Hardened Ward heal making it to live is a mistake and needs to be changed

divnyi · July 18

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

ZDunlain wrote: »

And then comes my eternal doubt, use living dark (bubble) or extended ritual, one provide heal but no minor mending and the other heal, provide minor mending and clean 5 effects. So I usually go for ritual soooo once again it sucks in general the barspace.

Use both? Do you have two bars?

I feel it's kind of ironic that it used to be sorcs with bar space issues that now can slot skills just to sit as passive mag boosts, and in this thread telling templars to use 2 bars to slot ER and living dark when they mention bar space issues. Not a lot of room when you need HTD, Focus, vigor RAT, POTL/PL, Jabs, gap closer with how much ranged is kiting you, j-beam, ele susceptibility kind of a must just to have a chance PL/POTL isn't just autopurged

Most of the players that I see run living dark for as strong as it is, do so with intent to hump and draw players to them. Kind of the difference from ward that allows a sorc to both initiate and retreat

Top 3 candidates:
* Living Dark can heal you as fast as vigor and it snares, there is no reason not to run it.
* I also don't run gap-closers. That's personal thing, but my feeling is that I die more doing gap closers than win by doing them. You can also go for vamp elusive mist, which is both teleport and speed buff (instead of RAT).
* Not everyone purges. And those who do, can purge deeper and POTL will still be hit. So Ele sus is definitely not a mandatory slot.

StaticWave · July 19

Bushido2513 wrote: »

Two separate things. I know the build has damage and how the damage works. I'm not good at that particular way of creating damage.

I've never driven a Ferrari and I'm not a race car driver but I can conceptualize how it could win a race with a race car driver in it. Make sense?

Put a MotoGP racer on a 600cc bike and he wins vs an incompetent racer on a 1000cc bike. Put a MotoGP racer on a 1000cc bike and he smokes the same guy even faster.

Same logic goes for Sorc. I could win vs a bad Sorc on a bad class. Give me a Sorc and I’ll make that quicker. Individual skill plays a huge factor in a 1v1 and often masks the strength of a class. Is it the class being strong or the player? You never know when the skill gap between two opponents is too big. Sets can sometimes close the gap, but they definitely won’t guarantee a majority win.

So when I hear comments like “Ward is not OP”, I can’t help but question the individual skill level of that player.

Bushido2513 · July 19

StaticWave wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

Two separate things. I know the build has damage and how the damage works. I'm not good at that particular way of creating damage.

I've never driven a Ferrari and I'm not a race car driver but I can conceptualize how it could win a race with a race car driver in it. Make sense?

Put a MotoGP racer on a 600cc bike and he wins vs an incompetent racer on a 1000cc bike. Put a MotoGP racer on a 1000cc bike and he smokes the same guy even faster.

Same logic goes for Sorc. I could win vs a bad Sorc on a bad class. Give me a Sorc and I’ll make that quicker. Individual skill plays a huge factor in a 1v1 and often masks the strength of a class. Is it the class being strong or the player? You never know when the skill gap between two opponents is too big. Sets can sometimes close the gap, but they definitely won’t guarantee a majority win.

So when I hear comments like “Ward is not OP”, I can’t help but question the individual skill level of that player.

I think at the start of this thread it was about saying ward is or isn't op because perhaps people didn't really think it through or don't understand it to be any more complicated then that.

From my perspective it's both and really just depends on perspective and situation. Built at the high end in a 1v1 ward is absolutely op, cmx and math shows that. Once you start to build in other ways and get away from 1v1 it's really not as op. But that's a scale too because if you build for a top end build and still go up against bad players it still can seem a little op.

So it's probably going to be about the skill of the player, the formats they play in most, and other various factors I'd say as to how someone thinks of ward's performance. I don't use it at the most optimal build because that doesn't suit my playstyle so for me it seems fair but as said above I can see it looking other ways to other players in other situations.

xylena_lazarow · July 19

Bushido2513 wrote: »

Built at the high end in a 1v1 ward is absolutely op, cmx and math shows that.

Hooray, progress. Surely there is a way ZOS can figure out how to fix this but still help casual Sorcs.

TechMaybeHic · July 19

Bushido2513 wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

ZDunlain wrote: »

And then comes my eternal doubt, use living dark (bubble) or extended ritual, one provide heal but no minor mending and the other heal, provide minor mending and clean 5 effects. So I usually go for ritual soooo once again it sucks in general the barspace.

Use both? Do you have two bars?

