing ward possible.
Meanwhile this entire time as long as the sorc isn't a complete idiot he/she will simply dps us down because of the loss of spell resist, magicka regen/reduction, useful set bonuses from the standard set used. And all we get is the passives from med armor skill line... Oh wait why would a pure magicka build invest much in that, and even if you did it would still be useless.
The funny thing is, I know nightblades that dont' suck. They manage to kill sorcs just fine. Why are you having so much trouble?:trollin:0 -
TheM0rganism✭✭✭ITT: the two classes that require the least amount of skill have a pissing contest over which of their broken mechanics is least broken
smh. git gud u nublords. STAMINA TEMPLAR TANK 4 LYFEPS4 DC Stamina Templar Tank/DPS...because I ALWAYS play on hard mode
#2233 - Never Forget2 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »mr_wazzabi wrote: »If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down.
They do, its called any CC
I'll amend his statement:
If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down with a 5 second lockout that is NOT CC breakable.
This is such a pointless debate. If they include an ability that prevents us from casting shields then they need to include one that prevents you from casting blur, roll dodging, and takes away all of your armor and spell mitigation. See now how ridiculous you are? If you are so terrible that you can't CC and break a 12k ward or find a way to drain our stamina, then it doesn't matter what they do to our class, you're still going to be a terrible player.
So you do see my point!
The exact same thing can be said about dealing with Cloak.
I rest my case.
Magelight should reveal you to the person using it and no one else. This complete lockout of using cloak is hilarious (bad).<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Tiphis✭✭✭✭eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »
The funny thing is, I know nightblades that dont' suck. They manage to kill sorcs just fine. Why are you having so much trouble?
The funny thing is, I know sorcerers that don't suck. They manage to kill nightblades just fine. Why are you having so much trouble?
I never mentioned anything about night blades and no I don't even have one, I was talking more about the fact that shield breaker is not an appropriate counter for shield stacking for a magicka build.0 -
Xeniph✭✭✭✭✭eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »mr_wazzabi wrote: »If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down.
They do, its called any CC
I'll amend his statement:
If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down with a 5 second lockout that is NOT CC breakable.
This is such a pointless debate. If they include an ability that prevents us from casting shields then they need to include one that prevents you from casting blur, roll dodging, and takes away all of your armor and spell mitigation. See now how ridiculous you are? If you are so terrible that you can't CC and break a 12k ward or find a way to drain our stamina, then it doesn't matter what they do to our class, you're still going to be a terrible player.
So you do see my point!
The exact same thing can be said about dealing with Cloak.
I rest my case.
Good job. Your cloak is only useful against newbs who refuse to slot Radiant Magelight. I NEVER once advocated for nerfing it. In fact I have said repeatedly that it works exactly as it should and defended against the coming nerf. The fact that you feel like our shields need to be nerfed as some sort of misguided recompense is asinine. Your argument is null and void. Honestly I feel bad for you. As a sorc I have no problems staying in stealth until I'm ready to attack. The fact you need it as a crutch is just sad.
I'm not advocating for a change to shields. I am advocating for a change to the current iteration on the pts of magelight. The fact that so many non-NB's are like " Ya man, bout time" is an example that they don't want balance.
So I used the example of applying the same buff/nerf to shields and suddenly it's asinine.
Honestly, I have all the classes leveled. And I am above pvp rank 20 on all of them, so there is no reason to feel sorry for me.
But should these changes go through with magelight and the "skill lock" it's not a far stretch for other abilities to get this same treatment.
I'd prefer CD's and skill lockouts not become part of this game. And we all know Hardened, Wrecking Blow and Healing Ward are some of the most complained about and controversial skills, next to Cloak. These would likely be next.
Here since Beta.
Characters: All of them, both Stamina and Magicka.1 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »
The funny thing is, I know nightblades that dont' suck. They manage to kill sorcs just fine. Why are you having so much trouble?
The funny thing is, I know sorcerers that don't suck. They manage to kill nightblades just fine. Why are you having so much trouble?
I never mentioned anything about night blades and no I don't even have one, I was talking more about the fact that shield breaker is not an appropriate counter for shield stacking for a magicka build.
