Overland Content Feedback Thread

CP5

SilverBride wrote: »

tonyblack wrote: »

...Not everyone remain new player for long. We learn and improve to overcome harder challenges but we can’t experience them in majority of released content because it’s essentially starter areas.

Every zone is set up so that even new characters and players new to ESO can succeed in them. This is by design and has been a very successful formula.

tonyblack wrote: »

Dungeon and trials can be experienced in both settings, why is it such strange concept for some naysayers that same could be done with zones?

Dungeons and Trials are designed to give players a challenge beyond overland so it makes sense that they offer multiple difficulty levels. Technically the same could be done with overland but that doesn't mean it should be.

"has been a very successful formula" - so long as you ignore all the people who leave because they find it boring, disengaging, or otherwise a waste of time. You and your friend group enjoy it as is, and that is a good thing, everyone here benefits from more players enjoying the game, but if you aren't willing to listen to those outside your social group you won't understand that your enjoyment isn't applicable to everyone.

"that doesn't mean it should be" - but if anyone has a vested interest in playing ESO for the long term, then the long term health of the game should matter. Issues causing people to leave should matter. Such issues should be addressed, not ignored. If someone cares for this game to last as long as it can, addressing the issues and concerns of other players should be a priority, regardless of if they play the game differently. For myself, I came to ESO because I was already invested in the world, but now that very world is so off-putting to experience that I avoid it entirely.

SilverBride wrote: »

BIackHand wrote: »

Its not about how my actions effect others.

If creating a separate veteran overland splits the player base and gives out better rewards and takes time and resources that could have been used for things that benefit all players then it does negatively affect others.

BIackHand wrote: »

Nowadays you dont need anyone for overland content, doesnt matter you gear or cp. Its simply not needed...

That is one of the positive changes that One Tamriel brought. Players can now play their own way at their own pace and not be dependent on others to do simple quests and enjoy the story. But they do still group for the more challenging overland content such as World Bosses and Harrowstorms and Dragons. I group with others for these things every day because I want to, not because I have to.

"Splits the player base" which, as has been mentioned already happens, between different overland instances, players going to trials or dungeons, or players flat out leaving. What difference does it make if people are either in a dungeon or trial, offline or in a separate overland instance?

"Gives out better rewards" which is compensation for the increased time that it takes to clear the content, a concept applicable to every single piece of pve content in the game already.

"Takes time and resources" despite the fact that ZOS is making a card game. I don't know the numbers, but I would guess that the number of people who would participate in some version of harder overland, whatever form it may take, is more than those who are interested and will actively entertain the card game. There are entire years of content in zones I have skipped, if this were done I could go back and do all of it, while enjoying it, and I'm probably not alone in that.

BIackHand

SilverBride wrote: »

BIackHand wrote: »

...Its frustrating that you just meet the same difficulty from lvl 1-50. And when you evolve your gameplay and gear, its even worse. A loooot worse... Most boring quest experience i had so far and thats why i am proud that i experienced cadwells silver/gold and the overland content of my faction before...

I experienced Cadwell's Silver and Gold, too. I completed both on one character and hated it so I never did it again.

I have evolved my characters by looking up builds and gearing them in good sets and enchants and have become powerful enough to solo a lot of normal dungeons and World Bosses. But rather than feeling bored by overland I just feel relief. When I encounter a story boss that gave me a lot of trouble before and can defeat him without multiple failed attempts I finally feel like the Hero I am proclaimed to be.

Fine if thats is your attitude, but that belongs to people wich dont like enagaging questlines, who just wanna lvl up all chars fast, collecting fast all lorebooks and skyshards for the endgame and let overland behind. But there are also the same and bigger majority of people wich like to progress their character/gameplay to have the feel of getting more powerful for more engaging overland content. Right now you just getting more powerful, to be more bored as before, while thinking 5 times to quit the game until you reached the endgame to feel released from that boring journey from lvl 1-50. Congratz on gearing up and theorycrafting to complete normal dungeon.

