Away with the Champion System!

Alcast · July 2015

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

BugCollector wrote: »

There's already a couple of players with 1000 CP. The gap just keeps on growing and growing between these grinders and newbie players. They have no way to catch up, even with ZOS's catch up program.

My suggestion is to get completely rid of the Champion System, BUT compensate the grinders, who have 400 or more CP, with a unique title and mount or something.

Champion System is the cause of imbalance. Listen before it's too late.

There isnt even a single player with 1000. The one who claimed it on here it was proven his screenshot was faked.

good joke man...good joke, ofcourse there are lawl.

not many, but there are.

though tbh they aint hurting nobody because all they do is grind :Pé

kevlarto_ESO · July 2015

Away with the letter "R" from the vocabulary, just about as likely to happen.. LOL

iamnotweakrwb17_ESO · July 2015

All it needs is a global cap on champion points that increases at a rate of 1 per day. This is a server wide cap that all players are bound too whether they are playing when the system rolls out or start playing 6 months in.

To make it crystal clear what i'm talking about :=

Champion point system comes online jan 1st 2015. 1 year passes and the maximum number of champion points in play is 365.

If a new player begins to play 6 months after the champion point system comes online... they will be able to "catch up" all those champion points missed via questing, grinding, XP potions, etc. up until they hit the server global cap.

Njag · July 2015

BugCollector wrote: »

There's already a couple of players with 1000 CP. The gap just keeps on growing and growing between these grinders and newbie players. They have no way to catch up, even with ZOS's catch up program.

My suggestion is to get completely rid of the Champion System, BUT compensate the grinders, who have 400 or more CP, with a unique title and mount or something.

Champion System is the cause of imbalance. Listen before it's too late.

Away with BugCollector!

Garethjolnir · July 2015

No.

BugCollector · July 2015

Njag wrote: »

BugCollector wrote: »

There's already a couple of players with 1000 CP. The gap just keeps on growing and growing between these grinders and newbie players. They have no way to catch up, even with ZOS's catch up program.

My suggestion is to get completely rid of the Champion System, BUT compensate the grinders, who have 400 or more CP, with a unique title and mount or something.

Champion System is the cause of imbalance. Listen before it's too late.

Away with BugCollector!

That's not very nice.

xxslam48xxb14_ESO · July 2015

iamnotweakrwb17_ESO wrote: »

All it needs is a global cap on champion points that increases at a rate of 1 per day. This is a server wide cap that all players are bound too whether they are playing when the system rolls out or start playing 6 months in.

To make it crystal clear what i'm talking about :=

Champion point system comes online jan 1st 2015. 1 year passes and the maximum number of champion points in play is 365.

If a new player begins to play 6 months after the champion point system comes online... they will be able to "catch up" all those champion points missed via questing, grinding, XP potions, etc. up until they hit the server global cap.

That is better then the current system, but it falls apart just the same. Say you join the game 3 years late, this player would be expected to grind 1000+ champion points to catch up. Content would be balanced around the current cap too so its not like it would be optional to catch up. You would have to catch up fast just like you have to do with vet levels.

iamnotweakrwb17_ESO · July 2015

xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »

That is better then the current system, but it falls apart just the same. Say you join the game 3 years late, this player would be expected to grind 1000+ champion points to catch up. Content would be balanced around the current cap too so its not like it would be optional to catch up. You would have to catch up fast just like you have to do with vet levels.

They can rectify this any number of ways through various different catch up methods.

The easiest and simplest way is a mechanic where you are only allowed to fall X number of days behind before being given either "free" champion points or allowed to acquire champion points at an accelerated rate. The further behind, the more extreme the acceleration.

wraith808 · July 2015

Rune_Relic wrote: »

They don't need to remove it and replace it with something else with 6 months of work.
All they need to do is add a CHAMPION BAR with 3 slots.
1 Warrior passive can be loaded.
1 Thief passive can be loaded.
1 Mage passive can be loaded.

Now it doesn't matter how many CP you have as you can only use 3 passive out of the 36.

People can grind away to their hearts content.
Someone with 300 CP will be just as powerful as anyone with 3600 CP..except they wont have 36 passive skills to choose from.

The stam/mag/health from each CP has to be nerfed though.

No power creep.
No power gap.
No gated content.
Endless progression
No gated endgame
Forced Build diversity.

I actually like this. However, I'd suggest a change... 3 slots, and you choose which slots you use. So someone could go straight warrior, mage, or thief, or a combination of them.

FancyTuna8 · July 2015

I'm new to this game and on console, but couldn't they introduce a weighting system to pvp involving teams/sides? As in, champion points and levels are given a weighting, and all teams need to be equal overall in team weighting. I play World of Tanks, and they do this. Of course, that game only features 15 v 15 players, or sometimes 7v7; from what I gather this is quite different. But there still seems a way to even teams out, and then it is up to players to utilize good teamwork.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · July 2015

Alcast wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

BugCollector wrote: »

There's already a couple of players with 1000 CP. The gap just keeps on growing and growing between these grinders and newbie players. They have no way to catch up, even with ZOS's catch up program.

