Why do you dislike the new feature: Tales of tribute card game?

whitecrow · February 2022

I don't actually dislike the card game, i just want to be in the poll! :D

Won't know until I try it. Don't even know what it looks like yet. If we can get nice cosmetics or furnishings that will be cool.

WhiteCoatSyndrome · February 2022

I don't actually dislike the card game, i just want to be in the poll! :D

jerek95 wrote: »

And with deck shuffling, as I've said, there is no way to monetize it further. It would just be stupid.

I figured it was intended to be advertising of a sort - a cheapskate like me would only ever use the cards available for free. So with this setup if I end up in a card dual with a whale who buys all the most expensive cards, I’ll get exposed to them and use them and (presumably) want them for my own deck(s).

duagloth · February 2022

All/some of the above (please, comment which ones).

Its not a reason i play eso, i also feel devs wasted their resources and time implementing it

Zephiran23 · February 2022

I don't play/like card games.

Having played it extensively for months I would like to say...

SammyKhajit · February 2022

I don't play/like card games.

WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »

jerek95 wrote: »

And with deck shuffling, as I've said, there is no way to monetize it further. It would just be stupid.

I figured it was intended to be advertising of a sort - a cheapskate like me would only ever use the cards available for free. So with this setup if I end up in a card dual with a whale who buys all the most expensive cards, I’ll get exposed to them and use them and (presumably) want them for my own deck(s).

Or maybe the whale will get a slight edge for having the more extensive card collection. Have to see on PTS on the card game runs, but this one is afraid it’ll be another gambling thing.

Danikat · February 2022

I think this is gonna be another cash grab and pay-to-win.

jerek95 wrote: »

Danikat wrote: »

ZOS called it a 'deck building game', that usually means something like Magic the Gathering, Pokemon cards, Netrunner etc. where each player has their own deck which they can customise ahead of the game and cards are not shared between players.

Other than the initial announcement and the couple of sentences currently on the main site I've not seen any information on how exactly the game works - either while playing it or how cards will be obtained - so I don't see how we can know this deck building game will be different to all the others and both players will share 1 deck.

No, ZOS called it "resource building game" (or resource gathering, can't check right now) and clearly stated that each player will choose 2 decks that he has and then 4 decks are shuffled and cards are distributet randomly to each player.
We have in fact little information about this card game but this is almost the only thing they talked about - shuffling both players cards. If that's the only thing they talked then I guess they wanted us to hear this info specifically. Aka - they are not probably going to remove this both player deck shuffling mechanic.

And with deck shuffling, as I've said, there is no way to monetize it further. It would just be stupid.

It's right there on the announcement page:

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/updates/chapter/highisle

etchedpixels · February 2022

It doesn't feel like it should be a full main new feature.

I can buy a dozen perfectly adequate collectible digital card games for a heck of a lot less money than the new chapter.

As far as I can see so far the entire chapter contents are
- A card game I don't care about
- A trial
- A story line
- - and a pair of companions

(the dungeons are crown DLC, the second story part is presumably going to be crown DLC, the mount is almost certainly crown store, the house is crown store)

If I wanted to play an Elder Scrolls card game I'd have played Legends.

I know Zenimax said they were going to do less this year to give the staff a bit of a needed recovery and because of the ongoing covid fallout but do less usually also implies pay less.

I hope the card game is great, but I'll be waiting until this chapter is in the sale bin, or ESO+

Eccentric_Vampire · February 2022

Other (please, comment why).

I've never been good at card games and I'm worried about missing out on rewards by either not playing it or not winning. I already miss out on a lot of rewards in this game because I'm not skilled enough to complete the content and I'm worried this will just be another thing I can't do.

Sylvermynx · February 2022

All/some of the above (please, comment which ones).

Eccentric_Vampire wrote: »

I've never been good at card games and I'm worried about missing out on rewards by either not playing it or not winning. I already miss out on a lot of rewards in this game because I'm not skilled enough to complete the content and I'm worried this will just be another thing I can't do.

Well.... it's another thing I WON'T do - I have never had any interest in or use for online card games. I'm quite sure there will be leads etc walled behind it; I don't personally care - because I refuse to be held hostage for something I won't find any sort of fun at all.

Antiquities? I love it. Card game? Nope. Ain't hap'nin for me.

peacenote · February 2022

All/some of the above (please, comment which ones).

Mushroomancer wrote: »

I don't dislike it, mostly because we know absolutely nothing about it, so I'll reserve judgment on it until the time comes (even though I'm not a fan of CCGs, so my opinion will most likely be quite biased).

