"Joining Encounter In Progress" = VERY VERY VERY BAD IDEA

FlopsyPrince

I will note that while I have guilds who do great things (and had them on the PS4), I tend to be much more of a loner. No amount of "guild camaraderie" or whatever will fix that aspect of myself. I may push a bit outside the box, but I will never be the fully social creature guilds help with in this area.

I don't want major changes, though I had the request since the last Undaunted Event to give credit for boss kills and quest progress wherever you are. That would help me, since I am usually seeking more skillpoints at this point, not another read through of the quest line, which I have done at least 20-25 times already, over the PS4 and PC.

Kwoung

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Lauranae wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

...

If ppl are complaining that their guilds are not active during their play times then they should find one that has a better time coverage. We have 5 guild slots, iam sure that these guys can spare one for that purpose. Of course they can use the group finder, but they shouldnt use their guild as an excuse why the group finder should bend to their will.

Of course, after all my guildies are there to serve me, at any time, as their time is less valuable than mine. While you are at it, ask ZOS to completely suppress such totally useful tool as GF.

Sometimes, the lack of respect goes beyond inimaginable!!

Every guild has typical core playing hours where the most of the guild members are online. At least one player in this thread complained that his guild members are rarely online during his play time, which means his play time does not fit the core play hours of his guild. Using one of the other 4 slots to find a guild that is active during these hours is not unreasonable nor is it a lack of respect.

We have actually had many Aussies join our (US based) guild over the years and actively play with us... because they worked off hours in their time zone, and wanted folks to play with. Most of them were extremely nice and funny to boot, so a great fit for all.

Sadly though, I have found that most players seem to misuse the Guild Finder and simply look for a lot of members (possibly a trader) and nothing else, then simply click apply on whichever ones floated to the top of the list, regardless of what the guild actually focuses on or the hours they mostly play. They could save themselves and many GM's a lot of hassle and increase their game experience exponentially, if they simply took the time to use the advanced search options, read through the guild descriptions (most are very specific about what they do/expect) and join a guild that does exactly what they are looking for. I have seen people join PVP guilds looking for dungeon/trial runs, folks looking for progression trial events in newbie based guilds, folks joining guilds that require Discord, but the player refuses too.. and I am fairly certain most RP based guilds probably get a lot of applications from folks that don't even know what RP stands for.

How is that misuse?

I primarily play solo, but I help out the guilds I am in as I can, including weekly contributions. I did my first guild even with one the other day, but that is not my norm.

Nothing says you MUST do group events with the guild.

It is misuse because someone didn't take the time to use the tool to find what they were looking for. Had they used the tool correctly, they probably could have found a close, if not exact match for their playstyle, goals, play hours, etc... There are a LOT of guilds out there and many are very specific about what they do... including Dungeon Story or Speed runs, grinding, questing, trials, PVP, RP, or whatever someone happens to be interested in using that guild for. Not reading descriptions, nevermind even using the filters, to find a guild to do RND Normals with say... and clicking apply on 3 PVP or overseas guilds and expecting it to work out, is pretty much misusing a tool.

[snip]

I don't see where I say anything about how someone should play the game. Just pointing out that coming to the forums and complaining about something like "my guild is never there for me", is probably more of a self inflicted issue than a game problem. Especially since the game does offer a fairly robust (but far from perfect) tool to find a guild that would be there for you, plays when you do and focuses on the content you are interested in as well..

[edited to remove quote]

FlopsyPrince

Kwoung wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Lauranae wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

...

If ppl are complaining that their guilds are not active during their play times then they should find one that has a better time coverage. We have 5 guild slots, iam sure that these guys can spare one for that purpose. Of course they can use the group finder, but they shouldnt use their guild as an excuse why the group finder should bend to their will.

Of course, after all my guildies are there to serve me, at any time, as their time is less valuable than mine. While you are at it, ask ZOS to completely suppress such totally useful tool as GF.

Sometimes, the lack of respect goes beyond inimaginable!!

Every guild has typical core playing hours where the most of the guild members are online. At least one player in this thread complained that his guild members are rarely online during his play time, which means his play time does not fit the core play hours of his guild. Using one of the other 4 slots to find a guild that is active during these hours is not unreasonable nor is it a lack of respect.

We have actually had many Aussies join our (US based) guild over the years and actively play with us... because they worked off hours in their time zone, and wanted folks to play with. Most of them were extremely nice and funny to boot, so a great fit for all.