Shagreth

It's interesting reading all this. One thing that many of you don't realize is how much old-gen console support is holding ESO back. New Skill-Lines? No can do, because of old-gen memory limitations, better graphics, servers, you name it, the list is infinite. I am seriously hoping we don't get to the point when they are FORCED to drop support because of bleeding subs, it might be too late then to turn things around. Choose now and make some people angry and lose some subs, or risk and lose everything later. The game is in dire need to evolve, then we can have nice things.

I consider overland offering a challenge and proper rewards that matter part of that evolution, people will just flock in, but that's just me. Really hoping they decide and soon, also hoping they give us something, anything - about what they might be thinking regarding overland.

spartaxoxo

The difference between splitting someone not engaging in Overland content from splitting someone who does engage in Overland content is that the people who are engaging in Overland content are playing together. Splitting a highly populated zone doesn't have much impact but low population zones become unhealthy in their player engagement and ability for new players to complete content when an already low population is reduced even further. It can literally be the difference between a new player getting help and joining a guild, and thinking the game is dead and telling everyone that asks them how the game was it's dead.

It's a total non-issue if they just did what LOTRO did, but that has it's own flaws too.

spartaxoxo

Shagreth wrote: »

It's interesting reading all this. One thing that many of you don't realize is how much old-gen console support is holding ESO back.

This has literally nothing to do with console. And consoles are not holding eso back in any form. The money from console, which is about 1/2 to 2/3rds of their playerbase is what helps keeps this game afloat. There would be no eso as it currently is without console. They aren't going to develop a bunch of new skills for a game that is undergoing massive maintenace repairs that they can't even recoup. They are working on fixing performance first.

The pandemic prevented them from fixing their servers. The global shortage prevented their console userbase from even buying new consoles. Them needing to fix foundational code issues is preventing that kind of work. They are still working from home. Those things get changed and then we can talk about console holding things back. And not before.

It's like if a bakery is flooded, it's trucks with flour and stuff are delayed, they have a massive line of angry customers to deal with, their cash register is not working and they are out of butter. And you think you'd get to cut in line and get your croissant right now if you gave them a stick of butter.

Yes, they need butter for croissants. But it is the absolute least of their issues and is absolutely not why you're not getting the croissant right then. They have a whole other host of issues to fix before they can get to that.

Shagreth

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Yes, they need butter for croissants. But it is the absolute least of their issues and is absolutely not why you're not getting the croissant right then. They have a whole other host of issues to fix before they can get to that.

It is rather unfortunate then, with the on-going chase to meet deadlines and having to present a product or an idea for the next thing all while putting tape and baling wire to keep things from falling apart -- the future of ESO looks rather bleak doesn't it? All that doesn't change the fact the game IS held back and that ideally all that you mentioned should have been addressed. Yeah, and in an ideal world we wouldn't have to die. It's tough. Let's see how it all plays out, I do hope I'm wrong.

CP5

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The difference between splitting someone not engaging in Overland content from splitting someone who does engage in Overland content is that the people who are engaging in Overland content are playing together. Splitting a highly populated zone doesn't have much impact but low population zones become unhealthy in their player engagement and ability for new players to complete content when an already low population is reduced even further. It can literally be the difference between a new player getting help and joining a guild, and thinking the game is dead and telling everyone that asks them how the game was it's dead.

It's a total non-issue if they just did what LOTRO did, but that has it's own flaws too.

True, if they were to implement such a system. In the case of zones that are currently dead on the live servers, if anything I feel there could be a chance for a 'vet' version of these zones being more popular than they currently are just because of the players coming back to participate in content they previously skipped.

kindred

I think Tamriel should be a more dangerous place. Back when I use to play Skyrim, I was always felt danger and I was aware not to get myself in a situation where I could die. ESO on the other hand, I never worry about dying, ever. I do not want to be weaker. I'm not asking you to nerf us (please do not do that.) I would like the option for npc's and bosses to feel dangerous in this world. Like maybe I would need a strategy before I engage.