I never said I had any trouble killing Nightblades. Show me where I said that.:trollin:0 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »mr_wazzabi wrote: »If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down.
They do, its called any CC
I'll amend his statement:
If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down with a 5 second lockout that is NOT CC breakable.
This is such a pointless debate. If they include an ability that prevents us from casting shields then they need to include one that prevents you from casting blur, roll dodging, and takes away all of your armor and spell mitigation. See now how ridiculous you are? If you are so terrible that you can't CC and break a 12k ward or find a way to drain our stamina, then it doesn't matter what they do to our class, you're still going to be a terrible player.
So you do see my point!
The exact same thing can be said about dealing with Cloak.
I rest my case.
Good job. Your cloak is only useful against newbs who refuse to slot Radiant Magelight. I NEVER once advocated for nerfing it. In fact I have said repeatedly that it works exactly as it should and defended against the coming nerf. The fact that you feel like our shields need to be nerfed as some sort of misguided recompense is asinine. Your argument is null and void. Honestly I feel bad for you. As a sorc I have no problems staying in stealth until I'm ready to attack. The fact you need it as a crutch is just sad.
I'm not advocating for a change to shields. I am advocating for a change to the current iteration on the pts of magelight. The fact that so many non-NB's are like " Ya man, bout time" is an example that they don't want balance.
So I used the example of applying the same buff/nerf to shields and suddenly it's asinine.
Honestly, I have all the classes leveled. And I am above pvp rank 20 on all of them, so there is no reason to feel sorry for me.
But should these changes go through with magelight and the "skill lock" it's not a far stretch for other abilities to get this same treatment.
I'd prefer CD's and skill lockouts not become part of this game. And we all know Hardened, Wrecking Blow and Healing Ward are some of the most complained about and controversial skills, next to Cloak. These would likely be next.
The change doesn't just effect nightblades, it effects anyone in stealth. All it requires is that you pay attention to your proximity to people using it. I'm not saying it won't be challenging but it's not the end of the world. You didn't see my crying when they cut my shields in half. I just dealt with it and I adapted. That's what NBs have to do now.
:trollin:0 -
pmn100b16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Sorcerors starting to sweat it lol. Dark Cloak was the buffer for a hardened ward nerf. They couldn't nerf ward before cloak. Now cloak has taken a nerf, the buffer is gone. The nerf bat is coming. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but soon(tm).2 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »Sorcerors starting to sweat it lol. Dark Cloak was the buffer for a hardened ward nerf. They couldn't nerf ward before cloak. Now cloak has taken a nerf, the buffer is gone. The nerf bat is coming. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but soon(tm).
Too many streak nerfs.
Also hardened ward alone is a nonissue. Hardened + healing + harness however...<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 500 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »Sorcerors starting to sweat it lol. Dark Cloak was the buffer for a hardened ward nerf. They couldn't nerf ward before cloak. Now cloak has taken a nerf, the buffer is gone. The nerf bat is coming. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but soon(tm).
Too many streak nerfs.
Also hardened ward alone is a nonissue. Hardened + healing + harness however...
Oh the QQing about the big bad sorcs...It's nice to see we keep you up at night with the nerd rage that you can't kill us.:trollin:0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »Sorcerors starting to sweat it lol. Dark Cloak was the buffer for a hardened ward nerf. They couldn't nerf ward before cloak. Now cloak has taken a nerf, the buffer is gone. The nerf bat is coming. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but soon(tm).
Too many streak nerfs.
Also hardened ward alone is a nonissue. Hardened + healing + harness however...
Oh the QQing about the big bad sorcs...It's nice to see we keep you up at night with the nerd rage that you can't kill us.
That was not the quote you were looking for
<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
khele23eb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »mr_wazzabi wrote: »If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down.
They do, its called any CC
I'll amend his statement:
If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down with a 5 second lockout that is NOT CC breakable.
This is such a pointless debate. If they include an ability that prevents us from casting shields then they need to include one that prevents you from casting blur, roll dodging, and takes away all of your armor and spell mitigation. See now how ridiculous you are? If you are so terrible that you can't CC and break a 12k ward or find a way to drain our stamina, then it doesn't matter what they do to our class, you're still going to be a terrible player.
