Anti-Teabagging Policy now encouraging even worse toxic behavior

Xandreia_

SilverBride wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

This may be an extreme idea but... why not just stop teabagging?

The only way to stop teabagging is for the developers to get rid of crouching. That means getting rid of stealth.

When someone crouches to go into stealth mode, they crouch once... not repeatedly over the top of another player's head.

you really think someone wouldn't find a way to bag even if they did that? plus spaulder would need to be changed along with stealth detection

MidniteOwl1913

Xandreia_ wrote: »

or you could stop telling people how to play and conduct themselves on a game? why bother trying to dictate how people play on a game that's meant to be an escape? i don't understand the burning passion some people have to ruin things for others just because the pixels did a thing they don't like -.-

i dont know a single person that would teabag a random person just for the sake of it, its all banter!

Random person, always solo been tea bagged numerous times. The first couple of times I didn't even know what was going on (honestly it never occurred to me that one player would do that to another), my daughter told me it was "tea-bagging", and then she explained what it was and yes I felt humiliated.

These are not my friends, this not "friendly banter"!

spartaxoxo

Those old COD lobbies are exactly why bagging has such a bad reputation and why game companies needed to fix the rules. Those old lax lobbies created some very bad pipelines that aren't appropriate to discuss here. Good riddance to them.

Xandreia_

MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »

Xandreia_ wrote: »

or you could stop telling people how to play and conduct themselves on a game? why bother trying to dictate how people play on a game that's meant to be an escape? i don't understand the burning passion some people have to ruin things for others just because the pixels did a thing they don't like -.-

i dont know a single person that would teabag a random person just for the sake of it, its all banter!

Random person, always solo been tea bagged numerous times. The first couple of times I didn't even know what was going on (honestly it never occurred to me that one player would do that to another), my daughter told me it was "tea-bagging", and then she explained what it was and yes I felt humiliated.

These are not my friends, this not "friendly banter"!

then why play a multiplayer game when every single multiplayer game that has crouch and stand has this. im genuinely curious why someone would get offended by it. in my 25 years of gaming ive never been offended by it. only thing i get offended by on this game are weird men that wanna *cough* my healer -.-

SilverBride

Is teabagging other players so vital to some player's enjoyment of the game that they can't just stop doing it, even though there have been countless threads about wanting something done about it? And even though they know they may be reported for it, and even banned?

Xandreia_

SilverBride wrote: »

Is teabagging other players so vital to some player's enjoyment of the game that they can't just stop doing it, even though there have been countless threads about wanting something done about it? And even though they know they may be reported for it, and even banned?

no it isnt vital but neither is crying about it over 20 different threads. they already wrote it into ToS thats it, you guys have your way, dont like it, ask them to stop, send a vid in if they are set to offline, idc but im just over seeing people moan and cry on the forums over something that has been talked about to death

SilverBride

Xandreia_ wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Is teabagging other players so vital to some player's enjoyment of the game that they can't just stop doing it, even though there have been countless threads about wanting something done about it? And even though they know they may be reported for it, and even banned?

no it isnt vital but neither is crying about it over 20 different threads. they already wrote it into ToS thats it, you guys have your way, dont like it, ask them to stop, send a vid in if they are set to offline, idc but im just over seeing people moan and cry on the forums over something that has been talked about to death

Because if the player doing the teabagging is in another alliance, which of course they would be, or in offline mode, the affected player can't ask them to stop. This is why there needs to be a clear rule about this, not just a stipulation that is impossible to fulfill.

spartaxoxo

Xandreia_ wrote: »

MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »

Xandreia_ wrote: »

or you could stop telling people how to play and conduct themselves on a game? why bother trying to dictate how people play on a game that's meant to be an escape? i don't understand the burning passion some people have to ruin things for others just because the pixels did a thing they don't like -.-

i dont know a single person that would teabag a random person just for the sake of it, its all banter!

Random person, always solo been tea bagged numerous times. The first couple of times I didn't even know what was going on (honestly it never occurred to me that one player would do that to another), my daughter told me it was "tea-bagging", and then she explained what it was and yes I felt humiliated.

These are not my friends, this not "friendly banter"!

then why play a multiplayer game when every single multiplayer game that has crouch and stand has this. im genuinely curious why someone would get offended by it. in my 25 years of gaming ive never been offended by it. only thing i get offended by on this game are weird men that wanna *cough* my healer -.-

At the very best, it is saying "LOL I'm better than you." That's the nicest thing someone can mean by it. Some people also mean things that are best left to Molag Bal or a homophobic message.

