Do you think there should be an AoE cap?

Cepeza

No

Reavan wrote: »

Countering the zerg is all well and good.
But when people start using aoes as the go to ability even in small groups or 1v1 then something is wrong.

I don't think the target cap is a great idea but i also dont believe in these cookie cuter aoe builds that excel in any situation. So i am against aoe spam but aslo against zerging.

The dacoc spreading out makes sense and i have a fine idea to enforce it.

IDEA
Remove target caps of aoe.
Reduce damage of aoe by a %, could be anything. Lets say 25% of the current.
If you hit 3 targets you do double damage to each.
4 targets triple damage.
5 targets quad damage. (same as now)
6 targets 5x damage.
7 targets 6x damage.
8 targets 7x damage.
9+ targets 8x damage. (or double the current damage)

This way dedicated aoe builds have a place to counter zergs while removing the whole concept of AOE SPAM VS EVERYTHING.

I don't like your idea. That would be a massive buff to AOE.

There is another.

Let AOE abilities have a fixed damage pool. No max target limit. Simple ruleset: The more target you hit the less damage you do to a single target. Your fixed dps get evenly distributed among targets hit. For well ironed AOE balance ZOS adjusts each AOE ability max damage step by step alowing a well ironed AOE balance in PvP and PvE.

...or implement collision detection in PvP to avoid zerg blob!

Kanvindr

No

If people are close enough to me to kiss me, they should be close enought to get slapped too.

Digerati

No

Cepeza wrote: »

Reavan wrote: »

Countering the zerg is all well and good.
But when people start using aoes as the go to ability even in small groups or 1v1 then something is wrong.

I don't think the target cap is a great idea but i also dont believe in these cookie cuter aoe builds that excel in any situation. So i am against aoe spam but aslo against zerging.

The dacoc spreading out makes sense and i have a fine idea to enforce it.

IDEA
Remove target caps of aoe.
Reduce damage of aoe by a %, could be anything. Lets say 25% of the current.
If you hit 3 targets you do double damage to each.
4 targets triple damage.
5 targets quad damage. (same as now)
6 targets 5x damage.
7 targets 6x damage.
8 targets 7x damage.
9+ targets 8x damage. (or double the current damage)

This way dedicated aoe builds have a place to counter zergs while removing the whole concept of AOE SPAM VS EVERYTHING.

I don't like your idea. That would be a massive buff to AOE.

There is another.

Let AOE abilities have a fixed damage pool. No max target limit. Simple ruleset: The more target you hit the less damage you do to a single target. Your fixed dps get evenly distributed among targets hit. For well ironed AOE balance ZOS adjusts each AOE ability max damage step by step alowing a well ironed AOE balance in PvP and PvE.

...or implement collision detection in PvP to avoid zerg blob!

I don't like your idea, either... It's effectively a disguised target cap... Distributed damage over an area is not what I would consider an area of effect ability.

The only sensible way to handle AoE spells is to make their epicenter deal tremendous damage that tapers off the further from the target you get.

Shaun98ca2

No

I was thinking since most the cap is already there just wait for the patch to go through then start streaming and posting how bad the zerg blobing really is.

At the same time get out there and try your best at defeating the zerg blobs with 12 man groups.

This way you can either prove that the cap system is WILDLY broken or you simply prove to yourself that the caps are fine and well designed groups pwn all.

I think the WORST answer is leaving in drones, there is still a possibility for hope.

Edited:

I was thinking...zerg blobs CANT heal as well in this game as others. Healing is done over time with 90% of the abilities PLUS mana regen makes this VERY hard to maintain. MAYBE there is a chance the system even with caps still favors well designed groups over large zerg blobs due to how bad healing is in general in addition to how powerful AOEs are to begin with as well as spamable.

Alyenora

No

If this really goes live... Then im out!

Digerati

No

Just for those keeping score... $572,400/year does not want AoE caps, as per this poll.

torstenb16_ESO8

No

I think, the main problem is that the cooldown of some skills skills are much too fast. Some skills you can do 4 to 8 times after each other and you can kill lots of players.maybe increase the armor for all races for 15% or more can help, than you will have better and longer gameplay.Look at DAOC, you can mezz,stun for about 2 minutes and gameplay is slower,my archer is running fast like the red flash.Slower gamplay and muuuuuch longer cooldowns for skills and maybe much more armor for all classes can improve gameplay a lot. To die with one or two hits, makes not fun for all to play pvp. Please remove aoe cap and make a better balance for longer gameplay.So some archer skills make sense to use again.

fabsley

No

bat swarm wont get hit by that aoe cap "fix" .. and why should it? imbalanced?

shame on you zenimax, for not making this your VERY first priority of balancing

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ucmjldufa6U

Kililin

No

Wow, did not expect such a clear Vote.

RaZaddha

No

34.7K Views, 970 Comments and not a single word about why theres an AoE cap in place.

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ChairGraveyard

No

fabsley wrote: »

bat swarm wont get hit by that aoe cap "fix" .. and why should it? imbalanced?

shame on you zenimax, for not making this your VERY first priority of balancing

BECAUSE BAT SWARM ALREADY HAS A CAP!!!!!!