I feel it's kind of ironic that it used to be sorcs with bar space issues that now can slot skills just to sit as passive mag boosts, and in this thread telling templars to use 2 bars to slot ER and living dark when they mention bar space issues. Not a lot of room when you need HTD, Focus, vigor RAT, POTL/PL, Jabs, gap closer with how much ranged is kiting you, j-beam, ele susceptibility kind of a must just to have a chance PL/POTL isn't just autopurged

Most of the players that I see run living dark for as strong as it is, do so with intent to hump and draw players to them. Kind of the difference from ward that allows a sorc to both initiate and retreat

Well it's comparing 2 bar build to 2 bar build and yes all those skills fit as seen below. If you're talking 1 bar builds then yeah setups for both classes will look a lot different.

https://eso-pvp-builds.com/templar/

And its giving up POTL/PL so the burst is gone. I mean, its not great but for most decent players, you have to at least have the threat of it. Good luck just jabbing and dawn breakering someone into execute range

Ummm did you look at the build? The burst is all in the sets and yes it works but there are just better and easier options and jabs does tend to miss in lag. I've played mag and stamplar but didn't go with this build because at the time there was no ssc and I've never been good at the acuity window. That being said the build could definitely burst without the need for potl

Do you always talk in circles? "Could definitely burst, but I never been good at the acuity window" Im not sure from which end of you, words come out

Two separate things. I know the build has damage and how the damage works. I'm not good at that particular way of creating damage.

I've never driven a Ferrari and I'm not a race car driver but I can conceptualize how it could win a race with a race car driver in it. Make sense?

And what I am saying is I've gained a plar since beta. I've done acuity. I've seen the work it takes to just keep on a target in that window and how it starts to fail when anyone knows what you are doing and can just stay out of jabs. It's special easy right now with the power budget of range. I mean, you do notice hiw more plans are ranged now, right? I will give it's probably because their only como is javelin meteor

I have played sorc considerably less and lately; those same players thst I run into nightly, will dodge it a lot but right when I think they might pull it off, they stop dodging and a combo lands and it ends it. And I chuckle because of how easy it was from what I'm used to. Didn't have to run a set for my burst. Barely rely on an ulr. Dint have to hit ER, vigor, living dark and HTD to survive. Usually just vigor and shield or just spam shield.

So maybe that's why you weren't as fast in a Ferrari and so you jumped in an F1 race car and think it's fine.

Bushido2513 · July 19

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

Built at the high end in a 1v1 ward is absolutely op, cmx and math shows that.

Hooray, progress. Surely there is a way ZOS can figure out how to fix this but still help casual Sorcs.

I'm ok with just putting an upper limit on the ability of the skill or changing the scaling past a certain point. I just don't think a reduction would be that helpful. But also I'm relying on ZOS for analysis there to see how much of an overall problem the high end is or isn't. Of course I'm not saying people shouldn't say what they see by any means.

Bushido2513 · July 19

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

ZDunlain wrote: »

And then comes my eternal doubt, use living dark (bubble) or extended ritual, one provide heal but no minor mending and the other heal, provide minor mending and clean 5 effects. So I usually go for ritual soooo once again it sucks in general the barspace.

Use both? Do you have two bars?

I feel it's kind of ironic that it used to be sorcs with bar space issues that now can slot skills just to sit as passive mag boosts, and in this thread telling templars to use 2 bars to slot ER and living dark when they mention bar space issues. Not a lot of room when you need HTD, Focus, vigor RAT, POTL/PL, Jabs, gap closer with how much ranged is kiting you, j-beam, ele susceptibility kind of a must just to have a chance PL/POTL isn't just autopurged

Most of the players that I see run living dark for as strong as it is, do so with intent to hump and draw players to them. Kind of the difference from ward that allows a sorc to both initiate and retreat

Well it's comparing 2 bar build to 2 bar build and yes all those skills fit as seen below. If you're talking 1 bar builds then yeah setups for both classes will look a lot different.

https://eso-pvp-builds.com/templar/

And its giving up POTL/PL so the burst is gone. I mean, its not great but for most decent players, you have to at least have the threat of it. Good luck just jabbing and dawn breakering someone into execute range

Ummm did you look at the build? The burst is all in the sets and yes it works but there are just better and easier options and jabs does tend to miss in lag. I've played mag and stamplar but didn't go with this build because at the time there was no ssc and I've never been good at the acuity window. That being said the build could definitely burst without the need for potl

Do you always talk in circles? "Could definitely burst, but I never been good at the acuity window" Im not sure from which end of you, words come out

Two separate things. I know the build has damage and how the damage works. I'm not good at that particular way of creating damage.