Now, some will take "LOL I'm better than you," and reply "Not for long! You're so getting bagged the next time I see you!" And a friendly rivalry can occur. Others will feel bad and embarrassed and won't like someone mocking them.

It shouldn't be hard to understand why two different people may feel different emotions about being teased. And this is especially true of strangers, who don't know you or your intentions. Such things tend to go better with friends who know each other's lines and moods.

I_killed_Vivec

Elsonso wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

I was doing some push bagging on a dead craglorn NPC last night. Was I harassing the NPC? Am I at risk of getting banned? The NPC AI doesn't have the option to send me a whisper asking me to stop.

If your character is a Necromancer, I think you might be good.

I never saw where the rules for tea bagging changed, so as long as that NPC does not report you, and you were not witnessed by a player that took offense, I doubt it was noticed.

Oh there were witnesses alright, and that isn't how it went down.

NPC hit 'em once, they went down like a sack of potatoes... it was the NPC doing the teabagging

Aggrovious

I t-bag bosses. When will the NPCs report me for my freedom?

Stafford197

ZOS, why are we encouraging players to abuse the Report tool?

I was once mass reported for Cheating after 1vXing players in PvP. This caused me to receive a permaban on my account for weeks until Support completed their investigation to find me innocent. In other words, these players successfully punished me by abusing a broken system and faced no repercussions since they thought I was cheating.

SilverBride wrote: »

As a society we need to have a system that holds those that do not treat others with respect accountable for their actions rather than just letting them continue their toxic behaviors.

This one is interesting. What do you propose?
After all, “toxic behaviors” are heavily subject to personal opinion. I believe accountability for being mean should occur naturally within society itself.

Basically go ahead and say bad words, act rudely, and display “toxic behaviors”. You’ll be proven wrong, hated, embarrassed, lose your friends and connections…. these seem like pretty convincing reasons for someone to rethink their behavior, no? If we want to reduce occurrences then we need to have respect for each other and personal accountability, including for those we associate with. You can also continue to be rude to everyone, and we can all cut you out of our lives. Legally.

The secondary method is to legislate it, but I believe it should never be illegal to behave in a manner which cannot be defined since it then leaves the law up to interpretation. Basically you may be happy about voting in a system where stuff you consider “toxic behavior” is held accountable, but the only thing it takes for “toxic behavior” to eventually be defined as your own personal views and opinions is time. This path focuses on oppressively using the legal system to shut down all constructive conversation.

Funnily enough, my ESO permaban situation above is a great example for this….. When players think you’re cheating, would you prefer to be permanently banned so you are removed from the playerbase and then hope you can get it reversed in the future? Or would you rather have a short conversation where both parties tell their side of the story, and then they apologize to you for the misunderstanding?
It gets a lot scarier when this is translated into real life terms.

JiubLeRepenti

I honestly don't understand why people get so offensive over teabagging. I will probably never truly understand it. I'm an old-school gamer... I've developed a thick skin over the years. I was also bullied in RL school so this pretty much helped me to develop my thick skin so maybe that is it?

I think how you react to teabagging really comes down to how much you can take a joke and not take things too seriously. Honestly, the idea of being offended by this is just beyond me. I genuinely can’t understand it. At all. It’s like saying you feel oppressed by a stone you saw during a walk in the forest, just because it was looking like a weenie.

If I saw someone teabagging me in the middle of a crazy battle, I’d just laugh. It’s such a ridiculous thing that it’s clearly just for fun. If someone thinks that’s actual harassment, I wonder how they’d handle real-life problems.

Sure, everyone has their feelings, but gaming is meant to be about fun and playful banter. It seems obvious to me that you should keep some emotional distance from the pixels on the screen.

RaikaNA

SilverBride wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

This may be an extreme idea but... why not just stop teabagging?

The only way to stop teabagging is for the developers to get rid of crouching. That means getting rid of stealth.

When someone crouches to go into stealth mode, they crouch once... not repeatedly over the top of another player's head.

