Official Discussion Thread, "Unveiling The New Arcanist Class"

Patro

@ZOS_Kevin when Arcanist skill lines will be released?

CoolBlast3

Stinkyremy wrote: »

CoolBlast3 wrote: »

Stinkyremy wrote: »

CoolBlast3 wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Khenarthi wrote: »

Will we get more character slots? You know, for those of us already attached to 18 characters?

Yes! We are getting two new slots taking the total to 20!

Are there any thoughts on class changes?
We need a way of changing class, even if only once per toon!
After years of having a main, I've done every quest in the game, i've all my skill lines leveled, i've so much grind put in. I want to play with the new class (it looks AMAZING) but I won't actively be able to without class changing

I want to keep playing the story with my character who i'm attached too...but that'll lock me out of enjoying a new feature.

ZOS, you can do this in a way where you still control the grind-skip Crown Store items.
Make the tokens limited so people can't change at will. Sell them only when a new class or massive balance change drops. Do it only once, I don't know, but please, we need this! Please think about it at least!

That is a nothing issue, just change to a different toon.
Yeah sure if you only wanted to do the PVE story once but wanted to play as X class and your main is Y class, it is a bit annoying but the PVE is so easy it doesn't even matter what class you play as as everything dies by spamming one skill.

With the universal achievements tied to every account now, it is so easy to just switch a different toon and still make overall progress in grindy content.

It isn't a nothing issue. It's hundreds of hours of being connected to a character thrown away just to be able to do content we paid for lol. I get not everyone does the "roleplaying" part of the massively multiplayer roleplaying game, but it's still a valuable aspect of it.

Roleplaying is cool, but quite simply what are you missing out on by just changing characters?
You can swap the gear from your main to alt via the back, back and forth, or create and earn gear for the alt instead.
The alt can get every skill the main can get except the 3 unique class skill lines.
The alt can do every quest the main can do.
And now with universal achievements, minus a few unique achievements, the alts progress (in most achievements) is shared with the main.

There is little in the way of restriction other than the one you are making for yourself.

I am not against class change, and even myself I pretty much always play with my main, but if I really wanted to change to a different character, there is nothing stopping me.

I miss the hundreds of hours of quest content which built up on my character's arc. Sure, I could just start fresh and start in the new dlc, but that'd make me miss encounters with recurring characters like Naryu or Ashur. I can see why you don't think it's necessary, but it's just a QoL thing ZOS could control at their own pace

ZOS_Kevin

Thanks for the feedback, @Maitsukas. We're sharing with our teams now to address.

Seraphayel

Patro wrote: »

@ZOS_Kevin when Arcanist skill lines will be released?

Based on the Necromancer back in 2019, shortly before PTS starts in March.

Remember, there’s a dungeon DLC coming first which needs proper testing, meaning the test realm is blocked until that DLC has been released.

karthrag_inak

Looks delightful, all around, except for the new slots. Is this really only 2 new slots? Not 3? That makes this one's tail flutter. Khajiit has 3 of every profession - stam/mag dps and tank. You are going to drive this one to distraction forcing only 2 for new class.

danno8

What was the "tentpole" feature?

Was it the combo system? I think it would be cool if a combo system was applied across all classes in the game to make class skills overall more desirable than weapon/guild line skills. As long as it isn't overly complicated.

Araneae6537

Class change would be cool, if it were possible, as arcanist looks fun and like it would be a better fit for my Telvanni than magsorc. I’ll just have to make another Telvanni… but then who gets the mushroom tower? I hope there will be some nice editions to housing this year!

NotaDaedraWorshipper

Is this the feature you were working hard on to implement that so many wanted?

A new class, which many did not want at all, and on top of that it's the most specifically themed and niche class we have ever got.

Why would you make a class that is strictly themed to a single prince?

There's no roleplay there, except deciding what flavour of Hermaeus Mora worshipping/deals or whatever your character has done. Then you go dare name then Arcanist. More like Mora-ist.

ZOS_Kevin

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

I don't think the new class is the feature. Near the end, they mentioned a new infinite dungeon system to be released in an update after the Necrom chapter.

Going to push back on this a bit. The amount of work and balancing that it takes to make a new class, it is absolutely a new feature that changes the dynamic of multiple aspects of the game.

The infinite dungeon is also a new feature that we're excited to get to later this year, but we should not discount a new class. It's a ton of work to get as feature like a new class online, and the team is excited to be able to fulfill this request.

ZOS_Kevin

Patro wrote: »

@ZOS_Kevin when Arcanist skill lines will be released?

We'll have more info over the coming weeks as we continue content rollout. So keep an eye out for those articles.

Sealish

Finally... something I am hyped about in ESO after years of 'Meh'.

I am a huge fan of the Arcanist aesthetic and would love to play it. It is an addition that would make me pre-buy the expansion, re-subscribe, and pay an additional $20-$30 for a class change token.