My suggestion is to get completely rid of the Champion System, BUT compensate the grinders, who have 400 or more CP, with a unique title and mount or something.

Champion System is the cause of imbalance. Listen before it's too late.

There isnt even a single player with 1000. The one who claimed it on here it was proven his screenshot was faked.

good joke man...good joke, ofcourse there are lawl.

not many, but there are.

though tbh they aint hurting nobody because all they do is grind :Pé

There has been one person who posted a screenshot. It was an obvious fake with many things wrong. a very poor photoshop job. There are no players period with 1000 cp.

Pirhana7_ESO · July 2015

BugCollector wrote: »

There's already a couple of players with 1000 CP. The gap just keeps on growing and growing between these grinders and newbie players. They have no way to catch up, even with ZOS's catch up program.

My suggestion is to get completely rid of the Champion System, BUT compensate the grinders, who have 400 or more CP, with a unique title and mount or something.

Champion System is the cause of imbalance. Listen before it's too late.

The Champion System is actually very minor compaired to Vet Ranks. The different between V1 and V14 is gigantic. Once the Vet ranks get removed and it is ONLY the champion system. Then the progression difference should be just right with 10% max bonuses instead of 500% with vet levels

tordr86b16_ESO · July 2015

Crybabies

Pheefs · July 2015

Champion Points are fun!
& I love earning them for my lower characters

...but I don't mind that PVP grinders have more than me.
AND I don't feel ineffective in Cyrodiil either, I win some & loose some.

Why are we supposed to care so much how many points other people have? I don't get it!

PBpsy · July 2015

Yes . What this game always needed is yet another round of major mechanics and game system changes. Why have new content when we can just switch the ruleset each freaking month?

Rune_Relic · July 2015

wraith808 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

They don't need to remove it and replace it with something else with 6 months of work.
All they need to do is add a CHAMPION BAR with 3 slots.
1 Warrior passive can be loaded.
1 Thief passive can be loaded.
1 Mage passive can be loaded.

Now it doesn't matter how many CP you have as you can only use 3 passive out of the 36.

People can grind away to their hearts content.
Someone with 300 CP will be just as powerful as anyone with 3600 CP..except they wont have 36 passive skills to choose from.

The stam/mag/health from each CP has to be nerfed though.

No power creep.
No power gap.
No gated content.
Endless progression
No gated endgame
Forced Build diversity.

I actually like this. However, I'd suggest a change... 3 slots, and you choose which slots you use. So someone could go straight warrior, mage, or thief, or a combination of them.

In some ways I would like that too.
But Mage Is offensive, Warrior is defensive and Thief is resources.
I think that was the whole point about forcing the round robin style points allocation.
Letting people pick 3 from any of the 36 rather than 1 from 12 (x3) kind of breaks the original design fro that reason.
I assume its a balancing issue.
We don't know the original design concept behind the round robin system so I didn't want to break it.
I was trying to fix the existing concept to remove all the issues....without changing anything too much.

[Deleted User] · July 2015

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Rune_Relic · July 2015

FancyTuna8 wrote: »

I'm new to this game and on console, but couldn't they introduce a weighting system to pvp involving teams/sides? As in, champion points and levels are given a weighting, and all teams need to be equal overall in team weighting. I play World of Tanks, and they do this. Of course, that game only features 15 v 15 players, or sometimes 7v7; from what I gather this is quite different. But there still seems a way to even teams out, and then it is up to players to utilize good teamwork.

There is no fixed sides in cyrodiil
It can be X vs 1 or X vs Y.
You could never balance it this way as the group sizes are random.
Even then you might have 60 vs 40 in any area with 6x 10 man groups vs 2x 20 man groups.
The power division is completely random as is the group sizes.... and indeed the population on any server.

The games you are talking about have rigid population and team balance using X vs X.
Combat balancing such a system is easy.

Rinmaethodain · July 2015

I LOLed and stopped reading when someone mentioned "getting free champion points"

Entitlement everywhere, people wanting everything by doing nothing. They will kill someone alive and skin him out of his 0.2% just because he wanted to work for it 2 hours.

The glorious logic of "i dont want anything to get something but i want it, but id rather have it taken away from someone who worked for it. This way i didnt do anything and im as good as him after he got robbed out of his work"

kmorganlfcb16_ESO · July 2015

A couple of suggestions:

No limit on how many CPs can be earned or any form of control on the rate of earning them, but place a limit on how many can be spent, which will force players to make considerations concerning which CPs will be best suited to particular situations which will require choices to be made by players on which ones to use in certain situation. This will be similar to some trait systems in other MMOs.

Slightly similar to the above, but players can only spend CPs in one constellation (with or without a limit. I haven't decided on that one but it's food for thought).

Eucken · July 2015

I like champion points and far to many people just take it as an excuse for why they are bad players. Even before the champion point system you had groups of 10 players in PvP who could kill 50+.