ESO_Nightingale

alberichtano wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

enemies die so fast it's just boring now. Questing is no-where near as fun as it could be because every enemy just dies nearly instantly, it doesn't feel like there's real stakes to anything. I wish there was a way for me to increase the difficulty without ruining my build but at the same time, without ruining the fun of other players who don't want harder difficulty

And long, meaningless fights with random mobs all over the maps is not boring?

No, it's more fun. Not to say fights should last way too long, but they currently don't last any time at all.

EozZoe1989

i want the card game
i really do,, theres alot people that are not apart of this thread on this forms.. i really think should asking them in social medias too and other.. also the fact that need share the form to all would be better and tell people how to join.. its not private thing is it.. or is this a club lol.. hehe-- well anyways i think this cool place and people need to be able to vote on here also and have there options thoughts and other things heard.. i like the card game and i think there should be more mini games in the game for rewards like they said,. also add mount racing.. id like that

spartaxoxo

CP5 wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The difference between splitting someone not engaging in Overland content from splitting someone who does engage in Overland content is that the people who are engaging in Overland content are playing together. Splitting a highly populated zone doesn't have much impact but low population zones become unhealthy in their player engagement and ability for new players to complete content when an already low population is reduced even further. It can literally be the difference between a new player getting help and joining a guild, and thinking the game is dead and telling everyone that asks them how the game was it's dead.

It's a total non-issue if they just did what LOTRO did, but that has it's own flaws too.

True, if they were to implement such a system. In the case of zones that are currently dead on the live servers, if anything I feel there could be a chance for a 'vet' version of these zones being more popular than they currently are just because of the players coming back to participate in content they previously skipped.

Even working under the assumption that the vet verision would draw more vets, it does nothing to address how bad off the normal version would be. And that's clearly the reason they keep harping about it, even if they aren't saying it. There's no reason to keep going on and on about new player experience being intregal to their decisions and caldwell silver and gold if they weren't in particular concerned about the new and casual experience in the normal zones. I also very much doubt it would be an issue at all in high population areas, and they've made it clear they don't think a ton of people would use it...

So that narrows it down logically ro them being worried about the new/casual player experience in low population zones playing the normal instances in particular.

Which is why I really think they should do what LOTRO did. It doesn't separate the players, which they keep citing as a primary concern. But to do nothing is just bad in my opinion.

CP5

Definitely, hopefully they are keeping tabs on this thread, but since our only updates come from so distant sources it's hard to gauge what they're working on, what direction they are looking to go, or if they even understand what players are asking for. The answers in that q&a suggest that hasn't changed, though this quote, "We’re not worried because we want the game to be full of options. The more ways players have to enjoy the world, the better." at least gives some insight that if this topic doesn't die down, they'll see it as a big enough priority to give some effort towards. It's just had to tell if they're doing anything at the moment with the radio silence.

Ethos_evos

Interesting that Cadwell silver and gold is brought up as an argument as why "harder" overland is not popular... I played all of silver and half of gold, personally i stopped because it felt much of the same and there wasn't enough reward to it. Perhaps I'll return but it'll because i was to RP not to look for a challenge.

My routine usually involves running around doing surveys, doing world bosses and i find adds to be an inconvenience. In Skyrim i crank up the difficulty which helped make every encounter memorable, in ESO its not fun to fight anything since it dies so fast...i feel like dynasty warrior 1 versus 1k. I am usually left with a feeling of disappointment like "wow now i got to wait to leave combat so i can mount again".

World bosses are really boring specially when there is a lot of players in the area, things instantly die it's not even about the fight its about the loot at that point, i find it really refreshing to fight a boss when i am solo or in a small group, it takes a little longer and i see boss abilities or mechanics/behavior that i have never seen due to players nuking stuff. Wish they would get more health or unlock new behavior based on how many people are attacking.