Templar is fun and all, but it gets stale given that it has been my class since launch. In fact, the combat having gotten stale (the last actual thing added to 'mix it up a bit' was the Psijic skill line YEARS ago) is the main reason I left. The zone and chapter stories and such still interest me, but playing with the same skillset for a decade just got boring.

At the same time, I have put hundreds of hours into this character. I have 100% completed all the vanilla zones, about half the chapter and DLC zones, and many of the dungeons. My adventure through Tamriel is my character's adventure through Tamriel. If I come back... I want to continue that adventure, not start a new one.

I am tempted by mysterious and alien magick, I want to lay down my aetherial spear and dive into forbidden knowledge... something SO in line with the theme of this new chapter that it feels borderline immersion breaking NOT to introduce a class change token. I mean really... could you imagine someone going up to Hermaeus Mora and being all "Hey so I, an exceptionally powerful and influential mortal who has been known to change the fate of the entire world like every year or two, would like to learn your arcane secrets. I am willing to trade my holy templar magic for it." And him going "Nope, I don't want to gain influence over someone who is one of the most powerful mortals of this age and who is obviously a nexus point for fate. I don't want the knowledge of their experience with Aedric magick, and I don't want to offer them access to secrets that may bind them to my service forever."

And I'm sure I'm not alone in this.

Class change tokens are now Lore Friendly (hell, you literally got the ability to respec in Skyrim FROM Hermaeus Mora), they wouldn't hurt the game in ANY way (FOTM Chasers can easily just make one character of every class. Lvling to 50 is quick and easy if you don't care about the RP journey that the character is on and you don't use the character as your self representation in the game world), they would be exceptionally profitable for ZOS, and they would bring back players like me to the game who don't find making an alt and abandoning your avatar within the game world a reasonable solution to class fatigue in a primarily story driven game.

cmetzger93

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

I don't think the new class is the feature. Near the end, they mentioned a new infinite dungeon system to be released in an update after the Necrom chapter.

Going to push back on this a bit. The amount of work and balancing that it takes to make a new class, it is absolutely a new feature that changes the dynamic of multiple aspects of the game.

The infinite dungeon is also a new feature that we're excited to get to later this year, but we should not discount a new class. It's a ton of work to get as feature like a new class online, and the team is excited to be able to fulfill this request.

Push back on it all you want you only have to look at this forum that you moderate to see what it is people actually wanted and this wasn't it

CoolBlast3

Sealish wrote: »

Finally... something I am hyped about in ESO after years of 'Meh'.

I am a huge fan of the Arcanist aesthetic and would love to play it. It is an addition that would make me pre-buy the expansion, re-subscribe, and pay an additional $20-$30 for a class change token.

Templar is fun and all, but it gets stale given that it has been my class since launch. In fact, the combat having gotten stale (the last actual thing added to 'mix it up a bit' was the Psijic skill line YEARS ago) is the main reason I left. The zone and chapter stories and such still interest me, but playing with the same skillset for a decade just got boring.

At the same time, I have put hundreds of hours into this character. I have 100% completed all the vanilla zones, about half the chapter and DLC zones, and many of the dungeons. My adventure through Tamriel is my character's adventure through Tamriel. If I come back... I want to continue that adventure, not start a new one.

I am tempted by mysterious and alien magick, I want to lay down my aetherial spear and dive into forbidden knowledge... something SO in line with the theme of this new chapter that it feels borderline immersion breaking NOT to introduce a class change token. I mean really... could you imagine someone going up to Hermaeus Mora and being all "Hey so I, an exceptionally powerful and influential mortal who has been known to change the fate of the entire world like every year or two, would like to learn your arcane secrets. I am willing to trade my holy templar magic for it." And him going "Nope, I don't want to gain influence over someone who is one of the most powerful mortals of this age and who is obviously a nexus point for fate. I don't want the knowledge of their experience with Aedric magick, and I don't want to offer them access to secrets that may bind them to my service forever."

And I'm sure I'm not alone in this.

Class change tokens are now Lore Friendly (hell, you literally got the ability to respec in Skyrim FROM Hermaeus Mora), they wouldn't hurt the game in ANY way (FOTM Chasers can easily just make one character of every class. Lvling to 50 is quick and easy if you don't care about the RP journey that the character is on and you don't use the character as your self representation in the game world), they would be exceptionally profitable for ZOS, and they would bring back players like me to the game who don't find making an alt and abandoning your avatar within the game world a reasonable solution to class fatigue in a primarily story driven game.

Very big agree on the thoughts of a class change token, and your introspection on the "grind" of leveling a character

Maitsukas

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Thanks for the feedback, @Maitsukas. We're sharing with our teams now to address.

Works perfectly now, thank you!