I don't know how many times that has been repeated over the course of this thread, probably 10 dozen.

Bat Swarm already only hits 6. The ultimate cost reduction is the problem.

fabsley

No

AoEcapviewer sais something different, mate

DaveMoeDee

There should be diminishing returns for AOE. How many people can get burned by fire emanating from a person? People closest end up absorbing damage as a shield for people next to them. There usually needs to be a max total damage for AOE that uses fire or things like that.

That is far more common sense than saying there should be no caps.

Now, if it makes more competitive sense to provide strategies that can allow the more thoughtful players to kill 10x their numbers of mindless zerg, than that might justify having no caps. But it dimishes the role-playing aspect.

achall83_ESO

Yes

Going with the dissenting opinion here, but as a melee player (DK Sorc/Vamp no less) in PvP I think there should be a cap. Note my current classes too, I'm probably one of the most effected by any nerf.

My reasoning is that the AoE's allow a small group to hold any choke point indefinitely. It's not fun for anyone really, it becomes a game of spam 1-3 skills in the right place make sure you keep cycling between Stam and Magika drains rather than anything that requires skill or snap decision making. It's particularly bad for those that favor melee, since standing off at range or playing corner games becomes far safer and more efficient than actually rushing into the breach and fighting for the keep itself.

NoMoreChillies

No

nerf aoe and say goodbye to my money

Prospero_ESO

No

Do not make another GW2 where the biggest Zergball win´s

Thragnaf

No

aoe cap in a game like this is the most stupid thing ever. kills games.

Digerati

No

If there is no technical reason for AoE caps, they absolutely should not be added and removed whenever possible.

There is NO balance reason that AoE caps should be in place.

Jankstar

No

I like the mix of capped and uncapped abilities. It could create some very interesting tactical situations. Should we stick close like a shield wall for mutual protection or do we need to spread out to avoid being caught in one blast? I think having both would make for excitement. I understand that they intended to cap the aoes, and don't blame them for making it work the way it was intended. Hopefully they will see the possibilities of some uncapped abilities and add that level of tactics to the game.

Xsorus

No

hopefully i've managed to convince Mark Jacobs that Caps are bad for the game.

ozmorgudduth

No

No AoE cap please. Hitting only 6 enemy targets will make their healers job super easy, and whoever spams faster wins, no skills involved whatsoever.

Don't break the game, fix batman crap don't brake everything else, I'm no AoE player, I'm a sorc sigle target brawler without any AoE abilities in my build, but this is easy to see through and it will affect everyone...

RaZaddha

No

Hey, maybe if we push this thread to 1000 comments ZOS will deem us worthy of giving us the reason why theres already caps in place.

Rev Rielle

Yes

Yes, it should. It's nonsensical.
With no AoE cap, PvP should have player collision and friendly fire. In fact they should have those things anyways. The eight know Cyrodiil is big enough to support such.

Xsorus

No

Rev Rielle wrote: »

Yes, it should. It's nonsensical.
With no AoE cap, PvP should have player collision and friendly fire. In fact they should have those things anyways. The eight know Cyrodiil is big enough to support such.

So wait..It makes no sense to not have an aoe cap?

It makes more sense that if 100 people are in a burning building, technically only 6 of them should burn with the building.

drodel

No

They are going to do the same as GW2. AOE cap was what made that game a dull zerg vs zerg. I bought ESO ONLY because of that video The Chalamo keep defence, where quite a few people defended versus two zergs. Now they gonna kill that concept.
Zeni, GW2 at least has no subscription. Why we should pay you for the same mediocre content, which another supplier gives away for free?
I can only hope that you will change your mind and decide to invest in hardware capable of calculating real AOE and let us have REAL FUN we ve been waiting for so long.

Alexandrious

Yes

I got the feeling this game is gonna flop before it even has a chance to go F2P from everything I seen, heh.

scave

No

GW2's little RVR zone, with its little keeps and towers, probably needs the AOE cap as there's not a whole lot of positioning space. Stuff like arrow carts could murder whole raids without it.

I don't see that as being relevant to ESO PVP, where chokes can be bypassed for the most part, and simple positioning actually adds to the tactical element of group combat because it encourages maneuvering.

Ganksalot

No

If you stand in a PBAOE You deserve to die. Regardless if there is 1 or 100 people standing in it.

Xsorus

No

scave wrote: »

GW2's little RVR zone, with its little keeps and towers, probably needs the AOE cap as there's not a whole lot of positioning space. Stuff like arrow carts could murder whole raids without it.

I don't see that as being relevant to ESO PVP, where chokes can be bypassed for the most part, and simple positioning actually adds to the tactical element of group combat because it encourages maneuvering.

heh, Arrow Carts in GW2 had a 50 Man Cap, vs the regular 5 man cap for all AoE's

That's why only Arrow Carts were using for fighting zergs.

Niffo

No

This game disappoints a little more each day. If there was any indication that every ability would have an AoE cap I wouldn't have bothered with the game, why do only a few skills list a target cap while the majority don't? I don't understand Zenimax wanting to give the player as little information as they possibly can because of some ridiculous vision they have for the game. What a let down this game has been.