The other day i found a special enemy in blackwood that had all sorts of abilities. He would do this spin charge attack at me and flank me, stealth up and try to catch me off guard. I had to stop damaging him though because my light attacks were burning him down fast. I let him live because i believe that's a special encounter and i like to experience it again.. there are other enemies like that, like the orcs in Wrothgar that fly up and shoot down, those encounters really stick with me and I wish that AI was common place.

Shagreth

Alright, so my wife started playing during this free week, I will not say much about how stocked she was to play and later how disappointed by certain things. In short, she kept hearing about Molag Bal etc. as she played and then at some point she saw her first anchor drop, she was SO amazed by it and couldn't wait to fight his forces, she had no gear, literally, just a couple of greens, no CP.. she melted everything so fast it wasn't even funny, then some maxed out dude came and everything just evaporated before she could land a hit. So much for Molag Bal and the whole build-up.

It's the same everywhere, we know it, boss appears for the daily, it melts and so on and so forth. I don't know how people are okay with this, I mean, I get many here come from games like The Sims etc. and don't want to deal with fighting and that is fine, but claiming that Overland content is 'fine as is' just breaks me inside. I hope they do something and fast, even a band-aid fix of the like 4x more health and 2x damage would be nice until there's some proper solution.

Sylvermynx

Well, when you're creeping up on 80-ish, your reflexes are shot, and you're playing over satellite with massive ping, I imagine you'll finally understand.

SilverBride

Shagreth wrote: »

It's the same everywhere, we know it, boss appears for the daily, it melts and so on and so forth. I don't know how people are okay with this, I mean, I get many here come from games like The Sims etc. and don't want to deal with fighting and that is fine, but claiming that Overland content is 'fine as is' just breaks me inside. I hope they do something and fast, even a band-aid fix of the like 4x more health and 2x damage would be nice until there's some proper solution.

I am ok with this because I want to relax and have fun and feel how strong my character has gotten. I came from games where I frequently participated in end game content. Those games also had easy questing zones but no one complained and asked for them to be made more difficult because if they wanted a challenge they went where the challenge was.

There are no plans for any major changes to overland as Rich Lambert stated in his interview a few days ago.

BIackHand

SilverBride wrote: »

Shagreth wrote: »

It's the same everywhere, we know it, boss appears for the daily, it melts and so on and so forth. I don't know how people are okay with this, I mean, I get many here come from games like The Sims etc. and don't want to deal with fighting and that is fine, but claiming that Overland content is 'fine as is' just breaks me inside. I hope they do something and fast, even a band-aid fix of the like 4x more health and 2x damage would be nice until there's some proper solution.

I am ok with this because I want to relax and have fun and feel how strong my character has gotten. I came from games where I frequently participated in end game content. Those games also had easy questing zones but no one complained and asked for them to be made more difficult because if they wanted a challenge they went where the challenge was.

There are no plans for any major changes to overland as Rich Lambert stated in his interview a few days ago.

The only time you feel how strong you get is from the state of beeing naked with lvl 1 weapons until the state of beeing green geared with setbonuses and fitted almost to your actual lvl. Then you hit a wall where is no noticable progress anymore because you kill every mob without doing a half rotation. If 1% brainusage is needed to kill overland mobs, and its fun for you, then its fine. But for majority of people wich like engaging Questcontent, its not. The people wich just dont like engaging Questcontent, just wanna LvL up fast to max lvl, get skyshards and lorebooks together and let overland behind and forgotten, but pretending its to hard and not enjoyable. It will slow them down because they cant pull 40 mobs together and AOE them down. Nobody cares except them. Thats why we are now in that situation. Left alone with fart dry Quest content, because people were to lazy going through it, because they want 10 chars maxed out for the endgame.

SilverBride

BIackHand wrote: »

The only time you feel how strong you get is from the state of beeing naked with lvl 1 weapons until the state of beeing green geared with setbonuses and fitted almost to your actual lvl.