So you do see my point!
The exact same thing can be said about dealing with Cloak.
I rest my case.
Good job. Your cloak is only useful against newbs who refuse to slot Radiant Magelight. I NEVER once advocated for nerfing it. In fact I have said repeatedly that it works exactly as it should and defended against the coming nerf. The fact that you feel like our shields need to be nerfed as some sort of misguided recompense is asinine. Your argument is null and void. Honestly I feel bad for you. As a sorc I have no problems staying in stealth until I'm ready to attack. The fact you need it as a crutch is just sad.
I'm not advocating for a change to shields. I am advocating for a change to the current iteration on the pts of magelight. The fact that so many non-NB's are like " Ya man, bout time" is an example that they don't want balance.
So I used the example of applying the same buff/nerf to shields and suddenly it's asinine.
Honestly, I have all the classes leveled. And I am above pvp rank 20 on all of them, so there is no reason to feel sorry for me.
But should these changes go through with magelight and the "skill lock" it's not a far stretch for other abilities to get this same treatment.
I'd prefer CD's and skill lockouts not become part of this game. And we all know Hardened, Wrecking Blow and Healing Ward are some of the most complained about and controversial skills, next to Cloak. These would likely be next.
The change doesn't just effect nightblades, it effects anyone in stealth. All it requires is that you pay attention to your proximity to people using it. I'm not saying it won't be challenging but it's not the end of the world. You didn't see my crying when they cut my shields in half. I just dealt with it and I adapted. That's what NBs have to do now.
They cut your shields in half, they didnt give everyone a skill that dispels them and blocks you from using them for the next 5 seconds with a single key press on top of providing a massive damage buff just by being on the skill bar.Edited by khele23eb17_ESO on February 9, 2016 10:49PMP2P offered you 'hell yeah!' moments. F2P offers you 'thank god its over' moments.1 -
silky_soft✭✭✭✭✭
✭Scale them all off HP except ulti. Everyone's happy. Implement it k goThis recent update has made me sad. Sad for the game. Sad for the community. Sad to pay whatever it is now. I want the previous eso back.0 -
MisterBigglesworth✭✭✭✭✭
✭Hey how about we swap Annulment with Conjured Ward. Nothing would change for shield-stacking Sorcs, but the other classes would then have access to a really strong shield that absorbs Physical damage as well (without having to use a Resto staff)Edited by MisterBigglesworth on February 9, 2016 11:01PMReally we do it without like, the musical instruments. This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.0 -
Bossdonut✭✭✭✭✭
It´s not going to happen because the sorc class has a total of five skills that all entirely scale with only magica (in case you did not know that). Too much work reworking all of those.
You´re basically proposing breaking 4 skills in order to fix one that you feel is overperforming.
So you'd be forced to choose between survival or max dps like you know, everyone else.
The horror.0 -
EdTerra✭✭✭cloak =/= shields
cloak DODGE
shield ABSORB
cloak can be hit and crit by AoE
shields can't be crit
this is the only unbalanced thing with shields[EU] AD - Erdril v16 N(oo)B | AR40
[NA] EP - Erdril NB
Still a solo player in this zergfest
Youtube : https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXPJv3O6DC5ZYECfF3-rQ-Q1 -
PlagueMonk✭✭✭✭✭eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »mr_wazzabi wrote: »If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down.
They do, its called any CC
I'll amend his statement:
If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down with a 5 second lockout that is NOT CC breakable.
This is such a pointless debate. If they include an ability that prevents us from casting shields then they need to include one that prevents you from casting blur, roll dodging, and takes away all of your armor and spell mitigation. See now how ridiculous you are? If you are so terrible that you can't CC and break a 12k ward or find a way to drain our stamina, then it doesn't matter what they do to our class, you're still going to be a terrible player.
So you do see my point!
The exact same thing can be said about dealing with Cloak.
I rest my case.
Good job. Your cloak is only useful against newbs who refuse to slot Radiant Magelight. I NEVER once advocated for nerfing it. In fact I have said repeatedly that it works exactly as it should and defended against the coming nerf. The fact that you feel like our shields need to be nerfed as some sort of misguided recompense is asinine. Your argument is null and void. Honestly I feel bad for you. As a sorc I have no problems staying in stealth until I'm ready to attack. The fact you need it as a crutch is just sad.
