Disabling crown gifting is a bad idea

SilverBride

The fact that they have been working on this for awhile now is why they needed to just pause it completely so they can focus on it without any outside distractions.

This isn't ideal for anyone, especially ZoS who will be losing revenue from this. Revenue that helps them continue to maintain and develop this game.

Players caused this mess and it's not an easy fix, so blame them.

FireBreathingNord

IrisDupree wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

wilykcat wrote: »

Sometimes investigations and temporarily disabling stuff does take longer. Not everything in life happens quickly and instantly.

Just wanted to build on this point. We are working on building solutions that protect everyone when gifting crown store items. Investigating solutions and building those out does take time. We understand this is not deal. It isn't ideal for anyone not engaging in fraudulent behavior. It isn't ideal for us. However, we want to stress this is temporary as we are working out the best path forward. We don't know how long this will take, but we are working to resolve this as soon as we can.

I know being the bearer of news like this likely sucks. But, with respect, you all have been working on the crown crates for over 6 months now and now adding another layer of not gifting is not giving us any hope that its going to be fixed. This fix not only affects people like me who cannot afford crowns but also your own streamers and large guilds that gift prizes to members.

We as your players deserve a timeline or an honest we are not bringing it back ever. So we can make informed choices on whether its time to move on from this game or stick around.

You're right - an indefinite ban with no timeline erodes trust. Blanket bans hurt engaged players far more than bad actors.

Points that make banning crown gifting bad:

• It hurts legitimate players more than fraudsters, who find loopholes. Blanket bans are a broad hammer.
• Active crown gifting drives engagement through giveaways, contests, rewards. Removing it negates this.
• Player economy and gift culture is healthy for long-term game sustainability. Bans undermine this.
• Fraud will never be fully eliminated. The goal should be balancing integrity with freedom. Bans go too far.
• Compromises exist like gift limits, vetting processes, temporary bans during investigations on individual accounts.
• Alienating loyal spenders who gift crowns may lose their business in the long run, reducing revenue. Short-sighted.
• Loyal Players who have invested expecting to be able to gift. Rug being pulled out loses
• goodwill.
• Signals lack of care for legitimate community activity and creativity. Erodes trust in developer-player relationship.

Four_Fingers

Reverb wrote: »

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Well there goes my only way of being able to obtain future DLCs.....

I’m pretty sure that’s the intent. Instead of being able to get the DLCs from someone in exchange for gold, you’ll have to either sub or buy your own crowns. That’s a win for zeni

ZOS still got their money the seller had to buy crowns and purchase the DLC.

BardokRedSnow

Reverb wrote: »

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Well there goes my only way of being able to obtain future DLCs.....

I’m pretty sure that’s the intent. Instead of being able to get the DLCs from someone in exchange for gold, you’ll have to either sub or buy your own crowns. That’s a win for zeni

Not when they lose a third of the player base or more for this. Its comical how bad the mismanagement is, but I think this was the final nail in the coffin for me. Whether it is for others, idc so no for anyone reading I'm not advocating anyone quit or whatever.

But really, even if you do buy crowns and dlc with real money, crates, etc. What is there really to buy anymore with in game gold. Mats for potions and food... unless you farm those yourselves by grabbing mats in craglorn or doing writs for an hour or two daily.

Furniture for decorating.

Thats it.

Getting stuff from the crownstore, even if not crates, for me personally was the only thing keeping me logging in anymore and the only reason I renewed my sub.

Alchimiste1

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

wilykcat wrote: »

Sometimes investigations and temporarily disabling stuff does take longer. Not everything in life happens quickly and instantly.

Just wanted to build on this point. We are working on building solutions that protect everyone when gifting crown store items. Investigating solutions and building those out does take time. We understand this is not deal. It isn't ideal for anyone not engaging in fraudulent behavior. It isn't ideal for us. However, we want to stress this is temporary as we are working out the best path forward. We don't know how long this will take, but we are working to resolve this as soon as we can.

I'm happy to hear that. If time has proven anything it's that you guys have good work ethic and are committed to solving issues in the shortest time and giving players the best possible experience.

Speaking of, what's the current status of that code rewrite again?

React

Glad to see so much focus being spent on protecting profits from the cosmetic store.

How is that now 9-month-overdue code rewrite going?

Casul

Another thought, how will this prevent people from selling gold for currency cards to then buy crowns with those? You didn’t fix the issue, you just made it more dangerous for players trying to do legitimate gold for crowns exchanges?

shadyjane62

Thank You, ZOS.

Marronsuisse

I wonder if they could implement something like, only players in good standing can gift Crown Store items - your account has to be x months old, with regular non-suspicious activity. Or after x months you can apply to have your account verified in some way by customer service before gifting is enabled for you.

It would be unfortunate for new players, but it seems better than removing the gifting option from the game entirely.