That may be true for you but it's not in my case. I remember struggling with even some of the quest mini bosses in the past and now that I can take them down easily it reinforces to me just how powerful I have gotten. This is a good feeling to me, not boredom.

BIackHand wrote: »

Then you hit a wall where is no noticable progress anymore because you kill every mob without doing a half rotation. If 1% brainusage is needed to kill overland mobs, and its fun for you, then its fine. But for majority of people wich like engaging Questcontent, its not.

According to Rich Lambert the majority find overland challenging. "We have millions of players that play The Elder Scrolls Online, and a large portion of them find the game hard and the Overland content challenging."

BIackHand wrote: »

The people wich just dont like engaging Questcontent, just wanna LvL up fast to max lvl, get skyshards and lorebooks together and let overland behind and forgotten, but pretending its to hard and not enjoyable. It will slow them down because they cant pull 40 mobs together and AOE them down. Nobody cares except them. Thats why we are now in that situation. Left alone with fart dry Quest content, because people were to lazy going through it, because they want 10 chars maxed out for the endgame.

This may be true for some but certainly not all. I do not rush through anything. I love taking my time as I quest though all the zones and enjoy the story.

Also most of the players who are power leveling this way are doing so in Alikr or buying Skyreach runs. They aren't running around overland pulling 40 mobs together because that's not possible. The mobs aren't that closely placed and they will only follow the player a short distance before turning and running back to their spawn spot.


But the bottom line is that they currently have no plans for any major overland changes.

Shagreth

Sylvermynx wrote: »

I am ok with this because I want to relax and have fun and feel how strong my character has gotten. I came from games where I frequently participated in end game content. Those games also had easy questing zones but no one complained and asked for them to be made more difficult because if they wanted a challenge they went where the challenge was.

There are no plans for any major changes to overland as Rich Lambert stated in his interview a few days ago.

I have been in those games, in fact, I've played every mmorpg in the western market, at least for a few months. In most of them, 'overland' is an afterthought or a means to an end, in ESO I want to believe that it is more and certainly COULD be more. A large portion of ESO players find overland challenging? I would truly like to meet even one of them and have a talk, I find it extremely difficult to believe those people have even LOOKED at video game before coming into ESO. My wife, barely one you would call a gamer, found the game to be a joke. I am sorry, but this is either false or truly the majority of the ESO players are in their 80's.

No current plans for overland changes? Okay, so we know that we are the minority, we are NOT the ones 'keeping the lights on' at ZOS HQ, so what's the point of this thread, again? Probably a smokescreen, said the cynic in me. If they have something in mind, I hope they show it to us soon, overland is in a broken state, along with a few other aspects of this game. Like I said, they have a lot on their plate, and it's a race, I get it, I just wish they weren't all radio silence with us. Just like the vampirism rework, most can agree that it wasn't good and ever since its release -- we have had zero responses on the matter, and there's a lot of people that care for that.

Sylvermynx

@Shagreth - that was not my quote there; that one belongs to SilverBride. And yes, I find overland very challenging with my ping (750ms for the most part) and my aging reflexes, which makes "twitch combat" very difficult for me.

I played both WoW and RIFT - 20 years ago, when I was younger obviously and in better shape....

Shagreth

Sylvermynx wrote: »

@Shagreth - that was not my quote there; that one belongs to SilverBride. And yes, I find overland very challenging with my ping (750ms for the most part) and my aging reflexes, which makes "twitch combat" very difficult for me.

I played both WoW and RIFT - 20 years ago, when I was younger obviously and in better shape....

My uncle (the one that got me into gaming) recently finished Godfrey in Elden Ring, he's 74, though he's in great shape as he works out frequently, I don't know man, maybe there's other things to blame here and people DO age differently. I have gotten my ass wooped a few times with certain world bosses when attempting to solo them, but in the end I always beat them, since I have a semi-optimized spec. THAT, I get, but if you're telling me that you find general questing challenging, then I'm sorry. As for ping, well, that can't be helped.

