Booted from server then says account permanently banned!

SerafinaWaterstar

JoeCapricorn wrote: »

vsrs_au wrote: »

I find the biggest problem with this situation is that endeavours can be earnt without the player even being aware of it ***, and still the responses to the un-banned players from ZOS seem to imply that it's the players responsibility to know about the problem.


*** because they can easily miss the notification on getting some endeavour seals, if their attention is focused on some other activity.

Yeah, this happens all the time. Sometimes I see the notification, other times it's just "Daily 3/3 Endeavors Complete!" and if I go look at Endeavors, and the UI is telling me that I did not complete them, I believe it.

If the UI was telling those players they did not complete endeavors when they actually did... don't ban those that got maybe 15 or 30 extra endeavors, or saw that it was a bug and reported it in good faith. Ban the ones that raked up 10,000 seals of endeavor.

This was my situation. Went by what the UI told me, as I always do, as don’t keep checking actual seal numbers & don’t always see pop up saying done etc. When showed incomplete just went & did whatever to complete & then ignored them and went and played as normal.

Was even one of those who put on a ticket & posted in forum thread. The thread where it was acknowledged as a bug and people were asked to try again & see if it was working properly.

So whilst I am grateful for my account being unbanned, I still think that it should not have been in the first place - how are we supposed to know a bug from an exploit?

Quackery

If it's about the Rawl'kha exploit, then there is an easy fix: remove the endeavor seals that were accumulated to the accounts in question due to the bug. Volendrung doesn't need to destroy the accounts of so many because of this bug.

Grimbauld

ZOS_Volpe wrote: »

Greetings all,

After removing a few bashing and off-topic posts, we would like to ask everyone to keep posts on the subject at hand, as well as keeping things civil and constructive. If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them .... here.

Thank you for your understanding.

Well, the censorship has struck!

FeedbackOnly

Lydawobbles wrote: »

It sounds like some of the frozen accounts have already been unbanned so it's not taking them weeks...

but THEYRE the ones that said several days to several weeks. That made a lot of people panic.

It usually takes 14 days

Surak73 wrote: »

So I received the mail saying that my account has been reinstated "because we determined that you did not do this egregiously or an excessive number of times. In the future, please make your best effort to avoid using exploits and report them to us".

All good, except that I was the first to exactlyy
pinpoint the issue, https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/7917108#Comment_7917108, allowing them to fix the bug in a couple of days... And for that I have lost one day of Eso+. Nice...

It's also a point against your account too.

FeedbackOnly

stargazer69 wrote: »

Wil this (wholly unjustified) ban go on our record?

Yep

It will be interesting to see how many people want to report bugs after this issue.

Grimbauld

Do I have to reckon with the fact that if I renew my account now that I can be banned arbitrarily and out of the blue?
Or maybe I'll get banned for making that defeatist comment?

Elsonso

Quackery wrote: »

If it's about the Rawl'kha exploit, then there is an easy fix: remove the endeavor seals that were accumulated to the accounts in question due to the bug. Volendrung doesn't need to destroy the accounts of so many because of this bug.

That might be what was happening to some or all of the "unbanned" accounts. The accounts were locked ("temporarily suspended") and that is an excellent opportunity to clean house. The number of Seals is frozen , the player will not be logged into the account while they are editing it, and the player cannot spend the Seals before they get a chance to remove them.

I have not heard whether anyone noticed the Seals were removed, but with so many different threads in so many different venues, I am not reading everything on the subject.

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

It will be interesting to see how many people want to report bugs after this issue.

Did you notice in the email that they requested the ticket number if you reported the bug? Makes me wonder. I can't think of any reason for them to ask for it, as it is already in their system, unless it can have some bearing on the outcome of the investigation.

tincanman

stargazer69 wrote: »

React wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

vsrs_au wrote: »

I'm just disappointinted that after Gina's apology re: lack of communication on the queue problem, they repeated it for this problem. An update or two, just to reassure the affected players, would have been nice.