I'm not advocating for a change to shields. I am advocating for a change to the current iteration on the pts of magelight. The fact that so many non-NB's are like " Ya man, bout time" is an example that they don't want balance.
So I used the example of applying the same buff/nerf to shields and suddenly it's asinine.
Honestly, I have all the classes leveled. And I am above pvp rank 20 on all of them, so there is no reason to feel sorry for me.
But should these changes go through with magelight and the "skill lock" it's not a far stretch for other abilities to get this same treatment.
I'd prefer CD's and skill lockouts not become part of this game. And we all know Hardened, Wrecking Blow and Healing Ward are some of the most complained about and controversial skills, next to Cloak. These would likely be next.
The change doesn't just effect nightblades, it effects anyone in stealth. All it requires is that you pay attention to your proximity to people using it. I'm not saying it won't be challenging but it's not the end of the world. You didn't see my crying when they cut my shields in half. I just dealt with it and I adapted. That's what NBs have to do now.
Oh you are so funny.......shield stacking went from nigh invulnerable to just simply OPed plus your shields are STILL highly effective whereas this skill completely negates a NBs main utility ability. When I have an ability on my bar that can totally negate your shields (and their ability to stack) then we will talk. Until that time it's not a fair comparison.0 -
Bossdonut✭✭✭✭✭PlagueMonk wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »mr_wazzabi wrote: »If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down.
They do, its called any CC
I'll amend his statement:
If anyone can magelight to stop a nb from cloaking away then everyone should also be able to cast an ability to stop sorcs from reapplying 3 shields after you get their shield down with a 5 second lockout that is NOT CC breakable.
This is such a pointless debate. If they include an ability that prevents us from casting shields then they need to include one that prevents you from casting blur, roll dodging, and takes away all of your armor and spell mitigation. See now how ridiculous you are? If you are so terrible that you can't CC and break a 12k ward or find a way to drain our stamina, then it doesn't matter what they do to our class, you're still going to be a terrible player.
So you do see my point!
The exact same thing can be said about dealing with Cloak.
I rest my case.
Good job. Your cloak is only useful against newbs who refuse to slot Radiant Magelight. I NEVER once advocated for nerfing it. In fact I have said repeatedly that it works exactly as it should and defended against the coming nerf. The fact that you feel like our shields need to be nerfed as some sort of misguided recompense is asinine. Your argument is null and void. Honestly I feel bad for you. As a sorc I have no problems staying in stealth until I'm ready to attack. The fact you need it as a crutch is just sad.
I'm not advocating for a change to shields. I am advocating for a change to the current iteration on the pts of magelight. The fact that so many non-NB's are like " Ya man, bout time" is an example that they don't want balance.
So I used the example of applying the same buff/nerf to shields and suddenly it's asinine.
Honestly, I have all the classes leveled. And I am above pvp rank 20 on all of them, so there is no reason to feel sorry for me.
But should these changes go through with magelight and the "skill lock" it's not a far stretch for other abilities to get this same treatment.
I'd prefer CD's and skill lockouts not become part of this game. And we all know Hardened, Wrecking Blow and Healing Ward are some of the most complained about and controversial skills, next to Cloak. These would likely be next.
The change doesn't just effect nightblades, it effects anyone in stealth. All it requires is that you pay attention to your proximity to people using it. I'm not saying it won't be challenging but it's not the end of the world. You didn't see my crying when they cut my shields in half. I just dealt with it and I adapted. That's what NBs have to do now.
Oh you are so funny.......shield stacking went from nigh invulnerable to just simply OPed plus your shields are STILL highly effective whereas this skill completely negates a NBs main utility ability. When I have an ability on my bar that can totally negate your shields (and their ability to stack) then we will talk. Until that time it's not a fair comparison.