Sadly though, I have found that most players seem to misuse the Guild Finder and simply look for a lot of members (possibly a trader) and nothing else, then simply click apply on whichever ones floated to the top of the list, regardless of what the guild actually focuses on or the hours they mostly play. They could save themselves and many GM's a lot of hassle and increase their game experience exponentially, if they simply took the time to use the advanced search options, read through the guild descriptions (most are very specific about what they do/expect) and join a guild that does exactly what they are looking for. I have seen people join PVP guilds looking for dungeon/trial runs, folks looking for progression trial events in newbie based guilds, folks joining guilds that require Discord, but the player refuses too.. and I am fairly certain most RP based guilds probably get a lot of applications from folks that don't even know what RP stands for.

How is that misuse?

I primarily play solo, but I help out the guilds I am in as I can, including weekly contributions. I did my first guild even with one the other day, but that is not my norm.

Nothing says you MUST do group events with the guild.

It is misuse because someone didn't take the time to use the tool to find what they were looking for. Had they used the tool correctly, they probably could have found a close, if not exact match for their playstyle, goals, play hours, etc... There are a LOT of guilds out there and many are very specific about what they do... including Dungeon Story or Speed runs, grinding, questing, trials, PVP, RP, or whatever someone happens to be interested in using that guild for. Not reading descriptions, nevermind even using the filters, to find a guild to do RND Normals with say... and clicking apply on 3 PVP or overseas guilds and expecting it to work out, is pretty much misusing a tool.

[snip]

I don't see where I say anything about how someone should play the game. Just pointing out that coming to the forums and complaining about something like "my guild is never there for me", is probably more of a self inflicted issue than a game problem. Especially since the game does offer a fairly robust (but far from perfect) tool to find a guild that would be there for you, plays when you do and focuses on the content you are interested in as well..

That was definitely not the only part of this discussion. I will admit I didn't read every last post really closely, but I didn't see that in what I read.

Your mileage may vary of course.

[edited to remove quote]

spartaxoxo

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Lauranae wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

...

If ppl are complaining that their guilds are not active during their play times then they should find one that has a better time coverage. We have 5 guild slots, iam sure that these guys can spare one for that purpose. Of course they can use the group finder, but they shouldnt use their guild as an excuse why the group finder should bend to their will.

Of course, after all my guildies are there to serve me, at any time, as their time is less valuable than mine. While you are at it, ask ZOS to completely suppress such totally useful tool as GF.

Sometimes, the lack of respect goes beyond inimaginable!!

Every guild has typical core playing hours where the most of the guild members are online. At least one player in this thread complained that his guild members are rarely online during his play time, which means his play time does not fit the core play hours of his guild. Using one of the other 4 slots to find a guild that is active during these hours is not unreasonable nor is it a lack of respect.

We have actually had many Aussies join our (US based) guild over the years and actively play with us... because they worked off hours in their time zone, and wanted folks to play with. Most of them were extremely nice and funny to boot, so a great fit for all.

Sadly though, I have found that most players seem to misuse the Guild Finder and simply look for a lot of members (possibly a trader) and nothing else, then simply click apply on whichever ones floated to the top of the list, regardless of what the guild actually focuses on or the hours they mostly play. They could save themselves and many GM's a lot of hassle and increase their game experience exponentially, if they simply took the time to use the advanced search options, read through the guild descriptions (most are very specific about what they do/expect) and join a guild that does exactly what they are looking for. I have seen people join PVP guilds looking for dungeon/trial runs, folks looking for progression trial events in newbie based guilds, folks joining guilds that require Discord, but the player refuses too.. and I am fairly certain most RP based guilds probably get a lot of applications from folks that don't even know what RP stands for.

How is that misuse?

I primarily play solo, but I help out the guilds I am in as I can, including weekly contributions. I did my first guild even with one the other day, but that is not my norm.

Nothing says you MUST do group events with the guild.

It is misuse because someone didn't take the time to use the tool to find what they were looking for. Had they used the tool correctly, they probably could have found a close, if not exact match for their playstyle, goals, play hours, etc... There are a LOT of guilds out there and many are very specific about what they do... including Dungeon Story or Speed runs, grinding, questing, trials, PVP, RP, or whatever someone happens to be interested in using that guild for. Not reading descriptions, nevermind even using the filters, to find a guild to do RND Normals with say... and clicking apply on 3 PVP or overseas guilds and expecting it to work out, is pretty much misusing a tool.

[snip]

I don't see where I say anything about how someone should play the game. Just pointing out that coming to the forums and complaining about something like "my guild is never there for me", is probably more of a self inflicted issue than a game problem. Especially since the game does offer a fairly robust (but far from perfect) tool to find a guild that would be there for you, plays when you do and focuses on the content you are interested in as well..