Gina posted a comment explaining what was happening within about 30 minutes of the first report on the forums.

Explaining that the bans were intentional and justified.

And the resolution email reads like it's still my fault for getting more SOEs than shoudl be possible due to a bug in their code, and also not noticing that routine activities (like killing things or picking flowers) were triigering the bug.

A "Sorry for the inconvernience caused by our bad coding, knee-jerk banning and lack of communication" would have been better.

Please make sure you push back against this with support - tell them if you already reported the bug and that you won't accept their resolution nor any marks against your account. And ask for some sort of compensation for what is clearly THEIR error. The point here is to have your COMPLAINT logged and to ensure your account hasn't been marked as in any way bad and register your dissastisfaction with the process and outcome. And the forum really isn't the place to do any of that, apparently.

I really can't believe the (lack of) support response at all here.

agelonestar

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Just to update everyone on this issue, we are close to completing our investigation and have started unbanning the majority of affected players; only those that we found have exploited maliciously or an excessive number of times will remain banned. Please remember if you come across a game exploit, make your best effort to avoid it and report it to us as soon as possible. Thanks for everyone's patience while we investigated this issue and you can expect an email from our Support Team soon with an update on your account, if you haven't already.

I have to be honest, it's a little worrying that you guys are banning first, investigating second. Surely there's a better way? I'm guessing you don't compensate people for having been falsely accused and banned.

Paulytnz

What I would like to know is if they investigated ALL the banned accounts or only those who disputed the ban. Because if they ignored the ones who didn't dispute it, this could be why they do it this way.

Less work right, if the guilty ones don't bother disputing because they know they cheated - so we don't have to investigate them.

Either way, not the best way to go if you ask me. I remember years ago a similar thing happened in GW2. You know what they did? No bans, just removed the extra currency or whatever it was. Because they knew the problem was at their end, not the players.

This is how the creators of an AAA game treat their customers.

Varana

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Just to update everyone on this issue, we are close to completing our investigation and have started unbanning the majority of affected players; only those that we found have exploited maliciously or an excessive number of times will remain banned. Please remember if you come across a game exploit, make your best effort to avoid it and report it to us as soon as possible. Thanks for everyone's patience while we investigated this issue and you can expect an email from our Support Team soon with an update on your account, if you haven't already.

And still, people who have reported this bug, i.e. have followed your very words here, have been temporarily banned. I that is how you handle bug reports, I definitely won't report any bugs at all.

SerafinaWaterstar

Um, what is this about it being a black mark on my account?

Is this really a thing?!

If found not guilty, then there should be no ‘black mark’.

Can you clarify please @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin

Ingenon

Varana wrote: »

And still, people who have reported this bug, i.e. have followed your very words here, have been temporarily banned. I that is how you handle bug reports, I definitely won't report any bugs at all.

Where I live, we have a slogan "If you see something, say something". It means to report suspicious activity.

Since ZOS temporarily banned the people who reported this exploit, I'm NOT going to say anything when I see something that looks suspicious in ESO. Once burned, twice shy.

Tandor

It seems to me that when you ban someone and then unban them a few days or even weeks later, some token recompense wouldn't go amiss by way of apology for all the worry and frustration that must cause an honest and loyal player, not to mention the lost playtime. An extension to the ESO+ for lost time along with a few crowns would be a good PR gesture as well as going some way to easing the bad taste in the mouth resulting from being treated in this way.

React

You know, I thought that essentially abandoning the code rewrite was about as bad as things could get in terms of zenimax not caring at all about their game or playerbase.

But not even apologizing after a massive ban wave of innocent players, whom the overwhelming majority of weren't even aware they had benefitted from this "exploit"?

They never fail to sink to new lows. I don't get how anybody can defend this company when they blatantly do not care about the community.