GeneralEU

It's probably high time to make a LEGAL "Crown Store Exchange" system. This will reduce scams by 90%!
So someone will show their e.g. 4k crowns for the sale of e.g. 1 crown 2,000 gold, and the buyer can buy anything up to this amount. The seller's crowns will then be deducted from his account and the gold will be sent to his in-game mail.

RicAlmighty

………..

Overamera

This is outrageous!

zaria

Four_Fingers wrote: »

So it was illegal to buy crowns for gold after all?
They have been so unclear about this always speaking in mysterious fraud terms.
No wonder people are confused, they thought it was OK because it has been condoned by some members of ZOS.
So no longer can buy alliance change tokens for gold, etc.

I assume they was bored by all the support request because people got scammed.

One very simple solution, You can buy an 1000 crown coffer in the crown store for 1000 crown or 1100 if they want to be evil.
This box is an in-game item like an potion who can be sold in guild stores, traded pr gifted. Then used the account get 1000 crowns. Problem solved and this is an much safer and easier to access method.

Have used the crown black marked discord but this is some effort setting up an trade, you have to wait hours for it to gone true and has to be online to trade.
Unlike gifting this could not violate the loot box ban as you simply got more crowns.

Aka_

React wrote: »

Glad to see so much focus being spent on protecting profits from the cosmetic store.

How is that now 9-month-overdue code rewrite going?

Im not sure what you mean considering their last "temporary" solution has disabled a major part of the store for over half a year. The whole game is messed up no matter where you look. We just get to spread the headaches from PvP to PvE to everywhere beyond and in-between now.

zaria

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Naftal wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Zezin wrote: »

PrincessOfThieves wrote: »

Yeah. For me personally, being able to earn stuff in game is very important, and I spend a lot of time farming stuff I can sell (dungeon masks, writs and the like).
Without the ability to buy crown gifts, there will be no cosmetic goals to work towards and I will have significantly less motivation to play. The amount of cosmetics you can earn ingame is very limited, and some of them require insane feats such as trial trifectas.

Same with me, gridind for gold felt good because of the recompense of getting stuff from the crown store, now what's the point? The majority of my time playing was making gold, what am I supposed to do now? Just hoard a pile of useless fake currency?

You mean, play a video game...

Honestly, any outrage over this against ZOS is misplaced. Fraud is not good, and frankly, it is in ZOS' best interest to make sure their game doesn't allow for it.

They disabled the biggest gold sink in the game. I don't think you are thinking this through.

Technically speaking, it wasn't really a gold sink. Gold sinks are when the player buys something and that gold disappears from the market - Gold was never disappearing from the market in Crown Gifts, just exchanging hands between players.

Its an indirect gold sink as gold goes from very wealthy players to housing or golding out gear.
Without this expect inflation to go up

KS_Amt38

The Inflation is gonna be huge...

code65536

I've been seeing a lot of ads in zone chat for a gold-selling service. Before this, I haven't seen gold sellers advertise in-game for years, but in recent months, I've seen those ads every single day. I wonder if this is related?

Imagine a criminal organization that steals credit cards and needs a way to launder the money from them. That usually means buying stuff with the stolen cards and then selling that stuff to get clean money. Physical goods are difficult, though, since they can be physically traced, so digital goods seem like an ideal avenue. Buy crowns with stolen cards, sell those crowns in-game for gold, and then sell the gold for real money. Maybe this is the reason behind the rise in gold-seller spam in chat?

If this is indeed the kind of fraudulent behavior that ZOS is concerned about, then a requirement that people be friends or guildmates for, say, two weeks, would prevent that kind of abuse, while preserving their intended use case of gifting between friends.

zaria

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

wilykcat wrote: »

Sometimes investigations and temporarily disabling stuff does take longer. Not everything in life happens quickly and instantly.

Just wanted to build on this point. We are working on building solutions that protect everyone when gifting crown store items. Investigating solutions and building those out does take time. We understand this is not deal. It isn't ideal for anyone not engaging in fraudulent behavior. It isn't ideal for us. However, we want to stress this is temporary as we are working out the best path forward. We don't know how long this will take, but we are working to resolve this as soon as we can.

How about my idea about the 1000 crown coffer who can be traded or gifted.
Should be easy to implement, only issue is an inventory item generate crowns then used.

Aorys

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

wilykcat wrote: »

Sometimes investigations and temporarily disabling stuff does take longer. Not everything in life happens quickly and instantly.

Just wanted to build on this point. We are working on building solutions that protect everyone when gifting crown store items. Investigating solutions and building those out does take time. We understand this is not deal. It isn't ideal for anyone not engaging in fraudulent behavior. It isn't ideal for us. However, we want to stress this is temporary as we are working out the best path forward. We don't know how long this will take, but we are working to resolve this as soon as we can.

Please keep in mind that people quitting the game today will not be back since they gonna be engaged in other games being released now. That's all because ZOS team had 6 months to investigate the case.

Ezhh

Reverb wrote: »

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Well there goes my only way of being able to obtain future DLCs.....

I’m pretty sure that’s the intent. Instead of being able to get the DLCs from someone in exchange for gold, you’ll have to either sub or buy your own crowns. That’s a win for zeni

Is it really?