There's stuff for you to do and there's a card game coming, the game already caters to people like you, and in my opinion is that it shouldn't, provided they care for its long-term survival, we need new blood, it's a problem with aging mmorpg's. Anyway, at the end of the day none of this matters, they will do what they think is best, meanwhile we're left in the dark.

ZOS_Kevin

Hi All, as many of you have noted already from Rich's interview, there are no current plans for changing the structure of overland content. It is something we will continue to look at, so constructive feedback is always appreciated.

The purpose of this thread is to collect constructive feedback so if there is an opportunity to make changes, we have feedback from players to possibly incorporate. However, if the conversation continues to be users arguing with each other, we will lock this thread. We understand not everyone will agree with the statement. However, you can disagree and voice it without pushing the buttons of other forum users.

As always, please follow the community guidelines.

IKYMI: Rich's Quote on Overland Content
"That's a difficult one because difficulty is definitely subjective. We have millions of players that play The Elder Scrolls Online, and a large portion of them find the game hard and the Overland content challenging, especially as a new player when you don't have gold, all the gear, and Champion Points. Ultimately it comes down to, if we make the game harder, what are the incentives for players to play it at the harder level? That opens up a whole huge can of worms. I also look back and remember we had harder Overland content. We had Cadwell Silver, we had Cadwell Gold, and players really didn't like it. It was too hard for them, and when we did One Tamriel, we ripped all that out based on player feedback. Like, nobody did it. So it's a challenging subject and a difficult question to answer. All I can really say is we're definitely looking at it, but we don't have any major changes planned for the Overland difficulty."

Sylvermynx

The devs I've known in the past (the other mmos I played) never were very forthcoming either. I haven't been at all surprised about the ZOS devs' silence.

Yes, I do have things to do - and will - unless those who want harder overland wind up with ONLY that, instead of optional. And no, I'm not interested in the card game. SO not my thing.

And yes - general questing is very difficult when I get to the end bosses. The number of times I died to Molag Bal, to Mulaamnir, to Vandacia - I've lost count....

Shagreth

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Hi All, as many of you have noted already from Rich's interview, there are no current plans for changing the structure of overland content. It is something we will continue to look at, so constructive feedback is always appreciated.

The purpose of this thread is to collect constructive feedback so if there is an opportunity to make changes, we have feedback from players to possibly incorporate. However, if the conversation continues to be users arguing with each other, we will lock this thread. We understand not everyone will agree with the statement. However, you can disagree and voice it without pushing the buttons of other forum users.

Apologies, it's a trap I fell in myself. I should have given my opinion (which I did) and stop there, I still think overland is broken and the opposite of fun and nothing will change that, it's sad that the developers themselves can't see it.

p.s. there should be an option to unsubscribe from a thread you've participated in. (aware of the current option, but it's too general) just an idea, that would help some people from getting drawn into pointless conversations.

SilverBride

There are no major changes planned but this makes me wonder if suggestions such as debuff foods or challenge banners for story bosses would still be possible. I consider these minor as opposed to a separate veteran overland, but I am not a programmer and can't say for sure that this is true. But I hope something like this is possible for those who are interested.

If they did provide one or both of these it would be a good test to see how many use them and if it is enough to justify adding additional challenging features to overland in the future.

Arunei

Shagreth wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Hi All, as many of you have noted already from Rich's interview, there are no current plans for changing the structure of overland content. It is something we will continue to look at, so constructive feedback is always appreciated.

The purpose of this thread is to collect constructive feedback so if there is an opportunity to make changes, we have feedback from players to possibly incorporate. However, if the conversation continues to be users arguing with each other, we will lock this thread. We understand not everyone will agree with the statement. However, you can disagree and voice it without pushing the buttons of other forum users.

Apologies, it's a trap I fell in myself. I should have given my opinion (which I did) and stop there, I still think overland is broken and the opposite of fun and nothing will change that, it's sad that the developers themselves can't see it.

p.s. there should be an option to unsubscribe from a thread you've participated in. (aware of the current option, but it's too general) just an idea, that would help some people from getting drawn into pointless conversations.