Glitches happen Blame it on the lag

MidniteOwl1913

Xandreia_ wrote: »

MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »

Xandreia_ wrote: »

or you could stop telling people how to play and conduct themselves on a game? why bother trying to dictate how people play on a game that's meant to be an escape? i don't understand the burning passion some people have to ruin things for others just because the pixels did a thing they don't like -.-

i dont know a single person that would teabag a random person just for the sake of it, its all banter!

Random person, always solo been tea bagged numerous times. The first couple of times I didn't even know what was going on (honestly it never occurred to me that one player would do that to another), my daughter told me it was "tea-bagging", and then she explained what it was and yes I felt humiliated.

These are not my friends, this not "friendly banter"!

then why play a multiplayer game when every single multiplayer game that has crouch and stand has this. im genuinely curious why someone would get offended by it. in my 25 years of gaming ive never been offended by it. only thing i get offended by on this game are weird men that wanna *cough* my healer -.-

Well let's look at it this way. How do you know that the intent of the bagger wasn't to make me feel humiliated? They don't know me. This is just some random encounter. To me it feels like the wall between playing a role and a personal act has been crossed. I don't like it. There are thousands of players on at the same time as me. The vast majority of them don't do this. How is it a problem to object to the ones that do?

In my opinion, these are a few bad actors intent on humiliation. I'm not going to give up some I enjoy because of them. Why would I? I'm not doing anything wrong.

Synapsis123

Just make teabagging against the rules. Don't make some weird loopholes or special rules where you have to warn the other player first.

Either that or don't have any rule against teabagging.

I also know of a ton of players who have been teabagging players in an attempt to get them to teabag back so they can weaponize customer service to try and get the player banned. I have seen this work two times.

RaikaNA

Synapsis123 wrote: »

Just make teabagging against the rules. Don't make some weird loopholes or special rules where you have to warn the other player first.

Either that or don't have any rule against teabagging.

I also know of a ton of players who have been teabagging players in an attempt to get them to teabag back so they can weaponize customer service to try and get the player banned. I have seen this work two times.

Too many rules are just going to drive people away from the game.

It's kind of ironic that people are so offended by the act of teabagging yet I don't hear the players asking ZOS to remove the vampire storyline from the game... including removing the polymorph of Molag bal.. .essentially glorifying satan.

SilverBride

RaikaNA wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

This may be an extreme idea but... why not just stop teabagging?

The only way to stop teabagging is for the developers to get rid of crouching. That means getting rid of stealth.

When someone crouches to go into stealth mode, they crouch once... not repeatedly over the top of another player's head.

Glitches happen Blame it on the lag

Lag stops actions. It doesn't make them repeat.

JiubLeRepenti

SilverBride wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

This may be an extreme idea but... why not just stop teabagging?

The only way to stop teabagging is for the developers to get rid of crouching. That means getting rid of stealth.

When someone crouches to go into stealth mode, they crouch once... not repeatedly over the top of another player's head.

Glitches happen Blame it on the lag

Lag stops actions. It doesn't make them repeat.

Mmmmmh not always... I'm 100% serious here, already got the bug while parsing on my dummy. Micro-freezes were kinda "retaining" animations that got all released at the same time when it was coming back to normal.

tsaescishoeshiner

Asking reporters to provide a video is not feasible imo.

Teabagging could be fixed if the animation was slowed down so it took 1-2 seconds to fully crouch. It would take the same time to enter sneak, but the drop-rise animation would be slower and less responsive and rewarding.

SilverBride

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

Asking reporters to provide a video is not feasible imo.

Teabagging could be fixed if the animation was slowed down so it took 1-2 seconds to fully crouch. It would take the same time to enter sneak, but the drop-rise animation would be slower and less responsive and rewarding.

I agree. What is the player supposed to do to get this video? Just record the entire time they are in Cyrodiil or battlegrounds on the chance that they may catch someone?

Jimbru

Nobody should be surprised. PVP is always the most toxic part of every game that includes it, and it attracts and encourages bad people. The only permanent solution to bullies in any form is to hit them back, which in this game means banning them. Gaming needs to get back to the old EQ paradigm of having GMs active and visibly present in the game, with Judge Dredd authority to smite bad players on the spot. Otherwise, the only solution for players who just want to enjoy the game is simply to stay out of PVP, which is what I do except during events.

BetweenMidgets

ridiculous.

its like these people are just waiting with baited breath to be offended just to stick it to someone else and spread their own misery.