Yellow_Monolith

This whole thing is unsettling. Banning players for a bug they had no power over and many people were unaware it even existed. Literally anyone that travelled to Reapers March to farm sets, do writs, use a bank, outlaw refuge, use a guild trader, organise a pve dungeon/trial, do a treasure map, do a dolmen, dig up an antiquity, do zone quests, skyshards, fishing, visit a player home, do a companion quest is effected. If this bug was so bad and so many people were effected, then why wasn't the server taken offline at the first sign of the problem? and why was it not communicated by community managers or in game notifications that there was a problem in Reapers March? Also for every person that got unbanned, there's still many many people banned. Most people don't even know these forums exist and are being left in the dark and many people that reported this bug on forums are still banned with no email update.I won't be investing any more money in this game as there's no respect for players.

Elsonso

Yellow_Monolith wrote: »

If this bug was so bad and so many people were effected, then why wasn't the server taken offline at the first sign of the problem?

Hmm. It would probably still be offline, then. They apparently don't have a fix, yet.

Troodon80

Elsonso wrote: »

Did you notice in the email that they requested the ticket number if you reported the bug? Makes me wonder. I can't think of any reason for them to ask for it, as it is already in their system, unless it can have some bearing on the outcome of the investigation.

They've always done this. Read the mail I posted from three years ago on the previous page. It's the same thing. They're covering their backsides. They first and foremost call you out as a cheater/exploiter with little to no investigation, bringing down the ban hammer on your account immediately, then go on to say that if it's a mistake then you'll get your account back, and finally say that if you reported the issue then provide the ticket number so they can confirm your "valuable assistance in nailing down the issue."

As much as I wish they would change the accusatory and condemning language they use, I doubt they ever will.

SDKTJ

This situation has made many unhappy, me included

SimonThesis

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Just to update everyone on this issue, we are close to completing our investigation and have started unbanning the majority of affected players; only those that we found have exploited maliciously or an excessive number of times will remain banned. Please remember if you come across a game exploit, make your best effort to avoid it and report it to us as soon as possible. Thanks for everyone's patience while we investigated this issue and you can expect an email from our Support Team soon with an update on your account, if you haven't already.

Read the room...

Mass banning your paying customers during an event and then unbanning most of them is a serious misstep, and then to make matters worse you go on to blame the players.

Baldur's Gate 3 is looking better and better.

Panthermic

Ingenon wrote: »

Varana wrote: »

And still, people who have reported this bug, i.e. have followed your very words here, have been temporarily banned. I that is how you handle bug reports, I definitely won't report any bugs at all.

Where I live, we have a slogan "If you see something, say something". It means to report suspicious activity.

Since ZOS temporarily banned the people who reported this exploit, I'm NOT going to say anything when I see something that looks suspicious in ESO. Once burned, twice shy.

There is a saying where I live "Tell the truth, and your head will break."

zaria

SimonThesis wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Just to update everyone on this issue, we are close to completing our investigation and have started unbanning the majority of affected players; only those that we found have exploited maliciously or an excessive number of times will remain banned. Please remember if you come across a game exploit, make your best effort to avoid it and report it to us as soon as possible. Thanks for everyone's patience while we investigated this issue and you can expect an email from our Support Team soon with an update on your account, if you haven't already.

Read the room...

Mass banning your paying customers during an event and then unbanning most of them is a serious misstep, and then to make matters worse you go on to blame the players.

Baldur's Gate 3 is looking better and better.

Yes, now as I assume the bug causing the exploit was already fixed it was no reason to mass ban people.
I would recommend firing the one initiating the ban or put them in an position there they can not do an mistake of this magnitude again.

sarahthes

zaria wrote: »

SimonThesis wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Just to update everyone on this issue, we are close to completing our investigation and have started unbanning the majority of affected players; only those that we found have exploited maliciously or an excessive number of times will remain banned. Please remember if you come across a game exploit, make your best effort to avoid it and report it to us as soon as possible. Thanks for everyone's patience while we investigated this issue and you can expect an email from our Support Team soon with an update on your account, if you haven't already.

Read the room...

Mass banning your paying customers during an event and then unbanning most of them is a serious misstep, and then to make matters worse you go on to blame the players.