Before they were getting paid even though it was from a source other than the person receiving the dlc. Now what might happen is that people who relied on buying dlcs with gold will just drift off from the game. This in turn makes it harder for people who want to turn their crowns into gold and they may then also drift away.

The ability to turn crowns into gold is one of the reasons people buy crowns.

jommerryrth

well this is gonna *** people off to all sorts of forum drama

Lags

wilykcat wrote: »

They paused it which means it's temporary.

and how long ago did they pause crate gifting? only on PC and then on console, when many people knew it was more than pc, and that it was more than just crates that this was happening with. They are always late or slow with everything. If they had done this back when they stopped crate gifting maybe a solution would be closer. But knowing the speed of zos to handle anything, ill guess 2 years.

FantasticFreddie

Naftal wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Zezin wrote: »

PrincessOfThieves wrote: »

Yeah. For me personally, being able to earn stuff in game is very important, and I spend a lot of time farming stuff I can sell (dungeon masks, writs and the like).
Without the ability to buy crown gifts, there will be no cosmetic goals to work towards and I will have significantly less motivation to play. The amount of cosmetics you can earn ingame is very limited, and some of them require insane feats such as trial trifectas.

Same with me, gridind for gold felt good because of the recompense of getting stuff from the crown store, now what's the point? The majority of my time playing was making gold, what am I supposed to do now? Just hoard a pile of useless fake currency?

You mean, play a video game...

Honestly, any outrage over this against ZOS is misplaced. Fraud is not good, and frankly, it is in ZOS' best interest to make sure their game doesn't allow for it.

They disabled the biggest gold sink in the game. I don't think you are thinking this through.

It's not a gold sink, it just moves gold from one player to another.

code65536

Ezhh wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Well there goes my only way of being able to obtain future DLCs.....

I’m pretty sure that’s the intent. Instead of being able to get the DLCs from someone in exchange for gold, you’ll have to either sub or buy your own crowns. That’s a win for zeni

Is it really?

Before they were getting paid even though it was from a source other than the person receiving the dlc. Now what might happen is that people who relied on buying dlcs with gold will just drift off from the game. This in turn makes it harder for people who want to turn their crowns into gold and they may then also drift away.

The ability to turn crowns into gold is one of the reasons people buy crowns.

But if those crowns were acquired fraudulently, e.g., with stolen cards, then ZOS is the one who gets shafted.

jommerryrth

Lags wrote: »

wilykcat wrote: »

They paused it which means it's temporary.

and how long ago did they pause crate gifting? only on PC and then on console, when many people knew it was more than pc, and that it was more than just crates that this was happening with. They are always late or slow with everything. If they had done this back when they stopped crate gifting maybe a solution would be closer. But knowing the speed of zos to handle anything, ill guess 2 years.

they dont have two years. in two months the game is done without crown store gifting. the bottom just fell out.

Trundik

Idea is *** terrible. I can't pay real money for crown store decorative items. Because i don't have free money at all. But there is limited buyable items, which will appear in store next time in one year. [snip] Its not fun at all.

[snip]
[edited for bashing]

Four_Fingers

code65536 wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Well there goes my only way of being able to obtain future DLCs.....

I’m pretty sure that’s the intent. Instead of being able to get the DLCs from someone in exchange for gold, you’ll have to either sub or buy your own crowns. That’s a win for zeni

Is it really?

Before they were getting paid even though it was from a source other than the person receiving the dlc. Now what might happen is that people who relied on buying dlcs with gold will just drift off from the game. This in turn makes it harder for people who want to turn their crowns into gold and they may then also drift away.

The ability to turn crowns into gold is one of the reasons people buy crowns.

But if those crowns were acquired fraudulently, e.g., with stolen cards, then ZOS is the one who gets shafted.

An account with a bad credit card transaction should be suspended immediately.
And get a better credit card authorization service.

Tyrant_Tim

I was waiting for this year’s mass exodus of veteran players after last year’s Update 35, like clockwork, here we are.

This is yet another negative change that directly impacts players that have invested countless hours into the game.

BHoth_

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

wilykcat wrote: »

Sometimes investigations and temporarily disabling stuff does take longer. Not everything in life happens quickly and instantly.

Just wanted to build on this point. We are working on building solutions that protect everyone when gifting crown store items. Investigating solutions and building those out does take time. We understand this is not deal. It isn't ideal for anyone not engaging in fraudulent behavior. It isn't ideal for us. However, we want to stress this is temporary as we are working out the best path forward. We don't know how long this will take, but we are working to resolve this as soon as we can.

This is meaningless until you can provide a timeline for a solution.
Why disable such a meaningful part of player interactions before having a more comprehensive solution/statement/timeline in hand?

Twohothardware

They need to state their policy on whether friends and guild mates will be allowed to exchange gold for gifted items from the crown store. They added a line to the crown crate form you filled out to gift crates through customer service which stated exchanging gold was not allowed.