What I don't accept is the fact that it is the main feature and selling point of the chapter. If it were a side activity alongside a class or a skill line, or hell, even just one in a slew of "tavern games" or whatever you wanna call them, I wouldn't mind it as much. When the game clearly needs some refreshing in the combat department however, I can't take this as a response. Plus, I really hope this new, supposedly complex, system didn't take away from them designing the trial and dungeons, I really don't want to get another Kyne's Aegis.

Bottom line is, I am getting a bit fed up with the fact that ZOS seems to cater each chapter to a single portion of the playerbase, when they could at least try to please every section of it.

Also, I am at the point where I am not gonna trust ZOS about improving performance anymore. When they say "no new systems, we want to focus on performance", and we get a new system, that only makes me think performance is gonna stay in the crapper. Now, most likely they have separate sub-teams handling performance and game systems, I just hope making this minigame didn't affect the team working on performance fixes for one reason or another.

I pretty much feel EXACTLY the same way as you, so now I can write less.

I might even enjoy the card game, but the reveal made it seem like a LOT of work went into it, and it touches all areas of the game, and I'm really not happy about that coming on the heels of a "no new systems" announcement. Plus it feels like it will be similar to antiquities. "Something for everyone." What that means in ZOS-speak is that "everyone, whether they want to get into the card game or not, will find a reward behind it that they want or need to do well in content they would rather be doing." I am here, in ESO, to play combat and quest with my friends. I'm all about popping into a tavern and playing a card game when they are all offline, and I'm bored. I'm not thrilled with the idea that I may have to chase leads or spend time away from my friends to play cards with an NPC to unlock something and be viable in a raid. Antiquities was kind of OK because after the grind of leveling it, it's quick to unlock your leads, and a lot of the leads make sense to farm with your friends. This seems way more involved, especially adding the card collecting/trading part to it. PLUS I quit ESO Legends due to the way it put the big reward for daily logins on the last day; I find this manipulative and frustrating. It's not at all a stretch to assume that kind of thing will make its way to ESO with its new mini card game.

To top it all off, we're getting a card game with a leaderboard and ranking system and who knows what else, while losing a bunch of complexity in the achievement system, which I actually loved. Now I can see if I'm trending in wins or losses in this card game but I no longer look back and see when my tank brought a group through a no death if my healer did it first. Since "the real game" is the main reason I'm here, this seems completely and utterly backwards to me.

I'd be totally fine if a) character-achievement achievements weren't in jeopardy, b) this wasn't the big new thing of the year, and c) it didn't seem SOOO integrated. But put it all together and I'm not impressed right now.

peacenote · February 2022

All/some of the above (please, comment which ones).

Dojohoda wrote: »

Does cards help us in Cyrodiil? No? Didn't think so.

You're probably going to like it even less if it does...

Arunei · February 2022

BazOfWar wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

AJones43865 wrote: »

This years global reveal, in total, convinced me that ZOS is winding down it's investment into ESO and they aren't going back. If you look at how over the last couple years new content has been getting smaller and smaller and is less related to the original base game, with essentially all content, mounts etc. being a reskinned version of things we already have, it appears ZOS is on track to cease all investments into ESO in a couple years or so. I am now wholly convinced that ZOS is not investing anything into ESO they don't absolutely have to and it's unlikely they are making the investments required to fix any performance issues. I'd like to be wrong, but based on the evidence I am not.

I mean, this year even one of the 'perks' for pre-ordering the collectors bundle is an emote that we already have. ??? (/ownthrone is not new)

If ZOS was planning on abandoning the game, they wouldn't be spending the year reworking base code to finally fix PvP. People have been saying the game is dying or going to be closed ever since the game was released.

Actually they did say they where reworking the base code for the whole game but "Saying" and actually doing are totally different, they have been saying they are working on improving performance for years and haven't fixed a thing, in fact the games getting worse even in PvE now.

And that statement only arrived on the forums magically to quell the pooh storm that was growing over the remarks of certain developer.

From what I know of that situation it was Rich's wife who said that stuff, but Rich himself has said some pretty questionable things before ("You know you don't have to be here, right?" in response to player dissatisfaction in the past for example). They may not have been ready to announce the rework of the code until that crapstorm hit the fan, and released the news early to quell justified anger. That being said we will have to wait and see what happens, since ZOS has a habit of saying one thing and doing another in regards to stuff like this, but I like to think that maybe finally they're getting their stuff together.