In addition to the fact that nerf affected ALL shields and not just sorc stacks, rendering the already laughable blazing shield utterly useless.0 -
FriedEggSandwich✭✭✭✭✭
✭This thread is was quite painful to read, why does everyone hate each other? Avoiding/avenging your class nerfs by attempting to assassinate the other classes is pretty weak imo. The way I see it; the cloak nerf wasn't that bad although I didn't personally believe it needed any nerf, magelight was totally over-buffed to the point of ridicule and shield-stacking is bad for everyone and needs to go.
None of the wards need individual nerfs until shield-stacking is gone. It's frustrating to see people rightfully complaining about shield-stacking to only go on to suggest hardened ward should scale off health, or be nerfed in some other way. There are sorcs making an effort to avoid shield-stacking and their experience seems to be that a 10-12k hardened ward is just about enough by itself in the current live patch. With the exception of some kena/maelstrom weapon stam-builds who can still destroy hardened ward and my 21k health pool faster than I can recast hardened ward.
The new patch will give strength to hardened ward against stam users only, which in my opinion was needed. I need to wait to see if it was too much. I agree that stam should do slightly more damage than magicka to make up for its other shortfallings, but some physical mitigation was needed. I hope and believe that if hardened ward is evaluated by itself in the new patch it will be balanced. The imbalance comes when it's combined with healing ward or harness magicka; this is the easy mode, surviving on hardened ward by itself isn't. If hardened ward was nerfed in any way it would penalise those sorcs attempting to survive with this skill only and potentially pressure them to go back to shield-stacking.
Why zos don't properly address shield-stacking I don't know; the only counters they have provided, new cp line included, penalise single shield users as much as shield-stackers, making giving up shield-stacking less desirable. As a sorc I'm pretty sick of the whole 'sorcs don't need hp/resistances/impen etc cos bubbles lol' mentality. I want my resistances to mean something. Ideally I'd like to have the option not to rely on any shield whatsoever, but sorcs still need to wear 5 light and can't realistically reflect/vanish at all or roll/block much, so not sure that will ever be possible. I would just like hardened ward to be a safety net rather than the effective health pool of a sorc.
Zos have a nasty habit of nerfing things from both ends, resulting in over-nerfs. Classic example is the recent cloak nerf combined with the magelight buff, the two things have potentially ended up with cloak now being too weak, whereas the cloak nerf might have been fine by itself. If zos remove shield-stacking and nerf hardened ward at the same time then sorcs will be overly vunerable in pvp. One needs to happen before the other, and because I believe hardened ward to be almost balanced by itself I would much rather zos removed shield-stacking before any discussions about individual ward nerfs are had.PC | EU2 -
SanTii.92✭✭✭✭✭
✭I also believe magelight is brutaly overpower and couldn't believe sorcs didn't got any substantial nerf; but this logic right here.. come on man.When the snows fall and the white winds blow,
the lone wolf dies, but the pack survives.
Arg | Pc Na | Factionless Mag Warden.1 -
mr_wazzabi✭✭✭✭✭
✭FriedEggSandwich wrote: »This thread is was quite painful to read, why does everyone hate each other? Avoiding/avenging your class nerfs by attempting to assassinate the other classes is pretty weak imo. The way I see it; the cloak nerf wasn't that bad although I didn't personally believe it needed any nerf, magelight was totally over-buffed to the point of ridicule and shield-stacking is bad for everyone and needs to go.
None of the wards need individual nerfs until shield-stacking is gone. It's frustrating to see people rightfully complaining about shield-stacking to only go on to suggest hardened ward should scale off health, or be nerfed in some other way. There are sorcs making an effort to avoid shield-stacking and their experience seems to be that a 10-12k hardened ward is just about enough by itself in the current live patch. With the exception of some kena/maelstrom weapon stam-builds who can still destroy hardened ward and my 21k health pool faster than I can recast hardened ward.
The new patch will give strength to hardened ward against stam users only, which in my opinion was needed. I need to wait to see if it was too much. I agree that stam should do slightly more damage than magicka to make up for its other shortfallings, but some physical mitigation was needed. I hope and believe that if hardened ward is evaluated by itself in the new patch it will be balanced. The imbalance comes when it's combined with healing ward or harness magicka; this is the easy mode, surviving on hardened ward by itself isn't. If hardened ward was nerfed in any way it would penalise those sorcs attempting to survive with this skill only and potentially pressure them to go back to shield-stacking.