Baldur's Gate 3 is looking better and better.

Yes, now as I assume the bug causing the exploit was already fixed it was no reason to mass ban people.
I would recommend firing the one initiating the ban or put them in an position there they can not do an mistake of this magnitude again.

They have stated the bug is not fixed. However they also stated that it's pretty hard to trigger accidentally and only people who obviously do so intentionally will be flagged from now on.

kringled_1

sarahthes wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

SimonThesis wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Just to update everyone on this issue, we are close to completing our investigation and have started unbanning the majority of affected players; only those that we found have exploited maliciously or an excessive number of times will remain banned. Please remember if you come across a game exploit, make your best effort to avoid it and report it to us as soon as possible. Thanks for everyone's patience while we investigated this issue and you can expect an email from our Support Team soon with an update on your account, if you haven't already.

Read the room...

Mass banning your paying customers during an event and then unbanning most of them is a serious misstep, and then to make matters worse you go on to blame the players.

Baldur's Gate 3 is looking better and better.

Yes, now as I assume the bug causing the exploit was already fixed it was no reason to mass ban people.
I would recommend firing the one initiating the ban or put them in an position there they can not do an mistake of this magnitude again.

They have stated the bug is not fixed. However they also stated that it's pretty hard to trigger accidentally and only people who obviously do so intentionally will be flagged from now on.

I think it's clear that the situation that made it very very easy to trigger this (on PS-EU, in Reaper's March, around 2-3 days in mid-late July) is gone. It may only be difficult to trigger now. But during that period (where the dailies included things like "harvest x resources from the world", "Complete x quests", "sell x items to a npc vendor", it appears to have been incredibly easy to trigger just by playing normally in that zone. And they've treated and talked to people in that group much as they would someone who has triggered a reset deliberately.

Wuduwasa13

Apologise & compensate those wrongly banned.

Elvenheart

React wrote: »

You know, I thought that essentially abandoning the code rewrite was about as bad as things could get….

Abandoning the code rewrite?

TechMaybeHic

Elvenheart wrote: »

React wrote: »

You know, I thought that essentially abandoning the code rewrite was about as bad as things could get….

Abandoning the code rewrite?

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/637691/server-multithreading-update-july-2023/p1

TaSheen

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Elvenheart wrote: »

React wrote: »

You know, I thought that essentially abandoning the code rewrite was about as bad as things could get….

Abandoning the code rewrite?

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/637691/server-multithreading-update-july-2023/p1

Yeah. Y'know.... trying to "retrofit" using a code rewrite to clean up this antique engine.... is not a "fix" at all. Because - a code rewrite for this seriously outdated engine isn't going to be fast. And it isn't going to be clean. And.... it's really rather unlikely that if they accomplish the stated goals (um - WERE there any??) of said code rewrite, that any of us would be here years in the future to actually use said code rewrite to see the game as being infinitely better.

If they really thought they could accomplish this.... well, I think they've had to admit it's not actually possible.

Alinhbo_Tyaka

Elsonso wrote: »

Quackery wrote: »

If it's about the Rawl'kha exploit, then there is an easy fix: remove the endeavor seals that were accumulated to the accounts in question due to the bug. Volendrung doesn't need to destroy the accounts of so many because of this bug.

That might be what was happening to some or all of the "unbanned" accounts. The accounts were locked ("temporarily suspended") and that is an excellent opportunity to clean house. The number of Seals is frozen , the player will not be logged into the account while they are editing it, and the player cannot spend the Seals before they get a chance to remove them.

I have not heard whether anyone noticed the Seals were removed, but with so many different threads in so many different venues, I am not reading everything on the subject.

- snip -

I can understand needing to lock accounts to make corrections to database information for players but if that was the case ZOS should say the accounts were locked to correct for an exploit. They should not be telling them they are banned unless they truly were permanently banning them. This all gets back to ZOS needing to provide accurate information something you would think would have been learned after all of these years. It certainly would improve the company's image in the gaming sphere.

BahometZ

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