I've never driven a Ferrari and I'm not a race car driver but I can conceptualize how it could win a race with a race car driver in it. Make sense?

And what I am saying is I've gained a plar since beta. I've done acuity. I've seen the work it takes to just keep on a target in that window and how it starts to fail when anyone knows what you are doing and can just stay out of jabs. It's special easy right now with the power budget of range. I mean, you do notice hiw more plans are ranged now, right? I will give it's probably because their only como is javelin meteor

I have played sorc considerably less and lately; those same players thst I run into nightly, will dodge it a lot but right when I think they might pull it off, they stop dodging and a combo lands and it ends it. And I chuckle because of how easy it was from what I'm used to. Didn't have to run a set for my burst. Barely rely on an ulr. Dint have to hit ER, vigor, living dark and HTD to survive. Usually just vigor and shield or just spam shield.

So maybe that's why you weren't as fast in a Ferrari and so you jumped I'm an F1 race car and think it's fine.

So I've been playing magsorc at a time when nobody really played it unless you like it. It wasn't easy but I got better at it and got the right build and did well wayyy before this buff.

In my experience when you really like a class you have a chance at making it work better than others can because the class appeals to you and you feel better about the time.

I don't doubt that an acuity user that's a better player than me who just really enjoys plar would give me a run for my money. Granted it wouldn't be easy because I'm so tanky but I've seen myself just get outplayed in a situation where I thought I had it in the bag.

So when I say the build can work I'm not saying it's easy or that anyone could do it. Just saying the math of the damage works out though yes you might have to do things like bait the other player into over committing or get a little lucky and tricky with your damage window.

xylena_lazarow · July 19

Bushido2513 wrote: »

I'm ok with just putting an upper limit on the ability of the skill or changing the scaling past a certain point.

This used to be in the game, it was called "soft caps" where stacking a stat past a certain point would result in harshly diminishing returns, this was very good for the game and absolutely tragic that they removed it in order to market "infinite progression" with the CP system. Soft caps would solve Hardened Ward, Polar Wind, and more.

Alchimiste1 · July 19

You know what the crazy thing is, because of the changes they have made to magsorc it’s so close to being an oakensoul build lol. You can be both offensive and defensive on the same bar for so long.

It doesn’t even need to rotate a single hot.

Tcholl · July 19

One of the problems with this kind of OP skill is that makes the game feel artificial, either if you are winning or losing. Personally, I want to feel that my performance will have impact on the final outcome rather than expect what is going to happen.

Bushido2513 · July 19

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

I'm ok with just putting an upper limit on the ability of the skill or changing the scaling past a certain point.

This used to be in the game, it was called "soft caps" where stacking a stat past a certain point would result in harshly diminishing returns, this was very good for the game and absolutely tragic that they removed it in order to market "infinite progression" with the CP system. Soft caps would solve Hardened Ward, Polar Wind, and more.

Now that's an even better way to look at it that I didn't think of as in putting that on everything in the game. It either needs to be diminishing returns or pools that work for damage vs healing. Played ideally need to be making meaningful and rewarding build choices but that also complicates the game for players and ZOS so who knows if we'll ever see that

Bushido2513 · July 19

Alchimiste1 wrote: »

You know what the crazy thing is, because of the changes they have made to magsorc it’s so close to being an oakensoul build lol. You can be both offensive and defensive on the same bar for so long.

It doesn’t even need to rotate a single hot.

You can definitely stay on the front bar longer but then your damage and overall defenses take a hit. I do appreciate that I can fight and defend longer on the same bar but you definitely notice the difference when and if you don't rotate for added damage, damage, and defense buffs.

But I've also seen other classes do similar things where it seems like there have an endless pool of resources to keep up their assault while still healing. But yeah sorc defensive lack if gcd requirements are definitely noticeable.

Bushido2513 · July 19

Tcholl wrote: »

One of the problems with this kind of OP skill is that makes the game feel artificial, either if you are winning or losing. Personally, I want to feel that my performance will have impact on the final outcome rather than expect what is going to happen.

This is interning because I feel the same way. My build just happens to be off meta and I am usually outnumbered so I don't feel op but I could imagine someone being even midway decent with sorc, getting the higher end build and maybe challenging 1 or a few lesser players and feeling like the game is less rewarding.