That was definitely not the only part of this discussion. I will admit I didn't read every last post really closely, but I didn't see that in what I read.

Your mileage may vary of course.

It was not a point made in this thread at all.

This is what I actually stated.

Nobody in this game has 24/7 on demand access to their guildmates. That some guild you're not in somewhere would have been willing to run it with you then is completely irrelevant.

Your guilds aren't your servants =/= I generally do not have access to them.

Even very helpful guilds that are online at the same time as you aren't literally always available at your beck and call. They aren't your servants. The fact remains though is that group finder is for people to find groups when a premade is unavailable.

Premades are NOT always available and it does NOT mean you're too stupid to join a guild or make friends.

[edited to remove quote]

Crimsonwolf666

Dragonlord573 wrote: »

The only dungeon you actually have to do the quest in is Vaults of Madness.

Incorrect. Selenes Web is at least another one where the group was too far ahead of my alt character and it stalled the quest. I have heard of this from guild mates from other quests including DLC quests like RoM and LoM too. Just because it doesn't happen to you, doesn't mean that it doesn't for others.

Crimsonwolf666

A lot of ppl on here seem to assume, "jUsT jOIn a GUilD/MakE fRiEndS" will solve all their problems, but I have had ppl speed through NORMAL dungeons...there is no bloody achievement for speeding through Normal. Most Normals, even on DLCs, are doing quests or taking it slow. Slow the oblivion down already, its not like achieving speed runs through normal will make you live longer IRL. I have many times on NORMAL dungeons ask to slow down, I am doing quest and got kicked as a tank or healer...so be it, find another when you literally just said at start that you waited over 40minutes lol.

Gandalf_72

"Joining Encounter in Progress" functionality prevents any try to restart from the beginning

Joining Encounter in Progress on Scalecaller Peak and Bloodroot Forge


Edited on January 24, 2022:
Bloodroot Forge fixed!
I don't know if Scalecaller Peak has been fixed too, as I haven't run it lately

Xebov

Crimsonwolf666 wrote: »

A lot of ppl on here seem to assume, "jUsT jOIn a GUilD/MakE fRiEndS" will solve all their problems, but I have had ppl speed through NORMAL dungeons...there is no bloody achievement for speeding through Normal. Most Normals, even on DLCs, are doing quests or taking it slow. Slow the oblivion down already, its not like achieving speed runs through normal will make you live longer IRL. I have many times on NORMAL dungeons ask to slow down, I am doing quest and got kicked as a tank or healer...so be it, find another when you literally just said at start that you waited over 40minutes lol.

You might not get it, but thats a matter of efficiency. The majority of players in normal group queue are either farming gear or getting their daily dungeon reward. Questers are only a minority by the fact alone that you can only do the quest once but need up to 45 runs to complete a dungeons gear collection. Right now iam ending up in alot of dungeons where ppl farm certain sets.
What you have to understand here is that no playstyle or need takes precedence in random groups. Your time is not more important than mine and vice versa. This means that everyone that needs specific things that they cant get done the way they like have to find like minded players.

Elsonso

Xebov wrote: »

Crimsonwolf666 wrote: »

I have had ppl speed through NORMAL dungeons...there is no bloody achievement for speeding through Normal. Most Normals, even on DLCs, are doing quests or taking it slow. Slow the oblivion down already, its not like achieving speed runs through normal will make you live longer IRL. I have many times on NORMAL dungeons ask to slow down, I am doing quest and got kicked as a tank or healer...so be it, find another when you literally just said at start that you waited over 40minutes lol.

You might not get it, but thats a matter of efficiency. The majority of players in normal group queue are either farming gear or getting their daily dungeon reward. Questers are only a minority by the fact alone that you can only do the quest once but need up to 45 runs to complete a dungeons gear collection. Right now iam ending up in alot of dungeons where ppl farm certain sets.
What you have to understand here is that no playstyle or need takes precedence in random groups. Your time is not more important than mine and vice versa. This means that everyone that needs specific things that they cant get done the way they like have to find like minded players.

Exactly. SLOW DOWN. That's all the speed runners need to do. SLOW DOWN. One time, I had to do Fungal Grotto three times on a lowbie character I was leveling just to get the event tickets because the boss was already dead before I could push my way through all the snares and CC. SLOW DOWN.

Facefister

or KEEP UP.

Elsonso

Facefister wrote: »

or KEEP UP.