Obviously the devs can see it, though, given how Rich said the majority of people find the content challenging. They have access to statistics and numbers that we players can't see. It's completely valid if people think overland is too easy, but it's another thing to claim it's broken entirely and the devs are unaware.

Personally, I think this thread may have run its course. There might be the occasional new poster chiming in with their views on the matter, but for the most part it seems to have become the same group of people repeating their stances, and I'm guilty of that to an extent as well. It's why I stopped posting or even checking the thread after my last post, up until seeing Kevin's post. It's just us saying the same things to each other.

Shagreth

Arunei wrote: »

Obviously the devs can see it, though, given how Rich said the majority of people find the content challenging. They have access to statistics and numbers that we players can't see. It's completely valid if people think overland is too easy, but it's another thing to claim it's broken entirely and the devs are unaware.

Sure, they can and I pray that it's accurate. I still find it so difficulty to believe that some people find said content hard. In any case, yes, this will also by my final post here, probably. My only hope is that the people that want more are also taken into consideration and hopefully are many.

baratron

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

IKYMI: Rich's Quote on Overland Content
"That's a difficult one because difficulty is definitely subjective. We have millions of players that play The Elder Scrolls Online, and a large portion of them find the game hard and the Overland content challenging, especially as a new player when you don't have gold, all the gear, and Champion Points. Ultimately it comes down to, if we make the game harder, what are the incentives for players to play it at the harder level? That opens up a whole huge can of worms. I also look back and remember we had harder Overland content. We had Cadwell Silver, we had Cadwell Gold, and players really didn't like it. It was too hard for them, and when we did One Tamriel, we ripped all that out based on player feedback. Like, nobody did it. So it's a challenging subject and a difficult question to answer. All I can really say is we're definitely looking at it, but we don't have any major changes planned for the Overland difficulty."

Cadwell's Silver and Gold was terrible NOT because it was too hard, but because it was too empty.

Pre-One Tamriel, you could only play with friends of your own Alliance. There was a strict progression from the Normal zones to Cadwell's Silver to Cadwell's Gold.

• Aldmeri Dominion members went to the Ebonheart Pact then to the Daggerfall Covenant.
• Daggerfall Covenant members went to the Aldmeri Dominion then to the Ebonheart Pact.
• Ebonheart Pact members went to the Daggerfall Covenant then to the Aldmeri Dominion.

So there were multiple copies of each zone - Level 3-10 Glenumbra for DC players, Veteran Rank 1-3 Glenumbra for EP players, and Veteran Rank 9-10 Glenumbra for AD players. Or something around those levels - it's been a long time.

The Cadwell's Gold version of each zone would be basically empty. You'd only run into other players in the main city. You could put out a request for help in zone chat and no one would be there to answer you at all. Even the later Cadwell's Silver zones were empty. It was easier for most people simply to make alts in other Alliances just so they could find people to talk to.

And it wasn't as if you could play with anyone you knew, either. You had to be on a character of the matching Alliance as well as the correct level. If you're a person who plays off-peak times, like me (often on at 2 am in my timezone), good luck finding anyone at all to play with! I used to spend a lot of time playing on PC-NA with a friend who lived in Seattle (8 hours away) because PC-EU was dead.

If you brought back the concept of Cadwell's zones, but kept them open to all Alliances in a One Tamriel manner, I think they would be popular among all of us who find overland content "too easy".

Aliyavana

^ agreed

SilverBride

baratron wrote: »

Cadwell's Silver and Gold was terrible NOT because it was too hard, but because it was too empty.

It was terrible for me because it was too hard. I died a lot just fighting random mobs that were in my way as I was travelling to my quest location and it got very old very fast. This is why I only did it once on one character, and ended up leaving the game when Craglorn (which was like veteran overland on steroids) was introduced.

Struggling is not fun for a lot of players.