Currently for me it feels like there is a good sampling of people I can kill, people I can't kill, groups that do enough damage to run me off, procs that take me down to 40 percent or less, and groups of players that straight up run me down.

But yeah if I felt like nobody could challenge me or take me out that would be boring

Alchimiste1 · July 19

Bushido2513 wrote: »

Alchimiste1 wrote: »

You know what the crazy thing is, because of the changes they have made to magsorc it’s so close to being an oakensoul build lol. You can be both offensive and defensive on the same bar for so long.

It doesn’t even need to rotate a single hot.

You can definitely stay on the front bar longer but then your damage and overall defenses take a hit. I do appreciate that I can fight and defend longer on the same bar but you definitely notice the difference when and if you don't rotate for added damage, damage, and defense buffs.

But I've also seen other classes do similar things where it seems like there have an endless pool of resources to keep up their assault while still healing. But yeah sorc defensive lack if gcd requirements are definitely noticeable.

whats your bar setup look like for your magsorc ?

Alchimiste1 · July 19

this is what the magsorc bar setup should look like, unless you are using some of the new scribing skills

Bushido2513 · July 19

Alchimiste1 wrote: »

this is what the magsorc bar setup should look like, unless you are using some of the new scribing skills

I use crushing and hurricane instead of ele, well I'm testing the out but this is what my bar usually looks like

So if you don't back bar on the bar setup shown you eventually lose sorcery, berserk, pen, curse.

ZDunlain · July 19

divnyi wrote: »

ZDunlain wrote: »

And then comes my eternal doubt, use living dark (bubble) or extended ritual, one provide heal but no minor mending and the other heal, provide minor mending and clean 5 effects. So I usually go for ritual soooo once again it sucks in general the barspace.

Use both? Do you have two bars?

That is the bar I use, I cannot drop PoTL because outside that "burst" it buff me with weap/spell dmg and gives minor breach to the enemy. Camouflage hunter is a must imho against nb and also major prophecy and in the backbar elemental susceptibility is a must also, then my only option to place living dark is that or the cleanse, and the cleanse provide a reliable minor mending and in a duel that is super important imo, and also in sieges to cleanse yourself.

ZDunlain · July 19

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

ZDunlain wrote: »

And then comes my eternal doubt, use living dark (bubble) or extended ritual, one provide heal but no minor mending and the other heal, provide minor mending and clean 5 effects. So I usually go for ritual soooo once again it sucks in general the barspace.

Use both? Do you have two bars?

I feel it's kind of ironic that it used to be sorcs with bar space issues that now can slot skills just to sit as passive mag boosts, and in this thread telling templars to use 2 bars to slot ER and living dark when they mention bar space issues. Not a lot of room when you need HTD, Focus, vigor RAT, POTL/PL, Jabs, gap closer with how much ranged is kiting you, j-beam, ele susceptibility kind of a must just to have a chance PL/POTL isn't just autopurged

Most of the players that I see run living dark for as strong as it is, do so with intent to hump and draw players to them. Kind of the difference from ward that allows a sorc to both initiate and retreat

Well it's comparing 2 bar build to 2 bar build and yes all those skills fit as seen below. If you're talking 1 bar builds then yeah setups for both classes will look a lot different.

https://eso-pvp-builds.com/templar/

And its giving up POTL/PL so the burst is gone. I mean, its not great but for most decent players, you have to at least have the threat of it. Good luck just jabbing and dawn breakering someone into execute range

Literally this, PoTL is a must imo, if not, not enough damage, sad days for templars in PvP.

Alchimiste1 · July 19

Bushido2513 wrote: »

Alchimiste1 wrote: »

this is what the magsorc bar setup should look like, unless you are using some of the new scribing skills

I use crushing and hurricane instead of ele, well I'm testing the out but this is what my bar usually looks like

So if you don't back bar on the bar setup shown you eventually lose sorcery, berserk, pen, curse.

Ofc, but they are all fairly long buffs you don't actually need to go to your backbar for more than a second at a time.

It seems to me like you aren't running an optimal magsorc setup so maybe that's why your view is skewed. With respect, if you have the time, I would like for you try out the following build

2x Chudan, 5X wretched vitality, 5x crafty alfiq(front bar 5) and ddf. You should be able to hit 50k+ mag with little issues. Use max mag + health food. Your mundus can be anything depending on how comfortable you feel. (mage, shadow, recovery etc). 2-3 heavy pieces. Don't go below 17k max stam.

Please use the exact skills I have listed in my previous screenshot. Crushing is fine but ele is a bit better

After trying this out, please come back to these forums and update us on whether your position has changed.