I'll probably be disappointed but hey sometimes we have to be optimistic.

Romo · February 2022

I don't think a card game makes sense in ESO. ESO is a mmorpg not a card game.

Stealing this from another poster:

"I don't like or play card games and the team at ZOS while producing nice content also has a habit of locking things inside that force you to play said content to get the rewards. The examples are numerous OP weapons in solo arenas, mythics in antiquities, PVP skill line,

Which means they are going to lock something behind the card game you will have to play the card game to achieve."

Says it all.

Jusey1 · February 2022

I don't actually dislike the card game, i just want to be in the poll! :D

I'm actually excited for it. Need to make sure to get my main remake caught up though so I can get right into it once it releases.

FeedbackOnly · February 2022

Other (please, comment why).

I don't think it is enough for chapter main feature.

Ragnarok0130 · February 2022

I don't think a card game makes sense in ESO. ESO is a mmorpg not a card game.

Personally I don't like card games and I play MMOs to play the MMO content like dungeons and quests not play virtual cards. My fear is they'll lock rewards and content behind this mode to try to force us to play it for their quarterly earnings calls to report good player engagement.

If there are any rewards associated with this content they should also make those rewards earnable in non-card game activities as I have zero interest in engaging with this cash grab of a mode.

Gaebriel0410 · February 2022

A cardgame sounds kinda cool to me, I always enjoyed Gwent in Witcher, or Triple Triad in Final Fantasy. I think side activities in an MMO are a good thing. It might not be for everyone, but it's nice to have options. And who knows, you might even like it.

Though I really don't get the mindset of feeling 'forced' to play it because you want / need the rewards.

If you think like that, everything becomes horrible by default.

I'm forced to go and buy food in the rain because civilization has locked the supermarket behind a weatherwall.

Drammanoth · February 2022

I think development time could've been spent on something else more important or another better feature.

Yes, I am curious about the cards, yet there are other issues that require attention now, aren't there...

Sealish · February 2022

It doesn't feel like it should be a full main new feature.

I think that this could be a fun addition to the game (I won't say it will or won't till I've tried playing it), however it should have been a DLC addon and it should 100% not give anything beyond cosmetic rewards to players.

Something like this isn't the sort of content that can be expected to appeal to players of ESO as a whole, and as such should be 100% optional with no numerical penalty for choosing to opt-out of playing it. As such, it should not be the "Main Game Feature" of the yearly chapter. The headline new game features should always be something available to everyone, something that ESO players can be reasonably expected to want to participate in, and something that changes combat in a meaningful way by adding new choices, abilities (active or passive), or skills. This feature only fills one of those three things.

Sealish · February 2022

It doesn't feel like it should be a full main new feature.

Dojohoda wrote: »

Does cards help us in Cyrodiil? No? Didn't think so.

They may actually do that, and that is part of the problem with this being the "Main Feature"
It being the main feature means that they will want people to play it and as such may make some of the rewards something like mythic leads that could end up providing a PVP focused mythic item. This would be awful.

rpa · February 2022

I don't play/like card games.

If it's fully ignorable by all means have a card game for people who enjoy things like that. If it is not ignorable like antiquities then it's just another chore.

DaveMoeDee · February 2022

I don't actually dislike the card game, i just want to be in the poll! :D

MovesLikeJaguar wrote: »

So they already have a full card game that was developed and supported, which had depth and fantastic gameplay and was put on life support in December of 2019. TESL is still a thing you can play, and is very good. They had the assets, and with it being on life support and owned by Zenimax, along with the fact that TESL and ESO have collaborated in the past (looking at the dark brotherhood direwolf mount), it was the obvious decision to, if they were adamant on putting a card game in ESO, it should have been TESL.
Fact of the matter, card games are hard to make, and harder to make well. It's unlikely that they're going to make a card game that is better than TESL, since that was fantastic, and with the single deck mechanic they teased, it sounds like there won't be much of a competitive nature with this new card game. I could be proven wrong; it could be a very competitive game with a lot of strategy, cool cards, neat decks you can make and compete with, and it could be better than TESL. If it goes that route, then great! But a game that requires each player to make and submit 2 decks, only for all 4 (2 from each player) to be combined into one central deck sounds like, just from a core design standpoint, not a competitive game. It sounds like a party game, but it's 1 on 1, making it a coin flip where your decks don't matter since you and your opponent pull from the same pool of cards.
I want it to be good. But TESL vets like myself are sorely disappointed, and TCG players also like myself are very skeptical that it'll be good. And if it's not good, it'll become dead content.