Why zos don't properly address shield-stacking I don't know; the only counters they have provided, new cp line included, penalise single shield users as much as shield-stackers, making giving up shield-stacking less desirable. As a sorc I'm pretty sick of the whole 'sorcs don't need hp/resistances/impen etc cos bubbles lol' mentality. I want my resistances to mean something. Ideally I'd like to have the option not to rely on any shield whatsoever, but sorcs still need to wear 5 light and can't realistically reflect/vanish at all or roll/block much, so not sure that will ever be possible. I would just like hardened ward to be a safety net rather than the effective health pool of a sorc.
Zos have a nasty habit of nerfing things from both ends, resulting in over-nerfs. Classic example is the recent cloak nerf combined with the magelight buff, the two things have potentially ended up with cloak now being too weak, whereas the cloak nerf might have been fine by itself. If zos remove shield-stacking and nerf hardened ward at the same time then sorcs will be overly vunerable in pvp. One needs to happen before the other, and because I believe hardened ward to be almost balanced by itself I would much rather zos removed shield-stacking before any discussions about individual ward nerfs are had.
A well thought out post.
I have no problem with hardened ward by itself. It's when sorcs stack it with healing ward and harness magicka that it becomes imbalanced.
What zos should do is make hardened ward de-summon if healing ward of harness magicka are activated.
One shield of 12k is enough, with streak and cc of crystal frag to survive against any build.
Sorcs that need 3 shields to beat nb, dk and templars 1v1 are the ones that need to l2p. You only should need to use 1.
Sorcs stacking shields are the 1vx meta for very good reason. Their particular build is op and anyone hat disagrees either has no clue about balance, or secretly wants to stay op and 1vx to their heart's content. This is not balance.
No build should be able to 1vx consistentlyEdited by mr_wazzabi on February 10, 2016 2:52AMBosmer Stamina NB
Altmer Magicka TEMP
Dunmer DK both stam/mag (depends what I feel like)
Altmer Magicka NB
Breton Magicka Sorc
Redguard Stam Sorc
Max CP1 -
mr_wazzabi✭✭✭✭✭
✭
https://youtu.be/AszE5GuCTHI
Hardest boss of the hardest vet duneon burned down in 1 min by 4 magicka sorc dps.
No healer, no tank needed. The shields make you a tank.Edited by mr_wazzabi on February 10, 2016 3:24AMBosmer Stamina NB
Altmer Magicka TEMP
Dunmer DK both stam/mag (depends what I feel like)
Altmer Magicka NB
Breton Magicka Sorc
Redguard Stam Sorc
Max CP3 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I think the answer to shield stacking should be diminishing returns on stacked shields.
Basically one shield will operate at full power... but the 2nd will be diminished... and the 3rd one diminished further. etc
That's a solution to the problem that doesn't just take a hammer and shatter an entire play style (now if only the whine and whine crew cared about wrecking nightblades).0 -
DeanTheCat✭✭✭✭✭You know, with all the suggestions here about shieldbreaker etc, I might actually put it on next patch... I'm already forced to play a bow build now due to various changes gutting my old build. Shieldbreaker isn't that big of a change.
May actually be an excellent idea, considering Magma Shell, Igneous Shields and the sheer amount of Annulment spam due to a rise in Magicka builds.Dean the Cat
Somewhat Insane Puddicat
EU-PC Megaserver; Ebonheart Pact, Alliance Rank 34
This one hails from far Singapore, excuse this one for his high pings. He also apologizes for any formatting/spelling errors, as he tends to answer using a mobile device.
Insanity is the price of Knowledge. Herma-Mora and Sheogorath, this one bows before thee.
This one does not advocate for any class to be nerfed. There are far deeper underlying issues then a simple "Class Imbalance". The Champion System is the problem. Not classes.
Please read this before creating yet another nerf thread.
My guides:1 -
Anhedonie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ZOS should add one simple thing to the description to solve the problem.
"Shield effects do not stack."
And remove shield penalty from battle spirit.Edited by Anhedonie on February 10, 2016 3:57AMProfanity filter is a crime against the freedom of speech. Also gags.2