Bushido2513 · July 20

Alchimiste1 wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

Alchimiste1 wrote: »

this is what the magsorc bar setup should look like, unless you are using some of the new scribing skills

I use crushing and hurricane instead of ele, well I'm testing the out but this is what my bar usually looks like

So if you don't back bar on the bar setup shown you eventually lose sorcery, berserk, pen, curse.

Ofc, but they are all fairly long buffs you don't actually need to go to your backbar for more than a second at a time.

It seems to me like you aren't running an optimal magsorc setup so maybe that's why your view is skewed. With respect, if you have the time, I would like for you try out the following build

2x Chudan, 5X wretched vitality, 5x crafty alfiq(front bar 5) and ddf. You should be able to hit 50k+ mag with little issues. Use max mag + health food. Your mundus can be anything depending on how comfortable you feel. (mage, shadow, recovery etc). 2-3 heavy pieces. Don't go below 17k max stam.

Please use the exact skills I have listed in my previous screenshot. Crushing is fine but ele is a bit better

After trying this out, please come back to these forums and update us on whether your position has changed.

So I tried this build pre change to ward and I tried it yesterday again. It's not for me so I'm back on my old build but that's because it's more suited to my playstyle.

I can see what some would have an issue with and would say that I think the top end of this setup should have more diminishing returns to encourage using what it is now but also build diversity.

As I said previously ward is too strong in some areas and just fine in others. So when I played in bgs I felt pretty strong though certainly not invulnerable. At this point I would have preferred a top end limit to make it a bit more fair to compete against. The damage wasn't far over my current build and I didn't find that I was some kind of nuke with endless resources.

Now I will say in IC I was at some point quickly hunted down and dispatched by a group and proc sets in any format can really just hurt.

So I appreciate the bar space and diversity I have now but the top end on ward as well as many skills should probably have diminishing returns to encourage players to make choices that matter in terms of what they gain and give up.

I do think ZOS still is the only one that can ultimately see the full picture but again I can very much see why some would have an issue with this iteration of ward especially when they have to face it at the top end and don't have the numbers or damage to deal with a ward user.

Also I do get my fair share of kills in the game but on either build I still ran up against a good number of people that just didn't die at all or didn't die easy or without help. So while I think the top end could use a review I'd still say that it wasn't a blowout by any means. So while I had what some would call everything I still felt the issues with the overall game and other classes where it was sometimes just hard to kill anyone. I say that to say that perhaps I look at ward slightly differently because at a more manageable end you're now just as tanky as a lot of other players out there. I do hope that changes to undeath and maybe other things in the game make this more of a place where players including myself can die deaths that make a bit more sense but it's going to take some changes to ward and other things to get there for sure.

MEBengalsFan2001 · July 20

It’s not only harden ward that the issue. It’s also that the buff crystal frag can be used off any skill instantly and it gets a significant buff in damage. It proc way to often and allows for Sorc to help burst down its target. The biggest issue I have with that skill is it can proc off itself. I have gotten it to go 7x in a row. Crystal frag imo should only proc off Sorc skills and never proc from itself. That would fix that problem.

MEBengalsFan2001 · July 20

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Bushido2513 wrote: »

I'm not good at that particular way of creating damage. I've never driven a Ferrari and I'm not a race car driver but I can conceptualize how it could win a race with a race car driver in it. Make sense?

No not really. Put an incompetent driver in the Ferrari (Sorc), and I'll win the race in a used Ford Fiesta (Necro). Doesn't mean a Ford Fiesta is faster than a Ferrari, doesn't mean Necro is good or Sorc is balanced. You can only fairly judge race cars when driven by equally skilled and competent drivers. Piloting gaming builds parallels this.

All depends on the Ferrari and type of race. Drag race against a newer Ferrari you would lose almost every time. Only time you would win is if the Ferrari break downs or tire blows.

As for sorc they are super easy to play. They have great burst from frag, decent heal and defensive capability from harden ward, great mobility from streak, and that just 3 skills being used. You also get increase to magic by 8% and minor resolve on both bars. Most use the head piece to get major res freeing up another slot to get another skill that could be beneficial etc…

Sorc are like warden. Easy to play. Great mobility, great defensive and even their defensive capabilities give them offensive opportunities to counter and do burst damage. DK and Arcanist also fall into this category.