NoticeMeArkay

Question:

Since the visual effects of the Arcanist class differ so greatly from already released classes, including the "newer" ones Warden and Necromancer, are there any chances on a visual overhaul for these classes?

I feel like especially Dragonknights could really use a VFX update to be able to shine next to their groupmates.

Lumenn

So dmg shields, blasts, projectiles, gates, buffs, runes, and a magic book. It SOUNDS interesting, and I'll end up trying it out(I've only got 14 characters) but what about melee? This game is SO heavy on Magicka until recently we were BEGGING for stamina morphs. I'll of course have to wait until pts to make up my mind if it's for me, but disappointed 3 times over now you passed over Monk.

Wolf_Eye

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

I don't think the new class is the feature. Near the end, they mentioned a new infinite dungeon system to be released in an update after the Necrom chapter.

Going to push back on this a bit. The amount of work and balancing that it takes to make a new class, it is absolutely a new feature that changes the dynamic of multiple aspects of the game.

The infinite dungeon is also a new feature that we're excited to get to later this year, but we should not discount a new class. It's a ton of work to get as feature like a new class online, and the team is excited to be able to fulfill this request.

I'm sorry Kevin. I didn't mean to imply the new class was not appreciated or did not require a lot of work. I think I was confused because it was hinted at prior to the stream that we would be getting a new system late in the year that many were asking for. I thought that is what was meant by the infinite dungeons.

But as you pointed out, a new class is a significant addition. So it turns out we were not getting just ONE new system as promised, but now we are getting TWO new systems. Infinite dungeons and new class.

Sorry about my words. Thinking and Words are difficult right now for me.

ZOS_Kevin

@Wolf_Eye No need to apologize. Just wanted to clarify the feature note from our perspective. And to your point, we are taking back that feedback around some players hoping for a brand new system. That will come later with the endless dungeon. More info to come later this year.

MashmalloMan

While I am excited ZOS is getting back to making combat related features like a new class, I was really hoping this year would expand upon our existing characters like you eluded to in the 2022 article. I think most of us thought it was Spell Crafting which still to this day gives me chills when I watch the 2014 preview of it. It would be the one thing that separates ESO's features from the rest (although I can see the new endless dungeon being unique in that regard).

I'll enjoy the new class for a few weeks, maybe use it as an alt, but I've been a die hard Sorc main and thats not going to change. It will be fun (or annoying at first) to fight them, but I was really hoping we could find new ways to play the characters we've had for 8+ years now.

Even if we couldn't get Spell Crafting, a new guild or weapon would of done wonders to revitalize the game for existing players to allow more build opportunities.

CoolBlast3

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

@Wolf_Eye No need to apologize. Just wanted to clarify the feature note from our perspective. And to your point, we are taking back that feedback around some players hoping for a brand new system. That will come later with the endless dungeon. More info to come later this year.

I don't want to keep pushing, as I understand you probably don't have a simple yes or no answer. But could we at least get confirmation that our feedback regarding class changing has been seen?
Appreciate all the work you do Kevin!

MashmalloMan

Lumenn wrote: »

So dmg shields, blasts, projectiles, gates, buffs, runes, and a magic book. It SOUNDS interesting, and I'll end up trying it out(I've only got 14 characters) but what about melee? This game is SO heavy on Magicka until recently we were BEGGING for stamina morphs. I'll of course have to wait until pts to make up my mind if it's for me, but disappointed 3 times over now you passed over Monk.

Yeah they showed off the spammable and it looks like another ranged spammable. While very flashy and it looks like a fun mechanic with crux, I can't help but feel that melee is always overlooked in favour of skills that can be used for more than 1 purpose by making them ranged and it almost always falls flat. Look at Warden and Necro..

To put this in perspective, lets take a look at all the new or updated spammables throughout the games life cycle:

Warden - Ranged Cliff Racer
Psijic Order - Ranged/Melee, attached to Weapon
Necro - Ranged Skulls
Fighters Guild - Ranged Silver Shards Update
DK - Ranged Stone Fist Update
Sorc - Ranged/Melee Crystal Blast to Crystal Weapon Update
Sorc - Ranged Crystal Shard Cast Time Update
Vampire - Melee Eviscerate

Of all those additions, only 1 was 100% melee. Necro's Sythe is close, but thats technically not a traditional spammable as it falls closer to the category of AOE spammable which do about 30% less damage in comparsion.

Katahdin

Awesome
Thank you

Much happier about a new class now that I know we are getting additional slots available

Carry on

.

Stamicka

The animations look very cool and the concept of the class is very cool! Just a few things to consider. First, Necromancer and Warden (especially the mag versions) have had viability issues in PvP. The new class should have a consistent stun, and the ability to reliably burst.

Warden (especially mag) had a stun on shalks when it released, but when this was taken away magden became a pretty bad class. Now in the game's current state, warden is doing ok but it still feels a bit clunky in PvP.