You do realize that not every character has the stamina reserves or skills unlocked to actually keep up with a high CP character that can do a teflon run past all the bosses and trash mobs, right? I think that a lot of people in PUGS think that everyone in the game is identical to them, and so they can just do whatever they want, because if they can, everyone can.

Facefister

Slot a speed buff, and do heavy attacks. If they're pulverizing everything already, there is nothing you could contribute something meaningful anyway.

Grega

Elsonso wrote: »

Facefister wrote: »

or KEEP UP.

You do realize that not every character has the stamina reserves or skills unlocked to actually keep up with a high CP character that can do a teflon run past all the bosses and trash mobs, right? I think that a lot of people in PUGS think that everyone in the game is identical to them, and so they can just do whatever they want, because if they can, everyone can.

I’ve never had a problem keeping up even on level 10 character with 8k stam.

But then again, even if one is too slow, this joining encounter feature solves all problems. You get teleported right in without the need to walk

Elsonso

Grega wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

Facefister wrote: »

or KEEP UP.

You do realize that not every character has the stamina reserves or skills unlocked to actually keep up with a high CP character that can do a teflon run past all the bosses and trash mobs, right? I think that a lot of people in PUGS think that everyone in the game is identical to them, and so they can just do whatever they want, because if they can, everyone can.

I’ve never had a problem keeping up even on level 10 character with 8k stam.

But then again, even if one is too slow, this joining encounter feature solves all problems. You get teleported right in without the need to walk

Yeah, that is the dev solution, and perhaps that will work, once they extend it to all dungeons.

It is going to be a brutal experience for new players, but this game isn't really as new player friendly as it could be.

TequilaFire

So how far can this feature be pushed? If I snooze at the entrance will it pull me to the last boss?
Not that anyone would do that...

Grega

TequilaFire wrote: »

So how far can this feature be pushed? If I snooze at the entrance will it pull me to the last boss?
Not that anyone would do that...

Yup

Elsonso

TequilaFire wrote: »

So how far can this feature be pushed? If I snooze at the entrance will it pull me to the last boss?
Not that anyone would do that...

1. stand at entrance
2. wait to get warped forward
3. light attack boss
4. profit

spartaxoxo

Facefister wrote: »

Slot a speed buff, and do heavy attacks. If they're pulverizing everything already, there is nothing you could contribute something meaningful anyway.

Not everyone really has a speed buff to slot.

Auztinito

I will say, if devs continue to make this the only way to do dungeon and from now on. If people speed run, just light attack the boss once and sit it out. I mean they obviously felt that they didn’t need you so you may as well profit off their work.

That’ll be my plan for ALL DUNGEONS AS TANK. If they wish to speed through it. I’ll just refuse to tank that boss off you and just tag the boss with a LA and reap the rewards.

Rishikesa108

So have I to assume that looting chests and killing trash mobs is descouraged from ZOS ? I've been pulled forward while I was picking the lock of a chest, preventing me from looting.
And I've seen low level players always dead due to the big big number of trashes left, then pulled into the boss fight, then left with trashes again. And I couldn't help them, because of the pulling.
This feature is rude, like those rushing players.
I hope ZOS will understand.
New players have to be protected, not shocked.

Amottica

We had the pug in our group run ahead and start the fight. Our tank was of the mind that the pug clearly wanted to tank the fight. After they died we stepped in and killed the boss. The pug fell in line and started letting the tank lead the way. They were fine after that.

Xebov

Elsonso wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Crimsonwolf666 wrote: »

I have had ppl speed through NORMAL dungeons...there is no bloody achievement for speeding through Normal. Most Normals, even on DLCs, are doing quests or taking it slow. Slow the oblivion down already, its not like achieving speed runs through normal will make you live longer IRL. I have many times on NORMAL dungeons ask to slow down, I am doing quest and got kicked as a tank or healer...so be it, find another when you literally just said at start that you waited over 40minutes lol.

You might not get it, but thats a matter of efficiency. The majority of players in normal group queue are either farming gear or getting their daily dungeon reward. Questers are only a minority by the fact alone that you can only do the quest once but need up to 45 runs to complete a dungeons gear collection. Right now iam ending up in alot of dungeons where ppl farm certain sets.
What you have to understand here is that no playstyle or need takes precedence in random groups. Your time is not more important than mine and vice versa. This means that everyone that needs specific things that they cant get done the way they like have to find like minded players.

Exactly. SLOW DOWN. That's all the speed runners need to do. SLOW DOWN. One time, I had to do Fungal Grotto three times on a lowbie character I was leveling just to get the event tickets because the boss was already dead before I could push my way through all the snares and CC. SLOW DOWN.