TESL would be a problem. It would be too much work to maintain a deck. I also assume this new game will play faster.

TESL was great, but I like the mechanic in this game where both players use the same cards. It means a new player isn't at a disadvantage due to having a lesser deck. Well, to some degree. I assume the players don't know what was in the other player's deck, so it could be harder to plan for cards with more flavor.

I don't want to care about deck building so much. I also prefer this approach because there is less of a need to get balance right.

DaveMoeDee · February 2022

I don't actually dislike the card game, i just want to be in the poll! :D

Destai wrote: »

I don't dislike it because I haven't seen in it.

I have 2 main concerns, just in general:
1. It takes away from other game systems development in the future. I know they're working on some deep overhauls, so hopefully not supporting new combat systems frees up resources to contribute to that effort.
2. How it will be monetized. I hope it'll be no more monetized than Antiquities.

I don't have enough information to make a concrete value statement - yet.

In general, I'd want a more combat oriented system - new skills, weapons, or classes. I hope this systems takes pressure off of the combat and engineering teams so they can work on the overhaul mentioned by ZOS leadership a few weeks back. Time will tell.

Considering both players share their decks as a single pool, there will be a lot less pressure to get the best deck. They can add all the silly cosmetics to it they want for people into that. But I don't see monetization mattering for competitiveness.

Fhritz · February 2022

I don't actually dislike the card game, i just want to be in the poll! :D

I mean, it's something original in the game. Let be honest, a new class or skill line isn't the priority now since ZoS need to fix the game first (as they've said before, they'll rebuild the game thought the year), and a lot of player would be angry and would call the expansion "P2W" (looking at you, necro). And I don't think a card game is easier to develop than a class or anything - in fact it can be even harder because you need to build a game in a game.

I'll wait for more info before giving my final thoughts, but it seems pretty promising !

wenchmore420b14_ESO · February 2022

It doesn't feel like it should be a full main new feature.

I don't dislike the new CCG. But being a "completions" type guy, I'm like, darn gonna totally be addicted. probably.
I play MTG, but never played Hearthstone or Legends, so this will be my first "on-line" game.

But, I do feel as the rest as this was not enough to be the major feature of a new chapter.
Yes, they are giving us other new stuff, but still kinda disappointing.
Just my 2 drakes.
Still looking forward to new zones and storylines, but hope dialogues are more fleshed out and involved than last one.

Finedaible · February 2022

I really don't give a rat's behind about a mini card game, like companions before it. I only leveled the companions for the unlocked passives in lack of anything else remotely interesting, and partially because the chapter had gone on sale.

At this point in time ESO has become exceedingly stagnant, especially regarding combat and player abilities. Devs are relying too much on sets to 'expand' combat without adding to skill lines. Champion Point system 2.0 could have had the potential to create build diversity but that turned out to be a weird rehash of generic buffs with no rewarding specializations, and an excessive need to limit non-combat passives which need to be micromanaged between actvities. There's just a general lack of creativity and wasted potential clouding the game right now and I know that some of it might be due to the current game engine restrictions, but at the same time I find it baffling how ZoS could have gone this far without realizing there would be this many problems without doing something about it.

Kalik_Gold · February 2022

It doesn't feel like it should be a full main new feature.

Should have been a maintenance day add-on for a new minigame. On a Random Tuesday....

Xorxe · February 2022

It doesn't feel like it should be a full main new feature.

The whole game feels like its in maintenance mode for last two years. At least as far as creativity and inovation is concerned. So I'm not surprised, but I'm dissapointed. Card game like side activity that is added in some random patch, mentioned in patch notes in one or two sentences, sure, I'm all for it. But like main feature for whole expansion? It's like making new updated model of a car, where whole selling point is a new color of a car freshener. OMG madlads, are you sure you are not doing too much at once, hold your horses, I'm dizzy :-/

Gylzyn · February 2022

It doesn't feel like it should be a full main new feature.

This might be OK as an additional feature to be played as a bit of a side distraction. But I am disappointed that this is the main feature of this year's chapter (other than the new zone/story). As I have said elsewhere, my biggest worry is that "must have" rewards get tied to this card game.

Rasande_Robin · February 2022

I don't actually dislike the card game, i just want to be in the poll! :D

I do look forward to it, I don't think it will live up to my expectations but I'm hopeful.
They do succeed in most of what they do.

I was more of a "meh" for the antiquities system. But it actually turned out quite enjoyable and different. I just wish there was a harder mode than "ultimate" leads.