Necromancer (especially mag) is not very effective outside of bombing in PvP. It doesn't have very good options for stuns, and the burst is tied to blastbones. Blastbones behaves too unpredictably in PvP and when it does land, its usually not enough to fully burst people. In my opinion, it is not a very well-designed class.

Basically, don't make the same design mistakes. Both Warden and Necromancers seem to have incomplete kits. Please keep PvP in mind because the last two new classes have lacked in the PvP area. The reason the mag versions lacked more than the stam versions for both Warden and Necro was because you could rely on weapon abilities to make up for the shortcomings.

Malyore

I agree with the majority here that introducing new classes (without a bare minimum of a class change token) isn't the way to be going about new content anymore with just how long some people have developed their current characters. It seems better to introduce new skill lines instead, via weapons, guilds, covenants, or even in this case the ogma infinium. I get that by shoving everything into a class it limits the amount of skill synergy (one ability pairing with another to be extraordinary) some classes could get with a new line added. But there's ways around that that still brings uniqueness, value, and balance.

It's just disappointing that a role playing game will let you role play for years, then say "sorry you can't use these new features for that character. Gotta start all over." Means a new name, no relations to any recurring npcs, gotta grind certain skill lines again, etc.

WiseSky

Well Zos just made themselves 10 new Outfits Slots and 5 new Armor slots + one character slot

FeedbackOnly

Hope they balance warden portal vs Arcatist

Please use smart targeting for runes do buffs go on allies without it and heals to lowest health ally

Overall looks more fun then last year. Also comestics look nice in bundles.

Sealish

Malyore wrote: »

I agree with the majority here that introducing new classes (without a bare minimum of a class change token) isn't the way to be going about new content anymore with just how long some people have developed their current characters. It seems better to introduce new skill lines instead, via weapons, guilds, covenants, or even in this case the ogma infinium. I get that by shoving everything into a class it limits the amount of skill synergy (one ability pairing with another to be extraordinary) some classes could get with a new line added. But there's ways around that that still brings uniqueness, value, and balance.

It's just disappointing that a role playing game will let you role play for years, then say "sorry you can't use these new features for that character. Gotta start all over." Means a new name, no relations to any recurring npcs, gotta grind certain skill lines again, etc.

Yep... and that resetting of the world state is why even though I am unreasonably excited for the chapter theme and Arcanist class (I love Mora and the lore/aesthetic of it. I actually modded my last Skyrim playthrough to go all in on it and basically made myself a custom "Arcanist" magic set and RPd the whole thing as a follower of Mora) I am going to unfortunately give it a pass unless I can play it on my existing character.

Super cool chapter theme and new class. Sucks that it'll probably be something I miss out on as I am unwilling to throw away a decade of RP and slowly completing zones that remember that I completed them. All because ZOS for some reason doesn't want to sell a highly requested feature that would have no negative impact on the state of the game other than possibly causing server lag from the influx of old players who have been waiting for it.

Fata1moose

I wanted to see more traditional TES classes the apocrypha centered theme is oddly specific and limiting towards making a character. More things like the Necromancer, less classes like Warden (Morrowind centered) and Arcanist (Apocrypha centered) in the future please.

I'd also rather have new weapons/skill lines over classes if I'm being honest. Hopefully we can get 1H+destruction and spears at least.

shadyjane62

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

i never thought i would go past 10 characters because of all the work to set up a new one, but apocrypha themed class? yes please sign me up for at least 2 more lol

I wish I could give you 1 or 2 or 15 of the extra char slots I no longer use.

BigDanT

Every class has "arcane spells". Of course I've always been underwhelmed by the depths of ESOs class selections. Templars were stylized after paladins. Dragonknights after dragon powers of fire, earth, and poison. Nightblades were wannabe vampires and proclaimed a rogue class. Sorcs were created to be the arcane purists. Necromancer filled a gap that should have been in place on the creation of the Imperial City, but instead were placed into play with Elswyer whose class release should have been a monk/healer class. Wardens were actually an interesting class with diversity and depth stylized after druids.**** I've learned not to get hopeful on releases after 8 years of play. I will be made happy when I see an "actual" focused rogue class. An actual support class like a healer/monk. Or a class that inspires role-playing like a Bard. Life improvements like syncing instruments to the same songs or the ability to create music in game. PvP content that goes beyond penetration, crit, and impen. for best play results. An end to one mechanic for PvP and another for PvE. Don't get me wrong I've played 8 years because the team is very good at what they do. Stories, Quests, Events, Bringing personality to play. I am one of those players who loiter and listen to npc chit chat. You guys do awesome work. I also enjoy the little Easter eggs you throw in never saying anything ; ) I just would like some of our critiques to be heard openly and not be taken as insults and ignored. The players who have been here forever love the world as much as you and pay to be here.