Your problem is not that players speed up during the dungeon. Your problem is that ppl drain adds without killing them. Thats 2 different things.

In all my dungeons all adds are killed. This means that snares and CCs are not an issue. Now iam a Tank in heavy armor and i have a speed penealty and i easily can keep up and if i can keep up everyone else can because they all are literally faster than me.

Elsonso

Xebov wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Crimsonwolf666 wrote: »

I have had ppl speed through NORMAL dungeons...there is no bloody achievement for speeding through Normal. Most Normals, even on DLCs, are doing quests or taking it slow. Slow the oblivion down already, its not like achieving speed runs through normal will make you live longer IRL. I have many times on NORMAL dungeons ask to slow down, I am doing quest and got kicked as a tank or healer...so be it, find another when you literally just said at start that you waited over 40minutes lol.

You might not get it, but thats a matter of efficiency. The majority of players in normal group queue are either farming gear or getting their daily dungeon reward. Questers are only a minority by the fact alone that you can only do the quest once but need up to 45 runs to complete a dungeons gear collection. Right now iam ending up in alot of dungeons where ppl farm certain sets.
What you have to understand here is that no playstyle or need takes precedence in random groups. Your time is not more important than mine and vice versa. This means that everyone that needs specific things that they cant get done the way they like have to find like minded players.

Exactly. SLOW DOWN. That's all the speed runners need to do. SLOW DOWN. One time, I had to do Fungal Grotto three times on a lowbie character I was leveling just to get the event tickets because the boss was already dead before I could push my way through all the snares and CC. SLOW DOWN.

Your problem is not that players speed up during the dungeon. Your problem is that ppl drain adds without killing them. Thats 2 different things.

In all my dungeons all adds are killed. This means that snares and CCs are not an issue. Now iam a Tank in heavy armor and i have a speed penealty and i easily can keep up and if i can keep up everyone else can because they all are literally faster than me.

That would be nice. What I see more than I would like to see is a DPS that queues as a tank or healer in a normal base game dungeon so they can farm the end boss. They don't care about role because they are going to solo the bosses anyway. They end up soloing the dungeon with three unnecessary people there. If they teflon past trash mobs and mini bosses, and only do bosses that unlock doors along the way, they can get to the end boss, solo him, and move onto the next dungeon pretty quickly.

Now, the dynamics are going to be different in the DLC and vet dungeons, as they are harder to cheese for end-boss farming. I am guessing that this is why so many people complain when they get DLC dungeons out of dungeon finder.

As an aside, I find PUGs worse on EU, when compared to NA, and a little better on XBox, when compared to PC.

newtinmpls

Jaimeh wrote: »

<snippage> I can see how this is problematic for PUGs, since not everyone is there for the same purpose, <snippage>

This is inherent truth, so in an ideal situation, people would try to

1-Right away state their goals "I'm here for a speedrun (and for example if it was Fungal Grotto) only need two bosses to finish this thing - is that okay with y'all"

or

"I have the quest and [I have]/[I have not] done it before, so I can [be pretty quick]/[could use any advice to sort it out]"

and then

2-Try to show some consideration for your team mates

newtinmpls

Facefister wrote: »

or KEEP UP.

I have three characters out of 18 who can "run" without quickly blowing all their stamina. Not everyone spends CP on speed crap, slots some version of rapids, or has the antiquity speedy-ring equipped during a dungeon.

Nor does everyone have the dungeon layout, shortcuts and which bosses can be skipped and still get a key memorized.

AND

neither did you at first.

Facefister

newtinmpls wrote: »

Facefister wrote: »

or KEEP UP.

I have three characters out of 18 who can "run" without quickly blowing all their stamina. Not everyone spends CP on speed crap, slots some version of rapids, or has the antiquity speedy-ring equipped during a dungeon.

Nor does everyone have the dungeon layout, shortcuts and which bosses can be skipped and still get a key memorized.

AND

neither did you at first.

Backthen, I've spent a comical amount of time on the dummy and crafting the right sets before I've entered my first normal dungeon. Because I thought, I am new to this game and I would probably drag down the others if I underperform. Now, "questers" and "adventurers" who do mental gymnastics about "not being a fake DD" enter dungeons and even vets with zero preparation and even have the audacity to demand others to accustom to their "playstyle".

guarstompemoji

An easy solve for this would be making the dungeon quests work like the Craglorn dailies, but only awarding a skill point on the first run.

The story version of the quest then could be done/repeated any time.