NordSwordnBoard

RaikaNA wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

This may be an extreme idea but... why not just stop teabagging?

The only way to stop teabagging is for the developers to get rid of crouching. That means getting rid of stealth.

When someone crouches to go into stealth mode, they crouch once... not repeatedly over the top of another player's head.

Glitches happen Blame it on the lag

No need, most of my pals on other alliances just give me the "one dip sip" anyway. It's become quite fluid for them after practice. I on the other hand don't bother tbaggging. They bag me, I don't do it back. Not worth my time. I never told anybody in group when I was crown "to bag or not to bag" - that is the question they must answer themselves.

RaikaNA

Jimbru wrote: »

Nobody should be surprised. PVP is always the most toxic part of every game that includes it, and it attracts and encourages bad people. The only permanent solution to bullies in any form is to hit them back, which in this game means banning them. Gaming needs to get back to the old EQ paradigm of having GMs active and visibly present in the game, with Judge Dredd authority to smite bad players on the spot. Otherwise, the only solution for players who just want to enjoy the game is simply to stay out of PVP, which is what I do except during events.

Hold on wait a min.. we gotta talk here.

I play PvP and Pve in this game so I'm pretty much a hybrid player. PvE shares a lot if not more toxicity in the game, and no shortage of drama goes on in the endgame pve guilds. In most of their discords... if you do not pass the parse check (120K dps) forever the reason might be... you are not welcome to participate in any of their core groups... So much for that Vmol skin that you've been dreaming of having... if you want it.. you gotta pay for a carry with gold that you probably also don't have.

I rather deal with getting teabagged rather than dealing with segregation that goes on in Endgaming PvE.... there is a reason why I refuse to join a vet trial pve guild.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

You know there is one thing that can be done to solve everyone's problem, ZOS needs to simply adjust the crouch animation to something different.

SilverBride

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

You know there is one thing that can be done to solve everyone's problem, ZOS needs to simply adjust the crouch animation to something different.

Interesting idea.

tastyleaf

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

You know there is one thing that can be done to solve everyone's problem, ZOS needs to simply adjust the crouch animation to something different.

This sounds like a good suggestion.
I feel like if they disabled the crouch animation for PvP, and instead put something like a shadow under the character or the Nightblade invisibility opacity change to visibly show the toggle to sneak/stealth, that seems like a way to avoid dealing with false report tickets and frustrated players.

Also it's interesting to read peoples opinions on this, as I've never understood why anyone would want to waste button presses like that to taunt someone. I've seen it off and on both in ESO and other games, and generally assumed it was a someone young enough to not have arthritis lol.

WolfCombatPet

If ZOS has decided that they do not want tea-bagging in their game, they can remove the animation that places someone in crouch mode in all PvP zones/BGs.

Players will be either standing or fully crouched and hidden. No animation in between.

Problem solved.

SteveCampsOut

Ingel_Riday wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

As a society we need to have a system that holds those that do not treat others with respect accountable for their actions rather than just letting them continue their toxic behaviors.

Who decides what's toxic?

Also, I don't go to comedy clubs where they make fun of the audience and get upset when I'm made fun of. Know the venue. Central Cyrodiil is a warzone in this game. It's a three-faction slaughter festival designed to encourage people to show each other no mercy. Expecting etiquette and courtesy there is... I don't get it. Same with the Imperial City. That zone is purposefully built to encourage people to torment each other and rob each other blind. To look for individuals going it alone and gang up on them, stabbing them to death before stealing half their Tel Var Stones. The zone chat even helps you brag by broadcasting who you just murdered for everyone to see.

In real life and in the real world, there have ALWAYS been "Rules of Engagement" that expect even people in War to maintain some semblance of actual humanity. That's why we try people who break those rules for "War Crimes". This excuse that it's a war zone I don't have to be kind it just doesn't hold water except with people who, face it, are barely human to begin with.

zaria

Xandreia_ wrote: »

The report system has to change imo, I've had 3 friends who got banned in pvp purely because they were mass reported for cheating when all they did was play the game. Solo/small scale players are always being mass reported for no reason other than groups being salty they died.

Sounds a lot like New World strategy as in guilds simply mass reported enemy officers to ban them to cut off the head of enemy guilds.
General rule do not do New World things.
In the current culture its very easy to loose an audience. Ubisoft is the poster child today but chances for an Starfield 2 is low.