This game is much less about CP then it is about gear. Do Champion difference affect the 0,1% playerbase who strugle who is first, second or third in the leaderboards? It could, but then again in generell, I would argue that those players have more CP then the average player anyways, so I don't think so. ( thats at least true for 12 man trials because the base is much bigger)

I mean just take at look at the last episode of ESO Live. Most people have the LAdy has a Mundus stone. Why? Because they don't care to figure out how there character works best and just stick with the first one they find. This is an improvement that would cost no Gold to change it and would take all of 5 min. too change maybe 10 min. if we factor reading through all the effects of the different mundus stones.

And a look at the Leaderboards of Arena even proofs this. Hodor goes in with a full stamina templar group and like hodor just loves to point out has no PvP buffs and every little CP and and the second group is a magica group with problably 750 Champion points more asthe Hodor group and they even have all the PvP buffs.

And they can barly keep up.

So all the "CP are unfair" people are in my opinion just whiners or lazy people because other things factor in much much more.

Darkeus · July 2015

cut this crap with op champions points! champ points are ok

Ghosted · July 2015

Get over it, if you can't/won't put in the time to get points then you don't deserve to be in the same level as the people that can. It's like saying, I don't want to put the time in to be good at shooting basketball from 3 point line, but Steph Curry does, so take away 3 point line so we are all even (whuuuuu)

DerpyShadowz · July 2015

BugCollector wrote: »

Njag wrote: »

BugCollector wrote: »

There's already a couple of players with 1000 CP. The gap just keeps on growing and growing between these grinders and newbie players. They have no way to catch up, even with ZOS's catch up program.

My suggestion is to get completely rid of the Champion System, BUT compensate the grinders, who have 400 or more CP, with a unique title and mount or something.

Champion System is the cause of imbalance. Listen before it's too late.

Away with BugCollector!

That's not very nice.

Awarding peoples months of work by removing a system and offering them a replacement title isnt that nice either

Xantaria · July 2015

I'd love to see CP disabled in leaderboards tho. It's not a competition about who grinded the most, is it?

Taonnor · July 2015

My suggestions

- Set the maximum CP of passives to 300 (25%) instead of 100 (25%)
- Set the maximum needed CP for level 4 free passive to 1200 instead of 120 (10->100, 30->300, 75->750, 120->1200)
- Let the 3600 CP maximum stay

So now you got diversity in the CP system.

- If you want the level 4 free passive from one constellation you need to skill out all 4 passives before. But then you put all your CP in one constellation.
- If you want passives from other constellations you never got a level 4 free passive from one constellation.

Other arguments:
- The skaling of passives are much more flat
- You never can have all level 4 passives
- The CP system is not changed too much, only adjusted

Eucken · July 2015

Taonnor wrote: »

My suggestions

- Set the maximum CP of passives to 300 (25%) instead of 100 (25%)
- Set the maximum needed CP for level 4 free passive to 1200 instead of 120 (10->100, 30->300, 75->750, 120->1200)
- Let the 3600 CP maximum stay

So now you got diversity in the CP system.

- If you want the level 4 free passive from one constellation you need to skill out all 4 passives before. But then you put all your CP in one constellation.
- If you want passives from other constellations you never got a level 4 free passive from one constellation.

Other arguments:
- The skaling of passives are much more flat
- You never can have all level 4 passives
- The CP system is not changed too much, only adjusted

I tell you what I don'T like about not beeing able to have it all. A lot of people are playing PvE and PvP and then I would never have the hope of every haveing the ability at some point to put my points in things that I need for PvE and for PvP I would have to reskill every time and I think a lot of people wouldn't like that.

Would be a bit like making Stamina only good for PvP and Magicka build only good for PvE and if you would want to play both on one char, well then it sucks to be you...

And you would have to rebalance a lot of things aswell. Just think about a DK and a Sorc. A sorc does Elemental and magic dmg so to get a 25% increase overall he need 200 blue champion points a DK only deal Elemental(fire) dmg so he only needs 100. In your new system the DK would need 3600 and the sorc 7200 but upps thats no even possible to get.

Xantaria · July 2015

Taonnor wrote: »

My suggestions

- Set the maximum CP of passives to 300 (25%) instead of 100 (25%)
- Set the maximum needed CP for level 4 free passive to 1200 instead of 120 (10->100, 30->300, 75->750, 120->1200)
- Let the 3600 CP maximum stay

So now you got diversity in the CP system.

- If you want the level 4 free passive from one constellation you need to skill out all 4 passives before. But then you put all your CP in one constellation.
- If you want passives from other constellations you never got a level 4 free passive from one constellation.

Other arguments:
- The skaling of passives are much more flat
- You never can have all level 4 passives
- The CP system is not changed too much, only adjusted

Pretty good suggestion.

EgoRush · July 2015

Skill>CP for sure. A difference of 100-400 is negligible IMO. Certain passives need to be fixed though (*cough* Last Stand *cough*).

washlov · July 2015

the CP system is boring and linear everyone will have the same passives, one give dmg the other protects from dmg
it makes pve unfair
it makes pvp unfair
its only good for 24/7 china farmers
its separating the player base
it makes all activity in game where you dont get max ep feeling worthless

elder scrolls is better than a system which makes you king cause you farm 24/7