Tcholl · July 20

A content creator called Feng Rush posted an U43 in his youtube channel and expressed the same opion as most of players right now regarding the hardened ward. The current state of this skills is absurd for pvp and make no sense for pve. He plays sorc, or at least used to, as stated by him on the video.

He is sick, as everyone else, for ZOS not addressing issues such as the ward change. He also referenced this same thread and others in the forum.

Every day we have more players stating the obvious about the current state of the Hardened Ward and also about the current state of sorcs and nbs in general.

You can check the video on the link below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTYTSzzOYAQ

It is a shame to see many and many players leaving pvp due to awfull changes/decisions that makes no sense whatsoever.

Tcholl · July 20

You can check his final conclusion about the ward at 1:36:43

Zabagad · July 20

MEBengalsFan2001 wrote: »

It’s also that the buff crystal frag can be used off any skill instantly and it gets a significant buff in damage. It proc way to often and allows for Sorc to help burst down its target. The biggest issue I have with that skill is it can proc off itself. I have gotten it to go 7x in a row. Crystal frag imo should only proc off Sorc skills and never proc from itself. That would fix that problem.

@Jsmalls @Turtle_Bot
Can one of you two acknowledge that this is possible?

After Static wrote that 2 weeks ago, I thought that his "back to back proc" has a different meaning then I understand "back to back" from sports, but after MEBengalsFan2001 now claims to get 7 in a row I'm confused.

I never ever had a procced frag which procced another frag.
Three options:
1) It's not possible and static+MEB say something wrong
2) I'm the unluckiest Sorc in Eso
3) I'm doing something wrong

Can one of you help me pls?

Bushido2513 · July 20

Tcholl wrote: »

A content creator called Feng Rush posted an U43 in his youtube channel and expressed the same opion as most of players right now regarding the hardened ward. The current state of this skills is absurd for pvp and make no sense for pve. He plays sorc, or at least used to, as stated by him on the video.

He is sick, as everyone else, for ZOS not addressing issues such as the ward change. He also referenced this same thread and others in the forum.

Every day we have more players stating the obvious about the current state of the Hardened Ward and also about the current state of sorcs and nbs in general.

You can check the video on the link below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTYTSzzOYAQ

It is a shame to see many and many players leaving pvp due to awfull changes/decisions that makes no sense whatsoever.

That was an amazing representation of someone just being straight up frustrated and fed up with the direction of the game. It's one thing to read it and another to hear and see someone talk about how it bothers them. Interesting post

Bushido2513 · July 20

I will say that hardened ward has never really made me feel one way or another about the game when I'm fighting someone using it. Proc sets sometimes just seem to be garbage because they can hit when another effect happens that you can't break from longer than usual and well that's that. But I had a match a bit ago that was a warden heal fest and I was like you know what, all these wardens could be hardened ward users and I'd be happier because maybe one group or another could focus someone and they'd die. With heals it's just play until you get bored or your hands hurt.

Still agree that ward upper limit could be looked at but just a little perspective to say that ward is at least somewhat more resolvable then the other issues which is maybe why I look at it with a little less ire then some.

ZOS_Icy · July 20

Greetings, as we've removed a few non-constructive comments around baiting, please remember that while it’s all right to disagree or even debate with each other, provoking conflict, baiting, inciting, mocking, etc. is never acceptable in the official The Elder Scrolls Online community.

Thank you for your understanding.

Joy_Division · July 21

Bushido2513 wrote: »

Tcholl wrote: »

A content creator called Feng Rush posted an U43 in his youtube channel and expressed the same opion as most of players right now regarding the hardened ward. The current state of this skills is absurd for pvp and make no sense for pve. He plays sorc, or at least used to, as stated by him on the video.

He is sick, as everyone else, for ZOS not addressing issues such as the ward change. He also referenced this same thread and others in the forum.

Every day we have more players stating the obvious about the current state of the Hardened Ward and also about the current state of sorcs and nbs in general.

You can check the video on the link below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTYTSzzOYAQ

It is a shame to see many and many players leaving pvp due to awfull changes/decisions that makes no sense whatsoever.

That was an amazing representation of someone just being straight up frustrated and fed up with the direction of the game. It's one thing to read it and another to hear and see someone talk about how it bothers them. Interesting post

You should have heard the streams in 2015

StaticWave · July 21

Fengrush mains Sorc and is a pretty objective player when it comes to PvP balance. I would take his opinion into consideration if I were ZOS devs.

Hardened Ward change being problematic was warned on 1st week of U40 PTS update by several players like myself. It's a shame that 5 months have passed and nothing is done to fix this issue.